| Probably because it's damn hard to get into unless you've played the game. The anime was made for FGO players after all. Though I am surprised this has the same amount of members on here as Case Files, which is arguable more obscure. I guess having a character from F/Z as the main man helps. From what I've seen Babylonia is popular over in JP though. Not really surprising considering Japans FGO playerbase is massive. |
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deg said: ssjokg said: Apo was popular because it looked like Zero to people not familiar with it and it had interesting Servants. Then the execution failed. wow i really got shit taste then since i have scored high and totally enjoyed Fate Apocrypha lol You and me both, I scored Apo pretty high as well. The only Fate franchise that I rated low was the one Shaft did, the Ilya one I dont watch but I did watch the movie where Shirou had some kind of focus playing the big bro and fighting a gender bended Gil, that one was hype af. FGO's pretty good, but there are times that Im lost cause apparently they skipped tons of stuffs just to adapt this but its still fun to watch nonetheless. Characters are good, Mash, Ishtar and the blonde Ishtar are waifu af, Ana's almost close to a perfect loli and we have a matured version of Gilgamesh and Merlin. People really missin out on this show. Granted its not F/Z level of awesomeness or any of the F/SN adaptations (- the Deen one) |
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| Wow... MAL, the ultimate standard to decide if something is popular or not lmao |
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| Fate Apocrypha wasn't ufotable. Fate Extra wasn't ufotable and if you didn't play the game you didn't understand shit. Fate/Grand Order Babylonia isn't ufotable and is based of a game like Fate extra. I get why people don't want to watch it because of the previous two which is a shame. The movie and special don't leave you completely lost like Fate Extra and it isn't by ufotable but all the scenes that have gotten animated so far, even the ones that we weren't expecting have been damn impressive. |
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| because loud sound effects arent doing it for me. i enjoyed Apocrypha alot more. |
Kerozinn said: because loud sound effects arent doing it for me. i enjoyed Apocrypha alot more. Sound effects in Apocrypha are way worse, with artificially induced clipping that makes explosions even more loud/distorted. In fact, both shows have the same sound director - he's using similar methods in FGO. |
| because I feel like watching cutscens from game, not actual anime. Episode ends with something, and you play next episode and you feel like you miss something. For example - end of episode, when Gorgon perepare to fight our heros. Next episode, they are beat up, and she say they are tough. Next example. Our heroes buy Isthar with gems. Next episode they charge to quetzalcoatl temple with Jaguar man. As someone who only watch anime, my reaction is "WTF just happend? How did they recruit Jaguar?". |
Shaddy said: because I feel like watching cutscens from game, not actual anime. Episode ends with something, and you play next episode and you feel like you miss something. For example - end of episode, when Gorgon perepare to fight our heros. Next episode, they are beat up, and she say they are tough. Next example. Our heroes buy Isthar with gems. Next episode they charge to quetzalcoatl temple with Jaguar man. As someone who only watch anime, my reaction is "WTF just happend? How did they recruit Jaguar?". That's funny...as if the series didnt explain why any of those happened. |
| To be honest, the FGO game's storytelling is shit. Aside from the Camelot chapter, everything else is underwhelming. I believed that many players beside me have no expectations as well when the anime was just announced, and many players have decided to just boycott the show completely before airing. However, to my surprise, this adaptation is doing better than I imagined. I'm glad that they changed a lot in the execution because this could have become the shittiest of the FATE ANIME if not. Whoever is the scriptwriter of the anime deserves some praise. |
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Aelyn said: Kerozinn said: because loud sound effects arent doing it for me. i enjoyed Apocrypha alot more. Sound effects in Apocrypha are way worse, with artificially induced clipping that makes explosions even more loud/distorted. In fact, both shows have the same sound director - he's using similar methods in FGO. i got 2 300€+ headphones and i used both to watch FGO and i just hate how distorted and cheap the sound effects sound. Cant compare to Apocrypha cause i watched it on netflix on tv + sony soundbase and it didnt sound bad at all. https://myanimelist.net/anime/38671/Enen_no_Shouboutai has those soundeffects aswell but they sound sooo much better and precise. |
Kerozinn said: i got 2 300€+ headphones and i used both to watch FGO and i just hate how distorted and cheap the sound effects sound. Cant compare to Apocrypha cause i watched it on netflix on tv + sony soundbase and it didnt sound bad at all. https://myanimelist.net/anime/38671/Enen_no_Shouboutai has those soundeffects aswell but they sound sooo much better and precise. Well, I'm using Sennheiser HD 800 and I can absolutely assure you that the things have definitely improved since Apocrypha. I still have no idea why would a sound director use such crude methods in specific shows (some of his other works sound pretty much normal). In case if FGO makes your ears hurt, you should check out the Japanese TV-rip instead of watching it on Funination/Crunchy/etc. Weirdly enough, there are 2 different sound mixes, and Japanese one has the effects considerably toned down. The only downside is that nobody puts English subs in Japanese RAWs nowadays, and they also have those "sponsored by blah-blah-blah" inserts that screw up the timings. You'll either have to edit the audio track and then put it together with the subbed web-rip, or spend some time figuring out how to edit/offset English subs (this might be a lot more difficult thing to do). |
| I think most people are unaware of this anime existing thus is much less popular than other seasons of Fate series. This anime is still rather new. Besides that having the Fate Go movies as a prequel probably further drop the amount of people that watch this season. |
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deg said: YooNooMAL said: people need to understand that there are people watching anime and dont use MAL when MAL numbers are low that doesnot mean the show is unpopular also evan the popular shows like Darling in the Franxx and Violet Evergarden had around 100K or less when it was airing err no Darling in the FranXX already have 100K or more when its half way through the show if i remember right meanwhile we are in episode 15 already out of 21 episodes and this Fate show did not reach 100K yet on youtube the official OP did not even reach 1 million views at the moment too, im talking about this one https://youtu.be/jkF171eBUTc The official opening is/was this one https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iQS2-3HPuXY It was published on Japanese Aniplex channel, if I remember correctly, sometime around the day the first episode of anime was released. Later it was set to private and the whole channel was... region-locked? deleted? I don't know. If I recall correctly, this version of opening had more than one million views (and was on YouTube for less than a month), but I do not have any visual proof though. Maybe someone knows more about it. |
| To Be Hero X spoiler-free timeline, recommended to use as you're watching the show. |
| because it isn't for casuals. that's it |
Xiandragons said: because it isn't for casuals. that's it well or because of bad writing. |
YooNooMAL said: people need to understand that there are people watching anime and dont use MAL when MAL numbers are low that doesnot mean the show is unpopular also evan the popular shows like Darling in the Franxx and Violet Evergarden had around 100K or less when it was airing i think mal is a good way to get a sample size regardless. its unlikely that something is hugely super popular but gets super neglected on MAL kind of like twitch is a good sample size to see how popular a game is |
CuteAssTiger said: YooNooMAL said: people need to understand that there are people watching anime and dont use MAL when MAL numbers are low that doesnot mean the show is unpopular also evan the popular shows like Darling in the Franxx and Violet Evergarden had around 100K or less when it was airing i think mal is a good way to get a sample size regardless. its unlikely that something is hugely super popular but gets super neglected on MAL kind of like twitch is a good sample size to see how popular a game is If MAL is enough then how the hell is FGO the most grossing game? |
ssjokg said: CuteAssTiger said: i think mal is a good way to get a sample size regardless. its unlikely that something is hugely super popular but gets super neglected on MAL kind of like twitch is a good sample size to see how popular a game is If MAL is enough then how the hell is FGO the most grossing game? Because anime watchers and mobile-game players are 2 different target audiences MAL shows sample sizes of people that watch anime. Besides that mobile games make a lot of money because they focus on whales. Most of the money comes from a small percentage of the userbase. So making a lot of money doesn't mean a lot of people are going to watch the anime. Especially since gameplay and story are actually kinda bad. Besides that Babylonia is the adaptation of an arc that happens a bit later into the game. Wich is going to turn people off that didn't play the game up to that point. That contributes to the relative low success of babylonia compared to the other fate animes. |
CuteAssTiger said: ssjokg said: If MAL is enough then how the hell is FGO the most grossing game? Because anime watchers and mobile-game players are 2 different target audiences MAL shows sample sizes of people that watch anime. Besides that mobile games make a lot of money because they focus on whales. Most of the money comes from a small percentage of the userbase. So making a lot of money doesn't mean a lot of people are going to watch the anime. Especially since gameplay and story are actually kinda bad. Besides that Babylonia is the adaptation of an arc that happens a bit later into the game. Wich is going to turn people off that didn't play the game up to that point. That contributes to the relative low success of babylonia compared to the other fate animes. Yeah no... I didnt see Last Encore or Apocrypha trending EVER on Twitter. I never saw something like that for even the ufotable Fates. Mal is a site used mostly by westerners that think ufotable adaptations are the only thing that matters.It in no way is an accurate representation of how many watch it or like it. |
ssjokg said: CuteAssTiger said: Because anime watchers and mobile-game players are 2 different target audiences MAL shows sample sizes of people that watch anime. Besides that mobile games make a lot of money because they focus on whales. Most of the money comes from a small percentage of the userbase. So making a lot of money doesn't mean a lot of people are going to watch the anime. Especially since gameplay and story are actually kinda bad. Besides that Babylonia is the adaptation of an arc that happens a bit later into the game. Wich is going to turn people off that didn't play the game up to that point. That contributes to the relative low success of babylonia compared to the other fate animes. Yeah no... I didnt see Last Encore or Apocrypha trending EVER on Twitter. I never saw something like that for even the ufotable Fates. Mal is a site used mostly by westerners that think ufotable adaptations are the only thing that matters.It in no way is an accurate representation of how many watch it or like it. Yeah I'm sure MAl is specifically a website for people that think only UfoTable anime count . Do I even have to explain how this doesn't make sense ? Twitter is a website for everything. So if the game gets popularity there it doesn't mean that people will watch the anime. Getting something to trend there is not an accurate measurement on how popular something is going to stay. I think everyone knows how quick a trending hashtag dies out on twitter. Taking that as a measurement when looking at the anime reception specifically over a website that specifically tracks anime( primarily) sounds more like confirmation bias tbh Besides the reception of the Babylonia anime wasn't just negative on MAL. Many people on disqus and similar discussion sites don't like it either. |
CuteAssTiger said: ssjokg said: Yeah no... I didnt see Last Encore or Apocrypha trending EVER on Twitter. I never saw something like that for even the ufotable Fates. Mal is a site used mostly by westerners that think ufotable adaptations are the only thing that matters.It in no way is an accurate representation of how many watch it or like it. Yeah I'm sure MAl is specifically a website for people that think only UfoTable anime count . Do I even have to explain how this doesn't make sense ? Twitter is a website for everything. So if the game gets popularity there it doesn't mean that people will watch the anime. Getting something to trend there is not an accurate measurement on how popular something is going to stay. I think everyone knows how quick a trending hashtag dies out on twitter. Taking that as a measurement when looking at the anime reception specifically over a website that specifically tracks anime( primarily) sounds more like confirmation bias tbh Besides the reception of the Babylonia anime wasn't just negative on MAL. Many people on disqus and similar discussion sites don't like it either. Except yes if a Fate isnt by Ufotable people arent very interested since the two series that came from other studios after UBW were not that great.I dont know under what rock you were living but many think that if it isnt animated by ufo it isnt worth it. If the episode or character in a certain episode is trending then the anime is the reason, not the game. And it is far more important than a website that has it ups and downs.I just recently returned after the last hack/issues they had. You also assume that MAL matters with the japanese or other asian viewers. Many people dont like ufoUBW either.That doesnt mean anything. |
ssjokg said: CuteAssTiger said: Yeah I'm sure MAl is specifically a website for people that think only UfoTable anime count . Do I even have to explain how this doesn't make sense ? Twitter is a website for everything. So if the game gets popularity there it doesn't mean that people will watch the anime. Getting something to trend there is not an accurate measurement on how popular something is going to stay. I think everyone knows how quick a trending hashtag dies out on twitter. Taking that as a measurement when looking at the anime reception specifically over a website that specifically tracks anime( primarily) sounds more like confirmation bias tbh Besides the reception of the Babylonia anime wasn't just negative on MAL. Many people on disqus and similar discussion sites don't like it either. Except yes if a Fate isnt by Ufotable people arent very interested since the two series that came from other studios after UBW were not that great.I dont know under what rock you were living but many think that if it isnt animated by ufo it isnt worth it. If the episode or character in a certain episode is trending then the anime is the reason, not the game. And it is far more important than a website that has it ups and downs.I just recently returned after the last hack/issues they had. You also assume that MAL matters with the japanese or other asian viewers. Many people dont like ufoUBW either.That doesnt mean anything. Except you just make assumptions that fit your story rather then looking at what the logically correct conclusion is . First off UfoTable is an amazing studio. But the vast vast majority of people don't know what studio does what. Also you said that MAL is being used by people that only think UfoTable anime count. That is something else then saying that is the general perception . As to why the general perception is that way you have to look at the dates that UfoTable adapted . UfoTable made the prequel fate and the main fate routes aka the ones that are generally considered good while the fate spin offs are notorious for being mediocre at best. Your assumption that people don't like fate anime if they aren't animated by UfoTable isn't the logical conclusion here. People like the UfoTable dates because those are the main line .the ones that are actually good . As for episodes trending I didn't really pay attention to that but if you say so sure. And I don't assume that Asian viewers use MAL but the sample size that we have is big. And usually when somebody assumes something is just bigger in Japan it doesn't hold true in perspective. People say that about fire emblem all the time but it turns out that sales say otherwise. Also considering how many countries are able to use MAL because we all speak English the sample size is pretty big and pretty wide As for the last part. From what I see the main route is generally seen as the better fate. Sure there are haters for everything and we don't have hart numbers but how many people do you know that prefer the spin offs to the main fate? Besides that objectively speaking the spin offs are very lackluster. The Character design is pretty much always amazing but pretty much every fate spin off game suffers from bad gameplay and the story's aren't very good either . |
Zaphkiel_El_Rem said: Considering Babylon is the most popular and beloved chapter in the game for part one, your points only correlate to the minority there.To be honest, the FGO game's storytelling is shit. Aside from the Camelot chapter, everything else is underwhelming. I believed that many players beside me have no expectations as well when the anime was just announced, and many players have decided to just boycott the show completely before airing. However, to my surprise, this adaptation is doing better than I imagined. I'm glad that they changed a lot in the execution because this could have become the shittiest of the FATE ANIME if not. Whoever is the scriptwriter of the anime deserves some praise. |
-MahesvaraFeb 10, 2020 2:01 PM
My Queens  |
| >Also you said that MAL is being used by people that only think UfoTable anime count. never said that.I said that the westerners that use it think only Fate adaptation by ufo count.Not any ufo anime. Reading half of your post I realized that you dont even know what even is the source material of whatever spin off. And what even is Main route? Honestly you dont know shit about Fate or its fanbase. MAL is irrelevant to the popularity of not just Fate but ANY series and if it mattered then many anime would go beyond 1 or 2 seasons. And yes people REALLY CARE if ufotable animates a Fate series.This isnt even up for debate.First question when a Fate anime is announced is "Why not ufotable". Almost 10k sales on the first week(with the set at 100~ dollars/euro for 3 eps)and trending on Twiter. But you think people arent bothering with it because MAL's page doesnt have many members. Lets see how much MAL matters in popularity: FGO:Babylonia: 89,042 Keep Your Hands Off Eizouken!:86,533 So you are telling me that somehow BOTH of these series are talked about EVERYWHERE even tho they have so few members? MAL alone doesnt mean shit. |
ssjokg said: CuteAssTiger said: Because anime watchers and mobile-game players are 2 different target audiences MAL shows sample sizes of people that watch anime. Besides that mobile games make a lot of money because they focus on whales. Most of the money comes from a small percentage of the userbase. So making a lot of money doesn't mean a lot of people are going to watch the anime. Especially since gameplay and story are actually kinda bad. Besides that Babylonia is the adaptation of an arc that happens a bit later into the game. Wich is going to turn people off that didn't play the game up to that point. That contributes to the relative low success of babylonia compared to the other fate animes. Yeah no... I didnt see Last Encore or Apocrypha trending EVER on Twitter. I never saw something like that for even the ufotable Fates. Mal is a site used mostly by westerners that think ufotable adaptations are the only thing that matters.It in no way is an accurate representation of how many watch it or like it. correction, there is no such thing as ''westerners'', i believe the word you are looking for is ''americans'' / anglophones |
| Ah yes, the west is only Americans and people that speak English. |
CuteAssTiger said: Xiandragons said: because it isn't for casuals. that's it well or because of bad writing. nah, being the last chapter of your story doesn't make it a ''bad writing'' it's called targeting a specific audience. which translate to: not for casuals |
| @ssjokg While I'm here, I may as well explain why your view of ''Babylonia'' anime being ''the'' top tier to come out since zero is semi wrong. There is a reason why people dislike FSN after zero...actually, name it a couple of reasons, putting aside the fact that ufotable and nasu ''tried'' to originalise zero to become watchable before FSN with cameos and original (namely expository) content the one that stands out the most is because of FSN being an halfway work/story that doesn't conclude ''zero'' properly. from nasu somewhat acknowledging DSN as an actual legitimate fate route adaptation (shame on you, nasu) to UBW sacrificing monologues hurting shirou characterization and many in the process (subtlety can only do so much) to the main routes that ''complement'' each other hence the ''forced order'' being absent. that's the same issues that babylonia suffers from, you can however ''excuse'' it by it being targeted at specific audience from the get go since it was a fan poll project unlike ufo zero/ubw. that and the design being all saber to ease and fluid the animation. all in all babylonia is a decent entry to the franchise and should be the ''standard'' for future one. also, i don't think last encore i bad...if you played almot all ex series games and realise nasu lied about this being a 2 cour series for casuals. apo is a falure |
| @Xiandragons >While I'm here, I may as well explain why your view of ''Babylonia'' anime being ''the'' top tier to come out since zero is semi wrong I never said that tho. I said more popular(Babylonia today vs when Zero or UBW aired). Putting the quality of content aside there is no denying that Babylonia is popular, just not that popular in MAL. >ufotable and nasu ''tried'' to originalise zero to become watchable before FSN with cameo Just because adult Waver is at the last episode doesnt mean anything. Considering that anime only viewers have no reason to even know who that is without someone telling them, you are just wrong. Fake Iri is recognizable but that's it. And cameos in FSN doesnt mean they tried to make Zero the first story. We have FHA cameos and Kaleid cameos(depending on who you ask about Luvia). We could even add Garden of Avalon there because of the epilogue. >from nasu somewhat acknowledging DSN as an actual legitimate fate route adaptation "Somewhat" is correct because he has said time and again that he wants to rewrite Fate route and this was the reason ufo went with UBW first. >to UBW sacrificing monologues hurting shirou characterization and many in the process The viewer can still understand him if they want to think about it. Everyone loves Kiritusgu even tho Zero is about how wrong he is so absent monologues arent the real issue.All Kiritsugu does in Zero is talk shit about Saber and ideals. Even when Saber roasts him, viewers still dont get it and say how he was the one that put her in her place.Look at HF movies, viewers that had issues with UBW Shirou like him now, but only because he looks cooler...even if he didnt do anything grand yet. If you look cool/capable that's all you need in order to be called a good character. Back in UBW Shirou NEVER says that he wants to save everone, he even admits that he knows that is impossible. But then Archer says he thinks that so it must be true...even if Archer said that right after Shirou was talking shit to him for not killing Caster. There is a lot of bias towards Shirou and the monologues wont change much. >to the main routes that ''complement'' each other hence the ''forced order'' being absent. That's their issue so no comment. >also, i don't think last encore i bad...if you played almot all ex series games I played OG Extra and Extella before watching. Last encore was a disappointment because it had great ideas and concept but sucked at execution.I dont care if people not familiar with the games didnt get shit.If Nasu lied that hurts him not me. But when half of the story is posted on your blog/twitter/whatever instead of being in the series there is a big fucking issue. LE was pretty good up, for me, till the end of the fight with Drake even if some stuff wee obviously omitted.Then it was great again with NR's arc and that was it. Many things in it could have turned out great even if it was players that liked them but Nasu or the scriptwriter ruined it. It could have been even better than the OG's original premise but nah. |
ssjokg said: >Also you said that MAL is being used by people that only think UfoTable anime count. never said that.I said that the westerners that use it think only Fate adaptation by ufo count.Not any ufo anime. Reading half of your post I realized that you dont even know what even is the source material of whatever spin off. And what even is Main route? Honestly you dont know shit about Fate or its fanbase. MAL is irrelevant to the popularity of not just Fate but ANY series and if it mattered then many anime would go beyond 1 or 2 seasons. And yes people REALLY CARE if ufotable animates a Fate series.This isnt even up for debate.First question when a Fate anime is announced is "Why not ufotable". Almost 10k sales on the first week(with the set at 100~ dollars/euro for 3 eps)and trending on Twiter. But you think people arent bothering with it because MAL's page doesnt have many members. Lets see how much MAL matters in popularity: FGO:Babylonia: 89,042 Keep Your Hands Off Eizouken!:86,533 So you are telling me that somehow BOTH of these series are talked about EVERYWHERE even tho they have so few members? MAL alone doesnt mean shit. "Reading half of your post I realized that you dont even know what even is the source material of whatever spin off" How about you actually say why you think that instead of just claiming that ? I'm pretty sure I know what the sources for the majority of fate works are because I'm a pretty die hard fan. "And what even is Main route?" The original 3 routes of the VN? And I would personally count Zero into the mix. Because that is the original story that Fate is telling. It's the main Fate "Honestly you dont know shit about Fate or its fanbase." Baseless claims are strong In this one "MAL is irrelevant to the popularity of not just Fate but ANY series and if it mattered then many anime would go beyond 1 or 2 seasons." 1. You may want to research what a sample size is 2. Claims that a good sample size is irrelevant but a trending Twitter is a real measurement. Pls that is just confirmation bias. 3. If it (Mal?) Mattered many anime would go beyond 1-2 seasons ? You mean the popular anime that are finished after 1-2 season ? Yeah I wonder where that season 3 of fate zero or UBW . Would make sense. Yet again you may want to research what a sample size is. MAL doesn't have a direct say in the anime industry but it's a sample size that shows very well how people stand towards certain things " And yes people REALLY CARE if ufotable animates a Fate series.This isnt even up for debate.First question when a Fate anime is announced is "Why not ufotable"" Again The vast vast majority of people don't care about studios . From all people that watch anime only a small part is discussing is very actively. An even smaller part watches fate. An even smaller part knows what studio produces the adaptation. And an even smaller portion of those people gives a fuck . So yeah when you go into an online forum people might ask " why not UfoTable" but assuming that this means the majority of people cares is beyond delusional. Blaming that is definitely confirmation bias. "Almost 10k sales on the first week(with the set at 100~ dollars/euro for 3 eps)and trending on Twiter" 1. Numbers like this litterally don't mean anything without perspective. What are sales usually like etc? Besides that . As I already explained you can get a lot of things trending . Doesn't mean it sticks 2. I am not saying that this anime isn't popular because it's Mal members are low. Research what a sample size is. Pls . You make crazy mental gymnastics to get the result you want right now. The popularity isn't down because of MAL. The Mal numbers are low because that is what the anime viewers reception is like . Since we have all sorts of people here the distribution in the sample size likely shows what the whole picture looks like . "So you are telling me that somehow BOTH of these series are talked about EVERYWHERE even tho they have so few members" From what I've seen the reception of the latter has even been better. I havent seen it myself but heard a lot of good things about it And looking at the sample size it propably means that they have similar viewing counts when it comes to people that actively watch anime and talk about it online . I'm not saying that it looks like this " everywhere" but having a big sample size diverging much from the group that it's represents isnt common. It's a much better measurements then confirmation bias at the very least |
Xiandragons said: nah, being the last chapter of your story doesn't make it a ''bad writing'' it's called targeting a specific audience. which translate to: not for casuals Being the last chapter of a story isn't the thing that makes it bad writing. It's the number of bad writing choices that makes it bad writing. But analysing that is a huge different topic |
| @ssjokg Oh, so popularity in the sense of when it first aired. it's not just adult waver. the prologue of zero is almost all original when compared to the light novel since it tries to explain the stuff to the newcomers since obviously rin's prologue from fsn is missing (thank god, wait, i mean no) then you have her mini adventure and so on and so forth. obviously the cameos in FSN were made to connect the two Shirou monologues cover up more than his ideals but i'm sure you know that; case in point: the school roof scene where he teases rin or where he rants about how erotic sakura is or how artoria shouldn't act as if she isn't a girl (even if that is a bit sexist). and while shirou does *know* that being a seigi no mikata for all is impossible, he doesn't want to give up on it hence why his confrontation against archer is important and special and in my own opinion, a critical reason why UBW got picked up instead of the other two. the problem is that the anime tries to fool the viewers that his agony is solved right then and there when it's really actually not. and everyone notice that. even the ending is somewhat contradictory that forced mushroom to make an ending for it but couldn't make it since it wasn't accepted by the director as he *for some reason* preferred keeping it *ambiguous* (talk about cheap writing) when the lore contradicts that approach so he looks as if his character froze in a transition point. literature wise, we all know by this point that characters without flaws are called *mary sues* for a reason since they are bad; if you plan to represent a certain problem since who could have guessed, they don't have any. and that those with flaws if they stay so become cardboards (sieg). but being in an inbetween state is somehow even worse their flaw is their character drive to best it after all there are 2 main problems that make shirou's problematic as a protag in the anime. and that's coming from the mushroom itself A) no single route is a solution by itself and B) that makes it near impossible for the anime to capture shirou's actual character without adapting all of the VN. |
XiandragonsFeb 11, 2020 5:56 AM
| If you are a die hard fan then why are all spin offs *games*? And why isnt Zero considered a spin off when that's exactly what it is? It's funny how being popular in one platform isnt enough but being unpopular in another is all you need. And I am done with this. I have been following Fate titles on MAL and other sites since before Zero was a thing and yes people that know who ufotable is and care if they animate a Fate title are a lot.They arent the minority of the minority. I dont know where you get the idea that people dont know what they are watching especially on a site that list everything they need production wise. |
| @ssjokg don't mind the other person too much, it's clear the topic is silly. i edited some of the stuff so it becomes more coherent. see you around. it's rare to see someone who's not close minded about LE |
| @Xiandragons > the prologue of zero is almost all original when compared to the light novel since it tries to explain the stuff to the newcomers since obviously rin's prologue from fsn is missing Sorry to disappoint you but all the HGW and ritual infodumo was in the novel that Urobuchi and Nasu delayed in order for FSN readers to be done with FSN.From the top of my head, only "new scene" was Waver just mentioning the Servant Classes. >then you have her mini adventure How does that make Zero the first in order?It is just fanservice for FSN fans.I personally didnt like it because Rin at age 6-7 breaking a magical item created by any Caster screams bullshit to me but anyway. >the school roof scene where he teases rin or where he rants about how erotic sakura is or how artoria shouldn't act as if she isn't a girl (even if that is a bit sexist). Yeah I know Shirou isnt as teasing as much as in the VN but I dont see how that makes him better for everyone. Comments about Sakura or Saber are irrelevant in UBW's story. And the sexist comment is Fate route only iirc. >the problem is that he doesn't want to give up It is a personal issue Archer has. Even Archer admits that he didnt plan on saving everyone.Just all those in front of him. I dont know why this is even up for debate when Shirou actually gets pissed when they fail to kill an enemy contrary to what Archer says. Even in Fate where his ideals are challenged the least he displays that he has no issue with taking a life if he has to. I honestly dont see the issue with the entire format thing.We see Shirou's issues and why he thinks like this and then we see the development he reaches.I dont see how Shirou having 3 different developments according to how things play out makes it hard for others. >my interpretation of last encore was a what IF femc lost since her winning is what leads to extella I am pretty sure OG extra isnt Extella Zero and LE is just a continuation to a "bad ending" of OG Extra. >my problem with is how dispersed the materials are, there is cd dramas and the story books that cover some of the missing stuff that couldn't make it into the tv show. otherwise, when you experience it as a novel. it's quite fascinating. This is my issue.And I didnt know(or forgot) about the cd dramas and novels.This makes it worse actually. Why not just make the whole thing a LN and skip the anime for a while? |
ssjokg said: @Xiandragons > the prologue of zero is almost all original when compared to the light novel since it tries to explain the stuff to the newcomers since obviously rin's prologue from fsn is missing Sorry to disappoint you but all the HGW and ritual infodumo was in the novel that Urobuchi and Nasu delayed in order for FSN readers to be done with FSN.From the top of my head, only "new scene" was Waver just mentioning the Servant Classes. ''when compared to the light novel''. the anime is more info dump focused. they skipped a lot of stuff, like the narration at the start that explains the surrenderings of kiritsugu and even his monologues or how the scenes transition from one into another with some added bit of original material. par example: in the light novel, waver investigation about the holy grail leads directly to him being in fuyuki and talking with the gramps, but in the anime, it leads to kiri/tokiomi. and so on and so forth of other examples of this. Obviously it's no wonder that the anime is taking liberties but my point is that it does so to compress it as an info dump. it looked obviously to me they were setting her introduction earlier than she was intended even if that is for the fans. >the school roof scene where he teases rin or where he rants about how erotic sakura is or how artoria shouldn't act as if she isn't a girl (even if that is a bit sexist). it's just a part of his personality, it's not just that. but how also *pervy* he is. anyone who played the VN knows how much he checks in the heroines from time to time and how peotic he gets about it. it gives him personality if you would. even the sexist ones >the problem is that he doesn't want to give up archer is shirou after all, so he's a part of him. shirou ideals are hypocritical. he is fine with putting aside when he gets with artoria but turns into archer when it doesn't happen...it's clear his ideals are just his surivor guilt manifested in a twisted way. he doesn't want to give up on them even if they are wrong. which he knows but doesn't fix (discount UBW) and maybe a bit of HF but that's a rabbit hole for another day. fate route shirou is the most hypocritical since his ideals are the same. just shafted aside for artoria. because each development relay on the other though. it's thematic: Fate: the route where shirou has to stay ignorant of archer and retains his ideals while trying to attains artoria heart UBW: you know what it is. HF: the route where shirou ''actually gives up'' his ideals for another person at all costs after realising their misiry each one of those make up shirou and shows sides that people wouldn't have known if they only focused in one route. shirou saves artoria whom is a parallel to him which expose both of their worsts in that route but it doesn't develop into fixing it. >my interpretation of last encore was a what IF femc lost since her winning is what leads to extella I am pretty sure OG extra isnt Extella Zero and LE is just a continuation to a "bad ending" of OG Extra. you are right, OG extra and extella zero are not the same, extella zero is like a different route of OG extra, you are also right. LE is a bad ending continuation which made it wonderful for ex series fans iirc: femc winning in extella zero with a corrupted archer is what leads to extella, something that differs from OG extra. >my problem with is how dispersed the materials are, there is cd dramas and the story books that cover some of the missing stuff that couldn't make it into the tv show. otherwise, when you experience it as a novel. it's quite fascinating. This is my issue.And I didnt know(or forgot) about the cd dramas and novels.This makes it worse actually. Why not just make the whole thing a LN and skip the anime for a while? I know right! it actually happend also to extella zero as well no less if you may know. it was originally going to be a story book to explain extella but mushroom was backed out and thought publishing it in his diary as a mini story was a better idea? mushroom really is a sadist, isn't he...welp, we can only hope that the community may one day LN it in beast lair. |
XiandragonsFeb 11, 2020 8:18 AM
ssjokg said: If you are a die hard fan then why are all spin offs *games*? And why isnt Zero considered a spin off when that's exactly what it is? It's funny how being popular in one platform isnt enough but being unpopular in another is all you need. And I am done with this. I have been following Fate titles on MAL and other sites since before Zero was a thing and yes people that know who ufotable is and care if they animate a Fate title are a lot.They arent the minority of the minority. I dont know where you get the idea that people dont know what they are watching especially on a site that list everything they need production wise. I never said all spin offs are games ? What are you talking about ? I see you changed your strategy from confirmation bias to just making things up. Imagination =/= a real argument I would call zero Into the mix due to it being a closely related prequel ( except for conflicting details ). I didn't say being popular on one site isn't a measure while being unpopular on another is. What i am talking about is that being poorly received in multiple sample sizes says more then getting a hashtag trending. But "it's funny" how you just twist that arround till it fits your narrative. Imagination =/= real argument. "people that know who ufotable is and care" The vast majority of people doesn't know thou. I have already explained that so why are you making me repeat myself ? I have also already explained why their adaptations are as popular as they are. Why do I have to repeat that as well ? "I dont know where you get the idea that people dont know what they are watching especially on a site that list everything they need production wise." Because MAL is a sample size and not everyone who watches. You should really look into that concept because you don't seem to understand it at all. Even within this group most don't care. And even fewer discuss this actively. Compare the number of users we have in this group to the ones that actually care about this franchise. Compare that fraction to the number of people that actually discuss the topic. If someone fulfills these criteria they are obviously more likely to have a strong opinion on something. But the majority of the sample size obviously doesn't . Thou I'm pretty sure I explained that twice already in a similar manner. And yes you are done with this because there isn't much hope for someone who starts making things up when their confirmation bias faces a more logical conclusion. GG but your make believe way to make conclusions isn't accurate at all. |
| It's definitely way popular in Japan. It was trending on Japanese twitter a couple of times already. Of course global FGO players are probably watching along. |
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