Why is suicide considered a bad thing?

LayedBack said:


Seriously, lost what? What if a person had been gang raped nearly to death, and their entire family murdered? And then they were left in severe chronic pain every second for the rest of their lives. Did they fucking LOSE because they no longer wanted to live? Is it really weak to be victimized and forced to suffer with no choice or say in the matter?

What if a person was completely paralyzed and they're forced to drink food through a straw and cry in front of the TV all day, feeling helpless, scared, alone, and in agony?

Honestly it's sad that so many of you seem to not actually understand just how fucked up life can be. Not everyone committing suicide is a depressed teenager with a future and a loving family. Some people are actually suffering way beyond your small imagination and comprehensions.

SRTHGV said:
The sun may appear after the rain but what appears after the sun?

JennyEsquire said:

Maybe the person in question ''wins''? That of course depends on what your idea of ''winning'' is.

johnyjohny said:
Doing everything to make your love one's proud or happy even if it is bad for your self. In the end you still win because your goal is reached. ( I am happy if my family is happy)

Legendre said:

I think you misinterpreted his point horribly. Unless you didn't mean to quote Katsu, and were actually responding to Johnny. If that's the case, continue.

johnyjohny said:
Doing everything to make your love one's proud or happy even if it is bad for your self. In the end you still win because your goal is reached. ( I am happy if my family is happy)

LayedBack said:


Seriously, lost what? What if a person had been gang raped nearly to death, and their entire family murdered? And then they were left in severe chronic pain every second for the rest of their lives. Did they fucking LOSE because they no longer wanted to live? Is it really weak to be victimized and forced to suffer with no choice or say in the matter? ( That only happens in movies my friend)

What if a person was completely paralyzed and they're forced to drink food through a straw and cry in front of the TV all day, feeling helpless, scared, alone, and in agony? ( Love ones put a end to it right away)

What if a persons wife had been murdered and the husband was falsely accused of committing the crime, and then thrown in prison for life without parole? ( alright this i can understand but the guy can still have people who loved them)

Honestly it's sad that so many of you seem to not actually understand just how fucked up life can be.( are you calling me a harles basterd know!!) Not everyone committing suicide is a depressed teenager with a future and a loving family. ( in my country it is the fourth one today this month and i live in a small place called Holland ].

JennyEsquire said:
Well that's just your messed up idea of ''winning''. How exactly are you winning by doing something that's detrimental to your own well-being, just for the sake of others? Sounds more like something a loser would do to me.

JennyEsquire said:

lol

Well that's just your messed up idea of ''winning''. How exactly are you winning by doing something that's detrimental to your own well-being, just for the sake of others? Sounds more like something a loser would do to me.

katsucats said:
Read this parable about a farmer who lost his horse.

johnyjohny said:
that other person could be your very mom or dad who gave you this very live.Ii think that is very selfish.

SRTHGV said:
While true that we don't know whether what happened was actually good or bad until sometime after the actual event I was merely saying that in life you will have good experiences and bad experiences one after another.

katsucats said:
So if your parents tell you to jump off a bridge, you would without question?

Red_Keys said:
Johny, please stop embarrassing yourself.

johnyjohny said:
You guy getting of track now with your over reacted movie subjects. Besides Parents who tell you to jump of a bridge exist out of 1/1.000.000.000.000

katsucats said:
The point of the story is that good or bad experiences are what you make of them, not what they inherently are. If you are like the farmer who can maintain a content state of mind, then nothing that happens is either good or bad. This is actually a cornerstone to many eastern philosophies.

SRTHGV said:
Well unfortunately that logic is inapplicable to someone who is already considering suicide. It would only work with someone who has a strong mental state and someone in that situation wouldn't contemplate suicide in the first place. After re-reading the parable you are right but it also clearly shows that "good" things can from "bad" things.

katsucats said:
And bad things can come from good things. It all depends on the person perceiving it. So what makes suicide inherently bad?

johnyjohny said:
You would let you best friend kill him self then shame on you.

SRTHGV said:
If you read my posts you will clearly see that I'm in favor of suicide. I said that even though the sun appears after the rain, the rain will come back eventually you don't necessarily know when but it's certain that it will. This is implying that the rain is BAD and the sun is GOOD. Obviously in real life things aren't so black and white.

edit: you probably thought I had a different opinion cause I fucked up the quoting and that other persons opinion looked like it was mine.

Red_Keys said:
No, I wouldn't "let" them (although, I'm not going to police anybody's life either)

I personally think suicide is bad. But that is based in emotional and illogical, contradictive ideas.

You can't explain why suicide is bad. Because nothing is bad.

katsucats said:
No, I know you are. I'm just saying people who are saying "there are better days" are like that farmer's neighbor; they are myopic, seeing only a short distance ahead instead of the bigger picture.

Legendre said:
Slippery slope bud.

extraspectra said:
If meaning exists because of some "agent" who ascribes worth to things, then can't suicide be bad in most cases because I say so? I'm an agent, and I think life has meaning.

katsucats said:
But answer the question. If your parents gave you life, and doing anything against their expectation must be selfish, then you would jump off the bridge without question, right?

Logic must be applied equally no matter how absurd a situation seems. Saying something is only true for some particular situation but not true in others is a double standard. It means you do not actually believe what you yourself are saying.

extraspectra said:
I think suicide is a little more that disappointing to a person's parents, and why can't there be a line of how much sadness its ok to cause. Like if I buy the last packet of skittles that the guy in line behind me wants. That upsets him. Its not like
I shot his dog though.

johnyjohny said:
this i can't answer because just cant believe my parents would do such a thing. lets say i call this a no for now.

katsucats said:
There can be a line, but you have to be able to define it. You can't just arbitrarily say this is true here, but not true there, for no particular reason...

If we assume that there's no fundamental difference in the type of disappointment, that it's only the scale of disappointment that matters, then would it be okay to say that if Person A's parents are more emotional, then it would not be okay for Person A to suicide, but okay for Person B since his parents are more stoic?

If it upsets Person C's parents that Person C didn't go on a murderous rampage across town (hypothetical here) on the same scale that it upsets Person A's parents should Person A commits suicide, then is Person C selfish for not going on that murderous rampage?

Toanmaru said:
Im going to put this out here read the manga "Aku no Hana"
Is related to this topic have fun.

Toanmaru said:
Im going to put this out here read the manga "Aku no Hana"
Is related to this topic have fun.

extraspectra said:
Person C would be hurting a lot of other people by going on a killing spree.

extraspectra said:
I think the scale changes based on a person's sensitivity to an extent, but throwing out extreme cases doesn't really work all that well. If it would hurt me to bend so far because someone else was sensitive I wouldn't do it. But if it doesn't effect me inversely then why not.

johnyjohny said:
Alright just for the record are you guys mad at me because i have a different opinion?

katsucats said:

So now the utility of other people might counteract your parent's utility (does this mean that the "they brought you into this world" logic is forfeit, or are the parents' utilities still worth more than the third party, and if so, how much more?).

katsucats said:

If Person D was a slave driver at work and all 500 of the company's employees hates him. If he leaves the company, the assistant will rise to his rank and all 500 employees love this guy. Then would it be okay for Person D to commit suicide if the utility of the 500 people outweigh those of the parents?

katsucats said:

Come to think of it, I still don't know whether you think suicide is selfish, or what your positions are. I've just been arguing with you based on johnyjohny's opinions.

TookMe6Years said:
I am just going to say suicide goes against the human nature of surviving by socializing.

johnyjohny said:
I've been thinking about this a bit know and i don't think i am the one to argue about suicide. That's because i live a happy live my self and have never been close to something like that to happen. .
So i want to apologize for what i wrote on this topic last night because that was the opinion of someone who never ever ever ever had suicidal tough ts and if i had i would get rid of it right i way because i dont want my love ones to be unhappy. But than again i am never been rapped or something like that.

im4eversmart said:
"When a man dies before his time, how much is truly lost? like a withered branch that bears no more fruit, would his offspring had been saints? murderers? both? the answer goes with him when he leaves our world"

katsucats said:
Is the answer really important? There are infinite possibilities with every decision.

im4eversmart said:
The "infinite possibilities" IS the answer and its what Im trying to point out in response to this thread why suicide is a bad thing, cause you lose those infinite possibilities in the process

Immahnoob said:
Your problems wont be solved you said, but do you think you care after you die? If you die, you're free of whatever problems you have, after all, you'll rot somewhere in the ground.

Those that commit suicide don't think about solving the problem, but about running away from it, which also works, why should you give a fuck after your dead if you can't even do that?

katsucats said:
but the relief from pain -- the loss of a feeling