| Bruh if your removeing bots then fmab is no more |
| 👉👌 |
345EdwardElric said: I'm saying that Symphogear XV is in the same boat, a rapid score increase after a certain episode doesn't mean it has to be boosted. I used KnY as an example of this because it's recent and everyone is familiar with it.Roevhaal said: Just like Kimetsu no Yaiba was upvoted by bots from 8.50 to 8.90, right? Uhm, not sure what you mean there, pretty sure that the vast increase in Kimetsu no Yaiba started happening since episode 19, which evidently created an enormous amount of hype amidst fans & blew up a good part of the anime community with its quality. It was after that when KnY's score surged from 8.50 to 8.60+ as it breezed into Top 20; with every upcoming episode after that, the scorce started increasing steadily to ultimately reaching a peak of 8.97 when the final episode aired. The rise in score was fast, but still not unnatural as in mostly increased with each & every episode, it was more due to how well-recieved most of the episodes since episode 19 were & due to strong seasonal hype. KnY's score has since been dropping from 8.97 (it's 8.88) now with the hype dying down gradually, so everything about its score increase feels pretty natural. |
| IR fans literally in shambles rn |
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Kineta said: Pingu in the City will also have its score adjusted for the vote brigading it received in 2017, moving from its current 8.43 to 6.80. Likewise, Pingu in the City (2018) moves from 7.80 to 6.68. If you wanna decide my and other's opinions on the best children's cartoon I've seen in years is invalid because it doesn't conform to what you think it should be, there are plenty of other sites to keep track of anime. Absolute bullshit. |
| "No, son, you may not have your body pillow at the dinner table!" |
| Gintama's franchise was the mostly affected by down votes I see, probs. all of the seasons were downvoted and now they're ranked higher. I'm happy. |
 |
Jack said: A mistake and incorrect are two different things, neither of which applied to what Shy said about the youtuber. It's treu a mistake and being incorrect are two differnt things. Still; it's not his assigment in deciding the youtuber in question is an asshole or not. That sentence really doesn''t belong there in that post that I've seen. For these kind of things you really need to be neutral and keep your own opinions for your own. He did a bad job on that part. With that sentence alone he just fueled the shit storm even more. That sentence was clearly an emotionial one. |
| Sorry, due to licensing limitations, this message is unavailable in your region. Please come drink tea, eat cake and procrastinate at the Cute Girls Doing Cute Things Club. We have simulwatches! \o/  |
| Finally! While I didn't expect big changes in top, I didn't expect them to be this small. Anyway, may this signal a new age of peace and prosperity. |
AhoOtoko said: Looks to me like Ishuzuko Reviewers is simply a well-received anime. Doesn’t seem like brigading to me. Seems more like “hardcore fans” are a tad upset the 10 Gintama installments are getting pushed down the list. *cough* Kineta said: If you post in this thread saying that this is not vote brigading, that Ishuzoku Reviewers was not vote brigaded, or initiate any other circular arguments relating to the voting brigade (and YouTube videos made in the last week about it), you risk receiving a trolling and/or spam ban. *cough* |
Fortune favours the bold!  |
Roevhaal said: I'm saying that Symphogear XV is in the same boat, a rapid score increase after a certain episode doesn't mean it has to be boosted. I used KnY as an example of this because it's recent and everyone is familiar with it. Well I haven't seen Symphogear XV and am not even familiar with the franchise so I can't really speak much for it, but did any of Symphogear's episode create as much hype amidst the anime community as episode 19 of KnY did. The fast & steady increase in KnY's score since episode 19 doesn't come of as that much suspicions, since taking a look at the episode 19 thread or some threads related to the topic of it, it becomes clear that the episode really did cause an enormous amount of hype amidst the fans/community, there were many people who were simply left stunned by it & even calling it one of the best episodes in battle shounen. So the score increase after that KnY can be attributed to how really well-recieved the episode was & the sheer hype it generated. But if no episode of Symphogear was able to create something close to the hype & gain the same level of acclamation from people that episode 19 of KnY did....& yet had an abrupt increase in its score, I kinda feel like that kinda sounds suspicious. |
| "There's no such thing as a painless lesson, they just don't exist. Sacrifices are necessary. You can't gain anything without losing something first. Although if you can endure that pain and walk away from it, you'll find that you now have a heart strong enough to overcome any obstacle. Yeah... a heart made full-metal." ~Edward Elric |
| So this is how democracy dies, with thunderous applause. |
DeathTheKid4 said: AhoOtoko said: Looks to me like Ishuzuko Reviewers is simply a well-received anime. Doesn’t seem like brigading to me. Seems more like “hardcore fans” are a tad upset the 10 Gintama installments are getting pushed down the list. *cough* Kineta said: If you post in this thread saying that this is not vote brigading, that Ishuzoku Reviewers was not vote brigaded, or initiate any other circular arguments relating to the voting brigade (and YouTube videos made in the last week about it), you risk receiving a trolling and/or spam ban. *cough* If AhoOtoko seriously risks that for calmly expressing their opinion without attacking anyone or even swearing, that's a ridiculous overstep to silence someone who doesn't agree with the majority - which scarily seems to be a running theme around here. |
| "No, son, you may not have your body pillow at the dinner table!" |
| Back in December, MAL ran a series of posts here and on their FB account giving a recap of 2019 (and of the decade), which included among other things the top 10 anime from Winter/Spring/Summer/Fall 2019. I remember 'Chihayafaru 3' did not appear on the Fall 2019 Top 10 list. Are there any plans to regenerate/repost these lists using the corrected scores? |
A møøse once bit my sister... |
GreenClock said: 90% sure that they don't use this method but i love it. Even 2 weeks gap for new accounts would work.Why didn't you just make any account that existed less than a year then its score becomes invalid until the user logs in again after a year? which I highly doubt a troll user would remember his password. |
CatSoul said: DeathTheKid4 said: *cough* Kineta said: If you post in this thread saying that this is not vote brigading, that Ishuzoku Reviewers was not vote brigaded, or initiate any other circular arguments relating to the voting brigade (and YouTube videos made in the last week about it), you risk receiving a trolling and/or spam ban. *cough* If AhoOtoko seriously risks that for calmly expressing their opinion without attacking anyone or even swearing, that's a ridiculous overstep to silence someone who doesn't agree with the majority - which scarily seems to be a running theme around here. There is already a thread about discussing that particular thing. If the mods said you risk a ban by trying to bring that discussion here, then so be it, it's their rules. |
Fortune favours the bold! |
| Amazing news! Now I am quite ashamed (rightfully so) of speaking ill about MAL mods in the past. Thank you for your work. |
mwalimu said: Back in December, MAL ran a series of posts here and on their FB account giving a recap of 2019 (and of the decade), which included among other things the top 10 anime from Winter/Spring/Summer/Fall 2019. I remember 'Chihayafaru 3' did not appear on the Fall 2019 Top 10 list. Are there any plans to regenerate/repost these lists using the corrected scores? Scores are always moving around regardless and this isn't really different from that, so there isn't much point in doing so. |
Ardanaz said: A user must have seen 1/5th of a show for their score to count. Was this information public before the changes of today? It does not seem to me like a great idea to give precise hints at future bot makers. By the way, does it means that a show with less a a fifth of episodes released will not have a score? This seems like a good idea to prevent from too much score hype. |
345EdwardElric said: It did but it stayed within the Symphogear fandom for the most part. see this reddit thread: https://www.reddit.com/r/anime/comments/cuwrnt/senki_zesshou_symphogear_xv_episode_8_discussion/Roevhaal said: I'm saying that Symphogear XV is in the same boat, a rapid score increase after a certain episode doesn't mean it has to be boosted. I used KnY as an example of this because it's recent and everyone is familiar with it. Well I haven't seen Symphogear XV and am not even familiar with the franchise so I can't really speak much for it, but did any of Symphogear's episode create as much hype amidst the anime community as episode 19 of KnY did. The fast & steady increase in KnY's score since episode 19 doesn't come of as that much suspicions, since taking a look at the episode 19 thread or some threads related to the topic of it, it becomes clear that the episode really did cause an enormous amount of hype amidst the fans/community, there were many people who were simply left stunned by it & even calling it one of the best episodes in battle shounen. So the score increase after that KnY can be attributed to how really well-recieved the episode was & the sheer hype it generated. But if no episode of Symphogear was able to create something close to the hype & gain the same level of acclamation from people that episode 19 of KnY did....& yet had an abrupt increase in its score, I kinda feel like that kinda sounds suspicious. |
dc22 said: So this is how democracy dies, with thunderous applause. Democracy died by no longer counting thousands of votes that were effectively by one person? |
| I, for one, am happy about Interspecies Reviewer's 7.60 score, it's the honest score. Thanks. |
| "Well, she's flatter than a pancake" -Mimi Alpacas "Woof" -Tobiichi Origami "Are you trying to turn the dormitory into a strip club!?! -Atena Saotome |
Meusnier said: Ardanaz said: A user must have seen 1/5th of a show for their score to count. Was this information public before the changes of today? It does not seem to me like a great idea to give precise hints at future bot makers. By the way, does it means that a show with less a a fifth of episodes released will not have a score? This seems like a good idea to prevent from too much score hype. It was at the top of the ranking page. |
icebergmm said: Meusnier said: Was this information public before the changes of today? It does not seem to me like a great idea to give precise hints at future bot makers. By the way, does it means that a show with less a a fifth of episodes released will not have a score? This seems like a good idea to prevent from too much score hype. It was at the top of the ranking page. Thank you for the information, I did not notice this point, and sorry for the useless question Ardanaz. |
| Great system and it looks like you guys have made a very accurate algorithm. I assume your developers use StackOverflow and know what kind of system they use. I'm surprised you don't just ignore all scores from users who haven't met a certain criteria until they've met it (when they will then be counted). E.g. account is 3 months old, semi regular activity, 25+ series. Anyway, I guess you guys might consider the concept in the future since you've got the infrastructure to modify the algorithm at this point. |
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Kineta said: Finally, the rating troll scoring system is not fixed, done, never to be looked at again. We anticipate malicious individuals will continue to try to break our new system and create even more accounts to manipulate votes in the future. Oh you surely can count on that. Especially the most malicious idiot of them all will keep making his accounts (in fact he made new ones about 50 minutes ago): I really hope his fake scores have now been made completely ineffective, because he certanily won't stop. He has been doing this for years already... |
| This is a nice feature for the people who obsess about the opinion based numbers that anime get. Now they don't have to worry about trolls putting a low number on their favorite anime! |
| I was so happy to see Black Clover going up gradually every 1-2 Episodes, now it's down 0.07 :( Which is strange cause you would think that people who actually troll would vote it lower because it originally was getting so many fake ratings, kinda weird that it went down and not up. |
| That's good news. Thumbs up to the admins. |
| I probably regret this post by now. |
HaXXspetten said: I get dyslexic with consonants sometimes, particularly when running on low sleep :'D Thank you, fixed.PS: You wrote Ishuzoku as Ishukozu a bunch of times -.^ biswa290701 said: Top 50 were already looked into. We updated their scores first so that the top pages wouldn't have series bouncing around for a week.I think the top 50 most popular animes should also be looked into. SNK s1 and SAO s1 scores are reducing for the past few days. gamers12 said: It was our intention to remove the score histogram with this update for the same reasons you state. However, after discussing it with the moderators and some 3rd party developers, we decided to keep it. The argument was that the majority of series in the database are not rating trolled, and it would be removing interesting information from most entries due to a select number of corrupted entries. Thus, we opted to keep it for now and remove it later if necessary.Then they should remove that Stats page all together if stats doesn't reflect score any more. It becomes confusing. When I made same calculation earlier my score was almost the same as in MAL calculation. That said, you've never been able to perfectly calculate the score from the stats, due to cache and weighted scoring. JDean773 said: They may change sliiiiightly due to the weighted scoring (which all other entries in the database contribute to), but they shouldn't really.snk s3 part 2 only got up to 9.09?? i swear it should be a lot higher than that its insane. i hope it rises in the coming 7 days. is it even possible for any more titles in the top 10 to still change over this next week? borderliner said: I understand your concern, borderliner. When I got the new calculated score back from the tech team, I thought, "I wish it were 0.1~0.2 higher..." However, the way we chose to tackle it made logical sense before knowing the recalculated score, so fiddling with it more after to achieve a different score truly felt like we would be manipulating it ourselves to prevent backlash.Hi Kineta, I find it troubling that IR got pushed back down to 7.57 which is a value it had passed by the 26th Jan. More so since it was trending up from the 22nd Jan - 31st Jan and this trend accelerated from the 1st Feb to the 4th Feb I strongly suspect you have punished legitimate accounts wishing to support this show. Wonderllama5 said: I wish there was an algorithm to prevent Gintama from dominating the top 10 Farabeuf said: Yes, when I was making the Top 50 graph, I was reminded why Gintama probably receives so many downvotes as it does, with the series occupying 7 slots of 50. I'd like to see this handled in the future, but on my own personal priority list, there are other things I think MAL needs beforehand. (Note: I don't make all the decisions of what gets prioritized, just stating my opinion.)If you're ever considering future improvements in the futre, you might want to consider pooling several seasons of the same series as one entry. You already do it for lets say LOGH. It would really help addressing the issue of sequel bias. Farabeuf said: Yes.Did I understand correctly and the accounts of which scores have been ignored are not made aware of this fact? -Aincrad- said: "Perfectly calculated" is debatable. But to answer your question, the tech team gave me a data dump of every anime in the database with before and after stats of scored members, score, rank, etc in December. Over the Christmas holidays, I combed through the All Member pages of many, many entries to check that the number of accounts which were discounted matched illegitimate voting patterns I could see from the entries. Luna was also monitoring illegitimate account creation for 5 years and saw many different score patterns over those years. The series which changed were series she expected would be.This is great, but I still have one, but important question. How did you test it? How do you know for sure, that your algorithm indeed works the way intended, and the scores are perfectly calculated? enJ0Yable said: Unfortunately, that would give someone looking to break the system too much ammunition.Could you maybe provide information how many percent of accounts have been "blacklisted" by this system, per anime? So for example, how many of the 1.170.000 MAL members that rated SAO season 1 still contribute to its score? That would help seeing the impact on the site and/or on specific anime... 345EdwardElric said: All entries in the database are being recalculated based on the same set of conditions (the two vote brigaded series I mentioned aside). If BnHA fell due to rating troll accounts, the score will be adjusted.I think my previous post was a bit too lengthy for people to spot my question which I put there at the end, so I'll say it again. My Hero Academia's scores (all seasons) have been dropping kinda unnaturally/drastically fast over the last few months as I've seen, so has it also been affected by the downvoting problem? If that's the case then can we hope to see some adjustment in the scores of the MHA seasons as well? Skadi said: I'm not sure I understand what you're suggesting here.Wouldn't it be simpler to just not have the scores count for the All-Time lists for shows that are currently airing, or to just not count as much? There is a seasonal list too and if something is brigaded and trolled it would only really affect that list. Skadi said: We're not trying to read anyone's minds with their votes. All entries in the database are being recalculated to discount duplicate accounts to manipulate the score, as you stated you agree with.It bothers me alot that people seem to want to try to read people's minds in their votes. The only entries with anything "more" than that are Ishuzoku Reviewers and Pingu. We need to treat Isuzoku Reviewers differently to discount thousands of scores given at the direction of 1 YouTuber. He didn't say, "This anime is great, you should watch it." He didn't say, "I love this anime and gave it a 10." He said, "Click this link, login or make an account, and vote this anime a 10." You might like to think people can think for themselves, and I would like to think the same as well. But studies on mob lynching and group thinking prove otherwise. So does the fact that the stats page burst into a flurry of accounts giving the series a 10 - with episodes seen of 0/12, 12/12, etc. - and an entry with 9,500 scored members suddenly grew by 7,000+ 10s in only a few hours. So we're not trying to read anyone's minds. What we're trying to do is not allow any random internet user with a bit of online fame to dictate our database scores. The only entries we will ever take such measures with will be vote brigaded entries, and the community will be informed when an entry has been deemed to be vote brigaded. NeoAnkara said: Pages are cached at different intervals, so over the next ~7 days, a lot of entries will probably be out of sync.There is discrepancy between score shown in actual series page and seasonal page. Case in point Bang Dream 3rd season is 7.89 on seasonal page but on the show page the score is 7.74. Ericonator said: The scoring system is still essentially the same weight score calculation. What has changed is the automatic exclusion of duplicate account scores without Luna needing to manually delete the accounts to make the scores not count. What makes an account a "duplicate" will not be stated publicly.Are you going to release how the new scoring system will work to the public? matteas said: No, I fear that would be massaging the scores too much. Each legitimate user gets 1 account and 1 vote. It's up to them what to do with it. Vote brigaded entries will be the only exception out of necessity, and the community will be informed when an entry has been deemed to be vote brigaded for transparency.But if that 1/10 is from a totally legitimate user who is let's say a fanboy of an anime that could be overtaken, then I think it's very difficult to decide that it's an invalid vote. Does the new system also try to address and counter such behaviour, some kind of mass up/downvoting from legitimate accounts? I think that would be very difficult and if there is a countermeasure for that in the new system, then I'm impressed. Meusnier said: I believe the adjustment is done when the series completes, but I'm not 100% sure. It's too difficult to not show any score until a certain percentage of episodes are release because many series air without definitive episode counts (and consider entries like One Piece or Detective Conan...)By the way, does it means that a show with less a a fifth of episodes released will not have a score? This seems like a good idea to prevent from too much score hype. |
KinetaFeb 12, 2020 10:18 AM
| Looking forward to seeing chihayafuru with a propper rating again. |
 |
| Since @Kineta is here I just want to ask is Nogi Wakaba score really fall that hard? I know that log ago before mass upvote happen the score is at least 8.50-8.51. After all it;s the series that affected the most out of all on this list. BobRossTree said: Tell that to people that participate in a thread with 50+ page rant about score this week alone.who cares about scores? |
NeoAnkaraFeb 12, 2020 10:18 AM
 Kickstarter for Rokujouma is fully funded. Good work everyone. Lets wait for the result of our hard work together. |
| mods,whatchu gonna do if some anime discord server/ some anime series subreddit try to rally a mass voting again ? where to report that shit ? |
Timz0r said: Jack said: Yeah we're definitely the ones stopping you from being a MAL mod, otherwise you'd have no problem ;p Oh it's you! I remember you! F for my pretty well thought out Clannad - JoJo recommendation. If I'm honest: I would if only I had the spare time, really... If you wanna fight weaponized autism, you gotta use weaponized autism. It's just that I'm already using my weaponized autism towards paleontology. ;-( But really joke's aside; some staff here really need to look at the mirror once again and have a reality check. Mods and administators need to admit they make mistakes awell and should apologize whenever possiblle. Shymander should not have putted that sentence in calling Nux Taku an asshole. That was a mistake on his part. I am not used to replying to any message in the forums. However, I think that you are mistaken about the staff. We are devoting our free time to help the community and we are glad to do it. Furthermore, I know that we are not perfect and that we made mistakes. For example, replying to you could be one mistake because this thread is for other information, such as the changes in the scoring system. Changing the subject, I am glad that there is a new tool that could help us to prevent false votes that affect directly the rating. Furthermore, I do not share some negative comments saying that the system will fail or that the MAL score system is irrelevant. If it is irrelevant, then why the influencers see it as a target? The answer is simple, it is relevant for most of the persons; that's why the dev team took time working in an algorithm and coding it. I thank the team for all the magnificent job. These changes will help MAL to improve. |
unamerican said: Hopefully this'll fix the Interviewers show score... ? The score is 7.60 atm, the original score was around that before the vote trolls. |
| "Well, she's flatter than a pancake" -Mimi Alpacas "Woof" -Tobiichi Origami "Are you trying to turn the dormitory into a strip club!?! -Atena Saotome |
| maybe a delayed hidden scoring system would work better for airing shows. that way votebombing anime up or down would deter trolls from sabotaging seasonal charts. |
 |
icebergmm said: Jack said: A mistake and incorrect are two different things, neither of which applied to what Shy said about the youtuber. Except calling someone an asshole, even justified as it was, doesn't help matters any. All it did was paint a target on his back. But we should probably get back on topic. May as well call it like it is if they bend over backward to be outraged about "lost his marbles." I chose to stand up for my colleagues and friends being unjustly dragged into this mess despite the risk, and I'd gladly do it again. |
ChocoPuni said: I appreciate the addition. That said, I think you should focus on making a NSFW toggle for the website, so that all of the pornography content would be blurred off or turned off completely if someone doesn't want to see that. It's ridiculous and unacceptable that an anime such as that Reviewers one had a chance of being in top aired in the first place, and that everyone on MAL had to see it. When I was very new to anime, I would often use Top Airing page to find something new to watch. You have no idea how many casual anime viewers go there and it's not ok to give off an impression that "watching anime" equals "being ok with morally disgusting pornography". It's rated R+, so even if MAL introduced a toggle to remove hentai from public listings, it would still be visible. Because it's not hentai. |
| "No, son, you may not have your body pillow at the dinner table!" |
| Thank you for your hard work. |
 |
| finally some changes happend. great system and gonna say great job to all mal people who did this changes |
cl_skinnyguyFeb 12, 2020 10:47 AM
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ChocoPuni said: I appreciate the addition. That said, I think you should focus on making a NSFW toggle for the website, so that all of the pornography content would be blurred off or turned off completely if someone doesn't want to see that. It's ridiculous and unacceptable that an anime such as that Reviewers one had a chance of being in top aired in the first place, and that everyone on MAL had to see it. When I was very new to anime, I would often use Top Airing page to find something new to watch. You have no idea how many casual anime viewers go there and it's not ok to give off an impression that "watching anime" equals "being ok with morally disgusting pornography". Anything classed as hentai is already excluded from the rankings. There are, of course, a handful of series that push the borders of what can get away with not counting as pornographic, but you have to draw the line somewhere. |
| There is no such thing as shit taste. Only idiots who think everyone should have the same taste as they do. |
Shymander said: icebergmm said: Except calling someone an asshole, even justified as it was, doesn't help matters any. All it did was paint a target on his back. But we should probably get back on topic. May as well call it like it is if they bend over backward to be outraged about "lost his marbles." I chose to stand up for my colleagues and friends being unjustly dragged into this mess despite the risk, and I'd gladly do it again. I know you mean you'd stand up for them again. But the same people who targeted you for the tweet are probably going to claim you mean you'd throw fuel on the fire again. |
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