Guilty Crown Episode 13 Discussion

RawrORawr said:
Why would Shu need to resurrect Funeral Parlor ? With his new-found abilities he'll match up well against GHQ. At this point, it seems extremely likely that he will attain the ability to extract an unlimited amount of voids without anyone fainting. Imagine Inori's sword with Arisa's shield.

GodlyKyon said:
I don't get why do people care for Daryl at all... Oh well, not many characters in this series is worthy of being cared

Salinga said:

It's the glasses.

Yumekichi11 said:
Nah, it's him licking the apple. He does that 2 different ways. Girls like that stuff in anime.

Zergneedsfood said:
It's mindless action with fan service. The show isn't anything amazing or great, but it's decent, and it's brainless entertainment that I can enjoy for 30 minutes a week.

You don't have a lot of original stories these days, a lot of them are VN adaptations, LN adaptions, or manga comics.

I'd give them a break for that very reason.

You can say "Well dude, so many bad cliches, characters, blah blah blah." Sure that may be true, Inori is pretty much emotionless with very little development. Tsugumi is the nya nya character that's there for fan service. Shu is basically Shinji Ikari but has recently been acting less of a panzy. Still, while these exist, there's room for improvement. Tsugumi's interaction this episode with that crazy kid and Ayase was interesting. Shu is always growing and surprising people with manly actions. Inori is....well I don't see hope for her so maybe not. :P

But I guess at that point, you can also call Code Geass lousy, because it had the same things described in this thread. Bad characters, cliches, bad pacing, blah blah blah. In fact, you can probably call a number of popular shows lousy and bad these same reasons.

I'm not defending Guilty Crown and calling it the best thing since sliced bread, but what I am saying is that it's not a terrible show. I think people are too caught up with random nuances to appreciate something that's just thoughtless entertainment.

Guilty Crown has a better score than most scores I've heard in anime in last few seasons (and I actually watched quite a lot of anime from the last few seasons) with a few exceptions off the top of my head.

It also is incredibly ambitious with the concept of Voids. Sure it's currently not explained very well, but at least it's better to watch a new idea rather than sticking with a lot of the same old same old badness that plagues every season. I think it's fair to say that Ayase's void was kind of expected, but I think overall, everyone's Void was interesting to say the least, with Hare's bandaid being my favorite.

I don't know why I wasted so much time to defending this show, but I just felt that everyone's comments here are ridiculous, bashing a show for trying to come up with an original concept (and of course using a number of ideas from other shows as a springboard).

This is why nobody comes up with any new and interesting ideas, because a lot of times they get smacked around for it. As a result, they just stick with their adaptations of already popular ideas to try to make a buck instead of risking inventing a new story and getting completely shut down by an anime audience that thinks it's seen everything.

dany_elle1908 said:


u drop it now when are only 9 eps left lol ok xD

Zergneedsfood said:
Meh. There's really no point in talking to people like you about it anyway. I've already provided a lot of reasons why it's not bad, and I'm convinced the rationale for not liking is either personal preferences or an inherent hipster complex that stops people from liking anything that seems mainstream.

Like I said, Guilty Crown isn't amazing, but it's decent. Compared to a lot of dumb stuff that's coming out right now, it's easily something that's entertaining and at least tries to bring forth something new other than stuff this season.

If you guys don't like it, just don't watch it. Why would you watch a show that's utter shit just to bag on it?

Zergneedsfood said:
Guilty Crown has a better score than most scores I've heard in anime in last few seasons (and I actually watched quite a lot of anime from the last few seasons) with a few exceptions off the top of my head.

Zergneedsfood said:
It also is incredibly ambitious with the concept of Voids. Sure it's currently not explained very well, but at least it's better to watch a new idea rather than sticking with a lot of the same old same old badness that plagues every season. I think it's fair to say that Ayase's void was kind of expected, but I think overall, everyone's Void was interesting to say the least, with Hare's bandaid being my favorite.

Zergneedsfood said:
I don't know why I wasted so much time to defending this show, but I just felt that everyone's comments here are ridiculous, bashing a show for trying to come up with an original concept (and of course using a number of ideas from other shows as a springboard).

Zergneedsfood said:
This is why nobody comes up with any new and interesting ideas, because a lot of times they get smacked around for it. As a result, they just stick with their adaptations of already popular ideas to try to make a buck instead of risking inventing a new story and getting completely shut down by an anime audience that thinks it's seen everything.

Zergneedsfood said:
If you guys don't like it, just don't watch it. Why would you watch a show that's utter shit just to bag on it?

Zergneedsfood said:
I think you're tossing out a bunch of fancy terms as if you're some kind of literary/film expert.

Zergneedsfood said:
I think it's fair to say that the show is not amazing. I don't think it's fair to say that the show is just objectively horrible.

Zergneedsfood said:
You've just said "Oh, the script is terrible. The direction is bad, and the characters are poorly written." In a way, those are all personal preferences, vague, and overall just not any clear example of why the show is bad. I think you'll have to work harder to convince me that there's something so wrong with the show that you can label it as horrible.

Zergneedsfood said:
I agree with the general analysis though. I feel like the script is pretty haphazard and is random at times, and as a result the direction is also shaky and sloppy. The characters, while having flaws and having little development, are hard to relate to.

I understand most of these concepts, and I'm not avoiding them. But I think if you're trying to watch Guilty Crown for some kind of intellectual stimulation, then I don't know why you're still watching it. I already said that it's basically like Code Geass, brainless entertainment that you just shut up, turn off your brain and watch.

Zergneedsfood said:
I think you're being way too vague by saying there's deus ex machina and cliches. Those exist inherently because most ideas have been exhausted and you can basically say that deus ex machina is done precisely to build up tension and relieve it. For example, I don't think that the Voids are deus ex machina, precisely because the Voids that are extracted are actually believable.

Ayase's legs are her Void? That's easily believable. Hare bandaids? Yup. Inori is a sword? Now that I have to question, and I'm sad that it hasn't been explaiend. However, for the most part, I don't think Voids are deus ex. Deus ex machina is when something happens that is completely unexpected and saves someone from disaster. Voids, if anything, are a development on the character and unveils certain things about said character that's already been known.

Granted, I don't like that way as a means of exposing the characters, precisely because I want to know more about them before I know their Void, but still, I buy the method and I don't think it's bad.

Ultimately, no one is convincing me that Guilty Crown is down right horrible. I think Guilty Crown is okay. It's not a bad show, but it's never going to be amazing either. I get annoyed at characters, I don't like how they do some things, but unless you're some kind of expert on film, I don't think you have enough to say that the script is "horrible". It might be lacking, but it's definitely not horrible.

Zergneedsfood said:
Edit: And I'm not saying people don't like this because of cliches. I'm just saying that people bag on the show for no real reason.

Minenene said:
This was an okay ep, I loved seeing more of Tsugumi, she's too cute. I liked it when Shu gave Ayase legs, that was nice of him. Actually I'd like to see more of Daryl, idk I find him interesting. The OP and ED was good, I liked the old ED better though.

I didn't like the fact that they planned a festival even though the rest of the city was destroyed and lives were lost etc etc, it was way too soon.

This episode wasn't very interesting as far as plot goes, but since when did Guilty Crown ever have a continuous plot anyway.

Veretax said:
Voids as Deus Ex? Okay then I guess if I go down shows I've watched in this vein you'd have to say all of the following are basically Deus Ex.

Pokemon, Digimon, Voltron, I mean heck X-men for crying out loud. Your definition of Deus Ex seems to be something out of the ordinary, but this is cleary a Science Fiction show at best, Fantasy at worse, it's not meant to be realistic in the void plot device.

This review explains why voids are deux ex machinas:
http://myanimelist.net/reviews.php?id=52187

Rykimaruh said:
Anyone has any idea what's the song during their battle in this episode? It was also in the previous one too. I've been searching everywhere, but I think it's a guilty crown theme...not some 3rd party artist... :(

Zergneedsfood said:
I understand most of these concepts, and I'm not avoiding them. But I think if you're trying to watch Guilty Crown for some kind of intellectual stimulation, then I don't know why you're still watching it. I already said that it's basically like Code Geass, brainless entertainment that you just shut up, turn off your brain and watch.

Edit: And I'm not saying people don't like this because of cliches. I'm just saying that people bag on the show for no real reason.

Magito said:


No, it's both the Apple and the glasses. XD

Zergneedsfood said:
The definition of a deus ex machina are situations where there appears to be absolutely no hope, and then suddenly something come out of nowhere and makes it all better.

Zergneedsfood said:
These actions are more for entertainment purposes than to be taken seriously... Action doesn't need to be logical.

Zergneedsfood said:
I think on the topic of characters you probably have your best point. The characters are pretty bad and I'm pretty annoyed at them. Still, I wouldn't go as far to say that they don't have personalities and motives.

Zergneedsfood said:
Overall, all of your points only serve to show that Guilty Crown is a decent show, and not a terrible show.

Zergneedsfood said:
All of the negative drawbacks are just indications that the show is decent, or at most average. There's nothing in these shows to demonstrate that it deserves anything below that, because it honestly isn't that bad.

Zergneedsfood said:
Clearly you don't know what deus ex machina is so I won't even bother.

Zergneedsfood said:
I already told you that people's voids are believable and convincing. If Hare's void was a huge rocket launcher, then I'd like "Well that was dumb." In all honesty, I'm convinced you haven't given the show a proper chance and haven't really thought about it and instead just labeled it as bad based on face value. Because if you really did, then it'd be clear that Voids are not deus ex machina.

Illogical placement and timing Deus Ex Machina — When something is established and explained in the work, but its use in that situation is jarring and impossible to believe.

Zergneedsfood said:
It's not a bad show. It's a decent show. 7s aren't what I consider "average". Those are just arbitrary numbers used by me to illustrate how much I enjoyed a show.

Zergneedsfood said:
I already told you that people's voids are believable and convincing. If Hare's void was a huge rocket launcher, then I'd like "Well that was dumb."

Zergneedsfood said:
In all honesty, I'm convinced you haven't given the show a proper chance and haven't really thought about it and instead just labeled it as bad based on face value. Because if you really did, then it'd be clear that Voids are not deus ex machina.

Zergneedsfood said:
I already told you that I agree that the characters need work, but I don't think that they're completely bad characters. Ayase had a nice episode today. Shu has had a lot of changes that, while could have been improved stylistically, actually has been well received by a lot of people.

Zergneedsfood said:
I think you can talk about how Inori is a bad character all day long, but ultimately a lot of shows have a or number of characters that aren't very good but still manage to do decently. I think Inori doing dumb stuff doesn't justify that it's bad.

Zergneedsfood said:
You've just been bashing stuff that you really haven't properly understood, and you bash the script, characters, and plot based on arbitrary reasons that I've already outlined in my post and you've also ignored. At that point, there's really no point in really talking specifics because I can do exactly what you've been doing this entire discussion: making up vague talking points or coming up with ambiguous examples that don't refute the points I'm making.

Zergneedsfood said:
In reality, I was talking about action sequences and the dumb things that occasionally happen and how these shows need us to suspend our disbelief because that's what makes it entertaining.

Karura_Jiinsaru said:
Would you mind explaining to me the reasons of certain characters´ Voids? I mean Gai, Daryl (or whoever it belonged to the one from episode 2), Kaede (Hare´s friend), Souta and Kenji (the one rescued from prison in episode 4), since because of the terrible characterization, I may have missed something...

Fallacy54 said:
You have been proven wrong. You called pacing "a fancy term." You refuse to study the meaning of deus ex machina. You ignore facts. You are saying random good sides and not seeing the show as a whole. Still you say you are perfectly aware of what makes a good show. LOL, you can dream all you want.

I.e. You don't know much about anime and it's quality. This is you: "I do not know anything about it, but I do disagree."
You also failed to understand what the show is about and what it tries to be.

My time spent to anime is 186 days, yours is 42. Since you thought that makes you smart, then I shall say that my IQ is 134 and I know lot of stuff.

You aren't even wroth of anyone's time with that level of ignorance, hypocrisy and trolling.

Sukau said:
Well this show is great 9/10 for me :D

Zergneedsfood said:
wtf is this with Code Geass being creative with a lot of ideas. Anyone who's watched a good enough amount of Mecha and old shows will tell you that Code Geass borrowed so much shit from a lot of other shows.

destructo22 said:
Poor ayase~! ;___;

DraconisMarch said:
CLUSTERFUCKCLUSTERFUCKCLUSTERFUCKCLUSTERFUCKCLUSTERFUCK

If you blindly accept what's going on without question, you're retarded.

"We're confined in an concentration camp. People are thirsty and starving. I know! Let's have a culture festival! Because we're a clichestorm realistic original like that."

Tsugumi looks EXACTLY like Hazuki from Moon Phase with those cat ears.

Asspull asspull asspull.

Ayase is officially retarded. Come at me, Ayase fans. (At least ship Ayashu is afloat.)

Good music though.

PS: Calling it right now: Gai or Mana (or both) gets asspulled back to life/isn't really dead.