nocorras said: I don't expect Rin to win the poll lol. We might have to start a revolution though :/
And I'm fine with Saber being the poster girl btw. I just felt like shit posting while waiting for live reactions.
B-but I'm gonna get bored.
I need to get muh entertainment from somewhere. And Fai is so salty that if I came close to him, I'd get liver cancer. So I have to rely on the rest of the Rinfags D:
nocorras said: Normally the people pushing for social change start in the minority, and they aren't necessarily 'wrong' or 'salty'. You saying the majority is right is just plain wrong and a logical fallacy anyway, I just felt like calling it out.
Technically, saying that "normally the people pushing for social change start in the minority" is also a logical fallacy. It's called appeal to antiquity. You are saying that "because change happened this way before, it is true in most cases."
There is no way to prove that the majority of the time social change starts with a minority. Change is constantly happening, the only difference is that change that starts with a majority happens so rapidly that it's sometimes not noticeable, while change that starts with a minority takes a lot longer and is more apparent and public because of it's length.
nocorras said: Normally the people pushing for social change start in the minority, and they aren't necessarily 'wrong' or 'salty'. You saying the majority is right is just plain wrong and a logical fallacy anyway, I just felt like calling it out.
Technically, saying that "normally the people pushing for social change start in the minority" is also a logical fallacy. It's called appeal to antiquity. You are saying that "because change happened this way before, it is true in most cases."
There is no way to prove that the majority of the time social change starts with a minority. Change is constantly happening, the only difference is that change that starts with a majority happens so rapidly that it's sometimes not noticeable, while change that starts with a minority takes a lot longer and is more apparent and public because of it's length.
So, me and Aurioch just had some Ramblings, or as Aurioch likes to call em ''fan-pulled-out-of-our-asses-right-now-fics'', over Skype when i posted something with ''Father... no, Emiya Kiritsugu, I will stop you'', and we decided to Post em over here :D
Before i post them here, i would like to thank k0k0 for correcting alot of mistakes.
Thanks, k0k0^^
My Oneshot
''Let's go, Rider"
We move out of the house and make our way to the Fuyuki Center mall. It's time for the final Battle of the 4th Holy Grail War.
''Father... no, Emiya Kiritsugu, I will stop you. If you are ready to sacrifice one person to save the world, then I am ready to be all the evil contained in the world necessary to stop you."
I mutter as i move out to stop Emiya Kiritsugu from sacrifing her for his own desire.
As i move in, I see her on the table, lying flat and helpless. Emiya Kiritsugu was about to commence the ritual that would take her life. I also see his Servant, Saber, standing guard besides him.
''Rider, try to hold off Saber. I'll head for the other and finish him off."
I am walking through the flames.
It happened again, just as it happened 10 years ago. The town was alive with fire. Again.
"I...Failed."
I couldn't save her. I was able to demolish Emiya Kiritsugu, but I was a moment too late to save her from her impending doom. The ritual was completed. She was cut down on the alter.
And as I began to ready myself in order to use the Grail to revive her, I witnessed the true nature of it.
Angra Mainyu. All the evil in the World.
It...it talked to me.
It told me that I was worthy of becoming it.
It offered to bring her back to me. But the price was...
The price was everyone else on this planet, but us.
I couldn't do it.
Even if I swore to become her superhero, would we be able to live with ourselves knowing that we were responsible for the perishing of all the people?
No, we couldn't.
And so, the decision was made.
''Rider, by the order of the command seal, I order you to destroy the Holy Grail and everything within it.''
Near defeat, Rider blinks at me, at first, uncomprehending, but then the realization dawns in her eyes and she prepares her Noble Phantasm.
I see Saber rushing towards us, sword out, attack at the ready.
''Rider! By the order of my last command seal, I ask you to use your Noble Phantasm to destroy the Holy Grail!''
Saber was rushing in, crying in desperation.
And that's how the town was torn apart and eaten up in flames of red and smoke that rose from black charcoal. Black charcoal that were bodies.
''I...I killed all those people...''
I kept walking among them.
"One person. Atleast one person," I repeated to myself meaninglessly.
I have to save atleast one Person. Just one. Any.
I kept searching and searching. One... someone..
And Finally, I found a life, preserved and walking within the rubble.
An ebony-haired, sunny-eyed young girl was howling in tears and making her way through the obliterated town.
I reached her as quickly as my feet would allow and pulled her out from between the merciless flames.
As I carried her, she continued to mutter to herself, not fully conscious.
''Shirou nii-san... please help me.''
''Shirou nii-san?''
I wake up. For a reason I couldn't fathom, sleep refused to come to me. I spot my elder brother seated on the porch outside.
We weren't biologically related, but he very much resembled an older version of 'him'. As I walk towards him, I think about how it would've been almost impossible to distinguish him from my biological brother, were it not for a lock of white in his hair.
''Oh, Miyu. You are still awake," he stated, rather than questioned.
''I couldn't sleep, nii-san," I reply.
As I position myself comfortable on the wooden deck besides him, he continues to stare at the sky, his head tilted at an angle directly in line with the rotund moon.
''You know, Miyu, 10 years ago my father and I were sitting in this very same place, in this very same way,"
"Eh?" I probed.
He never talked about his past. Why would he do it now?
Still, I keep listening. I owed it to him to listen, at least. And to be quite frank, I myself was consumed with curiosity.
''He had entrusted me with a verbal lesson. It was an important one," Shirou continued, eyes reflecting the moon light. "Would you like to know what he told me?"
''What did he tell you, nii-san?'' I ask the anticipated query.
''He told me... he told me that he wanted to be a hero." Nii-san confided. "On that night, Miyu, I decided to become what he couldn't--a hero."
"Were you successful?"
''No, Miyu. I gave up. When you grow up, you realise that you can't become a hero."
His sigh was audible.
He'd failed? How could he, when he had already become my hero?
''But, nii-san, you'd saved me that day. From the fire."
He pats my head.
''It makes me happy that I could save one person, at the least. To become one person's hero, if not the world's."
It were those minutes that solidified my decision of turning his dream into a palpable reality, and achieveing what he could not. As the sole survivor of the disaster that nearly destroyed me, I was indebted to the people who were taken in my stead, espicially my dead brother. That one part of faded memory of my past that I could recall. The only part.
''Then, nii-san, I shall become a super-hero for you!" I smile at him eagerly.
He returns it with a tragic one.
"I won't stop you, Miyu, but do not forget the things and the people you cherish, and you will, undoubtedly, surpass the hero even I couldn't become."
Those were his last words to me.
Here's Aurioch's Version.
Note: unlike mine, it takes place during the 5th war, not the 4th.
I'm climbing the stairs leading to the Ryuudou temple, carrying the unconscious girl over my shoulder.
My own daughter, Illya, with whom I finally managed to reunite in this Holy Grail War.
But my happiness hadn't last long. For the sake of my own wish... To redo what happened 10 years ago... no, to redo my decision from 18 years ago... I chose to sacrifice her.
My Servant, Saber, with whom I reconciled for this summoning after finally explaining my wish, follows me without saying anything.
As I start performing the Grail ritual, irony of the my life shows its fangs once more. I see the familiar red-headed boy, the one I saved from that fire, slowly coming to me.
"Ah, I see... so any family I try to make, I'm destined to destroy with my own hands... How pathetic of me", I mutter with a sigh. Through my mind flash the images of every person I cared about... every person who lost the life for sake of my childish ideal. 'How pathetic of me. Still... I can't stop now', I sight, then turn to my Servant, ordering her: "Saber, stop them any way you can." She nods and moves to engage Shirou's Servant... while I return to my work.
Just when I start the ritual, I hear the words: "Father... no, Emiya Kiritsugu, I will stop you."
Hearing the boy's words, I can't help but smile... Yeah, the words he said are making me happy. Slowly, I turn to him. "Well said, Emiya Shirou... but there's one mistake you made here. I'm not trying to save the world... this time, I'm trying to save myself. So, rejoice, because you finally got a villain to defeat."
Looking at him with challenge in my eyes, while taking my firearms, I speak last words to him: "Let's go, superhero. Will you be able to save those around you?"
We hope you guys like em :D
PS: If you couldn't guess, the ''her'' Shirou was talking about it in my version Big HF Spoiler
Saber doesn't feel like a character at all.
She appears in the story primarily as a tool for Shirou to win the war.
There is no personal conflict created between her and her environment.
She doesn't seem to suffer throughout the story. She doesn't sacrifice anything either. There is little to no character development. And needless to say her personality is equivalent to my refrigerator. And her entire motive is reduced to some vague desire to redo British history.
I still don't understand why people even bother voting for her. Are blondes really that popular?
Tsundereppoi said: Saber doesn't feel like a character at all.
She appears in the story primarily as a tool for Shirou to win the war.
There is no personal conflict created between her and her environment.
She doesn't seem to suffer throughout the story. She doesn't sacrifice anything either. There is little to no character development. And needless to say her personality is equivalent to my refrigerator. And her entire motive is reduced to some vague desire to redo British history.
I still don't understand why people even bother voting for her. Are blondes really that popular?
That's because all her development is in the Fate route; in UBW she's shafted aside and her development happens offscreen.
Though, even in scenes where they could show her problems (shed after Shirou projected for first time), they didn't.
astroprogs said: If HF ended up being a single movie, what would it need to do so it can get a high score from all of you?
Illya makes my heart beating fast.
It's like she's made to bear my child.
I know she can't get pregnant and she isn't made for me. Stfu
I wonder how Nasu write her H-scene.
The command seals on her body shining beautifully.
Her defenseless entrance is moist with lust.
The desire to taint her rises, my meat become as hard as diamond.
It is taboo to desire such thing.
A sinful deed
And yet
Precisely because it is a taboo, the idea of violating her become even more appealing to me.
fateoffate said: Illya makes my heart beating fast.
It's like she's made to bear my child.
I know she can't get pregnant and she isn't made for me. Stfu
I wonder how Nasu write her H-scene.
The command seals on her body shining beautifully.
Her defenseless entrance is moist with lust.
The desire to taint her rises, my meat become as hard as diamond.
It is taboo to desire such thing.
A sinful deed
And yet
Precisely because it is a taboo, the idea of violating her become even more appealing to me.
Tsundereppoi said: Saber doesn't feel like a character at all.
She appears in the story primarily as a tool for Shirou to win the war.
There is no personal conflict created between her and her environment.
She doesn't seem to suffer throughout the story. She doesn't sacrifice anything either. There is little to no character development. And needless to say her personality is equivalent to my refrigerator. And her entire motive is reduced to some vague desire to redo British history.
I still don't understand why people even bother voting for her. Are blondes really that popular?
fateoffate said: Illya makes my heart beating fast.
It's like she's made to bear my child.
I know she can't get pregnant and she isn't made for me. Stfu
I wonder how Nasu write her H-scene.
The command seals on her body shining beautifully.
Her defenseless entrance is moist with lust.
The desire to taint her rises, my meat become as hard as diamond.
It is taboo to desire such thing.
A sinful deed
And yet
Precisely because it is a taboo, the idea of violating her become even more appealing to me.
Tsundereppoi said: Saber doesn't feel like a character at all.
She appears in the story primarily as a tool for Shirou to win the war.
There is no personal conflict created between her and her environment.
She doesn't seem to suffer throughout the story. She doesn't sacrifice anything either. There is little to no character development. And needless to say her personality is equivalent to my refrigerator. And her entire motive is reduced to some vague desire to redo British history.
I still don't understand why people even bother voting for her. Are blondes really that popular?
U W0T M8?
You better be talking about FSN;UBW Anime :l
Cos you clearly haven't read the VN...
Tsundereppoi said: Saber doesn't feel like a character at all.
She appears in the story primarily as a tool for Shirou to win the war.
There is no personal conflict created between her and her environment.
She doesn't seem to suffer throughout the story. She doesn't sacrifice anything either. There is little to no character development. And needless to say her personality is equivalent to my refrigerator. And her entire motive is reduced to some vague desire to redo British history.
I still don't understand why people even bother voting for her. Are blondes really that popular?
I hope you are talking about UBW
In F/Z she was a great character there was a lot of conflict and interesting conversations between her and Rider, and her and Kiritsugu
one of my favourite female characters actually
Now she has been reduced to a tool and a punching bag I agree
But apparently thats because this isn't her route, honestly though the Fate route doesn't sound that much better a romance between her and Shirou? way to ruin a character
And even though Rin is better (in UBW at least otherwise hell no) and has more screentime she isn't the most complex character either
Tsundereppoi said: Saber doesn't feel like a character at all.
She appears in the story primarily as a tool for Shirou to win the war.
There is no personal conflict created between her and her environment.
She doesn't seem to suffer throughout the story. She doesn't sacrifice anything either. There is little to no character development. And needless to say her personality is equivalent to my refrigerator. And her entire motive is reduced to some vague desire to redo British history.
I still don't understand why people even bother voting for her. Are blondes really that popular?
I hope you are talking about UBW
In F/Z she was a great character there was a lot of conflict and interesting conversations between her and Rider, and her and Kiritsugu
one of my favourite female characters actually
Now she has been reduced to a tool and a punching bag I agree
But apparently thats because this isn't her route, honestly though the Fate route doesn't sound that much better a romance between her and Shirou? way to ruin a character
And even though Rin is better (in UBW at least otherwise hell no) and has more screentime she isn't the most complex character either
What character? Alex summed it up in one sentence. She's just a little girl hiding behind her facade, trying to be the big man. :I
She was always a tool. That's how she sees herself as. But there's no way you'd know that, if you haven't read Fate route, and therefore haven't fully grasped her character.
Yes, she is a punching bag, but that's becasue
1) The FSN servants are stronger than their Zero counterparts. Except Archer
2) She's nerfed
3) It's not her route. And even in her route, the Berserker fight is...yh, just has a baaahhhd ending.
In FZ, it's like she just gave up after one damned speech. In FSN, it took persuasion, fighting, and a mirror, to get her back on track.
That's way deeper and better than her character in FZ :/
Tsundereppoi said: Saber doesn't feel like a character at all.
She appears in the story primarily as a tool for Shirou to win the war.
There is no personal conflict created between her and her environment.
She doesn't seem to suffer throughout the story. She doesn't sacrifice anything either. There is little to no character development. And needless to say her personality is equivalent to my refrigerator. And her entire motive is reduced to some vague desire to redo British history.
I still don't understand why people even bother voting for her. Are blondes really that popular?
I hope you are talking about UBW
In F/Z she was a great character there was a lot of conflict and interesting conversations between her and Rider, and her and Kiritsugu
one of my favourite female characters actually
Now she has been reduced to a tool and a punching bag I agree
But apparently thats because this isn't her route, honestly though the Fate route doesn't sound that much better a romance between her and Shirou? way to ruin a character
And even though Rin is better (in UBW at least otherwise hell no) and has more screentime she isn't the most complex character either
What character? Alex summed it up in one sentence. She's just a little girl hiding behind her facade, trying to be the big man. :I
In FZ, it's like she just gave up after one damned speech. In FSN, it took persuasion, fighting, and a mirror, to get her back on track.
That's way deeper and better than her character in FZ :/
I haven't read the Fate route so I can't comment on that I'm just talking about UBW (where she is just bland and terrible) and her romance with Shirou (which sounds silly, King Arthur with a highschool boy? C'mon)
FanEu said: Now she has been reduced to a tool and a punching bag I agree
Umm... Saber was always a punching bag. There is only a single instance in which she won a battle without someone's assistance or things going too conveniently for her while she was losing... and it's not in F/Z.
FanEu said: But apparently thats because this isn't her route, honestly though the Fate route doesn't sound that much better a romance between her and Shirou? way to ruin a character
I love how people dismiss Fate route just because of that one sentence. Due to spoiler reasons I can't talk much about it, but Shirou's romance with Saber makes sense considering that they're very similar to each other. But again, you'd have to read Fate route to grasp completely her character; Alexander's summary in Zero isn't good enough to show how messed up she is.
I agree that Saber looks bland in UBW TV, but that's the drawback of adapting 2nd route without proper 1st route adaptation.
astroprogs said: If HF ended up being a single movie, what would it need to do so it can get a high score from all of you?
Tsundereppoi said: Saber doesn't feel like a character at all.
She appears in the story primarily as a tool for Shirou to win the war.
There is no personal conflict created between her and her environment.
She doesn't seem to suffer throughout the story. She doesn't sacrifice anything either. There is little to no character development. And needless to say her personality is equivalent to my refrigerator. And her entire motive is reduced to some vague desire to redo British history.
I still don't understand why people even bother voting for her. Are blondes really that popular?
I hope you are talking about UBW
In F/Z she was a great character there was a lot of conflict and interesting conversations between her and Rider, and her and Kiritsugu
one of my favourite female characters actually
Now she has been reduced to a tool and a punching bag I agree
But apparently thats because this isn't her route, honestly though the Fate route doesn't sound that much better a romance between her and Shirou? way to ruin a character
And even though Rin is better (in UBW at least otherwise hell no) and has more screentime she isn't the most complex character either
What character? Alex summed it up in one sentence. She's just a little girl hiding behind her facade, trying to be the big man. :I
In FZ, it's like she just gave up after one damned speech. In FSN, it took persuasion, fighting, and a mirror, to get her back on track.
That's way deeper and better than her character in FZ :/
I haven't read the Fate route so I can't comment on that I'm just talking about UBW (where she is just bland and terrible) and her romance with Shirou (which sounds silly, King Arthur with a highschool boy? C'mon)
Alexander the Great with a nerd.
Come on :I
Herakles with a loli
Come on :I
Gilgamesh caring deeply for Hakunon
Come on :I
I could literally keep naming them. I know all the servants and their masters.
Nasu's already stated that
1) UFO UBW is an Alternate universe from VN UBW
2) Saber's just there to look pretty.
Don't worry, I'm even more heart broken that you are.
You should just try reading Fate route Realta Nua version.
And HF, cos she gets some, unexpected, stuff there, too.
I hope you are talking about UBW
In F/Z she was a great character there was a lot of conflict and interesting conversations between her and Rider, and her and Kiritsugu
one of my favourite female characters actually
The whole point of Saber in Fate/Zero is (paraphrased thoughts of the author): Saber gets bullied.
By Kiritsugu, who basically ignores her and by Gil and Rider who think she is ridiculous/amusing. Then she becomes the punching bag for Lancer, Caster and Berserker. Really, what a great character in Fate/Zero. Not to mention that there is no real development, because she has to stay the way she is in FSN.
And romance with Shirou in UBW? Am I missing something here? Camaraderie means romance?
But since there is romance in Fate... Saber is in the body of a 14/15 year-old girl. Hooking up with a 16/17 year-old boy doesn't sound that unreasonable.
mira-nyan said:
nocorras said: Even the way she figures it out in UBW is good, sucks that it can't be in though.
Good, but not as good as Fate.
Yes, I know I shouldn't have pushed on. But FITE!
I think that's kind of obvious, since she doesn't get much screentime in UBW. In my opinion it still works with Fate knowledge in mind, but I would find it rather disappointing otherwise.
CapsuleCore said: The whole point of Saber in Fate/Zero is (paraphrased thoughts of the author): Saber gets bullied.
By Kiritsugu, who basically ignores her and by Gil and Rider who think she is ridiculous/amusing. Then she becomes the punching bag for Lancer, Caster and Berserker. Really, what a great character in Fate/Zero. Not to mention that there is no real development, because she has to stay the way she is in FSN.
And romance with Shirou in UBW? Am I missing something here? Camaraderie means romance?
But since there is romance in Fate... Saber is in the body of a 14/15 year-old girl. Hooking up with a 16/17 year-old boy doesn't sound that unreasonable.
Yh, but GoA said
10yrs from pulling out sword to killing Vortigen
10 more yrs from building Camelot and battle of Camlann.
She was 15 at the time, so she'd be older than Taiga in Fate route.
Such wrong.
But Archer is Shirou, so Mira's ship still sails
Unless the 10yrs thing was wrong and PapaCore would like to enlighten me?
CapsuleCore said:
mira-nyan said:
nocorras said: Even the way she figures it out in UBW is good, sucks that it can't be in though.
Good, but not as good as Fate.
Yes, I know I shouldn't have pushed on. But FITE!
I think that's kind of obvious, since she doesn't get much screentime in UBW. In my opinion it still works with Fate knowledge in mind, but I would find it rather disappointing otherwise.
Yeah, pretty much. I don't really think an Anime-only viewer would get the resolution.
I hope you are talking about UBW
In F/Z she was a great character there was a lot of conflict and interesting conversations between her and Rider, and her and Kiritsugu
one of my favourite female characters actually
She was bland as hell in F/Z, though.
When is Seiba not bland? Even in Fate she's pretty bland. I still find it baffling that she's by far the most popular character from Fate/.
I hope you are talking about UBW
In F/Z she was a great character there was a lot of conflict and interesting conversations between her and Rider, and her and Kiritsugu
one of my favourite female characters actually
She was bland as hell in F/Z, though.
When is Seiba not bland? Even in Fate she's pretty bland. I still find it baffling that she's by far the most popular character from Fate/.
Japanese people love blond haired characters in most cases
I hope you are talking about UBW
In F/Z she was a great character there was a lot of conflict and interesting conversations between her and Rider, and her and Kiritsugu
one of my favourite female characters actually
She was bland as hell in F/Z, though.
When is Seiba not bland? Even in Fate she's pretty bland. I still find it baffling that she's by far the most popular character from Fate/.
I disagree she wasn't bland at all in F/Z her character was interesting
I hope you are talking about UBW
In F/Z she was a great character there was a lot of conflict and interesting conversations between her and Rider, and her and Kiritsugu
one of my favourite female characters actually
She was bland as hell in F/Z, though.
When is Seiba not bland? Even in Fate she's pretty bland. I still find it baffling that she's by far the most popular character from Fate/.
Japanese people love blond haired characters in most cases
But on the poll
R.Shiki > Arc :l
Your theory is not sound m8.
Plus, Blonde Extra Rin
Feaor said:
Insertanamehere said:
FanEu said:
I hope you are talking about UBW
In F/Z she was a great character there was a lot of conflict and interesting conversations between her and Rider, and her and Kiritsugu
one of my favourite female characters actually
She was bland as hell in F/Z, though.
When is Seiba not bland? Even in Fate she's pretty bland. I still find it baffling that she's by far the most popular character from Fate/.
Fite me, bitch. :I
FanEu said:
Feaor said:
Insertanamehere said:
FanEu said:
I hope you are talking about UBW
In F/Z she was a great character there was a lot of conflict and interesting conversations between her and Rider, and her and Kiritsugu
one of my favourite female characters actually
She was bland as hell in F/Z, though.
When is Seiba not bland? Even in Fate she's pretty bland. I still find it baffling that she's by far the most popular character from Fate/.
I disagree she wasn't bland at all in F/Z her character was interesting
Interesting as in her despair, yes.
We were all Gil when we watched that, and we know it. :l