| Ok, I'm really excited about these news, currently I'm a senior level student at my University (FIU) Florida International University, I study business Administration. Look what I found on today's Yahoo News: http://education.yahoo.net/articles/most_valuable_degrees.htm?kid=16K8L So, what do you guys think do you agree (even though this is pretty much fact, not opinion)... |
| If history has taught anyone anything. It is that degrees are meaningless. |
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| ^indeed. go watch some anime XD |
alexcampos said: (even though this is pretty much fact, not opinion)... don't be stupid http://www.college-living.com/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=117&Itemid=2 http://www.careeruniversities.com/top_ten_most_valuable_college_majors.htm http://www.scholarships.com/resources/college-prep/choosing-a-major/top-ten-highest-paying-college-majors.aspx Any sort of ranking is subjective, depending on the weighting given to the various parameters. Also, I don't see any graduate level degree, which generally provide more lucrative opportunities in life. Oh, and being successful in business is more about building a strong network of references, rather learning shit and getting a piece of paper from a school. |
SaitoeAug 3, 2010 10:54 AM
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alexcampos said: (even though this is pretty much fact, not opinion)... Ahahaha, no seriously.. those are some pretty crappy, bare-boned articles on that site. And that degree is also one of the most saturated, where they often produce more degrees than jobs available. A MBA is often a nice, pretty tack on for whatever industry you're in. |
ichigo03 said: WOW, I never thought Business Administration would be the best. Then again once you have a BBA you can go anywhere with it, I guess it makes sense for it to be the best college degree. You will need an MBA if you want to go anywhere with a business degree period. |
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| It's fine, I'll find some way to become rich with a Classics and English Lit degree. |
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alexcampos said: So, what do you guys think do you agree (even though this is pretty much fact, not opinion)... I knew I this line would get to people, and that's exactly why I put it. But in all seriousness, I think people should read the entire article to understand what they're trying to say. MisterSaito said: don't be stupid http://www.college-living.com/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=117&Itemid=2 http://www.careeruniversities.com/top_ten_most_valuable_college_majors.htm http://www.scholarships.com/resources/college-prep/choosing-a-major/top-ten-highest-paying-college-majors.aspx Any sort of ranking is subjective, depending on the weighting given to the various parameters. Also, I don't see any graduate level degree, which generally provide more lucrative opportunities in life. Oh, and being successful in business is more about building a strong network of references, rather learning shit and getting a piece of paper from a school. Meh, what YEAR are those links from??? at least I gave you an article that's from TODAY, I'm not saying they're wrong or right, but it would be nice to know that they are UP TO DATE. also, you totally contradict yourself with your last sentence, if a "piece of paper" isn't important, than why even bother with the links, why even bother with an education? *rolls eyes* |
alexcampos said: I knew I this line would get to people, and that's exactly why I put it. also, you totally contradict yourself with your last sentence, if a "piece of paper" isn't important, than why even bother with the links, why even bother with an education? *rolls eyes* Those links were less about the importance of the piece of paper and more about showing you that all of these ranking studies vary. In other words, they're pretty much total BS. When you have 10 different "studies" that all give different rankings, how reliable could any of them be?That piece of paper is only part of the equation in finding a job. Anyone currently employed with a higher level of education will tell you that working experience and networking are far more important in workplace. If you're a senior business student and you don't have this idea in your head, I worry for you. |
Xjellocross said: That piece of paper is only part of the equation in finding a job. Anyone currently employed with a higher level of education will tell you that working experience and networking are far more important in workplace. If you're a senior business student and you don't have this idea in your head, I worry for you. Wow, thank you so much for your life advice, everything will be ok now. [/sarcasm] So, you think I don't already know this, how much do you know about me??? You should've read my "about alexcampos" blog to at least know that I have plenty of working experience in the field I'm studying (more than 3 years), and I also know that I can't get direct promotions unless I have that "piece of paper", I also have recommendations, I've had internships, tons of real life experience outside of school that can only further my career. Seriously did you think I would do such a subjective topic if I couldn't back it up? Try again buddy. |
| I think rankings of such are essentially pointless. Even if it is the best degree by objective standards and despite a changing outlook on job trends, what can be called now as the best degree really doesn't have anything to do with what the best degree is for any given student. That's what research, advisors, and getting your feet wet is about. A degree of Business Admin could be something utterly worthless to a kid who has talent in medicine or art or education. But in the end, I find that having a degree is better than not having one. And I think a lot of people see a degree as a ticket to getting some big time job in whatever when it opens doors and gives you a competitive edge, but in the end, it is YOU who has to pave your path. You work hard to get a degree but you still have to work hard to get where you want. In ways, a degree could be described as owning a vehicle. It gets you places but you still need to know how to get where you want to go and you still need to pump gas and maintain the vehicle. But it's better than having none (depending where you live) where you are confined to where your legs can take you or what you can get out of public transportation. Having a degree is better than trying to establish yourself in the 'right' career for you with just a high school diploma. But I can think of people and myself who would be better off studying something suited for us and our abilities and interests than Business Admin. I can think of people who probably would get nowhere with that degree because they don't have what it takes to take advantage of it. But to make such rankings, it takes for granted a lot of other factors, some of which I mentioned. |
aixelsydAug 3, 2010 11:52 AM
| Best degree is Philosophy. Because there you actually learn to argue. It is the only degree where you do. Therefore, only people who have a degree in Philosophy can actually argue that their degree is best. Quod erat demonstrandum. (Sadly, since only we have learnt to argue, only we can see which arguments are valid, and can therefore not actually demonstrandum it to anyone not sharing our glorious knowledge.) alexcampos said: also, you totally contradict yourself with your last sentence, if a "piece of paper" isn't important, than why even bother with the links, why even bother with an education? *rolls eyes* "...being successful in business is more about building a strong network of references..." 1. The area discussed is what degree is best; 2. Saito mentions that a thriving business require connexions more than it does degrees; 3. You then claim that Saito linking studies which disagree with yours, which are on the subject of what degrees are best, is not coherent with saying (2). These are totally different matters; don't conflate them. 4. "more", not "the sole" - education is still important, and nothing he said precluded this. Black-white fallacy. That's only one place where you stumble on weird fallacies. Please don't be so antagonistic; if you are going to argue, do so well, or do it pleasantly, absolutely preferably both, but never neither. |
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Kaiserpingvin said: "...being successful in business is more about building a strong network of references..." I've already responded to this statement in my last comment. Kaiserpingvin said: Best degree is Philosophy. Because there you actually learn to argue. It is the only degree where you do. Therefore, only people who have a degree in Philosophy can actually argue that their degree is best. Quod erat demonstrandum. (Sadly, since only we have learnt to argue, only we can see which arguments are valid, and can therefore not actually demonstrandum it to anyone not sharing our glorious knowledge.) alexcampos said: also, you totally contradict yourself with your last sentence, if a "piece of paper" isn't important, than why even bother with the links, why even bother with an education? *rolls eyes* "...being successful in business is more about building a strong network of references..." 1. The area discussed is what degree is best; 2. Saito mentions that a thriving business require connexions more than it does degrees Don't complain to me, go complain to Yahoo news, I'm sure they're a bunch of idiots who don't know what they're talking about. Kaiserpingvin said: Best degree is Philosophy. Subjective, just like this article, just like all the links, AND JUST LIKE ALL THE COMMENTS, including mine. Also, wow three MAL mods all posted on this topic to share their OPINION on why this article and my comments are so OFF, I gotta say I'm honored that you feel the need to correct me and tell me what you guys think is right and wrong. In the end I posted a link, not my own opinion, if you feel so badly about it, go complain to Yahoo News, when it comes to topics such as this everyone thinks their major is the best, which is alright, since they don't want to feel that they made a wrong choice. I'm not trying to fight with anyone, I guess my ultimate message would be to go to school and get a degree (WHICH EVER ONE) as long as you get an education and that "piece of paper" you can go far in life. Remember guys the best investment you can ever make in life is to go to school :) |
| Pfff.........College degree. Better off dropping out and live to see the dream |
| I'll stick with mine, thanks. A business degree doesn't seem all that fun. If only we'd pick degrees out of hearts and not wallets, I'd be going for Philosophy. |
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| really? Business Administration? No thank you. I'll stick working towards my Elementary Education Degree. I say choose something that makes you happy. You have only one life to live. :3 |
| I'm going for a B.S. in Business Admin, with an emphasis in marketing. It's what I like. But do what you like, seriously. I dropped engineering because I didn't like the science and math. It wasn't that I was bad at it though. |
| College Degrees are definitely what you make of it. Some students go through College without learning anything (yes you can pull it off). But since you are paying to go there (or your parents or whatever), one really should make the best of it. High schools are certainly more in trouble than Colleges, as they'll pass anyone. A degree helps you snag a job faster, depending on what you are looking to go into anyway. |
Mr-Freeman said: I'll stick with mine, thanks. A business degree doesn't seem all that fun. If only we'd pick degrees out of hearts and not wallets, I'd be going for Philosophy. Business is TONS of fun, what's more fun than entering a free unregulated market, and flood it with sub prime loans so that the economy later collapses and everyone who was part of the "fun" is richer than countries, while all the other idiots are left in bankruptcy and ruins. TRUST ME, business rules the world and those of us who understand and can manipulate it will always find ways to get rich. Honestly without any jokes, these businessmen are powerful people who pretty much rule the world, I personally don't want to be part of any "unethical" and "evil" actions but I know that the biggest oxymoron in life is "Business ethics". So in conclusion you can join business to try to do it the "right" way and live a mediocre life or you can do it the "wrong" way and manipulate, lie, and cheat your way to the top :) |
alexcampos said: Mr-Freeman said: I'll stick with mine, thanks. A business degree doesn't seem all that fun. If only we'd pick degrees out of hearts and not wallets, I'd be going for Philosophy. Business is TONS of fun, what's more fun than entering a free unregulated market, and flood it with sub prime loans so that the economy later collapses and everyone who was part of the "fun" is richer than countries, while all the other idiots are left in bankruptcy and ruins. TRUST ME, business rules the world and those of us who understand and can manipulate it will always find ways to get rich. Honestly without any jokes, these businessmen are powerful people who pretty much rule the world, I personally don't want to be part of any "unethical" and "evil" actions but I know that the biggest oxymoron in life is "Business ethics". So in conclusion you can join business to try to do it the "right" way and live a mediocre life or you can do it the "wrong" way and manipulate, lie, and cheat your way to the top :) I was questioning the fun in getting a business degree. Not the fun in using that business degree. I'm taking a business class right now and its really boring. I had more fun in my psychology class, which is a major put down to business. Which of course, everything just depends on the person. Money isn't really a factor in my eyes. I just don't want to wake up to a boring job. |
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| That degree in no way fits my skills and interests. Definitely not the best major for me. By the way, I disagree with the articles definition of valuable. |
Mr-Freeman said: I'll stick with mine, thanks. A business degree doesn't seem all that fun. If only we'd pick degrees out of hearts and not wallets, I'd be going for Philosophy. Funny thing is my violin teacher is a Philosophy PhD and he did teach in uni but also made, I imagine, a lot of money because he established his own corporation until he retired, I guess. So really, there's no reason why your pocket book has to suffer if you pursue philosophy or whatever subject interests you. Of course, my parents told me to study what I was passionate about. And of course, I am happy for the OP in finding a degree they can believe in. Finding a degree is hard. I know I get plenty of shit from people who think my degree is worthless but I feel I made the right choice. |
aixelsydAug 3, 2010 3:01 PM
Mr-Freeman said: I was questioning the fun in getting a business degree. Not the fun in using that business degree. I'm taking a business class right now and its really boring. I had more fun in my psychology class, which is a major put down to business. Which of course, everything just depends on the person. Money isn't really a factor in my eyes. I just don't want to wake up to a boring job. Oh, yeah, you're right the classes are VERY boring, there are times where I have to fight the urge to fall asleep. BUT, even though it's boring the lessons I learn and the degree I will hopefully acquire are worth it. I enjoy business, I currently work at an office with an environmental services company, I have my own cubicle, my own computer, I ABSOLUTELY LOVE IT. We don't work weekends, we get EVERY holiday, 2 weeks vacation, the office area is always "lively" and you never know what's going to happen. |
alexcampos said: This is where I'm turned off of business by my probably excessive stereotypes.cubicle |
zharnotczar said: alexcampos said: This is where I'm turned off of business by my probably excessive stereotypes.cubicle Oh it's not so bad, in fact how do you think I make 70% of the comments on MAL??? Would you also believe that many of the other stereotypes of business are also true? Corruption...............YES (I've seen it with my own eyes) Office relationships.....YES (again, I've seen it, and almost was a part of it) Gambling on sports...... Definitely YES (I've been part of it, even with my own supervisor!!!) |
alexcampos said: zharnotczar said: alexcampos said: This is where I'm turned off of business by my probably excessive stereotypes.cubicle Oh it's not so bad, in fact how do you think I make 70% of the comments on MAL??? Would you also believe that many of the other stereotypes of business are also true? Corruption...............YES (I've seen it with my own eyes) Office relationships.....YES (again, I've seen it, and almost was a part of it) Gambling on sports...... Definitely YES (I've been part of it, even with my own supervisor!!!) How about the lunch taking one? |
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| Dudes... You all know getting an English degree is best. |
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Mr-Freeman said: alexcampos said: zharnotczar said: alexcampos said: This is where I'm turned off of business by my probably excessive stereotypes.cubicle Oh it's not so bad, in fact how do you think I make 70% of the comments on MAL??? Would you also believe that many of the other stereotypes of business are also true? Corruption...............YES (I've seen it with my own eyes) Office relationships.....YES (again, I've seen it, and almost was a part of it) Gambling on sports...... Definitely YES (I've been part of it, even with my own supervisor!!!) How about the lunch taking one? If someone ever took my lunch I'd make sure to make his/her day a nightmare ;) But, it's never happened to me, once in a while someone "accidentally" drinks someone else's soda or water, but never a whole lunch. |
| So this thread is to... what? I will assume boast about how much you love your main subject. Since I don't go to college and never will I'll speak of University :V Philosophy is fucking great, my previous joke aside. You won't get rich. You won't get prestige. You won't get all that many jobs. But you could get a job as a professor of philosophy - a decent pay for basically sitting and writing nonsense about other nonsense, with good vacations and never any overtime or other annoyances. Moreover, nothing teaches you rationality better than it (given you read proper philosophy and not Hegel). Personally I find nothing more desirable than being constantly as rational as can be. If someone does dearly desire to be irrational that is their thing, however, and I am not one to judge. Lastly, logic, ethics and epistemology is useful in pretty much any endeavour. To think critically, economically, and with clear eye for the factors relevant or not is what any kind of learning ultimately aims to involve; philosophy gives the most primitive, and therefore powerful and applicable forms of it. But, yeah, it's a fringe subject and only for us lunatic enthusiasts. That does not mean the fruit is great for us who know to savour it. I'll take linguistics this term. Let's see how that works out. |
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| You'll love the linguistics~ |
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| There's no such thing as a best degree. People value different things in terms of lifestyle, type of work, etc. - which leads them to value certain professions over others and thus makes certain degrees more valuable in reaching even somewhat vague goals. I'm not even going to try to go into people having different skills. Also, degrees aren't useless - many fields require specific degrees related to them, and a degree in general shows that you were smart and/or diligent enough to graduate from a college at all. Work experience probably trumps it in the long-run, but often the degree is needed to get a certain start, and work experience is usually the most recent thing on a resume, so of course it should get a lot of attention. I guess I'll stop at that. EDIT: the values part isn't even just about profession - though I made that the focus since that's where this debate usually seems to focus - but it can even just be what interests a person / what they want to learn. And some majors are really good at building certain skills... yeah, I'll stop for real now. |
LordWolfeyeAug 3, 2010 4:21 PM
zharnotczar said: That degree in no way fits my skills and interests. Definitely not the best major for me. By the way, I disagree with the articles definition of valuable. definitely. I am not interested in that kind of "education" I also really think getting a phd is best. :< and I may diss phil degrees but secretly I think they can be cool. So ilu kaiser <3 You can hf with your business degree, but I don't care for that sort of thing. |
| I didn't want to bore anyone with these stats but I guess I'll throw them out there: Graduation rates really vary but the consensus is that about 70% of students graduate HS in the U.S of that group only about 33% will attend a four college. of that group only about 67% will actually graduate a four year college. So in the end let's say you came from a class that started as 1000 students of all those students only about 154 of them will graduate with at least a Bachelor's degree or 15%. Again, some of these numbers might be off, and some of the data is not completely accurate, but it is still generally considered a fact that only about 15-20% of Americans will graduate with at least a Bachelor's degree, and only about 8-9% will have a Masters or higher. sources: http://www.csmonitor.com/USA/2009/0609/p02s13-usgn.html http://wiki.answers.com/Q/What_percentage_of_high_school_graduates_go_to_college_2008-2009 http://askville.amazon.com/percentage-students-graduate-high-school-college/AnswerViewer.do?requestId=14737326 http://www.usatoday.com/news/education/2002-06-05-education-census.htm |
| What are those stats supposed to mean? College isn't for everyone. Let alone getting a masters or Ph.D. Go with what you want like everyone's saying. Trying to back it up with numbers is a waste of time. I have a Ph.D. WHOOPIE! Doesn't mean I think it's the BEST answer. I wouldn't recommend that path to many people and usually warn others to really consider what they'll be committing themselves to for 5+ years. No one I knew in my field went into it because some study said to do so. |
Kaiserpingvin said: Language and philosophy: my two favorite thingsI'm taking a bunch of language and philosophy classes this next year. It's gonna be nice. I'm actually excited to go back to school this year. |
shinkeikaku said: What are those stats supposed to mean? College isn't for everyone. Let alone getting a masters or Ph.D. Go with what you want like everyone's saying. Trying to back it up with numbers is a waste of time. I have a Ph.D. WHOOPIE! Doesn't mean I think it's the BEST answer. I wouldn't recommend that path to many people and usually warn others to really consider what they'll be committing themselves to for 5+ years. No one I knew in my field went into it because some study said to do so. Dude relax, I'm not trying to do anything other than give stats and numbers in order to inform people. If anything it's supposed to prove how hard it is to achieve a degree or from someone else's point of view the bad the U.S is as a nation in terms of college graduates. College is not for everyone, some people think it's the right path others think it's a waste of time, I don't really care about why people go or don't go to college, I'm just putting out the stats , THAT'S ALL. |
shinkeikaku said: Guidance counselors, college advisors, and the like do students a disservice when they do nothing but proselytize to the tune of "more education is always better," when obviously, for a large portion of the population, it is not. There are tons of students in colleges and universities today who would, vocationally speaking, be much more suited for some type of trade school, or perhaps going straight into the workforce, but instead are scraping by in some university program (perhaps not even to finish) just because "it's the thing to do." While the idea that everyone should have a higher education seems to be based in noble aspirations, it has caused something of an unfortunate effect.What are those stats supposed to mean? College isn't for everyone. Let alone getting a masters or Ph.D. Go with what you want like everyone's saying. Trying to back it up with numbers is a waste of time. I have a Ph.D. WHOOPIE! Doesn't mean I think it's the BEST answer. I wouldn't recommend that path to many people and usually warn others to really consider what they'll be committing themselves to for 5+ years. No one I knew in my field went into it because some study said to do so. Most of us have probably heard the old adage that "a college degree today is the equivalent of a high school diploma in our grandparents' generation." This is true to a large extent, as, with some exceptions, both do (and did) more to prove you are 'trainable' in a field rather than impart some kind of fundamental knowledge. I mean, I'm sure there are some people who go to university for their own intellectual self-aedification, and that's great, but most people see it simply as a requisite step to get access to that high-paying job they want. They are, more often than not, correct as the degree becomes not a source of skills that they employ on the job, but rather a tool to help potential employers weed through the increased percentage of the young workforce who also have a newly-granted degree. And then reality hits when young people see that, while the percentage of the population who have degrees have increased greatly, the actual percentage of jobs that require them and pay accordingly has only increased moderately, leaving many with a degree that is not serving as the key to a high-paying job they expected. Ph.D.s are a perfect case of this, as the entire educational "upshift" does not stop at B.A./B.S., but goes all the way up. A good graduate advisor will sit down with their student and explain the real job outlook for a particular graduate degree. I will never forget when my advisor, a good-natured lady on the verge of retirement and who had virtually seen everything in academia, pointed out to me that when she took her Ph.D., it was a virtual job guarantee and that you would be in demand almost anywhere. Then she introduced me to a couple of the younger part-time undergraduate faculty that I had only occasionally come into contact with, and who had been teaching college-to-college in an itinerant fashion, since the oversaturation and easy availability of graduates in the field allowed the universities to hire and release them at will, with little hope of eventual tenure. This was somewhat shocking to me as I had never been forced to sit down and look at what a degree means from an economic point of view instead of an idealistic one. I'm not sure what this means in the long run. I hate to imply that, by more people getting education, it lessens the overall economic value of it; however, I can't dismiss that possibility either. Maybe in another 50 years we'll all be Ph.D.s and we'll need a couple of new degrees higher than it to separate the pack. Of course, those people won't be able to enter the workforce until they're somewhere around 45 or 50. :) |
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| The best for what exactly ? Business administration degrees are good to get a nice job, but that's all. For people who have higher ambitions, they aren't of great use because leadership, the spirit of entrepreneurship and creativity (yes, administration and management can be creative) are things you can't get through degrees. Actually, the most successful entrepreneurs don't have a BBA or MBA or any degree of this kind. Degrees, especially in business administration, are overrated. We need practical knowledge and creativity, not degrees, but sadly, most of b-schools kill creativity and offer programs high on theory and low on practical. |
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| I find that very hard to believe. I will stick with mine, thanks. |
 Where there is no imagination there is no horror. || Arthur Conan Doyle || Happy Halloween! |
| It is only a bachelor's degree. |
| Even when I was in crowd, I was always alone |
| I find that it is weird that mining or petroleum engineering isn't top 10? |
| Even when I was in crowd, I was always alone |
Shifter-Rage said: Care to explain this theory? I don't suppose you're a NEET?If history has taught anyone anything. It is that degrees are meaningless. Also, I can see how those degrees would rank high in terms of versatility and time to completion, but there are dozens of degrees which lead to far better salaries (both starting and mid-career) and to richer career opportunities. |
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