Why do people still hate Floch?

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Jan 2018

108

Piromysl said:
There are no mental gymnastics you can possibly do to justify global genocide.

Reading this I had to think about the Samson Option, so I read the wiki and there was a reference to Itamar Yaoz-Kest's poem entitled "The Right to Exist: a Poem-Letter to the German Author". It was quite interesting because it reads like Eren could have written it. So no, it's not mental gymnastics, there are a lot of people who think this way and there are entire nations that base their strategy of deterrence on it.

Mar 6, 2023 10:10 PM

#60

ryzxgum

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Apr 2022

7913

yeah, i don't get it either. it's pathetic, really. he's a top 5 character in aot.
even i hated pre-s4 floch, but his character development turned it all around for me.

Mar 6, 2023 10:38 PM

#61

DexterDrubo

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Jul 2022

771

RaidenSteiner said:
I mean , i dont really understood the hate for this character, he just wants to protect his homeland, even his enemies like Hange thinks he's doing the right thing, so where does this massive hate come from?!

maybe because I am in Paradise side and I don't care about Floch's perspective and maybe I have an opinion?

Mar 6, 2023 11:00 PM

#62

mapleter

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Mar 2022

112

windymountain said:

Piromysl said:
There are no mental gymnastics you can possibly do to justify global genocide.

Reading this I had to think about the Samson Option, so I read the wiki and there was a reference to Itamar Yaoz-Kest's poem entitled "The Right to Exist: a Poem-Letter to the German Author". It was quite interesting because it reads like Eren could have written it. So no, it's not mental gymnastics, there are a lot of people who think this way and there are entire nations that base their strategy of deterrence on it.

The mental part is that in this story, the threat of rumbling incites the fear of the world to attack them instead of being a proper deterrence. 💀

Mar 6, 2023 11:30 PM

#63

Piromysl

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Jul 2015

13595

windymountain said:

Piromysl said:
There are no mental gymnastics you can possibly do to justify global genocide.

Reading this I had to think about the Samson Option, so I read the wiki and there was a reference to Itamar Yaoz-Kest's poem entitled "The Right to Exist: a Poem-Letter to the German Author". It was quite interesting because it reads like Eren could have written it. So no, it's not mental gymnastics, there are a lot of people who think this way and there are entire nations that base their strategy of deterrence on it.

Amount of people sharing a belief has no bearing on reality nor wether it is moral or not.
Once again, (almost) whole Nazi Germany thought that Holocaust was a good thing, yet it would be ludicrous for any reasonable person to aggre with that statement.

Mar 6, 2023 11:42 PM

#64

Serafos

🍅 Tomato 🍅

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Feb 2020

123004

I don't hate Floch at all.

Mar 7, 2023 12:10 AM

#65

F3ryal

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Jan 2023

11

DeFa- said:
why do people like floch

Cuz he's well written. He went from being scared of dying to sacrificing himself for Eren's plan to succeed. He had great development and he was loyal to Eren till the very end unlike his "friends".

Mar 7, 2023 12:14 AM

#66

Fuhrer_Wrath

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Dec 2020

524

I don't necessarily hate his character. He's a good character that serves a pivotal purpose in the story.

I dislike what his character is supposed to be or represents. Floch is a Facist and actively supports genocide. He kills unarmed civilians just because they disagree with him.
That's why I don't like him.

Mar 7, 2023 1:33 AM

#67

DJ-Nash0

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Jan 2021

74

All the hate is because of his face

Mar 7, 2023 1:42 AM

#68

animu007

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Feb 2020

1646

better question is,
why not?
making this thread is just another bait, and i fall or it....
anyway...

seriously i was so happy when he finally closed his eyes.

he was a disgusting nazi prick.

not a cool or honorable thing about him.

even worse are of course his troll fans, calling him king or goat of course.

sure, sure i get what Isayama was going to do with this character, and it was genious, still i dont have to like him. respect that.

animu007Mar 7, 2023 1:47 AM

Mar 7, 2023 1:51 AM

#69

hunteraselia

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Mar 2023

1

he was just loyal to the eren.

Mar 7, 2023 3:38 AM

#70

uraume888

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Sep 2022

3

WilfredJohnson said:
He’s the reason hange died and he’s a complete prick

Isayama is the reason Hange died💀

Mar 7, 2023 4:22 AM

#71

Za_Panda

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Mar 2021

1501

Because apparently for someone to like a character, the chara must possess a sound moral compass
And god forbid if they do any action that is bad. Then the one who likes must have the same viewpoint as that of the chara and should be banished

Mar 7, 2023 4:33 AM

#72

Watchanime324

Offline

Dec 2020

59

What do you mean hating his 'character' or 'character writing'?Like he's well written villian,but he's literally the dictionary definition of fascist so I think people are more than justified to hate him.
Ofcourse hating his character writing is different thing.

Mar 7, 2023 4:55 AM

#73

a0t3a

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Apr 2020

611

he's too much of a dick rider. He's like mikasa if mikasa was a boy and was more thirsty

Mar 7, 2023 5:16 AM

#74

Havamug

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Mar 2016

6

This rant went on a little longer than I anticipated, please read with open-mind, if you like Floch it's fine, I am just trying to express my personal distaste for him.

He's roleplaying as Erwin without any of the good qualities of Erwin. He's an ultranationalist, whereas Erwin spent more time fighting Eldians inside the wall with conspiracies and schemes than he did fighting actual titans. Hell, Erwin would never have anything to do with Yeagerists, being an Eldian doesn't make you his ally because Eldians are the ones who killed his father and that's his sole motivation, he built his military career with Kenny's gun behind his back at all time, most likely he'll be among first ones to consider that being a Marleyan doesn't make anyone his true enemy. Erwin didn't coup government by killing all of his opposition, Erwin essentially cornered entire military into a coup because disagreeing with him was impossible, he specifically designed such a scenario, whereas Floch expected everyone to fall in line with him because he believes every Eldian would prioritize survival through genocide and all those who don't he killed, so he ended up killing Eldians to save Eldians, which is schizophrenic. He's essentially a misguided brat who ate Erwin's us vs them narrative that Erwin made up, but he made it up not because he believed in it, but because he wanted to see the truth in the basement. And masses would eat up something as primitive as that given the circumstances they lived in at the time (the constant danger of mindless zombies, not sentient beings), and without any tangible end goal Floch's movement ended up being a grotesque parody of Erwin. Is essence his motivation is noble, but he's too primitive and too stupid to realize it, his experience in Shingashina degenerated him into last surviving relic of doctrine too primitive to work in more complex scenario of Final Season, and the fact that he gets away with upstaging smarter character like Hange just because Isayama was too lazy to do anything with her is just grating (but it's more of criticism in writing in general than Floch himself), he is propelled just because writing demanded him to succeed for Eren's sake and Eren couldn't care less while huffing his freedom fumes.

Mar 7, 2023 5:46 AM

#75

Offline

Jan 2018

108

Piromysl said:

windymountain said:

Reading this I had to think about the Samson Option, so I read the wiki and there was a reference to Itamar Yaoz-Kest's poem entitled "The Right to Exist: a Poem-Letter to the German Author". It was quite interesting because it reads like Eren could have written it. So no, it's not mental gymnastics, there are a lot of people who think this way and there are entire nations that base their strategy of deterrence on it.

Amount of people sharing a belief has no bearing on reality nor wether it is moral or not.
Once again, (almost) whole Nazi Germany thought that Holocaust was a good thing, yet it would be ludicrous for any reasonable person to aggre with that statement.

Sure, if billions of people share a belief, then it has no bearing on reality. Absolutely stellar reasoning...

Mar 7, 2023 6:05 AM

#76

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Mar 2022

119

windymountain said:

Piromysl said:

Amount of people sharing a belief has no bearing on reality nor wether it is moral or not.
Once again, (almost) whole Nazi Germany thought that Holocaust was a good thing, yet it would be ludicrous for any reasonable person to aggre with that statement.

Sure, if billions of people share a belief, then it has no bearing on reality. Absolutely stellar reasoning...

well, billions of people thought they are island devils. And MAD is more commonly known among general public than Samson option because it's still negative PR for Israel.

Here's a reddit thread asking what's samson option? And the top upvoted reply is "A
hypothetical scenario devised decades ago that no one takes seriously except for Israel-haters masquerading as conspiracy theorists." So it's certainly NOT something billions people know about.

https://www.reddit.com/r/Israel/comments/24dc7j/eli5_what_is_the_samson_option/

cyf1986Mar 7, 2023 6:40 AM

Mar 7, 2023 6:10 AM

#77

Chota_Itachi

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Nov 2021

516

I don't like him but don't hate him either, and those who do and love warriors are hypocritical pricks

Mar 7, 2023 6:39 AM

#78

Jollyne7

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Apr 2019

547

I had nothing against him in season 3. He told Armin what almost everyone thought about Erwin's death. but... in season 4 he turned into some kind of psycho. Ok he fought for Paradis but no one noticed how he enjoyed killing people?? He actually comes out of nowhere, acts like an asshole and has some sort of superiority complex Compared to Hanji and the other scouts who had to kill their former comrades and visibly cried and felt remorse, he didn't. I will never forget that disgusting smile of his when he knew a lot of people had drunk wine, or when he killed a civilian just because he disagreed with him. Or when he was doing those public executions and he wanted to make Jean kill. He didn't have charisma so anyone who disagreed with him Floch either killed or threatened him. Eren's ideology got into his head too much. except that Eren knew he was doing wrong and had remorse while Floch had no conscience. For him, the deaths of those millions of people didn't matter. what matters is that the Eldian empire will be powerful. I don't know how people can compare him to Erwin. Something like this is an insult to Erwin. He would never support such actions because the scouts are a unit in the service of humanity. Erwin was able to do a coup on his own without bloodshed, and such senseless killing is not his style. Not to mention leadership skills and charisma.

Jollyne7Mar 7, 2023 6:53 AM

Mar 7, 2023 7:44 AM

#79

GENETIKMONSTER

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Jan 2022

10

cause he's still a radical fascist pig.

Mar 7, 2023 8:47 AM

#80

3miL

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Dec 2012

75260

@Erenyeager_69

Look at how many people hate you

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Mar 7, 2023 9:16 AM

#81

Merve2Love

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Apr 2020

3937

Cause he's hateable.

That's the whole Idea behind his character. Him beeing relateable but evil in his extremist ways.
Story is about War and the cycle of hate...and what it does to people.

Mar 7, 2023 10:01 AM

#82

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Mar 2020

508

Vendy13 said:

Piromysl said:
There are no mental gymnastics you can possibly do to justify global genocide.

For the record, I don't really care about Floch one way or another (actually more confused why so many people love and hate him so much).

As far as your statement goes, I think you'd be surprised at how many people and nations would realistically choose their own people and country if faced with a real choice of "Our entire country and people is eradicated, or the entire rest of the world is." I agree with you that I don't believe it's right or just, but on average, most people don't give a damn that their new shoes were made by child slaves in another country. "Out of sight, out of mind," as they say. If there's such little compassion (we'll at least say genuine, tangible compassion that gets them to change their behavior in one way or another) for such a vain and petty thing, then it's difficult to expect anything better when the choice is "kill or be killed."

So I can't justify it, no. Not to myself and not to you, neither of which are in such dire straights. Could I see someone justify it to themselves in such a situation? Yeah, sadly.

if you watched fate/zero i think kiritsugu's wish does a pretty well in explaining how far people would have to go to protect the ones they love, i think somehow Eren's goal is similar with it. To have granted his wish, realistically kirtisugu would end up killing basically the whole world except the ones dear to him. Though if u didnt watched im not gonna give any spoilers about what is happening and how things end up

Mar 7, 2023 10:10 AM

#83

mapleter

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Mar 2022

112

RaidenSteiner said:

Vendy13 said:

For the record, I don't really care about Floch one way or another (actually more confused why so many people love and hate him so much).

As far as your statement goes, I think you'd be surprised at how many people and nations would realistically choose their own people and country if faced with a real choice of "Our entire country and people is eradicated, or the entire rest of the world is." I agree with you that I don't believe it's right or just, but on average, most people don't give a damn that their new shoes were made by child slaves in another country. "Out of sight, out of mind," as they say. If there's such little compassion (we'll at least say genuine, tangible compassion that gets them to change their behavior in one way or another) for such a vain and petty thing, then it's difficult to expect anything better when the choice is "kill or be killed."

So I can't justify it, no. Not to myself and not to you, neither of which are in such dire straights. Could I see someone justify it to themselves in such a situation? Yeah, sadly.

if you watched fate/zero i think kiritsugu's wish does a pretty well in explaining how far people would have to go to protect the ones they love, i think somehow Eren's goal is similar with it. To have granted his wish, realistically kirtisugu would end up killing basically the whole world except the ones dear to him. Though if u didnt watched im not gonna give any spoilers about what is happening and how things end up

well fate/zero is prequel so we know what did not happen. xD

Mar 7, 2023 10:15 AM

#84

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Mar 2020

508

mapleter said:

RaidenSteiner said:

if you watched fate/zero i think kiritsugu's wish does a pretty well in explaining how far people would have to go to protect the ones they love, i think somehow Eren's goal is similar with it. To have granted his wish, realistically kirtisugu would end up killing basically the whole world except the ones dear to him. Though if u didnt watched im not gonna give any spoilers about what is happening and how things end up

well fate/zero is prequel so we know what did not happen. xD

Fair enough lol ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

Mar 7, 2023 10:24 AM

#85

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Jan 2018

108

cyf1986 said:

windymountain said:

Sure, if billions of people share a belief, then it has no bearing on reality. Absolutely stellar reasoning...

well, billions of people thought they are island devils. And MAD is more commonly known among general public than Samson option because it's still negative PR for Israel.

Here's a reddit thread asking what's samson option? And the top upvoted reply is "A
hypothetical scenario devised decades ago that no one takes seriously except for Israel-haters masquerading as conspiracy theorists." So it's certainly NOT something billions people know about.

https://www.reddit.com/r/Israel/comments/24dc7j/eli5_what_is_the_samson_option/

You didn't understand anything. I don't even know where to begin. Every single sentence is wrong.

"well, billions of people thought they are island devils."
And this is exactly my point. Piromysl wrote that the quantity of people doesn't matter for reality. Which is ludicrous. People as a collective shape reality, so if a billion people have a belief about X, then it will certainly impact reality.

"Here's a reddit thread asking what's samson option? And the top upvoted reply is..."
You know, I don't care what someone on Reddit posts or who upvotes what. They are nobodies like us. If you read the wiki, you'll see that it was part of policy making, it was talked about in the government, university profs and advisors to the president talk about it, it was justified in major newspapers like the LA Times, books were written about it, and so on. These are fact. If you want to ignore them because some post was upvoted on reddit, then it only shows that you don't want to think for yourself, or do any research. Maybe you should just take the final step and outsource your thinking to ChatGPT.

"So it's certainly NOT something billions people know about."
I never said this. This was a response to something completely different. See above.

Mar 7, 2023 10:28 AM

#86

Offline

Mar 2020

508

animu007 said:
better question is,
why not?
making this thread is just another bait, and i fall or it....
anyway...

seriously i was so happy when he finally closed his eyes.

he was a disgusting nazi prick.

not a cool or honorable thing about him.

even worse are of course his troll fans, calling him king or goat of course.

sure, sure i get what Isayama was going to do with this character, and it was genious, still i dont have to like him. respect that.

I'm a bit confused, is Floch a nazi or a facist? cause those 2 are different types of dicatorships, most people in thread called him a fascist though, but i wouldnt be surprised if the next one calls him a commie at this point or whatever lenin's type of dictatorship was called

Mar 7, 2023 10:52 AM

#87

Offline

Mar 2022

119

windymountain said:

cyf1986 said:

well, billions of people thought they are island devils. And MAD is more commonly known among general public than Samson option because it's still negative PR for Israel.

Here's a reddit thread asking what's samson option? And the top upvoted reply is "A
hypothetical scenario devised decades ago that no one takes seriously except for Israel-haters masquerading as conspiracy theorists." So it's certainly NOT something billions people know about.

https://www.reddit.com/r/Israel/comments/24dc7j/eli5_what_is_the_samson_option/

These are fact. If you want to ignore them because some post was upvoted on reddit, then it only shows that you don't want to think for yourself, or do any research. Maybe you should just take the final step and outsource your thinking to ChatGPT.

Lol I did not bring up a random reddit thread to prove what they are saying is correct, I brought it up to show that the common people do not know about it. As I said before, "MAD is more commonly known among general public than samson option". I NEVER SAY IT'S NOT REAL. I NEVER SAY IT SHOULD BE IGNORED.

(you said)"You didn't understand anything. I don't even know where to begin. Every single sentence is wrong. "

Lol. You shouldn't pretend you can mindread people. Only makes yourself look like an asshole by assuming the worst when it's not the case.

(you said)"I never said this. This was a response to something completely different."

Ok that was my bad. But the reason I thought that is because MAD IS very commonly known, which is basically samson option but with different name.

cyf1986Mar 7, 2023 11:06 AM

Mar 7, 2023 12:25 PM

#88

animu007

Offline

Feb 2020

1646

RaidenSteiner said:

animu007 said:
better question is,
why not?
making this thread is just another bait, and i fall or it....
anyway...

seriously i was so happy when he finally closed his eyes.

he was a disgusting nazi prick.

not a cool or honorable thing about him.

even worse are of course his troll fans, calling him king or goat of course.

sure, sure i get what Isayama was going to do with this character, and it was genious, still i dont have to like him. respect that.

I'm a bit confused, is Floch a nazi or a facist? cause those 2 are different types of dicatorships, most people in thread called him a fascist though, but i wouldnt be surprised if the next one calls him a commie at this point or whatever lenin's type of dictatorship was called

you can just google the differences when you are so confused.

Mar 7, 2023 12:35 PM

#89

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Mar 2020

508

animu007 said:

RaidenSteiner said:

I'm a bit confused, is Floch a nazi or a facist? cause those 2 are different types of dicatorships, most people in thread called him a fascist though, but i wouldnt be surprised if the next one calls him a commie at this point or whatever lenin's type of dictatorship was called

you can just google the differences when you are so confused.

so you just threw in words you yourself dont know what mean, understandable

Mar 7, 2023 12:37 PM

#90

animu007

Offline

Feb 2020

1646

RaidenSteiner said:

animu007 said:

you can just google the differences when you are so confused.

so you just threw in words you yourself dont know what mean, understandable

dont worry i know it. i'm old enough and in germany we learn what is what^^
and Floch is more like a nazi for me. anyway, when YOU want the difference you know that you do.

the thing is is just dont want to talk you and explain that is what, sure you will come again with thats an excuse, but it is like it is. respect that, please.

animu007Mar 7, 2023 12:42 PM

Mar 7, 2023 1:39 PM

#91

JohnnyBoi56

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Oct 2022

5

DeFa- said:
why do people like floch

asking the real questions here

Mar 7, 2023 1:53 PM

#92

Adnash

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Oct 2013

9975

Floch is one of the best written characters in the entire series with really solid character development.

He is meant to be despised by readers, to be hated by them, that's his role. Coward who was lucky enough to be in the right place at a right time and meet the right people.

At the same time, his fanatical stance can be something worth of respecting, even without supporting a tiny bit his actions.

So yeah, while we can hate him as a character, it's worth of mentioning how well written he was.

Of course, I'm talking about readers ans viewers who are capable of seeing the bigger picture. Mindless hate or edgy admiration are two sides of the same coin representing lack of objectivism.

✨Saint Seiya Club🌠

Mar 7, 2023 2:35 PM

#93

Offline

Mar 2020

508

animu007 said:

RaidenSteiner said:

so you just threw in words you yourself dont know what mean, understandable

dont worry i know it. i'm old enough and in germany we learn what is what^^
and Floch is more like a nazi for me. anyway, when YOU want the difference you know that you do.

the thing is is just dont want to talk you and explain that is what, sure you will come again with thats an excuse, but it is like it is. respect that, please.

you're the one that joined the discussion lmao, no one cares if you wanna talk or not, no one asked you to be here either, also learn words definitions before using them.
Have a wonderful day and glory to our king Floch!

Mar 7, 2023 2:52 PM

#94

Lord_Volt

Offline

Jul 2020

62

RaidenSteiner said:
I mean , i dont really understood the hate for this character, he just wants to protect his homeland, even his enemies like Hange thinks he's doing the right thing, so where does this massive hate come from?!

aw man, lemme protect my nation by genociding the entire world. bet they'll love me.

Mar 7, 2023 3:00 PM

#95

icefirestone23

Offline

Mar 2021

1413

Flock had common sense and people who read till the ending will know that. Pretty much all he warned people about came to be. Like 95% of the world wanted eldians erased. They had no other option. People really hate nationalists and patriots do they.

Mar 7, 2023 5:41 PM

#96

Say-My-Name

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Jul 2022

1167

He's a total asshole and his fanbase has an average IQ of 7.

Mar 7, 2023 8:49 PM

#97

Offline

Jan 2018

108

cyf1986 said:

windymountain said:

These are fact. If you want to ignore them because some post was upvoted on reddit, then it only shows that you don't want to think for yourself, or do any research. Maybe you should just take the final step and outsource your thinking to ChatGPT.

Lol I did not bring up a random reddit thread to prove what they are saying is correct, I brought it up to show that the common people do not know about it. As I said before, "MAD is more commonly known among general public than samson option". I NEVER SAY IT'S NOT REAL. I NEVER SAY IT SHOULD BE IGNORED.

(you said)"You didn't understand anything. I don't even know where to begin. Every single sentence is wrong. "

Lol. You shouldn't pretend you can mindread people. Only makes yourself look like an asshole by assuming the worst when it's not the case.

(you said)"I never said this. This was a response to something completely different."

Ok that was my bad. But the reason I thought that is because MAD IS very commonly known, which is basically samson option but with different name.

"I brought it up to show that the common people do not know about it."
Why did you even bring it up? How does it contradict anything that I said? Who cares if MAD is more commonly know? It doesn't matter that the mob doesn't know about it in this case, because the really important people who make all the decisions certainly know about it, and that's all that matters. When we learn about it, it will be too late anyways.

"You shouldn't pretend you can mindread people."
I don't pretend, I have proof. You mixed two different comments that are independent of each other. You took an answer that was posted in regards to question B and you used it for question A. Why do you try to confuse me?

"But the reason I thought that is because MAD IS very commonly known, which is basically samson option but with different name."
If it's basically the same as MAD, and MAD is more commonly known, what was even the point of this arguing? MAD is from a position of strength, if you nuke us, we will nuke you, because we have the same capabilities. Samson Option is from a position of weakness, if you try to destroy us in any way, shape or form, AND IF NOBODY HELPS US, we will take you ALL to the same fate. In AoT, they know that the Rumbling will fail in the future because of technological advancements in weaponry (I think it was mentioned in S04 Part 1). So they have to catch up to make MAD possible after the limited Rumbling. Which is up to luck, maybe they achieve it, maybe not. And without inventing nukes, how will they even do it? They will be obliterated by strong conventional weapons and bombs just because the outside world outnumbers them in a crazy way. If I remember correctly, they had rare resources and 1 ally as a starting point. To estimate the probability of survival, we would need to know a lot more about the world, we don't have the information as far as I know. And wether they can find more allies and create some kind of balance is too difficult to estimate because the geopolitical context and world in general changes too fast. In their present moment, they surely had to be major optimists and see the glass as half full rather than half empty.

windymountainMar 7, 2023 8:59 PM

Mar 7, 2023 9:04 PM

#98

Offline

Mar 2022

119

@ windymountain

(you said) "Why did you even bring it up?"

Uh, because you are the first one who brought up samson option. And since most commoners don't know about it or too lazy to read wiki, I provide the tldr by mentioning MAD and the next time you want to get the point across to other people(because YOU chose to post about samson option here), it would be easier to just say MAD.

(you said)"Why do you try to confuse me?"

Uh no? I admitted at the end of my previous comment that I did misinterpret part of your comment. I said "Ok that was my bad".

(you said) "MAD is from a position of strength.. Samson Option is from a position of weakness"

MAD is not exclusive to position of strength. The "cultural difference" is that samson option has Israeli origin. Other countries don't call it that for their deterrence Strat.

(you said) "To estimate the probability of survival, we would need to know a lot more about the world, we don't have the information as far as I know. And wether they can find more allies and create some kind of balance is too difficult to estimate because the geopolitical context and world in general changes too fast."

This I don't see many people here brought up and I had the same thought, full agreement here.

Mar 7, 2023 9:20 PM

#99

Offline

Jan 2018

108

cyf1986 said:
@ windymountain

(you said) "Why did you even bring it up?"

Uh, because you are the first one who brought up samson option. And since most commoners don't know about it or too lazy to read wiki, I provide the tldr by mentioning MAD and the next time you want to get the point across to other people(because YOU chose to post about samson option here), it would be easier to just say MAD.

(you said)"Why do you try to confuse me?"

Uh no? I admitted at the end of my previous comment that I did misinterpret part of your comment. I said "Ok that was my bad".

(you said) "MAD is from a position of strength.. Samson Option is from a position of weakness"

MAD is not exclusive to position of strength. The "cultural difference" is that samson option has Israeli origin. Other countries don't call it that for their deterrence Strat.

(you said) "To estimate the probability of survival, we would need to know a lot more about the world, we don't have the information as far as I know. And wether they can find more allies and create some kind of balance is too difficult to estimate because the geopolitical context and world in general changes too fast."

This I don't see many people here brought up and I had the same thought, full agreement here.

"the next time you want to get the point across to other people (because YOU chose to post about samson option here) "
Thank you master, give me please more orders. I don't see a poll here where the people made you their representative. Very nice of you to assume everyone here is stupid. It's not easier to say MAD. MAD would have made no contribution to this discussion, but the poem I mentioned does. Because it was astoundingly similar to Eren's view, he could have written it. Is it not interesting? I think it is.

"MAD is not exclusive to position of strength. The "cultural difference" is that samson option has Israeli origin. Other countries don't call it that for their deterrence Strat."
MAD wouldn't have brought my point across. And I also don't agree with you. I fleshed out my points above, you're just saying "no" to it and then posting absolute statements without backing them up. Read the poem. If you find something similar in context to MAD from another person from another country, then I would be interested to read it. I guess Putin is another example, saying "Why do we need a world if Russia is not in it?" But it's not the same, it's just a logical conclusion of what happens if a war between them and NATO starts. Samson is more about nuking everybody because nobody helped.

"This I don't see many people here brought up and I had the same thought, full agreement here."
Thanks. Glad we agree at least on one thing.

Mar 7, 2023 9:47 PM

#100