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Jun 7, 2017 7:35 PM
#701
Reread and my reads list is a mess. Shinichi-kun: Neutral. Too soon to tell. logic340: Town lean, but purely from gut. AbuHumaid: Not as active (a little suspicious), but he seems to actually be reading and thinking. DenjaX: Void. Sleipnirr: Town Lean, attitude is the same as usual, so maybe in a similar position as Shinichi-kun. Suzune-chan: Neutral, but I look forward to more of her reads. grrr: Suggests mass claim; more pushy than usual; scum lean. PTYamin: Where. Are. YOUUUUUUUU. Floofs: WhErE aRe YoU Militus: Rubs me the wrong way. I almost want to use his logic against him and lynch him instead of someone else to “see the results.” Annoys me. #503 Much BM. I know I’m town, and Karote’s town. The other person was PentaFlare, who couldn’t control the other two votes as he voted first. grrr 2.0 PentaFlare: Town Lean. Seems to be using the same tactics as normal Penta. BUT I don't know why he'd call out logic and not Coelestin. Karote: Captain. yurkin: Neutral. Feels different somehow though. SuzakuTsubasa: Even less of an impression of Rinto-kun... ironace: Few posts, most notable thing is logic and wen fighting over him... Rinto-kun: Not attention drawing at all, seems to be catching up, trusts wen for some reason... reiynii: Votes for logic, husband person, nothing beyond the norm yet... wen294: More aggressive than usual, and for little to no reason. Neutral-Scum. Coelestin: I’m not picking up a lot of scum hunting from this person tbh… Attack on Sleipnirr actually came from Pentaflare, who claims to have been “bluffing." Neutral but a little scummy. I'm actually pretty content with my vote right now. WTF is my target doing. |
...better to be hated for what you are than loved for something you are not. |
Jun 7, 2017 8:00 PM
#702
reiynii said: what did you read exactly? Can you define what is "under the radar" if it's not lurking? Actually no, when I'm offline I'm reading everything I just don't know what to say but I'm tryingAbuHumaid said: I'm just repeating what I read in one of the pages, but under the radar is a bit different from a lurker. You're not reading everything while offline, but rather just around.Are you saying that i'm lurking? This is all assumptions based off of the talk in town~ |
Jun 7, 2017 8:07 PM
#703
AbuHumaid said: I would say someone like yurkin could be considered under the radar. They are here posting but they don't really stand out.reiynii said: what did you read exactly? Can you define what is "under the radar" if it's not lurking? Actually no, when I'm offline I'm reading everything I just don't know what to say but I'm tryingAbuHumaid said: Are you saying that i'm lurking? This is all assumptions based off of the talk in town~ |
Proud Administrator of the D Gray Man FC and OnePunch-Man FC |
Jun 7, 2017 8:12 PM
#704
wen294 said: the last game was too active for meAbuHumaid said: In general you do. Last game you were extremely inactive and the one before that you were inactive for quite a while as well.reiynii said: AbuHumaid said: It's a floating rumor, that the best way to get you more involved is to ask you questions which means you generally prefer to hang out under the radar in a low key play style!it seems like you haven't played with logic enough I never said nor implied I need someone to pressure me to start convos, how did you assume that? So far you haven't contributed a whole lot either aside from posts directly aimed at you. Fine then I'll try giving some reads |
Jun 7, 2017 8:15 PM
#705
Karote said: @AbuHumaid answer this and tag Karote@Shinichi-Kun, @AbuHumaid, @DenjaX, @Sleipnirr, @Suzune-chan, @grrr, @PTYamin, @Floofs, @Militus, @PentaFlare, @RE1031, @yurkin, @SuzakuTsubasa, @ironace, @Rinto-kun, @reiynii, @wen294, @Coelestin Give me your top 3 suspects and I'll possibly put them in a list tomorrow depending which 3 gets the most votes. |
Proud Administrator of the D Gray Man FC and OnePunch-Man FC |
Jun 7, 2017 8:41 PM
#706
@logic340 oh I see so it's just being there but not doing much And wait I still have 2 pages to read I'll come back to that |
Jun 7, 2017 8:47 PM
#707
Tomorrow's another day. Goodnight all. |
Proud Administrator of the D Gray Man FC and OnePunch-Man FC |
Jun 7, 2017 9:16 PM
#708
@PTYamin Please do something. Why do you ask if there's time, see that there is, and say nothing? Are you planning something? Whatever it is, please don't assume it can wait. @Militus You say you're being weird to get reads. Have you gotten any? And are any of your posts prior #601 legitimate? @Karote grrr, PTYamin, & grrr wait & wen |
...better to be hated for what you are than loved for something you are not. |
Jun 7, 2017 10:42 PM
#709
AbuHumaid said: Floofs said: vote:AbuHumaid @AbuHumaid Lets talk about perk-a-colas! 1. What is your opinion on the perk-a-colas and have you seen something similar used in other games? 2. Do you feel that there are instances where perk-a-colas can have a negative impact on the green faction other than members of other factions obtaining them? 3. If you do feel that there are other instances where they can have a negative impact, what would be the best plan to mitigate or remove the negative effect? 4. How do you feel about the posts below from grrr, logic and shinichi about perk-a-colas? grrr said: @Karote I expect from the Captain to name the most looking town players to stay on the lynch train. This way we will maximize the chance to get Pepsi-a-Cola for town. Also this is will work well against Penta's strong desire to force draw votes : D . Shinichi-Kun said: logic340 said: With the perk system I feel we need to as close to majority lynch as we can. The more townies in the lynch train the better our chances of gaining perks for town. If anything doesnt it gunrantee scum will be on major trains, so it techhincally benefits us to have a smaller lynch train even if we risk giving mafia a perk. Atleast thats my opinion. 1. I think they're unnecessary because they make things more confusing imo at least, and no this the first time i see something like this 2. I'm not sure if i get the question, you mean which one is more likely to happen? 3. idk tbh, how can we remove a negative effect that already happened? 4. grrr's idea is bad, lynch a townie just to get perks? hell no there's no vanilla townies in this game every role is important + town going down in numbers is in mafia's benefit + less chance to lynch mafia so no, Logic's idea isn't bad but risky, mafia will have a place to hide + they'll still have a chance to get a perk, and i agree with Shinichi, less risk + high chance of townies getting a perk because mafia are outnumbered from the first place 1. This is my first time seeing this type of game mechanic. Green faction = most players so hopefully they will get most or all of the perks 2. My wording of the question is kind of confusing so I will try to explain where I was going with it. If other factions get perk-a-colas that would be bad for the green faction (obviously). I was trying to see if you thought this was the only problem with the perks. The other problem I foresee with perks is that it will lead to mass vote changes from everyone to get perks. In the quick start guide one of the strategies used to catch scum is the vote count analysis. I think with the mass vote changes, this strategy may not be helpful. Since this will result in the green faction having one less strategy to use, do you think this causes a disadvantage? 3. I was trying to have question 2 flow into question 3, but it didn't go over well XD I was hoping that you would bring up mass vote changes and talk about an idea to avoid that. I think train with 10 to 15 will make it extremely hard for the green faction to pick out scum (shinichi's point). @Karote Do you think that there is a way that we can avoid this since you are the Capitao? Since you can select 5 people on certain days, is there a way for you to use that somehow? I know this will require most if not all of the players to agree this and if you are okay with mass amounts of pressure, but do you think grrr's idea of you selecting people to be on trains will help stop a mass train and limit scum on the train? Also, I agree with logic that the main train should have 2 maybe 3 more votes than the 2nd largest train. 4. I picked these quotes since they talked about perks to try to give you other ideas about perks and to see if you would think about a mass vote change. EDIT:added @logic340 in regards to 353 EDIT 2: added @Suzune-chan since you answered my questions in 691 |
FloofsJun 8, 2017 1:39 AM
Jun 7, 2017 11:51 PM
#710
Floofs said: AbuHumaid said: Floofs said: vote:AbuHumaid @AbuHumaid Lets talk about perk-a-colas! 1. What is your opinion on the perk-a-colas and have you seen something similar used in other games? 2. Do you feel that there are instances where perk-a-colas can have a negative impact on the green faction other than members of other factions obtaining them? 3. If you do feel that there are other instances where they can have a negative impact, what would be the best plan to mitigate or remove the negative effect? 4. How do you feel about the posts below from grrr, logic and shinichi about perk-a-colas? grrr said: @Karote I expect from the Captain to name the most looking town players to stay on the lynch train. This way we will maximize the chance to get Pepsi-a-Cola for town. Also this is will work well against Penta's strong desire to force draw votes : D . Shinichi-Kun said: logic340 said: With the perk system I feel we need to as close to majority lynch as we can. The more townies in the lynch train the better our chances of gaining perks for town. If anything doesnt it gunrantee scum will be on major trains, so it techhincally benefits us to have a smaller lynch train even if we risk giving mafia a perk. Atleast thats my opinion. 1. I think they're unnecessary because they make things more confusing imo at least, and no this the first time i see something like this 2. I'm not sure if i get the question, you mean which one is more likely to happen? 3. idk tbh, how can we remove a negative effect that already happened? 4. grrr's idea is bad, lynch a townie just to get perks? hell no there's no vanilla townies in this game every role is important + town going down in numbers is in mafia's benefit + less chance to lynch mafia so no, Logic's idea isn't bad but risky, mafia will have a place to hide + they'll still have a chance to get a perk, and i agree with Shinichi, less risk + high chance of townies getting a perk because mafia are outnumbered from the first place 1. This is my first time seeing this type of game mechanic. Green faction = most players so hopefully they will get most or all of the perks 2. My wording of the question is kind of confusing so I will try to explain where I was going with it. If other factions get perk-a-colas that would be bad for the green faction (obviously). I was trying to see if you thought this was the only problem with the perks. The other problem I foresee with perks is that it will lead to mass vote changes from everyone to get perks. In the quick start guide one of the strategies used to catch scum is the vote count analysis. I think with the mass vote changes, this strategy may not be helpful. Since this will result in the green faction having one less strategy to use, do you think this causes a disadvantage? 3. I was trying to have question 2 flow into question 3, but it didn't go over well XD I was hoping that you would bring up mass vote changes and talk about an idea to avoid that. I think train with 10 to 15 will make it extremely hard for the green faction to pick out scum (shinichi's point). @Karote Do you think that there is a way that we can avoid this since you are the Capitao? Since you can select 5 people on certain days, is there a way for you to use that somehow? I know this will require most if not all of the players to agree this and if you are okay with mass amounts of pressure, but do you think grrr's idea of you selecting people to be on trains will help stop a mass train and limit scum on the train? Also, I agree with logic that the main train should have 2 maybe 3 more votes than the 2nd largest train. 4. I picked these quotes since they talked about perks to try to give you other ideas about perks and to see if you would think about a mass vote change. You want me tooo ... select certain people to be on the train to reduce of chances for mafia being there? I got an exam in few hours so I will come back later and think about it. |
Jun 7, 2017 11:57 PM
#711
Karote said: No clue man, i've never played with him before. If i had then i might have an easier time deciding what to think of him.wen294 said: Ah ohkey Pyro, thanks for answering that. That's one worry less. logic340 said: This response instead of answering the question bothers me. Couple it with the post below where you tell Coelestin that yo missed it though you clearly didn't make you look really bad. very comfortable in doing this Unvote: Vote: Militus @wen294 that thing you are worried about ironace doing I think this is the one you need to be looking out for. The Shinichi vote is exactly the type of thing you were talking about in regard to going with the flow. Do you see him as 3rd party? As far as i know messing around doesn't come from TPR a lot. Well unless they're jester of course or maybe survivor but that's not something that's in the game. (inb4 sledge is hidden jester lmao) So far he's just been stating that he'll do something anti-town while flaunting his "master-plan" around without giving any details. For my PoV he might be trying to look busy. |
Jun 8, 2017 12:14 AM
#714
Jun 8, 2017 12:43 AM
#715
logic340 said: inb4 you get nightkilled N1 and scum!sleip wraps up the game.just do you know my read on Sleipnirr is also neutral right now. After he wrecked me in Castle Panic and I Vigged him in Stray Dogs I realized something about Sleipnirr's late game play as town. I promised him I wouldn't let him be lynch fodder D1 because he's an important asset if he's town and I'm confident I can catch him as scum. So unless I'm certain he's scum or there is a great case against him in not touching it. A plan that relies on you making it into late game, and especially when you announce that plan beforehand, has a habit of failing. Might be just me tho. Coelestin said: Bit of both.@wen294 Do you actually vote for ironace because you're scum reading ironace or just to get him moving? And who'd you go next for after ironace? Truth be told i'm not sold on him being scum, but it doesn't feel like he attempts to change my, or anybody that voted him, of their opinion. Kinda feels like he doesn't want to show his thought process on the matter and just ignores it, which is a bit of a shame. Then again i didn't ask him anything directly but not sure i like the fact that i have to directly ask him something to get a reaction :\ As for who besides him, i want more to see from Mil 'cause i have trouble sorting him out, i kinda like penta's case on logic which may be partially because it consists of things i normally don't consider. I want Tubacabra to have more of a presence. Abu so far reminds me of his last 2 games where he was scum both times so eh. Hope to see more of him too. Bunch of annoying inactives. Also i remember something about RE feeling off but i forgot what, might have to dig for a bit to find what that was. All in all lots of people i want to see more from, not all THAT many concrete opinions yet. ironace said: Isn't this kinda inconsistent with what you said earlier? Following your reasoning on shinichi he can't be town or neutral because they'd want to know about sledge as well so only scum is left. What makes TPR (third party role) any different from town in the amount of knowledge they have/want about sledge? So then you basically conclude he's mafia and not vote? To me your read on shinichi comes across as stronger than your read on mil yet to vote mil. Not sure i get your thought process.ok so i have caught up with the disscussion so heres my answers to some of the questions i remember @coelestin I will not mind sheeping but you need to give atlest some convincing evidence to get my vote. And the reason why i say that shinichi is not neutral is because if he was then he would want to have some level of idea about sledge's role, but he doesnt, which isnt very beneficial to either the town or the 3rd party. Im siding with the fact that he's a mafia for now but i will not vote him for now. Ive actually forgotten why i was suspicious of grrr, he hasent talked after the begining of D1 and so i havent managed to get a better grasp of his character. As i said before my reasons were partly based on a gut feeling and that was the case with pentaflare. And for the moment of truth, the one you all have been waiting for, the person im voting for will be millitus. THIS IS NOT BECAUSE HE COPIED ME OK??!! well he appears to act too sinister and omnious, but his level is one which i believe will be avoided by the mafia. I dont think he is a townie either-if he is, hes trying to act as a shady man.I think he is neutral.I am voting for him because i see the roles of the 3rd party to be the most annoying ones to deal with. If you guys have some thoughts to share on why i could be wrong im willing to listen. But for now, vote:Millitus BTW, im soo popular right now ...hehehe. This is bad. Also mafia can work together and TPR can't. Also the TPR killing role has a higher chance of hitting scum than the chance of mafia killing TPR. In general it's better to try and get rid of the mafia before the third party roles due to these reasons. grrr said: This goes beyond yuck... It seems most of the people are against mass claiming. Then I have new top offer. I will town read anyone who votes yes! Lets all pick 3 role and claim them. It is like win - win. I can't see anything that might go wrong with this! Selling your vote like that... egh. Actually @coelestin throw grrr on that list of people i named earlier as well. I don't like him this game. Aside from getting stuck on that mass claiming thing he hasn't contributed much to anything. I can already imagine an anonymous video: "We are anonymous. We are sad. We feel ignored. y u do dis to me :( Ehm i mean us." |
Jun 8, 2017 1:16 AM
#716
Suzune-chan said: I think logic was the one who got started with sledge, then penta gave his answer to logic's question. Because people didn't know what a jumper was it turned to mechanics. I really didn't get the feeling that penta wanted to talk about mechanics from the start though, but that the conversation just kinda went there and then he stopped it from going on for too long. @Logic340, @Coelstein, @wen294, @Karote Since you all asked about my Pentaflare vote. I began to notice right away when she made the comment about the jumper potential. Link The topic arose a lot of interest on the topic because that role is not used or as well known as it used to be. Regardless in less then a page of comments penta flips the conversations. Says that talking about mechanics is not worth it. However, they were the first person to bring it up and then just shrugged it off. This struck me as quite odd. Ling After this moment, Penta is praised by several people for their thinking but the majority of the posts were light and fluffy about games people played, alignments, and this stuff about husbands. Karote said: @Shinichi-Kun, @AbuHumaid, @DenjaX, @Sleipnirr, @Suzune-chan, @grrr, @PTYamin, @Floofs, @Militus, @PentaFlare, @RE1031, @yurkin, @SuzakuTsubasa, @ironace, @Rinto-kun, @reiynii, @wen294, @Coelestin Give me your top 3 suspects and I'll possibly put them in a list tomorrow depending which 3 gets the most votes. Oh righto almost forgot this. ironace, grrr, floofs. I know i haven't mentioned floofs before because i kinda forgot about him but he said he needed abu to be more active and that you needed to interact with him, then he proceeded to ask him something about mechanics and then floofs dissapeared again. Hypocrite much? Also the fact that the only thing he really talked about were mechanics doesn't sit well with me either. grrr said: Guess you think he's TPR then?it is not that. but how about this. If you help us catch mafia I won't give you out. ironace said: Hmmm?grrr said: it is not that. but how about this. If you help us catch mafia I won't give you out. You really want to have somebody help you out right? Man thats sad. But sadly, i cannot help you since im not a mafia..not that youll believe me anyway. Anyway, time to go and prepare for my finals..maybe when i return ill just lynch you if the situation is what i think it will be. Why can't you help town with catching scum? Town helps town with catching scum as well. Why wouldn't you want to? TPR after all? Suzune-chan said: Yeah i know, that's why i call him Tubacabra now. Used to call him suzu though, before i had seen you. @Wen294 people usually refer to me as Suzu, so if you are going to use that for Tsubasa then I will probably respond to them too. |
Jun 8, 2017 1:22 AM
#717
Coelestin said: AbuHumaid said: @SuzakuTsubasa @Coelestin he's just tricky and hard to read, so i'm just being careful People voting for logic because they're scared lol. K. @Floofs Do you have a read on ironace and reiynii? Or any other read. I have ironace as neutral for the moment.I didnt like their post about lurking having an advantage since lurking generally gets you scum read, but this may just be a new player not knowing about how parts of the game work. Also, I think ironance said something about having finals in the sign up thread and wanted to start the game after the 8th so I understand their current lack of game play. In regard to ironance/new players, I think it is best to question new players to keep them engaged in the game and to learn more about their alignment, especially lurkers, but I think that new players are generally nervous and overly questioning them can scare them away. This may cause a new player, that could possibly be town, to lurk which will cause other players to read them as scum. I guess what I am trying to say is you should question them but try not to be too overbearing. Logic-slightly scummy- I understand that ironance is a new player and logic's friend, but logic need to let them answer their own questions. It is okay to try and help a new player here and there, but don't go overboard. Logic seems more over powering than actually helping. Wen-slightly scummy-I kind of iffy on wen's vote on ironance. I feel that wen should prioritize their use of their vote to sort out more experienced players that are tougher to read especially early on day 1. I think it should be easy to sort out a new scum player. I think they would either lurk, make a terrible play XD or come off as being coached. Their actions may even lead us to other scum. Reiynii-neutral-Seems kind of fluffy so a lot of their post are NAI. I understand their vote on Abu since Abu is a low key player and doesn't really engage in conversations that are not directly at them. This makes him an easy vote so I don't think the vote is alignment indicative. Abu-neutral-I agree that logic is a tough player, but I think that if you are going to vote for someone you should question them, too. I like that Abu is being more active this game than the last 2 games and I liked that they responded to my questions. I think I found the secret to getting Abu's attention: vote,tag and quote. As a player, I feel that Abu is hesitant. For some reason logic volunteered me to get Abu more active, so I guess I will continue to ask Abu questions to get them involved in the game and hopefully break their hesitance. I'm ready to see Abu venture out and ask questions to other players and have stronger reads. Note: I will have an updated reads when I catch up in the thread. |
Jun 8, 2017 1:43 AM
#719
logic340 said: @Rinto-kun your grace period is over. Thoughts on the lead train and it's voters? @AbuHumaid if you could share your thoughts as you catch up it would be much appreciated. @PTYamin I'm going to find it pretty scummy if you pop up to vote at phase change with the D1 you've had so far @Floofs this is eerily similar to your recent scum game. Same thing I said to PTYamin applies to you (especially with how those two EoD's went in Gakkougurashi!). Just because I did it once doesn't make it my special move XD |
Jun 8, 2017 1:47 AM
#720
Karote said: Floofs said: AbuHumaid said: Floofs said: vote:AbuHumaid @AbuHumaid Lets talk about perk-a-colas! 1. What is your opinion on the perk-a-colas and have you seen something similar used in other games? 2. Do you feel that there are instances where perk-a-colas can have a negative impact on the green faction other than members of other factions obtaining them? 3. If you do feel that there are other instances where they can have a negative impact, what would be the best plan to mitigate or remove the negative effect? 4. How do you feel about the posts below from grrr, logic and shinichi about perk-a-colas? grrr said: @Karote I expect from the Captain to name the most looking town players to stay on the lynch train. This way we will maximize the chance to get Pepsi-a-Cola for town. Also this is will work well against Penta's strong desire to force draw votes : D . Shinichi-Kun said: logic340 said: With the perk system I feel we need to as close to majority lynch as we can. The more townies in the lynch train the better our chances of gaining perks for town. If anything doesnt it gunrantee scum will be on major trains, so it techhincally benefits us to have a smaller lynch train even if we risk giving mafia a perk. Atleast thats my opinion. 1. I think they're unnecessary because they make things more confusing imo at least, and no this the first time i see something like this 2. I'm not sure if i get the question, you mean which one is more likely to happen? 3. idk tbh, how can we remove a negative effect that already happened? 4. grrr's idea is bad, lynch a townie just to get perks? hell no there's no vanilla townies in this game every role is important + town going down in numbers is in mafia's benefit + less chance to lynch mafia so no, Logic's idea isn't bad but risky, mafia will have a place to hide + they'll still have a chance to get a perk, and i agree with Shinichi, less risk + high chance of townies getting a perk because mafia are outnumbered from the first place 1. This is my first time seeing this type of game mechanic. Green faction = most players so hopefully they will get most or all of the perks 2. My wording of the question is kind of confusing so I will try to explain where I was going with it. If other factions get perk-a-colas that would be bad for the green faction (obviously). I was trying to see if you thought this was the only problem with the perks. The other problem I foresee with perks is that it will lead to mass vote changes from everyone to get perks. In the quick start guide one of the strategies used to catch scum is the vote count analysis. I think with the mass vote changes, this strategy may not be helpful. Since this will result in the green faction having one less strategy to use, do you think this causes a disadvantage? 3. I was trying to have question 2 flow into question 3, but it didn't go over well XD I was hoping that you would bring up mass vote changes and talk about an idea to avoid that. I think train with 10 to 15 will make it extremely hard for the green faction to pick out scum (shinichi's point). @Karote Do you think that there is a way that we can avoid this since you are the Capitao? Since you can select 5 people on certain days, is there a way for you to use that somehow? I know this will require most if not all of the players to agree this and if you are okay with mass amounts of pressure, but do you think grrr's idea of you selecting people to be on trains will help stop a mass train and limit scum on the train? Also, I agree with logic that the main train should have 2 maybe 3 more votes than the 2nd largest train. 4. I picked these quotes since they talked about perks to try to give you other ideas about perks and to see if you would think about a mass vote change. You want me tooo ... select certain people to be on the train to reduce of chances for mafia being there? I got an exam in few hours so I will come back later and think about it. I would, but I don't know how the other players feel about it. |
Jun 8, 2017 1:48 AM
#721
Karote said: @Shinichi-Kun, @AbuHumaid, @DenjaX, @Sleipnirr, @Suzune-chan, @grrr, @PTYamin, @Floofs, @Militus, @PentaFlare, @RE1031, @yurkin, @SuzakuTsubasa, @ironace, @Rinto-kun, @reiynii, @wen294, @Coelestin Give me your top 3 suspects and I'll possibly put them in a list tomorrow depending which 3 gets the most votes. Penta, militus, yamin lol. |
Jun 8, 2017 1:53 AM
#722
logic340 said: AbuHumaid said: I would say someone like yurkin could be considered under the radar. They are here posting but they don't really stand out.reiynii said: AbuHumaid said: I'm just repeating what I read in one of the pages, but under the radar is a bit different from a lurker. You're not reading everything while offline, but rather just around.Are you saying that i'm lurking? This is all assumptions based off of the talk in town~ lol stealth yurkin ;3 though i'm not doing it intentionaly. |
Jun 8, 2017 2:06 AM
#723
Just random thing to say that I thought of because it may turn out to be important: @Karote I would advise not listening to the 3 names given by everyone, or at least determine another way to make the list besides a tally. I'm not doing the math here but if there are 4 mafia I think it may be easy for them to sway the tally. |
...better to be hated for what you are than loved for something you are not. |
Jun 8, 2017 2:10 AM
#724
grrr said: It seems most of the people are against mass claiming. Then I have new top offer. I will town read anyone who votes yes! Lets all pick 3 role and claim them. It is like win - win. I can't see anything that might go wrong with this! grrr's such a fun guy :D But i'm still against claiming lol grrr do you scumread me now because i refuse your offer ? >:D |
Jun 8, 2017 2:18 AM
#725
RE1031 said: Just random thing to say that I thought of because it may turn out to be important: @Karote I would advise not listening to the 3 names given by everyone, or at least determine another way to make the list besides a tally. I'm not doing the math here but if there are 4 mafia I think it may be easy for them to sway the tally. Exactly, with the mafia/tpr among us these are not really something i would trust lolz. And its karote's ability after all, better use it the way he find to be right. |
Jun 8, 2017 2:20 AM
#726
Jun 8, 2017 2:30 AM
#727
reiynii reiynii said: I don't think Logic has much to post about yet, and I much prefer the shorter posts than the longer ones anyway! Aside from RVS, I wonder why is everyone so keen on Shinichi-kun's lynch? I'd like to get a cola myself but I don't want to lynch someone for no reason.. I honestly don't even understand how the Cola system works ;-; reiynii said: Shinichi-kun is a good friend and a kind person, he also has a twin which not only makes him very lucky, but also gives him one thing he and Beyonce have in common! I played with him a couple of times but I don't think he is all that to be wary of..? Could be just me though! reiynii said: Shinichi-Kun said: I think you still haven't gotten to the part where people who were talking about that completely ditch the subject. I reckon you shouldn't worry though, early day one trains as you probably know never work out and people often panic at the end of the day and lynch a random player!We just causing panic tho finding the actually scum is much better than trying to figure out a hidden role. Also i think its a fair point to say the people pointing out possible roles my beat said chracter just saying. Questioning the Shin train here quite much. I suppose he’s doing the right thing here cause it is ridiculous. reiynii said: Why not? I think logic is quite trustworthy! Change vote: Abu why do you need someone to pressure you into conversation when you could be involved in one anyway? A very secretive attitude eh! This could be seen as a lazy vote. That’s kind of a weak reason to vote for someone. Sadly, the need to pressure people into talking seems to be normal on MAL. It’s not really alignment indicative… reiynii said: Militus said: I don't think Militus is mafia, because of this post actually. He isn't being lowkey about what he wants and I guess it's a bit of a town tell to me..To kill someone and see the resoults ^^ Provoke people into doing stuff that can revel information Not going to say he isn't a serial killer though, since that guy will want to get rid of everyone as soon as possible! This reminds me of myself saying last game that grrr can’t be scum because his plan couldn’t be made by scum. This one is less accurate though, because it can be more easily faked by mafia. @reiynii Who'd you pick for the five people list if you were Carrot and why? And I'd like you to pick at least two of these for the list: Shinichi, logic, PentaFlare, Coelestin, wen294 wen294 wen294 said: Yuck. ironace said: Well the reasoning was about as yuck as i expected.logic340 said: will you be sharing this reason with us now or later on? the reason isnt anything big, its actually quite simple, im trying to get understand the type of guys im playing with. Since im new, im going to take it easy for a little while This is basically what you do when you want to go with the flow, which from my experience is something you want to do as scum. Vote: ironace This could be seen as an easy vote. There’s arrogance in his replies which is easily abused as said by logic. wen294 said: ironace said: Advantages for YOU, not for town. @Coelestin being a lurker has its advantages you know, immediately voting somebody can be seen as an act of desperation, as it seems to be the case here with Shinichi-Kun, where most of the people are vary of him. immediatly voting somebody is seen as RVS, which is normal. You're just overly concious of being suspected. wen294 said: ironace said: Why the hell does he go from scum to town due to a little bit of doubt.-im going to give pentaflare the benefit of the doubt and declare that hes a townie Should he go from scum to neutral or from neutral to town if it's just a bit of doubt? Adding to that, this could be seen as painting someone scum. wen294 said: Militus said: First of all it's not the first night.SuzakuTsubasa said: Wasn't this majority mostly made during RVS though? It doesn't seem like you care about who gets lynched. I don't care on the first night, we can't get any good evidence yet. Second of all if you don't try to create evidence by interacting we'll never have any good evidence. Well maybe power roles but it should be rather obvious we ain't winning with JUST those. wen294 said: Militus said: So you don't even care who gets lynched so long as it's not you, did i get that right?wen294 said: So is there any other reason for this vote besides sheeping the majority for the sake of not having to vocalize your own opinion? To kill someone and see the resoults ^^ Provoke people into doing stuff that can revel information Meaning you don't even bother trying to lynch scum, or protect town? Talk about an anti-town mindset.... Going for another pea in that same manner. Now the thing is that it’s generally not wrong to go after such people because they need to be dealt with as well. Frustrating, dunno what to say about that, really. wen294 said: logic340 said: Militus said: There's not much to discuss on the first night, we can't get any valid clues yet. I think i found the post you're referring to: AbuHumaid said: WyNdZ said: AbuHumaid said: @WyNdZ why do you have a leaning scum on me? inactivity isn't a good reason and i'm not even inactive anymore Well I disagree that inactivity isn't a good reason. Maybe not a good enough reason to lynch someone but it's a factor. It would be beneficial for the mafia to keep a low profile. The other reasons are that your general disinterest in the beginning such as when you said nothing interesting happened today. It seems like you aren't actively searching for who is mafia. It would be helpful if you tell us your current opinions on the players. Who do you think are town and who do you think are mafia? but i'm active now do i look like i'm trying to lurk? that wasn't disinterest, i genuinely just assumed that we wouldn't say much cause in day 1 we don't have much info, you see i'm not an experienced player so i didn't know how days 1 are like in MS. i can't think of anyone rn other than Melanoid, if he flips town then mafia are doing good at their job, i suspected Zymf too first but when you revealed that he's the confirmed townie he became neutral for me. i believe that after day 1 i will know more It is similar but it kinda gives of a different feeling imo. I do think there's a subtle difference in "have" and "get" where get is showing slightly more game solving intent, but that really is subtle and it might just be a way of personal wording and not the underlying thought process showing through. In the end it's still an anti-town statement to make though, but not one i haven't seen from town before tbh. I’d like to see more actual analysis than the general statements here… wen294 said: Coelestin said: Bit of both.@wen294 Do you actually vote for ironace because you're scum reading ironace or just to get him moving? And who'd you go next for after ironace? Truth be told i'm not sold on him being scum, but it doesn't feel like he attempts to change my, or anybody that voted him, of their opinion. Kinda feels like he doesn't want to show his thought process on the matter and just ignores it, which is a bit of a shame. Then again i didn't ask him anything directly but not sure i like the fact that i have to directly ask him something to get a reaction :\ As for who besides him, i want more to see from Mil 'cause i have trouble sorting him out, i kinda like penta's case on logic which may be partially because it consists of things i normally don't consider. I want Tubacabra to have more of a presence. Abu so far reminds me of his last 2 games where he was scum both times so eh. Hope to see more of him too. Bunch of annoying inactives. Also i remember something about RE feeling off but i forgot what, might have to dig for a bit to find what that was. All in all lots of people i want to see more from, not all THAT many concrete opinions yet. Huh, ok I suppose. wen294 said: ironace said: Isn't this kinda inconsistent with what you said earlier? Following your reasoning on shinichi he can't be town or neutral because they'd want to know about sledge as well so only scum is left. What makes TPR (third party role) any different from town in the amount of knowledge they have/want about sledge? So then you basically conclude he's mafia and not vote? To me your read on shinichi comes across as stronger than your read on mil yet to vote mil. Not sure i get your thought process.ok so i have caught up with the disscussion so heres my answers to some of the questions i remember @coelestin I will not mind sheeping but you need to give atlest some convincing evidence to get my vote. And the reason why i say that shinichi is not neutral is because if he was then he would want to have some level of idea about sledge's role, but he doesnt, which isnt very beneficial to either the town or the 3rd party. Im siding with the fact that he's a mafia for now but i will not vote him for now. Ive actually forgotten why i was suspicious of grrr, he hasent talked after the begining of D1 and so i havent managed to get a better grasp of his character. As i said before my reasons were partly based on a gut feeling and that was the case with pentaflare. And for the moment of truth, the one you all have been waiting for, the person im voting for will be millitus. THIS IS NOT BECAUSE HE COPIED ME OK??!! well he appears to act too sinister and omnious, but his level is one which i believe will be avoided by the mafia. I dont think he is a townie either-if he is, hes trying to act as a shady man.I think he is neutral.I am voting for him because i see the roles of the 3rd party to be the most annoying ones to deal with. If you guys have some thoughts to share on why i could be wrong im willing to listen. But for now, vote:Millitus BTW, im soo popular right now ...hehehe. This is bad. Also mafia can work together and TPR can't. Also the TPR killing role has a higher chance of hitting scum than the chance of mafia killing TPR. In general it's better to try and get rid of the mafia before the third party roles due to these reasons. This could be seen as a continuation of the earlier posts, as a stand alone post it’s really just null. @Wen294 I’d like some analysis/reads from you on the more active players as well. @logic340 @Sleipnirr You were kinda right about his arrogance on ironace :’D Dunno if that’s just his play style though. Even after re-reading I do not feel 100% scum vibes from him, tho maybe that’s just because he only talked about the most obvious anti-town peeps so far. Let’s see what we got here. |
Jun 8, 2017 2:31 AM
#728
Floofs said: @RE1031 @yurkin Since you're online, what do you guys think about my plan in post 720? If Karote is okay with it, would you consider it also? Ehhhhhh..... Problem with it is it requires a ton of cooperation. We're gonna have to agree with who's getting lynched. Then on top of that agree on who's going to vote for them? What if our town reads don't want to lynch that person? Personally, if I'm not on that list of "town" players, I'm not even going for it. I'd like some perks lmao. Also I should be asleep right now. What is wrong with me. |
...better to be hated for what you are than loved for something you are not. |
Jun 8, 2017 2:35 AM
#729
Anyway, hopefully I wake up before phase change! hahaha.... ;-; |
...better to be hated for what you are than loved for something you are not. |
Jun 8, 2017 2:53 AM
#730
Floofs said: @RE1031 @yurkin Since you're online, what do you guys think about my plan in post 720? If Karote is okay with it, would you consider it also? Considering the result is rng-ed, I cant really deny that bigger quantity of towns on a train gives better chances of receiving the perks. Still can see how that will screw the vote analisis, im not fan of jumping on random trains and that sound like giving orders to people how to vote, instead of they deciding it themselves :/ like a fake vote in a way, i dont really like the idea, since i can't see it happening in reallity. >: edit: and i dont really trust all townish people to be town, as if the mafia will try to look scummy on purpose lol |
yurkinJun 8, 2017 3:19 AM
Jun 8, 2017 2:56 AM
#731
Karote said: @Shinichi-Kun, @AbuHumaid, @DenjaX, @Sleipnirr, @Suzune-chan, @grrr, @PTYamin, @Floofs, @Militus, @PentaFlare, @RE1031, @yurkin, @SuzakuTsubasa, @ironace, @Rinto-kun, @reiynii, @wen294, @Coelestin Give me your top 3 suspects and I'll possibly put them in a list tomorrow depending which 3 gets the most votes. Militus, DenjaX, Logic. That's probably one of my biggest problem in mafia game, I only talk when I have something to say. I may end up voting this day though, to me Mil was clearly anti-town in his posts. I think a townie acting anti-town is like a scum. PentaFlare said: Shinichi-Kun said: Coelestin said: Huh? Does that mean that he has done anything out of ordinary for you yet or are you just wary of him? wen294 said: Advantages for YOU, not for town. Playing mafia is like a group project in school. There's always that one guy who just sits around doing nothing and eventually profits from all the other peeps in the group xD Tbf im the same way with jack and penta i almost lways distrust them cause of their capabilities. I mean sightless reality practically lurked every game and he was only scum once out of his like 10 games so chi chi is kinda right. Actually, tbf, I finished making mafia stats for myself recently. I have a 33% win rate as mafia. I'm not as good at playing mafia as everyone thinks. I'm a bit surprised. And we sometimes say you always roll scum but do you actually roll scum that often? grrr said: PentaFlare said: logic340 said: wen294 said: Coelestin is a woman bruh.Coelestin said: DenjaX said: Btw, I ddnt expect the game would start late and my schedule got conflicted so I wont be here for most of day 1... >.< I wont vote if I ddnt catch up much. Poor Denja -patpat-. Fite me >.< Fite me irl bro, i'll rek u so hard u'll die to death. My bet's on Magical Choco Girl Chichi. She would totally beat up wen in a fight. Not every chinese knows kung fu. What... I've been lied to all this time? |
Jun 8, 2017 2:56 AM
#732
Floofs said: Coelestin said: AbuHumaid said: @SuzakuTsubasa @Coelestin he's just tricky and hard to read, so i'm just being careful People voting for logic because they're scared lol. K. @Floofs Do you have a read on ironace and reiynii? Or any other read. I have ironace as neutral for the moment.I didnt like their post about lurking having an advantage since lurking generally gets you scum read, but this may just be a new player not knowing about how parts of the game work. Also, I think ironance said something about having finals in the sign up thread and wanted to start the game after the 8th so I understand their current lack of game play. In regard to ironance/new players, I think it is best to question new players to keep them engaged in the game and to learn more about their alignment, especially lurkers, but I think that new players are generally nervous and overly questioning them can scare them away. This may cause a new player, that could possibly be town, to lurk which will cause other players to read them as scum. I guess what I am trying to say is you should question them but try not to be too overbearing. Logic-slightly scummy- I understand that ironance is a new player and logic's friend, but logic need to let them answer their own questions. It is okay to try and help a new player here and there, but don't go overboard. Logic seems more over powering than actually helping. Wen-slightly scummy-I kind of iffy on wen's vote on ironance. I feel that wen should prioritize their use of their vote to sort out more experienced players that are tougher to read especially early on day 1. I think it should be easy to sort out a new scum player. I think they would either lurk, make a terrible play XD or come off as being coached. Their actions may even lead us to other scum. Reiynii-neutral-Seems kind of fluffy so a lot of their post are NAI. I understand their vote on Abu since Abu is a low key player and doesn't really engage in conversations that are not directly at them. This makes him an easy vote so I don't think the vote is alignment indicative. Abu-neutral-I agree that logic is a tough player, but I think that if you are going to vote for someone you should question them, too. I like that Abu is being more active this game than the last 2 games and I liked that they responded to my questions. I think I found the secret to getting Abu's attention: vote,tag and quote. As a player, I feel that Abu is hesitant. For some reason logic volunteered me to get Abu more active, so I guess I will continue to ask Abu questions to get them involved in the game and hopefully break their hesitance. I'm ready to see Abu venture out and ask questions to other players and have stronger reads. Note: I will have an updated reads when I catch up in the thread. Mhm, thank you, looking forward to your new vote. Vote: reiynii I don't see you accomplishing much here. Lemme see what you got for me <3 |
Jun 8, 2017 3:06 AM
#734
@Coelestin (post too much of a hassle to quote due to being long) Active players referring to...? Active is quite subjective. Also you'll be hard pressed if you're asking a read list from me. Don't expect something you never get, they're just not my thing. I usually only talk about a few people at a time, disregarding the rest for later. "I’d like to see more actual analysis than the general statements here…" Not sure i understand what you mean with this. The 'general statements' are my opinion yeah? So then what's the problem? |
Jun 8, 2017 3:09 AM
#735
SuzakuTsubasa said: That's probably one of my biggest problem in mafia game, I only talk when I have something to say. I may end up voting this day though, to me Mil was clearly anti-town in his posts. I think a townie acting anti-town is like a scum. Hm we think alike on this matter then. Tubacabra said: Some chinese don't just 'know' kung-fu, they ARE kung-fu.grrr said: PentaFlare said: logic340 said: wen294 said: Coelestin is a woman bruh.Coelestin said: DenjaX said: Btw, I ddnt expect the game would start late and my schedule got conflicted so I wont be here for most of day 1... >.< I wont vote if I ddnt catch up much. Poor Denja -patpat-. Fite me >.< Fite me irl bro, i'll rek u so hard u'll die to death. My bet's on Magical Choco Girl Chichi. She would totally beat up wen in a fight. Not every chinese knows kung fu. What... I've been lied to all this time? |
Jun 8, 2017 3:10 AM
#736
Good day everyone |
~I am just one sadist who supports friends~ |
Jun 8, 2017 3:27 AM
#737
wen294 said: @Coelestin (post too much of a hassle to quote due to being long) Active players referring to...? Active is quite subjective. Also you'll be hard pressed if you're asking a read list from me. Don't expect something you never get, they're just not my thing. I usually only talk about a few people at a time, disregarding the rest for later. "I’d like to see more actual analysis than the general statements here…" Not sure i understand what you mean with this. The 'general statements' are my opinion yeah? So then what's the problem? Yeh, it's quite subjective. How about the people you consider more active yourself? -sighs- To be fair, I don't really care about read lists most of the time. I just want people to consider everyone, not just anything that seems easy, which is not exactly wrong, but not exactly right either, because there's people who just dismiss thoughts to go with the flow or just hide behind the easy ones. That's how town gets into a slump. For myself, it's helpful to get questioned to think about my own thought process. If there's nothing noticable for you, that's fine. I don't have anyting against general statements, they're helpful to sort out the most important things. It was interesting to see you get onto the "have" and "get" thing, and I don't think there's much wrong with you going after Militus. It just kind of feels like you're dismissing other views and posts that way. |
Jun 8, 2017 3:29 AM
#738
yurkin said: Coelestin said: @RE1031 @yurkin How long do you intend to stay on PTYamin? I dont see a reason to move it. What is your reason not to move it? |
Jun 8, 2017 3:44 AM
#739
Coelestin said: yurkin said: Coelestin said: @RE1031 @yurkin How long do you intend to stay on PTYamin? I dont see a reason to move it. What is your reason not to move it? I dislike changing my vote unless i change my opinion. So i wont move it untill yamin shows up or i decide to vote someone else before that. >: |
Jun 8, 2017 3:46 AM
#740
Suzune-chan said: @Logic340, @Coelstein, @wen294, @Karote Since you all asked about my Pentaflare vote. I began to notice right away when she made the comment about the jumper potential. Link The topic arose a lot of interest on the topic because that role is not used or as well known as it used to be. Regardless in less then a page of comments penta flips the conversations. Says that talking about mechanics is not worth it. However, they were the first person to bring it up and then just shrugged it off. This struck me as quite odd. Ling After this moment, Penta is praised by several people for their thinking but the majority of the posts were light and fluffy about games people played, alignments, and this stuff about husbands. Is that about the prying you were talking about? |
Jun 8, 2017 3:49 AM
#741
Votes so far! PentaFlare (1) - (Suzune-chan) Shinichi-Kun (1) - (Militus) logic340 (2) - (AbuHumaid, PentaFlare) ironace (4) - (Sleipnirr, wen294, Rinto-kun, grrr) PTYamin (2) - (yurkin, RE1031]) AbuHumaid (1) - (reiynii) Militus (2) - (logic340, ironace) reiynii (1) - (Coelestin) Not voting: Shinichi-Kun, DenjaX, PTYamin, SuzakuTsubasa, Karote Time until Night 1! TIMER! |
~I am just one sadist who supports friends~ |
Jun 8, 2017 4:25 AM
#743
Captain list. Militus - (Sleip, ironace, logic, Abu, yurk, Suzaku, Floofs, Coel) 8 votes grr - (Sleip, ironace, reiynii, RE, wen) 5 votes Wen - (Sleip, logic, RE, Abu, Floofs) 5 votes Logic - (reiynii, Suzaku, Floofs) 3 votes PTYamin - (RE, Abu, yurk) 3 votes Penta - (logic, yurk) 2 votes Shinichi - (ironace) Abu - (reiynii) ironace - (wen) Floofs - (wen) Denja - (Suzaku) reiynii - (Coel) |
Jun 8, 2017 4:38 AM
#744
Less than 9 hours beforeee public executiooon WOHOO! |
~I am just one sadist who supports friends~ |
Jun 8, 2017 4:39 AM
#745
Karote said: Captain list. Militus - (Sleip, ironace, logic, Abu, yurk, Suzaku, Floofs, Coel) 8 votes grr - (Sleip, ironace, reiynii, RE, wen) 5 votes Wen - (Sleip, logic, RE, Abu, Floofs) 5 votes Logic - (reiynii, Suzaku, Floofs) 3 votes PTYamin - (RE, Abu, yurk) 3 votes Penta - (logic, yurk) 2 votes Shinichi - (ironace) Abu - (reiynii) ironace - (wen) Floofs - (wen) Denja - (Suzaku) reiynii - (Coel) Where are all votes for Karote? o: |
~I am just one sadist who supports friends~ |
Jun 8, 2017 5:19 AM
#746
wen294 said: I asked RE a question and Penta intercepted it. Sure I brought it up but Penta decided to have mechanics on his own not because he was asked about it. Big difference in how you're portraying things. Also it's not something that I was spending a bunch of time on yet Penta says let's not spend too much time on this.Suzune-chan said: I think logic was the one who got started with sledge, then penta gave his answer to logic's question. Because people didn't know what a jumper was it turned to mechanics. I really didn't get the feeling that penta wanted to talk about mechanics from the start though, but that the conversation just kinda went there and then he stopped it from going on for too long. @Logic340, @Coelstein, @wen294, @Karote Since you all asked about my Pentaflare vote. I began to notice right away when she made the comment about the jumper potential. Link The topic arose a lot of interest on the topic because that role is not used or as well known as it used to be. Regardless in less then a page of comments penta flips the conversations. Says that talking about mechanics is not worth it. However, they were the first person to bring it up and then just shrugged it off. This struck me as quite odd. Ling After this moment, Penta is praised by several people for their thinking but the majority of the posts were light and fluffy about games people played, alignments, and this stuff about husbands. |
logic340Jun 8, 2017 5:45 AM
Proud Administrator of the D Gray Man FC and OnePunch-Man FC |
Jun 8, 2017 6:16 AM
#747
Everyone please read this carefully Although it is great that people are providing reads and listing people for Karote, since that does show where everyone is in terms of mindset, we can't forget that we are lynching someone in 7 hours. That needs to be our focus right now. Because this is an open set-up, there is a way we should be approach this part of the phase. There seems to be a few suspects that many different people are wary of. To decide the lynch, ad need to run each of these players up one at a time. Focus on them for a moment, force a claim, decide if their claim is believable, and let them defend themself. If they seem good after this, we move on to another suspect. The most suspicious person gets lynched. This approach is very effective at sorting players and getting interaction that is very telling once there have been flips, but go do this, there needs to be focus from the town and an effort to get things done. I would like to start with logic. I have reasons to suspect him, but others have also said they are feeling a little suspicious or wary of him. Let's run him up, force a claim, and get a my heart clearer read, one way or the other. We need other people to vote him though to get him as the leading train. I don't want this to devolve into a last minute scramble. We have 7 hours, so if we start now we can make an educated lynch that is many times more likely to catch scum. |
Be like this seal. It is a happy seal. ~Review Guidelines~ | ~Recommendation Guidelines~ | ~Mafia Society~ |
Jun 8, 2017 6:31 AM
#748
@Pentaflare interesting idea but how does that work out exactly? Sounds like it'll end up being a repeat of points that the player already replied to which then drags on for overly long and just ends up with annoyed people. |
Jun 8, 2017 6:32 AM
#749
SuzakuTsubasa said: PentaFlare said: Shinichi-Kun said: Coelestin said: Huh? Does that mean that he has done anything out of ordinary for you yet or are you just wary of him? wen294 said: Advantages for YOU, not for town. Playing mafia is like a group project in school. There's always that one guy who just sits around doing nothing and eventually profits from all the other peeps in the group xD Tbf im the same way with jack and penta i almost lways distrust them cause of their capabilities. I mean sightless reality practically lurked every game and he was only scum once out of his like 10 games so chi chi is kinda right. Actually, tbf, I finished making mafia stats for myself recently. I have a 33% win rate as mafia. I'm not as good at playing mafia as everyone thinks. I'm a bit surprised. And we sometimes say you always roll scum but do you actually roll scum that often? 40% of my games. More often than I should on average. (I screwed up the quoting on this, so if you have deleted quotes, that's why) |
Be like this seal. It is a happy seal. ~Review Guidelines~ | ~Recommendation Guidelines~ | ~Mafia Society~ |
Jun 8, 2017 6:34 AM
#750
wen294 said: @Pentaflare interesting idea but how does that work out exactly? Sounds like it'll end up being a repeat of points that the player already replied to which then drags on for overly long and just ends up with annoyed people. No. I have no idea how that would happen. This actually results in new content instead of long conversations that drag on. Run people up, get claims, decide. This is not a new idea like you seem to be implying. This is how to play open setups. |
Be like this seal. It is a happy seal. ~Review Guidelines~ | ~Recommendation Guidelines~ | ~Mafia Society~ |
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