DO NOT discuss the source material beyond this episode. If you want to discuss future events or theories, please use separate threads.
DO NOT ask where to watch/download this episode or give links to copyrighted, non-fair use material.
DO NOT troll/bait/harass/abuse other users for liking or disliking the series/characters.
DO read the Anime Discussion Rules and Site & Forum Guidelines.
DO NOT ask where to watch/download this episode or give links to copyrighted, non-fair use material.
DO NOT troll/bait/harass/abuse other users for liking or disliking the series/characters.
DO read the Anime Discussion Rules and Site & Forum Guidelines.
| Ok thx for not spoilering :) Yeah I definitely feel that a season 2 is needed not only to repair relationships but also to repair the story, maybe that's part of the problem with the last few episodes. I'd have to say Golden Time was the better romance anime of 2013 but this was still very memorable. JC Staff don't stray from the happier ending most of the time thank god ;/ |
AnistylezJan 13, 2014 3:46 AM
| http://www.youtube.com/swiftstylez - My AMV's. I would really appreciate any comments and ratings :] |
MagicFlier said: He said that because a sketch of a CG from CC and Coda was posted on that twitter, so it's a big hint. It's not a sketch of a certain CG. And that's only from Coda. |
 |
| I cried for Setsuna in the end. :( |
Swiftstylez said: Ok thx for not spoilering :) Yeah I definitely feel that a season 2 is needed not only to repair relationships but also to repair the story, maybe that's part of the problem with the last few episodes. I'd have to say Golden Time was the better romance anime of 2013 but this was still very memorable. JC Staff don't stray from the happier ending most of the time thank god ;/ Yaa definitely , i feel the same. |
| I like realism and this is how real as it gets. I don't mind a bad ending as long as I got the message the writer is trying to send. Welcome to my favorites. 10/10 |
| Loved this anime so much. Seriously one of the best or the best I've watched.. It made me shed some tears and I don't know how to express how my heart felt after watching this. Just perfect. I'm really hoping for a second season to finish it up. |
hyperknees91 said: It's not like it has to have sex to be good. It can all be implied (much like how NANA did things). plus the uwaki route is Kazusa's normal ending. But yeah to break it down. Setsuna's true end = most happy go lucky. Kazusa's true end= most over the top and dramatic Kazasa's normal end = most realistic Guess it just depends on preference. They'll probably give us Kazusa's true end because people love drama. Oh please, Kazusa's true ending is the only ending that actually resolves the issue brought up in the second part of IC: that is, to accept one's true feelings instead of viewing it with guilt. The problem with Kazusa is that the only thing she's adept at doing, besides playing piano, is running away. Haruki, on the other hand, is super adept at being unable to accept the fact that he can't run away from his true feelings, and that forcing a relationship is never going to work. Kazusa's true ending is the only ending that aims at resolving these two key themes at work, bringing a proper thematic conclusion to an otherwise unresolved IC. What does Touma normal ending do? Show exactly what IC's second half already showed: keeping a forced relationship, while feeling guilty about the other end. Do we really need a rehash of what already happened, in more severe form? On the other hand, Setsuna's true ending fails to resolve either of the two themes, and comes off as a bit too idealistic. Everything just...worked out in the end. Kazusa's true ending is a tale of maturity, sacrifice, and ultimately, finding peace within oneself. Is that "overly dramatic"? I don't think so. |
ZeroHumor said: hyperknees91 said: It's not like it has to have sex to be good. It can all be implied (much like how NANA did things). plus the uwaki route is Kazusa's normal ending. But yeah to break it down. Setsuna's true end = most happy go lucky. Kazusa's true end= most over the top and dramatic Kazasa's normal end = most realistic Guess it just depends on preference. They'll probably give us Kazusa's true end because people love drama. Oh please, Kazusa's true ending is the only ending that actually resolves the issue brought up in the second part of IC: that is, to accept one's true feelings instead of viewing it with guilt. The problem with Kazusa is that the only thing she's adept at doing, besides playing piano, is running away. Haruki, on the other hand, is super adept at being unable to accept the fact that he can't run away from his true feelings, and that forcing a relationship is never going to work. Kazusa's true ending is the only ending that aims at resolving these two key themes at work, bringing a proper thematic conclusion to an otherwise unresolved IC. What does Touma normal ending do? Show exactly what IC's second half already showed: keeping a forced relationship, while feeling guilty about the other end. Do we really need a rehash of what already happened, in more severe form? On the other hand, Setsuna's true ending fails to resolve either of the two themes, and comes off as a bit too idealistic. Everything just...worked out in the end. Kazusa's true ending is a tale of maturity, sacrifice, and ultimately, finding peace within oneself. Is that "overly dramatic"? I don't think so. I'm not talking about the intents, rather the execution. The intent of Kazusa's true end is good like you said, but the execution is poor on almost all fronts if you ask me. Kazusa's normal end is kind of a foil of IC if you ask me. Nothing wrong with that. Plus the conclusion is completely different anyway. Plus the side heroine routes also cover the things Kazusa's TE do to some degree as well. So it's not like it's doing anything that special, it's just doing it in a more over the top fashion. |
hyperknees91Jan 15, 2014 6:05 PM
| The Feels man THE FEELS! *crys* |
leemeru said: It's not all that dramatic. They actually could have done much much worse if you ask me. It's hard to say which end they'll pick but I do have to agree with zero humor on Kazusa's true end being the one that resolves most of everything. Normal end? It IS basically IC all over again except 7 years later. Setsuna's ending is more of a romanticized ending. All goes well everyone's happy and they solve their problems really quickly. Satelight could either bring lots of rage with normal end (tho we have a conclusion it's kind of a no win scenario for any of the shippers), have the most drama in Kazusa true or be happy-go-lucky and choose Setsuna true (If Setsuna were either the most popular character in japan they would probably do it. People tend to like the perfect happy ending, but anime has proved wrong countless times that they don't always pick the perfect ending). Well yeah I'm not arguing it could be done worse (like they could have actually gone through with any of the stuff I just mentioned, instead of using it as a cheap scare for the audience). But it still took me out of the game because of how comical it got was the main point I was making. Like said before, there were silly moments in the game but this is when they went overboard and I could no longer take the story seriously That being said, I'm pretty sure they will pick Kazusa's TE like most of you said. Not that I mind as it's just personal preference. Hence why I'm fine with them adapting either of the 3 endings, because they are all viable for the fans that prefer any of them. |
hyperknees91Jan 16, 2014 7:18 AM
hyperknees91 said: leemeru said: It's not all that dramatic. They actually could have done much much worse if you ask me. It's hard to say which end they'll pick but I do have to agree with zero humor on Kazusa's true end being the one that resolves most of everything. Normal end? It IS basically IC all over again except 7 years later. Setsuna's ending is more of a romanticized ending. All goes well everyone's happy and they solve their problems really quickly. Satelight could either bring lots of rage with normal end (tho we have a conclusion it's kind of a no win scenario for any of the shippers), have the most drama in Kazusa true or be happy-go-lucky and choose Setsuna true (If Setsuna were either the most popular character in japan they would probably do it. People tend to like the perfect happy ending, but anime has proved wrong countless times that they don't always pick the perfect ending). Well yeah I'm not arguing it could be done worse (like they could have actually gone through with any of the stuff I just mentioned, instead of using it as a cheap scare for the audience). But it still took me out of the game because of how comical it got was the main point I was making. Like said before, there were silly moments in the game but this is when they went overboard and I could no longer take the story seriously That being said, I'm pretty sure they will pick Kazusa's TE like most of you said. Not that I mind as it's just personal preference. Hence why I'm fine with them adapting either of the 3 endings, because they are all viable for the fans that prefer any of them. Trust in the director ;) I don't know if I'm the only one here who thinks this, but I think that the anime was better than the VN's IC. Indeed, the immersion of a visual work depends heavily on execution, and I'm inclined to believe that with the proper directing, the anime can smooth out the rougher elements of the VN. By the way, do you happen to know any precedent where the anime didn't adapt the true route even though one exists? I haven't played any other VNs, so I have no clue. Also, regarding the adaptation of the Coda normal route, isn't it kinda...difficult? It's one thing to include one sex scene that's heavily censored and executed tastefully in IC (unlike the VN, which graphically showed Kazusa being deflowered in bright lighting...), but it's a whole different beast to adapt a story like the normal route without disturbing a good amount of people. "OH HARUKI, DO ME HARDER"~ |
| Yeah it's pretty much up to the director. I can almost guarantee they can make a more serviceable adaption then the visual novel was if they put effort into it. lawl I think they can write around a lot of that if they want. They aren't going to be able to do a perfect adaption by any stretch and it's not their job too. Really they are just going to have to be creative (kinda like the steins gate director was). WA2, like other long VN's, is just too long to get a perfect adaption. Umineko...lawl....... |
hyperknees91Jan 16, 2014 11:30 AM
| The last two episodes were a pain to watch. What the heck, I liked Touma, I liked Setsuna but god that main protagonist, hated him from the beginning. Doesn't deserve either of the heroines. Overall, 7/10 for this anime, it was a good ride. |
| Aliis si licet, tibi non licet. |
| that's why i watch final EP of awry anime, before add it to my MAL list, cause i ton't like that kind of endings, i think i would accept ending where 1 of the main dies to this kind of ending, but i'm not of fan of tragedy neither, just saying that i would rather watch tragedy ending then this ending, cause death in unavoidable thing, but if people are dumb that just ticks me of unnecessarily |
Sugram22 said: cause death in unavoidable thing, but if people are dumb that just ticks me of unnecessarily You think you're so great that you can do something different from how the characters in this show did? You think you can make everyone happy when two girls want you to pick one of them? You think that you can brush aside one of you're female friends from your group of three just to date the other one despite the one you actually loved was hiding feelings for ya? Well... I don't know what to say anymore. |
| ヽ(ｏ`皿′ｏ)ﾉ ヽ(ｏ`皿′ｏ)ﾉ ヽ(ｏ`皿′ｏ)ﾉ ヽ(ｏ`皿′ｏ)ﾉ ヽ(ｏ`皿′ｏ)ﾉ |
hackrabbits said: Sugram22 said: cause death in unavoidable thing, but if people are dumb that just ticks me of unnecessarily You think you're so great that you can do something different from how the characters in this show did? You think you can make everyone happy when two girls want you to pick one of them? You think that you can brush aside one of you're female friends from your group of three just to date the other one despite the one you actually loved was hiding feelings for ya? Well... I don't know what to say anymore. life is duff, i ton't know what i would do, but that dark haired girl should have stay'd with the guy cause he loved her back, its better the 1 suffers then all 3 suffer, so if i would be their friend, my advice would be for the dark haired girl, go for it, u cant trow away love awry time 1 of ur friend fall for same guy u do, it would be my advice as a bystander & also if i would be their friend, as u say'd u can't make all happy, well i know its easier say'd then done, but awry time i see something like that i feel like i wrote in my post the dark hired girl's choice result, all 3 will go separate way's, & maybe neither of them will find happiness cause they have bitter taste in their mouth also the other girl needs to understand u ton't always get what u want, all 3 can be happy if the girl with one sided love gives up & say's ton't mind me, just be together, well i know its hard, but its the only good choice, there was 1 girl more who liked the same guy & she would have gone after him if she would have seen chance. but she gave up cause shes smarter & knows there is nothing she can do & she say'd it to her & say'd that i did not like u as much as the dark haired, i got that from her flashback u cant always think for others, sometimes u need to think for yourself to |
Sugram22Jan 19, 2014 4:06 PM
| Sugram actually got it right. The characters continue to make dumb choices because they won't think for themselves and think for the sake of others too much. Hence they just end up hurting themselves, and alot more people all the more as a consequence. That's kind of the main message WA2 has to say honestly. Try to keep everyone happy, and you end up keeping no one happy, not even your self. |
hackrabbits said: Sugram22 said: cause death in unavoidable thing, but if people are dumb that just ticks me of unnecessarily You think you're so great that you can do something different from how the characters in this show did? You think you can make everyone happy when two girls want you to pick one of them? You think that you can brush aside one of you're female friends from your group of three just to date the other one despite the one you actually loved was hiding feelings for ya? Well... I don't know what to say anymore. as much as i got from their chat & flashbacks, wasn't the black haired girl first & then her Female friend try'd to get between then? confessed, & dark haired felt so bad & backed off, but she should not cause she was first, so if the black haired would have just went for it then she would not have be the villain cause the other girl was who try'd to get in between them, so the other girl would have been the villain, o ye she is villain either way, cause she knew how soft her friend is, well she should have if they were friends |
| @leemeru Kazusa was first so she had awry right to gave into her feelings for Haruki, cause Setsuna was trying to get between them, well at first Setsuna try'd to brush him of & bush Kazuma & Haruki together, but later Setsuna got between them & new all 3 are unhappy, smart choice what can i say, Haruki will never date Setsuna for what she did, cause she became the reason Kazuma left him, i know people in love are selfish sometime, well some people in love are, & i ton't mean just selfish, but 2 selfish, like if i cant have u no1 will, well that's the extreme case of extreme selfishness, its just i ton't like that type of ending :) i think Kazusa should have went for it & accept Haruki as her BF cause Setsuna was the1 who try'd get to between them no the other way around, she should have realized that she missed the train & its 2late, even School Day's is good example for this, what mite happen if u ton't realize that its 2late, in School days the girl who did not realize it was at fault that MC turned in to a man whore, not saying that MC is blameless, he was idiot to, but look what happened cause of her actions, she got killed MC got killed & the other girl lost her mind |
Sugram22Jan 20, 2014 11:13 AM
| I wouldn't call any of them villains. Just kinda...stupid is all. They didn't think about their actions at all and that's why they all suffered. So they kind of had it coming. |
Sugram22 said: hackrabbits said: Sugram22 said: cause death in unavoidable thing, but if people are dumb that just ticks me of unnecessarily You think you're so great that you can do something different from how the characters in this show did? You think you can make everyone happy when two girls want you to pick one of them? You think that you can brush aside one of you're female friends from your group of three just to date the other one despite the one you actually loved was hiding feelings for ya? Well... I don't know what to say anymore. life is duff, i ton't know what i would do, but that dark haired girl should have stay'd with the guy cause he loved her back, its better the 1 suffers then all 3 suffer, so if i would be their friend, my advice would be for the dark haired girl, go for it, u cant trow away love awry time 1 of ur friend fall for same guy u do, it would be my advice as a bystander & also if i would be their friend, as u say'd u can't make all happy, well i know its easier say'd then done, but awry time i see something like that i feel like i wrote in my post the dark hired girl's choice result, all 3 will go separate way's, & maybe neither of them will find happiness cause they have bitter taste in their mouth also the other girl needs to understand u ton't always get what u want, all 3 can be happy if the girl with one sided love gives up & say's ton't mind me, just be together, well i know its hard, but its the only good choice, there was 1 girl more who liked the same guy & she would have gone after him if she would have seen chance. but she gave up cause shes smarter & knows there is nothing she can do & she say'd it to her & say'd that i did not like u as much as the dark haired, i got that from her flashback u cant always think for others, sometimes u need to think for yourself to I think the difference here is you're thinking from your own perspective (as a third-person) rather than thinking in their shoes. There are people out there who wants to hope that they can make everyone happy. They want to make sure the people they love (whether it's friendship or romantic) that they are happy. This is the biggest issue in Setsuna's case. You can't help it. You cannot help it. You think it's best to give up the one-sided love because you're still thinking as a outsider. I know there are also many who knows how to handle this, but usually most would've needed to have experienced it or seen it happen first before they can think like this rationally. I can honestly say that I have been involved in a similar case to this, and I know that you simply can't help it. If these characters are dumb, then I guess I'm dumb too. Feelings doesn't follow logic, but the heart; and the heart always changes on a whim that can decide your rash decision. Sugram22 said: hackrabbits said: Sugram22 said: cause death in unavoidable thing, but if people are dumb that just ticks me of unnecessarily You think you're so great that you can do something different from how the characters in this show did? You think you can make everyone happy when two girls want you to pick one of them? You think that you can brush aside one of you're female friends from your group of three just to date the other one despite the one you actually loved was hiding feelings for ya? Well... I don't know what to say anymore. as much as i got from their chat & flashbacks, wasn't the black haired girl first & then her Female friend try'd to get between then? confessed, & dark haired felt so bad & backed off, but she should not cause she was first, so if the black haired would have just went for it then she would not have be the villain cause the other girl was who try'd to get in between them, so the other girl would have been the villain, o ye she is villain either way, cause she knew how soft her friend is, well she should have if they were friends hyperknees91 said: Sugram actually got it right. The characters continue to make dumb choices because they won't think for themselves and think for the sake of others too much. Hence they just end up hurting themselves, and alot more people all the more as a consequence. That's kind of the main message WA2 has to say honestly. Try to keep everyone happy, and you end up keeping no one happy, not even your self. What is wrong with thinking for the sake of others? There are people who obviously think a lot for themselves, but we are not talking about a group of strangers. This is a group of friends that practiced together, worked together towards one goal, and had fun on stage together. Even created a original song together. It's true that this can give others a different perspective on this hence "Try to keep everyone happy, and you end up keeping no one happy", but that's because we learned from their experience. Then who did they learn from? I'm pretty sure this is their first time experiencing this... Even if the characters wanted something impossible like wanting everyone to be happy around them, that doesn't mean the characters are dumb. They are just naive, immature, and new to what they were experiencing. How would they know it would end up with no one happy? It's basic knowledge that one would really want to try and keep the ones they love happy. In Setsuna's case, she wanted to make them happy because she loved them but she couldn't control her feelings. As I said before, feelings and heart do not follow logic, and can decide your actions on a whim. Despite that, she still wanted all three of them to remain happy. That's why she told Touma beforehand that she started dating Haruki despite knowing that Touma liked Haruki. Why did Touma keep her feelings hidden? I don't know. I have a feeling that Setsuna might've started dating Haruki just to get Haruki to realize Touma's feelings since she knows Touma's feelings for Haruki is stronger than hers. |
hackrabbitsJan 20, 2014 5:46 PM
| ヽ(ｏ`皿′ｏ)ﾉ ヽ(ｏ`皿′ｏ)ﾉ ヽ(ｏ`皿′ｏ)ﾉ ヽ(ｏ`皿′ｏ)ﾉ ヽ(ｏ`皿′ｏ)ﾉ |
| Using your feelings to not follow logic doesn't give you any excuses when a person decides to do something. You might be able to sympathize with the person on how they came to that point, but it isn't an excuse regardless. It's called being thoughtless. Hence why it's hard to feel bad for any of the characters. They got what they got because they didn't think. You don't think, you suffer the consequences. It's as simple as that. Being young and inexperienced doesn't give you any excuse not to use your brain. Now deciding to go with your emotions while thinking of all the consequences an action might have. That's when a character is not being dumb, and rather is just being honest. |
hyperknees91Jan 20, 2014 6:45 PM
| @hackrabbits nothing wrong of thinking for the sake of others as log as its not the only thing u do, only thinking for the sake with out thinking for urself, maybe ur 2 idealistic? :), like they are, if they think they can make awry1 happy, but i doubt that that's what they were thinking about (if not then they are not idealistic but dumb), for example Kazusa was just to good, did not want to hurt her friend Setsuna, but Setsuna was the1 who try'd to get middle of Kazuma & Haruki, so in that case she should forget that she doesn't want to hurt friend, if some1 try's to get between u & ur loved1 u fight regardless who it is, cause if that other person try's to get between u2 u have awry right to defend urself & fight |
Sugram22Jan 21, 2014 12:26 AM
| you seem to forget that the characters do not know everythingl that the audience know. Kazusa loves Setsuna as much as she does for Haruki. Haruki did not know of Kazusa's love for him so he decided to date Setsuna instead. When you see the person you love is happy, you will not want to ruin that happiness, even if you have to suffer. It may be culturally biased but it is reasonable course of action. |
voldemortq said: you seem to forget that the characters do not know everythingl that the audience know. Kazusa loves Setsuna as much as she does for Haruki. Haruki did not know of Kazusa's love for him so he decided to date Setsuna instead. When you see the person you love is happy, you will not want to ruin that happiness, even if you have to suffer. It may be culturally biased but it is reasonable course of action. They don't need to know anything the audience knows really. Haruki: "I guess I'll date a woman, even though I love someone else. I'm sure nothing bad could come of it" (ends up hurting both their feelings tremendously) "Dang how did that happen?" Setsuna: "Let me try to keep us three together, even though I know Kazusa has feelings for Haruki and Haruki for Kazusa. I'm sure it will all go fine." (nothing goes as planned) "Dang how did that happen?" Kazusa: "I'm sure if I don't confess my feelings or ever be honest with myself or to Setsuna I'll end up hurting nobody" (hurts both) "Dang how did that happen" If even one of them thought for more than 2 seconds about what they were doing then maybeeee things wouldn't have ended quite as badly. Sure someone would have gotten hurt, and their relationship wouldn't have been the same. But that was going to happen regardless. Granted I'm not saying they are bad characters just because they are stupid. But they are stupid nonetheless. |
hyperknees91Jan 21, 2014 5:32 AM
hyperknees91 said: voldemortq said: you seem to forget that the characters do not know everythingl that the audience know. Kazusa loves Setsuna as much as she does for Haruki. Haruki did not know of Kazusa's love for him so he decided to date Setsuna instead. When you see the person you love is happy, you will not want to ruin that happiness, even if you have to suffer. It may be culturally biased but it is reasonable course of action. They don't need to know anything the audience knows really. Haruki: "I guess I'll date a woman, even though I love someone else. I'm sure nothing bad could come of it" (ends up hurting both their feelings tremendously) "Dang how did that happen?" Setsuna: "Let me try to keep us three together, even though I know Kazusa has feelings for Haruki and Haruki for Kazusa. I'm sure it will all go fine." (nothing goes as planned) "Dang how did that happen?" Kazusa: "I'm sure if I don't confess my feelings or ever be honest with myself or to Setsuna I'll end up hurting nobody" (hurts both) "Dang how did that happen" If even one of them thought for more than 2 seconds about what they were doing then maybeeee things wouldn't have ended quite as badly. Sure someone would have gotten hurt, and their relationship wouldn't have been the same. But that was going to happen regardless. Granted I'm not saying they are bad characters just because they are stupid. But they are stupid nonetheless. its kind of like what i say'd, better hurt just 1 then 2 & urself with it, in other word, better hurt 1 then all 3, cause some1 will be hurt either way, only think they could have done is minimize casualties, number of how meany get hurt |
Sugram22Jan 21, 2014 6:51 AM
| Pretty much. Too much kindness can be just as painful as too much spite. Hence why if you actually care about the people around you, you have to actually put effort into thinking what your actions might do to them. |
hyperknees91 said: Using your feelings to not follow logic doesn't give you any excuses when a person decides to do something. You might be able to sympathize with the person on how they came to that point, but it isn't an excuse regardless. It's called being thoughtless. Hence why it's hard to feel bad for any of the characters. They got what they got because they didn't think. You don't think, you suffer the consequences. It's as simple as that. Being young and inexperienced doesn't give you any excuse not to use your brain. Now deciding to go with your emotions while thinking of all the consequences an action might have. That's when a character is not being dumb, and rather is just being honest. No, it's not called being thoughtless, it's called being too rash on decisions. If you think it's hard to feel bad for the characters... then I guess I have nothing to say there unless you actually experience the situation yourself. Though you already found the solution by figuring out the mistakes from these three so I guess that won't work. Can't believe your putting inexperience and brain in one sentence though... Being experienced is the exact reason one can use their brain, and they're inexperienced. That's true though, that they got what they got from their decisions and they suffered from it. That's exactly why I can sympathize with them. Whether they're dumb in your case, or just too honest and idealistic in my case, I can still feel for them. Sugram22 said: @hackrabbits nothing wrong of thinking for the sake of others as log as its not the only thing u do, only thinking for the sake with out thinking for urself, maybe ur 2 idealistic? :), like they are, if they think they can make awry1 happy, but i doubt that that's what they were thinking about (if not then they are not idealistic but dumb), for example Kazusa was just to good, did not want to hurt her friend Setsuna, but Setsuna was the1 who try'd to get middle of Kazuma & Haruki, so in that case she should forget that she doesn't want to hurt friend, if some1 try's to get between u & ur loved1 u fight regardless who it is, cause if that other person try's to get between u2 u have awry right to defend urself & fight It's probably a onece-in-a-lifetime chance but... you should go and meet more people. If you honestly think one would get in-between you and your loved one and fight regardless of being close friends, you're dead wrong. I have a living example, I already mentioned part of this in my last post... The biggest issue that created this mess anyway was Kazusa's tsuntsun. "Why doesn't she just confess to Haruki" was probably what Setsuna was thinking when she saw Kazusa kiss Haruki in the piano room. I have no idea what she would be thinking at that time since I'm not her, but she probably wanted to give herself a chance. She must of misinterpreted Kazusa's kiss in some way that led her to confess. Welp, as I said, Kazusa chose the route that will protect their relationship even after knowing they were dating. Instead of 'always fighting', she simply chose to support them. It happens. All girls don't fight over the same guy unless they're strangers. Just not all the time. Having this close of a relationship could even be called a rarity, but it might be more common than you think. |
hackrabbitsJan 21, 2014 7:58 AM
| ヽ(ｏ`皿′ｏ)ﾉ ヽ(ｏ`皿′ｏ)ﾉ ヽ(ｏ`皿′ｏ)ﾉ ヽ(ｏ`皿′ｏ)ﾉ ヽ(ｏ`皿′ｏ)ﾉ |
hackrabbits said: hyperknees91 said: Using your feelings to not follow logic doesn't give you any excuses when a person decides to do something. You might be able to sympathize with the person on how they came to that point, but it isn't an excuse regardless. It's called being thoughtless. Hence why it's hard to feel bad for any of the characters. They got what they got because they didn't think. You don't think, you suffer the consequences. It's as simple as that. Being young and inexperienced doesn't give you any excuse not to use your brain. Now deciding to go with your emotions while thinking of all the consequences an action might have. That's when a character is not being dumb, and rather is just being honest. No, it's not called being thoughtless, it's called being too rash on decisions. If you think it's hard to feel bad for the characters... then I guess I have nothing to say there unless you actually experience the situation yourself. Though you already found the solution by figuring out the mistakes from these three so I guess that won't work. Can't believe your putting inexperience and brain in one sentence though... Being experienced is the exact reason one can use their brain, and they're inexperienced. That's true though, that they got what they got from their decisions and they suffered from it. That's exactly why I can sympathize with them. Whether they're dumb in your case, or just too honest and idealistic in my case, I can still feel for them. Sugram22 said: @hackrabbits nothing wrong of thinking for the sake of others as log as its not the only thing u do, only thinking for the sake with out thinking for urself, maybe ur 2 idealistic? :), like they are, if they think they can make awry1 happy, but i doubt that that's what they were thinking about (if not then they are not idealistic but dumb), for example Kazusa was just to good, did not want to hurt her friend Setsuna, but Setsuna was the1 who try'd to get middle of Kazuma & Haruki, so in that case she should forget that she doesn't want to hurt friend, if some1 try's to get between u & ur loved1 u fight regardless who it is, cause if that other person try's to get between u2 u have awry right to defend urself & fight It's probably a onece-in-a-lifetime chance but... you should go and meet more people. If you honestly think one would get in-between you and your loved one and fight regardless of being close friends, you're dead wrong. I have a living example, I already mentioned part of this in my last post... The biggest issue that created this mess anyway was Kazusa's tsuntsun. "Why doesn't she just confess to Haruki" was probably what Setsuna was thinking when she saw Kazusa kiss Haruki in the piano room. I have no idea what she would be thinking at that time since I'm not her, but she probably wanted to give herself a chance. She must of misinterpreted Kazusa's kiss in some way that led her to confess. Welp, as I said, Kazusa chose the route that will protect their relationship even after knowing they were dating. Instead of 'always fighting', she simply chose to support them. It happens. All girls don't fight over the same guy unless they're strangers. Just not all the time. Having this close of a relationship could even be called a rarity, but it might be more common than you think. i did not mean u can necessarily remain friends, but if ur friend try's get between u & ur BF u would discard him or her from ur friend list, if he or she decides to get between U2 he or she has shown u that ur friendship mean nothing to him or her so, if he or she dose not care why should u? its better for 1 to get hurt then all 3, cause in this situation some1 gets hurt either way |
Sugram22Jan 21, 2014 8:11 AM
No, it's not called being thoughtless, it's called being too rash on decisions. If you think it's hard to feel bad for the characters... then I guess I have nothing to say there unless you actually experience the situation yourself. Though you already found the solution by figuring out the mistakes from these three so I guess that won't work. Can't believe your putting inexperience and brain in one sentence though... Being experienced is the exact reason one can use their brain, and they're inexperienced. That's true though, that they got what they got from their decisions and they suffered from it. That's exactly why I can sympathize with them. Whether they're dumb in your case, or just too honest and idealistic in my case, I can still feel for them. Rash, impulsive, thoughtless, they all mean the same thing you realize? If you make a decision quickly, you can't put any thought into it. Just because you are inexperienced, doesn't give you an excuse to not use your brain like said before. I mean just because the characters in school days are inexperienced in relationships, does that give them excuse to act as stupid as they did? Absolutely not. Plus nothing is outside of the common sense realm in this case. Setsuna knows that being betrayed by her friends hurts, Haruki learned that knowledge from Setsuna and Kazusa knows that not being cared for by her mother hurts. However they apply none of that knowledge here or even think about it. Plus the only one who was honest was Setsuna technically. There was nothing honest about what Haruki or Kazusa did until the end. They were just both being cowards (and they knew they were being cowards). And ironically at the end Setsuna is the one who turned into a coward. |
hyperknees91Jan 21, 2014 10:32 AM
For me, Setsuna is just as much a coward as Kazusa and Haruki right from the start. Setsuna's honesty is only towards her own feelings, she never confronts Haruki about his feelings towards Kazusa. If she had stated the entire truth to Haruki about his and Kazusa's feelings and asked him to make a choice between her or Kazusa, she would have lost. Which pretty much makes her just as much a coward like the other two. Fair enough, but at least she was honest with her own feelings at the very least. The other two weren't honest with anything. Don't get me wrong, she's still stupid for not thinking this through properly. But eh, what can you do? Now I won't hold it against the characters if they learn from their previous mistakes, because everyones capable of doing that.....yeah. |
Actually in one of side story Haruki managed to confess to Kazusa and they date afterwards.(2weeks after festival) so it's not that they werent honest but they need more time. Setsuna see the kiss and she need to act first cause she will lose if she wait longer. That doesn't really make them any less of a coward. The reason Haruki is a coward is because he's being dishonest to Setsuna and using her for comfort so he can run away from his feelings for Kazusa. The reason Kazusa is a coward is because she won't be straight up with Setsuna or Haruki afterwards and just tries to play it off. Also with that knowledge it just makes Haruki come off as a submissive idiot. Well he is always a submissive idiot but eh. |
| Cowards really is a silly word to describe them. It was young teenage love. Touma may have sounded mature. But she was every bit a teenager as the other two. They loved each other;the lied to each other; the hurt each other. That's was young lovers foolishly do. In the end it became too much for each of them. So Touma made the decision to leave when she had the chance. ........ This show was a beautiful tragedy. I enjoyed it very much. But the ending was totally bittersweet. much like our real rives in a way. It suddenly made me flash back to some of my first loves. I think this is the feeling animators were going for. In my opinion (and feelings), they succeeded. I get the feeling there won't be a true resolution where we see the trio reunited down the road. Just like in real lives, sometimes all that's left is the memories. |
| They are all 18, already adults. Regardless age isn't much of an excuse, I've seen grown adults and teenagers alike make very similar decisions, so it can happen at all crosses of life. I've seen people younger than them act more mature quite honestly. Plus So yeah, can't blame things on age. No one learns anything by making excuses. In fact making excuses is the main reason the characters will continue to suffer in the future. Also whose the one who told Setsuna that she shouldn't make excuses and just be honest with herself in episode 1? Yep it was Haruki. So not only is he a coward, but a hypocrite oof. Regardless this doesn't mean he has no chance at redeeming himself. It just means he just needs to realize his faults and work on improving them. |
hyperknees91Jan 23, 2014 7:28 AM
| Love isnt simple... |
| Hate Keeps me warm |
Gr33ncar said: Love isnt simple... I gave the show a 9/10. One of the best romances I've seen since Ef. While it got a whole lot of messy at the end, I still find it believable. Setsuna had to know what would happen if she brought him to the airport. If she really didn't want to see it, then she could've said nothing and moved along. Somehow the end makes it seem as though Haruki doesn't love Setsuna at all, but I'm not buying that either. He just had more feelings for Kazusa. Glad it didn't go for a School Days type of ending. I never cared to see that show and liked that they kept that extreme drama out of this. All in all, really impressed. I'll be looking for the CD when it comes out. |
 |
| Solid anime from start to finish. Now they simply must adapt closing chapter. Really looking forward to it. |
 |
Sugram22 said: Granted I'm not saying they are bad characters just because they are stupid. But they are stupid nonetheless. But the whole point of the show is the characters with the flaws to spice up the romance and the drama. The characters are not stupid at all, they are made to make mistakes in order to promote the main theme of the show. |
 |
DeadIEnd said: Sugram22 said: Granted I'm not saying they are bad characters just because they are stupid. But they are stupid nonetheless. But the whole point of the show is the characters with the flaws to spice up the romance and the drama. The characters are not stupid at all, they are made to make mistakes in order to promote the main theme of the show. Uh that would be terrible writing if that was the case. Being stupid for the sake of drama? Rather then it happening naturally? Though quite honestly at times I really believed this was how the story was written haha. Which is why it does have a lot of writing issues. |
hyperknees91Jan 28, 2014 11:33 AM
hyperknees91 said: Uh that would be terrible writing if that was the case. Being stupid for the sake of drama? Rather then it happening naturally? Though quite honestly at times I really believed this was how the story was written haha. Which is why it does have a lot of writing issues. First of all, the characters aren't stupid, they're flawed. I understand every anime fan enjoys perfect characters who make the best out of every possible situation, but the theme of the show doesn't allow them to be perfect. Second of all, drama can't happen 'naturally'. It has to planned out to happen. And thirdly, the story doesn't have any writing issues, what writing issues are you talking about, man? |
|
DeadIEnd said: hyperknees91 said: Uh that would be terrible writing if that was the case. Being stupid for the sake of drama? Rather then it happening naturally? Though quite honestly at times I really believed this was how the story was written haha. Which is why it does have a lot of writing issues. First of all, the characters aren't stupid, they're flawed. I understand every anime fan enjoys perfect characters who make the best out of every possible situation, but the theme of the show doesn't allow them to be perfect. Second of all, drama can't happen 'naturally'. It has to planned out to happen. And thirdly, the story doesn't have any writing issues, what writing issues are you talking about, man? Yes...that is what it means to happen naturally. It has to have build up, it can't happen out of nowhere. That's the difference between natural drama and bs facebook drama. What you were saying though is it just happened because the characters are forced to make mistakes to promote the main theme. Which would just be forced drama and terrible writing. IC doesn't actually have many problems if you ask me. The friendship between Setsuna and Kazusa is hard to believe, and it did get a little too overdramatic with the directing near the end. But it's overall still well done. The writing flaws I'm talking about came from CC (which I already discussed in earlier posts). Also there's nothing wrong with flawed characters. I didn't say the characters are bad just because they are stupid, just...they are stupid lawl. I mean as long as they learn in the end it's all fine and good. |
More topics from this board
Poll: » White Album 2 Episode 12 Discussion ( 1 2 3 4 5 )Stark700 - Dec 21, 2013 |
223 |
by x_scolopendra_x
»»
Oct 4, 6:18 AM |
|
Poll: » White Album 2 Episode 11 Discussion ( 1 2 3 4 5 )Stark700 - Dec 14, 2013 |
201 |
by x_scolopendra_x
»»
Oct 4, 2:40 AM |
|
Poll: » White Album 2 Episode 10 Discussion ( 1 2 3 4 )removed-user - Dec 7, 2013 |
159 |
by x_scolopendra_x
»»
Oct 3, 9:01 AM |
|
Poll: » White Album 2 Episode 9 Discussion ( 1 2 3 )Stark700 - Nov 30, 2013 |
140 |
by x_scolopendra_x
»»
Oct 3, 5:16 AM |
|
Poll: » White Album 2 Episode 8 Discussion ( 1 2 3 )Stark700 - Nov 23, 2013 |
135 |
by x_scolopendra_x
»»
Oct 2, 10:06 PM |