Wandering Witch: The Journey of Elaina (light novel)
Episode 3.
There's a quote here that applies: "Neutrality helps the oppressor, never the victim. Silence encourages the tormentor, never the tormented. Sometimes we must interfere." What's my takeaway? Well, first off I was lying, Elaina is not morally grey. What Elaina did here was the equivalent of walking past a lake with a drowning child in it, shrugging once and saying "eh, it'd just be tiring to save that one, whateversss". What do we call people who do shit like that? Neutral? No, I believe there are other descriptors that are far worse and far more fitting, such as coldhearted or psychopathic. But actually her reasoning is even worse according to the author, because Elaina's monologue in the LN goes like this, and I put this in a spoilerbecause if you have even a spark of empathy, this is the sort of shit that makes your blood run cold: This is terrible. Instead of reflecting and admitting to herself that she's a shitty person who doesn't give a damn about other people, her justification loops back around and centers on herself in one of the most inane ways possible. Why can't she go back and save her? "Because looking at her would make me feel sad". With what I'm given I can only come to one conclusion. Elaina is a rampant narcissist, and the author honestly might be too because who else could write such a disgusting character? If this is a taste of what's to come then I can confidently say that I have no interest in watching this show. Rarely have I seen such a loathsome and repulsive MC. Elaina is the queen of letting children drown in lakes and never looking back. From now on everything Elaina does will be tainted as I can't help but view it through the lense of her apparent narcissism. Her token attempt to stand up to the master? You bet she didn't do that to protect the slave, but to protect her self-conception of being a good person, typical narcissist behavior. In the end she did exactly as much as she needed to do to clear her own conscience, to keep believing that at least she didn't do nothing, even though she really did do nothing. How could I enjoy watching this show now that I know what kind of person she is? I can't. Actually, the only people who can enjoy watching this one are either blissfully unperceptive, narcissistic enough themselves to not mind, or have a clinical interest in narcissism. Sadly I don't fit in any of these categories, which can only mean one thing: Dropped, 1/10. Alright that's it, fuck this show I'm out. ---------------------------- Mod Note: Removed last part |
dipItFooOct 17, 2020 7:25 PM
| "my life at this state could be transposed into a pretty massive biography" - Cneq, "the guy who was literally using BTC in 2012 to make deals in the first main instance of a digital itemized economy forming naturally in all human history (also the precursor of NFTs) and who had 20k+ total trades.", 23 years old MAL's most prolific antivaxxer, Noboru. |
| Quality deduction skills my dude. |
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CheeseKnife said: I didn't deduce shit man, the same way I'm not deducing that the giant tree in front of me is a tree when I'm walking in a forest.Quality deduction skills my dude. You see the tree, you know it's a tree. Elaina is openly being a horrible narcissist and a shitty person. You see a terrible person doing terrible things and you know that's what is up, not much to deduce. |
| "my life at this state could be transposed into a pretty massive biography" - Cneq, "the guy who was literally using BTC in 2012 to make deals in the first main instance of a digital itemized economy forming naturally in all human history (also the precursor of NFTs) and who had 20k+ total trades.", 23 years old MAL's most prolific antivaxxer, Noboru. |
Railey2 said: CheeseKnife said: I didn't deduce shit man, the same way I'm not deducing that the giant tree in front of me is a tree when I'm walking in a forest.Quality deduction skills my dude. You see the tree, you know it's a tree. Elaina is openly being a horrible narcissist and a shitty person. You see a terrible person doing terrible things and you know that's what is up, not much to deduce. I mean, I get what you're saying, but also, I respectfully disagree with your opinion. I feel like you're reading way too far into it and deducing qualities of her character based on a singular decision. I don't believe it's as simple as her just "saving" the girl. She's not some superhero and technically she's property. Her taking on the girl would require extra responsibilities of her and I felt there wasn't much she could do in that aspect. I won't deny that she does think highly of herself and I feel like anybody who has accomplished as much as she has would have the right to feel pretty good about themselves, however, I wouldn't go as far as to say that defines her character or even call her a "rampant narcissist." That's all, sorry that you took this episode that way. |
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UncleJojo said: It's none of her purpose because she's a shitty person without empathy.The whole purpose of Elaina is to travel the world and document about it just like the witch she read about. It’s none of her business because she doesn’t have a justice boner like any generic Isekai protagonist. She’s just learning that the world is imperfect and nothing is all sunshine and rainbows. And your defense of her is indicative of what kind of person you are. Mr. "I defend people who let children drown in lakes". It's not even about her being a hero. You don't have to be a hero to intervene. You just have to be a person. But she's not. She's less. |
| "my life at this state could be transposed into a pretty massive biography" - Cneq, "the guy who was literally using BTC in 2012 to make deals in the first main instance of a digital itemized economy forming naturally in all human history (also the precursor of NFTs) and who had 20k+ total trades.", 23 years old MAL's most prolific antivaxxer, Noboru. |
| I sort of agree with the OP, you do ALWAYS have a obligation try and help those who are abused, is slavery even legal in that country. What is wrong with just having a regular paid maid who actually work there of their own will etc. It is just not only that. She seems really weird to me, why all of a sudden did she go stone cold observer. |
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| Good for you Eleonore, we're happy for you. |
| yea man this anime was great till ep2 but Elaina really disgusted me this episode this was just horrible I cant understand how ppl can like this they ignore what they see and just say: "its not her job to help. this anime is about traveling." this just shows how bad written this story is |
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| Elaina sucks, that's all... fucking terrible narcisist and cold person. |
| You comparing her behaviour to allowing children to drown in lakes says more about you than this episode says about Elaina as a character, and the author. You don't like it, don't read/watch it. Bye. |
| I looked at the other shows OP has "dropped". Just another extremist trying to make an impression. The funny thing is, some of your impressions aren't wrong, though you're really stretching to force your negative perception of Elaina's actions onto impressionable people. "Wow, he's right, what she did was really dark... she's a horrible person!" Man, she's a witch. Why do you think it's her duty to intervene in other people's personal affairs? I guess you missed the part where she was pointing her wand at the bloke, and considered for a good while doing something to him, but changed her mind. You're focusing way too much on her changing her mind and being a cold narcissistic person, and not WHY she decided to do that. Nobody's going to defend Elaina's actions in this episode. It's a dark episode, and probably not what you or other people were expecting. It's also FICTION. I love when people reach and try to accuse author's of this or that because of what they write. Frankly, I, as a MajoTabi fanboy, am honored that such a person added this show on their drop list with other amazing shows. |
AmadeusuOct 16, 2020 1:15 PM
| This series is too complex for OP, your brain stopped at SLAVERY IS BAD and never thought about the consequence of what might happen if Elaina tried to "help" her, it's almost as if you didn't even pay attention to this episode, they literally said that doing good things can end up being worse. It's ok to drop it, it's not for you. |
Railey2 said: Episode 3.
There's a quote here that applies: "Neutrality helps the oppressor, never the victim. Silence encourages the tormentor, never the tormented. Sometimes we must interfere." What's my takeaway? Well, first off I was lying, Elaina is not morally grey. What Elaina did here was the equivalent of walking past a lake with a drowning child in it, shrugging once and saying "eh, it'd just be tiring to save that one, whateversss". What do we call people who do shit like that? Neutral? No, I believe there are other descriptors that are far worse and far more fitting, such as coldhearted or psychopathic. But actually her reasoning is even worse according to the author, because Elaina's monologue in the LN goes like this, and I put this in a spoilerbecause if you have even a spark of empathy, this is the sort of shit that makes your blood run cold: This is terrible. Instead of reflecting and admitting to herself that she's a shitty person who doesn't give a damn about other people, her justification loops back around and centers on herself in one of the most inane ways possible. Why can't she go back and save her? "Because looking at her would make me feel sad". With what I'm given I can only come to one conclusion. Elaina is a rampant narcissist, and the author honestly might be too because who else could write such a disgusting character? If this is a taste of what's to come then I can confidently say that I have no interest in watching this show. Rarely have I seen such a loathsome and repulsive MC. Elaina is the queen of letting children drown in lakes and never looking back. From now on everything Elaina does will be tainted as I can't help but view it through the lense of her apparent narcissism. Her token attempt to stand up to the master? You bet she didn't do that to protect the slave, but to protect her self-conception of being a good person, typical narcissist behavior. In the end she did exactly as much as she needed to do to clear her own conscience, to keep believing that at least she didn't do nothing, even though she really did do nothing. How could I enjoy watching this show now that I know what kind of person she is? I can't. Actually, the only people who can enjoy watching this one are either blissfully unperceptive, narcissistic enough themselves to not mind, or have a clinical interest in narcissism. Sadly I don't fit in any of these categories, which can only mean one thing: Dropped, 1/10. Alright that's it, fuck this show I'm out. I mean in my opinion is even worse than just being neutral. Sure, a neutral individual can be considered selfish and cold, but at least it is just trying to stay out of trouble most of the time. Notice how the main arguments that people use to defend her action are stuff like: - "She just want to travel" - "What happens in the world is out of her control" - "She is very smart but not a super hero" - "Her mom told her to stay out of trouble" To be fair with the people saying that: Most of that is true. However if you pay close attention to first minutes of the episode: she technically also got the guard killed and probably his whole town, considering that she was the direct cause of the dude turning into a zombie plant thing... well, that is beyond being neutral. Remember that she brought those flowers to the town, flowers that got burned and which gas most likely turn people into crazy-flower-zombie things. In the particular case the whole "she is just a neutral espectator" crumbles. I could be wrong, but in that particular case maybe she even let the guard die just as revenge since he was kind of a moron with her when she was entering town. Before the fanbois jump on the hate train: I am not hating on the show, In fact I like it so far. However in my opinion Elaina is a trash human being. A show can still be good show with an evil MC, people don't need to deny this in order to validate the show. --------------------- Mod Note: Edited quote |
dipItFooOct 17, 2020 7:30 PM
| Isn't the whole point of the anime that Elaina is travelling around the world visiting places and experiencing things? She never set out to be a hero or a saviour It may seem obvious to help a slave from our perspective but this is a fantasy anime and she's a witch. I don't really see why applying 21st century moral codes here does much good. Yes of course she could've acted more honorably and try to intervene more, but she has no obligation to do so And in any case I really don't see why that would suddenly make it a 1/10 anime. Does every main character need to be a goody-two-shoes for you to enjoy a work of fiction? OP seemed to like Death Note for example which would be a textbook example of something with an evil protagonist. If that's okay then why shouldn't this be? |
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| Elaina is just an observer and travels and doesn't want to get too involved in people's lives generally to deep degrees. Simple as that. Just my opinion though. Even if she isn't the best person on the planet, I still find her character to be really well written and the show/novels too. |
| still prefer her to the characters that try too hard to be heroes but in the end it blows up in their face |
| I do not think Elaina is rampantly narcissitic at all. I did not read the light novels but no where in the recent episode have I found that Elaina viewed herself as morally correct or more important. Elaina is certainly a very powerful character in the series who has the ability to do amazing things and save people. I think you can agree that good morals would include helping and saving people if you have the ability to do so. However, in the recent episode, Elaina is morally ambiguous in the sense that she could not really save the girl who was a slave. The fact that slaves could be bought or sold in this world could demonstrate the morality and norms that the author wanted to set out in the story. If she were to "save" Nino from the slaveholder, she would either have to threaten the slaveholder or purchase her from him. However, that also means she has to take responsibility for taking care of Nino. Assuming that slaves are normally bought and sold in this world, I think the act of trying to save Nino would be narcissitic itself. If you expect it is morally right for Elaina to save this one girl from the descpiable system of slavery, then what about every other person that is enslaved in the world? Is she expected to save everyone else because she has the power to do so? If Elaina were your typical anime protagonist, then yes, she would probably try to do exactly that. But she cannot because that means going against the system itself. A better analogy than your "drowning child one" would be an ambassador from a country where slavery is outlawed visiting a prominent plantation owner in the U.S. during the 1800s. What can this important government official do if he views a slave being potentially abused and mistreated when the country views slavery as normal? This series is morally ambiguous in the sense that we are viewing the world in a different perspective with different morality and values than our current views. Remember what Elaina's mom told her in the first episode: "To not think that you are a special human, you're the same as everyone else." Unfortunately, this could also be applied here meaning that she should not play hero because in the end she would be only making herself feel better when saving people when in fact, reality is darker than that. |
| With great power comes great responsibility |
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| Hahahaha Aren't you the narcissist who's dismissing everyone else as terrible just because you couldn't stomach this episode. It was great and coherent with the message it tried to portray. High effort shit post. Or maybe you're for real, in any case, you got some mental issues |
FMmatronOct 16, 2020 1:43 PM
One Piece episode 914 & 915 & 1027 were a mistake and 957 brought the salvation - FMmatron |
| I'm beginning to think that Elaina is intentionally written as a villain protagonist. Let me preface this by admitting that I'm an anime-only, so IDK if what I'm about to say is blatantly contradicted by something in another part of canon. Let's get something out of the way first: Elaina has the power to act with little risk to her own personal well-being, but repeatedly chooses not to help those in need. She was clearly not in immediate danger from the flowers. She held that bouquet all the way to the village and even landed in the field briefly at the beginning of the episode with no ill effects. So how can we excuse her utter indifference? She didn't hurry back to check on the girl in the field after finding out about the flower's true nature. She didn't try to help the guard, even though he wasn't completely consumed yet. She didn't even warn the village of the potential threat. The slave owner is nothing but a human. How hard would it have been to go nuclear on him? Or at least to rescue the person he holds captive? It's none of her business, huh? To quote Uncle Ben, "With great power, comes great responsibility." She is not some meek peasant waif; she is proud, powerful witch, a person of influence in her society. She has a moral obligation to do something! I believe we are intended to be disgusted with Elaina's actions. She's a spoiled brat whose first, and only, major dose of hardship came at the hands of a strict teacher. The world, in her eyes, exists to entertain her, to provide her with meaningful experiences. She is young, beautiful, and talented after all. Why shouldn't she do as she pleases, and only as she pleases? Consider the entitled way she reacted when the guard told her she couldn't carry the flowers into town. Consider also the way in which she expected preferential treatment upon entering the city in the second episode. And why should witches be treated better than anyone else? Elaina hasn't done anything for her community that hasn't also benefited herself (taking flowers to town because it seemed novel, training a girl for a week because she took a fancy to her, etc.). In my eyes, Elaina is like those ultra rich people who go on poverty tours. The suffering of others in exotic locales makes for a neat journal entry and little more. It's cold and cruel and, as you say, her supposed "neutrality" is, in truth, tacit approval of those in power. Additionally, her comment on the sight of Nino "making her sad," reminds me of comments from the rich regarding the poor. They want the poor shunted away to slums and such because the sight of them is "unattractive," "depressing," and so on, and they would rather shove the suffering of others under the rug than use a meager portion of their own power to aide them. Not unlike Ursula K. Le Guin's well-known short story "The Ones Who Walk Away from Omelas," the show should inspire viewers to consider what common cruelties they have chosen to ignore for their own comfort. But maybe I'm giving the author too much credit lol (Regardless, I am sick of ppl talking abt how hard it is for Elaina to just turn her back on those in need. However, "difficult" it was for her, it is infinitely harder for Nino to continue to live in her present situation. Elaina can cry me a freaking river for all I care. Also: she is so absurdly powerful compared to the average person in this setting; it's baffling to see some try to justify her behavior as "avoiding danger." No, my dude, she's never been in danger. Not once. She's just trying not to rock the boat because she's a self-absorbed coward. You hit the nail on the head when you said she only cares about being able to think about herself as a good person rather than... actually caring about being a good person) |
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| The author was not in a mentally healthy condition when writing the first few volumes, so yeah. |
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Stardew said: Did you not watch the first episode? She could raze a small city all by herself, let alone a flower field or the zombified carriers. Witches are extremely powerful in her world, and she's one of the most talented ones there's ever been. It's why she carries herself like she's nobility and above everyone else, because she knows she's untouchable. That power is why the observer angle doesn't work. She doesn't choose not to help others for self-preservation reasons or because it would be too much effort. She simply doesn't care.She prob does not have any other spell except time reversal and broom flying, you cant blame her lol It's quite telling that the director of the anime felt compelled to add that scene where she gets mad at the rapist. They didn't show her suicide either, unlike in the manga, where the maid girl stabs herself. |
GersenOct 16, 2020 2:20 PM
| Not trying too be to meta here, but just the fact that the show caused many ppl to think and discuss about the morality of the protagonist is great. The quality of a show is not defined by the morality of the protgonist. The show is not evaluating her actions, leaving that to the viewer. Thought provoing content is good content. |
Akumaxd said: If you were completely immune to bullets, would you not go through gunfire to save someone?haha Op is acting like he/she would without a doubt jump into gunfire to save a random person they've never seen before. And also condemning everyone who doesn't have the same opinion. |
Gersen said: Stardew said: She prob does not have any other spell except time reversal and broom flying, you cant blame her lol It's quite telling that the director of the anime felt compelled to add that scene where she gets mad at the rapist. They didn't show her suicide either, unlike in the manga, where the maid girl stabs herself. That's just manga additions that are not canon. |
| Yeah Elaina, an adolescent should rescue a complete stranger, without knowing anything about the situation, and should shoulder the full responsibility. What a great worldview some people have here... You guys watched too many animes where only heroes and villains (white and black) appeared, that's why you can't handle a realistically written character like Elaina. She did what rationally would be the best. And your metaphor about the drowning child doesn't work at all. I mean the whole situation would be resolved after rescuing the kid out of the water. No responsibility involved at all @OP Your quote from the LN "It really was a beautiful place. But I had no reason to ever return. If I did, I would just end up feeling sad." Shows perfectly that she weighed her possibilities, and decided that it is regretably beyond her means. Hence she said she would feel sad |
my problem is that I cannot conceive that Elaina in the previous 2 episodes introduces me to the character as someone affable and caring and now she is totally insensitive, it is totally dissonant this  and this  |
616Knight said: PrincessJAM said: i know right? the past 2 episodes she's shown to be a caring person (who yeah might be a little full of herself but thats not bad) and willing to help people even strangers she just met but then in this episode she's just fine watching people die/seeing flower people and completely ignoring a girl who is clearly getting if not raped sexually and physically abused. it just such a character switch. I think this sums things up well, the first two episodes shows her as a caring individual, but its like a switch went off in her and she became cold and callous. Maybe in the novel it more detailed but in the anime, it just looks like she changed personalities in-between episodes. Though, I dont think the chef did anything sexual as I think he plans to sell her when she is older. The chef does. 1. He said he buys Nino for her potential beauty & Nino is a good maid, but we all see how bad Nino handles housework 2. When Nino left the room (where the chef was also inside), she was wearing her clothes |
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616Knight said: WeisserSchnee2 said: Yeah Elaina, an adolescent should rescue a complete stranger, without knowing anything about the situation, and should shoulder the full responsibility. What a great worldview some people have here... You guys watched too many animes where only heroes and villains (white and black) appeared, that's why you can't handle a realistically written character like Elaina. She did what rationally would be the best. And your metaphor about the drowning child doesn't work at all. I mean the whole situation would be resolved after rescuing the kid out of the water. No responsibility involved at all @OP Your quote from the LN "It really was a beautiful place. But I had no reason to ever return. If I did, I would just end up feeling sad." Shows perfectly that she weighed her possibilities, and decided that it is regretably beyond her means. Hence she said she would feel sad The problem is, its not beyond her means. The show has made it clear that she is every skilled and talented. Rescuing one person for someone that's clearly an overpowered character isnt beyond her means. Also, what responsibility would she have after saving the girl? Elaina could have brought them somewhere safe and they could have taken care of themselves. And the comment about black and white also makes no sense since the older man was clearly a morally abhorrent character, there was no grey area in that story. A possible reason is that Elaina wants to keep herself safe. Fighting the old man may make her name (in)famous to other rich people, which may cause trouble in her journey. Remember that Elaina’s mom reminded her that she was not special? |
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Gersen said: Stardew said: Did you not watch the first episode? She could raze a small city all by herself, let alone a small flower field or the zombified carriers. Witches are extremely powerful in her world, and she's one of the most talented ones there's ever been. It's why she carries herself like she's nobility and above everyone else, because she knows she's untouchable. That power is why the observer angle doesn't work. She doesn't choose not to help others for self-preservation reasons or because it would be too much effort. She simply doesn't care.She prob does not have any other spell except time reversal and broom flying, you cant blame her lol It's quite telling that the director of the anime felt compelled to add that scene where she gets mad at the rapist. They didn't show her suicide either, unlike in the manga, where the maid girl stabs herself. In the past two episodes, for a powerful witch that she is. She has only used two spells. She is strong in combat but she does not have a spell to even locate her brooch in episode two lol. Some LN reader told me this is because she doesn't have one lol(im using what they said xd), so she prob didn't have one to do anything here either. You don't even know if burning the entire thing will work at all shrugs or sending those attacks that she sent at flan will work at all. I agree with you in the real reason she does not do anything, she does not care at all. She is just there trying to get stories so she can write her book. |
StardewOct 16, 2020 4:08 PM
616Knight said: The problem is, its not beyond her means. The show has made it clear that she is every skilled and talented. Rescuing one person for someone that's clearly an overpowered character isnt beyond her means. Also, what responsibility would she have after saving the girl? Elaina could have brought them somewhere safe and they could have taken care of themselves. She is an adolescent who doesn't really know much about the world. You are really EXPECTING her to help Nino? What would you do when you can't find someone who takes the girl How can you ensure that you don't give her in the wrong hands? what would you do if you take the girl with you and she tries to kill herself, because her soul is already dead. What would you do if the "father" tries to go after Nino after some time? Just saying to safe the girl and doing it are two completely different things Many things have to be considered, you can't expect it from a mere adolescent She may be a skilled witch, but she isn't an almighty hero |
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