Attack on Titan
| I saw this online and I knew that people misinterpreted the entirety of the Rumbling arc, where everyone is in the most distressing periods of their lives and the actions they end up taking make 100% sense - but people, not being able to understand the nature of the arc and how the characters are perceiving the conflict and what they recognize to be the right call, think that it's rushed when in reality it is beautifully crafted. What confuses me is that even with this stance that people have taken, they still recognize that chapter 131 is an amazing chapter even though the same themes are re-affirmed masterfully. By this, I mean that it makes no sense to hate on the Rumbling arc and the whole bit with the Alliance but love chapters like 131 because both carry and resonate the same motifs/themes. I believe people love chapter 131 due to the combination of amazing artwork, the POV from Eren, and how it ties into his yearning for freedom, but the reason I think that 131 contains the single greatest scene in this series is quite simple. The writing of it. the stuff I found online that I wanted to share: (modified it a bit to include what I think in some parts) It is the darkest moment of the manga. When Halil and Ramzi are killed, when you see the titans stomping on two refugee kids who spent all their effort in trying to build a better future for themselves, two innocent kids with whom Eren spent a night drinking at their home and who had shown him nothing but gratitude and love. Eren calls Armin to Paths, his best friend with whom he shared that childhood dream of being free after reading a book about the outside world. A world filled with wonders that had that scenery which meant they were truly free. For Eren this was his moment, he shows Armin that scenery, that which both spent their lives fighting for, that for which both had died for the other multiple times to reach. We are here only to learn, that said scenery is Eren as a child, flying through the air as the rumbling is destroying the world. They no longer share that dream. Armin is repugned, no longer capable of understanding his friend. And at the bleakest moment, we see Armin sit by Annie. Two child soldiers who had committed heinous acts. Two broken people that hate themselves, coming together in the "fading twilight of humanity", capable of finding warmth with each other as the world dies. Both imagining a better future together, hoping that there is still time for a better world. Finally bridging the gap that separated them by fate, that gap which Eren was never able to cross. After that, an image of Eren's titan, eyes closed and connected by strings just as a puppet (perhaps literally too). Because he was never free in the first place, and his journey is not one of achieving freedom, but eternally pursuing a utopic world that would have never worked, one in which freedom was being able to live and do all as you wish. But freedom is not that, he understood licentiousness as freedom. And because of that, as long as something else exists, there will always be something outside of your control that binds you. In the process of yearning for freedom, he became a puppet to HIS idea of freedom. my original thoughts: I feel like this the greatest moment of the series and IMO cements Eren as one of if not the best MC of any show |
ZprotuFeb 23, 2021 6:06 PM
| I need to reread the rumbling arc from the looks of it, I quite liked it but maybe a deep lookover as you have done would allow me to see some of the flaws that people point out on as well as the great points. In any case good analysis. |
| Peak is definitely 121 for me but 131 is up there. #1 121 #2 122 #3 131 |
 |
| 131 is the peak for me as well . It finally showed us an Eren POV after so many chapters . Thats a blessing . Gonna cry so hard when it gets animated . |
Nyess_Feb 22, 2021 8:04 PM
  Something that’s supposed to die and doesn’t… will eventually rot away , whether it’s a man or a nation |
I agree with this, 121 is easily the peak, but 131 was my second favorite. Only times I teared up in AoT were Erwin's suicide speech and this panel from 131  |
| personally I didnt like chapter 131 because it made Eren look like a cuck The reason I liked 122 so much was because Eren looked like an evil badass keikaku mastermind with no remorse Kinda ruins it for me to see him cry. But its just my taste. I understand why some like 131. |
| My ranking: # Ch. 121 # Ch. 131 # Ch. 122 And this theory is interesting, although I wouldn't agree on the part where it says that "he became a puppet to HIS idea of freedom", a more detailed, not so philosophical explanation would be better. And yeah, I already know that Eren is the best shounen protagonist ever made. |
 I said keep your hands on the table |
| Yeah, both 116-122 and 130-131 is the peak of AoT, and all the manga, for me. |
Hhguf said: Chapter 131 is great, but it will make no sense if the story ends with an inappropriate ending Actually, the whole story wouldn't make any sense if eren woke up from his dream and says, "Oh, it was a bad dream I have to go to school." certainly not everyone will accept that the ending is bad they rather will seek excuses because they will not be able to forget what they spent in 10 years for me I will say it if the ending is trash I will say it I will not hesitate Out of all the authors in the world, you really think Isayama will do that? |
Hhguf said: if you ask me this question before ch137 i will say no but if you ask me this question after ch137 i will say yeah hahaha classic yams managing to subvert everyone's expectations once again calling it right now, the plot armour that was present in the last chapter will result in many characters' deaths in the next one |
| The stuff which happened in 137 was necessary. Otherwise the whole alliance build up had been an absolute waste of time. Go on yams. Prove them mfs wrong one last time. |
| Signature removed. Please follow the signature rules, as defined in the Site & Forum Guidelines. |
cAbaddon said: if you think so then wouldn't that make us.....best friends?Yeah, both 116-122 and 130-131 is the peak of AoT, and all the manga, for me. |
| Signature removed. Please follow the signature rules, as defined in the Site & Forum Guidelines. |
deg said: lol nah to me chapter 134 is better since it really shows how fuck up The Rumbling is more Eren feeling guilty in 131 seems fake or just too stupid for him since he only know violence as a solution for everything anyway he did not even consult his best friends Armin and Mikasa for better solutions im sure there is a limit to the future sight powers of the Attack Titan that we do not know about maybe being emotional like Eren makes it not activate at those times anyway so Eren did not see all of the future yes I hope we find more about the Attack Titan in the last 2 chapters |
Hhguf said: if you ask me this question before ch137 i will say no but if you ask me this question after ch137 i will say yeah Not sure what was in chapter 137 that would make you think on that way, but I think it's clear that Isayama won't pull a MLA ending on us and suddenly , that would make no sense within the stablished PATHS parameters denominated so far, especially in 137. |
 |
Funseco said: personally I didnt like chapter 131 because it made Eren look like a cuck The reason I liked 122 so much was because Eren looked like an evil badass keikaku mastermind with no remorse Kinda ruins it for me to see him cry. But its just my taste. I understand why some like 131. lol my god you are so edgy, we all know Eren is doing all this because he see no other choice in his head. That would go against what Eren character is as it showed in earlier flashback that he was looking for other options until he realize there isn't any other choice but to use the rumbling. You just want a one dimensional evil character with no feelings it seems, because it would make him look "badass" in your eyes. deg said: lol nah to me chapter 134 is better since it really shows how fuck up The Rumbling is more Eren feeling guilty in 131 seems fake or just too stupid for him since he only know violence as a solution for everything anyway he did not even consult his best friends Armin and Mikasa for better solutions im sure there is a limit to the future sight powers of the Attack Titan that we do not know about maybe being emotional like Eren makes it not activate at those times anyway so Eren did not see all of the future Why would he not feel guilt? He is doing it because as we have seen in all the flashback Eren looked for all possible way before resorting to the rumbling (Which implies this is the very last thing he would have wanted to do, Armin and Mikasa had no solution neither did Hanji, so I'm not sure why he would need to have a discussion with them. So of course Eren feels guilty about it, he doesn't want to kill innocent people but to him he has no other choice. I'm happy that it showed this perspective the vulnerable side of Eren. Mass Killing billion of innocent people should not come easy and he should have guilt in doing it. |
deg said: @keragamming i miss saying Eren is regretting The Rumbling big time thats why i find him too stupid too he did not see the consequences of his actions even his future sight powers did not able to make him see this kind of brutal consequence? im not gonna be surprise that the reason Eren did not fight back against his friends is because he is so guilty about The Rumbling Huh? He is not regretting the rumbling or he would not go a long with the rumbling to begin with, remember this flashback happen before he attack Marley, so he had plenty of time to change his mind. Hence why he was apologizing to the kid and the kid was wondering why he was crying, because Eren knows that he is going to Kill many innocent people. Basically he is saying to the kid I am so sorry for killing you and your family, before it happen because he knew the kid would die. im not gonna be surprise that the reason Eren did not fight back against his friends is because he is so guilty about The Rumbling This comment would somehow only make sense if he was having these regret in the present time, despite his guilt in the flashback he still went a long with it and killed billions of innocent people. So the question is, why would he make his friends kill him out of regret, when he could have not done the rumbling to begin with since he saw the future and knew that he would have killed billions of people? Doesn't make any sense to me. |
deg said: @keragamming thats the thing the Attack Titan future sight ability does not make sense to me too heck why would he feel sorry for the kids he killed if he already know that future will happen so thats regret and guilt right? chapter 131 might be the modified AnR ending i can see that maybe Ymir is the one doing The Rumbling too and Eren is just there doing nothing and regretting it all like the AnR ending is suppose to be I'm not really understanding your thinking here, its like doing something that you know is wrong but you still do it anyways even though you will have regret doing it. You do know that psychopath can have empathy/regrets right? Or are you implying Eren should have no feeling at all and should be stone cold that he is about to kill Billions of innocent people including children and baby? let me give you a real world example, do you know that many people that does suicide actually don't want to kill themselves but still do it, just because they feel like they have no other option? So you could also say why kill yourself if you don't want to actually do it? Its the same thing basically, Eren is doing it because he feels like there is no other option, he doesn't want to do it, but in his perspective he has no choice. The mind is a very complicated thing. |
deg said: keragamming said: I'm not really understanding your thinking here, its like doing something that you know is wrong but you still do it anyways even though you will have regret doing it. You do know that psychopath can have empathy/regrets right? Or are you implying Eren should have no feeling at all and should be stone cold that he is about to kill Billions of innocent people including children and baby? let me give you a real world example, do you know that many people that does suicide actually don't want to kill themselves but still do it, just because they feel like they have no other option? So you could also say why kill yourself if you don't want to actually do it? Its the same thing basically, Eren is doing it because he feels like there is no other option, he doesn't want to do it, but in his perspective he has no choice. The mind is a very complicated thing. sure fair enough but still he should know and and be READY of the consequences if he really can see the future since he is the mastermind of all of this anyway i still find his guilt and regret to be so cheap But he is, is he showing any regrets in the present time? During Marley or war and paradise arc? Nope! hence why he was so cold towards everyone and why anime only are saying that Eren has changed so much, so he got over it, you are acting like he is having these regrets in the present time. Reminder this was a flashback when his hair was short, so it wasn't too long after he saw those memories, which means at that period he was still a bit shaken up by it, but after a certain period of time his mind was made up and from the present time till now he has only been going forward with his plan. @Funseco I forgot to mention that as well, chapter 131 flashback doesn't affect the current Eren, it simple show how devastated Eren was when he saw the future memories and knew what he would do in the future, but he eventually got over it and made up his mind to go forward with his plans and thus the present Eren that you love was born. We need to remember that Eren wasn't always this cold character like what he is in the present, no one is born evil they have to be pushed in that situation base off the environment they live in, Eren said that to Falco himself, so seeing this Eren in the past isn't in anyway shitting on the present Eren. |
keragammingFeb 25, 2021 12:59 AM
| 100% Ch 131 is the peak of AoT for me as well. I was literally watching this vid when I stumbled across this post. |
keragamming said: lol my god you are so edgy, we all know Eren is doing all this because he see no other choice in his head. That would go against what Eren character is as it showed in earlier flashback that he was looking for other options until he realize there isn't any other choice but to use the rumbling. You just want a one dimensional evil character with no feelings it seems, because it would make him look "badass" in your eyes. yeah, and whats the problem? Eren was my favourite, but after 131, I dont like him anymore. Zeke was also my favourite, but after he was revealed to be a cuck pro-euthanasia in chapter 114, I stopped liking him. keragamming said: @Funseco I forgot to mention that as well, chapter 131 flashback doesn't affect the current Eren, it simple show how devastated Eren was when he saw the future memories and knew what he would do in the future, but he eventually got over it and made up his mind to go forward with his plans and thus the present Eren that you love was born. We need to remember that Eren wasn't always this cold character like what he is in the present, no one is born evil they have to be pushed in that situation base off the environment they live in, Eren said that to Falco himself, so seeing this Eren in the past isn't in anyway shitting on the present Eren. Yeah I know that, but he literally regressed to his child self in order to deal with the horror of what he is doing. At least thats what I think. And chapter 130 confirmed that he doesnt really hate Mikasa. Badass Eren doesnt exist. Eren plan is to be stopped. He never planned to complete the rumbling. |
omarahmed2000 said: It's called an opinion, learn to respect it douche.Zprotu said: I my original thoughts: I feel like this the greatest moment of the series and IMO cements Eren as one of if not the best MC of any show Wait what ? Are you high ? I know that Aot fans are weird but bot that much , it seems that aot is the only show you watched , but even though you can’t call a simple and generic villain like eren the best at anything , it is just too much , go get a life dude , read literature and read another manga either seinen or shounen, eren isn’t among the best 3 shounen MCs Also, Eren is anything but simple/generic, the fact that a huge fraction of the fandom struggles to understand him is proof enough. And then there's essays like these that prove he's an incredible character. https://youtu.be/H6GmVCD7cxk https://youtu.be/UmfmRK5dkEQ |
Alvacka97 said: omarahmed2000 said: It's called an opinion, learn to respect it douche.Wait what ? Are you high ? I know that Aot fans are weird but bot that much , it seems that aot is the only show you watched , but even though you can’t call a simple and generic villain like eren the best at anything , it is just too much , go get a life dude , read literature and read another manga either seinen or shounen, eren isn’t among the best 3 shounen MCs Also, Eren is anything but simple/generic, the fact that a huge fraction of the fandom struggles to understand him is proof enough. And then there's essays like these that prove he's an incredible character. https://youtu.be/H6GmVCD7cxk https://youtu.be/UmfmRK5dkEQ I mean they are also having an "opinion" So you should respect it too Nyohoho (And imo if a shit ton of essays is written for a character's analysis then its just too much time and energy spent on a useless task. Remember those shitty character analysis that we used to do in our eng literature classes ? This whole aot analysis by essays is just that) |
Za_PandaJan 4, 2022 4:38 AM
 |
Bababazooka69 said: It's not 'justification', imbecile, it's called analysis.Alvacka97 said: if a character needs this much justification on how he's a goat mc to make people like him, then that character is nothing but badly written in the end.It's called an opinion, learn to respect it douche. Also, Eren is anything but simple/generic, the fact that a huge fraction of the fandom struggles to understand him is proof enough. And then there's essays like these that prove he's an incredible character. https://youtu.be/H6GmVCD7cxk https://youtu.be/UmfmRK5dkEQ Just in case you don't know what that is: it's a detailed examination of anything complex in order to understand its nature or to determine its essential features. By your same idiotic logic; Walter White, Light Yagami, Tony Soprano, Shinji Ikari, Tyrion Lannister, etc, are all shit characters because people have done multiple detailed analysis on them thorough the years. |
omarahmed2000 said: You literally made that up, "people can't believe it, they tried making him a grey character, but he turned to be just a black character at the end", ¿where are the arguments that support this, where's the evidence? Because it sure isn't in the source material, not with chapters like 122, 123, 130, 131, etc.Alvacka97 said: wait , people struggles to believe that he is a simple villain, imagine fans sticking philosophies to him and making him a grey character, but he turned to be just a black character at the end, people can’t believe it , it is different from misunderstandingIt's called an opinion, learn to respect it douche. Also, Eren is anything but simple/generic, the fact that a huge fraction of the fandom struggles to understand him is proof enough. And then there's essays like these that prove he's an incredible character. https://youtu.be/H6GmVCD7cxk https://youtu.be/UmfmRK5dkEQ Your claims have no basis in reality as you have not provided any reasoning or counter-argument to the evidence presented in our analysis or the manga itself. |
Alvacka97Jan 4, 2022 4:50 PM
Bababazooka69 said: I'm not justifying jack-shit. I shared the video as a way of showcasing arguments to support my claims, the videos themselves were not made to justify anything, they were made to analyse the character and explain common misconceptions, they're no different than your average 44-50 minute long video essay in that regard.Alvacka97 said: analyzing a character doesn't mean u have to prove that the character is well written the people around you themselves tell u that and majority thinks eren is a badly written mc so u are here just trying to justify and prove that eren isn't badly written at all and he is a multi layered mc and that through 1-2 hours of video essayIt's not 'justification', imbecile, it's called analysis. Just in case you don't know what that is: it's a detailed examination of anything complex in order to understand its nature or to determine its essential features. By your same idiotic logic; Walter White, Light Yagami, Tony Soprano, Shinji Ikari, Tyrion Lannister, etc, are all shit characters because people have done multiple detailed analysis on them thorough the years. analyzing a character is a different thing and justifying that a character is complex and well written when majority thinks its not is a different thing. To give you an example, many people misunderstood Eren's apology to Ramzi as an apology out of desperation, that he was doing the rumbling because he felt he had no other choice, when in reality the text itself shows us that Eren is confessing to his deepest, most private desire and motivation (achieve his dream of a world where humans didn't exist beyond the walls, a world without titans, a fertile world ready to be explored alongside his best friend), while he used the circumstances and conflicts faced by his side as a way to motivate himself into doing it, as a convenient excuse to tell himself, to try and convince himself that what he's doing is for the greater good of his people. This does not mean that was his only motivation, he obviously cared about his friends and about the innocents in Paradis. But he prioritized his dream and his friends' safety over everything else. Now, you can either disprove the arguments presented in the videos or stay silent. That's all. PD: I advice you don't go around spouting nonsense that you can't back up with actual researched facts, like official polls. Your reddit/twitter/discord circlejerk or whatever social media group you've been hanging around for the past few months doesn't represent a majority in the fandom, and if you think it does, you'll need to show some proof. Here's an actual proven fact, for example. AoT was the #4 highest selling manga of 2021 with 7.3 million copies sold (this is counting volume 34 copies too). |
Alvacka97Jan 5, 2022 4:26 AM
omarahmed2000 said: Zprotu said: I my original thoughts: I feel like this the greatest moment of the series and IMO cements Eren as one of if not the best MC of any show Wait what ? Are you high ? I know that Aot fans are weird but bot that much , it seems that aot is the only show you watched , but even though you can’t call a simple and generic villain like eren the best at anything , it is just too much , go get a life dude , read literature and read another manga either seinen or shounen, eren isn’t among the best 3 shounen MCs imagine being so pressed about someone else's opinion from nearly 1 year ago |
Bababazooka69 said: Alvacka97 said: analyzing a character doesn't mean u have to prove that the character is well written the people around you themselves tell u that and majority thinks eren is a badly written mc so u are here just trying to justify and prove that eren isn't badly written at all and he is a multi layered mc and that through 1-2 hours of video essayIt's not 'justification', imbecile, it's called analysis. Just in case you don't know what that is: it's a detailed examination of anything complex in order to understand its nature or to determine its essential features. By your same idiotic logic; Walter White, Light Yagami, Tony Soprano, Shinji Ikari, Tyrion Lannister, etc, are all shit characters because people have done multiple detailed analysis on them thorough the years. analyzing a character is a different thing and justifying that a character is complex and well written when majority thinks its not is a different thing. too bad eren IS misunderstood then |
yaegerist-15 said: Alvacka97 said: stash and invaderzz are using their own interpretation which is NOT in line with erens character. They misunderstood 131 and say the freedom panel is some kind of escapism, while it has nothing to do with that. If eren would rumble the world anyway, he wouldnt try to find solutions for 4 yearsIt's called an opinion, learn to respect it douche. Also, Eren is anything but simple/generic, the fact that a huge fraction of the fandom struggles to understand him is proof enough. And then there's essays like these that prove he's an incredible character. https://youtu.be/H6GmVCD7cxk https://youtu.be/UmfmRK5dkEQ but it is escapism from his hopelessness... why do you think child eren appears instead huh? its legitimately right there |
| imo Chapters 130 and 131 are very overrated rts is peak aot for me but I can see why people like 130 and 131 but I can see why people like it IMO the chapter covered in s4 got the closest to beating rts |
Hhguf said: So if others say the ending is good it mean they're lying to themselves , Chapter 131 is great, but it will make no sense if the story ends with an inappropriate ending Actually, the whole story wouldn't make any sense if eren woke up from his dream and says, "Oh, it was a bad dream I have to go to school." certainly not everyone will accept that the ending is bad they rather will seek excuses because they will not be able to forget what they spent in 10 years for me I will say it if the ending is trash I will say it I will not hesitate Man this is the most braindrain thing ive seen on the internet today |
omarahmed2000 said: That's a cool headcanon you got there, you even forgot entire pages of the manga, assuming you even read it in the first place.Alvacka97 said: lol are you blind ? He said many times that he just wanted it , he doesn’t care for eldia or the greater goodYou literally made that up, "people can't believe it, they tried making him a grey character, but he turned to be just a black character at the end", ¿where are the arguments that support this, where's the evidence? Because it sure isn't in the source material, not with chapters like 122, 123, 130, 131, etc. Your claims have no basis in reality as you have not provided any reasoning or counter-argument to the evidence presented in our analysis or the manga itself. In the actual lines of dialogue he states: "It's the island, it's to save eldia, but.. it's more than that" -Chapter 131 In that same chapter, he states: "But i just can't accept an end like that" when considering the possibility of letting Eldians be wiped out, thinking about the King's philosophy. So yeah, he does care about the eldian race, if he didn't he would've gone along with Zeke's plan. He also cares deeply about his friends, he says as much in the train scene: "Because you're important to me, more than anyone else", and in chapter 130 he states: "Their lives will go on long after i die, at least... i want them to. I want them to have long lives" Eren had multiple goals, some of them contradictory, some of the incompatible with the other. Eren's plan was flawed, as was everyone else's, he started the rumbling with the full intent of exterminating the outside world, but when his friends decided to stop him, he had to compromise one goal to achieve the other. If he completes the rumbling, his friends die and the curse is not lifted, so he decided to sacrifice his own personal freedom to achieve his other goals. Yes, he was disappointed that humanity still existed beyond the walls, and achieving his own twisted ideal of freedom was a big driving force for him, but it wasn't his only motivation. |
More topics from this board
» 'Even a Child Can Do It': Shonen Jump Editor Calls Out Attack on Titan as Just 'Making a Lot of Noise'deg - Jul 18 |
6 |
by therealnagora
»»
Sep 13, 10:00 AM |
|
» Worst death of the series?Dragevard - May 29, 2021 |
3 |
by Kawaii_Otaku04
»»
Aug 3, 8:38 PM |
|
Poll: » Shingeki no Kyojin Chapter 19 Discussionricardocsc - Oct 2, 2012 |
17 |
by Jeffrey8172
»»
Jul 11, 7:15 AM |
|
Poll: » Shingeki no Kyojin Chapter 130 Discussion ( 1 2 3 4 5 )keragamming - Jul 6, 2020 |
213 |
by Adam_________
»»
Jun 3, 1:39 PM |
|
» Why do you think the ending was perfect?kiyoymir - May 6, 2021 |
29 |
by HagePotPotato
»»
May 30, 11:25 AM |