Do you think religion is holding back technological advances? How far advanced do you think we'd be if religion didn't exist?

Immahnoob said:
You have the historical fact that they:
1. Burned books.
2. Kept books.

Immahnoob said:
Religion is irrational by definition, I'm sorry Lupadim, but you can't win.

lupadim said:
Look at the strawman arguments.

lupadim said:
he church saved way more books than it destroyed

lupadim said:
Wrong again. I am not even amused this time, this is probably one of the threads where your arguments were the weakest (but they were never strong in general, so yeah, your situation in this thread is pretty bad)

merriam-webster said:
a : the state of a religious <a nun in her 20th year of religion>
b (1) : the service and worship of God or the supernatural (2) : commitment or devotion to religious faith or observance
2
: a personal set or institutionalized system of religious attitudes, beliefs, and practices
3
archaic : scrupulous conformity : conscientiousness
4
: a cause, principle, or system of beliefs held to with ardor and faith

Immahnoob said:

Beliefs, faith, supernatural.
None of these have to do with reason.

Coolspot said:
Some religions motivated people to try and figure out how things work, gave them a purpose to pursue some goals. I think it motivated some scientists.

Immahnoob said:
My real stance is that of "There is no god, period." but a weak atheist claims that "You can't prove god so I lack any belief.", people should follow that formula.

As we don't know there's no god, we have no proof, but the one's claiming such should provide proof or we automatically deem the argument invalid. That's why theists can't win when it comes to any type of god, because if there is a god or similar, we don't know how it is so how can we possibly define it?

So one can have no religion and still believe there might be creatures above us in some part of the universe that we did not yet see, "might" is the keyword.

Immahnoob said:
snip

lupadim said:
Humans are able to have faith and belief, and there is one more interesting fact with that: Humans are rational.

Immahnoob said:
Except for a few scientists that did not go against religion, what else do you have? You still haven't answered the issue with the books either.

lupadim said:
No matter how many times you claim victory, you'll only be fooling yourself. The worst liar is the liar that believes in his/her own lie. You are a bad liar.

lupadim said:
Then why don't you start listing scientists that were oppressed during the dark age?

militrix said:
tesla's projects financiers cut their funds when they discovered he was trying to discover a way to gather electricity freely from the air

"but without wires, how are we gonna make them pay to us?" they said

being such a genius, tesla would have found the way to do it almost undoubtedly, had he received the funds
so as you can see, religion doesn't hold back technological advances, people in general do, regardless of what they call their reason, religion, economy, greed

faith and spirituality don't hold back technological advances, people who want to have the control do, religion is just a system of control that uses the spiritual side of people to control them by polluting it with fear and guilt

lupadim said:
neckbeard fedora-tipping Internet atheists (like you, Immahnoob) have

JonyJC said:
Men precedes religion, the same mechanisms that built religion builds similarly dogmatic institutions, that is the current scientific paradigm. Write a paper in in England contradicting the big bang and you'll never find a place in western academia ever again.

dity said:
lol, religious groups hold different beliefs and don't believe in things like evolution but they're in no way holding back science - at all. they're not denying funding for research (they have no way to do so), killing scientists, or even blocking education. heck they're struggling to keep creationism alongside evolution within the classrooms of public schools.

i can google evolution right now and no pope is gonna come in my room and slap that mouse

katsucats said:
lol racist groups hold different beliefs and don't believe in things like integration but they're in no way holding civil rights back - at all. they're not denying funding for civil rights groups (they have no way to do so), killing minorities, or even blocking education. heck they're struggling to keep ideas of racial separation alongside assimilation within the public sphere.

i can google interracial sex right now and no KKK is gonna come in my room and lynch me.

lupadim said:
Except for racist groups ARE killing minorities, blocking education and oppressing those "minorities".

katsucats said:
Write a paper falsifying evidence, coming up with false or irrelevant conclusions, or with inadequate experimental methodology, and you'll never find a place in Western academia ever again. Write a scientifically sound paper that contradicts the Big Bang, then you'd be a scientific frontier and maybe win the Nobel prize.

JonyJC said:

Science and scientists are not infallible, if they are stuck in a paradigm no matter how much sense you make no one will take your research seriously.
If your research disproved man made climate warming a few years ago it would have been dismissed because scientists were too busy adulterating results and everyone would have laughed at you, now the news are coming out that it was all a bunch of bollocks.

JonyJC said:
You cannot prove or disprove anything if people won't even look at your research.

JonyJC said:
You cannot prove or disprove anything if people won't even look at your research.

JonyJC said:
Again the point is missed, keep worshiping your science guys.

emobuttercup said:
I think it is. There's so much we can learn from genetic engineering and cloning, but because so many believe it's "playing God" and we shouldn't raise ourselves to his level, we shouldn't be allowed to research it, so it gets outlawed.
Not to mention how many years ago, it was against the law to study astronomy because so many feared that it would disprove the fact that the sun doesn't revolve around the Earth.

lupadim said:
Except for racist groups ARE killing minorities, blocking education and oppressing those "minorities".

katsucats said:
[spoiler]

dity said:
it's alright, he did commit a major false equivalence between two verrry different topics in the current day. he didnt really show how i failed logic just that it cant be applied to the topic of racism - which is true, that subject's pretty up front these days.

militrix said:
Air France flight 447 in 2009 killed 228 when it crashed. The plane lost control due to flight speed inconsistencies from its measurements being obscured by ice crystals. However, if we had paid attention to the possibility and engineered the plane with this in mind, then the plane likely would not have crashed.
So as you can see, terrorists don't really kill people, people just die in general, whether it's a plane crash or by cancer.

militrix said:
lol i didn't say religion didn't hold technical advance, i just said faith and spirituality don't by themselves,

militrix said:
so as you can see, religion doesn't hold back technological advances

militrix said:
it's religious organizations using them for their benefit and those organizations are just people doing what they do, it's not like religion is a thing that has it's own will.

militrix said:
faith won't make you give money to a church just like love doesn't make you be a materialistic idiot because that's not what love is about, but that's not going to stop companies from using love in their advantage by polluting it with guilt and make me feel like a jerk if i don't buy a crappy teddy bear for my girlfriend tomorrow or make you buy the shiniest engagement ring

militrix said:
religious organizations do the exact same thing but on a much bigger scale

love doesn't make you buy crappy st valentine's cards, faith doesn't make you obey the pope, people and their organizations do it, and they twist diverse aspects of the human being to do it

but don't worry, if there weren't religion there would still be terrorist to crash those planes and they would kill each other over who has a bigger dick or whatever, if it weren't religion it would be the same thing with a different name and theme (who has the perfect science, the perfect race, the perfect faith, the perfect rightness, whatever), it's not people killing each other because of faith, it's people acting like people and being controlled by other people, but if you want to blame spirituality or even just religion (like if it were a thing with a will of it's own) as the root of all evil like if the world were going to become a better place without it just because you want to have it easy and have something to blame, nobody is going to stop you because i doubt anybody really cares about you having a narrow mind

spirituality is a part of being human and it can't dissapear, but if religion ever dissapears then another control system would just appear to take it's place

katsucats said:
(*see bold)

katsucats said:

Yeah, terrorism is perfectly fine in this world. It's not like terrorism is a thing that has its own will, it's the terrorists using them for their own benefit... You see, in fact, analogies are the best and only way for you to understand this. If you thought what I just said sounds absurd, then maybe you'd realize how absurd you are, once you learn how logic works. As a child, when you heard, "Roses are red, as violets are blue," did you go, "Huh? Violets aren't roses!" If so, you are going to do poorly on the SAT.

katsucats said:

See, if religion isn't a thing, then how does a person's faith support your argument?

katsucats said:

Faith in God, in the Catholic church, in the threat of heaven and hell, does make you obey the Pope, unless you were not only dumb enough to have faith, but dumb enough to contradict your beliefs that you will go to hell if you don't follow through. Faith that there's a cliff in front of you makes you stop walking, doesn't it? Faith in Valentine's gift cards, of course, doesn't make you obey the Pope. That's a fallacy, because it's completely irrelevant.