atheist or theist?
atheist
69.5%
162
theist
30.5%
71
233 votes
JennyEsquire said: I know that agnosticism is a epistemological position, but did you even read what I wrote? Language evolves, and the contemporary meaning of the word 'agnostic' is closer to just meaning apathetic agnostic all together, since people who are apathetic just suffice with calling themselves agnostics in today's society In response to what is said above: katsucats said: The definition of "agnosticism" hasn't changed, you've just been using it wrong. One of the definitions from merriam-webster: Agnosticism-broadly : one who is not committed to believing in either the existence or the nonexistence of God or a god katsucats said: I never had any problem with the definition of 'agnostic'. You can't admit that agnosticism entails atheism How many times do I need to tell you why I made the same distinction that everyone else does? It's quite obvious. If you read the bold you will see that I didn't use it incorrectly |
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JustALEX said: im born a christian and don't think that. the concept of devil did not exist until some one wrote a book called paradise lost. i like to study different religions and find connections between them. i guess you could say im in search of the "truth" personally i do think there's an afterlife. but i don't think there is a concept of good and evil every one does what they think is right. I think you'll quickly find out that a lot of MAL is atheist or agnostic. After all, anime is from the devil.....according to some christians. think of it you can get all the things to create a human body but we can't give it a soul. |
| "among monsters and humans, there are only two types. Those who undergo suffering and spread it to others. And those who undergo suffering and avoid giving it to others." -Alice “Beauty is no quality in things themselves: It exists merely in the mind which contemplates them; and each mind perceives a different beauty.” David Hume “Evil is created when someone gives up on someone else. It appears when everyone gives up on someone as a lost cause and removes their path to salvation. Once they are cut off from everyone else, they become evil.” -Othinus  |
hazerddex said: JustALEX said: im born a christian and don't think that. the concept of devil did not exist until some one wrote a book called paradise lost. i like to study different religions and find connections between them. i guess you could say im in search of the "truth" personally i do think there's an afterlife. but i don't think there is a concept of good and evil every one does what they think is right. I think you'll quickly find out that a lot of MAL is atheist or agnostic. After all, anime is from the devil.....according to some christians. think of it you can get all the things to create a human body but we can't give it a soul. There was a book called The Bible that invented that concept first. |
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mrmook9000 said: As a mere human, I realize that I can barely comprehend the inner workings of the universe, so I guess agnostic. Though I would be surprised if a god as we humans know it actually exists. I'm in the same boat as you pal. |
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| agnostic |
| Agnostic Theist |
| ??????? |
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| Neither, I don't give a shit. |
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Snok3n said: Neither, I don't give a shit. Amen. |
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JennyEsquire said: Heh, I'm not going to keep repeating ad infinitum. It's not so much the definition of 'agnostic' you got wrong, it's the definition of 'atheist'. I don't care how many illiterate role models you have, you're an agnostic atheist -- by the definition of it. Let that sink in. You can't change the truth no matter how hard you try. The English language doesn't revolve around you. Words are commonly understood for a reason.JennyEsquire said: I know that agnosticism is a epistemological position, but did you even read what I wrote? Language evolves, and the contemporary meaning of the word 'agnostic' is closer to just meaning apathetic agnostic all together, since people who are apathetic just suffice with calling themselves agnostics in today's society In response to what is said above: katsucats said: The definition of "agnosticism" hasn't changed, you've just been using it wrong. One of the definitions from merriam-webster: Agnosticism-broadly : one who is not committed to believing in either the existence or the nonexistence of God or a god katsucats said: I never had any problem with the definition of 'agnostic'. You can't admit that agnosticism entails atheism How many times do I need to tell you why I made the same distinction that everyone else does? It's quite obvious. If you read the bold you will see that I didn't use it incorrectly |
| My subjective reviews: katsureview.wordpress.com THE CHAT CLUB. |
katsucats said: JennyEsquire said: Heh, I'm not going to keep repeating ad infinitum. It's not so much the definition of 'agnostic' you got wrong, it's the definition of 'atheist'. I don't care how many illiterate role models you have, you're an agnostic atheist -- by the definition of it. Let that sink in. You can't change the truth no matter how hard you try. The English language doesn't revolve around you. Words are commonly understood for a reason.JennyEsquire said: I know that agnosticism is a epistemological position, but did you even read what I wrote? Language evolves, and the contemporary meaning of the word 'agnostic' is closer to just meaning apathetic agnostic all together, since people who are apathetic just suffice with calling themselves agnostics in today's society In response to what is said above: katsucats said: The definition of "agnosticism" hasn't changed, you've just been using it wrong. One of the definitions from merriam-webster: Agnosticism-broadly : one who is not committed to believing in either the existence or the nonexistence of God or a god katsucats said: I never had any problem with the definition of 'agnostic'. You can't admit that agnosticism entails atheism How many times do I need to tell you why I made the same distinction that everyone else does? It's quite obvious. If you read the bold you will see that I didn't use it incorrectly You can't just change your mind. Your original contention was my use of the word agnostic, and I just showed you how I wasn't using it wrong at all. Don't try and weasel your way out of this Have you taken note of the answers people are giving here? You're the only one who had a problem with my use of the word, and everyone else uses it the same way I did. Why are you just telling me instead of correcting everyone else to show them how ''wrong'' they are too? I don't have to say anything more really, it's all right above: You claim I used the word 'agnostic' wrong, I prove you that you wrong, but you can't admit it and try to make it seem like you were talking about something completely different. It's useless |
| Come visit my town // I apologize in advance for my second-rate English Join my fan club // Improve the transport network |
Let me quote for you the original context of my objection with the way you used 'agnostic', before you get too greedy and pull a fast one: katsucats said: JennyEsquire said: The definition of "agnosticism" hasn't changed, you've just been using it wrong.I know that agnosticism is a epistemological position, but did you even read what I wrote? Language evolves, and the contemporary meaning of the word 'agnostic' is closer to just meaning apathetic agnostic all together, since people who are apathetic just suffice with calling themselves agnostics in today's society. Wether they're technically right or wrong, when enough people start using a word a certain way that word will sooner or later also officially change it's meaning, and if you had any clue, you'd know that that's exactly what's happening. In the passage above, you indicated clearly your belief that the definition of 'agnostic' has evolved to mean, completely, the position that 'apathetic agnostics' take. Later on, you tried to quote a broad definition of 'agnostic' (i.e. "one who is not committed to believing in either the existence or the nonexistence of God or a god"), except here is where you've faltered: a broad, loose definition of a word is not the entire spectrum in which a word is used. I know you tried to frame this as me contradicting myself, but instead you're playing semantic games. Most people do not refer to some broad definition of 'agnostic', yet you've somehow assumed that the definition you've given is the entire definition, and you support that by cherry-picking some 'authority' figure (read: argument from authority fallacy) that plainly stated that he does not like the 'atheism' label because he does not want to be associated with hard atheists. So here you are, 2 feathers of the same bird, both playing word games using the following fallacious argument: 1. Some people who believe X (atheists) also believe in Y (hard atheism). 2. I don't believe in Y. 3. Therefore, I don't believe in X. OR 1. Movement X (atheism) is often associated with movement Y (hard atheism) 2. ....? 3. Therefore, Movement X is equivalent to movement Y. So to reiterate (once again), I don't have any problem with the dictionary definition of the word 'agnostic'. I do have a problem with you pretending that's the only, or even the most prominent definition, even going as far to say language has evolved towards that definition, while conveniently ignoring all the other definitions that are also in the same dictionary. And since you have come this far putting together this argument, I think it's now fair to say that you neither understand the definition of 'atheist' nor 'agnostic'. The fact that you're an 'agnostic atheist' continues to elude you -- it's like someone draws out a detailed treasure map, then hands you a GPS unit with full instructions, and you're still complaining that you're broke. You call yourself an 'apathetic' agnostic. The dictionary defines 'apathetic' as: "having little or no interest or concern". You don't give a shit, yet you think you know more than everyone else who does. In other words, ignorant and proud of it. |
| My subjective reviews: katsureview.wordpress.com THE CHAT CLUB. |
| Do the people who do not want to associate with the words atheist or theist do so only because they don't like some of the extreme examples from these sides?!?!? |
| Wait...TheHandOfShame didn't migrate to this thread yet? |
| As a child, I was told that society is a melting pot of talents; knowledge and experience combined to form important alloys that will contribute to mankind. When I got to highschool, however, I thought that it's more like a river in which the water represents our peers while we ourselves are the stones in the river. Constant erosion by mindless majority sheeping has made us lose our unique edge. After I hit the age of 18, I realized that I've been wrong all along. Society is no melting pot. Society is no river. Society is a person, a very skilled rapist, and he has fucked us all. |
BloodRequiem said: Shhh... you're jinxing it.Wait...TheHandOfShame didn't migrate to this thread yet? |
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JustALEX said: Do the people who do not want to associate with the words atheist or theist do so only because they don't like some of the extreme examples from these sides?!?!? There is no extreme in being Gnostic Atheist. |
| LUL |
JustALEX said: Do the people who do not want to associate with the words atheist or theist do so only because they don't like some of the extreme examples from these sides?!?!? It's still, "YOU EITHER BELIEVE, OR YOU DON'T!". There are only two options. |
Play League of Legends here! Autocrat said: Hitler was good, objectively. |
| i'm neither because our ultimate creation is not a concern in my life therefore i never have to take a stance in this topic |
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JustALEX said: Do the people who do not want to associate with the words atheist or theist do so only because they don't like some of the extreme examples from these sides?!?!? Yes, isn't that obvious? katsucats said: Let me quote for you the original context of my objection with the way you used 'agnostic', before you get too greedy and pull a fast one: katsucats said: JennyEsquire said: The definition of "agnosticism" hasn't changed, you've just been using it wrong.I know that agnosticism is a epistemological position, but did you even read what I wrote? Language evolves, and the contemporary meaning of the word 'agnostic' is closer to just meaning apathetic agnostic all together, since people who are apathetic just suffice with calling themselves agnostics in today's society. Wether they're technically right or wrong, when enough people start using a word a certain way that word will sooner or later also officially change it's meaning, and if you had any clue, you'd know that that's exactly what's happening. In the passage above, you indicated clearly your belief that the definition of 'agnostic' has evolved to mean, completely, the position that 'apathetic agnostics' take. Later on, you tried to quote a broad definition of 'agnostic' (i.e. "one who is not committed to believing in either the existence or the nonexistence of God or a god"), except here is where you've faltered: a broad, loose definition of a word is not the entire spectrum in which a word is used. I know you tried to frame this as me contradicting myself, but instead you're playing semantic games. Most people do not refer to some broad definition of 'agnostic', yet you've somehow assumed that the definition you've given is the entire definition, and you support that by cherry-picking some 'authority' figure (read: argument from authority fallacy) that plainly stated that he does not like the 'atheism' label because he does not want to be associated with hard atheists. So here you are, 2 feathers of the same bird, both playing word games using the following fallacious argument: 1. Some people who believe X (atheists) also believe in Y (hard atheism). 2. I don't believe in Y. 3. Therefore, I don't believe in X. OR 1. Movement X (atheism) is often associated with movement Y (hard atheism) 2. ....? 3. Therefore, Movement X is equivalent to movement Y. So to reiterate (once again), I don't have any problem with the dictionary definition of the word 'agnostic'. I do have a problem with you pretending that's the only, or even the most prominent definition, even going as far to say language has evolved towards that definition, while conveniently ignoring all the other definitions that are also in the same dictionary. And since you have come this far putting together this argument, I think it's now fair to say that you neither understand the definition of 'atheist' nor 'agnostic'. The fact that you're an 'agnostic atheist' continues to elude you -- it's like someone draws out a detailed treasure map, then hands you a GPS unit with full instructions, and you're still complaining that you're broke. You call yourself an 'apathetic' agnostic. The dictionary defines 'apathetic' as: "having little or no interest or concern". You don't give a shit, yet you think you know more than everyone else who does. In other words, ignorant and proud of it. I never claimed to know more than anybody else. Fetch me that quote if it exists, please. No I said that it had evolved to include the definition I used as well. I said that it was one of the definitions. When did I tell you that agnosticism can't entail atheism? When did I ''conveniently ignore all the other definitions''. What purpose would that serve? JennyEsquire said: I know that agnosticism is an epistemological position If you think that I meant what you just said, then you've misunderstood me. |
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| Humm.... QUESTION #1 JennyEsquire said: I never claimed to know more than anybody else. Fetch me that quote if it exists, please. ANSWER #1 JennyEsquire said: Okay, so you think you know just as much as everyone else, despite that you're not preoccupied with the topic, you're apathetic to it, and you've "been fine just not giving a fuck." In addition, you have the propensity to call people "stupid", "dumb shit", and "fucking dolt" when they tell you the correct definition of a word.That's some dumb shit right there. I'm not usually preoccupied with bullshit like this because life is short, you fucking dolt. There are more important things to worry about, and just because I don't have any belief or non-belief doesn't mean I don't know more than anybody else. I don't know why you would make such an assumption. ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- QUESTION #2 JennyEsquire said: No I said that it had evolved to include the definition I used as well. I said that it was one of the definitions. When did I tell you that agnosticism can't entail atheism? ANSWER #2 JennyEsquire said: Language evolves, and the contemporary meaning of the word 'agnostic' is closer to just meaning apathetic agnostic all together, since people who are apathetic just suffice with calling themselves agnostics in today's society. Wether they're technically right or wrong, when enough people start using a word a certain way that word will sooner or later also officially change it's meaning, and if you had any clue, you'd know that that's exactly what's happening. JennyEsquire said: How can agnosticism entail atheism if you're an agnostic, but not an atheist?katsucats said: I'm notIf you don't give a fuck, you probably don't have that belief, then you're an atheist. ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- QUETION #3 JennyEsquire said: When did I ''conveniently ignore all the other definitions''. ANSWER #3 JennyEsquire said: katsucats said: I told you that nobody is using it right, how language evolves, and that I specifically meant it in it's contemporary use.The definition of "agnosticism" hasn't changed, you've just been using it wrong. JennyEsquire said: katsucats said: You're wasting your own time. Did you even read the definition I showed you?Agnosticism and Gnosticism answer: Is it possible to KNOW about God? Atheism and Theism answer: Does God EXIST? ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- QUESTION #4 JennyEsquire said: What purpose would that serve? ANSWER #4 JennyEsquire said: katsucats said: I'm notIf you don't give a fuck, you probably don't have that belief, then you're an atheist. JennyEsquire said: You assumed a negative connotation to 'atheism' a priori, and you decided that you'd do just about anything including changing or conveniently misapplying the definitions of 'atheism' and/or 'agnosticism' (and 'theism') just so you could disassociate yourself with either side, when in fact the choice is binary:JustALEX said: Yes, isn't that obvious?Do the people who do not want to associate with the words atheist or theist do so only because they don't like some of the extreme examples from these sides?!?!? Either a 'belief in God' EXISTS (implying theism) or DOES NOT EXIST (implying atheism). There is no third choice. Any attempts to deny the above fact necessarily results in you not understanding the definitions of 'atheism' and 'theism' and possibly misapplying 'agnosticism'. And you've proven that in spades. JennyEsquire said: You clearly don't (and you probably don't know what epistemology means).I know that agnosticism is an epistemological position JennyEsquire said: Or it means that you meant what I said.If you think that I meant what you just said, then you've misunderstood me. |
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| Without societal conditioning, would religion exist? |
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fameONE said: Without societal conditioning, would people exist?Without societal conditioning, would religion exist? |
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katsucats said: fameONE said: Without societal conditioning, would people exist?Without societal conditioning, would religion exist? Explain. I seemed to have missed the point. My point is that religion is forced upon the masses to the point where it's become ingrained in cultures around the world. Because of this, people rely on it, clinging to a belief of a higher power. In some cases, it can be beneficial. In others, well, you know, global conflict. In some cases, it provides a twisted moral compass with people who just want to be nice. In others, it's oppression. I'm an atheist, but I'm not a dick about it. I respect the beliefs of others even if they don't expect mine. Vehemently expressing your beliefs, when no one cares to hear them, is a dick move no matter what you believe in. |
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fameONE said: Humans are evolutionarily evolved to survive though society. If that didn't occur, we'd still be hunting woolly mammoths.katsucats said: fameONE said: Without societal conditioning, would people exist?Without societal conditioning, would religion exist? Explain. I seemed to have missed the point. |
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katsucats said: fameONE said: Humans are evolutionarily evolved to survive though society. If that didn't occur, we'd still be hunting woolly mammoths.katsucats said: fameONE said: Without societal conditioning, would people exist?Without societal conditioning, would religion exist? Explain. I seemed to have missed the point. From that perspective, I agree. However, the problem isn't societal conditioning; it's what gets passed on from generation to generation. That's why I made the tie between conditioning and religion. |
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Immahnoob said: JustALEX said: Do the people who do not want to associate with the words atheist or theist do so only because they don't like some of the extreme examples from these sides?!?!? It's still, "YOU EITHER BELIEVE, OR YOU DON'T!". There are only two options. Oh trust me, I recognize that.....I pointed that out earlier in this thread. But not wanting to associate with words is just.....weird? At least to me it is.....For example: I'm an American but there are negative connotations to being an American. I can't simply say that I was born in America and live in America but I don't wish to associate myself with the word "American". That doesn't make sense....you are what you are. You either believe a god(s) exists or you don't. And we have labels to these beliefs. |
| Apatheist FTW |
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katsucats said: fameONE said: Humans are evolutionarily evolved to survive though society. If that didn't occur, we'd still be hunting woolly mammoths.katsucats said: fameONE said: Without societal conditioning, would people exist?Without societal conditioning, would religion exist? Explain. I seemed to have missed the point. It takes a group mentality to hunt wooly mammoths. If we weren't socially inclined, we wouldn't have even hunted those things to begin with. If you can't tell, I'm agreeing with you. Don't want to start a pointless argument over wooly mammoth hunting. |
كنت تهدر وقتك عن طريق ترجمة هذه. mattbenz99 said: Christians and Satanists are technically the same thing |
| Well I believe in Allah I recently converted |
| Signature removed. Please follow the signature rules, as defined in the Site & Forum Guidelines. |
| @Enlightened_Anon Are you a Muslim as well? |
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| As a pagan i'm a polytheist but i was atheist before and having to answer the poll theist was a bit weird to me because usually its mean monotheists and they are way more often trying to make ennemy of us and intolerant of our minority religion that atheist. I mean at worse atheists mocks us style "Lol believing in ancient gods is dumb why not in Santa Claus while you're at it" while monotheists often call us devil worshipers and try to eliminates us sometimes by using violence against us (no hate like christian love as they says). So i feel closer to atheists than to most theists who are monotheist i feel safer with the no gods team than with the one god team. So maybe...the poll need more options? Also : i knows that they are non believers and believers of every faith who respect everyones and are tolerant my comments above is just for the ones who dont. |
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| Oh great I can't wait to see wait an anime coomer thinks about religion/the existence of god, seriously I'd have a more intelligent conversation with some homeless dude then someone on MAL. |
| When a pancake lover does something: "Outrageous vicious crime" When a waffle lover does something: "That means it is not illegal" Quotes - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ld_HIM667Do&t=2822s |
| "are you an atheist or a theist?" Agnostic. |
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| I'm a theist, personally. Christian, to be exact. |
| I indeed believe in the existence of one and only God. |
If you enjoyed the time you wasted, then its not a waste of time.  |
| @Enlightened_Anon Afraid of? Yes. Bad deeds will bring punishment so be afraid of that. Good deeds will bring rewards so be hopeful of that . |
If you enjoyed the time you wasted, then its not a waste of time. |
| @Enlightened_Anon Thats judgment. Your actions will be judged accordingly. System of reward and punishment keeps us in check. We shouldnt be afraid of our creator but we should be mindful of our actions for every single bad deed wont go unnoticed and we might be punished for it. Thats what we must fear. |
If you enjoyed the time you wasted, then its not a waste of time. |
| @Enlightened_Anon Well, it's not too bad here in the U.S. despite what polarization would lead you to believe. I live in the Bible Belt, anyway. I do have some personal issues like anxiety, OCD, etc. that I'm struggling with and are affecting my faith. |
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