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Jun 19, 2012 12:24 AM

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Okay, I never really cared that Madhouse decided to animate HxH again. I was like... WHY AM I WATCHING THIS AGAIN? The first anime was perfectly fine. Until this episode. Yep.

DAT ANIMATION.

I cannot wait for the next arc. If only every week would come by more quickly.

By the way, I'm too lazy to quote anything but the comment about Gon not beating Hisoka. I think you should just stop now. You aren't going to see a 12 year old beat up experienced nen users with 4 months of practice. Just stick to Bleach.
Jun 19, 2012 2:52 AM

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vansonbee said:
My favorite Pedo character so far in anime history ^

This is what stood out for me in this ep' - didn't think the anime would go there, but they went there!

Jun 19, 2012 8:15 AM
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REN SPECIAL ART: LIGHT CROTCH
loved this episode. cant wait for the next
Jun 19, 2012 9:26 AM

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I gave it a 5...

I just wish that it was just a little slower in plot development... more episodes for character development. You don't chug a glass of fine wine, do you?

I don't! Gotta love it!
Jun 19, 2012 4:13 PM

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Chibi_Ubu said:
I gave it a 5...

I just wish that it was just a little slower in plot development... more episodes for character development. You don't chug a glass of fine wine, do you?

I don't! Gotta love it!


Hunter X Hunter (1999) would like to have a word with you.

It's better than 2011 in every way except for graphic quality, in my opinion ofc.
Jun 19, 2012 5:32 PM
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flaxman85 said:
Chibi_Ubu said:
I gave it a 5...

I just wish that it was just a little slower in plot development... more episodes for character development. You don't chug a glass of fine wine, do you?

I don't! Gotta love it!
Hunter X Hunter (1999) would like to have a word with you.

It's better than 2011 in every way except for graphic quality, in my opinion ofc.

*sigh* Guys, you've been watching HxH for 30+ episodes already. Haven't it become obvious to you that the "character development" you're looking for comes hand in hand with the "plot development"? As the story progresses, we gradually learn more of the characters and what makes them tick through how they think and act on situations.

Hunter x Hunter is not like any other typical shounen that for you to understand a character (his personality/motives), they tell you their lifestory. Togashi employs the "show" not the "tell".

Togashi actually made his stance on the flashback / tragic past trope prevalent on shounen series through Hisoka - he doesn't care about the past because the past doesn't interest him.

The 1999 series though just did the "telling" (establishing the characters) right from the start w/c created problems down the line.

---

On a happy note, I love this episode because THAT ANIMATION and Hisoka's pedo vibes was included. I was sure it wouldn't be included so I was really surprised.
Jun 19, 2012 5:42 PM

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The 1999 series though just did the "telling" (establishing the characters) right from the start w/c created problems down the line.

And under the assumption we have free will and different opinions, just because one version is closer to Togashi's vision doesn't mean any person here has to like or prefer that version.

The 1999 created no problems down the line.

Jun 19, 2012 7:58 PM

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Anime_Name said:
The 1999 created no problems down the line.


Funniest comment i read all week. Keep em coming.
Jun 19, 2012 8:21 PM

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LOL 1999 created no problems....

The 1999 series added extra continents to world map that don't exist and contradict the manga.


The real world map (for new fans don't click) Major spoiler below
v
NJZanDatsuJun 19, 2012 8:33 PM
Jun 19, 2012 9:05 PM

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noonealive said:
Anime_Name said:
The 1999 created no problems down the line.


Funniest comment i read all week. Keep em coming.


Funny thing is the lack of problems being cited.

The 1999 series added extra continents to world map that don't exist and contradict the manga.

Other than not being what Togashi drew or not being how it is in the manga, what is the problem created by the 1999 world map?

Jun 19, 2012 10:09 PM

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Yup, it's official. Hisoka's a pedophile.
And what's up with that "Shwing" thing? Hes so freaking nasty :S
Jun 20, 2012 12:17 AM

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Anime_Name said:
The 1999 series though just did the "telling" (establishing the characters) right from the start w/c created problems down the line.

And under the assumption we have free will and different opinions, just because one version is closer to Togashi's vision doesn't mean any person here has to like or prefer that version.

The 1999 created no problems down the line.


Lol no.
Jun 20, 2012 12:44 AM

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bleachjoj said:


Lol no.


The 1999 series lasted until Greed Island and had no "problems" because how the story was adapted.

All I ask is for you people to learn the difference from there being a problem vs it not being how Togashi did it in the manga.

Jun 20, 2012 2:17 AM
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fanimanga said:
[*sigh* Guys, you've been watching HxH for 30+ episodes already. Haven't it become obvious to you that the "character development" you're looking for comes hand in hand with the "plot development"? As the story progresses, we gradually learn more of the characters and what makes them tick through how they think and act on situations.

Hunter x Hunter is not like any other typical shounen that for you to understand a character (his personality/motives), they tell you their lifestory. Togashi employs the "show" not the "tell".

Togashi actually made his stance on the flashback / tragic past trope prevalent on shounen series through Hisoka - he doesn't care about the past because the past doesn't interest him.


One of the reasons why Kubo and Mashima are such terrible writers. They seem to be convinced that a character is fully developed when they create a stupid background story that is usually complete irrelevant with how they act.
Jun 20, 2012 2:59 AM
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Anime_Name said:
bleachjoj said:


Lol no.


The 1999 series lasted until Greed Island and had no "problems" because how the story was adapted.

All I ask is for you people to learn the difference from there being a problem vs it not being how Togashi did it in the manga.


But it is a problem because now fans who have watched the 1999 series and not read the manga think the older series is absolutely faithful. They criticise the 2011 series for altering things, when really it has tried to stay more closely to the manga.

Sure there's nothing wrong with someone preferring the 1999 series, that's perfectly fine. However, I think it changed too many things from the manga and made me appreciate it less. Changes in characterisations of killua, gon, kurapika, changing mito's relation to ging, altering order of events and that god awful illumi vs gon fight are all things that really irked me and did create problems down the line.

You are entitled to your opinion but it's hard for me to understand how you can't see these problems in the 1999 anime.
Jun 20, 2012 9:17 AM

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brigid001 said:
Anime_Name said:
bleachjoj said:


Lol no.


The 1999 series lasted until Greed Island and had no "problems" because how the story was adapted.

All I ask is for you people to learn the difference from there being a problem vs it not being how Togashi did it in the manga.


But it is a problem because now fans who have watched the 1999 series and not read the manga think the older series is absolutely faithful. They criticise the 2011 series for altering things, when really it has tried to stay more closely to the manga.


As an anime and manga fan I find that anime viewers are pretty adept at finding disparities between manga and anime. Why do you think HxH fans any more less able to check out the manga than OP, Bleach, Reborn, or any other adaptation fans?
People critizing the 2011 series because it doesn't do some of the things only found in the 1999 series is not a problem the 1999 series caused. There's a thing called personal preference that causes people to have different opinions. FMA had a more emotional Nina arc than the manga and Bortherhood but it's not FMA's fault that some people preferred how the first series expanded on Nina.

If I were to use your logic then the new series is the one causing the problems because it is causing the fans(new and old) to pick sides and quarrel about unimportant things like whether a picture has an extra continent on it even though NO BODY goes to the continent and all the other continents are unchanged.


Sure there's nothing wrong with someone preferring the 1999 series, that's perfectly fine.[/quote}
You say that here but your only complaint was that people preferred the 1999 series.

However, I think it changed too many things from the manga and made me appreciate it less.

That's irrelevant. You're just trading one opinion for another and only like read opinions like that more because you agree with it.


Changes in characterisations of killua, gon, kurapika, changing mito's relation to ging, altering order of events and that god awful illumi vs gon fight are all things that really irked me and did create problems down the line.

The anime used a different relationship for Mito, what problem did it create? The character is still basically the same. First cousin or aunt, Gon still regards her as his mom.

You are entitled to your opinion but it's hard for me to understand how you can't see these problems in the 1999 anime.

It's quiet simple really. People like you are turning insignificant differences that at no point in time interfered with the storytelling of the anime or manga and acting as if being different is enough to cause problems.

Jun 20, 2012 1:00 PM

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Anime_Name said:
Funny thing is the lack of problems being cited.


Problem is i don't need to. An anime adaptation that doesn't follow the manga to a certain extent causes problems down the line. Like i told you before Gon's Mom has a grave on whale island in the adaptation. Manga no such thing occurred. Hence problems down the line.


Hence why your comment was the funniest one i read.
noonealiveJun 20, 2012 5:10 PM
Jun 20, 2012 6:12 PM
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Anime_Name said:
The 1999 created no problems down the line.

Funny thing is the lack of problems being cited.

All I ask is for you people to learn the difference from there being a problem vs it not being how Togashi did it in the manga.
Then all I ask you is actually think it over w/o your obvious bias to the 1999 series getting in the way.

Gon from the first 3-4 episodes in the 1999 series was established as a mature (man-child) and good (against killing) kid. But then whenever he and Killua are together, his "maturity" completely vanishes and he revert to an "innocent" child so that Killua CAN be the "mature" one.

His "goodness" was thrown out the window when he allowed Hisoka to kill 2 applicants in the 4th exam phase in order for him to get his tag. In short, he sacrificed 2 people for his selfish reason. Where is his "goodness" now?

As for Killua, the minute we were introduce to him, he was established as Hiei version 2 (YYH). He's standoffish, quiet, serious and doesn't know the word "friend" (or what it means). Then he and Gon had a talk on the blimp and Killua mentioned that "he's charming because people can never tell if he's joking or serious".

That's odd. All his appearances prior to that talk was him being Hiei ver 2. What part did he made jokes, do funny stuff or even be happy?

And then when we got to the Zoldyck mansion mini-arc, we learned that when he was young, he tried to befriend the new staff (Kanaria/Canary). Wait, back up. Is this the same guy or was he swapped with someone else? Oh, he must have drop his head REALLY HARD that his personality completely changed.

I will skip Kurapika since the problem with his "emo" personality changed hasn't been animated yet on the new series.

If Furuhashi (99 series director) got the balls to change the characters Togashi created, he should have gotten ALL THE WAY and change events that SUITED the characters he established. Because of his half-assed changes - mashing his OWN characters with Togashi's plot - not only it created characterization inconsistencies but also plot holes/inconsistencies as well. Hence, the "problems down the line".

Anime_Name said:
If I were to use your logic then the new series is the one causing the problems because it is causing the fans(new and old) to pick sides and quarrel about unimportant things...
If you recall, it's the 99 fans who started their campaign against the 2011 series first. Most (long-time) manga fans went out of "hiding/lurking" after about 20 or so episodes have been aired and we still see/read the "they changed it, now it sucks" complaints from the 99 fans.

Don't go blaming the new series for "causing the rift" between the fans. Backtracking on this site's forum alone can tell you who started the rift.
fanimangaJun 20, 2012 6:52 PM
Jun 21, 2012 6:45 AM
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Fucking


EPIC
Jun 21, 2012 11:59 AM

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noonealive said:
Anime_Name said:
Funny thing is the lack of problems being cited.


Problem is i don't need to. An anime adaptation that doesn't follow the manga to a certain extent causes problems down the line. Like i told you before Gon's Mom has a grave on whale island in the adaptation. Manga no such thing occurred. Hence problems down the line.


Hence why your comment was the funniest one i read.


The wording was "created" problems down the line and such an assessment requires proof of what problems were "created". Seeing as it wasn't your statement you don't need to support it but latching onto it and doing a useless +1 post does nothing.

The game in the 1999 is a disparity and one that could be a problem, if and only if, Gon's mom ever makes an appearance in the manga.

Gon from the first 3-4 episodes in the 1999 series was established as a mature (man-child) and good (against killing) kid. But then whenever he and Killua are together, his "maturity" completely vanishes and he revert to an "innocent" child so that Killua CAN be the "mature" one.

He was not established as such and over the course of the anime(the parts that COMPLETELY matched the manga) it depicted Gon as not bing averse to killing and that he understood how necessary killing may be. The whole accepting Killua as a friend and not flinching about his family is a little hint that Gon isn't terribly moral. Even if any of the anime only characterizations were wrong they self-corrected by following the manga in other parts of the manga.

In fact all of you problem characterizations need for a person who watched the 1999 series to have stopped watching it at the point a difference occur so that they don't see the times where the 1999 series follows the manga. Since the 1999 series also had plenty(it had more similarities than differences) of similarites the characterizations are not that different, there will be some "anime only" tidbits out there because that's what happens when stores get adapted but merely having differences does not call for the type of reaction you are putting forth.

If Furuhashi (99 series director) got the balls to change the characters Togashi created, he should have gotten ALL THE WAY and change events that SUITED the characters he established.

Are you blind and ignorant to what anime does to manga ALL THE TIME? Togashi is not god, it doesn't take balls for a director to change somethings from the manga. All it takes is the the brains to understand that anime is a different medium and as such some concessions and creative differences will occur. Proof? Try looking at other big name shounen anime; Dragon Ball, One Piece, Bleach, Detective Conan, etc. The list goes on and Togashi is not going to be an exception. The only issue is the degree that which you react to said differences.

Don't go blaming the new series for "causing the rift" between the fans. Backtracking on this site's forum alone can tell you who started the rift.

Reading comprehension isn't your strong suit. I said "If" and that statement was created to provide a contrast to how someone was using the fan reaction to the 2011 series has being a problem the 1999 caused. The conclusion on what's to blame was illogical.

Jun 21, 2012 2:09 PM

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Like talking to a brick wall.
Jun 21, 2012 2:13 PM

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bleachjoj said:
Like talking to a brick wall.

Oh look another one-liner that is more of an ad hominem than a defense or support of anything that's open for discussion.

Jun 21, 2012 2:28 PM

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This arc shits on the 1999 version guys. IMHO...the H stands for holy.
End Zionazism
Jun 21, 2012 3:29 PM

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Anime_Name said:
bleachjoj said:
Like talking to a brick wall.

Oh look another one-liner that is more of an ad hominem than a defense or support of anything that's open for discussion.


I've presented my argument multiply times and so have others. But you ignored them.
Jun 21, 2012 5:31 PM

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Anime_Name said:
The wording was "created" problems down the line and such an assessment requires proof of what problems were "created". Seeing as it wasn't your statement you don't need to support it but latching onto it and doing a useless +1 post does nothing.

The game in the 1999 is a disparity and one that could be a problem, if and only if, Gon's mom ever makes an appearance in the manga.


It does not matter if she appears or not. Gon was dropped off to Mito by his Dad(Mito and Ging are related). Gon's real mom is not comfirmed dead.
The 1999 plays it off as Gon was born and raised on whale island by his Aunt Mito with a dead mom's burial site. This deviates from the manga completely. How is changing ones back story (especially the main character) not "create" problems down the road?
Jun 21, 2012 5:57 PM

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bleachjoj said:
Anime_Name said:
bleachjoj said:
Like talking to a brick wall.

Oh look another one-liner that is more of an ad hominem than a defense or support of anything that's open for discussion.


I've presented my argument multiply times and so have others. But you ignored them.


"lol no" is an argument now?
I addressed just about everyone that quoted me. That's hardly "ignoring" but I guessing not agreeing is the new ignoring for this generation.

It does not matter if she appears or not. Gon was dropped off to Mito by his Dad(Mito and Ging are related). Gon's real mom is not comfirmed dead.


Since the word used was "created" then that means a problem exists not that a possible problem could arise.

The 1999 plays it off as Gon was born and raised on whale island by his Aunt Mito with a dead mom's burial site. This deviates from the manga completely. How is changing ones back story (especially the main character) not "create" problems down the road?

How hard is this to understand? IF she never makes an appearance or IF she gets confirmed to be dead then there isn't a problem. The problem only happens IF she is confirmed alive in the manga. The topic has yet to be handled in the manga, so unless you know what Togashi is going to do then you can conclude that a problem was created.

So if we worded it as creating a possible problem down the road I would agree, and then it would be dependent on how his mom is introduced. If it's written that they thought she was dead having an honorary burial is hardly out of place or problematic.

Seeing as Togashi hasn't really touched on it he very well could take a page from the previous anime and just go with her being dead. If anything this complaint is a prime example of the Schrodinger's cat theory. Since you can't prove either either both remain valid states.

Jun 21, 2012 7:44 PM

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another great ep, cant wait for the next one. SCHWING! lol, that made me laugh so hard.
Jun 22, 2012 7:21 AM

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Mikasa said:
This arc shits on the 1999 version guys. IMHO...the H stands for holy.

This ac isn't even that good to begin with, not even in manga. So no big deal.
Jun 22, 2012 9:46 AM
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coldwave said:
Mikasa said:
This arc shits on the 1999 version guys. IMHO...the H stands for holy.

This ac isn't even that good to begin with, not even in manga. So no big deal.
Yea, it's the most boring arc in HxH, but well there's always an arc where they explain something (Nen in HxH's case), which is a prelude for a great serie or a great arc that's gonna come next.
Candor123Jun 22, 2012 9:51 AM
Jun 22, 2012 11:15 AM
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noonealive said:
It does not matter if she appears or not. Gon was dropped off to Mito by his Dad(Mito and Ging are related). Gon's real mom is not comfirmed dead.
The 1999 plays it off as Gon was born and raised on whale island by his Aunt Mito with a dead mom's burial site. This deviates from the manga completely. How is changing ones back story (especially the main character) not "create" problems down the road?


I watched 99 version before reading the manga and was not bothered by the changes. So apparently they´re not that bad. So no, that´s not a problem.

In fact, I´d rather have some minor changes, than the shit I had to get through with this version in the beginning. That lame soundtrack, bright colours and childish feeling. I will choose the first half of the Hunter exam of the 99 version anytime over this version. But the Zoldyck and Heavens arena arc go to this one.
Jun 22, 2012 12:34 PM

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i loved the animation, the fighting was..it was..so best! XD <3
Jun 22, 2012 3:29 PM

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eucalyptustree16 said:
noonealive said:
It does not matter if she appears or not. Gon was dropped off to Mito by his Dad(Mito and Ging are related). Gon's real mom is not comfirmed dead.
The 1999 plays it off as Gon was born and raised on whale island by his Aunt Mito with a dead mom's burial site. This deviates from the manga completely. How is changing ones back story (especially the main character) not "create" problems down the road?


I watched 99 version before reading the manga and was not bothered by the changes. So apparently they´re not that bad. So no, that´s not a problem.

In fact, I´d rather have some minor changes, than the shit I had to get through with this version in the beginning. That lame soundtrack, bright colours and childish feeling. I will choose the first half of the Hunter exam of the 99 version anytime over this version. But the Zoldyck and Heavens arena arc go to this one.


I'm tired of people listing "Bright colors" as a con. As if most anime now as days aren't lighter than anime in the 90's. The childish feeling was present in the 1999 anime as well, maybe even more so.

Anime_Name said:


"lol no" is an argument now?
I addressed just about everyone that quoted me. That's hardly "ignoring" but I guessing not agreeing is the new ignoring for this generation.

.


We've had this argument before but like you've done to everyone you ignore what they say and continue to say the same thing. You clearly have trouble understanding how others have successfully countered your argument.
Jun 22, 2012 4:20 PM

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I'm tired of people listing "Bright colors" as a con. As if most anime now as days aren't lighter than anime in the 90's. The childish feeling was present in the 1999 anime as well, maybe even more so.

In the TV series and Yorkshin arc, no.
For Greed Island, yes. I complain about the color palette of the 2011 series just as much as I complain about the Greed Island OVA's color palette.

We've had this argument before but like you've done to everyone you ignore what they say and continue to say the same thing. You clearly have trouble understanding how others have successfully countered your argument.

Yeah it's you trying to maintain that any and all changes are problems and are lesser than the manga just because it wasn't from Togashi's hand. So yeah, trying to go differences = problems isn't going to work.

Jun 22, 2012 5:09 PM

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I remember that in the old anime, machi was watching the fight between Gon Vs Hisoka. and when
she didnt even recognize him. << plothole?
Jun 22, 2012 5:33 PM

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Anime_Name said:

Yeah it's you trying to maintain that any and all changes are problems and are lesser than the manga just because it wasn't from Togashi's hand. So yeah, trying to go differences = problems isn't going to work.


This right here explains how you have not comprehended anything I've or anyone else has said.
Jun 22, 2012 6:10 PM

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bleachjoj said:
Anime_Name said:

Yeah it's you trying to maintain that any and all changes are problems and are lesser than the manga just because it wasn't from Togashi's hand. So yeah, trying to go differences = problems isn't going to work.


This right here explains how you have not comprehended anything I've or anyone else has said.

I comprehend fine but don't think comprehension means I am going to agree. If you want to keep trying to question my comprehension then by all means point out the arguments I have not understood.

Jun 22, 2012 7:44 PM
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@Anime_Name


Candor said:
Yea, it's the most boring arc in HxH, but well there's always an arc where they explain something (Nen in HxH's case), which is a prelude for a great serie or a great arc that's gonna come next.
You're right about that. That's why I applaud MH for making this arc fun and at least memorable... SCHWING!

eucalyptustree16 said:
I watched 99 version before reading the manga and was not bothered by the changes. So apparently they´re not that bad. So no, that´s not a problem.

In fact, I´d rather have some minor changes, than the shit I had to get through with this version in the beginning. That lame soundtrack, bright colours and childish feeling. I will choose the first half of the Hunter exam of the 99 version anytime over this version. But the Zoldyck and Heavens arena arc go to this one.
Yes, the changes aren't bad but you cannot say they are good either when you review it in the context of good storytelling. What would the 99 series do WHEN Togashi touch upon Gon's other parent? Gon obviously doesn't care (or seem to) about his birth mother but what about Ging?

The childish feeling IS intended. Does it not also occur to you when you read the manga (barring the graphic violence)? Even the manga covers of volumes 1-6 has a "childish" feel and look to it.

As for the "lame soundtrack", I too was annoyed with it but after 10 or so episodes and it become apparent that MH doesn't intend to change how they use the soundtrack, I looked at it at a different angle: What if MH doesn't (fully) intend that the BGM match the mood of a scene but rather what the character(s) is/are feeling in that scene/event?

It helps drive the point that these said characters are definitely NOT normal if they're feeling cheery and adventurous on a life and death scenario (Gon) or feeling sexy and flirty while fighting/killing people (Hisoka). It also serves as a distraction - aimed to the younger audience - and misdirection - aimed to casual viewers (read: parents) - that HxH is your regular kid-friendly anime... hence, the "cute" character design, the "kiddy" BGM and use of creative censorship.

BlackListHunter said:
I remember that in the old anime, machi was watching the fight between Gon Vs Hisoka. and when
she didnt even recognize him. << plothole?
She just forgot because Hisoka raped her and then he banged her head to a wall so she'll forget about it. :P

On that note, Machi in the old anime feels very feminine (lipstick!) with her doing her hair (w/ a mirror) while watching Gon-Hisoka fight when she's more of a tomboy in the manga. <---- which certainly shed light to WHY Hisoka is interested in her
Jun 22, 2012 7:57 PM

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eucalyptustree16 said:
I watched 99 version before reading the manga and was not bothered by the changes. So apparently they´re not that bad. So no, that´s not a problem.

In fact, I´d rather have some minor changes, than the shit I had to get through with this version in the beginning. That lame soundtrack, bright colours and childish feeling. I will choose the first half of the Hunter exam of the 99 version anytime over this version. But the Zoldyck and Heavens arena arc go to this one.


See you read the manga so you know the material. Now Say if someone watched 99 version and read the manga from where the anime left off.... it's a problem no matter how big or small. So yeah it's a problem.
Jun 22, 2012 8:09 PM

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Anime_Name said:
How hard is this to understand? IF she never makes an appearance or IF she gets confirmed to be dead then there isn't a problem. The problem only happens IF she is confirmed alive in the manga. The topic has yet to be handled in the manga, so unless you know what Togashi is going to do then you can conclude that a problem was created.

So if we worded it as creating a possible problem down the road I would agree, and then it would be dependent on how his mom is introduced. If it's written that they thought she was dead having an honorary burial is hardly out of place or problematic.

Seeing as Togashi hasn't really touched on it he very well could take a page from the previous anime and just go with her being dead. If anything this complaint is a prime example of the Schrodinger's cat theory. Since you can't prove either either both remain valid states.


Beating around the bush is sad. Look, changing how a person is characterized is a problem. It doesn't matter if Togashi hasn't presented Gon's mom yet. When people watch the 1999 anime and not read the manga they are going to have the impression that Gon was raised by his dead mom's sister. Which in fact she isn't dead in the manga nor related to Mito. It's a problem plain and simple.
Jun 22, 2012 9:04 PM
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BlackListHunter said:
I remember that in the old anime, machi was watching the fight between Gon Vs Hisoka. and when
she didnt even recognize him. << plothole?


there was no plothole because in the 1999 version


eucalyptustree16 said:

I watched 99 version before reading the manga and was not bothered by the changes. So apparently they´re not that bad. So no, that´s not a problem.

In fact, I´d rather have some minor changes, than the shit I had to get through with this version in the beginning. That lame soundtrack, bright colours and childish feeling. I will choose the first half of the Hunter exam of the 99 version anytime over this version. But the Zoldyck and Heavens arena arc go to this one.

I am not really bothered by the changes done by the 1999 version either. The only change I see as totally contradictory to the facts in the manga is Gon's mother background, but she has like 0 presence anyways.

There are some minor character changes in 1999, but I feel they haven't changed the characters personality more than 1 to 2%, but some pro-2011 people like to exaggerate the changes as if they gave the protagonists a personality overhaul, yet they don't mind/don't mention much the 2011 changes to character/story, when there equally are a lot.

examples:
* people talk about it's silly Gido & co. is portrayed in 1999 version as faking disability so Gon & Killua look better, but what of the 2011 version change where Hisoka was provoked by other examinees first and put on the defense rather than offense during the 1st exam when he killed them? isn't that a silly attempt to make Hisoka look better too?

* The manga dialogue where Killua told Gon that he, just like Hisoka is under a facade and his lying to Wing about his birthday was removed in the 2011 version....a tendency to lie is an important personality trait of Killua that should not be reduced. It is also bizzre that Killua could not sense Gon is missing after running for so long to catch up with the examiner in the 2011 version's first exam.

* in the manga Reorio, Kurapica and Gon can each open the testing door by themselves, why change it to three people together in 2011?

I could go on, but the thing is changes that don't accord with how the characters/story are portrayed in manga is not just a 'problem' of the 1999, but also that of the 2011 version.

To me, neither version's changes really diverted much from the manga, so I don't think they are problematic. It is only a problem if you believe that the manga is forever the best version of HxH and nothing the anime versions change can surpass that, which I don't necessarily agree with.

there are 3 versions of HxH, and at different points of the story, one version may present a better portrayal than another version. There are some parts of the story that I feel one anime version gave a better portrayal than the manga, and other parts that I feel the animes did not live up to. (eg I like 1999 version of exam most, 2011 version of Zoldyck arc most, manga version of Yorkshin most).

Arguments like "it's always better if you stick 100% to the manga" is not the objectve truth and just means there is not much point at all in having the animes, because we will then be watching the exact same story 3 times. If the anime team can come up with something better than the manga, then I am all for slight changes, if not ,then stick to the manga. Of course whether the change is for the better or not is everybody's own subjective view.

ankifeatherJun 22, 2012 9:40 PM
Jun 22, 2012 9:24 PM

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Vapz said:
...Let's just take a moment to appreciate that Hisoka was standing in front of a window. Stark naked. Someone got a great view of his glowing crotch... o___o;;

Jun 22, 2012 9:33 PM
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That's what we call bad retcons. In short, the 1999 animators did a bad job adapting the material that they have to resort to "self-correcting" in the later parts for the mishaps they did on previous episodes. Good to know.

It's very easy to fault the 1999 team when you have the benefit of hindsight from 20+ manga volumes, which they didn't.

the so called 'material' that the 1999 version had to work off when it first started were 7 volumes of manga - at which point many of the character's background & development is unknown (including Gon's mom) and Togashi is on constant hiatus and the manga production is slow. The anime team is left in the dark to imagine some character background to add here and there to avoid over-taking the manga. If they didn't , the first anime would have ended way before the Yorkshin arc or added many totally unrelated filler arc like Naruto because there is no manga material left. Now that would have been even worse as filler arcs tend to change perceptions of characters even more so.

the majority of misshapa the 1999 team created initially (such as Machi seeing Gon at the Heaven arena), it was later self corrected, so not much problem left. Some like Gon's mother is harder to correct later, but they were very few and of aspects that ar unimportant to the story.

So we are disappointed and angry at the '99 die-hard fans for crucifying the new series just because it is different from their beloved old series. We (the manga fans) didn't do it on the old series despite the changes it made to our beloved manga and actually defended it when other anime fans says it's too slow. Why don't the '99 lovers have the same courtesy? And so we knocked down the old anime from the pedestal we helped build a long time ago.

I too think it is unfair that 2011 version is picked on for not being like the 1999 version, when it is following the manga.

But, as per my above post, It's equally unfair that the 1999 version is being picked on for changes from the manga by 2011 fans who at the same time are more forgiving of the 2011 versions changes from the MANGA ( not the 1999 version).
ankifeatherJun 22, 2012 9:55 PM
Jun 22, 2012 9:59 PM
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fanimanga said:
@Anime_NameThe childish feeling IS intended. Does it not also occur to you when you read the manga (barring the graphic violence)? Even the manga covers of volumes 1-6 has a "childish" feel and look to it.

As for the "lame soundtrack", I too was annoyed with it but after 10 or so episodes and it become apparent that MH doesn't intend to change how they use the soundtrack, I looked at it at a different angle: What if MH doesn't (fully) intend that the BGM match the mood of a scene but rather what the character(s) is/are feeling in that scene/event?

It helps drive the point that these said characters are definitely NOT normal if they're feeling cheery and adventurous on a life and death scenario (Gon) or feeling sexy and flirty while fighting/killing people (Hisoka). It also serves as a distraction - aimed to the younger audience - and misdirection - aimed to casual viewers (read: parents) - that HxH is your regular kid-friendly anime... hence, the "cute" character design, the "kiddy" BGM and use of creative censorship.


That's how I've always viewed the BGM.
What separates HxH from most shounen series is that HxH is a character driven story. The use of the BGM in the 2011 anime is indicative of this. Take the scene when Gon and Hanzo go at it during the last phase of the hunter exam for example. At first hanzo is speaking to the ref and then we switch to gon's perspective, cue gon's theme. While this is playing it shows how gon is viewing his situation, like this is going to play out as a fair fight of sorts, but the song immediately cuts off the moment hanzo slaps gon with the reality of the situation, i.e. chopping Gon down.
There are so many moments like this and I think the use of the BGM is mostly fantastic. There are a few tracks I'm not too fond of, but overall I like it. It captures the tone of the hunter exam, in the manga, very well in my opinion. When a "dark" moment happens, it's presented appropriately. Like you said, the beginning of HxH comes off as "kiddy," that's just how togashi writes, nothing is as it seems. That's the foundation of the series, in my mind, and I feel the 2011 series captures it better.
Jun 22, 2012 10:08 PM

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ankifeather said:
snip


To be fair, yes you are right. The 1999 anime did not have the luxury of 340 chapters to go off on, but, those changes you mentioned in 2011 are minor. It's not like killua never lies. A recent example is episode 32 when Killua lies about the Hisoka fight. Hisoka in that same arc killed many unprovoked. This is not like Killua being portrayed as a moody, distance, emotional burden child at first (Canary flashback). Or Gon being a lot more polite.

Also
Jun 22, 2012 11:23 PM

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So what about those scenes that doesn't completely match the manga? Are we suppose to think these characters suddenly got swapped with someone else, had amnesia, hit their head really hard, whatever excuse you can think up, and the reason why they suddenly change personalities?

Or you could simply not make a big deal about a difference just because it's not in the manga. Still as you said that people could think Gon is against killing if they go by some scene in the original, such a thought would quickly be corrected in other scenes that are more close to the manga as those scenes are abundant in the series. A person who thinks Gon is against killing can only still have that characterization if they didn't finish the anime and since your arguing about 1999 anime fans it's not likely that they didn't finish the series. This is the same for any characterization you think is wrong. All a person would have to do to accept the proper characterization is realize that what the character is doing now is how the character is.

That's what we call bad retcons. In short, the 1999 animators did a bad job adapting the material that they have to resort to "self-correcting" in the later parts for the mishaps they did on previous episodes. Good to know.

You don't know what a retcon if you're using it this way. An anime is going to deviate from it's source at some point in time be it filler or censorship. When the anime gets back to being inline with the manga it is not retconing away anything it did prior. The only thing good to know is incessantly you need to exaggerate and misuse words just to make the problems you have sound worse than they really are.


Incorrect. We love Hunter x Hunter, even if the anime was flawed (beggars can't be choosers), we still watched it until the end (even the OVAs) and recommend it to anime-only viewers in order to get many fans. In our minds, the 1999 series is different and left it at that.

Incorrect what? You're not even commenting on what you quoted. If any of the anime-only parts led a viewer to an incorrect characterization then watching the entirety of the series would give them the correct characterization as there was more inline with the manga then out of line. Proof? In terms of anime adaptations HxH(1999) was generally held to be one of the most accurate shounen anime around. You don't get called accurate if all you do is deviate from the source.

You're foaming on the mouth, I see.

And you're running out of gas, I see.

Kidding aside, I don't see the difference you speak of. The "big name shounen anime" you mentioned didn't changed their characters' core personalities. If you want to see how an anime do justice to the characters despite deviating from the manga plot, watch the Fruits Basket anime then read the manga.

I do believe this part of the quote came from your comment about how the directer needed or had the balls to dare change Togashi's work and I called your attention to big name shounen work to show you it doesn't take balls to dare change Togashi's work. TV adaptations do it all the time, you blind sycophant.

You were itching to throw back the "reading comprehension fail" at me, don't you? It was calculated and you, my dear, didn't disappoint. Too bad your comments above just showed how you fail at it more.

Actually I was holding it back as the majority of your replies reeks of your failed comprehension.

Showing is much more effective than tellling, no?

Not if you're the 1999 series then you'd get accused of showing too much by hypocrites.


Beating around the bush is sad. Look, changing how a person is characterized is a problem. It doesn't matter if Togashi hasn't presented Gon's mom yet. When people watch the 1999 anime and not read the manga they are going to have the impression that Gon was raised by his dead mom's sister. Which in fact she isn't dead in the manga nor related to Mito. It's a problem plain and simple.

At this point it feels like a claim some people are making up and exaggerating. What the kind of different characterization happens because of the change in relation? Holy hell you people are stretching so far I'm surprised you haven't pulled a muscle. Sorry but you can't say it's a fact she isn't dead if you don't know and guess what, you don't know. What's plain and simple is folks like you need to open up damn dictionary and stop incorrectly using words just because they make your statements sound big and scary.

Jun 22, 2012 11:46 PM
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This debate is getting out of hand...
I think what ankifeather said up there is something that should be considered when comparing the old series with the new.
It's these reasons that created the 1999 series we all know, and I feel that they did a pretty good job considering the limitations they had, even if it did result in the characterization changing a bit, and having the overall tone of the story change. I don't think there's any point in arguing over the choices the director and writers of the 1999 series made for their adaption of togashi's manga.
Whether these changes made for a better story or not is another issue entirely. Though it's of my opinion that the changes in the 1999 series made, despite the moments of faithfulness, for a lesser quality story. That's just my two cents :)
BUT, like I've already said, they did a really good job with the original series considering what they had to work with.
Jun 23, 2012 12:38 AM

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eucalyptustree16 said:
noonealive said:
It does not matter if she appears or not. Gon was dropped off to Mito by his Dad(Mito and Ging are related). Gon's real mom is not comfirmed dead.
The 1999 plays it off as Gon was born and raised on whale island by his Aunt Mito with a dead mom's burial site. This deviates from the manga completely. How is changing ones back story (especially the main character) not "create" problems down the road?


I watched 99 version before reading the manga and was not bothered by the changes. So apparently they´re not that bad. So no, that´s not a problem.

In fact, I´d rather have some minor changes, than the shit I had to get through with this version in the beginning. That lame soundtrack, bright colours and childish feeling. I will choose the first half of the Hunter exam of the 99 version anytime over this version. But the Zoldyck and Heavens arena arc go to this one.


Opinions are irrelevant, the question is did it or did it not create plotholes?
And the fact Is: it did wether people like it or not.
End Zionazism
Jun 23, 2012 12:39 AM

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coldwave said:
Mikasa said:
This arc shits on the 1999 version guys. IMHO...the H stands for holy.

This ac isn't even that good to begin with, not even in manga. So no big deal.

This arc introduced nen, that alone makes it a masterpiece.
End Zionazism
Jun 23, 2012 6:20 AM
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Mikasa said:
Opinions are irrelevant, the question is did it or did it not create plotholes?
And the fact Is: it did wether people like it or not.


You can go on about the "technical flaws" but if it doesn't cut the enjoyment of the individual (who is of course ignorant of those things, because a mangareader will bitch about it for sure wether it's an unpleasant change or not) I don't think it's that much of a big deal. Because that's what anime is about: enjoyment.

But I'm just giving my 2 cents here since I don't like it how every pro 99 comment gets attacked like predators surrounding its prey. And I'm sure I will get a half assed, sarcastic and short reply for this. But I'll leave it at this.
Jun 23, 2012 8:12 AM

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eucalyptustree16 said:
Mikasa said:
Opinions are irrelevant, the question is did it or did it not create plotholes?
And the fact Is: it did wether people like it or not.


You can go on about the "technical flaws" but if it doesn't cut the enjoyment of the individual (who is of course ignorant of those things, because a mangareader will bitch about it for sure wether it's an unpleasant change or not) I don't think it's that much of a big deal. Because that's what anime is about: enjoyment.

But I'm just giving my 2 cents here since I don't like it how every pro 99 comment gets attacked like predators surrounding its prey. And I'm sure I will get a half assed, sarcastic and short reply for this. But I'll leave it at this.

That is hilarios because those pro comments come from butthurt people who started the half assed sarcastic comments against the 2011 version in the first place and now they are whining about the smallest things but when it comes to the huge flaws in the previous one, "oh no you gotta respect my opinion and let me troll all i want"
That is how most of them sound
I call bullshit
Again, the entertainment is irrelevant, although it is still affected by the fuck ups the old version did since the story part is what entertains many people the most
End Zionazism
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