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Poll: Mahou Shoujo Madoka★Magica Movie 3: Hangyaku no Monogatari Episode 1 Discussion


#1
Oct 27, 2013 11:22 AM

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THIS IS AN ANIME ONLY DISCUSSION POST. DO NOT DISCUSS THE MANGA BEYOND THIS EPISODE.
----------------------------------------
Okay, so the previous thread was deleted because apparently only people who already watched the movie can create these thread. Don't really get it, but meh, whatever. Here's what I wrote before:

Oh wow. Just finished watching the movie. Was about to create a topic, glad I checked first. First time posting this, I hope I didn't miss spoiler-tagging anything

Anyway, thoughts. The first quarter, from when I saw Kyouko instead of Hitomi up until where all 5 puella magi forms a generic-seeming mahou shoujo team, I almost thought disappointingly that the story was an alternate storyline (as in a different story altogether) instead of a continuation, but then the plot started to kick in. The surrealness of Madomagi came back when Kyouko and Homura found out that
The next scene has Homura doing
which is AWESOME.

Later, after Homura talked with one of the characters, she found out that in fact

Next, the mahou shoujos fight

At the end, Madokami comes to take Homura,

and proceeds to

Afterwards, somehow

at which point
On the other hand, Kyubey


Really, at this point all I can do is just scream, "UROBUCHIIIIII!!!!" Love the movie, but feels unresolved at the end, although that might be caused by my glossing over of Kyubey's speeches. Hope I can understand it better after rewatching it later.

Actually, can anyone here explain to me the reasoning of what Kyubey actually did and why, and also
I would really appreciate it if anyone can explain it to me better.
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#2
Oct 27, 2013 3:51 PM
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If I remember correctly they were planning on continuing the series somehow after this movie. If so this should be real fun.
 
#3
Oct 27, 2013 4:06 PM

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Watching the premiere this December, reading this made me more excited :D
 
#4
Oct 27, 2013 6:12 PM
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Jakerams said:
If I remember correctly they were planning on continuing the series somehow after this movie. If so this should be real fun.


Where you get the source of it??
 
#5
Oct 27, 2013 6:25 PM
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fanny17i said:
Jakerams said:
If I remember correctly they were planning on continuing the series somehow after this movie. If so this should be real fun.


Where you get the source of it??


http://myanimelist.net/forum/?topicid=503791


Sorry took a while to find it.
 
#6
Oct 27, 2013 8:24 PM

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No wonder some commentators in Japan said that this movie is likely to give the same shock and amazement to the current generation of anime fans as what the Evangelion movie did to the older generation back in late 90s....
So MAL finally starts locking news threads that are only a few weeks old?

I wonder where was the announcement of this change? Or we are seeing yet another case of changes made that impacted users but not communicated to them?

I wonder how long people would put up with this.

As much as I have a bunch of information to share about anime announced recently I cannot share it in news board, and the anime series is too disorganized and chaotic to share information except with people already interested in the particular series.
 
#7
Oct 28, 2013 4:09 AM

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Jakerams said:
If I remember correctly they were planning on continuing the series somehow after this movie. If so this should be real fun.


I know people will complain/are complaining about milking the series. With the ending being as it is though, I personally don't mind any further milking. Well, not that I minded before, lol. Homu rabu<3

The thing is, if Urobuchi isn't going to write the new script, the sequel series might not be as good it is right now... Well I guess it depends on the new scriptwriter.
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#8
Oct 28, 2013 5:07 AM

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BTW where are those shorts?
 
#9
Oct 28, 2013 8:50 AM

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So MAL finally starts locking news threads that are only a few weeks old?

I wonder where was the announcement of this change? Or we are seeing yet another case of changes made that impacted users but not communicated to them?

I wonder how long people would put up with this.

As much as I have a bunch of information to share about anime announced recently I cannot share it in news board, and the anime series is too disorganized and chaotic to share information except with people already interested in the particular series.
 
Oct 28, 2013 11:20 AM

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I never took this series THAT seriously (as in it was a good 12 episode show and probably one of the better ones from 2011 but far from one of those defining experiences in my life that it seems to have been for others around here) so I don't really care what gets done with it at this point, especially since they seem to be disavowing the movie continuity from the original series going by interviews I've read. I did like it well enough though and if the movie turns out to be as contradictory and flimsily written as some of the spoilers make it sounds I'll probably be taking the franchise even less seriously in retrospect after seeing it.
Modified by PeacingOut, Oct 28, 2013 11:23 AM
 
Oct 28, 2013 6:11 PM

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Where are you people watching this movie? :<
Don't tell me you all decided to fly to japan just to watch it...
So long as you yourself enjoy it, what does the thoughts of others matter to you?
 
Oct 28, 2013 6:46 PM

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a) the movie is NOT flimsily written. I was never a huge fan of the series, I thought it was quite good, but it never did TOO much for me. This movie was honestly one of the best I've ever seen, anime or not. The only reason some of the spoilers might make it sounds silly and flimsy is because there are some hardcore fans upset at what the movie does to one of their pairings, and so you get very biased, pissed off fanboys and girls upset that their favourite magical girls will never have the flashy lesbian sex they hoped for.

To basically put the movie into perspective, this is Madoka's End of Evangelion. That's the best way of thinking about it, and the two movies are very similar in many ways

b) I don't know about everyone else, but the reason I've seen it is because I'm currently an exchange student in Japan. I'm just lucky :P
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Oct 28, 2013 8:49 PM
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To Kaioshin_Sama : No, the continuity with the tv series is real, the story starts some time after the end of the series (a few months I suppose), and nothing from the series is omitted or changed. And overall it is well written, apart from the ending, which is not really contradictory, more like surprising and clumsily written (but that's only the last 10 minutes or so of the movie).

I strongly advise those who want to watch this movie to avoid spoiler at all cost. I think that in this particular movie, knowing the story before seeing it spoils about 70% of the enjoynment you might get from it.

Also try to watch it in a good theater if possible, the movie was obviously created for theatrical release (whereas the first two were just the tv series episodes put together) and with a big screen and good sound the experience is outstanding. My first time watching it was maybe my best experience in cinema, ever.

And I'm also a lucky exchange student in Japan ^^
 
Oct 28, 2013 8:49 PM

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Kaioshin_Sama said:
I don't really care what gets done with it at this point, especially since they seem to be disavowing the movie continuity from the original series going by interviews I've read. I did like it well enough though and if the movie turns out to be as contradictory and flimsily written as some of the spoilers make it sounds I'll probably be taking the franchise even less seriously in retrospect after seeing it.
Which interviews you are talking about? I have read a couple and NONE disavowed the movie continuity. In fact some fans have made a timeline for the movie and the TV series to illustrate how tightly the continuity and plot lines fit together. So if you have any source about "disavowing movie continuity" I would be very interested in reading it.
So MAL finally starts locking news threads that are only a few weeks old?

I wonder where was the announcement of this change? Or we are seeing yet another case of changes made that impacted users but not communicated to them?

I wonder how long people would put up with this.

As much as I have a bunch of information to share about anime announced recently I cannot share it in news board, and the anime series is too disorganized and chaotic to share information except with people already interested in the particular series.
 
Oct 28, 2013 9:36 PM
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symbv said:
In fact some fans have made a timeline for the movie and the TV series to illustrate how tightly the continuity and plot lines fit together.


Can you provide it ? I would be interested in seeing it.
 
Oct 29, 2013 2:59 AM

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maxtheax said:
b) I don't know about everyone else, but the reason I've seen it is because I'm currently an exchange student in Japan. I'm just lucky :P
Pizza said:
And I'm also a lucky exchange student in Japan ^^

Huh, seems like everybody is an exchange student. I am a non-exchange foreign student though. Is there anyone who isn't a student here?

Pizza said:
clumsily written (but that's only the last 10 minutes or so of the movie).
This. I love the way the ending happened, but its presentation lacked some polishing.
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Oct 29, 2013 10:52 AM

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Pizza said:
symbv said:
In fact some fans have made a timeline for the movie and the TV series to illustrate how tightly the continuity and plot lines fit together.

Can you provide it ? I would be interested in seeing it.
They are in Japanese though. One that I particularly like is this one that gives details of from end of TV series to end of movie: http://blog-imgs-61.fc2.com/y/a/r/yaraon/1382971366.png Very clear as to what happens to each character through all the ups and downs.
So MAL finally starts locking news threads that are only a few weeks old?

I wonder where was the announcement of this change? Or we are seeing yet another case of changes made that impacted users but not communicated to them?

I wonder how long people would put up with this.

As much as I have a bunch of information to share about anime announced recently I cannot share it in news board, and the anime series is too disorganized and chaotic to share information except with people already interested in the particular series.
 
Oct 29, 2013 5:48 PM
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Lol original post deleted? I had my time writing post on staff interview OTL.

So in interview;
Plus, Iwakami said there is currently NO PLAN or PROJECT for the sequel.

PS.


maxtheax said:
a) the movie is NOT flimsily written. I was never a huge fan of the series, I thought it was quite good, but it never did TOO much for me. This movie was honestly one of the best I've ever seen, anime or not. The only reason some of the spoilers might make it sounds silly and flimsy is because there are some hardcore fans upset at what the movie does to one of their pairings, and so you get very biased, pissed off fanboys and girls upset that their favourite magical girls will never have the flashy lesbian sex they hoped for.
Really? Because I'm pretty sure 'breaking of a pairing' never happened, actually - pairing became even stronger.
Modified by Kitchiri, Oct 29, 2013 5:52 PM
 
Oct 29, 2013 7:26 PM

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symbv said:
Pizza said:
symbv said:
In fact some fans have made a timeline for the movie and the TV series to illustrate how tightly the continuity and plot lines fit together.

Can you provide it ? I would be interested in seeing it.
They are in Japanese though. One that I particularly like is this one that gives details of from end of TV series to end of movie: http://blog-imgs-61.fc2.com/y/a/r/yaraon/1382971366.png Very clear as to what happens to each character through all the ups and downs.


Nice of fans to take the time to make a concise summary of the MadokaMagica timeline!
For a moment I was wondering who なぎさ (Nagisa) was, but then I remembered there's a new magical girl in this movie, lol.
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Oct 29, 2013 8:23 PM

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Kitchiri said:
Lol original post deleted? I had my time writing post on staff interview OTL.

So in interview;
Plus, Iwakami said there is currently NO PLAN or PROJECT for the sequel.
Indeed, that is in the interview in the pamphlet sold at cinemas. Basically Urobuchi wanted to bring the whole story to a definitive end but Shinbo and Iwakami wanted a more open ending. Urobuchi got stuck and then Shinbo gave him that idea of ending you said in the spoiler and Urobuchi found it very much to his liking, hence the ending in the movie. But of course it just serves as a condition for sequel to be made but the actual decision for any sequel of course depends on a lot of other factors from box office receipt to merchandise sales etc.
So MAL finally starts locking news threads that are only a few weeks old?

I wonder where was the announcement of this change? Or we are seeing yet another case of changes made that impacted users but not communicated to them?

I wonder how long people would put up with this.

As much as I have a bunch of information to share about anime announced recently I cannot share it in news board, and the anime series is too disorganized and chaotic to share information except with people already interested in the particular series.
 
Oct 29, 2013 8:46 PM

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maxtheax said:
a) the movie is NOT flimsily written. I was never a huge fan of the series, I thought it was quite good, but it never did TOO much for me. This movie was honestly one of the best I've ever seen, anime or not. The only reason some of the spoilers might make it sounds silly and flimsy is because there are some hardcore fans upset at what the movie does to one of their pairings, and so you get very biased, pissed off fanboys and girls upset that their favourite magical girls will never have the flashy lesbian sex they hoped for.
Really? Because I'm pretty sure 'breaking of a pairing' never happened, actually - pairing became even stronger.


Well, in my eyes the pairing never "broke" per se, because it was never an actual thing, but
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Oct 30, 2013 7:06 AM
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symbv said:
but the actual decision for any sequel of course depends on a lot of other factors from box office receipt to merchandise sales etc.


There is no way in hell the fans will accept an ending like this.
 
Oct 31, 2013 2:13 AM
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FarWanderer said:
There is no way in hell the fans will accept an ending like this.


But nobody asked for their opinions.

Personnaly, I think it would not be a bad way to end MadoMagi, though I think it would have been better if


But there sure is no way in hell Shaft would just stop milking the cow now. I'm fine with it if the sequels are actually good, but I'm a little worried about that...
 
Oct 31, 2013 4:45 AM
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Pizza said:
FarWanderer said:
There is no way in hell the fans will accept an ending like this.


But nobody asked for their opinions.


Fan opinion matters, because fan demand is potential money. With what's happened in the story, there is both an narrative imperative AND financial imperative to continue. It's gonna happen.

The only issue is that the main Madoka writer (Urobuchi) is supposedly retiring from the project (although he has given his blessing for someone else to take his place).

Personnaly, I think it would not be a bad way to end MadoMagi,


I think it'd be terrible, if only because


though I think it would have been better if


Yes, that would have been fine with me too, and in fact
 
Oct 31, 2013 5:16 AM
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FarWanderer said:
Pizza said:
FarWanderer said:
There is no way in hell the fans will accept an ending like this.


But nobody asked for their opinions.


Fan opinion matters, because fan demand is potential money. With what's happened in the story, there is both an narrative imperative AND financial imperative to continue. It's gonna happen.


It's true when you say that fan opinion matters and that it leads to potential money. However there is no such thing as a "financial imperative" for anyone involved. Shaft and Aniplex did not waited for Madoka to make benefits, and they will probably continue to do so, even without Madoka.
Also, the fans appreciation of the ending doesn't really change a thing. If there is a new sequel to Madoka, fans will watch it, wether they liked the movie or not, if only because the are curious. And those who did not like the movie will most probably have high hope for it to "save the licence", or "fix the mess" of the end of the movie. The only potential impact is on the sells of the movie itself, but well, it's too late now to change the ending...
The opinions of the fans would really change a thing only if multiple shitty sequels started to appear, and the overall love of the fanbase toward the licence started to drop drastically.

What I wanted to say in my other post is that I can't see ANY reason why the fans being upset might lead to more sequels...

FarWanderer said:
Pizza said:
Personnaly, I think it would not be a bad way to end MadoMagi,


I think it'd be terrible, if only because


I thought the original ending was lacking something, it left me somewhat unsatisfied. Sorry I can't really elaborate on that, but I'm glad they did a continuation to the story.

FarWanderer said:
Pizza said:
though I think it would have been better if


Yes, that would have been fine with me too, and in fact


Yes, I heard of the first version for the end of the movie. But when I was watching the movie I already thought that this conclusion would have been better, so I was really frustrated when I heard it was originally planned like that...
Modified by Pizza, Oct 31, 2013 5:23 AM
 
Oct 31, 2013 8:39 PM
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FarWanderer said:
The only issue is that the main Madoka writer (Urobuchi) is supposedly retiring from the project (although he has given his blessing for someone else to take his place).
It is just 'possibility' of Urobuchi not going for the future project. Still very likely Urobuchi will give some key ideas if there will ever be a sequel.
Pizza said:
Yes, I heard of the first version for the end of the movie. But when I was watching the movie I already thought that this conclusion would have been better, so I was really frustrated when I heard it was originally planned like that...
Um... It is most likely that scenario of the movie was already done by the time when sequel movie was announced. The key thing is that 'original' plan never accepted and this series not done by a single person but 'Magia Quartet'. Thus, there is no point talking about 'eww original plan of urobuchi could've been better'.

Another key point is something suggested by Shinbo's interview, who said 'I believed in Urobuchi so I entrusted the scenario entirely to him'. Shinbo gave that certain idea because he believed that thing would be something Urobuchi does best at - meaning if scenario writer was not Urobuchi, that ending never even happened.

Honestly, I think this is like Eva-Q of MMM series, but done BETTER.
 
Nov 1, 2013 5:31 AM
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It is said pretty clearly in the interview what was the original plan for the ending, and that it had to be changed because they wanted to do more sequels. That's all I'm saying.

I don't think the Madoka movie has anything to do with Eva Q, except that both were unexpected and frustrated some fans (a lot of fans to be true in the case of Eva). If you want to elaborate on this comparison I would be interested.
 
Nov 1, 2013 11:16 AM
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I do not mind if they make it longer, Nanoha also has many seasons. But as long as they do not start making 'endless' seasons with new main featuring characters that are not interesting like Nanoha does.

Kazumi for example, it was disappointing for me and those new characters were nowhere as good as the cast of Madoka.
 
Nov 2, 2013 10:50 PM

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I want to watch next EP.
but It's OK this is the last EP.

Because We need evil and justice, order and chaos.
humm...>.<
 
Nov 3, 2013 7:10 AM
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So .... Homura is now evil.... Ho-shit.

I know that a sequel is coming, since there's a thread about it in the news section after all. Imma hope that it's a TV series. I respect Urobucher's talent for writing and stuff, and the guy knows how to build up a story. But with the news that Butcher's looking for a new writer to join the team, I hope that the new guy will somehow give us a happy end.
 
Nov 4, 2013 4:32 AM

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Xinception said:
So .... Homura is now evil.... Ho-shit.
So MAL finally starts locking news threads that are only a few weeks old?

I wonder where was the announcement of this change? Or we are seeing yet another case of changes made that impacted users but not communicated to them?

I wonder how long people would put up with this.

As much as I have a bunch of information to share about anime announced recently I cannot share it in news board, and the anime series is too disorganized and chaotic to share information except with people already interested in the particular series.
 
Nov 5, 2013 12:54 PM

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symbv said:
Xinception said:
So .... Homura is now evil.... Ho-shit.
http://images.puella-magi.net/6/6c/Homura_is_Lucifer_%28aka_anti-madoka%29.png?20131026114938
 
Nov 7, 2013 3:32 PM

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If the op is in anyway shape or form correct I will be furious if there is not a sequel to retcon this bullshit away.

Its amazing of how few lines of awful spoilers can ruin all the hype. I expected something great and majestic, but this sounds like an god-awful(pun intended) fanfiction. This


If they do not retcon that bullshit and still do the sequel with
I will just pretend the movies and everything after never ever existed.
Modified by Ahenshihael, Nov 7, 2013 3:39 PM
 
Nov 7, 2013 6:22 PM
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just to add my little view on the new madoka and hopefully show you a well thought out perspective to the madoka movie debate. Imho everything about the movie makes sense based off the series, people just make false assumptions about Homura, She is insane in both action and definition. She initially was selfless in her wish, but she became selfish as she went through the times lines. That's the point of her character. Realize she will try to protect Madoka from everything NO MATTER the cost. the entire show is her vs QB with madoka as the prize and the other girls are the pieces. She maneuvers through from killing endless QB''s and possibly the other girls. She never tries to save anyone, but Madoka, yet through all her lamentations she never once asks Madoka about hows he feellings, only stating why she cant understand her pain. Therefore with Madoka gone what does Homura have to live for? Nothing else matters to her. The whole new ending was pitched before the series final draft script and the original ending was scrapped which had Homura die with Madoka to possibly continue down this route based on the success of the anime. They also hinted to this route with angel symbolism and Homura, thus the paradise lost from Faust as with the devil the most devout angel and singular lover of god does not receive the same love from god even through his many trials to love him eventually falls. This is the direction its going, Homura has one singular focus, but Homura is not the single focus of Madoka. This is the reason Homura is visibly angered when Madoka states she will remember Mami always, "she must be lucky" she stated as if she was not loved. This is generally my view and a different perspective. If you have a question or objection please respond.
 
Nov 12, 2013 1:23 PM

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So I just watched it camripped. (Great quality from the rip btw)

Uhh

What
 
Nov 13, 2013 2:26 AM

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Raptor1221 said:
just to add my little view on the new madoka and hopefully show you a well thought out perspective to the madoka movie debate. Imho everything about the movie makes sense based off the series, people just make false assumptions about Homura, She is insane in both action and definition. She initially was selfless in her wish, but she became selfish as she went through the times lines. That's the point of her character. Realize she will try to protect Madoka from everything NO MATTER the cost. the entire show is her vs QB with madoka as the prize and the other girls are the pieces. She maneuvers through from killing endless QB''s and possibly the other girls. She never tries to save anyone, but Madoka, yet through all her lamentations she never once asks Madoka about hows he feellings, only stating why she cant understand her pain. Therefore with Madoka gone what does Homura have to live for? Nothing else matters to her. The whole new ending was pitched before the series final draft script and the original ending was scrapped which had Homura die with Madoka to possibly continue down this route based on the success of the anime. They also hinted to this route with angel symbolism and Homura, thus the paradise lost from Faust as with the devil the most devout angel and singular lover of god does not receive the same love from god even through his many trials to love him eventually falls. This is the direction its going, Homura has one singular focus, but Homura is not the single focus of Madoka. This is the reason Homura is visibly angered when Madoka states she will remember Mami always, "she must be lucky" she stated as if she was not loved. This is generally my view and a different perspective. If you have a question or objection please respond.

Yeah, question...
How did Homura turn into the devil? Putting motivation and all that stuff aside for the moment, where did all that power even come from? The movie provides absolutely no justification beyond "Love". And sorry, but that just ain't cutting it. You can't just suddenly bring in "LOVE IS POWERFUL ENOUGH TO ALTER THE VERY FABRIC OF REALITY" when the entire series up to this point has been running on constant cynicism. Hell, even the ending of the TV-series was less of a "Yay, everyone is saved and the world is a good place now" and more of a "Well... The world doesn't suck AS MUCH as it used to." (Oh, and BTW, I always thought, and still think, that the TV-ending was the most fitting, satisfying and thematically appropriate ending this story could have possibly had.)
And even then, when the TV-series turned Madoka into what's basically God, it was after 11 episodes of foreshadowing and building up the possibility that she might actually be able to do that with the right wish, because, as was stated pretty early on, the power of a magical girl depends on 1: her latent magic potential, and 2: the strength of the wish she makes. And considering how insistent Kyubey was on Madoka becoming a MG due to her insane, theoretically impossible amount of potential, you'd think we might have heard something about it if Homura had the same amount of potential.
 
Nov 13, 2013 2:26 AM
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This was stunning. Not so much Homura's transformation since I felt it had been hinted at throughout the whole movie and had a lot of proper build-up to prevent it from looking like a cop-out, but rather the visual aspect. Shaft realy outdid themselves this time, this movie had more surreal imaginary going on than the entire tv series. Homura's descent into insanity was portrayed in a wonderfully grotesque and morbid way that sent shivers down my spine.
 
Nov 13, 2013 3:47 AM
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Eudaimonia said:
Homura's descent into insanity was portrayed in a wonderfully grotesque and morbid way that sent shivers down my spine.

That's funny because I didn't think she was insane at all.


Anyway, pretty good movie. Although, at the end, all I could feel was sadness. I really felt for Homura, who pretty much sacrificed everything to bring Madoka happiness even though the latter won't appreciate it. That's understandable, but it's still sad, especially since Homura's aware of it all and plays the Devil because she herself feels what she's doing is evil but is determined to keep going nonetheless. That's proves she isn't evil at all, and that makes it all the more sad and tragic.

Surprisingly, I also felt bad for QB at the end. You can tell in his eyes he is suffering for the first time in his existence. He deserves it, but it's still sad because he probably can't even understand what he's feeling.
 
Nov 13, 2013 8:03 PM

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1idd0kun said:
Eudaimonia said:
Homura's descent into insanity was portrayed in a wonderfully grotesque and morbid way that sent shivers down my spine.

That's funny because I didn't think she was insane at all.

https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/66433557/Screenshotz/%5BMEncode%5D%20Puella%20Magi%20Madoka%20Magica%20-%20Rebellion%20Story.mkv_snapshot_01.50.59_%5B2013.11.14_13.02.00%5D.jpg
^Clearly the eyes of a completely sane person.
 
Nov 13, 2013 9:13 PM
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Those are the eyes of a very sad and broken person. The eyes of someone who knows what she's doing is wrong, but is determined to do it anyway because she believes it's the only way to make the one she loves happy.

What she's doing is misguided and wrong, but she knows it. She's not insane.
Modified by 1idd0kun, Nov 13, 2013 9:16 PM
 
Nov 13, 2013 10:06 PM

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1idd0kun said:


Those are the eyes of a very sad and broken person. The eyes of someone who knows what she's doing is wrong, but is determined to do it anyway because she believes it's the only way to make the one she loves happy.

What she's doing is misguided and wrong, but she knows it. She's not insane.

Yeah see, the way I see it... If she were actually right in the head throughout all this, she would never have done what she did in the first place. Oh, and it would also mean that she's quite possibly the single most level-headed, unshakable person in the history of ever, because between watching her fr... actually, she flat-out admitted to being in love with her in this so let's just go with that... watching the person she loves dying like a hundred times over, maintaining her memories as the entire universe was rewritten around her and winding up with a world where said loved one never existed at all, eventually growing to doubt if her memories of her were even real (flat-out stated in the movie BTW), realizing that she has, without even noticing, become the very thing that she'd been fighting for all this time, despite being in a world where this is theoretically impossible... Oh and I would like to point out that her Soul Gem was never purified either. Because at that point she instead went and bullshitted the universe into her own utopia of whatever-the-hell-that-was.

If she's still completely level-headed after this point... Yeah I might give this movie a lot of flak for how Homura's sudden Hostile Takeover of the entire universe is given no logical justification whatsoever, but I daresay that the idea that she hasn't lost her mind at this point is even more absurd.
 
Nov 14, 2013 2:38 AM
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Vegard_Aune said:
Yeah see, the way I see it... If she were actually right in the head throughout all this, she would never have done what she did in the first place.


Are you serious? Perfectly sane people do wrong things all the time in real life. Homura has never been exactly the kind of person that wouldn't commit a crime or two if she had to. Now she just went to the extremes, but what she's doing is still pretty much in character.

Anyway, to understand Homura actions there are two things you have to consider:

1) QB could try to capture Madoka again in the future, and if Homura left herself being collected by Madoka, she would not be able to protect her the next time.

2) At one point point in the movie when Madoka still doesn't remember that she's Madokami, she tells Homura that she would suffer quite a lot of she had to leave her family and friends behind for some reason. Homura asks if those are Madoka's true feelings and she confirms.

So, Homura's actions at the very end are driven by these two premises: First, to prevent QB from trying to do this shit again. Second, to try give Madoka some happiness, because she wasn't happy being Madokami. She become Madokami because she felt it was her duty, but she had to sacrifice of her own personal happiness in the process.

Perhaps what Homura does is wrong because she's forcing Madoka against her will, even if she does so to try make her happy. Regardless, her actions are perfectly in character. She has always been trying to protect Madoka and make her happy in the tv series. The only different is that this time she just took some pretty freaking extreme measures to achieve it. But it's ultimately the same Homura doing what she always does.
Modified by 1idd0kun, Nov 14, 2013 5:05 AM
 
Nov 14, 2013 5:10 AM
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Vegard_Aune said:
How did Homura turn into the devil? Putting motivation and all that stuff aside for the moment, where did all that power even come from?


The movie is a bit vague about it, but it seems she somehow managed to tap into all the curses that her soul gem accumulated across timelines.

Maybe she managed to do that because she's a time mage. Causality doesn't really apply to her in a normal way. Or perhaps just by being able to remember, her soul gem didn't get completely cleansed every-time she went back in time and keep accumulating curses. Either way, she got a hold of one hundred timeloolps worth of curses. Power enough rival that of god or even surpass it.

And the reason she can uses the power of those curses while keeping her soul intact is her love for Madoka. Thanks to that love, she managed to avoid becoming a witch and surpassed the limit, became something that's neither witch nor magical girl.
Modified by 1idd0kun, Nov 14, 2013 5:39 AM
 
Nov 14, 2013 11:42 AM

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Fai said:

Its amazing of how few lines of awful spoilers can ruin all the hype. I expected something great and majestic, but this sounds like an god-awful(pun intended) fanfiction. This



Hi Fai,

 
Nov 14, 2013 1:02 PM
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Lauriet said:



Maybe it's just my pre-existing disdain for Homura talking but I never saw her as anything but a pitiful, unlikable character whose life is so empty that she desperately clung to Madoka because the plot required it. Maybe we just needed more details in episode 10 because it seemed like her classmates (and Mami) were nice to her, but when push comes to shove it's all about Madoka.

Seriously. Name one detail about her that doesn't involve her inane obsession with the girl she dedicated her entire existence to after knowing her for only a month.

It always felt to me like Homura didn't so much care about Madoka's safety and happiness, as she simply she wanted Madoka in her life and can't exist without her.

So then we get to Rebellion Story....
 
Nov 14, 2013 8:20 PM

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1idd0kun said:
Vegard_Aune said:
How did Homura turn into the devil? Putting motivation and all that stuff aside for the moment, where did all that power even come from?


The movie is a bit vague about it, but it seems she somehow managed to tap into all the curses that her soul gem accumulated across timelines.

Maybe she managed to do that because she's a time mage. Causality doesn't really apply to her in a normal way. Or perhaps just by being able to remember, her soul gem didn't get completely cleansed every-time she went back in time and keep accumulating curses. Either way, she got a hold of one hundred timeloolps worth of curses. Power enough rival that of god or even surpass it.

And the reason she can uses the power of those curses while keeping her soul intact is her love for Madoka. Thanks to that love, she managed to avoid becoming a witch and surpassed the limit, became something that's neither witch nor magical girl.

Keyword here being "Somehow", and "It seems", and "Maybe". Which again brings me back to this all being speculation. Which again brings me back to how thoroughly disappointing this is considering how wonderfully self-consistent the show was. Oh and that last bit... Again, not buying that. You can't go from the TV-series showing the power of friendship to be thoroughly useless (and then following their attempt at saving Sayaka with Kyubey basically going "lol of course that wouldn't have worked. umad?") to THE VERY FABRIC OF REALITY BEING ALTERED JUST BY "THE POWER OF LOVE". That is of course also disregarding that I find Homura's declaration of "love" to ring thouroughly false anyway, but in any case... yeah, I do not find this an adequate explanation given what kind of series this is. And I also do not consider the complete and utter lack of any clear evidence as to how this all worked to be acceptable in the context of this series either.
 
Nov 15, 2013 2:05 AM

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Well that was depressing.. Homura...why...
 
Nov 15, 2013 9:43 AM

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I think all the power came from her wish to save madoka, so since madoka wasn't save yet she got a power to save god. Her wish was made beacause she loved madoka, so her wish is the power of love
 
Nov 15, 2013 1:58 PM
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First of all, great visuals, didn't expect less from SHAFT.

I enjoyed the movie a lot and I loved what kind of character Homura turned into and her destiny. However, I still do not understand how she became a Witch to begin with, when the concept was totally foreign in the new world. Witches shouldn't exist after Godoka erased them, so how was it possible for Homura to turn into one? Unless I missed something.

Now that Homura controls this world, I wonder how she can be faced in a next installment. Madoka still has her powers but it looks pointless since Homura has total control around. Unless of course something 'breaks' Homura and Godoka will be able to awaken and I suppose Sayaka will also play more of a role in this.

The post-ending scene was totally symbolic though?
 
Nov 15, 2013 2:44 PM

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>Everyone says that Homura did what she did just because she wanted to take away Madoka for herself and that it was selfish and shit
>Its fucking revealed that Madoka didn't want to become an existence that no one could remember and that she was scared and that even if she stayed in Goddess form its likely that Kyuubey would've continued to seek her out until he was able to control Madoka's power

Maybe try idk watching the movie
 
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