India is proposing a 2-child policy to keep its population under control, and it includes cash benefits for couples who opt for voluntary sterilization
| India is taking a leaf from China's population playbook with a proposed two-child policy in two states. The two-child policy in Uttar Pradesh would give cash benefits to couples who opt for voluntary sterilization. Meanwhile, those who choose to have more than two kids could have their government subsidies taken away. https://www.insider.com/india-2-child-policy-population-control-2021-7 good the world is overpopulated anyway |
| Now I know why so many Indian people immigrate to Canada. India seems like an authoritarian nightmare of a country. |
 This ground is soiled by those before me and their lies. I dare not look up for on me I feel their eyes |
| First world population are declining while third world shitholes are skyrocketing |
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Kayle_x_Morgana said: First world population are declining while third world shitholes are skyrocketing Maybe first world's racists/nationalists should make babies instead of being loser virgins on MAL. |
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Deathko said: Kayle_x_Morgana said: First world population are declining while third world shitholes are skyrocketing Maybe first world's racists/nationalists should make babies instead of being loser virgins on MAL. Obviously this is intended to be at me but I hate punk ass kids so never gonna happen. |
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| Not sure I agree with the sterilization part. Seems too exploitive of poor people which would cause a class demographic shift that will give the illusion Modi improved the living conditions for the poor while doing nothing for them. Plus surgery is a risky thing to undergo even when minor. Having government subsidies taken away also disproportionately effects the more poor people so that also is questionable. If anything what may be better is offer tax deductions based on how many kids someone has or does not have born after it's passed. However there may be flaws to that strategy as well because how should it be kept track of? By marriage? By names of parents on birth certificates? By paternity tests? Direct population control methods aside what overall is best is improve education in all areas both in cities and rural areas and provide infastructure needed for good health and improve worker's rights and guaranteed financial security. That would cause people to not reproduce so much though it will take time. Kayle_x_Morgana said: First world population are declining while third world shitholes are skyrocketing It's not declining. It grows every year. It's just the growth is declining which is a good thing. |
traedJul 18, 2021 10:34 PM
Kayle_x_Morgana said: Deathko said: Maybe first world's racists/nationalists should make babies instead of being loser virgins on MAL. Obviously this is intended to be at me but I hate punk ass kids so never gonna happen. You don't hate naked women but it's not happening either. |
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traed said: Kayle_x_Morgana said: First world population are declining while third world shitholes are skyrocketing It's not declining. It grows every year. It's just the growth is declining which is a good thing. Incorrect, the third world populations residing in the first world are increasing, whereas the native first world populations are declining. |
Deathko said: Kayle_x_Morgana said: First world population are declining while third world shitholes are skyrocketing Maybe first world's racists/nationalists should make babies instead of being loser virgins on MAL. I don't see the lie in what he said lol. Third-world shitholes are skyrocketing in natality rates specifically because they're shitholes and people lack the money and/or knowledge about contraception. Don't see how this is racist, it's just a fact. |
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RuneRem said: traed said: It's not declining. It grows every year. It's just the growth is declining which is a good thing. Incorrect, the third world populations residing in the first world are increasing, whereas the native first world populations are declining. Again no. Demographic groups also are not shrinking just growing at different rates. It's still all increasing. |
| So instead of hoping sex won't produce babies, wouldn't it be more practical to invest this policy into education, especially sex-ed since it leads to reduced birth rates. |
| "In the end the World really doesn't need a Superman. Just a Brave one" |
Silverstorm said: So instead of hoping sex won't produce babies, wouldn't it be more practical to invest this policy into education, especially sex-ed since it leads to reduced birth rates. yep this seems force and the natural way to solve overpopulation is empowering women like educating them and make them join the work force like what happened on rich western countries |
| When a nation gets overpopulated, it’s time to run that “One/Two/Three Child Policy” thingy. I hate this. |
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| lmao getting paid to cut off your balls. What a nice country. |
Hrybami said: lmao getting paid to cut off your balls. What a nice country. That's not how it works...like at all... |
traed said: Hrybami said: lmao getting paid to cut off your balls. What a nice country. That's not how it works...like at all... Ever heard of that thing called sarcasm? |
I mean people are that dumb so it doesn't come off sarcastic especially online with no tone of voice. |
| Voluntary sterilization? Outside of serial rapists, this crosses the line. No government should offer that to the average person, period. |
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Hoppy said: Voluntary sterilization? Outside of serial rapists, this crosses the line. No government should offer that to the average person, period. desperate times calls for desperate measures lol maybe the indian government will run out of budget and birth control is cheaper than maintaining a lot of decades of welfare pension or security |
| Well its happening in UP not in the whole country, so their is a chance of improvement,but I think GOI should now focus UCC tha. Population control bill, after all those who want to increase their population can only be controlled if their are put under same law. |
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| There are better and more ethical ways to winnow down the population. Education, contraception, lowering child mortality, vaccines, Anarcho-Darwinism, lifting people out of poverty, feminism, Anarcho-Darwinism, better healthcare, less corruption, Anarch... wait what? Why do I keep saying that? Just improve the living conditions and sex ED. The "1 or 2 child policy" is proved to be a failure by history. The government should not dictate how many babies you can or should have. Just look at what happened in China. |
| their government was too dumb that they have come up with voluntary sterilization. I don't think it will decrease the population rate at all. also, who sane persons are going to volunteer anyway, unless you're that greedy. 2 child policy is not gonna work either. they should've focused more on implementing sex education programs and subjects around the nation. |
"Increasing population is the root of major problems including inequality prevailing in the society. Population control is the primary condition for the establishment of an advanced society," What weird logic. Sounds like a scapegoat to me. 2.22 births per woman isn't even that huge. I'm sure they'll hit below replacement naturally soon enough anyway. |
| They should have done this sooner. About the sterilization. I'm all for it if it's truly voluntary. But I am doubtful, as it is often the case that such measures can be forced on people in places where the corrupt aren't held accountable. |
| Empower women within society at least in some small way, teach sufficient sex education and improve standards of living a little bit, not even anything near developed world levels just not dirt poor, and birth rates plummet as they've done almost everywhere in the world. But that's too logical and decent for authoritarian leaders, as always. |
| Engaging with those so clearly beneath you achieves nothing but lowering yourself to their level. |
Meanwhile, those who choose to have more than two kids could have their government subsidies taken away. Well, get ready for an even lower female-to-male ratio than what India's poorer regions currently have! Totally better than focusing on sex-ed and having a more widely available contraception methods. Totally solves the poor infrastructure in those communities. Totally. |
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| That's what happens when you have two majority religions that will do anything to stay in power. Literally procreating just to have numbers on your side is ridiculous. I know there's a lot more to it than that but I'm quite certain it's a factor. |
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| yeah that's good, too many feckers on this earth |
StarfireDragon said: Now I know why so many Indian people immigrate to Canada. India seems like an authoritarian nightmare of a country. Lol, it's happening only in Uttar Pradesh, not in entire country yet, and while I'm a RW nationalist, I don't really support this policy, coz look at Japan, their economy has been growing at an extremely slow pace (and even negative growth at times) since the 90s, and they also have one of the lowest birth rates in the world, so much that some of their leaders are willing to "import" people from other countries and cultures. On the other hand, I want same laws for all Indian residents irrespective of their caste, faith, religion, sect, etc. (ie, Uniform Civil Code or UCC in short), that is more than enough to solve all the anomalies caused by the former governments of the country (like exclusively allowing muslim men to practice polygamy by letting them marry upto 3/4 women of any religion, and giving benefits like reserved seats, jobs, etc to people born into lower castes/tribes). The people of India voted BJP massively since 2014 only for policies like these, and while it may seem quote-unqoute "authoritarian" to you, it is what the people of India, including me, want, and the extremely vocal minority, that has become completely "woke", who have zero productivity and only waste their time on the internet and other such shenanigans (there is a special term for such people, it is 'NEET' or 'not in education, employment or training'), well, like @AKA_Hornsby, no one gives a shit about them, and they can work their ass off and just fuck off to their wokeland (dreamland for wokes) called "US of A". Enjoy! |
| यदा यदा हि धर्मस्य ग्लानिर्भवति भारत। अभ्युत्थानमधर्मस्य तदात्मानं सृजाम्यहम् ॥४-७॥ परित्राणाय साधूनां विनाशाय च दुष्कृताम् । धर्मसंस्थापनार्थाय सम्भवामि युगे युगे ॥४-८॥ |
| "Right Wing nationalist" ew Anyways I'm not living in India so I'm not sure my two cents matter on this topic. India's population is high so I understand why this is being proposed. I was gonna say "yeah this seems fine" but also I don't wanna speak for Indians. |
| All measures taken to reduce population or population growth have succeeded at nothing but spiritually castrating the majority of their population. Quite frankly, I'd rather have a Malthusian catastrophe at some point then intentionally make it difficult for people to raise a family. |
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FierBub said: StarfireDragon said: Now I know why so many Indian people immigrate to Canada. India seems like an authoritarian nightmare of a country. Lol, it's happening only in Uttar Pradesh, not in entire country yet, and while I'm a RW nationalist, I don't really support this policy, coz look at Japan, their economy has been growing at an extremely slow pace (and even negative growth at times) since the 90s, and they also have one of the lowest birth rates in the world, so much that some of their leaders are willing to "import" people from other countries and cultures. On the other hand, I want same laws for all Indian residents irrespective of their caste, faith, religion, sect, etc. (ie, Uniform Civil Code or UCC in short), that is more than enough to solve all the anomalies caused by the former governments of the country (like exclusively allowing muslim men to practice polygamy by letting them marry upto 3/4 women of any religion, and giving benefits like reserved seats, jobs, etc to people born into lower castes/tribes). Good luck maintaining a healthy economy like that. Economic growth, and guaranteed jobs, are two concepts that are going to fundamentally end up clashing with each other at some point. When your economy ends up reliant on subsidized labour, it becomes difficult for the economy to flourish. The people of India voted BJP massively since 2014 only for policies like these, and while it may seem quote-unqoute "authoritarian" to you, it is what the people of India, including me, want, Doesn't matter to me, I can still have my opinion on it. "Majority rules" is a concept that I fundamentally disagree with anyway. and the extremely vocal minority, that has become completely "woke", who have zero productivity and only waste their time on the internet and other such shenanigans (there is a special term for such people, it is 'NEET' or 'not in education, employment or training'), well, like @AKA_Hornsby, no one gives a shit about them, and they can work their ass off and just fuck off to their wokeland (dreamland for wokes) called "US of A". Enjoy! That's nonsense as far as I can tell. They aren't leaving because they don't want to work. They just found better opportunities abroad. I've met tons of hard working Indian folk where I am. And it's good that they were able to find that opportunity. But unfortunately. due to your countries' lack of economic freedom, our country is directly subsidizing immigrant workers, and costing us a lot of money. So forgive me if I'm not exactly keen on your government's policies. |
This ground is soiled by those before me and their lies. I dare not look up for on me I feel their eyes |
StarfireDragon said: FierBub said: Lol, it's happening only in Uttar Pradesh, not in entire country yet, and while I'm a RW nationalist, I don't really support this policy, coz look at Japan, their economy has been growing at an extremely slow pace (and even negative growth at times) since the 90s, and they also have one of the lowest birth rates in the world, so much that some of their leaders are willing to "import" people from other countries and cultures. On the other hand, I want same laws for all Indian residents irrespective of their caste, faith, religion, sect, etc. (ie, Uniform Civil Code or UCC in short), that is more than enough to solve all the anomalies caused by the former governments of the country (like exclusively allowing muslim men to practice polygamy by letting them marry upto 3/4 women of any religion, and giving benefits like reserved seats, jobs, etc to people born into lower castes/tribes). Good luck maintaining a healthy economy like that. Economic growth, and guaranteed jobs, are two concepts that are going to fundamentally end up clashing with each other at some point. When your economy ends up reliant on subsidized labour, it becomes difficult for the economy to flourish. The people of India voted BJP massively since 2014 only for policies like these, and while it may seem quote-unqoute "authoritarian" to you, it is what the people of India, including me, want, Doesn't matter to me, I can still have my opinion on it. "Majority rules" is a concept that I fundamentally disagree with anyway. and the extremely vocal minority, that has become completely "woke", who have zero productivity and only waste their time on the internet and other such shenanigans (there is a special term for such people, it is 'NEET' or 'not in education, employment or training'), well, like @AKA_Hornsby, no one gives a shit about them, and they can work their ass off and just fuck off to their wokeland (dreamland for wokes) called "US of A". Enjoy! That's nonsense as far as I can tell. They aren't leaving because they don't want to work. They just found better opportunities abroad. I've met tons of hard working Indian folk where I am. And it's good that they were able to find that opportunity. But unfortunately. due to your countries' lack of economic freedom, our country is directly subsidizing immigrant workers, and costing us a lot of money. So forgive me if I'm not exactly keen on your government's policies. For your first point, I agree with you, that's why I initially said that I don't fully support it, but for the growth of a nation, it needs, for lack of better words, a "quality population", and in many cases, quality is inversely proportional to quantity, ie, the government is not able to spend a lot of money per capita on education and/or employment in the country if the population is massively high (like in India's case), so to ease their 'burden', governments use this policy, which, as long as it isn't forced on anyone but the serial criminals like rapists, is fair enough. On your second point, well, this is how it should happen imo, that in a democracy, majority should (and must imho) rule. I hold my opinion here, although I respect yours too, so I won't say much about it. Your third point, well, even I have relatives in US and Canada, and while they have their criticisms about the way things are done in India (and so do I), we all mostly are proud of being Indians by birth. My main issue with that guy was that he was "ashamed" of living in India and wanted to get out ASAP. And a lot of youngsters here, some even in my friend circles, have thoughts and opinions on similar lines, that they want to settle abroad, coz their country "sucks". But in reality, things aren't really that better elsewhere too, given the fact that in countries like USA, any legal adult can buy guns. I wouldn't feel safe if I were in the States tbh. TLDR; If you get better opportunities abroad, then there's nothing wrong in taking them and moving out, but I have absolutely zero respect for all those who have nothing but hatred and disgust for their country, you may not like it, but this is what I feel. I know there are a lot of countries that are not USA that are much better (like Finland), but I just wanted to give an example above. |
FierBubJul 25, 2021 8:59 AM
| यदा यदा हि धर्मस्य ग्लानिर्भवति भारत। अभ्युत्थानमधर्मस्य तदात्मानं सृजाम्यहम् ॥४-७॥ परित्राणाय साधूनां विनाशाय च दुष्कृताम् । धर्मसंस्थापनार्थाय सम्भवामि युगे युगे ॥४-८॥ |
| [quote=FierBub message=63904807] StarfireDragon said: FierBub said: Lol, it's happening only in Uttar Pradesh, not in entire country yet, and while I'm a RW nationalist, I don't really support this policy, coz look at Japan, their economy has been growing at an extremely slow pace (and even negative growth at times) since the 90s, and they also have one of the lowest birth rates in the world, so much that some of their leaders are willing to "import" people from other countries and cultures. On the other hand, I want same laws for all Indian residents irrespective of their caste, faith, religion, sect, etc. (ie, Uniform Civil Code or UCC in short), that is more than enough to solve all the anomalies caused by the former governments of the country (like exclusively allowing muslim men to practice polygamy by letting them marry upto 3/4 women of any religion, and giving benefits like reserved seats, jobs, etc to people born into lower castes/tribes). Good luck maintaining a healthy economy like that. Economic growth, and guaranteed jobs, are two concepts that are going to fundamentally end up clashing with each other at some point. When your economy ends up reliant on subsidized labour, it becomes difficult for the economy to flourish. The people of India voted BJP massively since 2014 only for policies like these, and while it may seem quote-unqoute "authoritarian" to you, it is what the people of India, including me, want, Doesn't matter to me, I can still have my opinion on it. "Majority rules" is a concept that I fundamentally disagree with anyway. and the extremely vocal minority, that has become completely "woke", who have zero productivity and only waste their time on the internet and other such shenanigans (there is a special term for such people, it is 'NEET' or 'not in education, employment or training'), well, like @AKA_Hornsby, no one gives a shit about them, and they can work their ass off and just fuck off to their wokeland (dreamland for wokes) called "US of A". Enjoy! That's nonsense as far as I can tell. They aren't leaving because they don't want to work. They just found better opportunities abroad. I've met tons of hard working Indian folk where I am. And it's good that they were able to find that opportunity. But unfortunately. due to your countries' lack of economic freedom, our country is directly subsidizing immigrant workers, and costing us a lot of money. So forgive me if I'm not exactly keen on your government's policies. For your first point, I agree with you, that's why I initially said that I don't fully support it, but for the growth of a nation, it needs, for lack of better words, a "quality population", and in many cases, quality is inversely proportional to quantity, ie, the government is not able to spend a lot of money per capita on education and/or employment in the country if the population is massively high (like in India's case), so to ease their 'burden', governments use this policy, which, as long as it isn't forced on anyone but the serial criminals like rapists, is fair enough. The fact that the service fails to provide doesn't have anything to do with the quality of the population. I don't see how it is the state's job to control the population, just because they can't provide for them. There are other ways to provide these services, so long as they are allowed to flourish, which, from what I understand, is difficult to do under such stringent regulations. On your second point, well, this is how it should happen imo, that in a democracy, majority should (and must imho) rule. I hold my opinion here, although I respect yours too, so I won't say much about it. Your third point, well, even I have relatives in US and Canada, and while they have their criticisms about the way things are done in India (and so do I), we all mostly are proud of being Indians by birth. My main issue with that guy was that he was "ashamed" of living in India and wanted to get out ASAP. And a lot of youngsters here, some even in my friend circles, have thoughts and opinions on similar lines, that they want to settle abroad, coz their country "sucks". But in reality, things aren't really that better elsewhere too, given the fact that in countries like USA, any legal adult can buy guns. I wouldn't feel safe if I were in the States tbh. TLDR; If you get better opportunities abroad, then there's nothing wrong in taking them and moving out, but I have absolutely zero request for all those who have nothing but hatred and disgust for their country, you may not like it, but this is what I feel. I know there are a lot of countries that are not USA that are much better (like Finland), but I just wanted to give an example above. People should be able to leave, if they find better opportunities, but I think you haven't brought that statement to it's logical conclusion. Which is that, the less oppurtunites that can be provided, the more people will end up leaving. The west might seem scary, but for a lot of people, the idea of self governance is more enticing than security. Although this is somewhat dying out, due to an increase in dependency on government. It might not be the perfect system, but it has allowed for more oppurtunities to become available, like the ones that your relatives over here have been able to procure for themselves. I can see where you are coming from, though. Nobody likes listening to how much their country sucks all the time. I just think that over time, you will find that, more and more people are going to leave, if something doesn't change. |
This ground is soiled by those before me and their lies. I dare not look up for on me I feel their eyes |
Kayle_x_Morgana said: First world population are declining while third world shitholes are skyrocketing Not really, third world countries have population momentum going for them, but their birth rates are following the same S curve that developed countries have. As they develop their birth rates plummet, global average fertility rate is already 2.2, I expect us to reach peak population by 2090 and start declining after. |
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| Either way it will take many years for India to fix itself and caste system is where it needs to start. Yes overpopulation is very big problem but the methods suggested here are near absurd |
| I support this policy wholeheartedly. India is overpopulated along with South Asia in general (Bangladesh, Pakistan, etc.), China is overpopulated, and Sub-Saharan Africa is overpopulated. Really, the entirety of the world is to some extent in terms of being far and away from ideal population figures, but those countries (and region) are some of the most egregious examples. It isn't from a resource perspective in terms of the distribution of resources, but from a deep ecology perspective. Of course, if you take the anthropocentric view, you'll support limitless human expansion and growth, but species of insects and bacteria exercise the same lack of selectivity and forethought; it isn't desirable. Mindless procreation is why so many species, at least from an external vantage point, live as zombies on autopilot. As if making more and more of oneself, either as an individual or on the collective level as a family, nation, or species, is an innate good in and of itself. A cockroach can "think" (or rather, follow chemically coded directives mandated by evolutionary biology unquestioningly into the abyss) on this same level. A dog can eat itself sick and dead. Every species acts on the implicit unspoken baseless assumption of "Wouldn't it be great if there were more of us?" but if any species is allowed to grow unchecked, they themselves take on the characteristics of a virus. All over the place, but especially in the northeastern and Midwestern U.S., deer run mindlessly into the roads and run at full speed into passing vehicles like a bazooka, TOW missile, or other projectile fired at a tank, causing many car accidents. There are too many deer. The deer are culled twice annually in an organized hunt. I support this. But the original problem of the overpopulation of the deer and why it causes problems for people is caused by humans in the first place - first by eradicating their natural predator in the area - the grey wolf, to pave the way for human settlement. Then from greedy and overzealous land development projects and constant bulldozing and laying waste the forest. So yes, the deer are a problem now, causing problems to humans, but the humans were the original problem, causing problems for their habitat and ecosystem. Anything allowed to grow mindlessly out of control for no good reason, "just because" is a problem and a threat. Just as weeds can overtake a garden, humans can overtake the Earth. But both should be avoided. A child should know better than to kill its mother. Ideally, the global population would be capped at around 1 billion. I tend to support any policies which contribute to population control, which is why I'm pro-abortion (pro-choice, but specifically pro-abortion in certain circumstances), pro-euthanasia, and pro-capital punishment. This falls into the same category; coordinated, purposeful, proactive, centrally planned and top-down birth control |
WatchTillTandavaJul 25, 2021 1:07 PM
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