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Because the criticisms aren't valid. And the only response people have when they get shown that their complaints aren't valid they just go "I don't like it this is a fucking cash grab " Seriously. Fuck off. HELL RIKA HAS ALREADY HAD THIS KIND OF GIVING UP MOMENT IN THE VN AND NO ONE COMPLAINS ABOUT THAT. This type of behavior is not new to Rika, and while yes it represents a regression for Rika, it's at least fucking a justified regression.  |
jaw201Jan 22, 2021 2:09 PM
| "you just don't understand" isnt a valid response to criticisms. |
jaw201 said: Fuck off. HELL RIKA HAS ALREADY HAD THIS KIND OF GIVING UP MOMENT IN THE VN AND NO ONE COMPLAINS ABOUT THAT. How does that have anything to do with Rika accepting that she shouldn't leave the village and that it was her fault? Why are you so random? |
jaw201 said: ssjokg said: How does that have anything to do with Rika accepting that she shouldn't leave the village and that it was her fault? This poem, specifically refers to a moment where Rika stopped trying to escape. This is essentially the same as what has just happened. The reason is irrelevant. Rika resolving to stay in hinamizawa is rika giving up. That's the connection. It isn't "random". Just because a plane has wheels it doesn't mean it is a car. Or maybe you would understand it better if I said "Hempel's Raven" ? This is what you are doing now. You compare two different actions, with different motives behind them and call them the same because they have a superficial common element. |
jaw201 said: ssjokg said: Just because a plane has wheels it doesn't mean it is a car. Or maybe you would understand it better if I said "Hempel's Raven" ? This is what you are doing now. You compare two different actions, with different motives behind them and call them the same because they have a superficial common element. Rika gave up. Rika lost her will to escape and to leavve hinamizawa. What difference is there? Just saying there is a difference isn't proof of a difference. This is amazing. As if you ignored everything people had a problem with just to focus on that one superficial common element. |
| Next ep gonna give lots of info with takano coming, god can't wait. Pretty sure Takano is not the one behind this nor is it Satoko. That everything went well this loop so far really ruffles some feathers. |
| Rika never expressed a desire to escape from Hinamizawa in the original series. She grew bored and apathetic because she kept reliving the same scenarios over and over again, hence the poem from "Tsumihoroboshi-hen" where she began to see her tragic life as a comedy. But even it stopped being funny and so she stopped caring--the only reason she cared if only for a little was not just Hanyuu, but the Game Club because Mion switched up their club activities all the time. In fact, chalk that up to another point of criticism that the lack of club activity scenes have bogged down the friendship in this series. When they're not adapting scenes that're already in the sound novel, the few original ones were so bland that you can't believe these characters came up with such a mundane idea. "I'm going to hide the marker somewhere in the school" is so vapid because Mion didn't even bother twisting the idea onto its head to make it enjoyable, she just "hid" it up in what, the attic? On the floor in the middle of the room? I got kinda excited about the idea of them playing hide-and-seek with Rika because they could get creative about her hiding place since she could've hid anywhere in Hinamizawa, but nope, let's make some callbacks to previous episodes instead. And it took them all forever to figure out "Oh, what if she chose the hardest spot to hide in--the storehouse?" Yawn. The only escape Rika expressed desire for was to escape her fate, but escaping her fate does not mean fleeing Hinamizawa. Hell, she mentioned off-handedly she once tried to escape into the woods away from Hinamizawa and managed to make it to July, but she was still caught and executed, which was the moment she realized she couldn't change her fate. She was still sick and tired of it, but her apathy won over. I legit am failing to see Gou's perspective here in changing Rika's desire from growing up and living a life with her friends to "escaping" Hinamizawa by going to St. Lucia's Academy (which doesn't really make sense unless she was totally okay with the school converting her, a shrine priestess, to a new belief system when she likely wasn't going to believe in Christian values anyway). I fail to see why it is Rika had to get thrown back into the loop after finally getting the miracle she always wanted, and expressing a desire to leave Hinamizawa when Hanyuu herself would be totally okay with it with the added bonus of Oyashiro's curse being broken thanks to that miracle doesn't make for a compelling reason why she has to go through with it again. No Higurashi fan has ever wanted to see Rika get tortured over and over again. The battle is won. Why even bother to bring it back? |
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Jean-Antoine said: Hero_Luka said: Next ep gonna give lots of info with takano coming, god can't wait. Pretty sure Takano is not the one behind this nor is it Satoko. That everything went well this loop so far really ruffles some feathers. Well, no shit, what do we have here, a fucking comedian. And you should probably get out of that elitist phase, not pleasant at all. |
| I have never seen something more brutal than this episode tbh...that was really too much and cruel... |
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ssjokg said: Oh my man, but I love the Gore >:)Hulio said: And like we now see, this is how things turned out. Most of the GOU defenders have had no idea what they've been talking about and been most eager to jump into false conclusions. You don't have to twist the knife. jaw201 said: No.Literally people were complaining about the lack of gore the most in the early discussion threads. On early threads most GOU defenders were arguing how Deen's version was bad cause it made Higurashi into something it wasn't - which included the over emphasized gore. jaw201 said: Because the criticisms aren't valid. And the only response people have when they get shown that their complaints aren't valid they just go "I don't like it this is a fucking cash grab " Seriously. Fuck off. HELL RIKA HAS ALREADY HAD THIS KIND OF GIVING UP MOMENT IN THE VN AND NO ONE COMPLAINS ABOUT THAT. This type of behavior is not new to Rika, and while yes it represents a regression for Rika, it's at least fucking a justified regression. I think the shortest and most direct answer to you, which you will hopefully understand is: "The most intricate thing to find in this world. Is it a needle that you lost in the desert? The most intricate thing to find in this world. Is it a crow's feather that you lost in the darkness of the night? The most intricate thing to find in this world is, Realizing your own erroneous contemplation." |
| Intelligent gets through situations which wise avoids. |
Hulio said: jaw201 said: Because the criticisms aren't valid. And the only response people have when they get shown that their complaints aren't valid they just go "I don't like it this is a fucking cash grab " Seriously. Fuck off. HELL RIKA HAS ALREADY HAD THIS KIND OF GIVING UP MOMENT IN THE VN AND NO ONE COMPLAINS ABOUT THAT. This type of behavior is not new to Rika, and while yes it represents a regression for Rika, it's at least fucking a justified regression. I think the shortest and most direct answer to you, which you will hopefully understand is: "The most intricate thing to find in this world. Is it a needle that you lost in the desert? The most intricate thing to find in this world. Is it a crow's feather that you lost in the darkness of the night? The most intricate thing to find in this world is, Realizing your own erroneous contemplation." I don't understand the point. It doesn't make the points that the other person has made any less incorrect |
jaw201Jan 22, 2021 4:25 PM
jaw201 said: Jin_uzuki said: Except it's not something compelled different. The characters are the same, the setting is the same, heck even the same bakeshit unfit character design is doing the art for the show AND the Gacha. Last week Akasaka went insane and guess who made an appearance in the gacha? Who gives a shit if the plot isn't the same? You think they launched a gacha and an anime (and a manga and probably a bunch of extra shit) at the very same time just "By coincidence"? They want to rekindle old fans love for Higurashi and get people into it so they play the gacha and spend 200$ trying to get Pope Rika. This makes totally sense, make a Higurashi anime just to market another anime that didn't even sell much and was considered a flop in Japan, for a novel that is notoriously controversial there and incredibly difficult to adapt, and do that by having zero characters from said anime (Novel) up to episode 16. You are a genius! >implying that a bernkastel origin story wouldn't be a perfect lead up to an umineko anime ???? >Umineko controversal in japan It hasn't been controversal since the manga was finished. Most people who didn't like the ending changed their mind when they finished the manga of umineko. >inb4 source go look on futaba or something. I'd like to answer to this post, but unfortunately is pretty hard to argue against speculations out of your ass that find no evidence in reality ¯\_(ツ)_/¯ Also stop trying to greentext, we are no to 4chen. |
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| damn i havent seen gore animes for a while and this gave me a boner. |
vangoz said: Previous episode made me scared for a while, but this one will make me traumatized for life. It's a freaking guro porn which I really hate and avoid. I've had a feeling Passione/the director amped up the violence to appeal to the guro crowd, and this episode pretty much convinced me of that. I've noticed the last couple of years interest in guro has gone up, after all, which if so, studios should just go back to producing OVAs of the guro manga that are out there. The bubble bursting in the '90s killed the OVA market before guro manga really kicked off, though, but no reason for them to try and start it back up again if they want to animate gore. Higurashi is no Corpse Party. Stop trying to be like Corpse Party, Higurashi. |
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jaw201 said: No. It's more convenient to do it this way than individual quotes. More like it's convenient to make strawmen and ignore arguments. You can answer 1 of the 2 things with facts. I can get screen caps of futaba posts, of anons on 2chan/futaba reacting favorably to umineko after the episode 8 manga was released. That part isn't speculation at all. The other one is literally asking for your opinion. And Featherine is already in Gou. Dude the post was about how the gacha and the anime are part of a multi-media project to make money and your answer consisted in ignoring every point and going "WELL ACTUALLY THIS IS A SUPER-SECRET UMINEKO PREQUEL FOR A CHARACTER THAT ALREADY HAD AN ORIGIN STORY, TRUST ME ON THIS BRO, IT HAS NOTHING TO DO WITH THE GACHA", nevermind that it wouldn't change the fact the anime exists to shill the gacha all the same even if they announced an Umineko anime after this (Doubtful, are you even basing this on what? Your feelings?) Did you somehow miss the whole truckload of merchandise they are releasing? Are you familiar with how the industry works? I can get screen caps of futaba posts, of anons on 2chan/futaba reacting favorably to umineko after the episode 8 manga was released. Clearly selective futaba posts represent the opinion of every single person who read Umineko yes. This isn't even that relevant to the discussion. And Featherine is already in Gou (Assuming that's her) Using a character that only appears in the 6th novel to hype an Umineko anime is really a 4d chess move. Especially given at this point the story has less Frederika Benrkastel then the original Higurashi.. where she was an actual character who even talked to the player... |
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That's a bit of a nothing burger, especially given Umineko isn't a word that was invented by R07. Also how the fuck can you make the claim that Umineko was controversial, and not provide proof, Probably because anyone who read Umineko and was around Ep. 6/7/8 knows the controversial reactions lol The goat stuff, the EGS score for Chiru (Ep. 8?) and infamous R07 hate Wikia. And of course the anime itself was never as popular as Higurashi (Motive because Higurashi got a fuckton of anime stuff and Umineko only got a season) but when I assert the opposite it's baseless, and tell me not to provide proof. Nice fucking double standard. No, you assert that Futaba's opinion is somehow the opinion of every single Japanese fan. No shit Ep. 8 manga was better received. But at this point you are fixating on a small detail to move the discussion away on Gou being shit so to be honest I don't really care about discussing this further. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯ |
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jaw201 said: Rika had the literal watanagashi performed on her in the VN. So this isn't amping up anything for gore or guro. Hell, this isn't even the worst thing to happen to a character in WTC. Umineko and ESPECIALLY Ciconia have way worse gore scenes that are written out in explicit detail. But it never went into detail as to how Takano pulled out her guts and such until the manga, so it was mainly always just the aftermath. When the manga was more graphic, it still didn't drag it out longer than what was necessary. Umineko is on a whole different level compared to Higurashi, and the gore I think was mainly due to the witches' cruelty. Higurashi's gore really cannot compare to Umineko's gore, and neither series' gore can compare to how Corpse Party presented its gore, which was borderline guro at times (and had a character who was all hot-and-bothered by it). Therefore, when compared to the original series even with the manga adaptations, Higurashi Gou is much gorier and has too much focus on the violence that is reminiscent of how Corpse Party lingered on its visceral details. Also, Corpse Party had immersive sound and voice-work, and far as I know (haven't started the sound novel yet, finishing up Higurashi first), Umineko is like Higurashi in that it has stock sound-effects but doesn't have unique sounds for various dismemberments. So for example, if someone were to get their tongue cut out in Umineko, I doubt there were sound-effects of the scissors or whatever-else clacking against the molars even though it would still show the method. Higurashi's violence is meant to be brief, but brutal. "Meakashi-hen" is the only arc that somewhat lingered on its violence (particularly Satoko's), but Rika's death was much quicker in comparison, and even so, it was in first-person in the sound novel. Why wouldn't Shion take in all that gruesome detail? She thought it beautiful, too. So why linger on Rika's evisceration? Or hell, why did she suddenly have her guts exposed anyway? What is the point of it outside of appealing to those who wanted to see violence? If they were always going to focus on it, they should've shown it from the start of the first incision instead of just jumping into it for no rhyme or reason except for cheap shockvalue of pulling the futon back to reveal it. |
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jaw201 said: Ryukishi07, I think is just writing the gore scenes to be more disturbing, I don't think it was a directorial decision, I genuinely believe it was in the script that Rika is eviscerated the way she was this episode. Just going from how bad Ciconia's gore is and when we take his word that he finished writing Gou in 2016 , it kind of makes sense. Well good for him he can write out gore better than before, but I just have to ask "Why?" for Higurashi. Why must he insist on the gore to be disturbing here when it was so rarely disturbing originally? Higurashi was disturbing not just due to the brutality of the death scenes, but because of the psychological aspect of it. The paranoid mind game (and torment) the characters went through were the scariest parts of it (helped immensely by it being in first-person) and the violence was just the end result of it. That still rings true even for Rena's case when she recalled the maggot disease and how it felt. So why ditch the psychological horror for visceral horror? |
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Lil-Bird said: jaw201 said: Ryukishi07, I think is just writing the gore scenes to be more disturbing, I don't think it was a directorial decision, I genuinely believe it was in the script that Rika is eviscerated the way she was this episode. Just going from how bad Ciconia's gore is and when we take his word that he finished writing Gou in 2016 , it kind of makes sense. Well good for him he can write out gore better than before, but I just have to ask "Why?" for Higurashi. Why must he insist on the gore to be disturbing here when it was so rarely disturbing originally? Higurashi was disturbing not just due to the brutality of the death scenes, but because of the psychological aspect of it. The paranoid mind game (and torment) the characters went through were the scariest parts of it (helped immensely by it being in first-person) and the violence was just the end result of it. That still rings true even for Rena's case when she recalled the maggot disease and how it felt. So why ditch the psychological horror for visceral horror? Like, what is the point of Satoko slowly pulling Rika's intestines while she is hugging her? Seems like they dont understand that Satoko performing watanagashi on Rika isnt what's bad. Well actually it is since Satoko has no reason to besuch a fanatic believer but lets assume that it was Rena. Rena doing the ritual would be fine. But the focus on slowly removing them...what is that for? Shion torturing Satoko in the anime wasnt even gory. It had weird faces of pain but if we want to talk about gore, Rika stabbing herself or Rena killing Teppei and Rina were far more gorier. So yeah, it isnt what happened to Rika that is the problem but how it was presented. But I guess someone will explain why that was acceptable. |
| had to move this off my thursday timeslot shit is too rough to watch now like god damn 15mins of seeing all that shit uncensored had to skip around , this'd be a awful end with how it's Satoko is gaslighting Rika into some Stockholm Syndrome but lets see where the hell this goes with 8ish episodes left |
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ssjokg said: So yeah, it isnt what happened to Rika that is the problem but how it was presented. But I guess someone will explain why that was acceptable. Thinking about it, I also believe the method was butchered. You could write it off as Satoko not knowing how to perform it, but Rika I think has done the dance for about a couple years in-story (not counting the multiple time loops, but as she's growing), and Satoko would've seen it at least once by 1983. Like I'm honestly not against the idea of bringing in the true method of Watanagashi and having it performed on someone (Takano somewhat did it to Rika, but it still wasn't how it was supposed to go), but Satoko literally was only hacking away at her guts and there was no "beauty" to it, like how the ritual is supposed to be. When you take Rika's dance at face-value, with the ceremonial hoe, she's making the first incision into the belly, then she's slowly scooping out the insides, maybe grounding them up a bit in the process. That's how it's supposed to go. It's supposed to be a delicate process to appease Oyashiro while also purifying the guts for consumption. I also was half-expecting Satoko to feast on her intestines, too, but she never did that. Not sure if that would've been too much or if it would've just been too on the nose, but they should've just gone all the way, and at least it would've made somewhat sense for her to start eating Rika knowing the lore. |
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Lil-Bird said: ssjokg said: So yeah, it isnt what happened to Rika that is the problem but how it was presented. But I guess someone will explain why that was acceptable. Thinking about it, I also believe the method was butchered. You could write it off as Satoko not knowing how to perform it, but Rika I think has done the dance for about a couple years in-story (not counting the multiple time loops, but as she's growing), and Satoko would've seen it at least once by 1983. Like I'm honestly not against the idea of bringing in the true method of Watanagashi and having it performed on someone (Takano somewhat did it to Rika, but it still wasn't how it was supposed to go), but Satoko literally was only hacking away at her guts and there was no "beauty" to it, like how the ritual is supposed to be. When you take Rika's dance at face-value, with the ceremonial hoe, she's making the first incision into the belly, then she's slowly scooping out the insides, maybe grounding them up a bit in the process. That's how it's supposed to go. It's supposed to be a delicate process to appease Oyashiro while also purifying the guts for consumption. I also was half-expecting Satoko to feast on her intestines, too, but she never did that. Not sure if that would've been too much or if it would've just been too on the nose, but they should've just gone all the way, and at least it would've made somewhat sense for her to start eating Rika knowing the lore. Now you touched the core, the guts, of the problem that ruins Gou. The lore and the characters are discarded in favour of shock value. And I am not talking about the Rules being different. That is a great idea.
Honestly if Pitch Meeting was doing anime, Ryan would have a field trip with Gou. |
| Maybe they will explain it. Maybe not. Maybe it will be a dumb explanation. Too bad this isnt even the only issue Gou has. |
| Gotta love how the studio censored Rena stabbing Keiichi in the first arc but didn't give a shit here about having Satoko playing with Rika's guts for nearly 10 minutes. Well... probably of the weirdest contrasts I have seen in an anime episode in a while. Bloody gore in the first half but the usual "beach episode" shenanigans with girls in swimsuits for the second half. Also, I hate the fact that we got fully detailed shots of both Rika and Satoko's... bodies but none of Mion and Shion's. Well... what else to say? Just another torture porn episode but at least this time, featuring a few hints of story progression. The whole "you must love your hometown no matter what" message is pure bullshit but hopefully, it was just Satoko being delusional. |
| i wish for Rika to escape from Eternal Suffering...this is just too unforgiving! 4/5. |
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SouthRzVa said: Gotta love how the studio censored Rena stabbing Keiichi in the first arc but didn't give a shit here about having Satoko playing with Rika's guts for nearly 10 minutes. It was censored when it aired on live tv. Funimation has been getting uncensored cuts since episode 13. I know because I watched it live, and saw massive black bars covering half of the screen. Oh and I really hope you don't take that message at face value, since it's pretty obviously a bad thing. Especially with all of the 1984 memes that have come out of this episode. |
jaw201Jan 22, 2021 10:04 PM
| Rena's beliefs dont change just because Hanyuu isnt apologizing 24/7. She isn't in the loops but Rena has heard her before. That doesnt even work as an excuse for Hanyu. You realize that if Rika ever managed to solve Onidamashi etc, she would still have to deal with Takano, who she left entirely unchecked right? Why didnt she talk to Tomitake in Onidamashi?Why did she only pat him on the head and then left him go DIE? At least that is what it's supposed to happen as far as she knows. Forget Mion since we have no idea what happened. All of the victims in Gou, except Mion, are so focused on the parasites. The parasites/worms/insects are a symptom yes but how come everyone has it to that extend? When Rena had it in Tsumihoroboshi it wasnt her sole focus when she was doing anything. It is like the director, script writer or R07 think people are dumb and need the neck scratching to confirm that they are paranoid. Yes parasites cause the syndrome. That doesnt mean they can be seen or felt. It is formication. How come everyone has the same symptom? I dont know about Tomitake but K1 died in minutes. How come everyone can just claw out their necks so easily, not feel pain, talk and scream with ease? How can Rika talk after being stabbed on the neck? How can she snap her fingers(why is that even a thing?) after getting decapitated? Have a clear head, not to mention being alive, after Satoko cut her in half and unprofessionally removed her guts? |
jaw201 said: SouthRzVa said: Gotta love how the studio censored Rena stabbing Keiichi in the first arc but didn't give a shit here about having Satoko playing with Rika's guts for nearly 10 minutes. It was censored when it aired on live tv. Funimation has been getting uncensored cuts since episode 13. I know because I watched it live, and saw massive black bars covering half of the screen. Oh and I really hope you don't take that message at face value, since it's pretty obviously a bad thing. Especially with all of the 1984 memes that have come out of this episode. Oh, my bad. Didn't know about that. Also, don't worry. It's not like I'm taking this series too seriously either. It sure was an odd turn of events tho. |
SouthRzVaJan 22, 2021 10:18 PM
StormxNightmare said: Devil_Slayer said: Also, people should really stop whining about "pedo" shit like they never watched Higurashi at all. R07 literally drew art of Satoko COMPLETELY naked in the original sound novel and the VN had to actually censor that Keiichi lusting over Satoko and Rika is also a mainstream gag in the side media of Higurashi Watching 10 years old kid butchering her friend like they butcher an animal is okay for you but them wearing swimsuits is crossing the line? And that was bad as well back then. You can't really force people to like that aspect about Higurashi, just because you don't have a problem with it. The difference between the gore scenes and the fanservice is the way the scenes are framed by the way (I never understood why some people don't understand that difference). Satoko butchering Rika is obviously framed as something horrible, wrong and extremely painful to Rika. It's supposed to disturb the viewer and if you take a look at this weeks discussion, it pretty much succeeded at doing so. Rika and Satoko in bathing suits with lighting/shading that especially highlights their bodies or the weird angles during the tag scene are not framed as that. It's sexualizing them in the positive carefree moments, it's supposed to be fun, desirable (in contrast to the suffering, not necessarily in a sexual way), it’s not framed as smth disturbing (which it is... sexualizing of 11 year olds shouldn't be thing) and only there cause they apparently thought some viewers want to see that. It serves no purpose to the story/narrative. You can do the fun and SoL moments without the fanservice, but it's hard to make a disturbing murder scene without gore (not impossible tho & the scene in this episode was definitely way too graphic/brutal). If anything people jumping the gun the moment girls are shown in swimsuit and calling the studio pedos THE MOMENT they see anything remotely to be taken as sexual is more creep if you ask me since it's pretty clear they were the ones who had sexual thoughts the moment a kid showed a part of her skin. Like, I srsly don't get what is wrong with the scene. They showed them for like 5 sec and showed all the other girls as well. Have you never seen a little girl in a swimsuit? Like, Jesus, where do you live? Middle east? If you think THIS is fan=service then you haven't seen much anime. If you want to see true fan-service of Satoko and Rika go watch the 2011 anime |
| Also what a shit show this thread is. I don't know how anyone can defend the clusterfuck that was the first 15 min of this episode. There is no reason for why Satoko should be doing Wataganashi on Rika, but lets ignore that for now, dragging it for 15 fucking min has no damn point and it just Gore for the sake of it. Also, Rika was already a goner the moment she jumped into a new fragment, which is ridiculous. This has never happened before and Rika is at least given some time to figure shit out. But Nah, this loop exists solely and only to torture and mind break Rika without giving her any chance while wasting out time on pointl blood we have been having for 2 straight episodes now |
| This show is disappointing. There have been many parts where there's just no logic to how stupid the whole thing is, like keiichi walking off losing more blood than he should even have from getting kitchen knifed dozens of times. |
ssjokg said: jaw201 said: Cynicism isn't criticism. >Battler was making up bullshit as the story was unfolding and seems that the same goes for R07 in Gou. Holy shit, are you fucking kidding me! LMAO. You don't understand why Battler committed the logic error in episode 6, do you? please tell me that it was an intentional 4D chess 5000 IQ move on his part. Believe it or not, Battler trapping himself on purpose in ep6 is a pretty popular theory I don't buy it tho since it's never hinted through Battler's thoughts or actions and him wearing the rings was basically giving off any chance of coming back even if he could but you know how it is with WTC fans. They will make up motivations and their own beliefs because R07 |
Devil_SlayerJan 22, 2021 10:48 PM
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