| What if I believed that that short people should all die, the United States should adopt Sharia, that condoms should be illegal, freedom is the antithesis of math, and 1+1=15... Would it still be just a personal belief, with no bearing on my intelligence? After all, as the logic goes, people can believe whatever they want, and they have the right to their own beliefs, right? Tell me you wouldn't judge someone who innocently believes that rape should be legal... It's just a personal belief. |
| My subjective reviews: katsureview.wordpress.com THE CHAT CLUB. |
| Yeah, the beliefs that you hold would still be personal whether or not they were moral. You do have the right to believe that short people should die, the United States should adopt Sharia, condoms should be illegal, freedom is the antithesis of math, and 1+1=15. These beliefs may be nonsensical, but they would still be yours. EDIT: As for judging, people are also free to judge anyone based on their beliefs. In fact, you should judge people based on their beliefs because beliefs are what define a person's personality. You only need to respect a person's right to have beliefs, not the beliefs themselves. I've said the word "belief" too much, I'm going to go pronounce a lot of hard consonants now. |
 I miss image BBC Code. May this sig stand as a testament to SSJMaster's power. |
| “You are not entitled to your opinion. You are entitled to your informed opinion. No one is entitled to be ignorant.” ― Harlan Ellison |
 I sometime have funky grammar, sorry about that. If you can correct some of my post, you would be an angel. |
SolidBarrel said: My point is why do people say "It's just a personal belief" as if that explains everything?Whats your point? |
| My subjective reviews: katsureview.wordpress.com THE CHAT CLUB. |
| Post this in the SAO subforums and it might actually have a context. |
| As a child, I was told that society is a melting pot of talents; knowledge and experience combined to form important alloys that will contribute to mankind. When I got to highschool, however, I thought that it's more like a river in which the water represents our peers while we ourselves are the stones in the river. Constant erosion by mindless majority sheeping has made us lose our unique edge. After I hit the age of 18, I realized that I've been wrong all along. Society is no melting pot. Society is no river. Society is a person, a very skilled rapist, and he has fucked us all. |
BloodRequiem said: It has a context here, because there's a bunch of people here who believe people can believe whatever they want and it will be a-okay.Post this in the SAO subforums and it might actually have a context. |
| My subjective reviews: katsureview.wordpress.com THE CHAT CLUB. |
-Miyu- said: I'm not that attached. This is a casual forum, so we might as well be discussing this rather than whether incest or picking up 11 year olds on MAL is acceptable. Someone post an entertaining thread on unicorns and we could do that too.katsucats said: katsu, you're getting to attached to this. Just ignore those people, and be glad your mentality isn't as corrupt as theirs.SolidBarrel said: My point is why do people say "It's just a personal belief" as if that explains everything?Whats your point? |
| My subjective reviews: katsureview.wordpress.com THE CHAT CLUB. |
| Even if you have freedom of speech, saying such things without any consideration for those who could be offended is unethical/immoral. If your opinions/beliefs are voiced in a way where it affects a considerable amount of people for the worse, it is deemed intolerable. Otherwise, it doesn't matter! That kind of thinking really degresses society though. |
  |
katsucats said: SolidBarrel said: My point is why do people say "It's just a personal belief" as if that explains everything?Whats your point? Because people are weak! Its hard to accept this rotten world (lol) So they "choose" to believe a more simpler path.. |
BloodRequiem said: Post this in the SAO subforums and it might actually have a context. Clever man, made me chuckle katsucats said: My point is why do people say "It's just a personal belief" as if that explains everything? Well in certain context, "It's just a personal belief" is all the explanation that needs to be given. For instance, 1: "Why didn't you like the movie?" 2: "I felt like there were too many shirtless scenes to be enjoyable. I don't like people without their shirts on; it's just a personal belief." and there you have it. In other contexts, using "it's just a personal belief" doesn't explain anything, or is irrelevant. 1. "I think _____ is the best anime that ever anime'd ever in the history of anime. It's also much better than your favorite anime." 2: "Why?" 1: "It's just a personal belief." In which case, while it is true that the opinion is just a personal belief, more detail and elaboration would be necessary in order to have a worthwhile discussion. I don't want to say the word "belief" again. |
I miss image BBC Code. May this sig stand as a testament to SSJMaster's power. |
| Believe whatever the fuck you like just don't force it upon others. |
 |
| Just noticed that using the word belief instead of opinion is quite funny. |
I sometime have funky grammar, sorry about that. If you can correct some of my post, you would be an angel. |
| I enjoy ignorance, it's blissful. That's my personal belief. ;D |
Hapax said: Just noticed that using the word belief instead of opinion is quite funny. Interesting observation you make here. Generally I think of it as Belief: holding something to be true Opinion: Having a belief in something subjective |
I miss image BBC Code. May this sig stand as a testament to SSJMaster's power. |
| Yea, I'm also kinda upset as this broke my wonderful /thread quote :/ |
I sometime have funky grammar, sorry about that. If you can correct some of my post, you would be an angel. |
Hapax said: Yea, I'm also kinda upset as this broke my wonderful /thread quote :/ We could try again. "Too often we... enjoy the comfort of opinion without the discomfort of thought." -JFK /thread |
I miss image BBC Code. May this sig stand as a testament to SSJMaster's power. |
| The whole concept of using "its a personal belief" to justify something can be used, but using it before a discussion starts is just a way people try to get out of explaining their opinion because either they cannot do it (avoidance of showing their weaknesses) or they know they are wrong (ish) and do not want to be put in a place where they will seem defeated/stupid/wrong/whatever it may be because everyone wants to leave a conversation of any type with their dignity intact. If it is used at the end of a conversation after a topic has been talked about, chalking it up to a personal beliefs is fine. People don't have to agree at the end of a conversation because neither person may be right. I think Teddy Roosevelt said that if he could be right 50 percent of the time he would be happy, and that man was pretty on top of his shit. It doesn’t matter how radical the topic is because things change over time. Can you imagine how conversations about women’s rights were 500 years ago? At the end of the day though everyone has the right to believe whatever they want. As long as it doesn’t interfere with how other people live their lives, people can believe anything. They may be wrong, but you can’t control them. You can only control yourself. |
katsucats said: SolidBarrel said: My point is why do people say "It's just a personal belief" as if that explains everything?Whats your point? People do not understand what the significance of the phrase is. You are entitled to think what you like; but on the understanding that your opinions can questioned should you decide to express them or act upon them. |
| Losing an Argument online? Simply post a webpage full of links, and refuse to continue until your opponents have read every last one of them! WORKS EVERY TIME! "I was debating with someone who believed in climate change, when he linked me to a graph showing evidence to that effect. So I sent him a 10k word essay on the origins of Conservatism, and escaped with my dignity intact." "THANK YOU VERBOSE WEBPAGES OF QUESTIONABLE RELEVANCE!" |
| I personally believe that U.S. Americans are unable to do so because, uh, some people out there in our nation don't have maps and, uh, I believe that our education like such as in South Africa and, uh, the Iraq, everywhere like such as, and, I believe that they should, our education over HERE in the U.S. should help the U.S., uh, or, uh, should help South Africa and should help the Iraq and the Asian countries, so we will be able to build up our future, for our children |
| The Art of Eight |
ChillyWilly said: The whole concept of using "its a personal belief" to justify something can be used, but using it before a discussion starts is just a way people try to get out of explaining their opinion because either they cannot do it (avoidance of showing their weaknesses) or they know they are wrong (ish) and do not want to be put in a place where they will seem defeated/stupid/wrong/whatever it may be because everyone wants to leave a conversation of any type with their dignity intact. This is so true sometimes. |
|
| You're free to believe what you want to believe and I'm free to judge you for it. I don't think anybody disagrees with that. I think yer preaching to the choir here... |
| I am important. I have a girlfriend. Check out my podcast |
ChillyWilly said: Thanks, this makes a lot of sense. If a discussion ends in a subject where there is a lack of evidence to prove one claim over another, then it is reasonable to state personal beliefs. Stating it before then is an intellectually dishonest and a way to duck under a rock and dodge facts.The whole concept of using "its a personal belief" to justify something can be used, but using it before a discussion starts is just a way people try to get out of explaining their opinion because either they cannot do it (avoidance of showing their weaknesses) or they know they are wrong (ish) and do not want to be put in a place where they will seem defeated/stupid/wrong/whatever it may be because everyone wants to leave a conversation of any type with their dignity intact. If it is used at the end of a conversation after a topic has been talked about, chalking it up to a personal beliefs is fine. People don't have to agree at the end of a conversation because neither person may be right. I think Teddy Roosevelt said that if he could be right 50 percent of the time he would be happy, and that man was pretty on top of his shit. It doesn’t matter how radical the topic is because things change over time. Can you imagine how conversations about women’s rights were 500 years ago? |
| My subjective reviews: katsureview.wordpress.com THE CHAT CLUB. |
Erenle said: Good quote, but no one ends my threads but Luna_."Too often we... enjoy the comfort of opinion without the discomfort of thought." -JFK Erenle said: Hapax said: Just noticed that using the word belief instead of opinion is quite funny. Interesting observation you make here. Generally I think of it as Belief: holding something to be true Opinion: Having a belief in something subjective Good point. If it's something subjective, then having an opinion is granted. However, often times this phrase is used to describe beliefs about objective matters. Sometimes the person making the assertion even admits that his beliefs may be meaningless, yet he still holds them. Why?! I mean, WTF. It is exactly as your quote says: replacing an opinion with actual thought. If X is an incomprehensible or factually incorrect proposition, and someone states: "It's just my personal belief that X is true, there is no other reason." Then I have the license to assume that person is an "Personal belief" becomes tautology: it states the obvious. It is not an explanation, it does not answer anything, but it's an excuse. |
katsucatsJan 5, 2013 9:48 PM
| My subjective reviews: katsureview.wordpress.com THE CHAT CLUB. |
| "it's a personal belief" is a huge copout phrase that is most typically used as an excuse to shove discriminative opinions down throats. |
katsucats said: If a discussion ends in a subject where there is a lack of evidence to prove one claim over another, then it is reasonable to state ... ...that you don't know. |
HapaxJan 5, 2013 9:55 PM
I sometime have funky grammar, sorry about that. If you can correct some of my post, you would be an angel. |
nqthing said: I think it's more in hopes of avoiding criticism and arguments."it's a personal belief" is a huge copout phrase that is most typically used as an excuse to shove discriminative opinions down throats. |
| ^_^ |
Comogury said: I think it's more in hopes of avoiding criticism and arguments. yeah this too. |
Hapax said: Ideally, yes. It should only come down to beliefs if:katsucats said: ...that you don't know.If a discussion ends in a subject where there is a lack of evidence to prove one claim over another, then it is reasonable to state ... 1. The topic is subjective in nature. 2. It comes down to minutiae (i.e. axioms) that must be taken for granted, yet cannot be proven. 3. It is a hypothesis for a scientific experiment, and further actions are being taken to determine the truth. |
| My subjective reviews: katsureview.wordpress.com THE CHAT CLUB. |
katsucats said: What if I believed that that short people should all die, the United States should adopt Sharia, that condoms should be illegal, freedom is the antithesis of math, and 1+1=15... Would it still be just a personal belief, with no bearing on my intelligence? Well, you could have one of those beliefs (maybe not the ones about math) you mentioned and be, for example, a particle physicist with several influential papers/experiments in his career... After all, as the logic goes, people can believe whatever they want, and they have the right to their own beliefs, right? Yes, but they don't have the right to go in a short people massacre... Tell me you wouldn't judge someone who innocently believes that rape should be legal... It's just a personal belief. Yes, I do agree that there's nothing wrong with judging other people's beliefs. |
on drinkbeer said: My point people with nothing better to do like to spam threads because their souls are hollow.SolidBarrel said: Whats your point? |
| My subjective reviews: katsureview.wordpress.com THE CHAT CLUB. |
| I think people are entitled to whatever "personal beliefs" they want, as long as they don't choose to act upon certain beliefs that would be harmful to society. For example, I'm sure there are plenty of guys on here who would consider themselves "lolicon". Although I personally think it's kind of creepy, as long as they don't actually go out and prey on little girls, I'm fine with them having that belief. On the other hand, people are also entitled to judge whomever they want based on their personal beliefs. So while it's okay to have certain beliefs, that doesn't make one immune to judgement. |
Adair said: Beyond just having a belief, how about when people state, "It's just a personal belief."?I think people are entitled to whatever "personal beliefs" they want, as long as they don't choose to act upon certain beliefs that would be harmful to society. For example, I'm sure there are plenty of guys on here who would consider themselves "lolicon". Although I personally think it's kind of creepy, as long as they don't actually go out and prey on little girls, I'm fine with them having that belief. On the other hand, people are also entitled to judge whomever they want based on their personal beliefs. So while it's okay to have certain beliefs, that doesn't make one immune to judgement. For example: Person A makes a statement. Person B argues against that statement. Person A responds, "It's just a personal belief." What puzzles me is the idea that "It's just a personal belief" is a legitimate response against valid points brought up against an argument. |
| My subjective reviews: katsureview.wordpress.com THE CHAT CLUB. |
katsucats said: Adair said: Beyond just having a belief, how about when people state, "It's just a personal belief."?I think people are entitled to whatever "personal beliefs" they want, as long as they don't choose to act upon certain beliefs that would be harmful to society. For example, I'm sure there are plenty of guys on here who would consider themselves "lolicon". Although I personally think it's kind of creepy, as long as they don't actually go out and prey on little girls, I'm fine with them having that belief. On the other hand, people are also entitled to judge whomever they want based on their personal beliefs. So while it's okay to have certain beliefs, that doesn't make one immune to judgement. In that case, it depends on the situation. I think someone already mentioned some examples, but basically, it all comes down to whether you share that belief, right? It's hard to understand certain points of view when you don't agree with them. I think what people mean when they use that phrase is that they just don't want to argue about it anymore, because it's hard to explain and it wouldn't change anything. |
Adair said: I can understand that sentiment, although there's a whole world of difference betweenI think what people mean when they use that phrase is that they just don't want to argue about it anymore, because it's hard to explain and it wouldn't change anything. 1. I don't have any proof, and don't wish to argue, so it's just a belief at the moment, and 2.. It's just a belief, therefore it can't be wrong. I don't have any proof when people say this whether in their head they mean #1 or #2, but it's pretty significant in my opinion. |
| My subjective reviews: katsureview.wordpress.com THE CHAT CLUB. |
katsucats said: Adair said: I can understand that sentiment, although there's a whole world of difference betweenI think what people mean when they use that phrase is that they just don't want to argue about it anymore, because it's hard to explain and it wouldn't change anything. 1. I don't have any proof, and don't wish to argue, so it's just a belief at the moment, and 2.. It's just a belief, therefore it can't be wrong. I don't have any proof when people say this whether in their head they mean #1 or #2, but it's pretty significant in my opinion. Well, I think it's probably #1 for most people, but #2 comes in when you start talking about religion and such. Honestly though, I think it's more of a colloquial expression that people use as an excuse to not have to think too much. And they probably don't go through such a complex thought process when those words come out of their mouths either. |
| I haven't really been following the forums that much lately, so there's lot of anecdotal stuff being said about people using 'it's just a personal belief' in response to objective matters. If that's true, then... yeah. But it's hard to say anything without anything solid to attach the OP to. |
 |
Jack_Rav said: That was deliberate. I didn't want it to be about anything in particular, but one could reasonably assume (since that phrase usually crops up in this context) that it's about belief in God, or perhaps some socio-political stance -- something that's hard to defend, yet it hits close to home.But it's hard to say anything without anything solid to attach the OP to. |
| My subjective reviews: katsureview.wordpress.com THE CHAT CLUB. |
katsucats said: What if I believed that that short people should all die, the United States should adopt Sharia, that condoms should be illegal, freedom is the antithesis of math, and 1+1=15... Would it still be just a personal belief, with no bearing on my intelligence? After all, as the logic goes, people can believe whatever they want, and they have the right to their own beliefs, right? Tell me you wouldn't judge someone who innocently believes that rape should be legal... It's just a personal belief. I could agree to the first half as a personal belief, but saying 1+1=15 would be too much Belief is just a name, and it doesnt encompass any attributes by its own, because of science and technology we have now, most beliefs we have are "logical beliefs" while in the old days when ppl worshiped gods they might be called as "spiritual belief", but in your situation i'd just call that illogical and self centered belief that most people wouldn't accept |
| kek |
| Oh well two sayings. Opinions are like assholes everyone has one. When you Assume you make an Ass out of You and Me. |
| It's all about doing what you want. |
 |
Legendre said: Sounds familiar.I enjoy ignorance, it's blissful. That's my personal belief. ;D But yeah, I usually just ask "then why do you believe this?" or something of the sort if they did nothing to answer the question. ie. "Why do people like this anime?" "Because I enjoyed it, it's just my opinion." Well the obvious question is, why did they enjoy it? Was it because it was a comedy that had jokes they laughed at? A worthy plot or characters? They just like lolis? Something is better than nothing. It's like saying "I liked it because I liked it." Well err, that was really meaningless. |
| I don't think a belief is a point of view, I think it is a fact to the person that has the belief. Other people may think that fact is wrong, but to the believer, it is always right. How do we know that 1+1 isn't 15? Because other people's belief's have been imposed upon us. That is how the whole thing works. Someone has a belief->someone else agrees with that belief->that belief spreads->it becomes a commonly accepted fact, rather than an individual's belief. That is how society works; the passing on of beliefs. |
| "He's not dead, he's Katsura." |
HiddenVoice said: Because it is wrong by definition. Anyone who believes this doesn't understand the semantic concepts behind the symbols "1", "+", "=", and "15".How do we know that 1+1 isn't 15? |
| My subjective reviews: katsureview.wordpress.com THE CHAT CLUB. |
More topics from this board
» What are your plans for Halloween 2024?Yuno - Yesterday |
25 |
by Maou_heika
»»
9 minutes ago |
|
» The Proust phenomenonRobertBobert - 2 hours ago |
2 |
by Mualani
»»
38 minutes ago |
|
» Thought about Black CloverOmBerry12_Bleach - 12 hours ago |
4 |
by Zarutaku
»»
39 minutes ago |
|
» How do you live nostalgia?Zakatsuki_ - Yesterday |
11 |
by Zarutaku
»»
49 minutes ago |
|
» How close or not close would you be with your sibling(s) if they weren't your sibling(s)?bucciest - 9 hours ago |
13 |
by Zarutaku
»»
55 minutes ago |