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Jul 17, 2015 9:13 AM
#3751
For once, I actually agree with JD. HxH is one of the easiest battle shonen to get into, considering how it cuts the bullshit and gets to the meaty parts immediately. |
Jul 17, 2015 9:19 AM
#3752
Still I think one should go for the 99 first or manga, then go for the 2011. Mito and Kite not being in the beginning. Madhouse screwed up that part. |
Jul 17, 2015 9:22 AM
#3753
tsudecimo said: Well the beginning of Bleach is quite dull, up until soul society is introduced. I think the only battle anime that is good from the start or at least easy to get into from the beginning is Naruto, Nanatsu no Taizai, HxH and Soul eater. Naruto is pretty slow if you´re not into the humor, I didn´t give a fuck about the series and was more annoyed than entertained about the bratty kid at first sight. Kakashi was the first good thing to happen. But it drops it´s bombs fairly early and switches between slow and fast constantly. One Piece is more like a gradual slow increase in quality untill it hiits the Grand line where the pacing problems start where it starts going from hell yeah too, meh. |
Jul 17, 2015 9:36 AM
#3754
There are literally only three episodes of comedy, that are not serious, where it introduces the main characters. Episode 4 is the bell test, and they go for the first serious mission on episode 6. So I don't know what you are talking about. |
Jul 17, 2015 9:38 AM
#3755
I pity those who don't appreciate the greatness of the Hunter exams, most creative arc. I think I like it better than the Chunnin exams. |
Jul 17, 2015 9:41 AM
#3756
JD2411 said: RedRoseFring said: I agree with KHR, but HxH? Really? It's the only battle shounen that skips the introduction arcs and goes straight into a main arc in the second episode (1st in 2011). If anything it's the easiest to get into since it doesn't have the MC killing fodder characters for 10+ episode before a serious arc starts.HxH and KHR are especially harder to get into. Both have some of the slowest starts I've seen in anime. I guess I should have clarified I meant the 1999 version. It will be easier to get into a remake when they cut things down. The Hunter exam is also one of the less interesting arcs, and followed by the least liked arc. Then again, I guess that doesn't say much considering it's only really 2 arcs that get a lot of praise and the second is polarizing. |
"Let Justice Be Done!" My Theme Fight again, fight again for justice! |
Jul 17, 2015 10:26 AM
#3757
RedRoseFring said: HxH and KHR are especially harder to get into. Both have some of the slowest starts I've seen in anime. nah, Hunter Exam arc is one of the best ways to kick off a Shonen, it pretty much shows you from the get-go what HxH is going to be all about compared to other shonen and it's incredibly easy to marathon at that. Daily Life is in it's own tier of bad, I've never seen an arc so hated even by it's own fandom |
Jul 17, 2015 10:46 AM
#3758
a-rootin-tootin said: I've tried watching both Bleach and Naruto and gradually lost interest in both of them. I've considered giving Bleach another shot. The only one I haven't attempted to watch yet is One Piece. The only problem I have with these sorts of shows is their length and their potential for too many off-shoots and being dragged out longer than the story necessitates simply because they are hugely popular. Still, One Piece looks like a lot of fun and I'm interested in giving it a go. And the entire concept behind Bleach keeps me intrigued enough that I want to go back and try watching it again. Naruto is meh, in my opinion. Being longer makes them better, they don't have to rush everything in 12 or 24 episodes. Characterization is important. Fillers can be skipped. Naruto was good until kishi sold out for chapter 700. One piece has been mediocre for the past 4 years. Listening to to the bleach haters will diminish the enjoyment too. They don't even have a good reason to hate it either, they're just butthurt that bleach >> their sht favorites that don't even sell XD |
Jul 17, 2015 10:48 AM
#3759
Kaimon said: RedRoseFring said: HxH and KHR are especially harder to get into. Both have some of the slowest starts I've seen in anime. nah, Hunter Exam arc is one of the best ways to kick off a Shonen, it pretty much shows you from the get-go what HxH is going to be all about compared to other shonen and it's incredibly easy to marathon at that. Daily Life is in it's own tier of bad, I've never seen an arc so hated even by it's own fandom Yeah, the KHR one is the worst, but I didn't find the Hunter Exam in the 99 version to be too much better. It was basically half the series (30 episodes). I don't think it did a very good job showing what it would be all about when many people claim that the tone and purpose shifts throughout the series. I'd say Naruto (mostly the first series by itself though), One Piece, Soul Eater, Toriko and even Bleach are the series that really include all the elements from their introductions all the way through. |
"Let Justice Be Done!" My Theme Fight again, fight again for justice! |
Jul 17, 2015 10:50 AM
#3760
Kaimon said: The daily life arc is fine and quite funny at times. It's only hated because it doesn't have muh action.Daily Life is in it's own tier of bad, I've never seen an arc so hated even by it's own fandom |
Jul 17, 2015 10:56 AM
#3762
yhunata said: The first 20 episodes of Katekyo Hitman RebornWhat is this daily life arc that you speak of? |
Jul 17, 2015 10:58 AM
#3763
JD2411 said: yhunata said: The first 20 episodes of Katekyo Hitman RebornWhat is this daily life arc that you speak of? Ah, that.. yeah, that wasn't very good. Outright boring at times. From what I heard, it was supposed to be like that, but was turned into a battle shonen later on. |
Jul 17, 2015 11:22 AM
#3764
I skipped straight to the Varia arc. No regrets. |
Jul 17, 2015 11:23 AM
#3765
tsudecimo said: I skipped straight to the Varia arc. No regrets. Shame that you skipped the Mukuro arc. I thought that was one of the better arcs of the series. |
Jul 17, 2015 11:28 AM
#3766
yhunata said: tsudecimo said: I skipped straight to the Varia arc. No regrets. Shame that you skipped the Mukuro arc. I thought that was one of the better arcs of the series. I think he is boring, so I'm glad I did. Varia is the best arc for me. |
Jul 17, 2015 12:28 PM
#3767
yhunata said: JD2411 said: yhunata said: What is this daily life arc that you speak of? Ah, that.. yeah, that wasn't very good. Outright boring at times. From what I heard, it was supposed to be like that, but was turned into a battle shonen later on. Oh really? I drop it around episode 5? So it gets better after 20 episodes? I might give this series another shot, but I also heard that the ending sucks so its probably not worth it. |
Jul 17, 2015 12:31 PM
#3768
keragamming said: yhunata said: JD2411 said: yhunata said: The first 20 episodes of Katekyo Hitman RebornWhat is this daily life arc that you speak of? Ah, that.. yeah, that wasn't very good. Outright boring at times. From what I heard, it was supposed to be like that, but was turned into a battle shonen later on. Oh really? I drop it around episode 5? So it gets better after 20 episodes? I might give this series another shot, but I also heard that the ending sucks so its probably not worth it. It gets better after the Mukuro arc starts and the Varia arc, which comes afterwards, is easily the best arc of the series. Then comes the Future arc, during which there are a few filler arcs, which is the longest arc in the entire series (over half the manga) and is pretty stupid at times. That's where the anime ends. I'd say give it a shot, hell even skip straight to the Mukuro arc. You're not gonna miss anything by doing so. |
Jul 17, 2015 12:38 PM
#3769
yhunata said: keragamming said: yhunata said: JD2411 said: yhunata said: The first 20 episodes of Katekyo Hitman RebornWhat is this daily life arc that you speak of? Ah, that.. yeah, that wasn't very good. Outright boring at times. From what I heard, it was supposed to be like that, but was turned into a battle shonen later on. Oh really? I drop it around episode 5? So it gets better after 20 episodes? I might give this series another shot, but I also heard that the ending sucks so its probably not worth it. It gets better after the Mukuro arc starts and the Varia arc, which comes afterwards, is easily the best arc of the series. Then comes the Future arc, during which there are a few filler arcs, which is the longest arc in the entire series (over half the manga) and is pretty stupid at times. That's where the anime ends. I'd say give it a shot, hell even skip straight to the Mukuro arc. You're not gonna miss anything by doing so. What episode does the Mukuro arc start at? |
Jul 17, 2015 12:40 PM
#3770
This is the first time I see people actively recommending to skip canon material, KHR must be one bad of a series. Kaimon said: RedRoseFring said: HxH and KHR are especially harder to get into. Both have some of the slowest starts I've seen in anime. nah, Hunter Exam arc is one of the best ways to kick off a Shonen, it pretty much shows you from the get-go what HxH is going to be all about compared to other shonen and it's incredibly easy to marathon at that. Daily Life is in it's own tier of bad, I've never seen an arc so hated even by it's own fandom Agreed. I was hooked from the start. Talking about beginnings, I wonder why Toei modified that of One Piece, the anime's first episode is good but the manga's first chapter is so much better better. |
Jul 17, 2015 12:40 PM
#3771
keragamming said: What episode does the Mukuro arc start at? Not sure of the exact episode, but it's around episode 20, I think. Wait, I'll check the wikia. EDIT: It seems to be exactly episode 20. http://reborn.wikia.com/wiki/Kokuyo_Arc |
yhunataJul 17, 2015 12:46 PM
Jul 17, 2015 1:02 PM
#3772
Hmmm. I wonder if I should bother taking the time to write a full review for any series. Probably start off a One Piece review like so: "'Kaizoku Ou, orewa naru!" There is no better way to build up expectations of an amazing journey, or an engaging story driven narrative and good sense of mystery than such a bold statement. Those expectations are definitely met with great gusto. For anyone who desires to understand why this series is so successful in Japan, I'm glad to say I gave the series a shot, and it is easy to see the appeal." |
"Let Justice Be Done!" My Theme Fight again, fight again for justice! |
Jul 17, 2015 1:02 PM
#3773
Agafin said: This is the first time I see people actively recommending to skip canon material, KHR must be one bad of a series. Your logic is just amazing sometimes. keragamming said: but I also heard that the ending sucks so its probably not worth it. Don't get why people care so much about the ending quality of anything. It was not adapted in the anime anyway. The ending of the anime is pretty good, albeit missing one thing that I would have loved to see. |
Jul 17, 2015 1:05 PM
#3774
keragamming said: yhunata said: JD2411 said: yhunata said: The first 20 episodes of Katekyo Hitman RebornWhat is this daily life arc that you speak of? Ah, that.. yeah, that wasn't very good. Outright boring at times. From what I heard, it was supposed to be like that, but was turned into a battle shonen later on. Oh really? I drop it around episode 5? So it gets better after 20 episodes? I might give this series another shot, but I also heard that the ending sucks so its probably not worth it. It has one good arc with the rest being either shit or mediocre, plus a terrible ending to boot (at least the manga one). Don't bother. |
Jul 17, 2015 1:10 PM
#3775
Actually, I don't think KHR is as bad as people say. The intro arc is certainly the worst I've seen in anime, but the following arcs were pretty decent, and Byakuran was a pretty interesting villain. He's not as good as the first arc Aizen for instance, but his motivation is better than someone like Obito's and he's a generally less painful character to watch. I'd not recommend it to watch though. |
"Let Justice Be Done!" My Theme Fight again, fight again for justice! |
Jul 17, 2015 1:11 PM
#3776
RedRoseFring said: Actually, I don't think KHR is as bad as people say. The intro arc is certainly the worst I've seen in anime, but the following arcs were pretty decent, and Byakuran was a pretty interesting villain. He's not as good as the first arc Aizen for instance, but his motivation is better than someone like Obito's and he's a generally less painful character to watch. I wish they'd adapted the Simon arc.... I really liked that arc. It was my favorite after the Varia arc. |
Jul 17, 2015 1:11 PM
#3777
RedRoseFring said: Actually, I don't think KHR is as bad as people say. The intro arc is certainly the worst I've seen in anime, but the following arcs were pretty decent, and Byakuran was a pretty interesting villain. He's not as good as the first arc Aizen for instance, but his motivation is better than someone like Obito's and he's a generally less painful character to watch. I'd not recommend it to watch though. Saying he's better than Obito doesn't exactly make us think he's good. |
Jul 17, 2015 1:17 PM
#3778
DrizzyXP said: RedRoseFring said: Actually, I don't think KHR is as bad as people say. The intro arc is certainly the worst I've seen in anime, but the following arcs were pretty decent, and Byakuran was a pretty interesting villain. He's not as good as the first arc Aizen for instance, but his motivation is better than someone like Obito's and he's a generally less painful character to watch. I'd not recommend it to watch though. Saying he's better than Obito doesn't exactly make us think he's good. Good point. I guess I should clarify that he's one of those villains that is pretty unpredictable and who's motives are mysterious. |
"Let Justice Be Done!" My Theme Fight again, fight again for justice! |
Jul 17, 2015 1:17 PM
#3779
tsudecimo said: I'm probably just traumatised since it's usually someone like Mikasa who would recommend to skip something which is not filler. Is it episodic like Conan or something?Agafin said: Your logic is just amazing sometimes.This is the first time I see people actively recommending to skip canon material, KHR must be one bad of a series. |
Jul 17, 2015 1:19 PM
#3780
Agafin said: tsudecimo said: I'm probably just traumatised since it's usually someone like Mikasa who would recommend to skip something which is not filler. Is it episodic like Conan or something?Agafin said: This is the first time I see people actively recommending to skip canon material, KHR must be one bad of a series. Painfully so. |
Jul 17, 2015 1:22 PM
#3781
Agafin said: tsudecimo said: I'm probably just traumatised since it's usually someone like Mikasa who would recommend to skip something which is not filler. Is it episodic like Conan or something?Agafin said: This is the first time I see people actively recommending to skip canon material, KHR must be one bad of a series. It's filler canon. It was supposed to be a gag manga, but it wasn't popular, so it changed to a battle manga (if you watch Bakuman they talk about this iirc) Aside from the introduction of some of the main characters, you won't miss much if you skip. |
Jul 17, 2015 1:23 PM
#3782
Why do people dislike Obito again? I don't see how Aizen is better than him in anything except maybe charisma. |
Jul 17, 2015 1:24 PM
#3783
Hmmm. It's interesting to see that KHR generally has better reviews than Naruto. For Naruto, you've got reviews like this: Overall rating: 4 I would like to start this review off by saying that I did not grow up with the Naruto series, nor did I have any pre-judgment of the series before I started watching it. Therefore I’d like to assert that my perspective on this series is as unbiased as it’s probably going to get, considering its popularity. When watching the series, the first thing I did was compile a list of filler episodes, and then promptly skipped all of them. This is so my watching experience in terms of the story deviated from the manga source material as little as possible. That being said, here is a breakdown of the score I gave the Naruto anime as well as reasons behind each scoring. As I typically do when reviewing anything, I will start off with the positives and end on the negatives. Sound: 7/10 The sound in Naruto is definitely above average, and certainly immerses you in the scenes at hand. That being said, while the sound is a step above average, it isn’t top tier quality, so I feel as if a seven out of ten is properly justified. No need to really go into much detail here. Art: 6/10 I found the art in this series to be pleasing to the eye; there weren’t any moe blobs, characters that looked like they could sooner pass for aliens rather than human beings, and it lacked a “childish” sort of look to it. That being said, there wasn’t anything here that was spectacular. Considering it was produced from 2002-2007, there were series with much better art than this even before that time. This is the justification behind me giving it the 6/10 that I think it deserves, which in my mind is just about average. Story: 3/10 This is where, for me, the Naruto series started failing. Anything mentioned here will be re-iterated in the very first episode of the series, so I’m assuming that this won’t be considered “spoilers” per say. Naruto is based off an infant child who is infused with the spiritual energy of a nine-tailed demon in order to prevent a disaster from befalling his village. He is now viewed as an outcast and a monster throughout his childhood because of these events, rather than a scapegoat for saving the entirety of his village. Now Naruto’s aim is to change this reputation, and gain the respect of his village by becoming the most powerful person in it. You might be thinking to yourself at this point, “Wow, that story isn’t bad at all, why are you giving this a 3/10?!”… Well, I will now explain my rating of this as concisely as possible. The issue here is that the story doesn’t evolve at all during the span of the 131 episodes that aren’t comprised of filler material. Naruto begins to be accepted by his peers early on, and the whole idea of him being viewed as a “monster” diminishes quickly. When that happens, Naruto wants to become the strongest just for the sake of being the strongest. This sets the stage for the story to carry out like practically every other shounen in existence, and what was once a unique story with a high potential for excellence loses said potency very fast. I see no reason why to consider this story anything even close to mediocrity, hence the three out of ten rating you see here. Characters: 2/10 This is where I’ve seen other people say the series suffers the most, and after watching it, I’d have to agree with them. The phrase “one dimensional characters” gets thrown around a lot, and while I might have a different idea than some about the interpretation of this phrase, I agree with it. The thing with the Naruto anime is that the author only knows how to write one type of character type well, and that is the character that involves some kind of tragic loss in their life. I guess you could simplify what I just wrote and say “the only character the author knows how to write is Naruto” and get away with it just fine. Literally every character in the plot that is riddled with some sort of tragedy happens to have the same tragedy; someone they cared about has died in the past, and it has left them broken, mentally damaged or downright evil as a result. Don’t expect any sort character depth beyond this. The villains? They’re mostly evil just for the sake of being evil, or for the other aforementioned reason. They have that cliché plot convenience of “I’m not the true mastermind behind all the said evil events you have been fighting against, merely a puppet of some greater evil!” sort of deal, and spoiler alert, it doesn’t get old as the show progresses. That’s just the beginning of why I consider this anime to have one of the worst characterizations I have ever seen. Moving on to something else; romance. In my opinion, a romance should either be included and done properly, or given the setting, not included at all. With Naruto, I’m leaning more towards “not included at all”. Think of it this way, the characters are roughly the age of your average elementary school student. When you were about 11 years of age, were you concerned about having a girlfriend? I sure as hell wasn’t, I was more concerned about finishing my collection of Zelda games and beating my friends in Super Smash Bros. Yet romance plays a part of the primary characterization of some of the main characters, despite their age, and it really isn’t done well. You won’t see any sort of romantic development throughout the entirety of this anime, and given that a certain character’s (that shall not be named) “character” depends almost entirely on this aspect, it makes for a very poor attempt at convincing the viewer that they have any sort of significance in the plot. For these reasons, I give the characters a 2/10, being one of the worst attempts at characterization I have seen in modern anime. Enjoyment: 2/10 As a result of the other scores that you see above, this is what I came up with as a score. Given that I get most of my enjoyment from characterization and story, this score seems fairly natural to hand out. Overall: 4/10 This is just an average of the scores you see above. This show is scoring consistently above 7/10 in reviews, and I see no merits behind why it should be, given what I have discussed above. As can be referenced by my profile scoring system, I would conclude that with this score Naruto has too many flaws to make it a passable watching experience. show less. Which is ironic considering similar reviews given by some of its fans for other shounen. Reciprocal blind bias maybe? |
"Let Justice Be Done!" My Theme Fight again, fight again for justice! |
Jul 17, 2015 1:28 PM
#3784
tsudecimo said: Agafin said: tsudecimo said: Agafin said: Your logic is just amazing sometimes.This is the first time I see people actively recommending to skip canon material, KHR must be one bad of a series. It's filler canon. It was supposed to be a gag manga, but it wasn't popular, so it changed to a battle manga (if you watch Bakuman they talk about this iirc) Aside from the introduction of some of the main characters, you won't miss much if you skip. I see. I may check it some day,... but the artstyle is very bishounen. "It was supposed to be a gag manga, but it wasn't popular, so it changed to a battle manga" Lol, if you replace "wasn't popular" with "was too popular" you basically get Dragon Ball. |
Jul 17, 2015 1:29 PM
#3785
I cringe every time I see "one dimensional". People really do not know how to use the expression, do they? |
Jul 17, 2015 1:31 PM
#3786
Agafin said: Why do people dislike Obito again? I don't see how Aizen is better than him in anything except maybe charisma. Honestly, I always thought the Aizen reveal was handled a lot better than Obito's. I'm probably in the minority here but I always had my suspicions that he had lived. Especially since we didn't know what happened to the girl in Kakashi's team; that is how she died before the reveal. The only other person I suspected was Itachi's best friend. For some reason when I first watched Bleach I never suspected Aizen was alive and orchestrating everything. I guess I wasn't paying too much attention when I watched it years ago but the revealed surprised me. Also, I like Aizen as a character much more than Obito. Despite Obito being better written. |
Jul 17, 2015 1:31 PM
#3787
Agafin said: I see. I may check it some day,... but the artstyle is very bishounen. One of the reasons why it's popular, it has a huge female fanbase. I personally love the art, it's very aesthetically pleasing. "It was supposed to be a gag manga, but it wasn't popular, so it changed to a battle manga" Lol, if you replace "wasn't popular" with "was too popular" you basically get Dragon Ball. .-.? Dragonball was never a gag manga. It had battles and action from early on. The big difference is that it changed from mainly adventure to battle. |
Jul 17, 2015 1:32 PM
#3788
DrizzyXP said: I cringe every time I see "one dimensional". People really do not know how to use the expression, do they? It's not much better than people who use "two-dimensional" as if that sets them apart. Agafin said: Why do people dislike Obito again? I don't see how Aizen is better than him in anything except maybe charisma. Probably the whole Starting a war with the entire world and killing former loved ones because a love interest (who didn't even love him back) died and whining about it all the time. Aizen despite his pathetic end didn't enter that realm of insufferability. His end was also technically less pathetic as there was no talk-no-jutsu involved. |
"Let Justice Be Done!" My Theme Fight again, fight again for justice! |
Jul 17, 2015 1:33 PM
#3789
tsudecimo said: Dragonball was never a gag manga. It had battles and action from early on. The big difference is that it changed from mainly adventure to battle. Eh, early Dragon Ball pre-tournaments was pretty much a gag manga even if it was issued under Action/Adventure Shonen. It played out a lot like Dr. Slump. |
Jul 17, 2015 1:34 PM
#3790
Agafin said: Why do people dislike Obito again? I don't see how Aizen is better than him in anything except maybe charisma. He started a war where thousands died because of a girl (who had a childhood crush on), just silly The moment the mask came off the interesting and mencaing Tobi was replaced with a lame whiner |
Jul 17, 2015 1:35 PM
#3791
Fullmetal89 said: Agafin said: Why do people dislike Obito again? I don't see how Aizen is better than him in anything except maybe charisma. Honestly, I always thought the Aizen reveal was handled a lot better than Obito's. I'm probably in the minority here but I always had my suspicions that he had lived. Especially since we didn't know what happened to the girl in Kakashi's team; that is how she died before the reveal. The only other person I suspected was Itachi's best friend. For some reason when I first watched Bleach I never suspected Aizen was alive and orchestrating everything. I guess I wasn't paying too much attention when I watched it years ago but the revealed surprised me. Also, I like Aizen as a character much more than Obito. Despite Obito being better written. Actually, that would put you in the majority. Aizen's reveal was genuinely surprising because: The audience had no idea of his ability, but it makes sense in context of what he accomplished. The motivation also made sense for the lengths he went to. I didn't mind the Obito reveal that much, but the issue most people seem to take beyond it being predictable is his motivations. |
RedRoseFringJul 17, 2015 1:38 PM
"Let Justice Be Done!" My Theme Fight again, fight again for justice! |
Jul 17, 2015 1:37 PM
#3792
8animet said: Agafin said: Why do people dislike Obito again? I don't see how Aizen is better than him in anything except maybe charisma. He started a war where thousands died because of a girl (who had a childhood crush on), just silly The moment the mask came off the interesting and mencaing Tobi was replaced with a lame whiner You phrased it in a pretty similar way to how I said it (check the spoiler): Starting a war with the entire world and killing former loved ones because a love interest (who didn't even love him back) died and whining about it all the time. |
"Let Justice Be Done!" My Theme Fight again, fight again for justice! |
Jul 17, 2015 1:37 PM
#3793
RedRoseFring said: It's not much better than people who use "two-dimensional" as if that sets them apart. "Two-dimensional" at least can be correct when you talk about relevant characters inside one franchise. You can at least make the argument that they are two-dimensional, even if they aren't. Not with "one-dimensional". If you know the least bit about a character's motivation, , objective, ideals backstory, or anything really, then he's no longer one-dimensional. And Naruto provides backstories and ideals and such in handfuls. |
Jul 17, 2015 1:38 PM
#3794
RedRoseFring said: Aizen's reveal was genuinely surprising because: The audience had no idea of his ability, but it makes sense in context of what he accomplished. The motivation also made sense for the lengths he went to. I didn't mind the Obito reveal that much, but the issue most people seem to take beyond it being predictable is his motivations. True, his motivation made sense but it was basically another vengeful Uchiha. Which had already been done with Sasuke and Madara. I also feel like Naruto talking him out of destroying the world was kinda meh. It didn't really matter since everything was quickly swept aside when Kaguya came out of nowhere so it didn't bother me that much. |
Jul 17, 2015 1:39 PM
#3795
yhunata said: keragamming said: What episode does the Mukuro arc start at? Not sure of the exact episode, but it's around episode 20, I think. Wait, I'll check the wikia. EDIT: It seems to be exactly episode 20. http://reborn.wikia.com/wiki/Kokuyo_Arc Thanks I'll think about it. |
Jul 17, 2015 1:39 PM
#3796
tsudecimo said: Yeah but before the first tournament, it pretty much was as fullmetal said.Dragonball was never a gag manga. It had battles and action from early on. The big difference is that it changed from mainly adventure to battle. |
Jul 17, 2015 1:41 PM
#3797
Agafin said: Why do people dislike Obito again? I don't see how Aizen is better than him in anything except maybe charisma. I had no problem with his motives, big shit that happen because something personal is a normal thing. What's made him disgusting is that after going that far, he just stopped halfways because the protagonist convince him with a small talk. He should really learn from Bellamy how to became the "I pick the wrong path" type of villain. Even if he know he's wrong and he regret what he did, at least he finished what he start. |
Jul 17, 2015 1:42 PM
#3798
DrizzyXP said: "Two-dimensional" at least can be correct when you talk about relevant characters inside one franchise. You can at least make the argument that they are two-dimensional, even if they aren't. Not with "one-dimensional". If you know the least bit about a character's motivation, , objective, ideals backstory, or anything really, then he's no longer one-dimensional. And Naruto provides backstories and ideals and such in handfuls. Well, it's a step up, but not by much. Such reviews also somehow inspire other similar ones. Consider this: overall rating: 4 ''I'm Luffy! The Man Who Will Become The Pirate King'' This is the quote, that sets the main plotline for the series. Along with the name of the title itself. Hearing this and glimpsing at the synopsis, I build up expectations of an amazing journey, coupled with an engaging story driven narrative and good sense of mystery. Unfortunately those expectations were not met with great content to satisfy them. My main motivations for starting this was my desire to understand why is this series so successful in Japan. And I'm afraid to say after I gave the show a shot, I wasn't able to get it, or even see the appeal like I would for others shows that I didn't like. Let's start with the Characters [3/10]. They might be one of my biggest gripe of the show. I could forgive the semi-episodic narrative of the show and the repetition found in the format of the arcs if the characters kept my interest and made me want to keep watching. It's not that I simply didn't like them, because Luffy the protagonist himself is pretty likeable, and I like Zoro and Robin. But characterization, progression and just the general writing of the characters fails to deliver. Luffy is two dimensional at best. Everything about him feels borrowed from Goku, and not much is exclusive to him. He doesn't have any significant character development for more than 100+ episodes. He has the same track mind, same point of view. Never changing or maturing. Not feeling any more sense of responsibility and not gasping a bigger sense of the world, emphasizing his naivety and immature personality. So he is a static character for a big portion of the show. While static doesn't mean a bad character by default, in the case of Luffy it makes him a bad character. It makes him super predictable in how he reacts to things, his interactions with others and his decisions in general. There is hardly any fleshing out of his character outside of simple dialogue and simple motives ''I want to be the pirate king'' '' I Will Protect my Nakama'' ''I love meat''. His characterization is very simple and while that could be considered likeable, it's yet not charming as Goku. Since it's just a copy. I just find him dull and non-simulating, the shouting and care free personality with the serious personality in fights doesn't make him interesting to me. There is just no particular depth in his characterization or the execution of his character. He is faced with a major life changing events later on in the series, but he is still the same character after it passes. When speaking of development, it's not meant to be a complete change of personality (180 personality change) but it means a significant change in characterization, while his fundamental character is still intact. A dynamic character most often than not is more interesting with more room to show more layers of the character. The other main characters more or less are the same as Luffy just slightly better. I found Nami's character to be good due to her conflict with pirates and her character development and back story in Arlong park. I thought that was a not so average aspect like most other things, and I even started liking her. But as soon as that arc finished she remains static with nothing to offer, making her interactions with the crew members predictable, annoying and hardly funny. I expected to see more to her than simple gags. They don't get development past their introductory arcs. Which makes them less believable and interesting, considering they are on a big journey that should alter their lives forever. Repeating of their dreams and motives every other time kinda makes them shallow, because they offer nothing else in conflicts, internal struggles or different dimensions or something subtle to make me wonder and try to think and understand something deeper or anything interesting really. They remain in a status quo for a very long time. The author just doesn't try and bring fourth interesting conflicts for them to develop alongside the story. It's like after he is done with their basic and initial characterization he just stops there. So they feel like very incomplete characters that have unharvested potential despite the length of the series. I really dislike Sanji. He is the worst crew member. No. He is the worst character in the entire show. No. He is the worst character I've ever seen in any shounen anime. There is bad, and there is offensively bad. Sanji belongs to the latter. His characterization, I don't exactly get what the author wanted here. Did he really want him to be a celebration of sexism? it's supposed to be chivalry but it goes beyond that, and enters the realm of sexism with Sanji. When he refuses to fights female characters even if the lives of his crew members depends on it. He is not supposed to be a comic relief character, so this isn't an excuse to how his character is written and presented. I don't see him as a classy womanizer, I see him as an offensive character who's love for women shouldn't be more than a comedic side to him. It shouldn't be a big part of his characterization. It came to the point where his comedic nose bleed became an actual plot point, I shit you not. It's like everything about him aside form his initial dream (that is never brought up as an actual point of relevance after his arc) is about women. And that's why he is that much worse than the other characters in the show. There is nothing redeeming about him (even his style of fighting is bleh) The story [5/10]. I didn't see something particular impressive about it. There are certain problems that is apparent in almost every arc. They are formulaic for the most part. The crew goes from an island to an island helping the inhabitants of said islands, and go on about their way. It feels like every arc is episodic and discontinued, with little things barely connecting them together to an overarching story. I didn't like that since I like continuity and for a premise such as this, I was more in favor of non-episodic storytelling. As it feels like padding, since you get introduced to a lot of characters that are in the end not important or even relevant outside of their perspective arc for the story or the main characters. Once in a while one of those characters make a surprise appearance and the fans get excited, feels a bit like tricking them from my point of view, especially with the characters that are supposed to be dead but are never shown exactly their death. The type of stories in each of these arc is more or less fundamentally the same. An evil oppressor (Arlong, Crocodile) does his evil ways in the island and controls it for his own objectives. The heroes (strawhat crews) became friendly and bond with the villagers, so they are asked to help them. Luffy takes on the big bad and the others take care of the henchmen. This type of scenario gets boring pretty fast. Especially when it in itself, without the repetition is dreadful and the bare bones of a hero vs villain narrative. In Alabasta, it almost feels like a Disney story, with the person asking for help being a princess. Villains in the series in general are evilly cartoon-ish. Another issue is the plot armor, and how almost nobody dies. 700 episodes and the death of important characters can be counted in one hand. Nothing wrong with keeping it light, but if that's the the intention then the characters shouldn't be facing that many near death experience and surviving through cartoon logic. It will really test your suspension of disbelief. Luffy for whatever reason almost always has to take the big bad of any arc, which adds to the formulaic nature of the arcs. There no logic behind it aside from Luffy being the protagonist. This negates the potential for more interesting conflicts or the chance for other crew members to get a bigger spotlight. Zoro's spotlight in Thriller Part is a fine example of how Luffy not hogging the spotlight for once was incredibly refreshing and most importantly great on it's own. The pacing [2/10]. This in particular is one of the biggest issues in the series. That overwhelming amount of episodes isn't like that just because of the great mass of content alone, but the almost snail pacing contributes to that greatly. Toei is the animation studio in charge of this adaption. It became infamous for this type of pacing and production. Intro in the beginning of each episode, recaps, a lot of paused shots, and overall just the mind numbing feeling that nothing of interest is happening for several minutes of an episode. This is definitely the biggest hindrance of enjoyment in the show, at least for me. But it's not all Toei's fault. The original source material also has a slow progression of events. Along with Toei's treatment, this makes for an unsatisfying watching experience. Which is one of the main reasons if not the biggest reason why I dropped the series above all else. Take in mind, that this isn't to say slow pacing is inherently bad, it actually can enhance the experience of certain works. But One Piece is definitely not one of those works. A balance would have been ideal, even if I have preferences for fast pacing in action shows. It's currently according to a lot of people unbearable, so it only gets worse. The action component of the series is, in my opinion just awful [3/10]. I personally consider the fights in One Piece to be the worst I've seen in any action shounen I've watched. Be it in terms of creativity, strategy, abilities/powers, excitement or animation. The abilities/powers are silly, while that works with the general style of the show, its still lacks creativity, as they feel like they are created by a child. A rubber man. Someone that can make anything into a door. Feet that generate fire from the passion of the heart, etc. I will get to the animation in it's own paragraph. The fights are sometimes really dumb, and are mostly devoid of strategy. The best you can get in terms of strategy, is juvenile tricks by Ussopp, and the silly 'tactics' Luffy comes up with, that shouldn't work but they do because of Luck or/and the incompetence of the villains (the classic trite of you are beneath me so I didn't take you seriously and was careless) . Shouting and straight forward predictable fighting, is what you will get. The tension created by how is this character going to best this character is simply not there. When Zoro gets beaten up badly by someone made of steel, but suddenly has the resolve and wants to believe he can cut steel, and he just does with no good explanations, you will know that you shouldn't expected anything smart out of the fights. In fact some are offensively dumb, Bon clay vs Sanji comes to mind. There is also how the comedy is inserted in some fights or certain scenes. I realize that show has a lot of comedy, and it's a prominent genre, but that doesn't mean it should be inserted whatever. With disregard of the current tone and atmosphere of the scene, a particular scene in thriller park had that. It undermines the importance of the fights sometimes and the mood that is being set, and it in itself is rarely funny. The humor in general is not great. As it's very repetitive and most often dry. How many times until Nami, yelling at the crew and showing her greed becomes just plain unfunny. Though maybe if you really like any particular gag, you will still like seeing it again and again (Zoro's bad sense of direction for example). So it depends on the individual's sense of humor. It wasn't until Alabasta that I found an episode to have legitimately funny scenes, so I came across more misses than hits. The Art and Animation, and OST [5/10]. I will be frank, I didn't really take much notice to the soundtrack so I can't comment on it. The artstyle of the series is often described as ''ugly'' by those who refuse or avoid to watch it. And I can't say that I blame them. Is the art different compared to similar shows? Yes. Does that automatically makes it better or good? not necessarily. The art is influenced by western cartoons and Disney. And it's fair point for those that think it's works well with the series, and I agree to a certain extent. But that still doesn't mean me or others will like it, as it's still very unappealing. It also has an apparent effect on the emotional scenes in the show. The facial expressions are so exaggerated that it disengaged me from whatever emotional scene I was watching. With big rainy eyes, and noses full of snot. It completely lacks subtlety. Bigger doesn't always mean better. It comes off as the show trying hard to emphasize just how sad what you are watching is. It can be ineffective and worse, counterproductive, when instead of feeling sorry and emotionally involved you feel like laughing because of the ridiculous faces. While I understand this is a long running anime therefore expecting fluid animation is unfair. It still should mean that at least once in a while you will be presented with good to great animation in important scenes and fights. Like with other long running battle anime. This unfortunately is not the case here. At times it feels like a slideshow. Barely any nice visual effects. Lot of pauses and staring. Still shots. No good Sakuga. And it only gets worse currently according to the fans. The Worldbuilding [5/10]. I left this at the last, because from my general understanding this is the most praised thing about the show. But why? from my point of view, there is nothing impressive about a city in the dessert or an island in the clouds/sky. Once again the creativity of the author seems child like. But maybe that's the appeal. The feeling of freedom, and childish imaginative without the shackles of reality. But it still doesn't necessarily make it great. It feels like it's praised because he created a vast world that is still expanding because why wouldn't he expand it, when the estimation for the number of chapters is beyond 1000. But then again, worldbuilding wasn't something that I cared for in general, in my favorite shows, or any work of fiction for that matter. I could appreciate well done aesthetics of a beautiful world, that you like to take a mental picture of. That's not the case here, so I can't really credit it. Ultimately, I truly and honestly wanted to like this. So the gigantic amount of episodes/chapters would become an advantage. I wanted to be immersed in a story and keep following it for years. But the series failed me, after giving it a fair enough chance. I stomached through the beginning since they said Arlong park where it will get good. I endured after that, when they said Skypiea is fun and worth it. I couldn't keep on hoping, when they said it's Water 7 this time, more than 200 episodes. I just gave up. There wasn't any pay off. Everything was standard average to below average, with few exceptions. Not special or distinctive to dislike or for this to become more than a disappointment. My enjoyment being hindered with the pacing, and lack of stimulating characters, I made the natural choice of dropping it. I just couldn't take another minute felt like I will just die from boredom. TL:DR- If you are hesitant whether or not to make this big time commitment, you should keep in mind that it's generally agreed upon by fans and haters alike that it doesn't get better until Arlong park, which more than 30 episodes into the anime. I would recommend this, if you are looking for a happy go lucky battle shounen, that has a lot of focus on the adventure. I don't recommend this, if you are looking for a continuous narrative of a complex story about finding a treasure, with interesting unique characters. Nothing of value is lost, or something worth the commitment if you are avoiding this. Which uses very similar language, terms and even similar ratings. There's something pretty ironic about it when you consider the reviewers :P |
"Let Justice Be Done!" My Theme Fight again, fight again for justice! |
Jul 17, 2015 1:44 PM
#3799
DrizzyXP said: "Two-dimensional" at least can be correct when you talk about relevant characters inside one franchise. You can at least make the argument that they are two-dimensional, even if they aren't. Not with "one-dimensional". If you know the least bit about a character's motivation, , objective, ideals backstory, or anything really, then he's no longer one-dimensional. Holy shit, someone that doesn't abuse the term. Surprising. I've thought a bit about Gilgimash from Fate series, and I really think he is one of the few major supporting character that fit the term. Like no matter how hard I thought about him, I litearlly could not come up with one thing about him that does not revolve around his arrogance. His motivations, dialogue, objectives, reasons, everything comes down to his arrogance and nothing more. |
Jul 17, 2015 1:47 PM
#3800
RedRoseFring said: 8animet said: Agafin said: Why do people dislike Obito again? I don't see how Aizen is better than him in anything except maybe charisma. He started a war where thousands died because of a girl (who had a childhood crush on), just silly The moment the mask came off the interesting and mencaing Tobi was replaced with a lame whiner You phrased it in a pretty similar way to how I said it (check the spoiler): Starting a war with the entire world and killing former loved ones because a love interest (who didn't even love him back) died and whining about it all the time. Didn't read that but you are definitely right Obito should have stayed dead as far as I'm concerned (or at least not be the Big Bad) |
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