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Mar 11, 2024 11:09 AM
#1

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May 2023
264
You might've noticed that the thread someone made about Andrew Tate got locked today for not encouraging discussion. I thought that this was a bit odd given that the thread got more responses than any other thread on CD in the past week, and a lot of those responses were back-and-forth discussion between different users. So, what exactly counts as discussion and how do you encourage it? I need to know!
Mar 11, 2024 11:12 AM
#2

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Aug 2014
4712
By finding a way to make a thread that doesn't violate some dumb rule, basically. Or just talk about a general topic.

I think many of the rules implemented on this site are only there to cater to advertisers rather than serving the end user.
Mar 11, 2024 11:20 AM
#3

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Oct 2009
564
Honestly, I think rules are applied depending on the whims of the moderator. There seems to be no consistency and the issue stems from the fact the rule is too broad. You can argue almost anything doesn't encourage discussion. You also got to remember that the "doesn't encourage discussion" rule also has its other sibling "topic is too controversial".

You can use either rule to essentially lock every thread as if there is not enough serious discussion you use the first rule and if the discussion is too "spirited" then you can close due to controversy. Nothing wrong with the decision-making process as in both instances the rules are being applied correctly. The issue is the laws are too loose and are therefore open to abuse.

To answer your question, nearly all threads in the casual board could be closed under the does not promote discussion rule as casual discussions by their very nature do not promote serious discussion. If you really want to hammer down on the law then we should lock the entire casual discussion board. But that is crazy, even for MAL so for better or worse we are at the mercy of the moderator's team discretion.
Mar 11, 2024 11:30 AM
#4

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Sep 2016
11715
It got locked because talking about social media members is forbidden, the "not encouraging discussion" is just a misused label in this case.
ZarutakuMar 11, 2024 11:34 AM
DesuMaiden said:
Nobody resembles me physically because I don't even physically exist.
Mar 11, 2024 12:32 PM
#5

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Dec 2015
8506
Hmmm a discussion is held by 2 or more people IRL or internet and for that is needed a subject, according to Wikipedia there are 4 types of subject which are the case for a proper discussion:
Subjective Idea, Objective Facts, Ohter People, Oneself.
If you want a polite discussion the subject should not include a topic which is associated with high risk of being controversial ex. theology beind discussed.

Now as I ain't finding an answer on how to encourage through stuff I am reading, gonna ask GPT [gonna shorten it and add my own stuff aswell]:

You need to begin a conversation and create a topic which should feel comfortable for everyone to express their ideas and thoughts about, there are 10 "strategies" listed from GPT to follow for a proper discussion:
Active Listening/Reading, Open-Ended Questions, Create a Safe Place [Everyone should be respected in nutshell], Acknowledge diverse viewpoints, Facilitate active participation, Stay neutral [not dominating others/forcing others to your view], Encourage brainstorming, Provide structure, Use icebreakers, Follow up.

Even tho in a perspective of a discussion talking about other people is a proper subject, it isn't in terms of mal rules.
Mar 11, 2024 9:43 PM
#6

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Dec 2016
7014
With violence. Perseverance is my number one attribute.

Mar 12, 2024 10:02 AM
#7

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Jan 2009
102094
the rules are too broad and vague, any thread can be considered not encouraging meaningful discussion or controversial and kaykimi with her overactive moderation is not helping either
Mar 12, 2024 11:52 AM
#8

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Aug 2019
590
everything on this forum can be controversial. Even saying that everything on this forum can be controversial is controversial.
Mar 12, 2024 3:33 PM
#9

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Jul 2023
175
Reply to Taiyaa
everything on this forum can be controversial. Even saying that everything on this forum can be controversial is controversial.
@Taiyaa
That's a rather controversial position to assume.
Mar 12, 2024 3:46 PM

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Sep 2016
11715
Reply to Longnines
@Taiyaa
That's a rather controversial position to assume.
@Longnines It's controversial to assume that position is controversial.
DesuMaiden said:
Nobody resembles me physically because I don't even physically exist.
Mar 13, 2024 4:01 AM
Call me Oniichan

Offline
Jan 2007
1958
"Not encouraging discussion" is just an excuse for the jannies to lock your thread if they don't like you.
Those topics that get locked usually get quite a lot of responses, so by nature they "encourage discussion".
Mar 13, 2024 6:49 AM

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Mar 2008
50199
Inb4 thread locked for not encouraging discussion and being controversial. Though im actually fine on the rule against topics revolving around internet "personalities", this isnt kiwi farms or twitter

I have a decent idea of what needs to change for MAL to function like a proper community again but no power to change it.
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Mar 13, 2024 7:19 AM

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Sep 2016
11715
Reply to traed
Inb4 thread locked for not encouraging discussion and being controversial. Though im actually fine on the rule against topics revolving around internet "personalities", this isnt kiwi farms or twitter

I have a decent idea of what needs to change for MAL to function like a proper community again but no power to change it.
@traed Please share this decent idea with us, we are curious.
DesuMaiden said:
Nobody resembles me physically because I don't even physically exist.
Mar 13, 2024 8:47 AM

Offline
Mar 2008
50199
Reply to Zarutaku
@traed Please share this decent idea with us, we are curious.
@Zarutaku
I have been for years lol For one thing i have been trying to get a user controlled blacklist so users can basically self moderate similar to how they can ignore and block users. Beyond that just having the rules more lax to allow actual discussion and just focus on users being jerks as more a priority, i have a rough idea what this should be like but it is too much to go into detail without it being a waste of time knowing nothing will happen. I also have been looking into anti bot measures. There also needs to be a change to how the anime and manga series topics are displayed so users can more easily find them.
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Mar 13, 2024 9:04 AM

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Sep 2016
11715
traed said:
I have been for years lol For one thing i have been trying to get a user controlled blacklist so users can basically self moderate similar to how they can ignore and block users.
I don't quite understand, what's the difference between user controlled blacklist and ignore list?

traed said:
Beyond that just having the rules more lax to allow actual discussion and just focus on users being jerks as more a priority
Laxing the rules yes but the 2nd parts sounds like a very dangerous idea that could end up in highly subjective arbitrary punishments like it already happens in many subreddits.
ZarutakuMar 13, 2024 9:07 AM
DesuMaiden said:
Nobody resembles me physically because I don't even physically exist.
Mar 13, 2024 9:05 AM

Offline
Aug 2014
4712
traed said:
I have been for years lol For one thing i have been trying to get a user controlled blacklist so users can basically self moderate similar to how they can ignore and block users.

Wait...you mean if enough users dislike someone, that would ban them from the site? If so, that is a terrifyingly bad idea. XD
Mar 13, 2024 9:54 AM

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Mar 2008
50199
Zarutaku said:
I don't quite understand, what's the difference between user controlled blacklist and ignore list?

Ignore list hides a user's posts. A blacklist i have suggested isnt about specific users just something that can be more widely used.

Zarutaku said:
Laxing the rules yes but the 2nd parts sounds like a very dangerous idea that could end up in highly subjective arbitrary punishments like it already happens in many subreddits.

Not really. I mean when it's obvious abusive behaviour not someone just joking with a friend. Im not even talking adding a rule, its stuff that was always enforced anyway.

SmugSatoko said:
Wait...you mean if enough users dislike someone, that would ban them from the site? If so, that is a terrifyingly bad idea. XD

Not even close. I detailed this in the suggestions board. It just means you can list out words and phrases that will automatically hide thread topics and posts containing it. It can be used against spoilers, against curse words someone doesnt like, against topics someone doesn't like etc. It would reduce the number of users complaining about so and so topic being discussed and people just trashing on others for liking this and that or hating this and that. This allows more topics to be discussed without as many people complaining since the power to just not read it is more easily placed in their hands. Of course they have to be wise with how they use it to not accidentally hide something they would be interested in.
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Mar 13, 2024 9:57 AM

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Aug 2014
4712
traed said:
Not even close. I detailed this in the suggestions board. It just means you can list out words and phrases that will automatically hide thread topics and posts containing it. It can be used against spoilers, against curse words someone doesnt like, against topics someone doesn't like etc. It would reduce the number of users complaining about so and so topic being discussed and people just trashing on others for liking this and that or hating this and that. This allows more topics to be discussed without as many people complaining since the power to just not read it is more easily placed in their hands.

I see. Blacklist isn't the best term for it, then. I guess that could be effective for those who value circle-jerk safe spaces. I'd avoid it like the plague, personally.
Mar 13, 2024 10:00 AM

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Mar 2008
50199
SmugSatoko said:
I see. Blacklist isn't the best term for it, then. I guess that could be effective for those who value circle-jerk safe spaces. I'd avoid it like the plague, personally.

Well there is more uses than just that. I call it a blacklist since it is blacklisting words and phrases for the user and ive seen scripts in past that do this that also called it a blacklist. Unrelated to the blacklist that auto bans users.... i got auto banned four times over past few years so I know how terrible that system is.
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Mar 13, 2024 12:35 PM

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Jun 2014
246
I mean, it's not like Andrew Tate is the only topic to discuss or the best one. As quoted from the great I don't know who, "Great Minds Discuss Ideas. Average Minds Discuss Events. Small Minds Discuss People."



....



Mar 14, 2024 2:26 AM

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Mar 2019
1268
what can I say? MAL mods have always hated the fun threads, I hate to be the guy to say it but controversy is what makes for the best discussions really. It's usually discussions like that I find lead to the most interesting banter or discussion, intelligent or not. It's a shame really. Especially considering it's topics like those that people actually want to engage with since just about anyone has an opinion on them.

Hate and discrimination are different things altogether. Obviously hate speech or a thread where that would get thrown around (Ie. HiTlEr DiD NoThInG WrOnG esque threads) but lets be real, talking about Andrew Tate is hardly going to offend anyone especially since his brand of content is saying outlandish things (I think you'd have to agree on that even if you did like him).

Anyway, to answer your question (TL;DR ig) idk dude, mods be trippin.
Mar 14, 2024 5:56 AM
♡( •ॢ◡-ॢ)✧˖° ♡

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Dec 2014
20637
Currently it's not that hard, just make a thread about either praising or trashtalking Frieren or compare it with other anime, and voila your thread is popular



(っ◔◡◔)っ 𝓘 𝔀𝓲𝓼𝓱 𝔂𝓸𝓾 𝓪𝓵𝓵 𝓱𝓪𝓿𝓮 𝓪 𝔀𝓸𝓷𝓭𝓮𝓻𝓯𝓾𝓵 𝓭𝓪𝔂 ♥
Jan 5, 6:06 PM

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Jun 2019
6753
Just saw another thread topic in the Anime Discussion sub-forum locked today on these spurious grounds. One more in a long series as this has continued unabated, both long before and since this thread was initially created early last year. And it's just sad at this point.

It would be nice if something could ever actually change in this respect and be done about this. It's such an unjustified lame excuse and baseless grounds to lock a thread and in so doing, actively disrupt, impede, and shut down others' discussions which those using it to justify locking threads are wrongly and falsely claiming aren't occurring.

Even a one-eyed person with functioning visual cortex can see discussion is occurring in these threads. There is a topic written about by the OP. Other users chime in, sharing their own thoughts and opinions, agreeing or disagreeing with said OP or neither and offering an alternative perspective completely. That is a discussion by definition. It's such a disgrace and a stain on MAL to have open lying (claiming a discussion isn't occurring where it factually is) baked into one of the rules, or the way it's routinely utilized.
WatchTillTandavaJan 5, 6:10 PM
Yesterday, 5:13 AM

Online
Jul 2013
6832
Well, discussions are actually very easy to encourage. Just post a random topic. And people will likely reply to it.

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It’s time to ditch the text file.
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