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| THIS IS AN ANIME ONLY DISCUSSION POST. DO NOT DISCUSS THE MANGA BEYOND THIS EPISODE. ---------------------------------------- Yay! Roberto is dead (or at least I hope he is)! I found it funny that both Tenma and Nina, want kill Johan so badly yet, when he's right in front of them, they both hesitate (at least Tenma did, Nina also seemed to). Things are getting quite epic now :) |
| And to think, it could have all ended in one shot. Tenma's hesitancy to fire makes me wonder how he plans on really confronting Johan. What'll he do if he's not going to kill him? I wonder if he'll get the resolve to follow through next time or if he'll find another method to stop Johan by the series end. |
 ...even a saint needs a soldier to do the dirty work. |
| so it takes 38 episodes for Tenma to realize that he cant shoot a gun when every viewer in the world knows that ever since episode 1 :( Killing that idiot had no story progression whatsoever. So he shot a damn subordinate... he had so many oppertunities to finish the job (and the series) if he pulled the trigger. But now that his fail status has solidified, we're here to endure another 30+ episodes of him trying to shoot again?? i mean sht :( i would've been fine if he shot him now, and then worked the rest of the way to clear his name or at the very least do more renegade surgeries w/o this weak drama. they shouldve shown ep 1-5, then 36-38 then 70-74... theres your whole season in a nut shell :( ...what a waste |
RanivusJul 25, 2008 12:50 AM
  "What happens when we die?" I know that the ones who love us will miss us. |
| Talk about an epic episode. |
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| This episode hurt the series. There's no reason Johan should still be alive right now. The show is going to have to make up for this, because that was a cop-out. Tenma had many chances to kill Johan. Stupid. |
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| Epic |
robosapien said: Can't be described as something else.Epic |
| Hooray Roberto finally got shot - he always freaked me out. It was obvious they weren't gonna shoot Johan now...wonder what will happen next. |
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| It's clear that he didn't shoot because Johann, unlike Roberto has an almost unnatural charisma. That's also the reason he can get so many people to trust him, he's just that good. |
| OK truly epic...There is no other word that could describe this episode better. There was nothing deep here like in the rest of Monster's episodes. But it was heavily action packed. Therefore my post will be much shorter. The fact that Tenma won't be able to shoot was know for a long time. His ability to shoot Roberto on the other hand, is a completely different thing. He shot Roberto only to save his own life. While Johan did not threaten Tenma directly. And therefore he could not kill a defenseless man. It seems that Anna was also hesitating. She shot after all, but it was obvious that her conscience let her do it only when Johan was gone far away behind the smokes, hoping that she would not hit. One thing truly shocked me. The scene with Karl in Schuwald's office. His mom is also from czeckoslovakia like Johan and Anna. But not only they were from the same country. Karl's mom and Johan's father were close friends. It is highly possible that Johan is Karl's step brother too. It also seems that Johan lived with Margot in Germany for quite some time. They even participated in that bank of darkness thing, which was told about in that villa few episodes back, together. And of course, Johan is the one who killed Margot. It is also quite obvious since he killed all of his other foster parents. Another thing I noticed is that Schuwald understood something from Johan's words. Maybe he already knows about his past, which was probably told to him by Margot? That would make a lot of sense. And add additional interesting story development. |
| No sig :( |
| Clearly I'm not the only one who liked when Tenma killed Roberto. :D I really loved when Johan pointed at his forehead. That just seemed so badass. I do wish someone could have killed Johan even though I like him. |
sfjsiufdsijgfdjApr 28, 2010 5:11 PM
| \ |
| MAMIKO NOTO!!!!!!!! |
| Signature removed. Please follow the signature rules, as defined in the Site & Forum Guidelines. |
| hurray.. congratulations to tenma who made his 1st gunshot :) but still he's hesitating to shoot johan.. same with nina ~_~ |
| The ending was just stupid. Not because Tenma was hestitating to shoot Johann, but because NINA doesn't want Tenma to shoot and Tenma doesn't want Nina to shoot, and neither one has the courage to do it. (I don't know why, this charisma thing is bullshit. You'll never see someone in real life saying, "oh, I want to kill him, but he has so much charisma that I can't ¬¬') Why soo much drama about one simple homicide?? |
| Woah, he actually shot someone :o |
| TIME TO LIVE FOREVER BABY! http://myanimelist.net/clubs.php?cid=19549 Please join if you love Asian Cinema :) |
| Don't know why, but I'm thoroughly convinced there is more to tenma and ana not killing Johann than the series is telling us. I mean he practically dared Tenma to shoot him. Maybe the defenseless thing is on the right track. It's quite a bit different to shoot someone trying to kill you. |
| "Yes, I have been deprived of emotion. But not completely. Whoever did it, botched the job." - Geralt of Rivia |
| Shit went from real to REALLY FUCKING REAL |
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| this was awesome hope ninas ok |
 Behold of my awesomeness~ controversial and/or sensitive topics likely devolve into the same repetitive, derogatory, abusive, and harassing comments can no longer be posted. But my feels. |
| Another chance to kill Johann gone. |
Life is really simple, but we insist on making it complicated.~ |
| tenma got some fucked up resolve.. he able to kill roberto to protect himself, why cant he kill johan to protect himself, his name, nina, reichwine, dieter, all those kids, everyone else in the world, that book, japan, the integrity of anime |
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| Good job, Tenma for being able to shoot. |
| finally roberto got shot |
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| This is beyond ridiculous now. There was such a perfect opportunity to finally shoot that blonde bastard that you couldn't ask for better one. Now i can't help but wonder what must happen that Tenma would manage to point his gun and pull damn trigger. As we saw he can only shoot in self defence, so that means only Johan himself can make that idiot doctor to shoot him? This episode wasn't epic at all. It felt like some cheep plastic drama. And it's so disappointing that i almost wanted to drop this anime.... >< |
| Why did Nina tell Tenma not to shoot? This was a bit silly in my view. Anyway, Tenma is still too 'good' to shoot an unarmed man so he should just find another way to deal with Johan. Karl's mother was friends with Anna and Johan's mother in Czechoslovakia. I suppose that will be a relevant plotpoint at some stage. |
| "Perhaps there is a universal, absolute truth. Perhaps it justifies every question. But that's beyond the reach of these small hands." Mamoru Oshii There is a cult of ignorance (...) nurtured by the false notion that democracy means that “my ignorance is just as good as your knowledge.” Isaac Asimov |
| So much bitching about Tenma not killing Johann.He could shoot Roberto but not Johann because Roberto was going to shoot him right then and there, so he had no choice.Johann on the other hand was unarmed and it was really up to Tenma to kill him out of his own will, and not a need to survive. Is this really so hard to understand?And besides, if Johann died right there the rest of the show would've been pretty boring if you ask me. |
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skapandi said: So much bitching about Tenma not killing Johann.He could shoot Roberto but not Johann because Roberto was going to shoot him right then and there, so he had no choice.Johann on the other hand was unarmed and it was really up to Tenma to kill him out of his own will, and not a need to survive. Is this really so hard to understand?And besides, if Johann died right there the rest of the show would've been pretty boring if you ask me. This. Even with Roberto, Tenma hesitated. But when Roberto whipped out his shotgun, instinct took over and his body went on autopilot. There was no opportunity for that to happen with Johan. More importantly, I think a lot of people are missing the point of this series. In the end, Monster isn't really a revenge/redemption quest. It's an exploration of human nature, whether 'monsters' are born or made, etc. If Tenma killing Johan were the actual point of the show, then there wouldn't be so many episodes that focus on uncovering Johan and Anna's past nor would there be such a big focus on Kinderheim 511 and the people who worked or lived there. |
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| Maan, that stand-off between Tenma and Nina allowed Johan to get away. But seriously, he is so creeeepy. Freaked me out when he put his finger to his forehead XD |
Pocketasces said: tenma got some fucked up resolve.. he able to kill roberto to protect himself, why cant he kill johan to protect himself, his name, nina, reichwine, dieter, all those kids, everyone else in the world, that book, japan, the integrity of anime this... Tenma disappoints me more and more! bleh episode... |
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| ugh that last bit was so pathetic, both Nina and Tenma screaming don't shoot, if neither of them can shoot why not just shoot his legs or something. |
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| I can see why Tenma hesitated this time. With Roberto it was either kill or be killed, so instinct kicked in. On the other hand, Johan was unarmed and defenseless so Tenma would have some reluctance in trying to shoot. |
| Action episode. About Episode: So Tenma survived and Roberto not. But still he couldn't get job done and eliminate Johan even Johan was face to face him and showed even where to point. Okay so 30 episodes more to see if Tenma can make it 3rd time. Nina seemed hesitating because Johan is her brother so maybe that's why. Best part when Tenma with two other guys got door open and everyone could now escape that firing library. Karl's part in this episode was also really good. So Margot's real name is Helenka Novakowa. And he was born in Czechoslovakia August 12 1955. And see also seems to be one of the organization president in that BOD (Bank Of Darkrness) project. Also it was explained we already knew that there were money laundered in five years ago. But it started in 91. So that we didn't know.And Helenka's friend seems to be one of the Johan's parents. 5/5 |
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| You know, I think this show really is amazing, but after shit like this I started to wonder whether i should drop it. Just what the hell was that? |
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| There's no good reason for Tenma not shooting Johan other than "there's still 36 episodes left to fill". It only acts to drag things out further, at the sacrifice of a believable story. I have no idea why this series is 74 episodes long. It just seems excessive for the story it's dealing with. And the whole will he/won't he shoot scenario is now beyond tiresome and is just plain irritating. It's a boring cliche in the first place. If we have to endure that every time Tenma points a gun i'll go insane. Sorry to complain. I'm still watching at 38 episodes in, so i guess it can't be all bad. The show definitely has a ton of potential. I just think it's often wasted with lazy writing and highly predictable plot devices. |
AugmaticDisportMar 1, 2013 4:18 AM
| Wow, i really didn't expect that a single episode could drop my excitement for a show this much. it has to be the worst episode of the series so far, i couldn't find no excuses for anything i saw in this episode, even Johan looked stupid in my eyes for the first time. They really need to put something great later on to make up for it. |
PsalidokratorApr 12, 2013 5:53 PM
| Only when his life was in danger he shoots. Seriously both Tenma and Anna couldn't shoot him. Because of that he will live longer and kill more. If Tenma couldn't kill him so who will? |
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| Tenma can't shoot someone who is, let alone defenseless, but Johan's taunting as well as the evil that he emits is horrifyingly intimidating. It may be even harder for Tenma to shoot Johan, for the fact alone that Tenma saved Johan's life. Roberto was trying to kill Tenma, which will definitely affect your actions. It's one thing to say "I will kill him." It's a completely different thing to actually kill. Nina's resolve is conflicted by the fact that he is her twin brother. Now, if my brother did these things, I know that no matter what, even if they were terrible things, I would definitely hesitate to kill him. I mean, he's my brother. My true brother. People don't understand what it's like to be a twin. It's not like normal brothers at all. Keep pursuing your dreams! ~ Wynn |
KuandohanAug 20, 2013 5:13 PM
| My brother and I compose classical and modern music, please click the link below if you're interested. http://thesearethetwins.wordpress.com/ Please check out my profile to see what anime I recommend. Keep pursuing your dreams! ~ Wynn |
| wow just wow!! definitely one of the best episodes ever!!!! first off, the reason why Tenma was able to shoot(not kill) Roberto is because of the life and death situation. it even showed the flashback with the Commander, it's either him or you. Johan is not even trying to kill Tenma, but rather intimidating him to do it. he knows Tenma will be scarred for life if he did this. i'm just glad Roberto is fucking dead, that fucking price lived waay too long now :P wow Tenma helping the people to get out, and it just so happens that he only has two bullets left lol XD i have a feeling that those black lines around Johan's cornea is the death of hundreds of people he saw all these years. Algirdyz said: One thing truly shocked me. The scene with Karl in Schuwald's office. His mom is also from czeckoslovakia like Johan and Anna. But not only they were from the same country. Karl's mom and Johan's father were close friends. It is highly possible that Johan is Karl's step brother too. It also seems that Johan lived with Margot in Germany for quite some time. They even participated in that bank of darkness thing, which was told about in that villa few episodes back, together. And of course, Johan is the one who killed Margot. It is also quite obvious since he killed all of his other foster parents. i too notice that Karl's mom Helenka are acquaintance with the real mother of Johan and Anna. though Karl being step brother of Johan is possible as well!! and i knew the bank of darkness incident!! this is how Johan was able to get alot of money and even became head of the establishment soo soon. i do wonder why Helenka didn't tried to find Karl? was it because it was too dangerous for him to be involved? i have a feeling Schubert does know who Johan truly is. so that's why Johan went after him. i don't agree what you said in the last paragraph, in the last few episodes the fake Margot Langer(Red Bitch or Blue Bitch whatever) said she first tried to trick Helenka by opening up to her in the past, and when she knew she was Margot Langer who had conceived a child with Schubert. she killed her while she was drowning in sorrow. that's how that fake bitch managed to used Schubert for money. though she did say Johan was there(i don't think so though), so maybe Johan made Helenka mentally disturbed and that fake bitch killed her right away? and lol Nina get's inside of the Library so easily upstairs. why the hell didn't people go there(well they did went up, but was weak to climb even more) i don't even know why people are talking about Tenma not being able to shoot Johan. look at what Johan did when he predicted the staged would fall down just like that. seriously that's one of the most badass things i have ever seen. walking there not touching anything, and then someone dies! please Nina be alive!!!!!! i don't want Mamiko Noto to stop voicing!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Schubert might have been dead though. man i wonder what Lunger would think of this!!!! next episode!!! |
Fumofu said: This is beyond ridiculous now. There was such a perfect opportunity to finally shoot that blonde bastard that you couldn't ask for better one. Now i can't help but wonder what must happen that Tenma would manage to point his gun and pull damn trigger. As we saw he can only shoot in self defence, so that means only Johan himself can make that idiot doctor to shoot him? This episode wasn't epic at all. It felt like some cheep plastic drama. And it's so disappointing that i almost wanted to drop this anime.... >< This after 37 epic episodes, this one shitty episode makes me like to drop the series, so fcken ridiculous |
| Smiles and laughter are always good, but never forget your Poker Face.~ |
| I think neither Tenma nor Anna wants the other to shoot Johan because neither of them wants the other to become a killer. Besides, there's so much more to learn about Johann's motives and his (and Anna's) past - it ain't time for him to die yet! |
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| Goddammit Tenma... Gave you props for pulling the trigger on that one dude, but man... JUST SHOOT THE BICH. |
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| Nina killed herself? what? also, johan is a monster,literally XD |
| EL PSY KONGROO!!! |
| WTF Tenma?! This dude should go home and let Anna handle her brother. |
| ''We don't know what kind of people we truly are until the moment before our deaths. As death comes to embrace you, you will realise what you are. That's what death is, don't you think?'' - Uchiha Itachi |
Tengai said: If I were in that library I wouldn't panic like those people. LOL Bullshit. vilmarbf said: Nina killed herself? what? also, johan is a monster,literally XD What episode were you watching, the stage collapsed how is that killing yourself?! Anyway, are you fucking kidding me with this episode. Don't get me wrong, it was epic and I love the show and this episode but holy crap. I can understand Tenma getting startled from Johan walking up to him like that but then there's the Nina VS Tenma resolve issue and ugh, just frustrating to watch but the writer knows which viewer buttons to push lol. |
| I really don't understand why they won't just shoot the fucking guy lol. The only explanation is the guy has so much influence over others that you just can't touch him. It's like he can make a girl pregnant just by staring at them. Yea idk |
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