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Oct 8, 2024 6:18 PM
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Aug 2015
52
glad women are finally included
Feb 5, 8:25 PM
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Oct 2023
24
Absolute dog shit reveal at the end. What a horrible way to ruin such a good story, but sadly this is now ALMOST Vampire Knight level bad.
Mar 14, 1:37 PM

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Jul 2011
4463
That implication of Kiku possibly being the father made me feel disgusted. But also, I'm highly skeptical. It's a weird thing to reveal for sure, but having spend 2 seasons on Kiku and understanding his character, I really don't see him as someone who would touch a child he was raising, being so old-school and strict with proper etiquette among other things. He rarely even has interest in women aside from his life-long obsession with Miyokichi. Also Konatsu doesn't look like either of her parents, so even if Shinnosuke looks like Kiku, does that mean much? Mangetsu also resembles Kiku, so it might be more of a poetic aesthetic as Shinnosuke has a seriousness to him that resembles his grandfather. Kiku spent so much of his life haunted by the guilt of his best friend and ex-lover's death, it makes zero sense for him to have a sexual relationship with Konatsu. He also mentions in episode 10 right before he died about how children keep him busy. I believe he truly sees her from a parental perspective.

My two inital thoughts were 1) it was added to make a more poetic statement and clearly indicate Shinnosuke is carrying on two legacies (tying Kiku & Sukeroku together), and 2) she's messing with him.

Edit: I read the last manga chapter that covered this scene. I honestly don't think Kiko is the father. The anime also cut other an intro to the dialogue where Higuchi mentions they might be half-siblings and joked that Miyokichi might be his mom given his mother never got pregnant/given the times, so I think Konatsu was just returning the sentiment of messing with him when he suggested that her and Kiku had a relationship. After reading this, my interpretation is that she was adding some fuel to the fire and reflecting on when she was younger she obviously had complicated feelings due to believing he killed her parents. Now that she's older, she realizes that what she was feeling was (puppy) love. Nothing indicates he felt that way in return. See spoilers below.



Also there was a side chapter released that someone translated, showing a window of time when Konatsu was in middle school and constantly getting into fights/trouble. She had a crush on the mob boss and Kiku, a natural teenage puppy love towards older men. Kiku knew about her feelings and was troubled by it - discussing it with the mob boss. At the end of the chapter, to deter her feelings, he starts winding her up with stories of murdering her parents so that she'd hate him. So yes Konatsu did have feelings for him at some point, but it was unrequited.

If Shinnosuke is Kiku's child, I imagine it was a one-off with Konatsu, either her forcing herself onto him or him giving in during a moment of weakness (ie he was lonely and saw Miyokichi in her). I certainly can't see them having an ongoing sexual relationship in any capacity. Remember she was also living away from home at the time.

Characters in the story have been proved unreliable narrators before, so I don't think the revelation should be taken at face value. The author might've wanted to give the viewers something to think about too.

I went down a rabbit hole reflecting on this series and that's my final thoughts on this particular point.

---

Anyways I took the time to rewatch this series, as I remember watching it when it aired and S2 was a solid 10/10 for me. The storytelling and passage of time to modern day was beautiful, from an archaic male dominated perspective respecting traditions under the 8th gen Yakumo to bringing it to the 21st century, it was masterfully told. A story transcending generations - I can't think of any series like it and trust me I've watched alot!

My favorite character is still Yotaro, proven further by the point that he has made rakugo accessible for everyone. What an amazing series.
MirorinMar 16, 3:33 AM
Apr 15, 9:39 AM
D. N.

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Aug 2022
61
I will choose to ignore the plot twist that was left to interpretation. That aside, this story was masterfully done. It delved into many sophisticated themes—mortality, loneliness, gender roles and exclusion, unconventional families, trauma, unrequited and forbidden love, loss, aging, identity, artistry, passion, and legacy. It does it in a subtle way with actions, mistakes, and regrets rather than words. There were times I would have preferred to linger longer in some moments to explore certain character dynamics, but I understand, as an anime, there's limited time.

The relationship between Shin and Bon was beautiful. I adored the exploration of the amalgamation of emotions a friendship like theirs would create. It felt human.

I felt deeply connected with Konatsu's character. Her trauma and emotional deprivation from the absence of familiar love felt so real when she broke down at Yotaru's proposal. Yakumo did his best with the limited experience he had with children, but I can only imagine the loneliness Konatsu must have felt. Her chaotic journey was an accurate representation of how someone would behave without guidance or mentors. It was also sad, but by the end, inspiring. The idea of giving up on your dreams because of gender norms and exclusion hits close to home. While progress has been made in addressing this issue, the stigma remains in certain areas and professions. To see her become the first female rakugo performer felt earned, and it couldn’t have been accomplished without her family’s support.

Anyways, there’s so much more to say, but this feels like enough. What a beautiful ending, filled with evocative emotions. This anime is now one of my favorites. I love it so much.

๐“˜ ๐“ญ๐“ป๐“ฎ๐“ช๐“ถ ๐“ธ๐“ฏ ๐“ฏ๐“ช๐“ต๐“ต๐“ฒ๐“ท๐“ฐ ๐“ฒ๐“ท ๐“ต๐“ธ๐“ฟ๐“ฎ ๐”€๐“ฒ๐“ฝ๐“ฑ ๐“ฏ๐“ต๐“ช๐”€๐“ฎ๐“ญ ๐“ฌ๐“ฑ๐“ช๐“ป๐“ช๐“ฌ๐“ฝ๐“ฎ๐“ป๐“ผ ๐“ช๐“ท๐“ญ ๐“พ๐“ท๐“ฒ๐“ฟ๐“ฎ๐“ป๐“ผ๐“ฎ๐“ผ.
Apr 23, 11:39 AM

Offline
Jul 2016
9296
Usagi Drop-like plot twist outta nowhere ๐Ÿคฎ
Dude, what's the problem with these Josei authors? Like... Kikuhiko had 1000+ issues when it came to sleep with Miyokichi but apparently he had no trouble banging and impregnating the daughter of his deceased and beloved friend. Not to mention it's crazy how Konatsu might be even more morally corrupt than her mother. Bruh... seriously, what a way to severely damage both Kikuhiko and Konatsu's characters.

So... who's gonna pay the therapy for Shinnosuke when he eventually finds out that his mother accidentally murdered his grandparents and that she also got his other "grandfather" (30+ years older than her, mind you) to impregnate her of him solely to keep the Sukeroku bloodline alive? Sessions are gonna be expensive for sure.

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And freaking Yotarou got cucked by his Master lmao. Now I wonder if Konatsu marrying him was just to bother Kikuhiko.
Nah, man... what a disaster lol. Still a 6/10 for this season tho. Only because Kikuhiko's character writing is fascinating af.
Aug 25, 11:05 PM
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Jul 2024
6
this episode ruined the entire show for me, the eighth generation a groomer confirmed and with his best friends kid bruhhh crazy work
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