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| The last song was good, I danced with them lmao. |
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Delta's execution of the Mecha/Music/Muse formula was tweaked to milk the idol craze and panders so hard to the idol otakus that I think it hurts Delta. Latest Macross Franchise title focuses on the current musical trends in Japan and incorporates them into narrative. News at Eleven! |
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DJAzureSky said: Akiotio said: News at Twelve! Pointing that out doesn't change the fact that the degree to which this pandering strategy was implemented in Delta (at least according to what was shown in this preview) inherently limits Delta's appeal to a much narrower degree. I felt that some of the other Macross titles at least tried to walk a line that was a little broader. With that said, this is just one episode where they chose to showcase the whole musical combat schtick. With the entirety of Delta yet to be seen, there's plenty of opportunities for them to show if this new formula can work out. How is it pandering when it literally is just reflecting the trends? JP Idols were on the rise when Frontier was premiering, JP Idol groups are at their height right now, there's no pandering, it's just trends. If it's a change that follows trends which one personally is not amenable to, then its pandering. That's how it works. |
DJAzureSky said: fst said: If it's a change that follows trends which one personally is not amenable to, then its pandering. That's how it works. So you're saying it's pandering depending on who it's viewed by? I guess that makes sense, but I just see it not as pandering because it's just Macross being Macross as usual. I'm just saying that around here, when somebody calls something pandering, that's what they actually mean. |
| Also anyone could tell that there is amost no difference between Mazinger Z (1972) and Gundam (1979) They were just in trend with the year they were produced... I can easily name common elements that the 2 shows had, to the point that they could be part of the same franchise ;) - Both 18m tall robot - Both pilots are 16 yo - Both cockpit is inside an escape plane that can be detached - Both are supported by 2 other robots much weaker - Both cant fly for the first part of the show, until a support unit that can combine with them is introduced - Both are destroyed in the last episode - Both are replaced by a stronger version in the following series... We could continue for very very long... But i will not say that someone is blind or worse, cause he cant see that mazinger and Gundam are the same |
Akiotio said: I think an important aspect that everyone seems to be ignoring is execution. Yes, Mazinger Z and Gundam follow the same formula, but how they execute that formula is what makes the difference. I agree I was just trying to make an example of two series completely diffetent from each other even if some elements are the same As for delta im not even sure to give it a chance, for the reason that i disagree with trends I disagree into changing that much a franchise and selling it with the same name cause is better for marketing |
ZeroGApr 8, 2016 9:53 AM
DJAzureSky said: It makes me a little sad, considering that the dogfight between the Knights of the Wind and Delta Squad was super hype and yet everyone only remembers Walkure, even though they only had about 6 minutes to themselves shared alongside Delta Squad. That fight is also a change of the trend, compared to the first macross How many draken vf did charged? 6 of them? Against a fleet of how many cruiser and aircraft carriers? Military ships that were already on red alert cause of the zeltran rampage Not one of them was shot down, if this will ever happen, it will by the hand of a named character, not an anonymous enemy Sure, is not that different from macross 7 when basara alone can charge a meltran fleet But completely different from the fist mecha show were the main character had a mecha of the same power of the others, and was taken down 3 times, with that mecha destroyed |
DJAzureSky said: For someone that claims they watched the original Macross, they totally forgot that Max, Milia, and Hikaru never got shot down in the final assault in DYRL. YOu hold SDF to such a high standard that you only look back on it in a positive light forgetting details Im starting to belive you never watched macross In the tv shows: Hikaru Shot down in the first episode, his vf got emergengy repairs but was destroyed in the second ep, he was saved by roy Later he got a different vf that was destroyed by britai in a brawl, he ejected Later he got a different vf and was shot down by friendly fire, he ejected and got hospitalized We can add 2 main characters killed in action also by unnamed soldiers that you dont even see while they shoot Macross was the FIRST show when a hero mecha was just common equipment The FIRST show when a main character can be killed by accidental explosions or unnamed fire from a random enemy fighter The RX78 gundam compared was the top of the line, best mecha in federation, immune to common fire (zaku bazooka cant scratch it from close range), destroyed only in the end after a duel with another main character This macross style is actually something that i appreciated In macross when i saw a fight for first time, i was scared that main characters could die anytime Here in delta im fine, i know that main characters will die, but only by the hands of other main characters after a good duel They can charge alone one fleet or 2 of unnamed grunts, no problems |
PointyThingy said: is ok, you are not the only one :)God, this show is so embarrassing to watch... PS: Am I the only one here who find that heart-shaped growth on Freyja's head fucking disturbing??? PS: i wonder if Freyja hairs after some experience, will go into a pink hearted super sayan mode while she sings Other idols are already able to win against battlepods, but a mile long battleship is still too strong for them... |
DJAzureSky said: Ranka was on the flight deck of the Quarter in Sayonara no Tsubasa tho... Then don't forget that Sheryl and Ranka had a Macross Cannon aimed at them in that same movie completely unprotected if it weren't for the Vajra. Like evey other civilian that lived in frontier, and if not for the Vajira, would have been killed by galaxy's macross cannon I belive that singing from a stage or the backseat of a plane is different from singing on the back of a plane during a fight If you dont belive me, try to sing on the roof of a car while it moves at fast speed Just ask someone else to report the results on this forum, cause i fear you will be unable to do it |
ZeroGApr 8, 2016 12:52 PM
DJAzureSky said: I guess, that's why I brought up Houkago Overflow from Sayonara no Tsubasa, she was on the frontlines to amplify her song to fight Galaxy's implants. And she was not coordinating with other 4 idols to Sing the same song with the others not missing a word Jump on the same time on the radar disk of a gerwalk Dance in perfect coordination with the others on that disk while it moves All of this during a battle... You really belive is no different from what ranka or min may did? |
DJAzureSky said: Many things from past macross series were ridicolousZeroG said: You really belive is no different from what ranka or min may did? Yeah. It's just done to a more ridiculous degree. Basara was ridicolous Ranka dressed as a carrot was ridicolus, and also cute Is ridicolous to see 6 draken VF that alone kill an entire fleet without a scratch, and can be stopped only by special unit (main characters with a name and superior VF) But singing from a stage is no more ridicolous than a concert in the real world, sorry Anyway why you got so upset in the past days, if you too agree that the walkure dance is ridicolus then we agreed from the start :) |
| As a fan of The original macross series that im note sure IF i like or hate Macross delta. Macross frontier was an okey anime but as macross anime it sucked big time. Kinda anoys me that both frontier and Delta has music more as main focus instead of being a space saga like the old macross was. Sure old macross had music but it was not the focus in the series. Wacthing first ep of Delta felt like watching an episode of that crappy Akb48 anime. Sure Delta seams like a nice anime but it is not macross it is more an idol anime than a space saga. But hey that how it is done today slap a famus name on something that don't belong there to get the hock on old fans to make more money. Like the resident evil movies that all they have in common it the games are names of characters and umbrella Corp just to sell shitty movies. All in all macross Delta is not bad but it is not macross not the one I loved and grew up with in the late 80s early 90s. |
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SwordBreaker28 said: Sadly that's whats happening with many other franchisings, like star warsBut hey that how it is done today slap a famus name on something that don't belong there to get the hock on old fans to make more money. Like the resident evil movies that all they have in common it the games are names of characters and umbrella Corp just to sell shitty movies. All in all macross Delta is not bad but it is not macross not the one I loved and grew up with in the late 80s early 90s. The storyboard is made to sell, to show what people is supposed to like, before thinking about what should realistically happen in the story they originally wrote. Realism is boring, who cares if that idol is doing nosense, have you see her legs? Her dress? The song is very good and her voice is even better. If this formula is a commercial success, the show will go on If not, they will continue or reboot the franchise with another approach I grew up in the 80, i watched many shows and liked many reboot, remake, sequels... Yamato 2199 was awesome Macross... well, think positive... That just means that original show is still the best ^_^ |
ZeroG said: SwordBreaker28 said: Sadly that's whats happening with many other franchisings, like star warsBut hey that how it is done today slap a famus name on something that don't belong there to get the hock on old fans to make more money. Like the resident evil movies that all they have in common it the games are names of characters and umbrella Corp just to sell shitty movies. All in all macross Delta is not bad but it is not macross not the one I loved and grew up with in the late 80s early 90s. The storyboard is made to sell, to show what people is supposed to like, before thinking about what should realistically happen in the story they originally wrote. Realism is boring, who cares if that idol is doing nosense, have you see her legs? Her dress? The song is very good and her voice is even better. If this formula is a commercial success, the show will go on If not, they will continue or reboot the franchise with another approach I grew up in the 80, i watched many shows and liked many reboot, remake, sequels... Yamato 2199 was awesome Macross... well, think positive... That just means that original show is still the best ^_^ Well it shows that back in the day the knew how to make a good space saga/opera like old macross or yamato or my nr2 favorite legend of the galactic heries. Ha I bet if they rebooted that anime it would be less space opera and more songs boobs and allot of nude scene with instead of a political plot and war. Give me back good space operas |
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DJAzureSky said: It's been big on music forever. Too bad that in the original macross min may started to sing pretty late in the show Also her songs were so weak, i remember her trying to escape from a zeltran with a song, the zeltran laughing at her, and kissing the meltran next to him, to show humans what real "culture" was If she had walkure power those zeltran would have been slaughtered |
SwordBreaker28 said: Well it shows that back in the day the knew how to make a good space saga/opera like old macross or yamato or my nr2 favorite legend of the galactic heries. Ha I bet if they rebooted that anime it would be less space opera and more songs boobs and allot of nude scene with instead of a political plot and war. Give me back good space operas Yeah, i wish that as well :) There is a space opera series called titania, that somehow have elements in common with logh, but it stops after one season and you get to see few battles and more individual stories Also one of my favourite space opera was banner of the stars... Problem with series is more or less always the same, and thats called sponsor Who put money on a series dont care of our feelings, but just the money they put into it The first gundam had to transform and use a rocket hammer cause of that Today anime are a big business, on the same level of Hollywood movies, they require alot of money for cg, and must promote toys, gadgets, cd.... Thats business :/ |
DJAzureSky said: SwordBreaker28 said: As a fan of The original macross series that im note sure IF i like or hate Macross delta. Macross frontier was an okey anime but as macross anime it sucked big time. Kinda anoys me that both frontier and Delta has music more as main focus instead of being a space saga like the old macross was. Sure old macross had music but it was not the focus in the series. Wacthing first ep of Delta felt like watching an episode of that crappy Akb48 anime. Sure Delta seams like a nice anime but it is not macross it is more an idol anime than a space saga. But hey that how it is done today slap a famus name on something that don't belong there to get the hock on old fans to make more money. Like the resident evil movies that all they have in common it the games are names of characters and umbrella Corp just to sell shitty movies. All in all macross Delta is not bad but it is not macross not the one I loved and grew up with in the late 80s early 90s. It's been big on music forever. This isn't Aquarion Logos compared to Sousei no Aquarion (where next to none of the themes of Aquarion were present) This is like Aquarion EVOL compared to Sousei (where the series takes everything that made the original good, and intensifies it to a ridiculous degree) That's why I say it's still pure Macross. Not really old macross did not have 2 songs every episode and not 4 bloody idols and also macross was about much more than music witch now seams to be the main fcous Delta is a anime about pop idols not a space saga. |
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ZeroG said: SwordBreaker28 said: Well it shows that back in the day the knew how to make a good space saga/opera like old macross or yamato or my nr2 favorite legend of the galactic heries. Ha I bet if they rebooted that anime it would be less space opera and more songs boobs and allot of nude scene with instead of a political plot and war. Give me back good space operas Yeah, i wish that as well :) There is a space opera series called titania, that somehow have elements in common with logh, but it stops after one season and you get to see few battles and more individual stories Also one of my favourite space opera was banner of the stars... Problem with series is more or less always the same, and thats called sponsor Who put money on a series dont care of our feelings, but just the money they put into it The first gundam had to transform and use a rocket hammer cause of that Today anime are a big business, on the same level of Hollywood movies, they require alot of money for cg, and must promote toys, gadgets, cd.... Thats business :/ Yeah titania was good and man the banner of stars was great also outlaw stars. But yeah as you say today's is all about the cash witch makes me kinda get sick of anime sadly I may find some shows that entertain me but they don't hock me like they did back in the day. I would pay to see a macross anime with more focus on war and space exploration with a few songs to make the combat more epic. I will watch Delta becuse it seams to be an okey anime but I will still say it is not a macross wordy anime. |
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SwordBreaker28 said: I would pay to see a macross anime with more focus on war and space exploration with a few songs to make the combat more epic. I will watch Delta becuse it seams to be an okey anime but I will still say it is not a macross wordy anime. I watched again the trailer of the last year, there was no idol fighting, and looked so cool Honestly, i would burn basara (very slowly) but loved macross 7 drawing style I do really like the design of some character from macross delta I do really like the mecha design of macross delta And right now i have still hope for delta, even if is very tiny: there is an anime that from the first episode could seem a school comedy, but in realty the world is next to total destruction and what we see is the delusional dream of a girl maybe this macross delta first episode was something similar maybe was the delusional dream of freyia point of view over the battle: idols that happily dance while hundreds are dead or agonizing in a crumbled city maybe was just a concert, and the second episode starts with a "surprise" and the concert ends... im being delusional i guess :( but this delta had so much potential, so much... the more you hope, the more you are disappointed when your hopes are not met |
DJAzureSky said: that's my line, to you, when you insists that there is almost no difference between macross tv / dyrl and deltaSDF ISN'T COMING BACK. GET YOUR MIND BACK TO REALITY. GET YOUR MIND BACK TO REALITY is totally different, and totally out of place with first macross (but not with seven of course) |
DJAzureSky said: it's not out of line, it's a natural evolution i've bought countless examples of how its not that natural as an evolution of first macross and many fans, both old and new, by comparing the shows agreed that is not in line with original franchise i guess no matter what the evidence you wont change your mind just a note: sdf not coming back? WRONG for a very simple reason: marketing like happens in gundam, with countless variations to the franchise, more or less in line to the original gundam idea, the same goes to macross macross plus that was supposed to be the prequel of seven, was totally different and much more in line with the first macross seven trash, that's drawn by the character design of the first macross, haruiko mikimoto, was pretty nice and very well drawn just wait for the next macross, and the one after that i have patience, and a lot of good anime i still have to watch while i wait ;) |
Akiotio said: Its all thanks to macross seven and basara!I'm resigned to the fact that, unless they RETCON hard in the next Macross series, this is part of the Macross canon now. Basara must die (slowly) :P :P :P |
ZeroG said: SwordBreaker28 said: I would pay to see a macross anime with more focus on war and space exploration with a few songs to make the combat more epic. I will watch Delta becuse it seams to be an okey anime but I will still say it is not a macross wordy anime. I watched again the trailer of the last year, there was no idol fighting, and looked so cool Honestly, i would burn basara (very slowly) but loved macross 7 drawing style I do really like the design of some character from macross delta I do really like the mecha design of macross delta And right now i have still hope for delta, even if is very tiny: there is an anime that from the first episode could seem a school comedy, but in realty the world is next to total destruction and what we see is the delusional dream of a girl maybe this macross delta first episode was something similar maybe was the delusional dream of freyia point of view over the battle: idols that happily dance while hundreds are dead or agonizing in a crumbled city maybe was just a concert, and the second episode starts with a "surprise" and the concert ends... im being delusional i guess :( but this delta had so much potential, so much... the more you hope, the more you are disappointed when your hopes are not met ZeroG said: SwordBreaker28 said: I would pay to see a macross anime with more focus on war and space exploration with a few songs to make the combat more epic. I will watch Delta becuse it seams to be an okey anime but I will still say it is not a macross wordy anime. I watched again the trailer of the last year, there was no idol fighting, and looked so cool Honestly, i would burn basara (very slowly) but loved macross 7 drawing style I do really like the design of some character from macross delta I do really like the mecha design of macross delta And right now i have still hope for delta, even if is very tiny: there is an anime that from the first episode could seem a school comedy, but in realty the world is next to total destruction and what we see is the delusional dream of a girl maybe this macross delta first episode was something similar maybe was the delusional dream of freyia point of view over the battle: idols that happily dance while hundreds are dead or agonizing in a crumbled city maybe was just a concert, and the second episode starts with a "surprise" and the concert ends... im being delusional i guess :( but this delta had so much potential, so much... the more you hope, the more you are disappointed when your hopes are not met I totally know what you mean my hopes was sadly a great space saga but first episode was not :( .Anyway I will give Delta a chans because it is not bad and I like the music but I will watch it with my mind set that it will be an idol anime and not macross. To be honest I would love a anime about admiral hunter and SDF3 rather than singing girls well at least there is no Sheryl and ranka man I wish both where killed in the second season they where so annoying just like Minmay Im glad hunter picked lisa Hayase. |
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| While it has the basic elements of a Macross series (valkyries, singing and a love triangle), they have horribly subverted the singing aspect of the show. Minmay in SDFM was a pacifist as was Basara (the only time Basara shot in anger he hated himself for it). By making the idols a military unit in itself, they have embraced things which they were once critical of in Macross (Jamming Birds in Macross 7 anyone?). The original Macross was also critical of the "building up" of an idol, and they showed both the good, but also the bad and the ugly of the idol business.. Here it seems they will wholeheartedly embrace it. But I suppose that's what sells today. Give the otaku their pure virginal idols doing cutesy things and everything is secondary. |
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