What was he?
| I just wanted to get your peception of what persona/personae that Yagami Light projected in the anime. Was he an Aristotelian tragic hero as defined by these criteria? 1) Nobility (of a noble birth) or wisdom (by virtue of birth). 2) Hamartia (translated as flaw or error in judgment). Either a mistake in the character's actions or in his personality that leads to a downfall. 3) A reversal of fortune (peripeteia) brought about because of the hero's Hamartia. 4) The discovery or recognition that the reversal was brought about by the hero's own actions (anagnorisis) 5) The audience must feel dramatic irony for the character Was he Nietzsche's Uebermensch/Overman? The death of God and moral values; he wants to give birth to a new world with his own values, and everything he does to create these values has vindication. A Lucifer incarnate? A mortal challenging the realm of God(s), life, and death; striving to obtain the status of a God. The antithesis of concieved moral values and ethics Is he just a plain monster? Or something else? A mix of some or all of them? While forumulating your opinion, ask yourself, "Does the ends justify the means?" Would you consider him a "hero" as dictated by contemporary connotations? With all that said, Yagami Light is an interesting character. I'm just going to sidle to the side-lines and see what you guys think. ;) |
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| I think he's just a brilliant mind who was too bored, with too much time on his hands, who eventually developed an irritating God Complex. I am not a Light fan, and I never will be. |
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Seishi said: I think he's just a brilliant mind who was too bored, with too much time on his hands, who eventually developed an irritating God Complex. I am not a Light fan, and I never will be. Lmao, there's some truth to that. |
In sterquiliniis invenitur. |
| Light cannot be the Ubermensch because the Ubermensch is supposed to be strong enough to kill the idea of God. If Light wants to be God, then the whole theory falls apart. Also; Death Note is a ripoff of MacBeth. |
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Seishi said: I think he's just a brilliant mind who was too bored, with too much time on his hands, who eventually developed an irritating God Complex. I am not a Light fan, and I never will be. Yay <3 His death was too satisfying. The crawling. The begging. Jackass. The trouble with it was that he completely understood how illogical his undertaking was, but ignored it. This is why kids need a hobby. |
| He played the role of the tragic hero quite well. In the end, I pitied him. I'm sure it was meant to be seen that way, too. |
| If Light was a real person I probably would've hated him.. He's just plain evil. Plus I believe that the ends do NOT justify the means.. |
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| I might have to say he was a tragic hero in my eyes, I'll admit to liking him more than anyone else in the series though, but whatever. |
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| I think he was a tragic hero. He really was trying his best to correct the world. But like all great men, he lost it due to various reasons (power, greed, god complex, stupidity whatever you want to call it.) I supported him from start to finish. >.> |
| I supported him in the beginning, but then switched over to L. In the beginning he started with the right idea, but then basically went down the wrong path and screwed everything up. But, I still think he was always bad and never actually a hero, cause a 'hero' wouldn't use evil tactics, thus I say Lucifer Incarnate, cause he basically was challenging the gods and wanted to be a god himself, with morals and ethics that aren't considered just. |
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hoshiii said: Seishi said: I think he's just a brilliant mind who was too bored, with too much time on his hands, who eventually developed an irritating God Complex. I am not a Light fan, and I never will be. Yay <3 His death was too satisfying. The crawling. The begging. Jackass. The trouble with it was that he completely understood how illogical his undertaking was, but ignored it. This is why kids need a hobby. Explain how it was illogical? If Light was a real person and didn't have to deal with the writer's opinions and stupid situations, he would have no problem succeeding. Whether he would go mad at some point or not, no one knows, but the only reason he did in the series was because of the situations he was forced into and because he was going against his OWN morals to do what needed to be done. His plan with the memory loss worked because he knew this. His morals were similar to L and his father's from the beginning, but he was given a chance to change everything, even if doing so meant going against his morals. He believed he was the only one that could pull it off because very few people would actually be able to keep their sanity in his shoes. As for the "begging" and people calling him a coward... what would you do if you were him in that situation at the end? After all you've been through and done, everything is about to come crashing down; what do you do? Stand there and look cool? I fucking doubt it. Light had slowly been losing it as time went on, but that's when he truly went over the edge - anyone would. Ultimately, he lost because the writer wanted him to lose. That's all there is to it. For example: I don't know about the manga, but throughout the whole anime series, after everything Light does, they show how his decisions affect certain people in a negative way (especially near the end). Many of the situations he was subjected to were extremely unrealistic, but it was necessary. The series wouldn't be very interesting otherwise. In reality, he wouldn't have any problem pulling it off. The only person that could possibly stop him would be himself. Earlier I said no one knows if he'd eventually go mad without a writer hindering him but honestly I think there's probably a good chance he would. Why? Because a person like Light was never cut out for it anyway, even though he believed he was. It's true he was brilliant and a lot more courageous than most people, but he was never cut out for it. That's another thing people need to realize is that Light had similar morals to the people on here that are against him. Even when his memory was erased, he was fighting against Kira. However, he was given a chance no one in reality will probably ever get. When you have a notebook that can kill anyone in the world just by writing their name down, you would no doubt start to get ideas like Light that you wouldn't normally get. So what do I think? I think he was extremely brave and the title of "tragic hero" fits him nicely, but he was bound to lose in the end. When you're subjected to the situations he had to go through, all while going against your own morals to do what you believe needs to be done, it's bound to happen. That doesn't change the fact that he was definitely a hero in his own right and he was certainly not a coward. |
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Neverender said: hoshiii said: Seishi said: I think he's just a brilliant mind who was too bored, with too much time on his hands, who eventually developed an irritating God Complex. I am not a Light fan, and I never will be. Yay <3 His death was too satisfying. The crawling. The begging. Jackass. The trouble with it was that he completely understood how illogical his undertaking was, but ignored it. This is why kids need a hobby. Explain how it was illogical? If Light was a real person and didn't have to deal with the writer's opinions and stupid situations, he would have no problem succeeding. Whether he would go mad at some point or not, no one knows, but the only reason he did in the series was because of the situations he was forced into and because he was going against his OWN morals to do what needed to be done. His plan with the memory loss worked because he knew this. His morals were similar to L and his father's from the beginning, but he was given a chance to change everything, even if doing so meant going against his morals. He believed he was the only one that could pull it off because very few people would actually be able to keep their sanity in his shoes. As for the "begging" and people calling him a coward... what would you do if you were him in that situation at the end? After all you've been through and done, everything is about to come crashing down; what do you do? Stand there and look cool? I fucking doubt it. Light had slowly been losing it as time went on, but that's when he truly went over the edge - anyone would. Ultimately, he lost because the writer wanted him to lose. That's all there is to it. For example: I don't know about the manga, but throughout the whole anime series, after everything Light does, they show how his decisions affect certain people in a negative way (especially near the end). Many of the situations he was subjected to were extremely unrealistic, but it was necessary. The series wouldn't be very interesting otherwise. In reality, he wouldn't have any problem pulling it off. The only person that could possibly stop him would be himself. Earlier I said no one knows if he'd eventually go mad without a writer hindering him but honestly I think there's probably a good chance he would. Why? Because a person like Light was never cut out for it anyway, even though he believed he was. It's true he was brilliant and a lot more courageous than most people, but he was never cut out for it. That's another thing people need to realize is that Light had similar morals to the people on here that are against him. Even when his memory was erased, he was fighting against Kira. However, he was given a chance no one in reality will probably ever get. When you have a notebook that can kill anyone in the world just by writing their name down, you would no doubt start to get ideas like Light that you wouldn't normally get. So what do I think? I think he was extremely brave and the title of "tragic hero" fits him nicely, but he was bound to lose in the end. When you're subjected to the situations he had to go through, all while going against your own morals to do what you believe needs to be done, it's bound to happen. That doesn't change the fact that he was definitely a hero in his own right and he was certainly not a coward. You make some good points. With that being said, let me ask you this,"Would you want to live in his world if he hypothetically succeeded; where he was "God" and literally the fate of everybody is at his fingertips?" Dont want to argue. Just curious is all. |
In sterquiliniis invenitur. |
You make some good points. With that being said, let me ask you this,"Would you want to live in his world if he hypothetically succeeded; where he was "God" and literally the fate of everybody is at his fingertips?" Dont want to argue. Just curious is all. Haha, no problem. I don't think it'd be too bad, especially for a nobody like me. It'd probably be a lot better than how things are now, but the thing about a character like Light is there's always a chance he'd become unstable at some point with that much power. Having a notebook that can kill anyone who's name is written down in your posession is one thing, but having the whole world bowing down to you is another. When you have the entire world in your hands, you'd probably get all kinds of ideas in your head. After all, Light is a lot smarter than any normal person, but he's still just a person. I can think of a lot of other people that would be a lot worse to have ruling the world, though (like Bush for example). |
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crowslayer91 said: i hate Light. he was an cocky arrogant bastard I think Light's arrogance was a sort of personal mental defense mechanism for himself. If he tells himself he will win, makes himself think he'll win, acts like he'll win, then the thought of him losing will rarely cross his mind. Consider how easily he started to fall apart every time his chance of victory was truly threatened by someone and it makes sense. |
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| I loved the fact that he was cocky and arrogant. It made him a G. |
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Neverender said: You make some good points. With that being said, let me ask you this,"Would you want to live in his world if he hypothetically succeeded; where he was "God" and literally the fate of everybody is at his fingertips?" Dont want to argue. Just curious is all. Haha, no problem. I don't think it'd be too bad, especially for a nobody like me. It'd probably be a lot better than how things are now, but the thing about a character like Light is there's always a chance he'd become unstable at some point with that much power. Having a notebook that can kill anyone who's name is written down in your posession is one thing, but having the whole world bowing down to you is another. When you have the entire world in your hands, you'd probably get all kinds of ideas in your head. After all, Light is a lot smarter than any normal person, but he's still just a person. I can think of a lot of other people that would be a lot worse to have ruling the world, though (like Bush for example). Lmao, Bush. As Seneca said," Errare humanum est perservare diabolicum: To err is human; to persist is of the devil." As you said, Light is still a fallible human just like the rest of us. |
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marcusyyz said: Nawww... he's not a coward for losing his sanity at the very end. He's a coward for: I don't really get how any of these make him a coward, lol. Of course his life is more important than anyone else's. If he dies, then it's all over. How does manipulating and killing people make him a coward? Don't get me wrong; it's not that I'm agreeing with how he went about things, but I don't know why people would call him a coward. Either way, the pressure on him at that point in the series (when he was forced to sacrifice family members) was immense, and he never even managed to kill his sister (again, wasn't cut out for it in the first place). Takada and Misa? Come on... They were meant to be used. What other use do characters like that have? |
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| A tragic hero. A great mind with a bit too simple motive. |
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| I still firmly believe that Light was in some way inspired by Hitler. All of my friends like him, call him a hero, whatever. They can't understand why I hate him. You can't deny he's pretty evil. EDIT-- Based on the manga. The anime isn't my cup of tea. XD |
| He is my idol. Not seriously though, just something that part of me wants to be. Light was too competitive to be a God. If a Death Note owner simply wrote the same amount of criminals everyday, at the same time, of the same caliber, in no particular region etc... The chances s/he would be caught are b/millions to one. |
wtfyourface said: MistaCloudStrife said: OVER 9000!!!From 100-1000, how much do you love LWL? |
| I voted something else, he's a Byronic hero, I think he fits this discription pretty well... http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Byronic_hero He had good ideals but they were flawed, never the less his ideals could be considered good. |
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| I personally think he's about 30 IQ points and a handlebar moustache away from being Dick Dastardly. |
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| Light was a good person, read this... http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stanford_prison_experiment He's no different from the sadistic guards in this experiment, he was given power over someone else and went mad with power... |
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| My opinion Light was a brilliant guy, who was bored and needed a hobby though frankly it was just the wrong hobby. I think his downfall was set the moment he picked up the note book, I didn't believe what he did was right even if those criminals did commit horrible crimes, its only a crime to take another life. Besides he stopped being "justice" when he killed innocent people who didn't deserve to die. I didn't like Light to be honest, but I didn't laugh when he died either though I cant say that I wasn't relieved. But I more so thought it was a pity that a smart mind like his, had to go down the way he did. He had so much potential and yet, he went mad over a goal that may or may not have been met. |
| What you saw at the castle on that windy night ,and what you saw at the bridge last night .. how I smiled, never utter a word to anyone. If you dare speak .. I will find where you are .. And I will kill you. Kill you. I will rip you apart .. crush your bones And eat your flesh.. I will drink your blood. I will .. devour you. |
| sry for the delay *moves to death note board* |
| hmm... I just think Light is one incredibly naiive kid with too much confidence. Maybe he went insane the moment he first used the death note, maybe the whole thing with 'ridding the world of evil' was just a way for him to feel better about becoming a murderer but hey, the long and short of it is: it was never going to happen. I guess that's what makes him a little tragic, though he's no hero in my books. Doctor prescribes: A large dose of pity |
-Chrissi-chan-Oct 28, 2008 12:15 PM
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| I think he's a flat character, far too flat to really say anything. It was probably intended this way, to set the focus on the proactive, bounce-off-on-eachother plot (it's among the least psychological anime I've ever seen, as opposed to what it's tagged rather highly as). If anything, he's a tad bit pathetic, a tad bit fabulous, a tad bit monstrous, decidedly asexual and massively narrow-minded. He's a moron who cannot think about his own stance for even a second, a genius schemer who can (by the grace of some well-placed Because the Plot Says So) outthink the best. He was psychotic, and I deem his actions disgusting. So herowise... Not a hero at all. He was the villain, narratively. A flat though entertaining one. Too good intentions to be an outright monster. Too pathetic to be Lucifer incarnate. Definitely not an übermensch (Haruhi's far closer), but he has a few traits of one. And not a tragic hero because he's neither very tragic (a whiff, maybe) nor a hero. |
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| An important - if not the sole - purpose of tragic heroes is to be the vehicle for catharsis. They are sympathetic characters, not romanticized mass murderers. Also, Light falls too soon, and doesn't have much of an anagnorisis. All in all, I don't want to be a literary snob, but it upsets me that anyone would put Light in the same moral category as Prometheus, Antigone, Pentheus, and later Shakespearean heroes. Kaiserpingvin said: Too pathetic to be Lucifer incarnate. Incidentally, Light is extremely similar to Milton's Satan, who starts off as a brave, heroic, sympathetic, and reasonable figure and degenerates into lunatic impotence. That said, I don't put much stock in Milton's interpretation of Satan, but it's an interesting parallel. |
ArachneiaMar 21, 2009 10:53 AM
| I think he's a Big Brother. XP Or, at least he was going to become one. All in all, I don't want to be a literary snob, but it upsets me that anyone would put Light in the same moral category as Prometheus, Antigone, Pentheus, and later Shakespearean heroes. Ditto. Macbeth vs Death Note? No competition. Also... I think I would've been more comfortable saying that Light was an outright monster if he had been a 60 year old man. (I mean, no offense, but his hotness is partially what kept him out of hot water. He IS playing the part of suave, ingenious protagonist, after all. ) I guess appearances do count. |
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| I think he was right till he started to want to "win" and therefore, started killing innocent people and small-time criminals. IMHO. |
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