When you combine 2 completely generic anime stereotypes into a character as their personality, are they stereotypical/original?
| Like say you wanted your character to be harsh and denial to their own feelings just like tsundere as well as stoic just like kuudere and you decided to fuse this stereotypes so you got a character like this one Or you can fuse any other generic stereotypes here. Are they original? Or still generic? Good or Bad? Other opinions? Discuss. |
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| Two generics don't make an original. If anything most of the combinations that can be derived from two dere types just fuck up the character. Honestly, why do you think Yukino is a good example? |
Gesu- said: Two generics don't make an original. If anything most of the combinations that can be derived from two dere types just fuck up the character. Honestly, why do you think Yukino is a good example? because she is harsh, during the first time she meets hachi she instantly spouts harsh remarks while blushing, yet tried not to losing her body composure and saying it in a somewhat stoic way. She is later desribed in S2 that all her harsh remarks are mostly a facade to cover up her weakness, which resembles a tsundere. |
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You said: I call this type of character "vague bitch".Like say you wanted your character to be harsh and denial to their own feelings just like tsundere as well as stoic just like kuudere and you decided to fuse this stereotypes so you got a character like this one She's rude and contrarian for seemingly no reason. There's hints of some sort of dilema/sweetness on the inside, but it's all very vague and convoluted in order to support the pretext of mystery and intrigue (which imo backfires and just makes her annoying, boring, and needlessly complex without the benefit of being interesting). Everything about her presence needs to scream sophistication and composure and loftyness (even though she's needlessly rude like a spoiled child). On a character level that's how she wants to be seen, but let's be honest, that's how the writer wants you to see her too; every word out of her mouth, even in her "honest" moments where the supposed facade is lifted, is dripping with unholy importance, even if it's nothing. The more vague, convoluted, and confusing, the better. Vague bitches are hardly original. |
Red_KeysJun 18, 2016 11:14 AM
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You said: Gesu- said: Two generics don't make an original. If anything most of the combinations that can be derived from two dere types just fuck up the character. Honestly, why do you think Yukino is a good example? because she is harsh, during the first time she meets hachi she instantly spouts harsh remarks while blushing, yet tried not to losing her body composure and saying it in a somewhat stoic way. She is later desribed in S2 that all her harsh remarks are mostly a facade to cover up her weakness, which resembles a tsundere. Is she really a tsundere though? As far as I've seen she's harsh to everyone.. She calls herself 'honest'. Either way she's not enough tsun.. |
Gesu- said: You said: because she is harsh, during the first time she meets hachi she instantly spouts harsh remarks while blushing, yet tried not to losing her body composure and saying it in a somewhat stoic way. She is later desribed in S2 that all her harsh remarks are mostly a facade to cover up her weakness, which resembles a tsundere. Is she really a tsundere though? As far as I've seen she's harsh to everyone.. She calls herself 'honest'. Either way she's not enough tsun.. She isn't honest, it's revealed in S2. and lol isn't there's many tsunderes that got pissed off rather easy? it's just that usually they more of feels embarrassed when it comes about romantic relationships. |
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| Sound like personality of that girl in Berserk. Guts girlfriend. |
| This salad is salty favored |
| trap and reverse trap es boy or es girl? I don't know |
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You'll got a futa with oppais and manly clothings/face. |
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| Really depends doesn't it Maybe dojikko kuuderes would be interesting |
lasterrending said: You may be joking, but believe it or not, it's been done. Sort of. As for the tsundere/kuudere combination, that's not all that original. Off the top of my head: Koneko from High School DxD Yami from To Love-Ru I'm sure I could think of others if I put some effort into it. Ah you're right Yami is kinda stoic too lol |
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| How about the "I don't give a fuck" mc + "I have to do everything to be nice to everyone!" generic mc? For example, Hachiman/Oreki/Kyon + Emiya Shirou. |
| I hate nice girls. If they so much as say hello, it stays on my mind. If they return texts, my heart races. The day one calls me, I know I'll look at my call history and grin. But that's just them being nice. People who are nice to me are also nice to everyone else. I almost end up forgetting that. If the truth is cruel , then lies must be kind. That's why kindness is a lie. I gave up on always expecting it, always mistaking it, and even hoping for it. Someone who's' worked so hard at being alone doesn't fall for the same trick twice. I'm a veteran at this. I’m the best when it comes to losing. That's why I'll always hate nice girls. |
| I have seen this done a bunch of times in anime, but I also think some fans are too focused on labeling the characters as one of the "dere" archetypes instead of making up their opinion on them for their individual traits. Not every single character was created to fit within the range of a certain archetype, but because they are a little stoic fans will deem them as a "generic kuudere" and if they're a little bit of a hardass they label them a "generic tsundere". Although, like Red_Keys said, the type of character your describing sounds like a vague bitch. I don't even know what show you're talking about though so I won't go into detail when it comes to judging whatever character this is. However, a character can still be generic even if they don't fit one of the 'dere' labels, and another character can still be original even if fans put them in one of the 'dere' categories. Fusing two different stereotypes together doesn't really subtract or add anything to their qualities or making them more unique. But there are quite a few characters I consider unoriginal that others have tried to convince me are "complex", so what do I fucking know fam? lol |
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Arrieta said: How about the "I don't give a fuck" mc + "I have to do everything to be nice to everyone!" generic mc? For example, Hachiman/Oreki/Kyon + Emiya Shirou. Hachi actually isn't that lazy either. He helped others by his own intentions while as for Oreki is well, Chitanda often forced him and Fuyumi broke his laziness. The same goes to Kyon and Haruhi, I guess. Perhaps they'll just become more in the middle, I think. KonaKoffee said: I have seen this done a bunch of times in anime, but I also think some fans are too focused on labeling the characters as one of the "dere" archetypes instead of making up their opinion on them for their individual traits. Not every single character was created to fit within the range of a certain archetype, but because they are a little stoic fans will deem them as a "generic kuudere" and if they're a little bit of a hardass they label them a "generic tsundere". Although, like Red_Keys said, the type of character your describing sounds like a vague bitch. I don't even know what show you're talking about though so I won't go into detail when it comes to judging whatever character this is. However, a character can still be generic even if they don't fit one of the 'dere' labels, and another character can still be original even if fans put them in one of the 'dere' categories. Fusing two different stereotypes together doesn't really subtract or add anything to their qualities or making them more unique. But there are quite a few characters I consider unoriginal that others have tried to convince me are "complex", so what do I fucking know fam? lol Well yep, people have different method of viewing character depth, I guess. For me characters like Taiga is the most well-written tsundere while that character I put on spoiler feels somewhat unnatural. |
YouJun 18, 2016 11:47 PM
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You said: Well yep, people have different method of viewing character depth, I guess. For me characters like Taiga is the most well-written tsundere while that character I put on spoiler feels somewhat unnatural. She is the epitome of the tsundere archetype for most of us anime fans, so I get that. I wasn't a huge fan of her character though, but I see the appeal when people tell me why they like her. though I gotta be real with you |
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| Most characters are not pure tsundere or whatever-dere but this definition generalises them so a combination of two generic stereotypes doesn't make an original character. However an original character can be a combination of 2 or more stereotypes if generalized. |
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KonaKoffee said: You said: Well yep, people have different method of viewing character depth, I guess. For me characters like Taiga is the most well-written tsundere while that character I put on spoiler feels somewhat unnatural. She is the epitome of the tsundere archetype for most of us anime fans, so I get that. I wasn't a huge fan of her character though, but I see the appeal when people tell me why they like her. though I gotta be real with you Oh nooooooooo you have joined the Acyka cult T___________T Well I'd like to say that Taiga is the deconstruction of the stereotypes itself considering how her family background affects her daily life and childish mentality and it's somewhat reconstructed in the end of the story as it deals more with 'being mature' theme, and also |
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haha nah, Misato is best girl overall. I like all the characters in NGE, in terms of writing (even though I may have not liked their character's personality), but I didn't hate Asuka or anything. I liked Shinji more though, and definitely Misato. You said: Well I'd like to say that Taiga is the deconstruction of the stereotypes itself considering how her family background affects her daily life and childish mentality and it's somewhat reconstructed in the end of the story as it deals more with 'being mature' theme, and also Yea, part of me started to like Taiga at a certain point. I still don't really like her character though lol sorry, but honestly I feel you on your statement in regards to her. And I haven't watched the rebuilds yet so idk what Asuka is like in it, but I am hoping it'll be somewhat good when I begin it (although I don't expect to be as good as the original series or anything). |
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KonaKoffee said: haha nah, Misato is best girl overall. I like all the characters in NGE, in terms of writing (even though I may have not liked their character's personality), but I didn't hate Asuka or anything. I liked Shinji more though, and definitely Misato. You said: Well I'd like to say that Taiga is the deconstruction of the stereotypes itself considering how her family background affects her daily life and childish mentality and it's somewhat reconstructed in the end of the story as it deals more with 'being mature' theme, and also Yea, part of me started to like Taiga at a certain point. I still don't really like her character though lol sorry, but honestly I feel you on your statement in regards to her. And I haven't watched the rebuilds yet so idk what Asuka is like in it, but I am hoping it'll be somewhat good when I begin it (although I don't expect to be as good as the original series or anything). Haha #TeamMisato ftw ;) And well Asuka is less of a bragger in the rebuild and more cooperative. |
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| No. Mixing a bunch of tropes isn't enough. You need to connect them. If the combination of these stereotypes created something new, if it shed light on these tropes then it'll be original. If it's just a character who switches from kuudere to tsundere then you haven't done anything. |
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TheBrainintheJar said: Mixing a bunch of tropes isn't enough. You need to connect them. If it's just a character who switches from kuudere to tsundere then you haven't done anything. I agree, especially when meta is involved. Example A: |
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Red_Keys said: You said: I call this type of character "vague bitch".Like say you wanted your character to be harsh and denial to their own feelings just like tsundere as well as stoic just like kuudere and you decided to fuse this stereotypes so you got a character like this one She's rude and contrarian for seemingly no reason. There's hints of some sort of dilema/sweetness on the inside, but it's all very vague and convoluted in order to support the pretext of mystery and intrigue (which imo backfires and just makes her annoying, boring, and needlessly complex without the benefit of being interesting). Everything about her presence needs to scream sophistication and composure and loftyness (even though she's needlessly rude like a spoiled child). On a character level that's how she wants to be seen, but let's be honest, that's how the writer wants you to see her too; every word out of her mouth, even in her "honest" moments where the supposed facade is lifted, is dripping with unholy importance, even if it's nothing. The more vague, convoluted, and confusing, the better. Vague bitches are hardly original. I totally agree with this statement. |
| That's not how you make a character... Supposedly. It depends, really. So many factor to consider. But, to make it easy and quick, many cheap writer stick to the archetype. Stick, as in there's nothing different beside how they look really different each other. But again, many writer too, use archetype for the looks. Some example in anime : Tsundere - Twintail, Yellow hair. Kuudere - Straight, black hair. Etc etc etc. |
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| It will still obviously be stereotypical. Depending on what archtypes are combines, it could be pretty interesting or even incredibly annoying. I can imagine what a disaster tsundere+yandere will be like. Already feeling sorry for the poor MC just imagining it. |
Maou_heikaSep 8, 2017 2:20 AM
| You shouldn't make a character with dere in mind, that would only make it generic no matter what. No I am off, going to make a combination of tsundere and yandere....... OH GOD WHAT HAVE I DONE??!?!?! |
| 2 wrongs don't make a right. Similar situation here. |
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| It'll probably just make the character more shit. The result of combining two dere types always result in disaster. Just avoid dere characters in general. |
"Most anime makers are basically autistic" - Hideaki Anno |
Bourmegar said: You shouldn't make a character with dere in mind, that would only make it generic no matter what. No I am off, going to make a combination of tsundere and yandere....... OH GOD WHAT HAVE I DONE??!?!?! Pudding from One Piece is pretty much that. |
| [quote=Wasshio message=52235659] KousakaK said: It'll probably just make the character more shit. The result of combining two dere types always result in disaster. Just avoid dere characters in general. But deres are something even in real life can be seen./quote] Well thats just right. Its quite simple to notice dere irl if you love to tease people. I myself also called dere by one of the classmates. but talk about generic into one. Yandere + Kuudere ? How does that make any sense? I think TS forgot that personality isnt just dere, Theres more into personality rather than just "Dere". |
Wasshio said: KousakaK said: It'll probably just make the character more shit. The result of combining two dere types always result in disaster. Just avoid dere characters in general. But deres are something even in real life can be seen. Most Puerto Rican women are tsunderes by nature :'V Puerto Rico sounds horrible then. I can see that real people can be deres, but I don't really like people who act like certain dere types. Deredere is the only one that is somewhat ok. |
"Most anime makers are basically autistic" - Hideaki Anno |
Wasshio said: KousakaK said: Puerto Rico sounds horrible then. I can see that real people can be deres, but I don't really like people who act like certain dere types. Deredere is the only one that is somewhat ok. Actually, they're not really acting like tsunderes. It's just something rather natural. Like heck I myself am rather tsundere-ish and I live there so. But I don't really hit anyone. People who deliberately go out of their way to act tsundere are the worst kind of people. Can say the same with kuudere and the others. If it's culturally appropriate and it's what's generally seen as normal, then it's ok i guess. I just don't really understand why that's even a thing. Good thing you don't hit anyone though. |
"Most anime makers are basically autistic" - Hideaki Anno |
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