Kimi ni Todoke 2nd Season Episode 5 Discussion

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Oct 2010

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I am very angry still so I will talk about Kent. I will quote from my own mouth “Kent you pissed me off and you don’t want to see me pissed me off. If I want I can murder your shitty ass. You took advantage of Sawako for yourself and that is unforgivable! You must die or at the very least get a beating and I shall give it to you.” What follows would be me jumping on him kind of like Tarou did from MM! Even worse, I would so get Accelerator from Index on his ass, that punch he gave to that girl would be my pleasure to see on Kento. Now look at my pic on the profile and tell me if I can’t do it with a military training from my father? I can do it, especially since I can get easily berserk. Kento at first did make Sawako feel her good such as reminding her of her fitting in well with the rest of the class and made her reflect her past to look at how it is now but that ends here right now! He just got worse after that, by reminding at first Sawako of what Kurumi said that is purely negative. He followed by giving her completely wrong thinking about Kazehaya although it made Sawako realize why she loved him, which was good.

Things just spiraled completely ugly after that, by mentioning to Sawako to avoid Kazehaya just like Kurumi did. he even mentions to her about living out her youth,that makes no sense at all. That stuff does not work on Sawako in her emotional state. His proceeding to dismiss him and lying to her like a shit he is about Kazehaya having someone must have given her the idea that Kurumi lied to her or hit her hard with a a depression since she started crying and her initial expression with her eyes sure told me that fast enough. Even after all that this piece of shit touches her and tells her he wants to be one to love her? Really? You piece of shit, guys like you and Makoto I eat up for breakfast, basically I beat them up. So my take on the following part,

gets your shitty ass hands off her! Leave her alone! Never see her again you manipulating scum of a shit! There was that satisfying enough for people? Well that’s how I feel about Kento. It’s over, I don’t think I will ever forget this at all of him as much as Kurumi. It will take a long time for me to see him being forgiven and in fact since I am a guy, it won’t happen. For Kurumi I had some sympathy as a guy. For guys as a guy, it’s no. I had too many girls IRL being hurt and ruined, basically used and thrown away. Just telling. You can see it from a good side and a bad one but no matter what you cannot deny a fact about Kento that would not be a in favorable position, he lied to Sawako and he manipulated her. I am sorry but he does not deserve her. Sorry about that but I am usually trying to be positive. Rest of positive stuff will come later.

Yumekichi11Feb 9, 2011 7:24 AM

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Feb 9, 2011 6:51 AM

#42

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443

So much hate for Kent.
Look at Sawako: why would Kazehaya be the only guy to fall in love with her.
Look at the interaction between Kazehaya and Sawako: there's no way an outsider can tell they're in love with each other.
In Kent's view Kazehaya only pities the ugly duckling (and might lose interest now she's getting accepted), which would be cruel if it were true.
And matters being as they are between Sawako and Kazehaya, ' May the best man win' is still playing it fair imo.

Meronpan_Chan said:
Kent must die for making Sawako-chan cry like that. That is all.

Hm, I think it's Kazehaya's vagueness that's the cause for it in the 1st place.
Luckily now he has to kick himself and clear up the misunderstandings.

Feb 9, 2011 7:08 AM

#43

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Jan 2011

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Yano-chin is such a nice friend. Chizu looked very lovely.

Ryu…Ryu, in how many ways do I love thee? I love when he told Chizu that he’s not going to act on her behalf but for himself because he’s concerned about Shota and also proceeds to tell her that what ever Shota tells him will remain with him. Now that’s a guy who not only knows his own mind, he can be safely trusted with secrets.

It was nice seeing Ryu, Kazehaya and Pin together. It almost felt like the first season again. Pin’s line upon greeting Kazehaya in the cafeteria made me chuckle but his advice to Kazehaya was really nice with a touch of tough love.

And now to the most face-palming moment of the episode for me, written in paraphrase, “I don’t mind being your consolation prize.” Once again Miura has, as they say, put his foot in it. That single line, however well-meaning it may seem, only serves to strengthen my opinion that Miura deals with Sawako on a shallow basis. Not only does he underestimate her as a person, since it’s quite inconceivable to him that there’s anything that someone like Kazehaya would find remotely attractive or interesting in her (something that those who truly knows her would disagree with), he also goes and devalues her feelings for Kazehaya. Has he been reading Naruto and somehow agrees with Kishi that a woman’s heart is as fickle as the autumn sky? Meanwhile, just moments before he kept thinking what an insensitive jerk Kazehaya is and yet he goes and say something as insensitive as that, which, folks, is pretty much like Ayane’s flinch-inducing line to Chizu when she told her that there are better guys out there than Tohru. By their nature, lines like those imply that the person’s feelings for the other person are not being taken seriously. Yano-chin knew that and immediately regretted saying it particularly because Chizu visibly flinched.

Again, Miura remains blissfully unaware of the situation. The fact that Kazehaya defended Sawako to him and Sawako defended Kazehaya to him should have given him a hint to the beginning of the truth, but alas, I believe he’s so smugly convinced that he knows the situation and is so caught up in his idea of philanthropy that the truth, which is staring him in the face, continues to evade him. Perhaps, just perhaps if he had instead tried to get to know Sawako as a person rather than showering her with advice about her external appearance, he might have realized that there is much more to Sawako than a gloomy girl in need of savior, aka HIMSELF.

Anyway, I liked that in Sawako’s thoughts she acknowledges that Kazehaya has always treated her like a normal person. Too bad that she’s now convinced that Kazehaya only treated her that way because, again, he can’t help reaching out to outcasts. Congratulations Miura! You’ve done a flawless job of creating and strengthening misunderstandings in the lives of people you barely know. All that’s left for me to do is sit back and watch as this mess gets even messier.

That said, I don't hate Kento. I dislike his meddlesome behavior but what Kurumi will do to him will definitely appease me enough that I can forgive his nosiness.

Feb 9, 2011 7:36 AM

#44

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Taylor_elle said:

And now to the most face-palming moment of the episode for me, written in paraphrase, “I don’t mind being your consolation prize.” Once again Miura has, as they say, put his foot in it. That single line, however well-meaning it may seem, only serves to strengthen my opinion that Miura deals with Sawako on a shallow basis. Not only does he underestimate her as a person, since it’s quite inconceivable to him that there’s anything that someone like Kazehaya would find remotely attractive or interesting in her (something that those who truly knows her would disagree with), he also goes and devalues her feelings for Kazehaya. Has he been reading Naruto and somehow agrees with Kishi that a woman’s heart is as fickle as the autumn sky? Meanwhile, just moments before he kept thinking what an insensitive jerk Kazehaya is and yet he goes and say something as insensitive as that, which, folks, is pretty much like Ayane’s flinch-inducing line to Chizu when she told her that there are better guys out there than Tohru. By their nature, lines like those imply that the person’s feelings for the other person are not being taken seriously. Yano-chin knew that and immediately regretted saying it particularly because Chizu visibly flinched.

Again, Miura remains blissfully unaware of the situation. The fact that Kazehaya defended Sawako to him and Sawako defended Kazehaya to him should have given him a hint to the beginning of the truth, but alas, I believe he’s so smugly convinced that he knows the situation and is so caught up in his idea of philanthropy that the truth, which is staring him in the face, continues to evade him. Perhaps, just perhaps if he had instead tried to get to know Sawako as a person rather than showering her with advice about her external appearance, he might have realized that there is much more to Sawako than a gloomy girl in need of savior, aka HIMSELF.

Anyway, I liked that in Sawako’s thoughts she acknowledges that Kazehaya has always treated her like a normal person. Too bad that she’s now convinced that Kazehaya only treated her that way because, again, he can’t help reaching out to outcasts. Congratulations Miura! You’ve done a flawless job of creating and strengthening misunderstandings in the lives of people you barely know. All that’s left for me to do is sit back and watch as this mess gets even messier.

That said, I don't hate Kento. I dislike his meddlesome behavior but what Kurumi will do to him will definitely appease me enough that I can forgive his nosiness.

Nicely said and guess the rage might have been as great as mines but I am a Sawako x Kazehaya shipper so no surprise why I really angry. I agree with you fully about your point in regards to Kento since I have calmed and decided to thinks things over.

cleo said:
So much hate for Kent.
Look at Sawako: why would Kazehaya be the only guy to fall in love with her.

Because he did so much for her and Kento did shit all compared to the value of Kazehaya's time and emotions spent on her. No I don't like guys in any anime that barge in and win it all fast. It takes cultivation for a love to have its fruits.

cleo said:
Look at the interaction between Kazehaya and Sawako: there's no way an outsider can tell they're in love with each other.
In Kent's view Kazehaya only pities the ugly duckling (and might lose interest now she's getting accepted), which would be cruel if it were true.

That's exactly the problem that Kento brainwashed Sawako with. It's only a looks like it situation while reality is bottled up inside of both waiting to spur out at the right moment. It was about to come but Kento screwed it up and wasted Ryuu's time with Kazehaya on that one.

cleo said:
And matters being as they are between Sawako and Kazehaya, ' May the best man win' is still playing it fair imo.

Perhaps but with dirty lying tactics it's unacceptable and I tap my foot in anger to that. No way is it okay.

Meronpan_Chan said:
Kent must die for making Sawako-chan cry like that. That is all.

cleo said:
Hm, I think it's Kazehaya's vagueness that's the cause for it in the 1st place.
Luckily now he has to kick himself and clear up the misunderstandings.

I think it's more Kento's fault for suggesting shit to Sawako although parts of it did make her realize things. I think my avatar shows my feelings towards Kento. For me it's a no in accepting his actions.

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Feb 9, 2011 7:54 AM

#45

patlagik

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Exciting episode...but wait 'till the next episode...it will be a total tears cascade.

Feb 9, 2011 8:26 AM

#46

sexiji

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And bubbles! Don't forget the bubbles ^^

/ignores all the angry rants of obsessive fandom

Feb 9, 2011 8:43 AM

#47

xhx

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I was hoping kazehaya would drag sawako away from kent like he did when sawako was talking to ryu back in season 1. =/

Feb 9, 2011 8:53 AM

#48

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Taylor_elle said:
Perhaps, just perhaps if he had instead tried to get to know Sawako as a person rather than showering her with advice about her external appearance, he might have realized that there is much more to Sawako than a gloomy girl in need of savior, aka HIMSELF.

I read that scene differently. Imo he was showing her that she's no longer in need of a savior, because she's blending in more and more.
Sure he's meddlesome, but his actions [c]do[/c] help her to gain confidence in herself.
Yes, he's smug in thinking he understands the situation so well, but I think his main objective is to get rid of the 'outcast girl needs savior' scenario.
And as long as Kent's actions help Sawako to see she's no longer in need of pity/a savior, I'm all for that.
Kazehaya defended Sawako, but that can be read as pitying her just as easily.
For the most part Kazehaya was being evasive, giving Kent the wrong impression, so he's very much to blame for the situation as well.

Taylor_elle said:
By their nature, lines like those imply that the person’s feelings for the other person are not being taken seriously. Yano-chin knew that and immediately regretted saying it particularly because Chizu visibly flinched.

True, he could have voiced it better.
Yet, like you said, loads of people say lines like that while meaning well, just like Yano.
We know Yano isn't shallow, and I'm really not sure if Kent is.

Feb 9, 2011 9:05 AM

#49

Orulyon

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Honestly im a big shipper of Kazehaya and Sawako, but i dont think Kento did it with a mean attitude. Before he know that Sawako liked Kazehaya, he was already trying to help her. He never avoided her since the first moment he met her. Give the guy a chance, he´s not a bad person.
And c´mon, his character brought a new life to the show, im loving him, he´s putting angst and jeallous in Kazehaya, which i think is good, because it will help Kazehaya to confess to herXD

ワンダーランド花 ♥

Feb 9, 2011 9:19 AM

#50

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Yumekichi11 said:

Because he did so much for her and Kento did shit all compared to the value of Kazehaya's time and emotions spent on her. No I don't like guys in any anime that barge in and win it all fast. It takes cultivation for a love to have its fruits.

What I meant to say was: she has grown since S1, looking prettier. It's not so strange another guy falls in love with her. I agree on the cultivating, but at this point (frustrating enough) Kazehaya isn't exactly doing much on that front either.

Yumekichi11 said:

Feb 9, 2011 9:35 AM

#51

kisami

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ok, so basically its like the fist season except this time its a guy going after her....

good timing on his part....or a step too late?

Feb 9, 2011 9:38 AM

#52

mljato

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Sawako shuld just dumb Kazehaya and go with Kento to get over this already, so I can have more supporting character moments, like the scenes with Yano and Chizu or Chizu and Ryuu. Also Kento is definitely the better thought out character with more interesting traits…but unfortunately the Kazehaya/Sawako pairing will be shoved down our throats anyway…

Also next week’s episode title pretty much describes my feeling for this show: affection and annoyance.

Feb 9, 2011 10:08 AM

#53

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Now then let’s have some positive things that happened before the Kento shit. IMO this episode was perfect that has lots of small details to attention. Personally the marriage of Toru/Haruka was very nice and Yano with Chizuru was great too. Arai was great too and the conversation between Ryuu/Kazehaya was terrific with its flashbacks. Now too elaborate on those under the spoiler

About preview,looks like it’s going to be another tear jerking ordeal for many Sawako fans including myself. I hope Kento GTFO from Sawako literally or as some would like, Kazehaya punching him since Kento is a guy, we need some Kazehaya GAR mode. He did a damn good job of it in first season to a certain extend and I hope he will do some full blast ones.

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Feb 9, 2011 10:15 AM

#54

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cleo said:
Hm, I think it's Kazehaya's vagueness that's the cause for it in the 1st place.
Luckily now he has to kick himself and clear up the misunderstandings.

Kazehaya was vague? To me Kazehaya has never been vague in his dealings with Sawako. There have been many instances where not only has Kazehaya told Sawako things that any normal person would perceive as amorous attention but has also demonstrated that he might have those kind of feelings for her. The problem is, Sawako being someone who has been ostracized for the first fifteen years of her life, always finds a way of attributing his attention to kindness just like everyone else around her except their close friends. Also, if Kazehaya was vague about his feelings toward Sawako, there is no way Pin could have asked, “What’s wrong with his taste?” or there’s no way Ryu could have said, “Why didn’t you tell her you wanted to see her too?” And even before that, by the time Sawako invited Kazehaya to Ryu’s place that Saturday night in episode 7 or 8 of season one, Yano-chin had pretty much already figured out that Kazehaya liked Sawako in that way.

Anyway, even though Sawako and Shota’s relationship was at a standstill because she’s terrified of him and he’s worried that he’s forcing his advances on her, the situation was not nearly as complicated as Miura has made it. Not for a moment do I think that his meddling is justified. Furthermore, if Sawako and Kazehaya’s own friends who know the truth about the situation haven’t yet taken it upon themselves to directly intervene, I don’t know what gives Miura the right to.

cleo said:
I read that scene differently. Imo he was showing her that she's no longer in need of a savior, because she's blending in more and more. Sure he's meddlesome, but his actions [c]do[/c] help her to gain confidence in herself.

Don’t you think that by this very act he is making himself into her saviour? lol The irony!

Anyway, in case you might actually think that Kazehaya has not supported Sawako, I’d refer you back to Sawako’s own statement to Kazehaya that he always gives her the strength to act. Mind you, Kazehaya doesn’t tell her to be more confident. He doesn’t try to change her. Instead, he accepts her for who she is and becomes her friend. Then by his encouragement, Sawako has watched the world around her change as she herself began to change little by little. This is the truth and no one is more aware of this than Sawako. The fact is, Kazehaya has made Sawako more confident in many instances.

-What voice did she hear in her head when she plucked up the courage to approach Yano and Chizu before the courage test?
-What voice did she hear in her head when she invited Endo-san and Tomo-chan into the classroom to help her finish the class roll?
-What voice did she hear in her head when she approached the students to tell them that the seat was not dirty or cursed and that they could sit there?

And the list could go on if only I remembered all of those season one moments.

cleo said:
Kazehaya defended Sawako, but that can be read as pitying her just as easily.

Pity? Do you really know Kazehaya? I get the impression that you don’t. There has not been a single moment in Kimi Ni Todoke, right up to the most recent chapter, when Kazehaya has pitied Sawako. Even when she was still an outcast, Kazehaya did not pity her. Instead, he was always trying to understand her. He himself said that from his standpoint, he always saw her as someone who finds joy in whatever she’s doing and he also thought that she had a knack for finding things that she liked to do. That’s the way Kazehaya saw Sawako before he became more acquainted with her. He's never pitied her and treats her quite normally. That's why he didn't understand what Kento meant about pitying Sawako.

cleo said:
For the most part Kazehaya was being evasive, giving Kent the wrong impression, so he's very much to blame for the situation as well.

How has Kazehaya given Kento the wrong impression? Please explain. From what I see, Kento himself has drawn the wrong impression of Kazehaya because he’s succumbed to the herd’s mentality that Kazehaya is nice to Sawako only because he can’t leave outcasts alone. Even during their conversation when Kazehaya asks him to explain himself when he said that Kazehaya only treats Sawako that way because she is/was an outcast, he just laughed it off in his own carefree way and told Kazehaya not to get so angry. If he was really interested in finding out what kind of guy Kazehaya truly is, that conversation could have progressed much differently.

Feb 9, 2011 10:19 AM

#55

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cleo said:
Look at the interaction between Kazehaya and Sawako: there's no way an outsider can tell they're in love with each other.
In Kent's view Kazehaya only pities the ugly duckling (and might lose interest now she's getting accepted), which would be cruel if it were true.

Yumekichi11 said:
That's exactly the problem that Kento brainwashed Sawako with. It's only a looks like it situation while reality is bottled up inside of both waiting to spur out at the right moment. It was about to come but Kento screwed it up and wasted Ryuu's time with Kazehaya on that one.

cleo said:
So you're hating Kent for not being able to read minds?
If people could do that in this series, we wouldn't have this misunderstandings in the first place lol.

No you got it wrong, I am hating him for taking advantage of the situation. He observed well enough to deduct what is going on between Kazehaya and Sawako. Certainly he might have assumed some things but make no mistake, he was full taking advantage of all this to twsit things around. Scum like him are not forgivable it's the same shit with Kimi Ga Nozomu Eien except more rough and it's a girl doing that.

cleo said:
Besides, it's not just Kent who's saying that Kazehaya is always nice to outcasts. I got the impression it's a well-known fact among students.

Yes it is and there are still seeing Kazehaya like that, which creates misunderstandings between if people do not know of their progress. I guess all these misunderstandings is what "Trying to reach you" is about, that of overcoming them to be united forever. Kind of a sweet if you think about it.

cleo said:
Kazehaya himself could have avoided this whole mess by being a bit more upfront with Kent. His evasiveness sure didn't help matters.

Spoken the truth like never before and I like that! He sure should have been upfront and at the beginning of the episode.

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Feb 9, 2011 11:22 AM

#56

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Yumekichi11 said:

cleo said:
Kazehaya himself could have avoided this whole mess by being a bit more upfront with Kent. His evasiveness sure didn't help matters.

Spoken the truth like never before and I like that! He sure should have been upfront and at the beginning of the episode.

I get the impression that you guys don't understand Kazehaya.

In the first place, who the heck is Kento in Kazehaya's eyes and why does he have to explain himself to him?

Secondly, have you watched season one? In there it is firmly depicted that Kazehaya doesn't like people all up in his business. He was that way since middle school and he's that way in high school. I'm not exactly sure what you all heard when Kazehaya told Kento that it's not Kento's place to tell him those things that he did in last week's episode. In other words, Kazehaya was telling him quite assuredly to mind his own business. This is the second time now that someone who is close to Sawako has told Kento to mind his own business. I wonder how many more of Sawako's friends will it take before he gets the message?

Feb 9, 2011 11:24 AM

#57

LadyOrihime

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WOW. Does ANYONE here read the manga? O.o All this Kent hate makes me believe so...

nznznz said:
To me Kent seems to be honest, not knowing about Kazehaya's true feelings and thinking he was just nice to her. It's up to Kazehaya now to get things straight but I guess this will be your typical misunderstanding with the big realization in the end. Hopefully I'm wrong and they try an orignal approach. Too bad Kurumi didn't had a part till now and probably won't have one. :(

I'm a manga reader, and you (and anyone else who said Kent's intentions were honest) are correct about Kent.

He is just one of those people who think out loud, and acts before really thinking about it.

As for Kurumi's part in this, patience is a virtue ;)

TL;DR - In the end, Kent and Kurumi have good intentions.

LadyOrihimeFeb 9, 2011 11:29 AM

Feb 9, 2011 11:53 AM

#58

Gar_Logan

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Ugh I hate Kent so much. He made Sawako cry :(

Feb 9, 2011 12:00 PM

#59

nznz

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LadyOrihime said:
As for Kurumi's part in this, patience is a virtue ;)

Thanks, that's good to hear and I'm looking forward to it. Won't read your spoilers though. ;)

Feb 9, 2011 12:01 PM

#60

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LadyOrihime said:
TL;DR - In the end, Kent and Kurumi have good intentions.

:) The first thing that came to my mind when I saw your statement above:

The road to hell is paved with good intentions.

I think it's quite befitting in this case although in Kurumi's case, her good intentions in no way ended up being a bad thing. Ultimately, her action did a lot of good. If and when Kento's good intentions ever take on an entirely different and worthwhile nature, then I'd say that it's all good.

Taylor_elleFeb 9, 2011 12:20 PM

Feb 9, 2011 12:02 PM

#61

ByeByeMrMoon

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890

Nice episode, I feel sorry for Kazehaya :|

Feb 9, 2011 12:26 PM

#62

typicalhonduran

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Good episode. Kent really is just karumi sub for the moment.

I lol'd at the almost kiss between Ryu and Chizu.

Feb 9, 2011 1:11 PM

#63

Gaia

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Mar 2008

378

Now this was a good episode!!

Feb 9, 2011 1:51 PM

#64

PseudoJord

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848

Oh my...things happened!

Feb 9, 2011 2:19 PM

#65

KinkyMegane

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Jun 2009

532

Wow...this episode was just...wow
I was so into it too

I read the manga but i think i skipped some chapter because I don't remember the whole wedding thing.
And the end OMG!! That was such a cliffhanger....I think my face was getting closer to the screen and when the ending theme started I screamed lol

Feb 9, 2011 2:25 PM

#66

VARIAchan

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Oct 2008

7711

Lol, Pin. :D

Life is really simple, but we insist on making it complicated.~

Feb 9, 2011 2:40 PM

#67

Rodreth

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171

Leave the protagonists alone, I want a development for Ryu and Chizu ~

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Feb 9, 2011 2:51 PM

#68

coolcatjas

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This episode was amazing! The ending though... it made my heart ache... I wanted to comfort Sawako and punch stupid Kent in the face DB< Never before has an anime made me tear up... I love Kimi ni Todoke.

Feb 9, 2011 2:53 PM

#69

billng

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1150

Oh kent you smooth operator.

Would like to see the Chizu and Ryu relationship developed more

Feb 9, 2011 2:53 PM

#70