| Is this srs? Out of all three, only one is a half-demigod king of alien-like civilizaton who can travel past the speed of light, break apart reality with swipes of his sword and literally, kill whole earth with his sword. Saber has good stats and magic-res, but pretty awful selection of NPS, which all equal to "beam of light" and abilities>stats in nasuverse. Archer has very shitty stats and all of his more powerful stuff requires shitload of mana, so realistically the only servant he can truly beat is Gilgamesh, due to UBW being a natural counter to GOB...and that is only if Gil is not serious and allows Archer to cast UBW. So yeah, Gil is canonically stated to be "The Strongest Servant". |
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| No need to ask him if he is serious when you dont even know if he is a VN reader. inb4 Saber(xShirou) fanboys voting for Saber. |
| Saber sucks and the only reason she "beat" Archer is because he went easy on her. Archer has no chance against Gil. That is, of course, if Gil did not see him as worthless mongrel trash. |
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Fai said: Is this srs? realistically the only servant he can truly beat is Gilgamesh, due to UBW being a natural counter to GOB...and that is only if Gil is not serious and allows Archer to cast UBW. Archer can also realistcally beat Caster Anyway Gilgamesh is by far the strongest servant in the entire fate frenchise. I think I remember reading somewhere that he could easily defeat all Fate/Zero servants in a single night if he actually tried. Enuma Elish>everything |
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| Fucking secondaries. |
| And I mean that in the most sexually painful way possible. |
| Ok so I'm not saying Saber is stronger, but... We haven't seen much Saber+Avalon though. Wouldn't she stand a fair chance if she used it properly? |
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| F/Z servants are stronger than FSN servants. |
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doom19876 said: Avalon does nothing except from isolating her from everything.Nobody can touch her but she cant do anything else either.Ok so I'm not saying Saber is stronger, but... We haven't seen much Saber+Avalon though. Wouldn't she stand a fair chance if she used it properly? Mycelistsukiyo said: F/Z servants are stronger than FSN servants. Nice joke. |
Mycelistsukiyo said: F/Z servants are stronger than FSN servants. Whoa. For a minute there, I could have sworn I had just read something stupid. Wait fuck, I don't even know if you're baiting. |
| And I mean that in the most sexually painful way possible. |
ssjokg said: Avalon does nothing except from isolating her from everything.Nobody can touch her but she cant do anything else either. Eh that sounds pretty powerful to me. Never getting hit sounds pretty good. I mean if you can dodge stuff at will... |
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doom19876 said: ssjokg said: Avalon does nothing except from isolating her from everything.Nobody can touch her but she cant do anything else either. Eh that sounds pretty powerful to me. Never getting hit sounds pretty good. I mean if you can dodge stuff at will... As I said she cant do anything else either. Unless if the enemy gets bored and give up her chances at winning dont get really high. |
| Who says she has to stay isolated the whole time? Can't she just use it whenever gil throws something at her? She can already sort of dodge it, but if she can fully dodge a Gáe Bulg for example that would make her really strong wouldn't it? I mean yes ok in terms of direct power it's not much, but isn't it the way you use it? |
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| Avalon isolates its user in another world, which means Saber is stuck at the place where she uses it. That's how it works. She can't just run around without a care and be invincible the entire time. The moment she leaves Avalon, she's dead. At best, she'll reach a stalemate because Gil can't kill her as long as she stays inside. |
| ^This. And you also assume that Avalon doesn't use mana. |
JabonHR said: Pretty sure it was just bait..Mycelistsukiyo said: F/Z servants are stronger than FSN servants. Whoa. For a minute there, I could have sworn I had just read something stupid. Wait fuck, I don't even know if you're baiting. |
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| I'd still say Avalon is a really effective way of dodging projectiles/slashes/all kinds of movements. |
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doom19876 said: And you are right.I'd still say Avalon is a really effective way of dodging projectiles/slashes/all kinds of movements. But it doesn't do anything else. |
doom19876 said: Defense does not make you win. Avalon is not an offensive weapon and cannot be used as such. You can't win if you don't attack.I'd still say Avalon is a really effective way of dodging projectiles/slashes/all kinds of movements. She can hide there all she wants but the moment she leaves to try to win she turns into mincemeat. |
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| I remember Nasu making a joke about it.Will look it up when I go home. |
Moetony said: Why are Arthur and Gilgamesh the only constants in fate/stay sagas? Because Gil is the big bad villain of the original and Saber isthe main heroine of the first anime and Zero. |
LeYop said: JabonHR said: Whoa. For a minute there, I could have sworn I had just read something stupid. Wait fuck, I don't even know if you're baiting. Well, I see everybody arguing about F/SN servants being superior, but if we do compare : - Rider (F/SN) is clearly inferior to Iskandar, whose IIonian Hatiaroi is clealry comparable to a GoB or an UBW. - Archer is nothing compared to Gilgamesh - Well, Saber is Saber - Lancelot actually challenged Gil while having a weak master, while Heracles was killed 7 times in once by a fake excalibur - The lancers are about equal, because Gae bolga is better than Gáe Buidhe & Gáe Dearg, but Diarmuid also masters the swords Móralltach & Beagalltach, and seems to fight better (we have to remember he single-handedly killed 3400 in a single battle) - Hasan is the only true Assassin On the other hand : - Sasaki Kôjirô is a better fighter - Medea is a powerful wizard while Gilles de Rais is nothing without his noble phantasm Thus, Why ? It's a genuine question waiting for a real and constructive answer Sigh...lets go. FSN Rider can kill FZ Rider AND his army in the fastest way compared to everyone else, including Gilgamesh. Yes Archer is nothing compared to Gil but Gil is a FSN Servant as well. Lancelot didnt challenge Gil.Lancelot countered less NPs than even Shirou when he was outside UBW.The LN makes it clear that the next spam would kill him and he was lucky Tokiomi was an idiot. Heracles was killed by Artoria's original sword, which by no means is fake, and if Herc fought lancelot it would be a question of how fast Herc can bitch slap him.Lancelot cant do anything in that fight.Oh and he would die by the "fake Excalibur" as well. Cu has faced entire armies alone.Has Runes magic and warp spams.Cu when he stabbed himself to the heart, got himself up, killed his Master and a put a castle on fire.Diarmuid died like a bitch. >Hasan is the only true Assassin FZ Hassan wins only because of numbers.IF Sasaki is slow enough he loses.Then again, this is the guy that fought full power Saber while he was fading and didnt give a shit about her massive advantage. |
LeYop said: ssjokg said: Sigh...lets go. FSN Rider can kill FZ Rider AND his army in the fastest way compared to everyone else, including Gilgamesh. Yes Archer is nothing compared to Gil but Gil is a FSN Servant as well. Lancelot didnt challenge Gil.Lancelot countered less NPs than even Shirou when he was outside UBW.The LN makes it clear that the next spam would kill him and he was lucky Tokiomi was an idiot. Heracles was killed by Artoria's original sword, which by no means is fake, and if Herc fought lancelot it would be a question of how fast Herc can bitch slap him.Lancelot cant do anything in that fight.Oh and he would die by the "fake Excalibur" as well. Cu has faced entire armies alone.Has Runes magic and warp spams.Cu when he stabbed himself to the heart, got himself up, killed his Master and a put a castle on fire.Diarmuid died like a bitch. >Hasan is the only true Assassin FZ Hassan wins only because of numbers.IF Sasaki is slow enough he loses.Then again, this is the guy that fought full power Saber while he was fading and didnt give a shit about her massive advantage. Even though I don't understand F/SN Rider's power (she always was described a weak and was killed even while using her Noble Phantasm) (I'm going to document myself about it), I appreciate the answer. Thanks ! In Fate she was killed by Excalibur which is no joke(till you compare it to Ea) and in UBW she is tricked just like Saber was. Who the Master is and if the Servant wants to go at it at 100% is a factor. And her Noble Phantasm isnt even the most terrifying thing about her. I would post her fight in HF 2 but seems that it isnt on YT. |
| Gilgamesh xD |
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| I'm more of a Archer fan but the golden boi is powerful but then again if Archer uses reality marble then the outcome would be different. |
typeOU said: for the original --> obviously Gilgamesh, easy planet buster zero/SN fights Saber:hm, Zero because shirou don't have enough mana Archer:... zero Lancer: Stay night,, undodgeable attack from 40 kilometers away and instant kill on a luck check (e-rank luck for zero lancer) Caster: Stay night Assassin: Stay night, hassan weakest servant Berserker: despite the advantage for lancelot, stay night. Arondight takes 5/6 lives and knight of the owner won't even take one. (knight of the owner was the advantage, but not strong enough). Rider: interesting fight, the eye is useless, but, well, bellerophon is OP Stay night again Which makes 4-3 for stay night Gil can kill them all tough How the hell are the Mystic Eyes of Petrification useless against Iskandar? |
| It doesnt cost by the number of targets. She only hast to use them for less time than she did against Archer or Saber Alter. She was using them for more than 10 minutes against Saber Alter AND she also used Bellerophon at the end. Mana isnt that much of an issue. |
typeOU said: ssjokg said: It doesnt cost by the number of targets. She only hast to use them for less time than she did against Archer or Saber Alter. She was using them for more than 10 minutes against Saber Alter AND she also used Bellerophon at the end. Mana isnt that much of an issue. it... does? see hollow ataraxia, it's litterally explained. Besides, she was going past her limit in her fight against saber alter. Anyway even if it was never explicitly said, it only makes sense, why would 1 be superior to 0 but 2 equal to 1? What does that even mean? And yes she was past her limit against an opponent vastly superior to herself AND Iskandar and she was still fighting. |
typeOU said: Who said that it costs more against stronger enemies?ssjokg said: What does that even mean? And yes she was past her limit against an opponent vastly superior to herself AND Iskandar and she was still fighting. way to miss the whole point. Stop putting your weird headcanon in it seriously, why would it cost more magical energy against stronger opponents? it loses in efficiency, that's it. Again, it was confirmed that it cost more magical energy the more targets there are in hollow ataraxia. It means that there's litterally no reason to think that not looking at anyone prevent it from costing mana but looking at multiple persons doesn't increase it I dont remember that part and even if true it was an endless horde of enemies. Not the same thing. And she doesn't even need to petrify everyone. AND all of them will be petrified instantly so even if she runs out of mana it isnt an issue. |
BlackCrow1 said: he didn't use enkidu for the same reason he didn't initially use ea. also shirou isn't divineI'd say Gil is probably the strongest servant. Saber is somehow said to be the strongest servant but doesn't really do jack. Archer is technically Shirou who beat Gil using protagonist asspull plot armor but in UBW, Archer technically doesnt even have a single win. Also Gil's noble phantasm is overpowered. I wonder why he didnt use the chains he used on rider in F/Z on shirou in F/SN |
BlackCrow1 said: The Saber Class is supposed to be the strongest, and the only reason that is believed is because the Saber class was able to reach the final fights in the last wars.I'd say Gil is probably the strongest servant. Saber is somehow said to be the strongest servant but doesn't really do jack. Archer is technically Shirou who beat Gil using protagonist asspull plot armor but in UBW, Archer technically doesnt even have a single win. Also Gil's noble phantasm is overpowered. I wonder why he didnt use the chains he used on rider in F/Z on shirou in F/SN But Archer also did that in Zero and Saber reached the final fight out of plot convenience. EMIYA Archer killed Caster and even Gil. And nice to see people still not being able to accept Gil's defeat. All that salt is actually sweet to the taste. |
BlackCrow1 said: @ssjokg, EMIYA double crossed Caster and Gil (Ok he shot Gil when he was being sucked by the grail but yeah whatever), doesnt count as a win imo, and Saber class was what I was referring to And Saber defeated Lancelot because dead man walking Kariya run out of mana....Yet it still counts as her victory and reaching the finals. The Edelfelt sisters in the 3rd War had TWO Saber Servants and they were apparently humiliated(with one dying/eloped and the other running away) BUT on the records the Saber class reached the finals again. EMIYA killing Caster after betraying her is still a feat, not so much of power but of brains.Same for Gil. |
BlackCrow1 said: He kills Heracles 6 times. That is pretty strong.@ssjokg, yeah but that doesnt mean EMIYA is strong right? Saber too won both her major battles either due to conveniences |
typeOU said: ssjokg said: Who said that it costs more against stronger enemies? I dont remember that part and even if true it was an endless horde of enemies. Not the same thing. And she doesn't even need to petrify everyone. AND all of them will be petrified instantly so even if she runs out of mana it isnt an issue. Rider herself why is it different with an endless horde? she doesn't have much of a choice, it's a line of sight AOE dying is an issue on another note, while I agree that EMIYA is probably a mid to upper mid servant (and has much better strategy than most), it is also true that his win against gil isn't much of a feat considering everything that happened Dude you mix up the effect's strength with magical energy. And it isnt "stronger" enemies that are an issue but those with high MAGIG, like Saber Alter. Power is irrelevant. Why an endless horde is different? Do I have to explain why endless, infinite, is bigger than thousands? And she doesnt have to petrify them all.The more die the more unstable the RM gets. |
ssjokgJun 22, 2021 1:20 AM
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