MercifulPriest said: Fai said: Major logic fail, lol. Right, I messed up a little with the wording there. It's not that the story is bad, it's just that there's already a twenty-five episode adaptation and UBW/HF are better options. Good, thank you for your concession on the undeniable fact that fate zero should be watched AFTER FSN remake. I understand your point, and I know that it's supposed to be watched in that order too. But that's exactly the problem - most viewers will be coming from F/Z. Totally little to gain. Except buckets of money. You seriously think that producing three animated series simultaneously, each with top grade animation, music, pacing, and proper adaptation, is possible within the span of two years? Animation is very expensive, and while they must've had a lot of money on their hands to produce something like these, a 'budget' still exists. Alright, I won't deny that they might adapt Fate at a later time, and if they do, they're totally welcome. But the fact is, they aren't adapting it now. They chose to adapt UBW and HF over Fate, and I highly doubt that it was due to not liking Fate. They just weighed the priorities and what would earn them the most money, and it's just unfortunate that an adaptation of Fate ended up ruled out. It's not really that Fate/Zero makes the Fate route unnecessary, but more that it lessens priority on the latter since a large amount of viewers would be aware about the whole Holy Grail War thing by then. Fate route's base isn't just to introduce the franchise. In fact, that's one of the minor reasons. And if they were to link it to Zero, it would be resolving Saber's story the way Alex wanted. And unlike UBW, Fate includes the scary similarities between Shirou and Saber. You're lessening it's point by naming it 'an introduction'. If we're using that logic, all the huge amounts of info should go to UBW seeing as it's the middle route. And HF should just clear everything up rather than have super infodumps...Ofc, overall, the other two routes are stronger, cos Fate only really informs us about the HGW rules, world-wise. Tho, the Avalon shipping is still most popular, so that's another reason to adapt Fate |
The sun is a deadly laser |
| Weak ass route. |
| Proud founder of The Official Anti-Ging Freecss Fan Club Join now! Kellhus said: GuusWayne said: there is a limit to the suspension of disbelief And it's the fan that did it. Not the smoking porn reading rubik cube genius rape ape with a magic boat. |
GangstaPriest said: Weak ass route. |
| After HF is done and all, what do you think ufotable will pick to adapt next? Fate? not going to happen. HA? maybe Mahoutsukai no Yoru? |
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| I will laugh for 1 whole week if/when Fate gets adapted, PROPERLY. Money wise, they'll make big bucks from Fate. And milking the fight scenes: Saber vs Assassin, Saber vs Rider, Saber vs Berseker + Rin & Shirou, Archer vs Berseker, Berseker and his ragdoll, Saber destroying Gil...The fights alone make adapting it worth it, then you add in the Saber moe as well as her past, and you get a winning package. |
The sun is a deadly laser |
mirakura said: I will laugh for 1 whole week if/when Fate gets adapted, PROPERLY. Money wise, they'll make big bucks from Fate. And milking the fight scenes: Saber vs Assassin, Saber vs Rider, Saber vs Berseker + Rin & Shirou, Archer vs Berseker, Berseker and his ragdoll, Saber destroying Gil...The fights alone make adapting it worth it, then you add in the Saber moe as well as her past, and you get a winning package. But doing that after UBW and HF feels wrong. |
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natsucule said: mirakura said: I will laugh for 1 whole week if/when Fate gets adapted, PROPERLY. Money wise, they'll make big bucks from Fate. And milking the fight scenes: Saber vs Assassin, Saber vs Rider, Saber vs Berseker + Rin & Shirou, Archer vs Berseker, Berseker and his ragdoll, Saber destroying Gil...The fights alone make adapting it worth it, then you add in the Saber moe as well as her past, and you get a winning package. But doing that after UBW and HF feels wrong. No more wrong than adapting FZ before FSN. |
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natsucule said: mirakura said: I will laugh for 1 whole week if/when Fate gets adapted, PROPERLY. Money wise, they'll make big bucks from Fate. And milking the fight scenes: Saber vs Assassin, Saber vs Rider, Saber vs Berseker + Rin & Shirou, Archer vs Berseker, Berseker and his ragdoll, Saber destroying Gil...The fights alone make adapting it worth it, then you add in the Saber moe as well as her past, and you get a winning package. But doing that after UBW and HF feels wrong. CookingPriest said: No more wrong than adapting FZ before FSN. Ninja'd. Still, Gil's character arc is finished well too. "But I shall forgive you. Some things are beautiful because they cannot be obtained." |
mira-pyonOct 17, 2014 6:17 PM
The sun is a deadly laser |
mirakura said: I will laugh for 1 whole week if/when Fate gets adapted, PROPERLY. Money wise, they'll make big bucks from Fate. And milking the fight scenes: Saber vs Assassin, Saber vs Rider, Saber vs Berseker + Rin & Shirou, Archer vs Berseker, Berseker and his ragdoll, Saber destroying Gil...The fights alone make adapting it worth it, then you add in the Saber moe as well as her past, and you get a winning package. I'd want them to make OVAs first of all bad ends in FSN before they even consider making a Fate route adaptation tbh. |
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damastah said: mirakura said: I will laugh for 1 whole week if/when Fate gets adapted, PROPERLY. Money wise, they'll make big bucks from Fate. And milking the fight scenes: Saber vs Assassin, Saber vs Rider, Saber vs Berseker + Rin & Shirou, Archer vs Berseker, Berseker and his ragdoll, Saber destroying Gil...The fights alone make adapting it worth it, then you add in the Saber moe as well as her past, and you get a winning package. I'd want them to make OVAs first of all bad ends in FSN before they even consider making a Fate route adaptation tbh. Honestly don't care WHEN they make it. But they'd at least want to finish 'stay night' before going to other fate/stuff. Especially when the name 'stay night' comes from Fate route... Only now did I realise how truly hilarious this pic is:http://i.imgur.com/LIWUMrp.jpg |
The sun is a deadly laser |
| Saber fans will not care about milking as long that ufotable would remake Fate. Am I right? |
| The world shall know the truth soon. |
SweetCoconut said: Saber fans will not care about milking as long that ufotable would remake Fate. Am I right? I guess. But by making LE alone, they can make a bunch of bucks -> All those Avalon Saber figures~ |
The sun is a deadly laser |
| Well there's always the chance that they'd do Fate True End after UBW.... |
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damastah said: Well there's always the chance that they'd do Fate True End after UBW.... mirakura said: SweetCoconut said: Saber fans will not care about milking as long that ufotable would remake Fate. Am I right? I guess. But by making LE alone, they can make a bunch of bucks -> All those Avalon Saber figures~ |
The sun is a deadly laser |
mirakura said: Fate route's base isn't just to introduce the franchise. In fact, that's one of the minor reasons. And if they were to link it to Zero, it would be resolving Saber's story the way Alex wanted. And unlike UBW, Fate includes the scary similarities between Shirou and Saber. You're lessening it's point by naming it 'an introduction'. If we're using that logic, all the huge amounts of info should go to UBW seeing as it's the middle route. And HF should just clear everything up rather than have super infodumps...Ofc, overall, the other two routes are stronger, cos Fate only really informs us about the HGW rules, world-wise. Tho, the Avalon shipping is still most popular, so that's another reason to adapt Fate Hmm, reflecting back on my words two months back, I'll clarify. First of all, I do agree that the Fate route is a good route, even if UBW and Heaven's Feel are stronger in terms of story and popularity. Also, if Ufotable does choose to adapt it anytime in the future, then that's perfectly acceptable as well. Saber and Shirou are cool together, I do agree. Calling it merely an introductory route does sort of lessen its value. My main point in my previous statements was to answer the question in the OP, why Ufotable hadn't already chosen to adapt Fate first. I wasn't exactly fond of calling F/Z a replacement for it either in terms of information, but simply speculating on the mindset Ufotable might've had when choosing to go with the middle route first. mirakura said: Honestly don't care WHEN they make it. But they'd at least want to finish 'stay night' before going to other fate/stuff. Especially when the name 'stay night' comes from Fate route... Doesn't the 'stay night' part come from the prat when Shirou first meets Saber? Like, 'I wanted that night to stay the same forever' and all that. It's repeated again in the name for the Fate route's climax since he's still with Saber and reminisces about the past, but with this logic, it's equally valid for all three routes. |
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MercifulPriest said: mirakura said: Fate route's base isn't just to introduce the franchise. In fact, that's one of the minor reasons. And if they were to link it to Zero, it would be resolving Saber's story the way Alex wanted. And unlike UBW, Fate includes the scary similarities between Shirou and Saber. You're lessening it's point by naming it 'an introduction'. If we're using that logic, all the huge amounts of info should go to UBW seeing as it's the middle route. And HF should just clear everything up rather than have super infodumps...Ofc, overall, the other two routes are stronger, cos Fate only really informs us about the HGW rules, world-wise. Tho, the Avalon shipping is still most popular, so that's another reason to adapt Fate Hmm, reflecting back on my words two months back, I'll clarify. First of all, I do agree that the Fate route is a good route, even if UBW and Heaven's Feel are stronger in terms of story and popularity. Also, if Ufotable does choose to adapt it anytime in the future, then that's perfectly acceptable as well. Saber and Shirou are cool together, I do agree. Calling it merely an introductory route does sort of lessen its value. My main point in my previous statements was to answer the question in the OP, why Ufotable hadn't already chosen to adapt Fate first. I wasn't exactly fond of calling F/Z a replacement for it either in terms of information, but simply speculating on the mindset Ufotable might've had when choosing to go with the middle route first. mirakura said: Honestly don't care WHEN they make it. But they'd at least want to finish 'stay night' before going to other fate/stuff. Especially when the name 'stay night' comes from Fate route... Doesn't the 'stay night' part come from the prat when Shirou first meets Saber? Like, 'I wanted that night to stay the same forever' and all that. It's repeated again in the name for the Fate route's climax since he's still with Saber and reminisces about the past, but with this logic, it's equally valid for all three routes. Mkay, soz for the half-rant :) Also, stay night: http://lparchive.org/Fatestay-night/Update%20110/ He wants it to 'stay night' cos he doesn't want Seiba to leave ;u; |
The sun is a deadly laser |
mirakura said: MercifulPriest said: Doesn't the 'stay night' part come from the prat when Shirou first meets Saber? Like, 'I wanted that night to stay the same forever' and all that. It's repeated again in the name for the Fate route's climax since he's still with Saber and reminisces about the past, but with this logic, it's equally valid for all three routes. Mkay, soz for the half-rant :) Also, stay night: http://lparchive.org/Fatestay-night/Update%20110/ He wants it to 'stay night' cos he doesn't want Seiba to leave ;u; No probs~ Well, the way you put it makes more sense. Still, it does connect. I believe the title itself refers to Shirou and Saber's first, momentary meeting in that warehouse. As short as it was, Shirou didn't want that moment to end. He wanted that night to stay like that, forever. Then, when it's repeated in the climax of Fate, it's more of a callback to that one moment since it's finally coming to end. |
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| Yeah, I think I accidentally skipped that bit ~.~ But: http://lparchive.org/Fatestay-night/Update%2021/ It's called 'one more time' rather than stay night. Also, I just realised, the whole name of FSN is in Fate route. But then again, there was originally only one route. O.~ The original idea for stay night was that last night, since the normal thing with names is that they show the meaning at the last part of the project. But I guess the 3rd night counts as well~.~ |
The sun is a deadly laser |
| Sorry, nope. As much as shippers would want it is because generally most of time, in the story, daytime is slice of life and night is magic stuff, tactics, fighting, etc. Mahoyo follows same naming convention too. |
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CookingPriest said: Sorry, nope. As much as shippers would want it is because generally most of time, in the story, daytime is slice of life and night is magic stuff, tactics, fighting, etc. Mahoyo follows same naming convention too. >Confused at what that's supposed to be~n~ |
The sun is a deadly laser |
| I'm pretty sure the only reason is because UBW feels more connected to Fate/Zero in terms of character development. We had an entire episode in F/Z devoted to Rin's adventure and thus a bit of an expanded view on her personality. And then we had Kiritsugu saving the kid who later becomes the main protagonist of F/SN. Thus avoiding Rin's route, as well as not giving proper focus to Shirou's hero-complex, to which the main protagonist of F/Z contributed largely, would be a crime from a story-telling perspective. Thus I (tldr;) conclude that Fate/Zero's very existence itself is to blame for uFotable's choice. F/Z makes UBW seem like the only route out of all 3 that doesn't feel supplementary. |
| ... |
Tsundereppoi said: I'm pretty sure the only reason is because UBW feels more connected to Fate/Zero in terms of character development. We had an entire episode in F/Z devoted to Rin's adventure and thus a bit of an expanded view on her personality. And then we had Kiritsugu saving the kid who later becomes the main protagonist of F/SN. Thus avoiding Rin's route, as well as not giving proper focus to Shirou's hero-complex, to which the main protagonist of F/Z contributed largely, would be a crime from a story-telling perspective. Thus I (tldr;) conclude that Fate/Zero's very existence itself is to blame for uFotable's choice. F/Z makes UBW seem like the only route out of all 3 that doesn't feel supplementary. It's not WHY they did UBW by why they DIDMN'T do Fate. Those two subjects are completely different. I expect them to do Fate before going on to FHA or anything else. It makes more sense, story wise, as well as name wise. FSN comes as a whole package, if UFO doesn't do Fate, it'd just be UBW and HF, especially when Fate is where the title comes from -_-' |
The sun is a deadly laser |
mirakura said: It's not WHY they did UBW by why they DIDMN'T do Fate. Potato, potahto. It's like arguing whether the glass is half full or half empty. They did it because UBW felt more befitting for a sequel to F/Z than Fate or HF. I don't think there's any chance of them investing into an animated version of the Fate route. Because this is the 'package' they're aiming for:  Doing Fate after all of the above is delivered would feel a bit... awkward, out of place, forced, overdone. You know what I mean. |
| ... |
| if they ever do the fate route i hope they add that realta nua scene when [spoiler] saber gets avalon and waits centuries for shirou |
| UBW isn't any more fitting a "follow up" than Fate or Heaven's Feel. Every damn route is relevant to the events of Fate/Zero. |
| "Yes, I have been deprived of emotion. But not completely. Whoever did it, botched the job." - Geralt of Rivia |
insan3priest said: UBW isn't any more fitting a "follow up" than Fate or Heaven's Feel. Every damn route is relevant to the events of Fate/Zero. Well, alright, I'll expand on my previous post a bit: >The focus on chibi Rin in F/Z made her seem more important than just a background character. The funeral ending interconnects Tokiomi's, Aoi's, Kariya's, Sakura's and Kirei's fate; with Rin becoming the official heir/successor to the clusterfuck those characters constructed. >The focus on Kerry's people-saving-complex was plot-driving. He was the main protagonist of F/Z. He directly influenced Shiro's (whom, by the way, is the main protagonist in F/SN) altruistic character and hero-complex. And UBW expands on that. If uFotable were to take responsibility for the two of the above, they'd go with UBW. If you disagree, then provide your reasons. |
| ... |
Tsundereppoi said: insan3priest said: UBW isn't any more fitting a "follow up" than Fate or Heaven's Feel. Every damn route is relevant to the events of Fate/Zero. Well, alright, I'll expand on my previous post a bit: >The focus on chibi Rin in F/Z made her seem more important than just a background character. The funeral ending interconnects Tokiomi's, Aoi's, Kariya's, Sakura's and Kirei's fate; with Rin becoming the official heir/successor to the clusterfuck those characters constructed. >The focus on Kerry's people-saving-complex was plot-driving. He was the main protagonist of F/Z. He directly influenced Shiro's (whom, by the way, is the main protagonist in F/SN) altruistic character and hero-complex. And UBW expands on that. If uFotable were to take responsibility for the two of the above, they'd go with UBW. If you disagree, then provide your reasons. |
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HeisenPriest said: Tsundereppoi said: Well, alright, I'll expand on my previous post a bit: >The focus on chibi Rin in F/Z made her seem more important than just a background character. The funeral ending interconnects Tokiomi's, Aoi's, Kariya's, Sakura's and Kirei's fate; with Rin becoming the official heir/successor to the clusterfuck those characters constructed. >The focus on Kerry's people-saving-complex was plot-driving. He was the main protagonist of F/Z. He directly influenced Shiro's (whom, by the way, is the main protagonist in F/SN) altruistic character and hero-complex. And UBW expands on that. If uFotable were to take responsibility for the two of the above, they'd go with UBW. If you disagree, then provide your reasons. - Kirei is not even close to becoming a lead protagonist in neither F/Z nor F/SN, which makes his goals and his character secondary for both stories. - Sakura whatnow? - Even though we can put Saber somewhat on par with Rin in terms of importance to the Fate universe, that one reason still feels too weak to support a separate adaptation. In fact, even going HFwards feels a more justified investment. Which is why we're getting the HF movie. |
| ... |
Ston3_FreeN7Oct 18, 2014 5:44 PM
| "Yes, I have been deprived of emotion. But not completely. Whoever did it, botched the job." - Geralt of Rivia |
insan3priest said: I agree, it's not worth arguing about, since uFotable clearly doesn't agree with your reasons. |
| ... |
| Well, that was a waste of time. |
| "Yes, I have been deprived of emotion. But not completely. Whoever did it, botched the job." - Geralt of Rivia |
insan3priest said: Well, that was a waste of time. Fighting a battle you can't win  |
| ... |
| Nah, we shouldn't argue this AGAIN. Each route has its unique links to FZ. Because FZ was based on ALL 3 routes. The reason Ufo chose UBW for TV series are mainly: - Shirou is portrayed very well as the main character in UBW. It's mostly about him after all. - Action route, don't need to say more. - Don't have to worry about censorship. - Most popular route (???) Those are objective reasons. My own thought to add is that HF cannot work because all non-Rider servants are killed off really quickly in that route. HF, if stands alone,would feel like a bad writing. |
Just_ChickenOct 18, 2014 6:04 PM
chickenonthepan said: Nah, we shouldn't argue this AGAIN. Each route has its unique links to FZ. Because FZ was based on ALL 3 routes. The reason Ufo chose UBW for TV series are mainly: - Shirou is portrayed very well as the main character in UBW. It's mostly about him after all. - Action route, don't need to say more. - Don't have to worry about censorship. - Most popular route (???) Those are objective reasons. My own thought to add is that HF cannot work because all non-Rider servants are killed off really quickly in that route. HF, if stands alone,would feel like a bad writing. Gawd, thank you so much ~.~ A wise man among idiots. |
The sun is a deadly laser |
| Mother of Necro. |
 |
| Can be off-topic, but does Fate / Extra has a good story to become an anime? I have heard good reviews about writing and everything, saying until it is truly the strength of the game, but do not know actually. And it would be interesting interesting adaptation, as the easter-egg of other works of the Type-moon. |
I am Hatedmainofanime. More no one. |
| Just had an idea, what if saber vs rider at the beginning of HF is animated similar to the fate route with the building jumping. That would be a stunning sight scene to kick everything off. |
 Anime is good, fucking deal with it. |
black1blade said: Just had an idea, what if saber vs rider at the beginning of HF is animated similar to the fate route with the building jumping. That would be a stunning sight scene to kick everything off. Not gonna happen. Cos how will they fit Zouken? And how will they fit the way Rider disappears? Really, not gonna happen ~.~ Vagabond_Musashi said: Can be off-topic, but does Fate / Extra has a good story to become an anime? I have heard good reviews about writing and everything, saying until it is truly the strength of the game, but do not know actually. And it would be interesting interesting adaptation, as the easter-egg of other works of the Type-moon. Apocrypha would be far easier to adapt. Considering it follows one straight route. Whereas Extra has a choice of Archer, Nero or Tamamo. It would be unfair to pick one of the three. |
The sun is a deadly laser |
Vagabond_Musashi said: Can be off-topic, but does Fate / Extra has a good story to become an anime? I have heard good reviews about writing and everything, saying until it is truly the strength of the game, but do not know actually. And it would be interesting interesting adaptation, as the easter-egg of other works of the Type-moon. As lot as they pick Female MC and Nero, it should be quite easy to adapt. And unlike Apocrypha it is a finished story. |
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mira-lala said: black1blade said: Just had an idea, what if saber vs rider at the beginning of HF is animated similar to the fate route with the building jumping. That would be a stunning sight scene to kick everything off. Not gonna happen. Cos how will they fit Zouken? And how will they fit the way Rider disappears? Really, not gonna happen ~.~ Maybe they come flying back down to the ground. I just want some building jumping! |
Anime is good, fucking deal with it. |
CookingPriest said: Vagabond_Musashi said: Can be off-topic, but does Fate / Extra has a good story to become an anime? I have heard good reviews about writing and everything, saying until it is truly the strength of the game, but do not know actually. And it would be interesting interesting adaptation, as the easter-egg of other works of the Type-moon. As lot as they pick Female MC and Nero, it should be quite easy to adapt. And unlike Apocrypha it is a finished story. I thought that the fifth and final volume of Apocrypha was released on December 30? |
| ^ at least it would clear out all the people bitching so they wouldn't bother us with UBW and HF |
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Forgetfulness said: On a side note, with all the comments I've read about how Shirou is a "generic", "annoying", etc. character even though ufotable is doing a pretty decent job and showing his characterization, I can only imagine the bitching would be much greater if ufotable did decide to do Fate first. I never got this part. Shirou isn't more "annoying" in Fate than he is in UBW. It's just that the whole "I won't let other people get hurt to protect me/fight alongside me" thing is a major part of his inner conflict in Fate (mostly thanks to Saber getting hurt vs Berserker), while UBW solves this conflict very early (in the same Berserker fight). If they had portrayed him properly, he wouldn't have been more "annoying" than the "I won't let anyone die" Shirou from UBW. |
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Forgetfulness said: On a side note, with all the comments I've read about how Shirou is a "generic", "annoying", etc. character even though ufotable is doing a pretty decent job and showing his characterization, I can only imagine the bitching would be much greater if ufotable did decide to do Fate first. Yeah it would have certainly been a s#$% storm if that had happened. |
| “When you have eliminated the impossible, whatever remains, however improbable must be the truth. - Shinichi Kudo” - Gosho Aoyama The Ayako Mitsuzuri Fan Club Taiga Fuji-nee Club Prince Kashima Club |
| If they adapted Fate they wouldn't have the monologue after he says she shouldn't fight because she's a girl (like they left out the Episode 7 monologue after Archer saves him) so it would be a whole other level of shit storm. Good luck ever being able to explain that one away. |
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| I hope they adapt Fate. And include that moment. And his comment about Mitsuzuri's feminity. Secondary rage would be hilarious. They should add LE so we can see Fai rage too. Now that I think about it, the Zero-is-so-much-better type secondaries reactions to Hollow Ataraxia would be quite amusing. |
Insertanamehere said: I hope they adapt Fate. And include that moment. And his comment about Mitsuzuri's feminity. Secondary rage would be hilarious. They should add LE so we can see Fai rage too. Now that I think about it, the Zero-is-so-much-better type secondaries reactions to Hollow Ataraxia would be quite amusing. I hope they do the Shirou vs Lancer scene in UBW just to read the rage. |
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Forgetfulness said: On a side note, with all the comments I've read about how Shirou is a "generic", "annoying", etc. character even though ufotable is doing a pretty decent job and showing his characterization, I can only imagine the bitching would be much greater if ufotable did decide to do Fate first. Not really. If fate was donef irst AND his monologues were done well, the bitching would be less since fate is the route that REALLY explains his mind. |
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| Yet again, if fate route is adapted correctly as psychological thriller with monologues and inner imagery, it would do miles upon miles at helping to understand Shirou. Just don't give it to fucking Miura... |
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CookingPriest said: I discovered today that KnK movie 6 is 1 hour long despite having as much content as the 7th movie.Just don't give it to fucking Miura... I can see why people hate him now. And I am scared of touching KnK 6. |
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