Fate/kaleid liner Prisma☆Illya 3rei!! Episode 11 Discussion

ShinsoPriest said:
Is this the same studio that animated the first season?

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ShinsoPriest said:
Forget the manga, the animation quality in this episode is just abysmal. What happened?

I'm getting flashbacks from one of the other Fate animes.

Linkark07 said:
All I can say is that this is miles better than Ufotable or Deen. But that isn't enough, this episode felt quite mediocre. Shame. Hopefully they don't screw up next season... meh, who am I kidding, they will disappoint too. Better not get our hopes up.

MightyM16 said:
And to think that there were people who wanted SL to adapt the F/SN main routes

And to think that there were people who actually thought SL could put a better animation work than Ufotable

And to think that there were people who actually though SL would deliver the hypest moment of 3rei properly when every other manga shot was underwhelming

MightyM16 said:

Hopefully SL can pull a decent finale next week at least. They fit Prisma but this episode showed they wouldn't be able to handle a true VN route

astroprogs said:

SL is way more than capable of doing really good action. 3rei is literally the first time they screwed up an action scene this badly.

Also, i don't think anyone really expected better animation than ufo from SL. We expected what SL dilevered for 3 seasons prior.

Not that i'd want SL to do F/SN anyway, but do you really think that SL would give the same budget and attention to mainline Fate as they give Prillya? Let's not kid ourselves now.

TheLittleRedHero said:

By the way a few people were saying that this is the first time SL had screwed over the art/animation department.

MightyM16 said:

SL had a way better deal through the lat few seasons because they had more SOL to work with it, only 10 episodes and most battles weren't as hectic as the ones in 3rei, that's mainly why they could put ome good, quality work. In fact you can see how the animation quality ecreased in this season, a lot of animation spots were awfully underwhelming, specially when you compare them to the manga

Anyway I just pointed that out becaue there are some people here who truly though that SL could handle a F/SN route in the same way they do Prisma, which was confirmed as a mistaken assumption due to this season as a whole

TheLittleRedHero said:


Honestly I think they kind of went too delusional. Yes true I love Silver Link and I love Kaleid... but honestly I wasn't expecting maybe for them to do like the other adaptations... Its simply impossible in a way. Are they the worst studio? Nah. But you do need a lot to work on for this, with planning, getting the good animators, etc. They just seem to rush things here as far as I can tell because, I'll be fair the previous Kaleids were pretty nice, and if I remember, they were 10 episodes each, and if I remember, they aired at the third to fourth week, which gives them a lot of time to work on things.

astroprogs said:
[
Prillya's resources allocation is proportional to its profitability. 3rei needed F/SN's budget, time and staff, which Prillya's profitability simply didn't warrant.
3rei's circumstances are in no way applicable to a F/SN adaptation, if SL were ever to do one. The reasons why 3rei looks this way is exclusive to Prillya, not SL as a whole.

MightyM16 said:

"Budget" most of the time isn't the problem but time constraints, the fact that we are seeing this QUALITY implies lack of organization and actual quality work from SL, specially considering they are a smaller animation studio compared to other ones

MightyM16 said:
Simply put, they didn't prepare well for 3rei or they aren't putting enough effort because they know that what makes Prisma afloat is the loli merchandise that it manages to sell

astroprogs said:

Again, project priority. Studios don't deal with all of their projects equally. You're assuming SL deals with Prillya the same way they'll deal with other high profile projects.

Then i wonder why they spent a lot of their resources on the fights on all the past seasons. Also, no, with 3rei, this is no longer the case. You think Hiroyama would choose to destroy what "keeps Prillya afloat" AND SL would still choose to continue to adapt it?

MightyM16 said:


I'm not "assuming" anything, I'm just saying what I see and from what I see from 3rei I wouldn't entrust a main F/SN route to SL

MightyM16 said:


Because it was just one big fight at the end of a half season of SOL and loli hijinks. 3rei isn't like that, it's more hectic and required more planning

Hiroyama didn't "destroy" anything. The flashback arc is only your temporary fate service, you'll be back to your normal loli service soon enough

Still, what keeps Prisma, as a series, afloat is how much merchandise they end up selling; this is why SL puts more effort in loli kisses and pandering scenes, even in 3rei

astroprogs said:

Do you realize how many frames/man hours/salary these fights cost? You don't do a high qulity token action scene that eats a huge portion of your resources if you can just half ass it. Who cares about the action if the loli fanservice is the main draw, right?

You realize that this arc lasted for more than entire year, right? Not to mention, 3rei has 43 chapters so far where the fanservice scenes can be counted on a single hand.

The manga, the anime and the merchandise are tightly related. If the merchandise business can survive on its own, we wouldn't need the manga or the anime, especially when they're doing very little to market the fanservice that fuels the merchendise.

MightyM16 said:


SL did a good job with them before even with their focus on the fanservice why couldn't they just reorganize their people, time and material to give the fans something of a higher quality? I believe you already know that "budget" isn't exactly a problem here



And what impact does this have on the merchandise? Do you see any Miyu Shirou plush being sold? Was Miyu Shirou part of th 3rei event in F/GO?



They are related but just because there was a temporary change in the mange doesn't means the merchandise did change. The loli centered merchandise is what gives Prisma the profits it needs to keep going

MightyM16 said:


SL did a good job with them before even with their focus on the fanservice why couldn't they just reorganize their people, time and material to give the fans something of a higher quality? I believe you already know that "budget" isn't exactly a problem here



And what impact does this have on the merchandise? Do you see any Miyu Shirou plush being sold? Was Miyu Shirou part of th 3rei event in F/GO?



They are related but just because there was a temporary change in the mange doesn't means the merchandise did change. The loli centered merchandise is what gives Prisma the profits it needs to keep going

MightyM16 said:


Even the DEEN F/SN Finale was better than this episode, structure wise and animation wise

everything felt rushed and strange, the source material (the manga) blows this episode out of the water in a whole new level

AlexTheRiot said:
Yeah art and animation obviously wasn't what it could have been, or even what we've been treated to in the past. And pacing was noticeably extreme from anime only perspective. But even then, the whole episode was still sheer fucking hype. I got my monologue fix that UBW never provided, Shiro+Kuro was fucking hype, senpai machine literally had me jump out of my chair, and Gil was just perfect.

I guess maybe Rewrite has just made me appreciate adaptations, for being actual adaptations.

astroprogs said:
Looking at the episode again, with some of my initial hype and disappointment affecting my judgment less, i think was a little too harsh on it.

Yeah, there were a lot of things this episode that are just plain inferior to its manga counterpart, usually in more aspects than one, but i can't say that the episode as a whole was bad. It's just above average, and i think, with how amazing the source material for it is, i just expected a lot more than just above average.

ssjokg said:


Can I ask why the same thing would make UBW below average?Because more than a year later, the hype and expectations still make it look like crap in the eyes of some fans.

astroprogs said:

But i never said it would. You know i gave ufoUBW an 8/10, right? That's way above average, and that had more episodes that i had problems with than this.

My comment above can almost be taken word for word as my opinion of ufoUBW, just substute "manga" with "VN" and "episode" with "series".

astroprogs said:

Definitely. It's just that the source material really saves the episode. The events (the content), even if badly represented, just can't be called "bad" IMO.

ssjokg said:


Nonono.
I mean many will later say the same thing.We know some will forgive it all because, everything else was fine, and it was just action and Shirou isnt even the MC etc etc

And in UBW we had the opposite.

Everything was GREAT till ep10 after than every frame of it was bad or had a mistake in it, even the ones in the previous eps.

ShinsoPriest said:

Then it's not the anime you're liking but the source material aka manga. That doesn't excuse this episode's quality in any way. It's a below average to average episode when it should be an excellent episode like in previous seasons. And that is embarrassing on SL's part.

Fleckens said:
Seems like it's all but confirmed that this is the end of prisma, the preview had 最終(last, finale, closing, etc)written above the title of the episode, something that wasn't there in any of the last episode previews of previous seasons. I didn't expect anything else but it still makes me a bit sad that next episode is the last we will see of her Illya and her friends.

Fleckens said:


They needed to have 13 episodes clearly, but weren't given that. Also just feels like they may have been very time constrained this episode, as others pointed out, it's one thing when the animation is subpar, but if you can't even do a still shot right, something is wrong.

Now I'm just hoping they don't screw up last episode. As this is most likely the last we will see of Prisma and with Illya being the character with most screentime in the last episode I really want them to do her justice. One thing is screwing up a scene with side character, an important one but still just a side character. If they screw up the episode focused on the main character in the most likely last episode of the show then that would just be really sad.

yrlek said:
they did a really good job in the other episodes and they animated it almost page to page from the manga so why make all these changes now? I think they had some serious production/time issues which maybe was inevitable for them, i was thinking there are certain scenes where it seems like something is missing like a part of the scene itself is missing, especially in the first part of the episode, a studio which made justice to drei till now wouldn't fuck up the anime at this point just for the sake of it.

astroprogs said:

Because they had more time. The previous seasons were 10 episodes each, this wasn't. ufo takes 2-3 seasons to prepare for Fate. SL does more than a single series almost every season. Why ufo can afford to do this, but not SL, is because Prillya won't sell 30K sets on its opening week. If SL wanted 3rei to look the best, they could've cancelled a show in the previous season to be ahead of the schedule, but Prillya's profitability simply won't cover for two seasons of work.

astroprogs said:

Not that i'd want SL to do F/SN anyway,

Fai said:
Oh wow, going by like 50 collapsed posts I guess the trolls finally set upon this. Oh well.Ignore lists are the best.



That's why its so weird. The rest of 3rei was pretty much PERFECT. I tblows my mind that this episode was possible. Going from previous two episodes which literally were the best of prillya to this feels so jarring. The start of 3rei adaptation was pretty much PERFECTLY eveyrthing I wanted out of it. There were some dips in animation here and there and some understandable cutting of less needed content, but it was perfect. Then everything after Illya doll arc was pretty much even better than expected. And then this episode happens?

It really feels like they either ran out of budget, or there was some production issues OR there was some executive meddling/sabotage going on.


Ufo also had that aniplex money and there's no doubt that ufoubw was financed as an advert for FGO.


Why not?

They showed they can do the designs and tone right.
They showed that they can do monologues right.
They showed that they can do ost homages perfectly.
They showed that they can depict nasuverse fights without turning it into explosion fests.
The 3rei season showed that they know how to cut the material properly(baring this episode)
They showed they can do character relationships right without dumbing it down to "they got to hold hands by the end!"
They showed that they do not shy away from more sexual parts of the story.

Given enough budget, that's pretty much the only studio, apart from maybe shaft(albeit I'd want shaft tsukihime more), that I would expect to do it justice. Shaft and SL are the only studios who bother explaining lore or doing monologues or actually adapting more wordy content instead of skipping it and replacing it with explosions.

This episode being bad still does not change that Silverlink is the only studio to have done fate franchise justice(I don't count Zero because without proper FSN it loses it's value). They have proven that given enough time and money they can be unrivaled.

You don't need a budget to make FSN a good show. It is not something that should rely on fighting. In this case its quite clear that TM is shafting prillya and putting all the money in more shallow experiences in terms of funding. God forbid this would catch on onto mainstream popularity more than their recent lackluster efforts elsewhere and their slotmachines.

zhaoyun99 said:

One punch Man had an average budget that wasn't even like Fate/Zero and UBW but had basically on par with ufo in term of animation quality. Also, you are telling me the past episode was PERFECT?

http://oi67.tinypic.com/scuqzn.jpg

Look AT THIS SHIT from Yggarasil post.

Also, Darius first battle was like RUSHED AS FUCK and they even cut the baddass announcement of the 6th Holy grail war.

They even skipped Gilgamesh's Monologue during his rescue of Miyuverse Shirou which added more ironic situation of the original rescue the faker.

I was holding on my disappointment for this episode but for them to FUCK THIS UP DAT BAD. I had to rewatch it and made a comparison from the past episode.

And here, LOOK AT ANOTHER OF THIS SHIT

http://h.mhcdn.net/store/manga/12152/011.0/compressed/l003rei011_027-028.jpg?v=1380176821

WHAT IN THE ACTUAL FUUUUUUCCCCCCKKKKKKKKK? How dare they skipped the most baddass scene of Darius?

LeftWingGuerilla said:
Yutaka Nakamura wasn't even a regular on One Punch Man. He merely showed up to do an uncredited short sequence in the finale. One Punch Man had the likes of Yoshimichi Kameda, Gosei Oda, and Norifumi Kugai taking on big animation roles.