Death Parade Episode 2 Discussion

Jan 18, 2015 4:14 PM

Offline

Dec 2013

2814

Tokoya said:
Using Wikipedia in a debate....Top lel

Dude me and many othere have proved that we are right and have shown analysis to back it up all throughout this thread.

Majority of the thread is on your side? Try you and the same 3 other people that are going on and on with this crap (Like the guy I confused you with in regards to the sacred vows thing xD) They're in our chain of posts even lol.

Majority of this thread are praising the episode. Nice try but nobody is that ignorant and gullible enough to fall for that ;)

Once again, you just failed to comprehend it all, it's a waste of time for me to keep on repeating myself to someone who's biggest argument revolves around "What is morally right"

Yet again, you have failed to explain your reasoning.
As for my usage of actual facts, if you can't top that, then well, I'm sorry for you.
I gave you plenty of opportunity to explain yourself, but as yet you haven't.

If you really want to prove yourself right, it's really simple: Link me to your so-called explanations. If you cannot do something so simple in this day in age as to link to your, or your "majority" opinion, own posts on this very thread (i.e. which paragraph of which page, of which post of this thread), then you have some serious credibility issues.

As of now, your own answers to my questions have consisted of "I have already told you", "you can see it in the episode" and "everyone who's seen my previous posts agree with me".

In that case, just prove it. Link me to your so-called posts that explain your so-called position. It ain't really that hard, now is it? It would end any debate that you have with me in 10 seconds flat.

Seriously, I'm giving you a chance to prove your credibility here. It's not my fault if you refuse to save yourself.

HESTIAAPPROVES

Jan 18, 2015 4:15 PM

#402

MezuAri

Offline

Nov 2011

14

L-Ryoshi said:

Tokoya said:

L-Ryoshi said:

Tokoya said:

L-Ryoshi said:

Tokoya said:

L-Ryoshi said:

Tokoya said:

IZEROII said:
[spoiler]I really enjoyed the "reverse" perspective of this episode. One of the better introductions to a universe I've seen recently.

Nona has captivated me.

Tokoya said:

EarlCiel said:

Tokoya said:

deadoptimist said:
Edit: The thread honestly scares me, especially people saying that destroying a soul for cheating is ok, even if the said person feels bad about it and would like to repent, cause religion. Christianity at least has a concept of mercy and forgiveness. To see sins as a lines on a tab is wrong from moral standpoint. It's not that their good deeds were taken into account, and only their relationships were studied, though they're not the only facet of life.

My point exactly

Everyone makes mistakes. Cheating is a mistake. In the end, we learned that she still loved him enough to sacrifice herself.
So...like, honestly, people who are saying it's okay to destroy a soul for cheating is denying her love and saying it''s okay to condemn people for all of eternity...just for making a mistake.

Some people have their heads screwed on the wrong way.

Tell me about it. I'm almost convinced that at least half of them never even experienced a situation like this first hand before

Or we just understand the concept of marriage vows which is arguably one of the strongest convents between a man and a women (in this case) let one between the couple and God (if you believe so). That said something like cheating on your husband may not be a forgivable event considering they are newlyweds and don't have a ton of tangible, vested interests in their marriage aside from "love". I think individuals like yourself and your agreeable peers need to reflect on the level on insult cheating ie being unfaithful imparts onto a marriage. I'm not married and I can understand the degree of betrayal one must feel given the situation this character was in. I will go on to say being unfaithful is a calculated "mistake".

IIRC, this couple was on their honeymoon when they died which usually takes place a few days if not the day after marriage, so she cheated on him before they got married

Clearly this woman loves this man and only wants him in her life but with that being said, why would a woman like this go out of her way and sleep with another man? It's because the guy himself is very selfish and extremely paranoid (which in itself are terrible qualities to have especially for a spouse). Everything that happened was his fault. Like I said before, her cheating on him was wrong too but at the end of the day when you take a good look at this man, she deserved better (Yet she still chose him in the end and that says a lot about her character). What annoys me is that some people are condemning the woman without even understanding the full story

I'm not going to repeat what I said earlier but forgiveness is also encouraged in some religions as well.

The guy was too much of a hot mess as well so he will never find happiness because that's just his nature...This outcome was inevitable even if she didn't cheat

Your argument is flawed. The ring was on the marriage finger, not the engagement finger. There is no evidence at all that the cheating occurred before the wedding took place, whereas the evidence points to the cheating taking place AFTER they got married.
Also, the man's paranoia only started up after the wedding ceremony, meaning that they were all lovey-dovey before and during, if anything had changed to make the wife feel neglected/unloved (i.e. cause her to cheat), it would occur only after the wedding.

By your standards, it's okay for a woman to cheat on a man, so long as it's before their marriage, she doesn't tell anyone about it, AND she's repentant for it? That's some seriously messed up logic if you ask me.

If the wife had cheated and not come clean about it before the wedding, even if she was repentant about it, that would make her indiscretion even worse. First, if she loved this man, why cheat on him? Second, if she cheated on him for no good reason, why still get married to him? Third, if she was really feeling that repentant and guilty, why not tell him about the cheating BEFORE getting married to him?
Instead she just zipped her mouth and hid everything from him, even until after they died. I don't see any of her actions, assuming that you were right in saying it happened before they got married, as being repentant or asking for forgiveness. If she was really feeling so remorseful about the entire situation, she would have owned up to her mistake instead of trying to hide things. It's because she was trying to hide that past lover who was trying to call her that they ended up dead. If they had talked things through before the honeymoon, none of this would have happened, Granted they probably would have ended up unhappily divorced, but that's still better than being dead.

Don't just put the blame on the man's inability to trust. She was equally guilty, if not guiltier in causing the situation that led to their deaths.

>Flawed
>lel

He found out about it the day of the wedding, so how could she have cheated on him afterwards when they died on their honeymoon lol. And I'm also guessing that you all missed the part where I said that her cheating was wrong too huh?

My goodness it's so funny how you guys are twisting what some of us are saying as well as the actual events of the situation just to get a point across which in itself is quite frankly ridiculous considering how big some of you are on these religious matters

Like the guy I quoted said, stop being uptight and open your eyes and think critically AND logically. Things happen for a reason, not by chance. Also watch the episode again at least 3 times because clearly you watched the wrong anime lol

[/spoiler]

Read much? I think I pointed it out very clearly.
Plus, as I mentioned in the bolded parts above, why marry the guy when you cheated on him behind his back? If you really felt true regret for your actions, then what was the proof of your so-called regret? Is keeping silent about the cheating really how you deal with your so-called regrets and remorse? Is that how you show that you respect and appreciate this so-called "love of your life"?

I never mentioned an iota of religion in my post, I used a purely logical and moral standpoint. It ain't my fault your opinion is clouded by other posts by other forumers. If you want to argue on my points, then clearly read only my points.

Things happen for a reason and not by chance, yes that is true. So pray do explain why this woman would cheat on this so-called love of her life? Was she unhappy about their relationship? It wasn't shown, nor mentioned by either.
Pray do show your evidence for how you know the infidelity occurred BEFORE the wedding (I think I proved my point with what they showed us in the flashback).

In your own words:
"Clearly this woman loves this man and only wants him in her life but with that being said, why would a woman like this go out of her way and sleep with another man? It's because the guy himself is very selfish and extremely paranoid (which in itself are terrible qualities to have especially for a spouse). Everything that happened was his fault."
Pray do explain how she knew before the wedding that he was "very selfish and extremely paranoid"? Was there any evidence in the show pertaining to it? Please show it to me.
Pray do explain why she would go sleep with another man if she knew all these bad qualities of the man, and STILL want to get married to him? Is she a saint? If yes, then why would she sleep with the other man?

If you don't like the qualities of the man you selected to be the love of your life, is your reaction to sleep with another man? Is it considered remorseful or regretful if you keep silent about your indiscretion and not own up to it to the person whom you consider extremely important and also the love of your life?

Seems to me that the one not thinking logically or critically here is you.

Lel right back at you.

>I'm the one not reading

1. I didn't bother responding to the latter parts of your post because if you actually fully understood and analyzed the characteristics of the man and have actually...I dunno been in or seen an an actual relationship before, you could answer those questions on your own. I'm not going to hold your hand and spoon feed it to you. But to put you on the right track, *no relationship is perfect*, and I'll leave it at that

2. All that talk about sacred vows etc that you mentioned IS APART OF RELIGION lol what are you even getting at? XD Clouded by other posters? Dude, the only one who is clouded is you because only Jesus Kawaguchi knows why you're not seeing anything. Using morals in an argument is a red flag in itself (You'll learn this as you progress further in english/debate class). Your points shows that you didnt fully understand the point of this episode hence why I told you to watch it again

3. There you go selecting certain parts of what I said to try to get your "point" along again XD. Sighhhhhhhh, the evidence is the darts game in itself and the scene of their death. The point of the game is to show these people's true colours so that it can be determined whof gets reincarnated and who goes to the void. The answers to your questions can be answered by yourself once you fully grasp the concept of what I stated in (1) and what I just said in the sentence before this one.

4. Now you're just being completely unrealistic here. You're telling me that if you fucked up...Like REALLY fucked up, you're going to immediately come clean about it? That's not how the real world works buddy, it's human nature to be ashamed of making a big mistake and wanting to hold hold for as long as you can so that you could think of something to try and fix it.

With that being said, once you fully understand the situation and human nature in itself lol, you should figure it out :)

Silly human,

go back to read my argument please, just because I have quotes that you quoted of other people does not mean that I said, nor agree, with what they said.

First off, when did I say anything about sacred vows? Quote me on this one please. When did I say anything at all about sacred vows?

Secondly, morality isn't limited to religion or anything, so I find nothing wrong with using it in my arguments.

Thirdly, I quoted your entire text proper, I did not take anything out of context, anyone else who has read this conversation through and through can clearly see this. If I had taken anything out of context, why would i bother even quoting your entire text?

Fourthly, despite all this posturing about "not spoon feeding me", you haven't even been able to come up with any viable evidence in the two episodes to support your argument. It's not about spoon-feeding, it's called empirical evidence. If you can't even bother to answer my queries properly just because "you can't be bothered to" that doesn't make you right, it just means you are unable to prove your position, so don't start acting all high and mighty. Answer my questions properly instead and actually prove me wrong. Otherwise, the one made to look like a fool isn't me but yourself.

And as for your point (4), it's not the way the world works for you, but I think I can speak for most normal people, that if you fuck up, and you were truly remorseful and felt bad about it, then you really would own up to it. Remember the guy who chopped down the cherry tree? Abe Lincoln? Yeah he really fucked up too, and yet he owned up to his mistake and was rewarded for his honesty.
Hiding your fuck ups doesn't show you to be a remorseful person, it just shows you to be a coward who is ashamed of their fuck up and cannot own up to their own mistakes. Even if you were trying to fix a fuck up, you could still own up to your fuck up.

Which leads me to my fifth point. If you were truly so in love with a person and cared so much about them, would you not make it a priority not to majorly fuck up what you had with said person? It's not human nature to cheat, simply because human beings are social creatures who are pressured by morals, laws and traditions passed on to us for centuries. For all the points you put out, you still have not been able to answer the most fundamental problem with your argument. Why would wifey-san fuck up so majorly in the first place? Have you been able to back up your argument that "It was the husbands fault she cheated" with real evidence?

Just answer my questions, no posturing needed. If you can truly prove me wrong, then do so.

Lmfaoooooooo, really now? And I confused you with that other guy lol, so my bad XD

Morality stems off of religion, nothing more and nothing less. It's a concept from the Bible/Whatever other religious books there are in the world. Killing and stealing are morally wrong, so if I did one or the other that means I'm evil and should go to hell. But what if I killed out of self defense? What if I stole for the benefit of others or my own survival? Because the act itself is morally wrong that means I'm a bad person? Gtfo with that bullshit.

Once again.....The evidence is RIGHT THERE FOR YOU TO SEE IN THE EPISODE. YOU just failed to FULLY INTERPRET what was said and shown because of your "morals" which as I stated earlier has NO PLACE IN A DEBATE.

If you want to know what I'm talking about, then read all of my posts in this thread and all of the others whereas we got the message and understood it.

>Implying that most people today are like fucking Honest Abraham Lincoln

I'm fucking done with this conversation, if you finally decide to stop being biased and blind then good for you, if not then I'll just continue to laugh my butt off lol

As such, I've read your previous posts, and yet you have still not answered my questions.

Give me some real answers backed up by empirical evidence, please. Don't bullshit with the "right there for you to see in the episode". Point out the exact scene and type it out. Where is it? Otherwise I'll still call bullshit on your argument.

As for your implication that "we got the message and understood it", I fail to see how you can even speak up for the others, specially when the majority of the thread are still going on about how Cheating is the worst and everyone who does it should go to hell or whatever. Please list out the posts that agree with you, or see things in your way, before you actually make such a bold statement.

Morality was not a concept devised by religion. I highly doubt that before religion was in place all men acted like animals and killed each other for fun, or cheated on their SOs for fun. The concept of what is right or wrong did not stem from religion, religion simply took common sense concepts and molded them to suit their needs in preaching to others. Philosophy, which is pretty much the antithesis of Religion, is very much based on concepts of morality.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Morality

Please try to read up a little more before you start spewing your own ideas as fact.

I was never talking about religion, nor was I even talking about whether what the couple had done during their lives had any weight on their judgment during the games and the revelations of their secrets and memories.

The very core of what I had said up to now was that even now you have failed to answer the basic questions that I had posed about your own argument about why the wifey fucked up so badly in the first place, because simply you have not presented any evidence at all that as you say, the husband is entirely at fault.

Seriously dude, just post the evidence. If you don't have any, just say so. Your "It's right there in the episode" is fooling no one. Either back up your argument, or just admit you don't got any. How simple is that?

By the way, leaving the conversation without proving yourself right does nothing either.

You guys are going on different tangents that are not necessary and at this point, based on what I am reading, are just trying to prove on another wrong.

With that said, let me say my points and views about these two couple who should have had "a fulfilled happy life." < I am quoting the anime, not you two, so don't attack me.

Why would she go and cheat if he is the love of her life? That is a very good question, and I think we found an answer at the end when Nona told Decim that "people make mistakes" after having heard that Onna's explanation... and that is the gist... humans are bound to make mistakes!

I want to say that I do not know when the cheating happened, for me it's just not clear enough and B) I want to say that the guy lived his life with her in doubt and with no trust, and that is not fulfilling for any human being. You should not be in a relationship, marriage or with someone if you have doubts and are not happy and not sharing. So, he should have brought the question forward earlier and talked to her about it (because his doubts caused the death eventually, which I think is a good twist).

I don't have answers and I think we should not try to enforce any of our thoughts on each other, specially form an anime that is open for interpretation.

State what you have to state, accept it and move on.

I think the anime is great and is a good portal to move our thoughts about humanity, morality and remind ourselves that at one point we will all be in the same shoes, so live as a better, understanding human being and never live in doubts or unhappiness (if you can of course, there are many circumstances that this not easy to achieve).

I just want to remind all that these are my personal opinions and interpretations of the 2 episodes so far and I am happy for discussion but will not respond to attacks.

Jan 18, 2015 4:33 PM

#403

Tokoya

The Komori

Offline

Mar 2013

7474

L-Ryoshi said:

Tokoya said:
Using Wikipedia in a debate....Top lel

Dude me and many othere have proved that we are right and have shown analysis to back it up all throughout this thread.

Majority of the thread is on your side? Try you and the same 3 other people that are going on and on with this crap (Like the guy I confused you with in regards to the sacred vows thing xD) They're in our chain of posts even lol.

Majority of this thread are praising the episode. Nice try but nobody is that ignorant and gullible enough to fall for that ;)

Once again, you just failed to comprehend it all, it's a waste of time for me to keep on repeating myself to someone who's biggest argument revolves around "What is morally right"

Yet again, you have failed to explain your reasoning.
As for my usage of actual facts, if you can't top that, then well, I'm sorry for you.
I gave you plenty of opportunity to explain yourself, but as yet you haven't.

If you really want to prove yourself right, it's really simple: Link me to your so-called explanations. If you cannot do something so simple in this day in age as to link to your, or your "majority" opinion, own posts on this very thread (i.e. which paragraph of which page, of which post of this thread), then you have some serious credibility issues.

As of now, your own answers to my questions have consisted of "I have already told you", "you can see it in the episode" and "everyone who's seen my previous posts agree with me".

In that case, just prove it. Link me to your so-called posts that explain your so-called position. It ain't really that hard, now is it? It would end any debate that you have with me in 10 seconds flat.

Seriously, I'm giving you a chance to prove your credibility here. It's not my fault if you refuse to save yourself.

I'm not going to look through this thread to repost something that I already stated, go and find them, read themore and then come back with something new please

So until then, good day to you sir

@MezuAri, don't worry man, no harm will come to you xD. I'm not atracking anyone, but she cheated on him before the wedding because

1. The girls in the bathroom let it slip that the wife had an affair

2. This happened on the day of the wedding (We know this because they said that it was a nice ceremony and referred the man as her husband. Plus he was still wearing his tux)

3. They died on the honeymoon which tales place either immediately after the wedding or the next day

Jan 18, 2015 4:50 PM

#404

L-Ryoshi

Offline

Dec 2013

2814

MezuAri said:

L-Ryoshi said:

Tokoya said:

[quote=L-Ryoshi][quote=Tokoya][quote=L-Ryoshi]

Tokoya said:

L-Ryoshi said:

Tokoya said:

IZEROII said:
[spoiler]I really enjoyed the "reverse" perspective of this episode. One of the better introductions to a universe I've seen recently.

Nona has captivated me.

Tokoya said:

EarlCiel said:

Tokoya said:

deadoptimist said:
Edit: The thread honestly scares me, especially people saying that destroying a soul for cheating is ok, even if the said person feels bad about it and would like to repent, cause religion. Christianity at least has a concept of mercy and forgiveness. To see sins as a lines on a tab is wrong from moral standpoint. It's not that their good deeds were taken into account, and only their relationships were studied, though they're not the only facet of life.

My point exactly

Everyone makes mistakes. Cheating is a mistake. In the end, we learned that she still loved him enough to sacrifice herself.
So...like, honestly, people who are saying it's okay to destroy a soul for cheating is denying her love and saying it''s okay to condemn people for all of eternity...just for making a mistake.

Some people have their heads screwed on the wrong way.

Tell me about it. I'm almost convinced that at least half of them never even experienced a situation like this first hand before

Or we just understand the concept of marriage vows which is arguably one of the strongest convents between a man and a women (in this case) let one between the couple and God (if you believe so). That said something like cheating on your husband may not be a forgivable event considering they are newlyweds and don't have a ton of tangible, vested interests in their marriage aside from "love". I think individuals like yourself and your agreeable peers need to reflect on the level on insult cheating ie being unfaithful imparts onto a marriage. I'm not married and I can understand the degree of betrayal one must feel given the situation this character was in. I will go on to say being unfaithful is a calculated "mistake".

IIRC, this couple was on their honeymoon when they died which usually takes place a few days if not the day after marriage, so she cheated on him before they got married

Clearly this woman loves this man and only wants him in her life but with that being said, why would a woman like this go out of her way and sleep with another man? It's because the guy himself is very selfish and extremely paranoid (which in itself are terrible qualities to have especially for a spouse). Everything that happened was his fault. Like I said before, her cheating on him was wrong too but at the end of the day when you take a good look at this man, she deserved better (Yet she still chose him in the end and that says a lot about her character). What annoys me is that some people are condemning the woman without even understanding the full story

I'm not going to repeat what I said earlier but forgiveness is also encouraged in some religions as well.

The guy was too much of a hot mess as well so he will never find happiness because that's just his nature...This outcome was inevitable even if she didn't cheat

Your argument is flawed. The ring was on the marriage finger, not the engagement finger. There is no evidence at all that the cheating occurred before the wedding took place, whereas the evidence points to the cheating taking place AFTER they got married.
Also, the man's paranoia only started up after the wedding ceremony, meaning that they were all lovey-dovey before and during, if anything had changed to make the wife feel neglected/unloved (i.e. cause her to cheat), it would occur only after the wedding.

By your standards, it's okay for a woman to cheat on a man, so long as it's before their marriage, she doesn't tell anyone about it, AND she's repentant for it? That's some seriously messed up logic if you ask me.

If the wife had cheated and not come clean about it before the wedding, even if she was repentant about it, that would make her indiscretion even worse. First, if she loved this man, why cheat on him? Second, if she cheated on him for no good reason, why still get married to him? Third, if she was really feeling that repentant and guilty, why not tell him about the cheating BEFORE getting married to him?
Instead she just zipped her mouth and hid everything from him, even until after they died. I don't see any of her actions, assuming that you were right in saying it happened before they got married, as being repentant or asking for forgiveness. If she was really feeling so remorseful about the entire situation, she would have owned up to her mistake instead of trying to hide things. It's because she was trying to hide that past lover who was trying to call her that they ended up dead. If they had talked things through before the honeymoon, none of this would have happened, Granted they probably would have ended up unhappily divorced, but that's still better than being dead.

Don't just put the blame on the man's inability to trust. She was equally guilty, if not guiltier in causing the situation that led to their deaths.

>Flawed
>lel

He found out about it the day of the wedding, so how could she have cheated on him afterwards when they died on their honeymoon lol. And I'm also guessing that you all missed the part where I said that her cheating was wrong too huh?

My goodness it's so funny how you guys are twisting what some of us are saying as well as the actual events of the situation just to get a point across which in itself is quite frankly ridiculous considering how big some of you are on these religious matters

Like the guy I quoted said, stop being uptight and open your eyes and think critically AND logically. Things happen for a reason, not by chance. Also watch the episode again at least 3 times because clearly you watched the wrong anime lol

Read much? I think I pointed it out very clearly.
Plus, as I mentioned in the bolded parts above, why marry the guy when you cheated on him behind his back? If you really felt true regret for your actions, then what was the proof of your so-called regret? Is keeping silent about the cheating really how you deal with your so-called regrets and remorse? Is that how you show that you respect and appreciate this so-called "love of your life"?

I never mentioned an iota of religion in my post, I used a purely logical and moral standpoint. It ain't my fault your opinion is clouded by other posts by other forumers. If you want to argue on my points, then clearly read only my points.

Things happen for a reason and not by chance, yes that is true. So pray do explain why this woman would cheat on this so-called love of her life? Was she unhappy about their relationship? It wasn't shown, nor mentioned by either.
Pray do show your evidence for how you know the infidelity occurred BEFORE the wedding (I think I proved my point with what they showed us in the flashback).

In your own words:
"Clearly this woman loves this man and only wants him in her life but with that being said, why would a woman like this go out of her way and sleep with another man? It's because the guy himself is very selfish and extremely paranoid (which in itself are terrible qualities to have especially for a spouse). Everything that happened was his fault."
Pray do explain how she knew before the wedding that he was "very selfish and extremely paranoid"? Was there any evidence in the show pertaining to it? Please show it to me.
Pray do explain why she would go sleep with another man if she knew all these bad qualities of the man, and STILL want to get married to him? Is she a saint? If yes, then why would she sleep with the other man?

If you don't like the qualities of the man you selected to be the love of your life, is your reaction to sleep with another man? Is it considered remorseful or regretful if you keep silent about your indiscretion and not own up to it to the person whom you consider extremely important and also the love of your life?

Seems to me that the one not thinking logically or critically here is you.

Lel right back at you.

>I'm the one not reading

1. I didn't bother responding to the latter parts of your post because if you actually fully understood and analyzed the characteristics of the man and have actually...I dunno been in or seen an an actual relationship before, you could answer those questions on your own. I'm not going to hold your hand and spoon feed it to you. But to put you on the right track, *no relationship is perfect*, and I'll leave it at that

2. All that talk about sacred vows etc that you mentioned IS APART OF RELIGION lol what are you even getting at? XD Clouded by other posters? Dude, the only one who is clouded is you because only Jesus Kawaguchi knows why you're not seeing anything. Using morals in an argument is a red flag in itself (You'll learn this as you progress further in english/debate class). Your points shows that you didnt fully understand the point of this episode hence why I told you to watch it again

3. There you go selecting certain parts of what I said to try to get your "point" along again XD. Sighhhhhhhh, the evidence is the darts game in itself and the scene of their death. The point of the game is to show these people's true colours so that it can be determined whof gets reincarnated and who goes to the void. The answers to your questions can be answered by yourself once you fully grasp the concept of what I stated in (1) and what I just said in the sentence before this one.

4. Now you're just being completely unrealistic here. You're telling me that if you fucked up...Like REALLY fucked up, you're going to immediately come clean about it? That's not how the real world works buddy, it's human nature to be ashamed of making a big mistake and wanting to hold hold for as long as you can so that you could think of something to try and fix it.

With that being said, once you fully understand the situation and human nature in itself lol, you should figure it out :)

Silly human,

go back to read my argument please, just because I have quotes that you quoted of other people does not mean that I said, nor agree, with what they said.

First off, when did I say anything about sacred vows? Quote me on this one please. When did I say anything at all about sacred vows?

Secondly, morality isn't limited to religion or anything, so I find nothing wrong with using it in my arguments.

Thirdly, I quoted your entire text proper, I did not take anything out of context, anyone else who has read this conversation through and through can clearly see this. If I had taken anything out of context, why would i bother even quoting your entire text?

Fourthly, despite all this posturing about "not spoon feeding me", you haven't even been able to come up with any viable evidence in the two episodes to support your argument. It's not about spoon-feeding, it's called empirical evidence. If you can't even bother to answer my queries properly just because "you can't be bothered to" that doesn't make you right, it just means you are unable to prove your position, so don't start acting all high and mighty. Answer my questions properly instead and actually prove me wrong. Otherwise, the one made to look like a fool isn't me but yourself.

And as for your point (4), it's not the way the world works for you, but I think I can speak for most normal people, that if you fuck up, and you were truly remorseful and felt bad about it, then you really would own up to it. Remember the guy who chopped down the cherry tree? Abe Lincoln? Yeah he really fucked up too, and yet he owned up to his mistake and was rewarded for his honesty.
Hiding your fuck ups doesn't show you to be a remorseful person, it just shows you to be a coward who is ashamed of their fuck up and cannot own up to their own mistakes. Even if you were trying to fix a fuck up, you could still own up to your fuck up.

Which leads me to my fifth point. If you were truly so in love with a person and cared so much about them, would you not make it a priority not to majorly fuck up what you had with said person? It's not human nature to cheat, simply because human beings are social creatures who are pressured by morals, laws and traditions passed on to us for centuries. For all the points you put out, you still have not been able to answer the most fundamental problem with your argument. Why would wifey-san fuck up so majorly in the first place? Have you been able to back up your argument that "It was the husbands fault she cheated" with real evidence?

Just answer my questions, no posturing needed. If you can truly prove me wrong, then do so.

[/spoiler]Lmfaoooooooo, really now? And I confused you with that other guy lol, so my bad XD

Morality stems off of religion, nothing more and nothing less. It's a concept from the Bible/Whatever other religious books there are in the world. Killing and stealing are morally wrong, so if I did one or the other that means I'm evil and should go to hell. But what if I killed out of self defense? What if I stole for the benefit of others or my own survival? Because the act itself is morally wrong that means I'm a bad person? Gtfo with that bullshit.

Once again.....The evidence is RIGHT THERE FOR YOU TO SEE IN THE EPISODE. YOU just failed to FULLY INTERPRET what was said and shown because of your "morals" which as I stated earlier has NO PLACE IN A DEBATE.

If you want to know what I'm talking about, then read all of my posts in this thread and all of the others whereas we got the message and understood it.

>Implying that most people today are like fucking Honest Abraham Lincoln

I'm fucking done with this conversation, if you finally decide to stop being biased and blind then good for you, if not then I'll just continue to laugh my butt off lol[/quote]

As such, I've read your previous posts, and yet you have still not answered my questions.

Give me some real answers backed up by empirical evidence, please. Don't bullshit with the "right there for you to see in the episode". Point out the exact scene and type it out. Where is it? Otherwise I'll still call bullshit on your argument.

As for your implication that "we got the message and understood it", I fail to see how you can even speak up for the others, specially when the majority of the thread are still going on about how Cheating is the worst and everyone who does it should go to hell or whatever. Please list out the posts that agree with you, or see things in your way, before you actually make such a bold statement.

Morality was not a concept devised by religion. I highly doubt that before religion was in place all men acted like animals and killed each other for fun, or cheated on their SOs for fun. The concept of what is right or wrong did not stem from religion, religion simply took common sense concepts and molded them to suit their needs in preaching to others. Philosophy, which is pretty much the antithesis of Religion, is very much based on concepts of morality.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Morality

Please try to read up a little more before you start spewing your own ideas as fact.

I was never talking about religion, nor was I even talking about whether what the couple had done during their lives had any weight on their judgment during the games and the revelations of their secrets and memories.

The very core of what I had said up to now was that even now you have failed to answer the basic questions that I had posed about your own argument about why the wifey fucked up so badly in the first place, because simply you have not presented any evidence at all that as you say, the husband is entirely at fault.

Seriously dude, just post the evidence. If you don't have any, just say so. Your "It's right there in the episode" is fooling no one. Either back up your argument, or just admit you don't got any. How simple is that?

By the way, leaving the conversation without proving yourself right does nothing either.[/quote]

You guys are going on different tangents that are not necessary and at this point, based on what I am reading, are just trying to prove on another wrong.

With that said, let me say my points and views about these two couple who should have had "a fulfilled happy life." < I am quoting the anime, not you two, so don't attack me.

Why would she go and cheat if he is the love of her life? That is a very good question, and I think we found an answer at the end when Nona told Decim that "people make mistakes" after having heard that Onna's explanation... and that is the gist... humans are bound to make mistakes!

I want to say that I do not know when the cheating happened, for me it's just not clear enough and B) I want to say that the guy lived his life with her in doubt and with no trust, and that is not fulfilling for any human being. You should not be in a relationship, marriage or with someone if you have doubts and are not happy and not sharing. So, he should have brought the question forward earlier and talked to her about it (because his doubts caused the death eventually, which I think is a good twist).

I don't have answers and I think we should not try to enforce any of our thoughts on each other, specially form an anime that is open for interpretation.

State what you have to state, accept it and move on.

I think the anime is great and is a good portal to move our thoughts about humanity, morality and remind ourselves that at one point we will all be in the same shoes, so live as a better, understanding human being and never live in doubts or unhappiness (if you can of course, there are many circumstances that this not easy to achieve).

I just want to remind all that these are my personal opinions and interpretations of the 2 episodes so far and I am happy for discussion but will not respond to attacks.[/quote]

Thank you!
For once I feel like I'm not talking to a wall here.

My only gripe has and always has been the lay of the blame regarding the incident and the accusation that Tokoya had that everything was "all the guys fault". My entire rebuke of it has simply been the lay of blame of both persons deaths caused by the weird situation caused by the cheating (in fact, I'd posted several times in the past two episodes that the timeline of events didn't seem to make sense).
Tokoya was so adamant that his/her view was correct and that everyone on the forum bar a few "idiots" saw things the way that he did. I'm just here to ask for proof regarding all his claims. Simple as that.

It's really not my fault that he didn't explain it properly to shut me up, or to back up his points with valid explanations and evidence.

I too agree that humans are entitled to making mistakes, but here's the thing: If there is truly a reason for everything, can you truly prove that it was "All the mans fault" that the cheating occurred? Is it not possible that given the seriousness of the indiscretion and the facts provided to us in the anime that the wife was so in love with the man, that one reason for why the woman cheated was simply because it was something in her nature to do so? In which case, would that not mean the man was truly not fully responsible for the incident which cost them their lives?

Edit: I would also like to add that given his latest post on what he believes is the true timeline of things, laying the blame of their deaths on the man makes even less sense, considering that she had cheated on him before he supposedly turned all paranoid and indifferent towards her.

I've been posting questions up, you would think that if as he says that everyone and their uncle sees things his way, that there wouldn't be my questions here in the first place? Truth of the matter is, not everyone agrees with his points. He just has to accept it and move on.

I personally enjoy discussing about humanity and morality here on these threads. As such, I appreciate any and all logical discussion.

@Instakiller: fixed somewhat.

L-RyoshiJan 18, 2015 5:42 PM

HESTIAAPPROVES

Jan 18, 2015 5:19 PM

#405

InstaKiller

Offline

Jan 2014

166

I dream of a world where people put huge quote chains in spoilers

"When /a/ sends its fags, they’re not sending their best. They’re not sending you.
They’re sending fags that have lots of problems, and they’re bringing those problems to us.
They’re bringing cancer. They’re bringing bait. They’re shitposters.
And some, I assume, are good fags."
-@Xinil

Jan 18, 2015 5:33 PM

#406

Tokoya

The Komori

Offline

Mar 2013

7474

InstaKiller said:
I dream of a world where people put huge quote chains in spoilers

It's why I stopped quoting the chain xD The kid is even putting words in my mouth and spitting out insults now....How cute xD

Jan 18, 2015 5:39 PM

#407

PreachElectrick

Offline

Dec 2014

537

Good episode, though I'm kind of confused where this anime is going to go, but that makes it all the more mysterious I guess. Still loving that opening theme.

Jan 18, 2015 5:39 PM

#408

Primeval

Offline

Jul 2011

313

kokusho36 said:

Kurokolist said:
I'm stating facts here, there is no excuse for cheating. Ever. Cheating isn't exactly going to help your relationship afterall. They weren't even married long, she should have taken action to help their relationship if anything.

You are also making assumptions about their relationship that we have no idea about. We were never shown him particularly mistreating her or any of the other nonsense. He had trust issues that a normal couple would have worked on. They apparently never even discussed it at length. She cheated regardless and got her just deserts.

It's tragic because yes, he also has issues, but lets not just try and write her off as a saint here or a good person. By my standards, she was unforgivable.

You can't forgive her even if she regretted it for the rest of her (short) life? She made one shitty decision and she immediately regretted it, are you really saying that it's wrong for her husband to forgive her and continue their relationship?
The theme of this episode was "everyone makes mistakes", she also showed her good nature by acting as a scapegoat for her husband's mistake, which killed their son.

Lol forgive and just continue the relationship? No offence but it sounds like you've never been in a serious relationship. To be cheated on is a terrible feeling of constant distrust and fear. Forgetting after CHEATING is not something easily done. Once you cheat, it will stick with your partner forever, there is nothing the other partner can say or do that can ensure 100% loyalty without giving up their free will in the relationship.

Jan 18, 2015 5:41 PM

#409

L-Ryoshi

Offline

Dec 2013

2814

Tokoya said:

InstaKiller said:
I dream of a world where people put huge quote chains in spoilers

It's why I stopped quoting the chain xD The kid is even putting words in my mouth and spitting out insults now....How cute xD

Now who is the child here? I neither edited nor added to any of your posts when i made my quotes. Read much?

HESTIAAPPROVES

Jan 18, 2015 5:42 PM

#410

Tokoya

The Komori

Offline

Mar 2013

7474

Primeval said:

kokusho36 said:

You can't forgive her even if she regretted it for the rest of her (short) life? She made one shitty decision and she immediately regretted it, are you really saying that it's wrong for her husband to forgive her and continue their relationship?
The theme of this episode was "everyone makes mistakes", she also showed her good nature by acting as a scapegoat for her husband's mistake, which killed their son.

Lol forgive and just continue the relationship? No offence but it sounds like you've never been in a serious relationship. To be cheated on is a terrible feeling of constant distrust and fear. Forgetting after CHEATING is not something easily done. Once you cheat, it will stick with your partner forever, there is nothing the other partner can say or do that can ensure 100% loyalty without giving up their free will in the relationship.

Subjective

P.S. Bill Clinton said hello

Jan 18, 2015 5:52 PM

#411

Tokoya

The Komori

Offline

Mar 2013

7474

L-Ryoshi said:

Tokoya said:

It's why I stopped quoting the chain xD The kid is even putting words in my mouth and spitting out insults now....How cute xD

Now who is the child here? I neither edited nor added to any of your posts when i made my quotes. Read much?

Lmao

"I think that everyone on the forum "bar a few idiots" agree with me"

That's called putting words in my mouth. In addition you even saying that also implies that you're attempting to antagonize the people that agree with by using something I never even said as fuel

In short you're trying to make it seem as if I'm rude and self centered which in itself is insulting me.

It's not my fault that you refuse to read through the thread to see where I made the points and analysis that you hilariously claim that I don't have and then rewatch the episode closely and critically so that you can see the truth for yourself xD

I think that you just refuse to look at it from a different perspective because your "morals" automatically has you biased towards the man. Yeah I feel bad for the man because I know how it feels to be betrayed but at the end of the day, he brought it on all on himself and it's his fault for not only killing his wife, but his unborn child too (Which is nothing short of murder). If he lived to tell the tale his ass would have been thrown in jail in a heartbeat for being a dumbass

Jan 18, 2015 5:57 PM

#412

NwAurion

Offline

Jan 2011

1073

So some souls are reincarnated, while the others get taking out of the loop by being sent to the void.

So where do new souls come from?

Also funny how Onna never asked if she is dead and why she is not sent on but chosen as an assisant, or if Nona and Decim are or what they are, seeing that they appear to be doing it for quite some time already.

Arbiters, okay, but who chose them? Who made that place in the first place? Nona said they call reincarnation heaven because it's easier to understand. Together with seeing how reincarnation is the good option, and the void the bad, there doesn't seem to be an actual heaven, therefore no god or anything.

To be fair, she was a bit preoccupied with the things Nona said, but stil..

Also: Decim is on the 15th floor. Even when Reincarnation and Void are both floors and counting Nona's place, that still leaves 11 floors. Seeing how spacious both the bar and especially Nona's place are, what do they need (at least) 11 additional floors for when all they do is judging souls and sending them on via elevator?

Jan 18, 2015 6:01 PM

#413

Primeval

Offline

Jul 2011

313

Kurokolist said:

mrdkreka said:

You mean like how the husband betrayed her wife love, and because of it she wasn't able to get along with him. So you have quite a lot in common in this aspect

Why do you think a lot of relationship end with cheating? Just because cheating is easier to define doesn't make it worse than treating your love like shit, and causing the death of both of them and their unborn child :-/

True the husband never approached the wife with his mistrust, and the wife didn't talk the issue over with her husband. This is what makes it a grey area issue, where the scale tipped in the women favor because of her sacrifice in Ano point of view, which Arbeiter didn't see.

Cheating is only a result, the reason/intent behind it defines its meaning.

That is apologetic bullshit. This is the shit that enables cheaters.

The only definition is that they are untrustworthy scum.

Relationships have ups and downs. How you respond to the hardships is what defines you as a person.

In the wife's case, she boned another guy, fulfilling her husbands paranoia. That great wisdom of hers.

Cheating is a choice. The wrong choice. It is so blatantly black and white.
You are never forced into it. You chose to be a lesser person. The wife even understood she was wrong so this isn't even a question.

Circumstances don't lessen her mistake at all. They don't even matter and are two separate issues. The husband and wife pair didn't handle their problems or relationship correctly from the start.

And I don't think a lot of relationships end with cheating, a lot do in fact end because of cheating. Others end because of other reasons. Whatever the case, cheating almost universally has a negative impact on the couple. There are sometimes underlying reasons behind cheating but it is often the proverbial nail in the coffin if it happens. Those reasons, again, don't impact the cheaters guilt at all. There are better ways to handle relationship problems besides screwing things up more.

And to the above couple guys who said she really did love him... no. That wasn't real love. Cheating and true love is indeed mutually exclusive. Because true love isn't situational. You don't just cheat when things get rough. Again, circumstances don't matter. Common sense people. You work through it and fix things. There was also no indication that she was indeed going to come clean about her cheating. Hell, it wasn't until the 11th hour that she actually came clean.

She did care and have affection for him... but real love? I've seen real love and that isn't it.

Fucking +1. Well said.

Jan 18, 2015 6:06 PM

#414

L-Ryoshi

Offline

Dec 2013

2814

Your words, not mine:

Tokoya said:
Clearly this woman loves this man and only wants him in her life but with that being said, why would a woman like this go out of her way and sleep with another man? It's because the guy himself is very selfish and extremely paranoid (which in itself are terrible qualities to have especially for a spouse). Everything that happened was his fault. Like I said before, her cheating on him was wrong too but at the end of the day when you take a good look at this man, she deserved better (Yet she still chose him in the end and that says a lot about her character). What annoys me is that some people are condemning the woman without even understanding the full story

Tokoya said:
If you want to know what I'm talking about, then read all of my posts in this thread and all of the others whereas we got the message and understood it.

Tokoya said:
he brought it on all on himself and it's his fault for not only killing his wife, but his unborn child too

Cause and effect. If she hadn't cheated, they'd still be alive (hence, it IS her fault them and their baby are dead, and not entirely his)
Oh, and in case you didn't read it, pray do explain your position on the below

L-Ryoshi said:
I too agree that humans are entitled to making mistakes, but here's the thing: If there is truly a reason for everything, can you truly prove that it was "All the mans fault" that the cheating occurred? Is it not possible that given the seriousness of the indiscretion and the facts provided to us in the anime that the wife was so in love with the man, that one reason for why the woman cheated was simply because it was something in her nature to do so? In which case, would that not mean the man was truly not fully responsible for the incident which cost them their lives?

Edit: I would also like to add that given his latest post on what he believes is the true timeline of things, laying the blame of their deaths on the man makes even less sense, considering that she had cheated on him before he supposedly turned all paranoid and indifferent towards her.

This has everything to do with morals. I only mentioned them because if cheating were amoral, then jealousy wouldn't come to play and no one would really give a damn whether a person cheats or not, hence there wouldn't be a situation for paranoia or aggression and lead to the death of both people.

Same to you here, mate. I think you are blinded by the possibility of an alternate perspective because you clearly are not answering my questions and responding to my points. You're only fixated on that you think you are correct and ignoring that other perspectives can still be right.

L-RyoshiJan 18, 2015 6:13 PM

HESTIAAPPROVES

Jan 18, 2015 6:07 PM

#415

cloud2313

Offline

Dec 2012

1897

The soundtrack is so amazing!!!!!

Hmm so it just confirmed our doubts. Machiko was making takahashi hate her and place all guilt on her... So he could be free and reincarnated. But still cheating is cheating. Maybe she was crying in that night as she discovered the baby was with the man she cheated with

Got to learn quite a lot about Decim. His hoby turned the back of his bar into a haunted house... Also the realisation of his mistake.

That black haired woman(what's her name) seems to be an interesting add to the bar and would love to see more of her.

cloud2313Jan 18, 2015 6:10 PM

Jan 18, 2015 6:13 PM

#416

Tokoya

The Komori

Offline

Mar 2013

7474

L-Ryoshi said:
Your words, not mine:

Tokoya said:
Clearly this woman loves this man and only wants him in her life but with that being said, why would a woman like this go out of her way and sleep with another man? It's because the guy himself is very selfish and extremely paranoid (which in itself are terrible qualities to have especially for a spouse). Everything that happened was his fault. Like I said before, her cheating on him was wrong too but at the end of the day when you take a good look at this man, she deserved better (Yet she still chose him in the end and that says a lot about her character). What annoys me is that some people are condemning the woman without even understanding the full story

Tokoya said:
If you want to know what I'm talking about, then read all of my posts in this thread and all of the others whereas we got the message and understood it.

Tokoya said:
he brought it on all on himself and it's his fault for not only killing his wife, but his unborn child too

Cause and effect. If she hadn't cheated, they'd still be alive (hence, it IS her fault them and their baby are dead, and not entirely his)
Oh, and in case you didn't read it, pray do explain your position on the below

L-Ryoshi said:
I too agree that humans are entitled to making mistakes, but here's the thing: If there is truly a reason for everything, can you truly prove that it was "All the mans fault" that the cheating occurred? Is it not possible that given the seriousness of the indiscretion and the facts provided to us in the anime that the wife was so in love with the man, that one reason for why the woman cheated was simply because it was something in her nature to do so? In which case, would that not mean the man was truly not fully responsible for the incident which cost them their lives?

Edit: I would also like to add that given his latest post on what he believes is the true timeline of things, laying the blame of their deaths on the man makes even less sense, considering that she had cheated on him before he supposedly turned all paranoid and indifferent towards her.

This has everything to do with morals. I only mentioned them because if cheating were amoral, then jealousy wouldn't come to play and no one would really give a damn whether a person cheats or not, hence there wouldn't be a situation for paranoia or aggression and lead to the death of both people.

Same to you here, mate. I think you are blinded by the possibility of an alternate perspective because you clearly are not answering my questions and responding to my points.

That was not my first post

Read the thread from the beginning

Until you fully understand the situation, you'll never get why Nona said that this man would have never found happiness and that the result will be the same

Which translates to "He's gonna be back there one day"

TokoyaJan 18, 2015 6:17 PM

Jan 18, 2015 6:13 PM

#417

ZephSilver

Offline

Jul 2014

235

lmaoo this shows opening is a complete troll.
Glad we got insight on the inner workings of the arbitrator's jobs, though I'm a bit worried that the novelty of this series will wear off quickly. Hope they atleast keep the games interesting.

Jan 18, 2015 6:17 PM

#418

evanlai

Offline

Jul 2012

55

Wow, this anime is exceeds my expectations. I love the behind the scenes. And it seems these scenes did not have enough evidence to denote what religion is there based upon (The buddha icon before Onna and Nona went inside the elevator is a bit not enough for me other than a design..) other than that....

In the story, reincarnation is indeed the basic of what we know. Plus (someone said it at the previous forum/s) is does not mean that it is a good thing (Case in point for Takashi. He has trust issues but then again that is everyone opinion since he was with Machiko).

Void is somewhat in a sense hell but once you go there you never go back. What better way to burn a soul for all eternity than waste the soul to nothingness.

Theories regarding about Machiko 'lying' and 'cheating' are right. Congrats guys! Still tragic though for her.

Is Death Parade a sequel to Death Billiards? or the other way around?

billybob300c said:
4. Machiko DID CHEAT. But it was a one-time thing and she truly regrets it. We don't know why she cheated but it was probably cuz of takashi's suspicions of her cheating.

This is quite I dunno know reverse? So Machiko cheated because Takashi suspected her cheating? Wouldn't be Machiko stopped to cheat if Takashi was suspicious? *_< Somethings not quite add up to your sentence. Pardon me if that is the case.

billybob300c said:
6. Takashi should've been sent to the void cuz he's the one who got both of them killed

Yeah he got them killed....through an ACCIDENT. It was not intentional to begin with. He simply did not look at the road. It is not a good evidence to sent him to the Void.

billybob300c said:
-TL;DR: 8. In the end, Dequim made a bad judgment call. He took machiko's "confession" at face value, saw that as her true dark self & used that to determine their judgment when it was clear that she was clearly putting up an act in order to reduce takashi's grief. she was using a lie to save takashi but dequim couldn't see it.

I think he did not made a bad decision cause still in the end, Machiko cheated whether it is a one time thing or not still 'she cheated'. It puts a dent in there relationship. Surely there is a chance there would be another.

Although I believe the mistake Decim did was he did not take into consideration the feelings of Machiko thus he thought Machiko indeed was telling the 'truth' but it was rather a 'lie'.

Jan 18, 2015 6:17 PM

#419

L-Ryoshi

Offline

Dec 2013

2814

Tokoya said:

L-Ryoshi said:
Your words, not mine:

Cause and effect. If she hadn't cheated, they'd still be alive (hence, it IS her fault them and their baby are dead, and not entirely his)
Oh, and in case you didn't read it, pray do explain your position on the below

This has everything to do with morals. I only mentioned them because if cheating were amoral, then jealousy wouldn't come to play and no one would really give a damn whether a person cheats or not, hence there wouldn't be a situation for paranoia or aggression and lead to the death of both people.

Same to you here, mate. I think you are blinded by the possibility of an alternate perspective because you clearly are not answering my questions and responding to my points.

That was not my first post

Read the thread from the beginning

Regardless of whether or not it was your first post or not, they are in fact all your opinions. I don't need to read from the beginning to understand a stated opinion from you.

You see, the main disagreement between you and me is the lay of the blame, which you clearly have not been able to denounce my opinion and points. You believe everything is the fault of the guy, whereas I believe the woman has more of the blame in the cause of their death.

If you misunderstood my points, it clearly isn't my problem.

I'm still waiting for you to back up your opinion about how it was entirely the mans fault that everything went down.

L-RyoshiJan 18, 2015 6:21 PM

HESTIAAPPROVES

Jan 18, 2015 6:23 PM

#420

Tokoya

The Komori

Offline

Mar 2013

7474

L-Ryoshi said:

Tokoya said:

L-Ryoshi said:
Your words, not mine:

Tokoya said:
Clearly this woman loves this man and only wants him in her life but with that being said, why would a woman like this go out of her way and sleep with another man? It's because the guy himself is very selfish and extremely paranoid (which in itself are terrible qualities to have especially for a spouse). Everything that happened was his fault. Like I said before, her cheating on him was wrong too but at the end of the day when you take a good look at this man, she deserved better (Yet she still chose him in the end and that says a lot about her character). What annoys me is that some people are condemning the woman without even understanding the full story

Tokoya said:
If you want to know what I'm talking about, then read all of my posts in this thread and all of the others whereas we got the message and understood it.

Tokoya said:
he brought it on all on himself and it's his fault for not only killing his wife, but his unborn child too

Cause and effect. If she hadn't cheated, they'd still be alive (hence, it IS her fault them and their baby are dead, and not entirely his)
Oh, and in case you didn't read it, pray do explain your position on the below

L-Ryoshi said:
I too agree that humans are entitled to making mistakes, but here's the thing: If there is truly a reason for everything, can you truly prove that it was "All the mans fault" that the cheating occurred? Is it not possible that given the seriousness of the indiscretion and the facts provided to us in the anime that the wife was so in love with the man, that one reason for why the woman cheated was simply because it was something in her nature to do so? In which case, would that not mean the man was truly not fully responsible for the incident which cost them their lives?

Edit: I would also like to add that given his latest post on what he believes is the true timeline of things, laying the blame of their deaths on the man makes even less sense, considering that she had cheated on him before he supposedly turned all paranoid and indifferent towards her.

This has everything to do with morals. I only mentioned them because if cheating were amoral, then jealousy wouldn't come to play and no one would really give a damn whether a person cheats or not, hence there wouldn't be a situation for paranoia or aggression and lead to the death of both people.

Same to you here, mate. I think you are blinded by the possibility of an alternate perspective because you clearly are not answering my questions and responding to my points.

That was not my first post

Read the thread from the beginning

Regardless of whether or not it was your first post or not, they are in fact all your opinions. I don't need to read from the beginning to understand a stated opinion from you.

You see, the main disagreement between you and me is the lay of the blame, which you clearly have not been able to denounce my opinion and points. You believe everything is the fault of the guy, whereas I believe the woman has more of the blame in the cause of their death.

If you misunderstood my points, it clearly isn't my problem.

>Asks me for my points and analysis to answer his questionson

>I direct you where to look to find them so you can see the full picture of what I'm saying to get your answers

>Refuses to go and see it and then goes on to repeat for the thousandth time that I have not provided anything

>Blames the woman who wasn't behind the wheel for why they died

*insert derp face/facepalm here*

Jan 18, 2015 6:45 PM

#421