rederoin said: Kaioshin_Sama said: Kyoukai no Kanata is in the top 100 with all 7 volumes. Told you people lol. Kyoani fanbase to the rescue yet again. What are you talking about? Volume 1 is ranked at 250#~ Top 100 for anime and climbing I mean. It's never been anywhere close to this, the idol singing episode it popular me thinks as expected. symbv said: Kaioshin_Sama said: Where is top 100? It only went to 250 or so.Kyoukai no Kanata is in the top 100. Told you people lol. Kyoani fanbase to the rescue yet again. 【2013年 11月 08日 22時(金)】 ***,495位 【2013年 11月 08日 23時(金)】 ***,541位 【2013年 11月 09日 00時(土)】 ***,485位 【2013年 11月 09日 01時(土)】 ***,256位 【2013年 11月 09日 02時(土)】 ***,254位 No KyoAni fanbase here no. As I said, if the "pandering" episode is considered done well, the new episode boost will kick in, and for this episode, it is generally considered done very well, so if it is having a boost stronger than previous episodes it is not something too surprising. But does it mean it will stay to become a "turn-around"? I am not sure. rederoin said: I guess perhaps he was using the BD->Anime ranking but that is showing a more limited picture of the reality compared to the all-genre DVD/BD ranking Stalker uses. Kaioshin_Sama said: Kyoukai no Kanata is in the top 100 with all 7 volumes. Told you people lol. Kyoani fanbase to the rescue yet again. What are you talking about? Volume 1 is ranked at 250#~ You really underestimate this fanbase. Of course it's going to stay, it already has for like 4 days now. It's not going anywhere but up based on the trend. Whether it does indeed become the seasons best seller remains to be seen but it definitely worked and if the next episode pushes the right buttons again....(and looking at it it has the cast in school swimsuits so it looks like they'll be following up with yet more aimless pandering) well we'll see. Whatever the case people in the west won't stop raving about that episode like it's the greatest thing to come out of the season and I can imagine Japan probably has similar elements that have now been activated and are finally buying. Also that doesn't track to me cause I see lots of episodes that are well done in shows and there's rarely a boost like this. If you say an episode that is considered well done by Kyoani then maybe it makes a little more sense, but I don't think it works that way in general. Kyoani has always been a special exception in that regard. In any case at this rate it's just going to show yet again that shameless pandering and dance sequences even at the expense of basic continuity and tonal consistency is the way to go and opens the path to more imitators and anime that struggle with pacing and tone even more than a lot of late night stuff already does. |
PeacingOutNov 8, 2013 10:42 AM
Kaioshin_Sama said: Whether it does indeed become the seasons best seller remains to be seen lol. To put you into perspective of how ridiculous the post above this one is, Kyoukai no Kanata's stalker prediction has dropped by about 300 since symbv's post at the start of the thread. |
kuuderes_shadowNov 8, 2013 10:50 AM
| There is no such thing as shit taste. Only idiots who think everyone should have the same taste as they do. |
kuuderes_shadow said: Kaioshin_Sama said: Whether it does indeed become the seasons best seller remains to be seen lol. To put you into perspective of how ridiculous the post above this one is, Kyoukai no Kanata's stalker prediction has dropped by about 300 since symbv's post at the start of the thread. Was this before or after the show decided to switch genres for an episode to something more obviously enticing to moe otaku? |
Kaioshin_Sama said: kuuderes_shadow said: Kaioshin_Sama said: Whether it does indeed become the seasons best seller remains to be seen lol. To put you into perspective of how ridiculous the post above this one is, Kyoukai no Kanata's stalker prediction has dropped by about 300 since symbv's post at the start of the thread. Was this before or after the show decided to switch genres for an episode to something more obviously enticing to moe otaku? Between now and 3 days ago. I abandoned KnK myself (too much better stuff this season) so I don't know when this change you claim happened occurred. But that's just about the same period which you claimed above as the time that showed that it was on an inevitable path upwards. |
| There is no such thing as shit taste. Only idiots who think everyone should have the same taste as they do. |
kuuderes_shadow said: Kaioshin_Sama said: kuuderes_shadow said: Kaioshin_Sama said: Whether it does indeed become the seasons best seller remains to be seen lol. To put you into perspective of how ridiculous the post above this one is, Kyoukai no Kanata's stalker prediction has dropped by about 300 since symbv's post at the start of the thread. Was this before or after the show decided to switch genres for an episode to something more obviously enticing to moe otaku? Between now and 3 days ago. I abandoned KnK myself (too much better stuff this season) so I don't know when this change you claim happened occurred. But that's just about the same period which you claimed above as the time that showed that it was on an inevitable path upwards. You're probably thinking about it too logically then. This studio has defied expectations, trends and IMO basic logic more than I can count with it's output and it's inevitable popularity. Shows people normally would never like they claim to love and even adore when they are involved and they just typically have a much easier time with criticism and people accepting pretty obvious faults in storytelling and consistency etc because they're shows are considered (and it's arguable) to have the best animation in the industry. It doesn't matter that there's better stuff this season in terms of story content, this is Kyoani with the most loyal of the loyal fanbases who will and have responded to an episode like this. I predict this, if it doesn't gain much from here the next episode will put it amidst the top sellers in IS, Little Busters, Non Non Biyori etc if it is indeed a swimsuit fanservice episode. I mean think about it, when you look at the best sellers what do you see right now? Moe, SoL and fanservice shows are yet again dominating the charts. With Kyoani's budget and the apparent switch to this angle for Kyoukai no Kanata I see absolutely no reason why they can't get a slice of that pie with 2 months to go until the first BD is out. Demon_Acker said: KnK might average 2.5k if it's lucky. Hardly "best of the season" material. And what will you say if in 2 months it proves to have surpassed this mark and then some? |
Kaioshin_Sama said: I think it has always been you who are overestimating the legendary (or should I say elusive or mythical) loyal KyoAni fanbase. Looking at the Stalker graph the length of upward move is not that different from previous episodes, and as I said the last episode was deemed to be particularly good as entertainment, so if it means the title rises higher or the boost lasts longer it is only natural and does not need any existence of blindly loyal fanbase to accomplish that. You really underestimate this fanbase. Of course it's going to stay, it already has for like 4 days now. It's not going anywhere but up based on the trend. Kaioshin_Sama said: Not sure about the next episode pushing the right buttons because the person who handles series composition, Hanada Jukki, wrote on his twitter that this is indeed a "breather" episode that is nothing but "stupid fun". A lot of watchers indeed comment that given this episode is done so well (in terms of entertainment), the whole series should be like this, but most likely it will not turn out like this given what Hanada said. Whether it does indeed become the seasons best seller remains to be seen but it definitely worked and if the next episode pushes the right buttons again....(and looking at it it has the cast in school swimsuits so it looks like they'll be following up with yet more aimless pandering) well we'll see. As for "bestseller" I really don't see how you could think it has any realistic chance of making it, even in a weak cour like the current one. To be honest, 2.7k estimated sales is really too low for a show that is not done worse than Tamako, so I would at least think that sales of 3-4k should be achievable for KnK. The recent boost could help it reach that, but bestseller of the season? Fat chance I'd say. Kaioshin_Sama said: Well, for "well done" I mean in terms of feedback from watchers, most of them are likely not to be studio fanboys. And if an episode is widely considered to be well done, the boost would be particularly strong. This is what happened to the "pandering" sexy dance episode of Gargantia for example. So it is not really something that is limited only to KyoAni, and if KyoAni managed to make a boost stronger than usual I would say it has more to do with KyoAni knowing how to press the right buttons than there are some super loyal fanboys who would react quickly and enthusiastically to rescue a KyoAni show. Also that doesn't track to me cause I see lots of episodes that are well done in shows and there's rarely a boost like this. If you say an episode that is considered well done by Kyoani then maybe it makes a little more sense, but I don't think it works that way in general. Kyoani has always been a special exception in that regard. Kaioshin_Sama said: Indeed in Japan there are also comments that pacing and consistency was sacrificed, but as I said many were also expecting "breather" episode anyway so it is not something that bothers them too much as it is within their expectation. And if anything, it is not as if KyoAni is establishing any precedent here, instead it is more like KyoAni is also imitating the overall trend in the industry these days to have "pander breather" episode in the series. The key thing to consider is thus how well the "pandering breather" is executed, and on this regard the last episode of KnK was considered to be done very well.In any case at this rate it's just going to show yet again that shameless pandering and dance sequences even at the expense of basic continuity and tonal consistency is the way to go and opens the path to more imitators and anime that struggle with pacing and tone even more than a lot of late night stuff already does. |
symbvNov 8, 2013 11:43 AM
| So MAL finally starts locking news threads that are only a few weeks old? I wonder where was the announcement of this change? Or we are seeing yet another case of changes made that impacted users but not communicated to them? I wonder how long people would put up with this. As much as I have a bunch of information to share about anime announced recently I cannot share it in news board, and the anime series is too disorganized and chaotic to share information except with people already interested in the particular series. |
symbv said: Indeed in Japan there are also comments that pacing and consistency was sacrificed, but as I said many were also expecting "breather" episode anyway so it is not something that bothers them too much as it is within their expectation. And if anything, it is not as if KyoAni is establishing any precedent here, instead it is more like KyoAni is also imitating the overall trend in the industry these days to have "pander breather" episode in the series. The key thing to consider is thus how well the "pandering breather" is executed, and on this regard the last episode of KnK was considered to be done very well. lol of course it was, it's by Kyoto Animation. Whatever needs to happen for them to ultimately find their way to popularity will inevitably fall into place for them. They're like the Heisenberg of the anime industry. You do raise a good point about that episode of Gargantia, but then again that was I.G, not Kyoto Animation. In the west there's something of a meme known as "Kyoani Finds A Way" referring to how no matter how bleak the outlook is, no matter how polarized peoples opinions are on their latest show it's guaranteed top selling status at some point. There will just always be a turnaround. I used to scoff at it, but now based on everything I've seen frankly I've already started to believe it's absolutely true. Like I said though whether I continue to believe as such hinges heavily on this shows performance because as you say it would take an unprecedented turnaround to make it happen in this case those it's a good time to put the theory to the test. Right now I'm sort of playing devils advocate, but honestly a small part of me sees it as inevitable at the same time just cause this is how it always goes. We'll see how well our logical side and what should happen based on estimates matches up against the reality THAT transpires and I think one way or another it'll be enlightening. |
PeacingOutNov 8, 2013 11:14 AM
Kaioshin_Sama said: Didn't you say something similar when Tamako was aired? Surely Moe, SoL and fanservice shows also dominated then? I predict this, if it doesn't gain much from here the next episode will put it amidst the top sellers in IS, Little Busters, Non Non Biyori etc if it is indeed a swimsuit fanservice episode. I mean think about it, when you look at the best sellers what do you see right now? Moe, SoL and fanservice shows are yet again dominating the charts. With Kyoani's budget and the apparent switch to this angle for Kyoukai no Kanata I see absolutely no reason why they can't get a slice of that pie with 2 months to go until the first BD is out. Kaioshin_Sama said: As I said, I think it is plausible that this show could get to Tamako level and 3-4k is already "surpassed this mark (2.5k) and then some" but still it would not make "bestseller of the cour" tier. Far from it.And what will you say if in 2 months it proves to have surpassed this mark and then some? |
symbvNov 8, 2013 11:15 AM
| So MAL finally starts locking news threads that are only a few weeks old? I wonder where was the announcement of this change? Or we are seeing yet another case of changes made that impacted users but not communicated to them? I wonder how long people would put up with this. As much as I have a bunch of information to share about anime announced recently I cannot share it in news board, and the anime series is too disorganized and chaotic to share information except with people already interested in the particular series. |
Demon_Acker said: [ Then again, this season is so weak that averaging 5-6k would make it a "top seller", lol. To be fair, summer had a bunch of shows that where underestimated by around 100%(going by the data from August). But yes, so far its looking to be rather weak, it might even be close to winter. Spring and Summer will be the strongest 2 seasons of this year. |
Demon_Acker said: Then I'll admit that I was wrong, simple as that. There's nothing that shows that it's going to sell very well, though. Even when it goes up, it drops back to the 700-1000 mark on Amazon after a few days. Then again, this season is so weak that averaging 5-6k would make it a "top seller", lol. This is true, but it hasn't happened that way this time. If anything it's continuing to go up. From the 700-1000's to the 400-500's to now all 7 volumes being in the 200's. How do you explain that better than symbv did? |
| It's a shame about this seasons performance on Amazon because IMO there's a lot of great stuff that deserves a lot better than this....just I guess nothing that Japan is interested in as usual. Figures..... |
Kaioshin_Sama said: This just goes to prove what I said time and again before: That KyoAni deserves success because it knows how to get people to buy its stuff, and it is not because it manages to train up some captive loyal fanboys to buy its stuff no matter what, but because it always plans and executes its work in such a way that appeals people enough for them to open their wallet. lol of course it was, it's by Kyoto Animation. Whatever needs to happen for them to ultimately find their way to popularity will inevitably fall into place for them. They're like the Heisenberg of the anime industry. Kaioshin_Sama said: So it just proves that studio other than KyoAni could achieve a strong boost with a "pandering" episode. You do raise a good point about that episode of Gargantia, but then again that was I.G, not Kyoto Animation. Kaioshin_Sama said: Actually I agree that KyoAni finds a way, but not the way you described. As I said above, KyoAni being so successful in many shows they made is because they know how to get a considerable number of anime fans to open their wallet, but it is not like it is "guaranteed" or "turnaround" happens so easily and commonly. The facts and history do not validate a "turnaround no matter" view. It is more like they did their homework well enough to know what the fans want from them and provide it. Sure, KyoAni can be polarizing, but as long as the end result is creation of disc buying consumers, the number of detractors and haters does not really matter.In the west there's something of a meme known as "Kyoani Finds A Way" referring to how no matter how bleak the outlook is, no matter how polarized peoples opinions are on their latest show it's guaranteed top selling status at some point. There will just always be a turnaround. I used to scoff at it, but now based on everything I've seen frankly I've already started to believe it's absolutely true. |
| So MAL finally starts locking news threads that are only a few weeks old? I wonder where was the announcement of this change? Or we are seeing yet another case of changes made that impacted users but not communicated to them? I wonder how long people would put up with this. As much as I have a bunch of information to share about anime announced recently I cannot share it in news board, and the anime series is too disorganized and chaotic to share information except with people already interested in the particular series. |
symbv said: This just goes to prove what I said time and again before: That KyoAni deserves success because it knows how to get people to buy its stuff, and it is not because it manages to train up some captive loyal fanboys to buy its stuff no matter what, but because it always plans and executes its work in such a way that appeals people enough for them to open their wallet. I don't accept this sorry. A studio that just flails around and panders with basic otaku humor albeit well animated and without any regard for basic continuity and storytelling does not deserve such success. If that's the case then this industry is a bigger joke than I ever though possible and I've been giving it and the current fanbase even more credit than I feel I'm already conceding, which right now feels like an awful lot. How did I know you'd come out with an excuse like this though? It's just such a typical typical defense of Kyoani, "they just deserve it" etc. It's like the equivalent of a serpent eating it's own tail in terms of an argument in their favor. Kaioshin_Sama said: So it just proves that studio other than KyoAni could achieve a strong boost with a "pandering" episode. Yeah well unlike that show I bet this show stays this way. And then of course people can tell me it's just because they earned it and are just that much better than others. That fanbases ability to affirm itself is astonishing, but then hey if they want to champion their celebration of mediocre garbage that can't stay remotely consistent from episode to episode I think they ultimately lose the battle of integrity and basic taste. Actually I agree that KyoAni finds a way, but not the way you described. As I said above, KyoAni being so successful in many shows they made is because they know how to get a considerable number of anime fans to open their wallet, but it is not like it is "guaranteed" or "turnaround" happens so easily and commonly. The facts and history do not validate a "turnaround no matter" view. It is more like they did their homework well enough to know what the fans want from them and provide it. Sure, KyoAni can be polarizing, but as long as the end result is creation of disc buying consumers, the number of detractors and haters does not really matter. Again typical Kyoani defense. What others think doesn't matter as long as it sells in the end. It doesn't matter if basic storytelling consistency is sacrificed as long as it sells at the end of the day. Such a complete joke. That's what I truly despise about this company, that because they are always successful their terrible sense of how to tell a story and develop characters consistently is ultimately championed and people like me are just labelled as haters and detractors in the end who are wrong by default. It's such a sickening place this fandom is in right now that they can't recognize just how wrong this is. And what's so hard exactly about figuring out that pandering with idols, characters in showers and man muscle is going to get people to take notice exactly. I assume this is Kyoani's latest stroke of "genius". To me it's more a matter of will, not market saavy. Not every creative team is so willing to sacrifice all integrity of a story just to boost sales like they are. If anything what it tells me is that this studio truly has no shame whatsoever, that's their secret weapon. It's like Satsuki from Kill La Kill, how do you go against a studio that will stop at nothing be it butchering their own story if it means a chance at getting ahead and furthering it's ambitions of making money? What's sad is when this does become a bestseller instead of coming around to my side of the argument and acknowledging that I had a point after all people are probably going to make excuses like all of this as to why it was earned through genius market savvy or whatever and thus claim that my points are invalid and I'm just being a hater. Of this I have very little doubt. |
PeacingOutNov 8, 2013 11:51 AM
| http://i.imgur.com/Yx5XGkL.jpg http://i.imgur.com/vAWV6rf.jpg hahaha |
[center] |
Yep that's the meme I was talking about. It's true, but for all the wrong reasons that are IMO a very bad thing for the anime industry. Pandering will find you a way and this joke of a fanbase will just go ahead and be okay with it like it's all well and good as long as this joke of a studio keeps on being popular in spite of itself. This fanbase has no integrity to me right now, absolutely none. I think I need a breather at this rate so stepping out of this thread. Maybe in the meantime someone with an actual clue will say something that doesn't make me cringe. |
PeacingOutNov 8, 2013 12:01 PM
Kaioshin_Sama said: For deserve I mean as a business. If a business provides what the consumers want, why shouldn't they deserve success? And we know just by good animation it does not mean a show will then sell, and you already know there are failed shows done by KyoAni. Yet it still manages to make shows that sell better than average and if this is achieved by winning the competition, why should not its success be deserving? I don't accept this sorry. A studio that just flails around and panders with basic otaku humor albeit well animated and without any regard for basic continuity and storytelling does not deserve such success. Kaioshin_Sama said: Perhaps it is time for you to consider it really a bigger joke then. The current fanbase clearly shows a lot of taste and preference that is different from yours and what they love seem often to be what you dislike much. If you have to put it down to your taste is best and their taste is a joke, then perhaps you should just throw up your arms and call the anime fanbase in Japan a "big joke"/ If that's the case then this industry is a bigger joke than I ever though possible and I've been giving it and the current fanbase even more credit than I feel I'm already conceding, which right now feels like an awful lot. Kaioshin_Sama said: I know the word "deserve success" triggers some nerve in you when it is mentioned along with KyoAni, but it is not just KyoAni I would use that word. If the studio is doing better in the competition then it would deserve its success, and it is not just KyoAni. I can say the same thing for Shaft too for example. How did I know you'd come out with an excuse like this though? It's just such a typical typical defense of Kyoani, "they just deserve it" etc. It's like the equivalent of a serpent eating it's own tail in terms of an argument in their favor. Kaioshin_Sama said: I will remember your bet. But your assumption is that just because of this latest episode it is going to change the fortune of the show, but of course a lot would depend on what comes up in the later half of the series, and if the last half is indeed well received and win wide acclaim, then why shouldn't people say that KyoAni earns the good sales then? As I said repeatedly before, your view, taste and judgement (that it is a mediocre garbage) counts for little in how the buying consumers judge the show and thus how deserving KyoAni is for the success it achieves if the show sells well. Yeah well unlike that show I bet this show stays this way. And then of course people can tell me it's just because they earned it and are just that much better than others. That fanbases ability to affirm itself is astonishing, but then hey if they want to champion their celebration of mediocre garbage that can't stay remotely consistent from episode to episode I think they ultimately lose the battle of integrity and basic taste. Kaioshin_Sama said: But the truth is indeed it does not matter if it sells. But does it mean that a series that is nothing but pandering will automatically sell? No. You may think of fanbase in Japan to be "a joke" since they put money where you do not think deserve but I do not see it as necessarily meaning the fans in Japan care nothing about consistency at all. It is just that they hold a different expectation than you and thus are ready to be entertained even certain loss of consistency is there. Again typical Kyoani defense. What others think doesn't matter as long as it sells in the end. It doesn't matter if basic storytelling consistency is sacrificed as long as it sells at the end of the day. Such a complete joke. That's what I truly despise about this company, that because they are always successful their terrible sense of how to tell a story and develop characters consistently is ultimately championed and people like me are just labelled as haters and detractors in the end who are wrong by default. It's such a sickening place this fandom is in right now that they can't recognize just how wrong this is. Kaioshin_Sama said: Well, if the consumers do not mind some loss in storytelling integrity in the show they watch why a studio which is ready to do this thus has no shame? And we know KyoAni is far from the only studio which is doing it. Almost every studio is in the game. I guess every studio truly has no shame then. The only difference I see is KyoAni does this better than others, and this means market savvy and good execution.To me it's more a matter of will, not market saavy. Not every creative team is so willing to sacrifice all integrity of a story just to boost sales like they are. If anything what it tells me is that this studio truly has no shame whatsoever, that's their secret weapon. It's like Satsuki from Kill La Kill, how do you go against a studio that will stop at nothing be it butchering their own story if it means a chance at getting ahead and furthering it's ambitions of making money? |
symbvNov 8, 2013 12:12 PM
| So MAL finally starts locking news threads that are only a few weeks old? I wonder where was the announcement of this change? Or we are seeing yet another case of changes made that impacted users but not communicated to them? I wonder how long people would put up with this. As much as I have a bunch of information to share about anime announced recently I cannot share it in news board, and the anime series is too disorganized and chaotic to share information except with people already interested in the particular series. |
Kaioshin_Sama said: Yep that's the meme I was talking about. It's true, but for all the wrong reasons that are IMO a very bad thing for the anime industry. Pandering will find you a way and this joke of a fanbase will just go ahead and be okay with it like it's all well and good as long as this joke of a studio keeps on being popular in spite of itself. This fanbase has no integrity to me right now, absolutely none. I think I need a breather at this rate so stepping out of this thread. Maybe in the meantime someone with an actual clue will say something that doesn't make me cringe. Btw "Kyoani finds a way" isn't always related to sales, it's also used to express a personal new found appreciation for a show. But yes, most of the time it refers to sales. |
VioLinkNov 8, 2013 12:14 PM
| [center] |
VioLink said: ^Btw "Kyoani finds a way" isn't always related to sales, it can also be used to express a personal new found appreciation for a show. But yes most of the time it is used it refers to sales. Its just a way of Kyoani fanboys showing their unconditional praise and rock bottoms standards for the studio IMO. In short just another aspect of why I consider it one of the worst subfandoms I've ever encountered. Generally though its used to refer to sales and undermine the opinions of people that take the time to properly vet and critique a show without actually having to put any real thought and effort in. Like idol like worshiper in that regard in a way. IMO no other subculture in the anime fandom besides maybe shaft has this. Of course this is a bit of a rant so rather than take into consideration what I'm saying people are totally just going to claim I'm being butt hurt and should be ignored or whatever, but it truly is an upsetting trend for someone who feels anime could aspire to so much more than Kyokai no Kanata episode 6, infinite stratos and the like. And anyway it just goes to show yet again that if thats a case of newfound fandom that this fanbase puts having their basic instincts pandered to over a good story with interesting characters. I mean who cares about their personalities and what they think about one another beyond she has glasses, he has an imouto fetish and he's a youmu. Who cares if the cast has actually been shown to have a meaningful reason to be together, they're dancing. In short nowadays the most desirable kind of show according to the anime fandom is one that looks nice and has dancing and that's it. This whole anime thing has come down to nothing more than this. And people wonder why the industry in the west died out completely around the time the likes of kyoanis output became the ideal to which both japan and large chunks of the Western fandom feel anime should aspire in 2009. |
VioLink said: Kaioshin_Sama said: Yep that's the meme I was talking about. It's true, but for all the wrong reasons that are IMO a very bad thing for the anime industry. Pandering will find you a way and this joke of a fanbase will just go ahead and be okay with it like it's all well and good as long as this joke of a studio keeps on being popular in spite of itself. This fanbase has no integrity to me right now, absolutely none. I think I need a breather at this rate so stepping out of this thread. Maybe in the meantime someone with an actual clue will say something that doesn't make me cringe. Btw "Kyoani finds a way" isn't always related to sales, it's also used to express a personal new found appreciation for a show. But yes, most of the time it refers to sales. You also got a lot of people who only do it to annoy people like Kaioshin_Sama. |
| Did I not tell you? Did I not warn you? |
rederoin said: VioLink said: Kaioshin_Sama said: Yep that's the meme I was talking about. It's true, but for all the wrong reasons that are IMO a very bad thing for the anime industry. Pandering will find you a way and this joke of a fanbase will just go ahead and be okay with it like it's all well and good as long as this joke of a studio keeps on being popular in spite of itself. This fanbase has no integrity to me right now, absolutely none. I think I need a breather at this rate so stepping out of this thread. Maybe in the meantime someone with an actual clue will say something that doesn't make me cringe. Btw "Kyoani finds a way" isn't always related to sales, it's also used to express a personal new found appreciation for a show. But yes, most of the time it refers to sales. You also got a lot of people who only do it to annoy people like Kaioshin_Sama. Which says a lot doesn't it. People would rather troll then join in the conversation. I'm well aware but it just gives me another reason to call this situation one big joke and point out a lack of integrity and forthrightness |
Kaioshin_Sama said: Which says a lot doesn't it. People would rather troll then join in the conversation. I'm well aware but it just gives me another reason to call this situation one big joke and point out a lack of integrity and forthrightness Those people are not kyoani fans. |
| I wanted to say "stop replying to him already" but I'm also guilty, just that it happened in another thread... |
| Oricon Daily All-Genre Top 30 DVD/Top 20 BD Rankings for Nov 8. Madoka is back after being back in stock yesterday! DVD **4 **5 **6 **7 **8 **9 *10 週 *** **3 **3 **4 **2 *** *** | -- | Free！3 *** *** *** **5 **7 *** *** | -- | Crayon Shin-chan Movie 21 *** **8 *27 *** *** *** *** | -- | ONE PIECE 15th Season Gyojintou-hen 12 *** *15 *** *** *** *** *** | -- | Hataraku Maou-sama！5 *** *16 *** *** *** *** *** | -- | NARUTO Shippuden Ninkai Taisen 3 *20 *** *** *** *** *** *** | -- | Hetalia 4 BD **4 **5 **6 **7 **8 **9 *10 週 *** **1 **1 **2 **1 *** *** | -- | Free！3 *** **3 **5 **8 **3 *** *** | -- | Hataraku Maou-sama！5 *** *** *** *** **4 *** *** | -- | Madoka Movies Limited Edition *** **4 **2 **6 **5 *** *** | -- | SymphogearG 2 **1 *** *12 *** *17 *** *** | -- | Infinite Stratos 2 1 *** *** *** **9 *** *** *** | -- | Crayon Shin-chan Movie 21 *** *11 *** *** *** *** *** | -- | Pon Poko Movie *** *15 *** *** *** *** *** | -- | WataMote 2 *10 *** *** *** *** *** *** | -- | NekoShiro 1 *11 *** *** *** *** *** *** | -- | Hanagai NEXT 4 *13 *** *** *** *** *** *** | -- | Eva 3.33 *16 *** *** *** *** *** *** | -- | Highschool D×D NEW 2 *17 *** *** *** *** *** *** | -- | Tamayura ~More Aggressive~ 1 *18 *** *** *** *** *** *** | -- | UtaPri 2000% 5 *19 *** *** *** *** *** *** | -- | Yamato 2199 7 |
EjcNov 9, 2013 2:15 AM
The News Club: Quality News/Discussion (anime, CDs, manga, novels, games, seiyuu), & sales data (daily, weekly, mid-year, yearly). |
| guys i bet that the log horizon sales will get a boost from today on :p this episode is the start of the true log hirozon series :p |
 |
| KyoAni fanboys to the rescue? Kyoukai no Kanata keeps rising? Possibly top of season and so it proves KyoAni can do whatever and still gets a turnaround? Let's see: 【2013年 11月 09日 02時(土)】 ***,254位 【2013年 11月 09日 03時(土)】 ***,271位 【2013年 11月 09日 04時(土)】 ***,271位 【2013年 11月 09日 05時(土)】 ***,266位 【2013年 11月 09日 06時(土)】 ***,276位 【2013年 11月 09日 07時(土)】 ***,262位 【2013年 11月 09日 08時(土)】 ***,268位 【2013年 11月 09日 09時(土)】 ***,279位 【2013年 11月 09日 10時(土)】 ***,250位 【2013年 11月 09日 11時(土)】 ***,295位 【2013年 11月 09日 12時(土)】 ***,295位 【2013年 11月 09日 13時(土)】 ***,377位 【2013年 11月 09日 14時(土)】 ***,406位 【2013年 11月 09日 15時(土)】 ***,403位 【2013年 11月 09日 16時(土)】 ***,436位 【2013年 11月 09日 17時(土)】 ***,424位 【2013年 11月 09日 18時(土)】 ***,456位 【2013年 11月 09日 19時(土)】 ***,456位 【2013年 11月 09日 20時(土)】 ***,445位 【2013年 11月 09日 21時(土)】 ***,433位 【2013年 11月 09日 22時(土)】 ***,489位 【2013年 11月 09日 23時(土)】 ***,432位 【2013年 11月 10日 00時(日)】 ***,488位 【2013年 11月 10日 01時(日)】 ***,490位 【2013年 11月 10日 02時(日)】 ***,448位 【2013年 11月 10日 03時(日)】 ***,440位 【2013年 11月 10日 04時(日)】 ***,465位 【2013年 11月 10日 05時(日)】 ***,479位 【2013年 11月 10日 06時(日)】 ***,495位 【2013年 11月 10日 07時(日)】 ***,499位 【2013年 11月 10日 08時(日)】 ***,448位 【2013年 11月 10日 09時(日)】 ***,457位 【2013年 11月 10日 10時(日)】 ***,473位 【2013年 11月 10日 11時(日)】 ***,462位 【2013年 11月 10日 12時(日)】 ***,462位 【2013年 11月 10日 13時(日)】 ***,515位 【2013年 11月 10日 14時(日)】 ***,610位 From Stalker graph, the ups and down are similar to new episode boost from previous weeks. The extent of upward move was better but then feedback is that the latest episode is especially entertaining. Otherwise it still looks like the usual new episode boost and far from a turnaround. |
| So MAL finally starts locking news threads that are only a few weeks old? I wonder where was the announcement of this change? Or we are seeing yet another case of changes made that impacted users but not communicated to them? I wonder how long people would put up with this. As much as I have a bunch of information to share about anime announced recently I cannot share it in news board, and the anime series is too disorganized and chaotic to share information except with people already interested in the particular series. |
| Well look at the episode of KnK that was shown this week, it had such a stellar finish to it and a funny end. Ai is confirmed to be all levels of adorable and sexy. |
 |
Kaioshin_Sama said: As I said before, you need to separate the western fans from the disc buying Japanese fans. Who said "KyoAni finds a way" and made those meme jpg? The western anime fans, and we do not even know if they are fanboys or haters. Do these people buy KyoAni discs? Probably not. Why then do you lump the disc sales projection with those people branding "KyoAni finds a way" meme? VioLink said: Its just a way of Kyoani fanboys showing their unconditional praise and rock bottoms standards for the studio IMO. ^Btw "Kyoani finds a way" isn't always related to sales, it can also be used to express a personal new found appreciation for a show. But yes most of the time it is used it refers to sales. Kaioshin_Sama said: Of course people wonder why because it is not just moe contents but also everything from cultural difference, taste difference to price difference, execution problems, business mistakes made by distributor and franchise holders in the west, over-ambition and over-investment (bubble is a word often gets associated here), problems dealing with illegal download and fansubbing. With things so complex, it is easy why people are not sure how things came to pass. The only thing we know is that the reason is not by one single matter.And people wonder why the industry in the west died out completely around the time the likes of kyoanis output became the ideal to which both japan and large chunks of the Western fandom feel anime should aspire in 2009. |
symbvNov 9, 2013 10:36 PM
| So MAL finally starts locking news threads that are only a few weeks old? I wonder where was the announcement of this change? Or we are seeing yet another case of changes made that impacted users but not communicated to them? I wonder how long people would put up with this. As much as I have a bunch of information to share about anime announced recently I cannot share it in news board, and the anime series is too disorganized and chaotic to share information except with people already interested in the particular series. |
| Jumps of between 10 and 30% of an anime's previously predicted sales are reasonably common, and happen several times a season. Anything under 10% isn't really notable (even that may not be for a series with low sales to start with, meaning that a high % boost is a low number of people). It's only when they get to around 30% that it starts being noteworthy. I think Non Non Biyori got slightly under 30% boost from episode 4, for example, coming from a rise from consistantly around 250th in the rankings to consistantly in the high double figures or low triple figures of rankings. Girls und Panzer episode 3 is probably the biggest episode boost of any anime ever, although off the top of my head I can't remember exactly how much it was. |
| There is no such thing as shit taste. Only idiots who think everyone should have the same taste as they do. |
Hahalollawl said: After so many rounds of debates and discussions I now come to the conclusion that Kaioshin_Sama projected his frustration and dislike with the taste of the anime fans in general into the frustration and dislike at KyoAni's doing well. And so KyoAni is just like an lightning rod that draws and concentrates his overall frustration and hatred regarding the general anime industry and fandom. Failing to understand fans would actually like what KyoAni made that catered to their needs and desires and their standard of what a good show is can be different from his (e.g. story consistency may not held in such supreme importance for an anime series), he would rather believe that a cadre of loyal studio fanboys would blindly support the studio and turn around shows' fortune no matter how bad it turned out from watchers' point of view. That being said, it seems like Kaioshin_Sama's...hatred? paranoia?...whatever it is, has gotten excessive. Don't you see how blaming an industry's decline on "the likes of kyoani" seems exaggerated? As Symbv noted, we may not know for certain, but a significant decline is likely due to a confluence of circumstances. Try to look at things objectively and not let your animosity towards KyoAni consume you. For me, I bear no position for KyoAni's likeability. Just like many fans in Japan, I always check their shows because I love its art and sakuga, but I have never bought its discs (except Haruhi) because it did not captivate me enough to want to own the shows. So no one can say I am the studio's fan (or fanboy). My view is based on the business it runs: It wins the competition for anime fans' money because it did the right things to get them to spend money. It is a win achieved fair, clean and square, via the solid and diligent effort of making one show after another. Thus on this it fully deserves its success. It is not like its success is kept by complete lack of effort like sitting on its laurels to rely on milking old characters, or by throwing its weight around like using legal threats to keep its leading position, or worse by any underhanded act. Whether what it makes suits your taste should have absolutely no bearing in making the call if its success is deserved or not. |
symbvNov 10, 2013 12:44 AM
| So MAL finally starts locking news threads that are only a few weeks old? I wonder where was the announcement of this change? Or we are seeing yet another case of changes made that impacted users but not communicated to them? I wonder how long people would put up with this. As much as I have a bunch of information to share about anime announced recently I cannot share it in news board, and the anime series is too disorganized and chaotic to share information except with people already interested in the particular series. |
| Oricon Daily All-Genre Top 30 DVD/Top 20 BD Rankings for Nov 9. DVD **4 **5 **6 **7 **8 **9 *10 週 *** **3 **3 **4 **2 **3 *** | -- | Free！3 *** *** *** **5 **7 **6 *** | -- | Crayon Shin-chan Movie 21 *** **8 *27 *** *** *** *** | -- | ONE PIECE 15th Season Gyojintou-hen 12 *** *15 *** *** *** *** *** | -- | Hataraku Maou-sama！5 *** *16 *** *** *** *** *** | -- | NARUTO Shippuden Ninkai Taisen 3 *20 *** *** *** *** *** *** | -- | Hetalia 4 BD **4 **5 **6 **7 **8 **9 *10 週 *** **1 **1 **2 **1 **1 *** | -- | Free！3 *** **4 **2 **6 **5 **4 *** | -- | SymphogearG 2 *** **3 **5 **8 **3 **5 *** | -- | Hataraku Maou-sama！5 *** *** *** *** **4 **6 *** | -- | Madoka Movies Limited Edition **1 *** *12 *** *17 *16 *** | -- | Infinite Stratos 2 1 *** *** *** **9 *** *** *** | -- | Crayon Shin-chan Movie 21 *** *11 *** *** *** *** *** | -- | Pon Poko Movie *** *15 *** *** *** *** *** | -- | WataMote 2 *10 *** *** *** *** *** *** | -- | NekoShiro 1 *11 *** *** *** *** *** *** | -- | Hanagai NEXT 4 *13 *** *** *** *** *** *** | -- | Eva 3.33 *16 *** *** *** *** *** *** | -- | Highschool D×D NEW 2 *17 *** *** *** *** *** *** | -- | Tamayura ~More Aggressive~ 1 *18 *** *** *** *** *** *** | -- | UtaPri 2000% 5 *19 *** *** *** *** *** *** | -- | Yamato 2199 7 |
EjcNov 10, 2013 8:26 PM
| The News Club: Quality News/Discussion (anime, CDs, manga, novels, games, seiyuu), & sales data (daily, weekly, mid-year, yearly). |
Hahalollawl said: It's good but not great. If you check the charts you'll see the big hits like Shingeki no Kyojin's OP, the first Valvrave OP in the hundreds of thousands but over 10K is still good.ExecRory said: nano is more popular than I thought. This might be a stupid question, but is that a good number? I hope so, that song is so catchy lol. |
| You're being somewhat unfair here, CDs which get huge sales don't get them because of their anime or quality but name of the person/group singing the OP/ED (see the Valvrave with huge OP sales but terrible OST sales). I wouldn't compare those monsters to normal anime CD releases. |
Progeusz said: I think it can be a combination of both. Music shows give the CDs a boost often even for character songs from lesser known seiyuu and bands while well known singers and bands can obviously have a huge seller regardless of whether the anime does well. It is co-marketing and there are advantages to it from both sides. You're being somewhat unfair here, CDs which get huge sales don't get them because of their anime or quality but name of the person/group singing the OP/ED (see the Valvrave with huge OP sales but terrible OST sales). I wouldn't compare those monsters to normal anime CD releases. I think you can see it in places where you compare the OP and ED sung by a known musician or band in one case and seiyuu in the other case. Like this one: 10, 10,376 *10,376 Aoki Hagane no Arpeggio: Ars Nova OP "Savior of Song" 23, *3,604 **3,604 Aoki Hagane no Arpeggio: Ars Nova ED "Blue Field Obviously Nano is already fairly well known so it sold better than the ED song by seiyuu in character. But has Linked Horizon had a big seller like Shingeki no Kyojin's OP? 54, *1,098 225,537 Shingeki no Kyojin OP "Jiyuu e no Shingeki" I think the anime helped the artist there. Sound Horizon's previous best hit sold 69K. And SnK's OST numbers show the anime boosted that as well, though that OST is much more of a rock album than Valvrave's OST which features a soprano and a cellist. |
| Oricon Daily All-Genre Top 30 DVD/Top 20 BD Rankings for Nov 4~10. DVD **4 **5 **6 **7 **8 **9 *10 週 *** **3 **3 **4 **2 **3 *12 | -- | Free！3 *** *** *** **5 **7 **6 *24 | -- | Crayon Shin-chan Movie 21 *** **8 *27 *** *** *** *** | -- | ONE PIECE 15th Season Gyojintou-hen 12 *** *15 *** *** *** *** *** | -- | Hataraku Maou-sama！5 *** *16 *** *** *** *** *** | -- | NARUTO Shippuden Ninkai Taisen 3 *20 *** *** *** *** *** *** | -- | Hetalia 4 BD **4 **5 **6 **7 **8 **9 *10 週 *** **1 **1 **2 **1 **1 **2 | -- | Free！3 *** **4 **2 **6 **5 **4 **6 | -- | SymphogearG 2 *** **3 **5 **8 **3 **5 **7 | -- | Hataraku Maou-sama！5 *** *** *** *** **4 **6 *12 | -- | Madoka Movies Limited Edition **1 *** *12 *** *17 *16 *16 | -- | Infinite Stratos 2 1 *** *** *** **9 *** *** *** | -- | Crayon Shin-chan Movie 21 *** *11 *** *** *** *** *** | -- | Pon Poko Movie *** *15 *** *** *** *** *** | -- | WataMote 2 *10 *** *** *** *** *** *** | -- | NekoShiro 1 *11 *** *** *** *** *** *** | -- | Hanagai NEXT 4 *13 *** *** *** *** *** *** | -- | Eva 3.33 *16 *** *** *** *** *** *** | -- | Highschool D×D NEW 2 *17 *** *** *** *** *** *** | -- | Tamayura ~More Aggressive~ 1 *18 *** *** *** *** *** *** | -- | UtaPri 2000% 5 *19 *** *** *** *** *** *** | -- | Yamato 2199 7 |
| The News Club: Quality News/Discussion (anime, CDs, manga, novels, games, seiyuu), & sales data (daily, weekly, mid-year, yearly). |
| The day finally comes: The top three titles of this cour in Amazon ranking are not the four title tipped to be the TOP FOUR BESTSELLER ***,*65位/***,*68位 ★ (**1,261 pt) [*,**2予約] 2014/01/29 ストライク・ザ・ブラッド第1巻(初回生産限定版) [Blu-ray] Strike the Blood ***,*74位/***,*70位 ★ (**2,056 pt) [*,*98予約] 2013/12/27 【Amazon.co.jp限定】蒼き鋼のアルペジオ -アルス・ノヴァ- 第1巻(初回限定生産)(描き下ろし全巻収納BOX付き)[Blu-ray] Aoki Hagane ***,*93位/***,*96位 ★ (**1,763 pt) [*,*48予約] 2013/12/25 のんのんびより 第1巻 [Blu-ray] Non Non Biyori ***,*96位/***,*89位 ★ (**4,533 pt) [*,*18予約] 2013/12/25 IS<インフィニット・ストラトス>2 Vol.2 [Blu-ray] IS2 ***,108位/***,110位 ★ (**2,524 pt) [*,143予約] 2014/01/08 キルラキル 1(完全生産限定版) [Blu-ray] Kill la Kill ***,178位/***,181位 ★ (**2,267 pt) [*,*44予約] 2014/01/29 リトルバスターズ! ~Refrain~1(初回生産限定版) [Blu-ray] Little Busters Refrain ***,248位/***,233位 ★ (**1,201 pt) [*,*83予約] 2013/12/06 京騒戯画 零巻(VOL.0) [Blu-ray] Kyousougiga ***,264位/***,279位 ★ (**1,342 pt) [*,*39予約] 2013/12/25 機巧少女は傷つかない Vol.1【イベントチケット優先販売申込券付き】 [Blu-ray] Machine Doll ***,266位/***,239位 ★ (**3,308 pt) [*,*16予約] 2014/01/29 黒子のバスケ 2nd season 1 [Blu-ray] KuroBas2 |
| So MAL finally starts locking news threads that are only a few weeks old? I wonder where was the announcement of this change? Or we are seeing yet another case of changes made that impacted users but not communicated to them? I wonder how long people would put up with this. As much as I have a bunch of information to share about anime announced recently I cannot share it in news board, and the anime series is too disorganized and chaotic to share information except with people already interested in the particular series. |
| ^^^ While Strike the Blood is momentarily above all else for this cour, the predicted final number for it has really dropped! Bluray is only 4.4K, under the 4.8K current estimate for Non Non Biyori! Looks like a low season overall. Only IS2 and KB2 look to be sure bets for over 10K, LB!R should sneak over 10K but nothing else looks at all likely. I'm sure we'll have some OreGairu and Symphogear G style surprises over 10K by the time all is said and done but at the moment things are looking a bit depressing sales wise. Go Machine Doll! |
| hope Machine Doll doing well for 2nd Season. Like that Anime and want more than 13 eps. |
hpulley said: This is because it is still averaging from the past week's rankings and the 2-3 days before the latest episode its ranking got quite low (>300) while NonNon had been on a higher level for quite some time. On the other hand, the latest jump of StB is much bigger than I expected. I am not sure the new character is really a major factor but perhaps she is, because Yukina got really limited exposure (in whatever sense ;-) in this episode.^^^ While Strike the Blood is momentarily above all else for this cour, the predicted final number for it has really dropped! Bluray is only 4.4K, under the 4.8K current estimate for Non Non Biyori! |
| So MAL finally starts locking news threads that are only a few weeks old? I wonder where was the announcement of this change? Or we are seeing yet another case of changes made that impacted users but not communicated to them? I wonder how long people would put up with this. As much as I have a bunch of information to share about anime announced recently I cannot share it in news board, and the anime series is too disorganized and chaotic to share information except with people already interested in the particular series. |
| Oh sweet, finally Aoki Hagane no Arpeggio managed to book its name on the list! Been really worried that the Japanese otaku might get turned off by its heavily CG-based battleships, which gladly wasn't the case. Hmm, not really surprised about Machine Doll. I've been gradually warming up with it in recent eps and i actually enjoyed its plot and characters (despite the freakish CG), which is surprising since i initially dismissed this show as being another harem crap . . About Kill la Kill, i dunno. The amazing energy of this show has been waning much faster than i expected and i don't find myself enjoying it as much as when it first aired anymore. Though i'm still glad that it ranks well on the chart |
| I watched Kyousougiga episode 0 which was a recap and I didn't like it but I watched the TV series and I was just blown away, it was very enjoyable to see stuff gradually make sense, the setting is very nice and not so common/generic, the art is beautiful and creative. So I'm very glad to see it ranked well, I hope it has well reception in Japan more than currently on MAL. I wonder if fans of Rie and new fans of the anime liked her role here, she actually uses a different range of voice in this anime and it's very noticeable, this is my favorite voice of her, I hope she continues to use different range of voices outside of her trademark tsundere voice. Amiluhur said: About Kill la Kill, i dunno. The amazing energy of this show has been waning much faster than i expected and i don't find myself enjoying it as much as when it first aired anymore. Though i'm still glad that it ranks well on the chart I sadly have to agree. Episode 3 was the last episode that I found great and/or fully enjoyable. |
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