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| Oh wow, I really didn't expect Maria and Mamarou to actually be dead. All along I thought they were the brains behind this offense and they were just using the monster rats. That Squealer bastard! He must have sheltered the two of them until they eventually had a child, then killed them in cold blood. How pitiful! |
| Best episode so far. I wasn't expecting such outcome, that Queerats are abducting human childs.. |
| So if Maria got killed after giving birth, why did Saki say it was better if she wasn't born to begin with? Mamoru could have still run off and some other chick could have stayed behind and gave birth to the future ogre, so why only antagonizing Maria? Mamoru shares just as much fault as Maria for having a child. Hate that rat fucker, I wouldnt be surprised if he lobotomized the two and used them for breeding purposes, killed them off, and sent the two their real skeletons. *shiver* |
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| Ooooh, so it was Maria and Mamoru's child. I thought Maria (+ mayba Mamoru) wasn't really dead, but rather had turned into a fiend. Well them having a kid was another possibility of course, and it makes sense if you consider what Maria said in a previous episode. SaveTheAralSea said: Hate that rat fucker, I wouldnt be surprised if he lobotomized the two and used them for breeding purposes, killed them off, and sent the two their real skeletons. *shiver* Haha, well at least that's the kind of fucked up things one can imagine happening in this show by now. |
| Wait what? Wouldn't the ogre just turn on the rat people? How did they even create an ogre? |
| OH my god... Everything in the grand scheme... Everything as planned... This series is fucking amazing. Yoshimaru is a fucking bastard, but is he wrong? |
| "Justice Never Dies!" - Kenji Endou, 20th century Boys |
| As I suspected, the child of Maria and Mamoru is the Ogre. What a destructive force they have when there are no checks and balances on their minds. A few episodes ago I was criticizing their society for the way it treated his young, but this episode makes me question myself. Squealer is a vicious, scheming fiend, but you cannot deny his genius. He masterminded a plan that utterly and completely outwitted and destroyed the society that the Elders had so carefully put together. They going to have to remove the Death of Shame limitation from some of them, if they want to survive. I don't know what Squealer can do with 10 children like that. |
| "Perhaps there is a universal, absolute truth. Perhaps it justifies every question. But that's beyond the reach of these small hands." Mamoru Oshii There is a cult of ignorance (...) nurtured by the false notion that democracy means that “my ignorance is just as good as your knowledge.” Isaac Asimov |
43211 said: Wait wait wait!!! So why are the fiends so overpowered? Why cant they be affected by the whole revenge death thing? It seems to me like they are just psychos with magic ability. What makes them so much stronger then the other humans? Was this explained in episodes 1-21? If so, I think I missed it. Wow Squealer. Youre one of the greatest villains in anime history I have ever seen. smth in the genetic code "death feedback" kills you when you kill another human or want to kill him. Fiends are people where this genetic code through an illness doesnt work anymore and they go amok. Example: Imagine 20 people in a class, 1 somehow is brainill and doesnt care about ethics, and has a machine gun with ammu, while the others have machineguns without amu, because they cant kill each other. And since he is a madman he just shoots all in the class :P ^^ |
| My favorite quotes from animes: Those who seek miracles will never experience one. The hand of salvation only extends to people who try to make miracles happen. - Ef a tale of melodies. I destroy worlds. I create worlds. - Code geass We are humans. - Shinsekai yori 100 push-ups, 100 sit-ups, 100 squats, and a 10km run EVERY SINGLE DAY!!! - One punch man |
| I have nothing to say except... what a horrifying episode. That Hitler comparison from a few threads back is really sounding legit right about now. |
 ☩ Discord: the.path.to.pathos ☩ RateYourMusic ☩ last.fm |
| Lel, I just didn't get if Mamorou and Maria made that baby themselves, or did the Monster Rats made it for them, with their cells. That kid is cool nevertheless :Đ I like how he beat that double pupils guy, he was just starting to get annoying ;) Kudos <3 And I have no idea who that other random guy was. Izumi or whatevs. |
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| I've read the explanation of Squeeler's plan, but it doesn't make sense. Remember that while humans are psychologically conditioned not to hurt other humans, it is the genetic modifications added to the gene pool that cause attack inhibition and death feedback. The lack of conditioning and education would mean the child wouldn't know not to attack, but as soon as it did, it would die. Perhaps a few would be killed first, but that's not what happened. Remember, the "Fiends" are created by a genetic mutation of the genes controlling the death feedback. Raising a kid as a murder machine wouldn't make the mutation happen on its own. |
thaumx said: I've read the explanation of Squeeler's plan, but it doesn't make sense. Remember that while humans are psychologically conditioned not to hurt other humans, it is the genetic modifications added to the gene pool that cause attack inhibition and death feedback. The lack of conditioning and education would mean the child wouldn't know not to attack, but as soon as it did, it would die. Perhaps a few would be killed first, but that's not what happened. Remember, the "Fiends" are created by a genetic mutation of the genes controlling the death feedback. Raising a kid as a murder machine wouldn't make the mutation happen on its own. you are wrong. its about killing your own kind. But the kid was grown under squealers care without any human contact so ofc it thinks its a rat herself. Thats why the deathfeedback doesnt work when she kills humans. Thats also the reason why at the fight between the colonies, there was a report that all arrows were not used, like when a cantus caught them in midair.... she didnt kill any rats there. just stopped the range attacks. |
| My favorite quotes from animes: Those who seek miracles will never experience one. The hand of salvation only extends to people who try to make miracles happen. - Ef a tale of melodies. I destroy worlds. I create worlds. - Code geass We are humans. - Shinsekai yori 100 push-ups, 100 sit-ups, 100 squats, and a 10km run EVERY SINGLE DAY!!! - One punch man |
| From what I saw and heard on the show, it sounds like Yakumaro forced Mamoru and Maria to have a baby and then first killed Maria when mamoru wasn't around.Then he killed Mamoru when he saw Maria's dead body. Then they took the baby from them. |
| Yakomaru is frightening. |
| Hell of an information drop. So this is Maria's and Mamoru's child, - she does look like both of them a lot btw :D Yakumaru's big plan explained, making fiends over time with the children of humans ... Great episode for sure. |
PrOxAntoJul 21, 2019 5:14 AM
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| This is one of the exceptional time that I don't want the bad guy to win. I can't handle this. |
KotobakayaroNov 2, 2015 9:14 AM
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GuidedCursor said: This is one of the exceptional time that I don't want the bad guy to win. I can't handle this. I take back my word, I think I truly know the point of the show now. |
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| Rofl. . |
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| That rule is so stupid (death feedback thing) So it was Maria's daughter, That plan Yakomaru made is smart, it was a shock moment when they did those flashback scenes, now it makes sense why they killed the queens, GREAT! Excellent Episode. |
| Well yikes. They should have just let Squealer die all those years ago |
| Intense episode. How do the monster rats survive from the ogre? |
| If there's one thing I can laud this series for, it's that pretty much every single event actually has great significance. Every little thing shown in the earlier episodes has come full circle and became relevant. Not too sure on Satoru's revelation of it being Maria and Mamoru's child though. We as the viewers were given hints, flashbacks and the like, but Satoru has just came up with that seemingly out of nowhere. He hasn't been shown discussing it or theorising about it. If we weren't given Narrative Saki's regrets, if we weren't shown that random scene of Maria mentioning a child, the notion of it being their child would be less prolific. The execution of this has been a little shabby, which is a shame. Still wondering why Fiends don't suffer from death feedback. It's been proven that it's not just a mental thing - even though it also can be - when humans died after accidentally killing other humans without realising it. It seems really inconsistent. If you kill a rat or whatever but you think it's a human, you get death feedback. If you kill a human but 100% believe it's not a human, you STILL get death feedback. So why is it Fiends don't get it? Even if they don't mentally consider other humans to be the same as itself, we've been shown that it's more than just a mental thing, so it should be affecting them. Furthermore, the attack inhibition is not a good excuse for no-one sacrificing themselves to take out the Fiend. The priest guy who got murdered by cantus leakage was shown to be able to split the ground underneath the Fiend's feet, causing her to fall down. This shows he can use his Cantus against Fiends / humans in a non-direct manner. What, then, was stopping him from simply covering up the hole he just made and burying the Fiend in the process? He split the ground and made a hole, and then he would be simply covering it up. All indirect, so the Attack Inhibition wouldn't have taken effect. In this way it seems rather simple to take the Fiend out. |
MazApr 29, 2016 5:05 AM
 It's an entirely different kind of flying, altogether! It's an entirely different kind of flying. |
Maz said: Yeah I found that weird and surprising as well for him to suddenly blurt it out although we as an audience could already have an educated guess about it. Not too sure on Satoru's revelation of it being Maria and Mamoru's child though. We as the viewers were given hints, flashbacks and the like, but Satoru has just came up with that seemingly out of nowhere. He hasn't been shown discussing it or theorising about it. If we weren't given Narrative Saki's regrets, if we weren't shown that random scene of Maria mentioning a child, the notion of it being their child would be less prolific. The execution of this has been a little shabby, which is a shame. What the hell Shisei?! And I thought you were the greatest of the Cantus users, such a shame. X_x Well the death feedback mechanism is working as advertised and it's also gonna be the death of the human race, for the PK-enabled at least. What's the use of the powers when you can't use them to even defend yourself from extinction? In the end, it's back to good ol' human hubris. |
| You see there's no need to wonder where your god is, Coz he's right here! ...and he's fresh out of mercy. |
| Kaburagi killed so easily? Mamoru and Maria child? Unthinkable. How did Maria did it to Mamoru since she loves Saki? Okay, another world conquest. I have seen lot of anime regarding conquest. 2.2/5 |
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| Damn I also liked Shisei... he seems nice. But fucking hell, I knew it was related to Maria. But her own daughter? Fuck. Wait a minute... so when Tomoko said that the dental record perfectly matches Maria and Mamoru, that means they're really dead?! Fucking Yakomaru. |
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Cirris said: If you haven't put 2 and 2 together. Robber fly colony promised the bones of the two escapees, Mamoru and Maria. But they said it would take time. Essentially they needed time for Maria and Mamoru to mate and have a child. I'm pretty sure that Squealer sweet talked them into staying with them. When the child was born shortly thereafter, they eliminated the two and gave the bones to the ethics committee as proof. The little brat was brought up to be the perfect killing machine. He was nursed outside of human control so all the mental barriers placed on the humans with the rituals doesn't apply to him. He is pretty much Squealer's nuclear weapon against the humans. Thanks for this. I feel like I need to go back and give this show a second viewing to pick up on some of its particulars. |
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on 
| HOLY SHIT MAN.... The depths of Yakomaru's evil is boundless. To think what he forced Maria and Mamoru to do... |
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I think they died, they gave birth to the child and then that fucker killed them, and used their child, which pisses me off even more since first I shit on Mamoru x Maria, and wanted Maria x Saki, second I wanted to see more of Maria, and she is DEAD!!! FUCK!!!! They should have killed that Squealer bastard from the start, all of what they could have prevented... this is so retarded, all the more a fiend is really that powerfull, fuck no! If people got organized, they could kill him, you only need some to act as sacrifices for the death feedback, and then it is done! I so much want to go on rant right now, I like the show, but the direction it takes just pisses me off (I wanted Maria to be the fiend too), the humans have they cantus, no matter how sneaky that asshole was, everything that happened is just retarded. So how do I feel about this third arc?!  |
PlaycoolNov 18, 2016 4:25 PM
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| I knew from the beginning that this rat was kinda fishy. |
| Dub = fake crap. Always. |
| Fist step Kamisu, Second Step Japan, Third Step The World. EP 21. Plot: Kaburagi rises to begin a counterattack on the Queer Rats. Unfortunately the Ogre has appears and its Maria's and Mamoru's kid. He makes short work of Kaburagi, the strongest in Kamisu. Saki and Satoru get info from a queer rat and learn not only the depths of which they are committed to this plan but apparently the Ogre is the Messiah and the humans are the Ogres for oppressing the Queer rats for so long. Later they manage to escape to the Temple and learn from Inui-san that Squeara's true plan was to nab the children. For with more children, he will have more Ogres. Character:Squeara is an evil great strategist. If it gos to his plan, he has already won. Saki, its time for another breakdown but one you gotta get over quickly. It's time to step up. Satoru, you keep doing you. Animation/sound: The Ogre's appearance and massacre was horrifying. Not just because of its strength but because of the implications behind him and what the future holds for those other babies. 5/5. OF COURSE! Squera wants to rule the world. |
 I go where I wanna go, even if its into Oppai. |
| Shiseis death was cruel.. And what ? Maria and Mamoru had a child ? That was quite surprising tbh as well as Squealers ambitious plan to build up a army of Demons. |
One Piece episode 914 & 915 & 1027 were a mistake and 957 brought the salvation - FMmatron |
| This is a plan so brilliant, it makes me want to root for the rats. Squealer for world domination. Those stupid humans deserve it. |
| No, another awesome side character dies :( Shisei was so cool ... and the Fiend, confirmed to be Maria and Mamoru's child, kills him >_< Dang she's definitely crazy, and so is Yakomaru's plan ... steal children and use their Cantus to kill everyone. So I get the Fiend is cooperating with the queerats since they raised her, but how does that prevent her from killing all of them too? Not to mention did they kill Maria and Mamoru after she gave birth so they could use their bones as evidence? I mean even if they had sex right after they left, the queerats would have to wait 9 months before they could kill them ... OK, and what happened to Niimi? It doesn't seem like he survived but he managed to get to the town hall and warn people by playing that Go Home song? I'm confused T_T Well either way how are they going to defeat the queerats?! :O Come on Saki I know you can think of something :P |
| No wonder Saki said that if she hadn't been born, none of this would have happen. If they didn't break the False library creature's defense mechanism, they wouldn't have learn all their secrets. If they didn't get info about the Trickster cat, Mamou and Maria wouldn't have left the village. If they didn't help that dirty rat to win the war, none of this would have happen in the first place. Honestly many time I wanna say just kill that dirty scumbag , but they did not do that whatsoever. |
| I was wrong. It's embarrassing, but I'm glad I was. So the fiend isn't Maria, but her kid. This makes more sense, and is also more interesting. Now I see that in Maria's comment in one of the earlier episodes about not being able to have a baby with Saki was hinting to these developments. |
LeeTailorNov 1, 2017 2:38 AM
| So, that little brat is the son/daughter of Maria and Mamoru. He or she is Squealer's trump card. Oh, no, the most powerful user of Cantus is dead. 4/5 |
| All weebs creatures of the galaxy, hear this message. Those of you who listen will not be struck by western animation. You will no longer know hunger, nor pain. Your Anime have come to lead you now. Our strength shall serve as a luminous sun toward which all intelligence may blossom. And the impervious shelter beneath which you will prosper. However, for those who refuse our offer and cling to their western animation ways… For you, there will be great wrath. |
| That bastard killed Maria and Mamoru after there child was born, this episode explained a lot. |
| Man, the feeling of hope is extracted from everyone's faces and crushed in the palms of the Queerats. Squealer really made use of his anger towards humanity and came up with a near perfect plan. Knowledge is power indeed. |
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Cirris said: If you haven't put 2 and 2 together. Robber fly colony promised the bones of the two escapees, Mamoru and Maria. But they said it would take time. Essentially they needed time for Maria and Mamoru to mate and have a child. I'm pretty sure that Squealer sweet talked them into staying with them. When the child was born shortly thereafter, they eliminated the two and gave the bones to the ethics committee as proof Thank you! Wow, seriously got the chills when they lifted their head. This show is absoloutely outstanding at settng an atmosphere. Do have some issues with the weird pacing, especially in the first half and fact the characters don't show much emotion, again mostly in the first half. Always feel like I'm watching this from an outsiders perspective rather than fully immersed but that said, it does some things extremely well. Looking forward to the last few eps. |
| Must. Fucking. Slaughter. YAKOMARU!!!!!!!!!!!! D:< Is Kiroumaru ever gonna return? :( I'm pretty sure he's alive, mang Surprised that was Maria and Mamoru's kiddo D: I thought it was Maria turned crazy haha X) no wonder the character design was a little different, but I assumed it was her disheveled crazy woman form lmfao oops :P Someone kill the fiend ;[ who cares about death feedback if you can save so much more :3 |
| Okay wtf, they hyped Shisei so much and he died in such a pathetic way, fucking lame man Marias kid annoys the fuck out of me, I know hes being manipulated but its frustrating to see him slaughter everyone with a big fat grin And Yeah, everyone says Squealers plan was clever but hes still the biggest piece of shit I have seen in a long time. I hope that Kiroumaru gets the chance to murder his rat ass into oblivion. |
Zip_ZipFeb 25, 2019 7:44 PM
| Fuck, Shisei shouldn't have shown constraint and go all out, dying of death feedback but taking the Fiend with him. I still stand by my argument from the previous episode discussion that there should've been a countermeasure like altering the genome of some strong and trusted people to make the death feedback nonlethal. I don't think Squealer waited for Maria and Mamoru to feel like having a baby, just saying. Because he couldn't have made Ethical Committee wait too much for the bones or else they'd start suspecting a scheme. I think we can assume that some really messed up things happened to the two. |
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| The animation is and consistently was spotty but can't see the issues some have about the directing. It's directed and scripted very well. |
| Go Squealer Go! Put those humans to the lash. I’m real thankful there’s something in this series to root for. |
| Somehow Maria and Mamoru was killed after they had their daughter, who was raised wildly and become an ogre. The rat was planning this since the start, when lied about making "fake bones" to fool the Concil. As Saki, after come back to Tomiko, also lied saying Maria/Mamoru bodies fell in the mountains, the Concil had no other option then wait to the rats return that proof to them, what happened at least 8 months later. Finally the ogre girl is not affect by the Shame not only for being an ogre, but also because she dont see the humans as humans like her. |
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