| Let's say someone did horribly wrong things in the past that would have granted them a long stay in prison (you get the gist of it, let's not get into details or what they could have done exactly), but they somehow (one way or another) started to suffer from amnesia (which has been genuinely diagnosed) and literally forgot everything about themselves and their past. Do you believe they should still face justice? Or do you believe it wouldn't make sense to sentence them if they have no recollection of the crimes and are now a whole different self? |
| Amnesia would be even more reason to imprison them, because if they forgot what they did, then there would be no learning effect, so the probability they would do the same crimes again would be even higher. |
No, this isn't my signature. |
Reply to Zarutaku
Amnesia would be even more reason to imprison them, because if they forgot what they did, then there would be no learning effect, so the probability they would do the same crimes again would be even higher.
| @Zarutaku So for you it's basically a "you may feel like you're innocent but we're gonna put you in prison just in case you ever feel like doing it again" situation? (is the meme below how you envision them?) But realistically, wouldn't it be more likely for them to learn what they did and subsequently do their best to make sure it doesn't happen again? |
| "Hey that guy who tortured, raped, and killed your family got amnesia! So it's ok, we've released him. DON'T YOU FEEL THE JUSTICE??" At this rate, it's going to be hard deciding on the top ten worst fleurbleue posts  |
Reply to Shishio-kun
"Hey that guy who tortured, raped, and killed your family got amnesia! So it's ok, we've released him. DON'T YOU FEEL THE JUSTICE??"
At this rate, it's going to be hard deciding on the top ten worst fleurbleue posts
At this rate, it's going to be hard deciding on the top ten worst fleurbleue posts
| @Shishio-kun I'm not saying what should be done, I'm asking you guys what you would do. But I don't mind if you like to have a hate boner on me. |
| They should be forgiven after they repent and won't do something similar again and maybe repaired whatever they did. I personally think if they have amnesia there is a bigger chance they are going to repeat their mistakes. |
   |
| Regardless of if they remember, if they became a different person then there is no one left to really punish. Prison should be to keep people safe not for revenge. |
| ⠀⠀⠀⠀ ⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀ ⠀⠀⠀⠀ ⠀⠀⠀⠀ ⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀ ⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀ ⣸⠋⠀⠀⠀⡄⠀⠀⡔⠀⢀⠀⢸⠀⠀⠀⡘⡰⠁⠘⡀⠀⠀⢠⠀⠀⠀⢸⠀⠀⢸⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀ ⠀⠀⠀⠀ ⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀ ⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀ ⠀ ⠀⠀⠀⠀ ⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀ ⠀⠀⠀⠁⠀⣀⠀⠀⡇⠀⡜⠈⠁⠀⢸⡈⢇⠀⠀⢣⠑⠢⢄⣇⠀⠀⠸⠀⠀⠀⢸⠀⠀⢸⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀ ⠀⠀⠀⠀ ⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀ ⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀ ⠀⠀⠀⠀ ⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀ ⠀⢰⡟⡀⠀⡇⡜⠀⠀⠀⠀⠘⡇⠈⢆⢰⠁⠀⠀⠀⠘⣆⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠸⠀⠀⡄⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀ ⠀⠀⠀⠀ ⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀ ⠀⠀⠀⠀ ⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀ ⠀⠤⢄⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⡼⠀⣧⠀⢿⢠⣤⣤⣬⣥⠀⠁⠀⠀⠛⢀⡒⠀⠀⠀⠘⡆⡆⠀⠀⠀⡇⠀⠀⠇⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀ ⠀⠀⠀⠀ ⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀ ⠀⠀ ⠀⠀⠀⠀ ⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀ ⠀⢵⡀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⡰⠀⢠⠃⠱⣼⡀⣀⡀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠈⠛⠳⠶⠶⠆⡸⢀⡀⣀⢰⠀⠀⢸ ⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀ ⠀⠀⠀⠀ ⠀⠀⠀⠀ ⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀ ⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀ ⣀⣀⣀⠄⠀⠉⠁⠀⠀⢠⠃⢀⠎⠀⠀⣼⠋⠉⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠴⠢⢄⡔⣕⡍⠣⣱⢸⠀⠀⢷⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀ ⠀⠀⠀⠀ ⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀ ⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀ ⠀⠀⠀⠀ ⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀ ⠀⠀⠀⡰⠃⢀⠎⠀⠀⡜⡨⢢⡀⠀⠀⠀⠐⣄⠀⠀⣠⠀⠀⠀⠐⢛⠽⠗⠁⠀⠁⠊⠀⡜⠸⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀ ⠀⠀⠀⠀ ⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀ ⠀ ⠀⠀⠀⠀ ⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀ ⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀ ⢀⠔⣁⡴⠃⠀⡠⡪⠊⣠⣾⣟⣷⡦⠤⣀⡈⠁⠉⢀⣀⡠⢔⠊⠁⠀⠀⠀⠀⢀⡤⡗⢀⠇⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀ ⠀ ⠀⠀⠀⠀ ⠀⠀⠀⠀ ⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀ ⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀ ⠀⠀⢀⣠⠴⢑⡨⠊⡀⠤⠚⢉⣴⣾⣿⡿⣾⣿⡇⠀⠹⣻⠛⠉⠉⢀⠠⠺⠀⠀⡀⢄⣴⣾⣧⣞⠀⡜⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀ ⠀⠀⠀⠀ ⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀ ⠀⠀⠀⠀ ⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀ ⠐⠒⣉⠠⠄⡂⠅⠊⠁⠀⠀⣴⣿⣿⣿⣿⣻⣿⣿⡇⠀⠀⢠⣷⣮⡍⡠⠔⢉⡇⡠⠋⠁⠀⣿⣿⣿⣿⣄⠀⠀⠀⠀ |
| I think yes. Consciousness is poorly understood. You cannot guarantee that a person with full amnesia is even the same self and not a separate consciousness within the same brain. Would you judge an identical copy of someone for something their clone committed? It doesn't seem right just because their brain and body are biologically the same. Shishio-kun said: Hey that guy who tortured, raped, and killed your family got amnesia! So it's ok, we've released him. DON'T YOU FEEL THE JUSTICE?? I'm pretty sure that if your family is killed, no amount of justice would be sufficient either way, let alone justice against someone who doesn't even remember their name and done at the hands of the state. Imagine hearing the news; "Your wife and kids are dead but do not worry, for we have apprehended the body of the guy who committed it, and now we'll give him some real tough time but only after we explain to him what year and country he is in." |
Reply to fleurbleue
@Zarutaku So for you it's basically a "you may feel like you're innocent but we're gonna put you in prison just in case you ever feel like doing it again" situation? (is the meme below how you envision them?)
But realistically, wouldn't it be more likely for them to learn what they did and subsequently do their best to make sure it doesn't happen again?
But realistically, wouldn't it be more likely for them to learn what they did and subsequently do their best to make sure it doesn't happen again?
| Seems naive, if someone forgot everything about themselves and their past, they'd be similar to a demented lunatic without sanity, they couldn't be trusted. |
No, this isn't my signature. |
| "Should someone be forgiven for their evil past if they have amnesia?" Amnesia does not erase crimes, the perpetrator of the crimes must still pay for the crimes committed, if the victims and those affected wish to forgive they can forgive, but the criminal still has to suffer the consequences of their actions and receive treatment to try to fix Amnesia. |
Absurdo_NSep 19, 10:54 AM
Reply to 149597871
I think yes. Consciousness is poorly understood. You cannot guarantee that a person with full amnesia is even the same self and not a separate consciousness within the same brain.
Would you judge an identical copy of someone for something their clone committed? It doesn't seem right just because their brain and body are biologically the same.
I'm pretty sure that if your family is killed, no amount of justice would be sufficient either way, let alone justice against someone who doesn't even remember their name and done at the hands of the state.
Imagine hearing the news; "Your wife and kids are dead but do not worry, for we have apprehended the body of the guy who committed it, and now we'll give him some real tough time but only after we explain to him what year and country he is in."
Would you judge an identical copy of someone for something their clone committed? It doesn't seem right just because their brain and body are biologically the same.
Shishio-kun said:
Hey that guy who tortured, raped, and killed your family got amnesia! So it's ok, we've released him. DON'T YOU FEEL THE JUSTICE??
Hey that guy who tortured, raped, and killed your family got amnesia! So it's ok, we've released him. DON'T YOU FEEL THE JUSTICE??
I'm pretty sure that if your family is killed, no amount of justice would be sufficient either way, let alone justice against someone who doesn't even remember their name and done at the hands of the state.
Imagine hearing the news; "Your wife and kids are dead but do not worry, for we have apprehended the body of the guy who committed it, and now we'll give him some real tough time but only after we explain to him what year and country he is in."
| @149597871 So you think they should be set free? I think legally if such a thing were to happen, they would be institutionalized in a psychiatric facility since there is technically no way of ever knowing if they will get their memories back or not. |
Reply to Zarutaku
Seems naive, if someone forgot everything about themselves and their past, they'd be similar to a demented lunatic without sanity, they couldn't be trusted.
| @Zarutaku I'm not exactly sure how forgetting everything about yourself and your past would make someone a demented lunatic without sanity. Or is that what you think would become of you in such a situation? |
Reply to Absurdo_N
"Should someone be forgiven for their evil past if they have amnesia?"
Amnesia does not erase crimes, the perpetrator of the crimes must still pay for the crimes committed, if the victims and those affected wish to forgive they can forgive, but the criminal still has to suffer the consequences of their actions and receive treatment to try to fix Amnesia.
Amnesia does not erase crimes, the perpetrator of the crimes must still pay for the crimes committed, if the victims and those affected wish to forgive they can forgive, but the criminal still has to suffer the consequences of their actions and receive treatment to try to fix Amnesia.
Absurdo_N said: Wait, so the consequence for their actions is to receive treatment for their amnesia...? I don't think such a thing actually exists, though.has to suffer the consequences of their actions and receive treatment to try to fix Amnesia. |
Reply to fleurbleue
@Zarutaku I'm not exactly sure how forgetting everything about yourself and your past would make someone a demented lunatic without sanity. Or is that what you think would become of you in such a situation?
fleurbleue said: I'm not exactly sure how forgetting everything about yourself and your past would make someone a demented lunatic without sanity. Because forgetting all this would presuppose severe brain damage, which is also why many demented people become considerably dangerous with time. |
No, this isn't my signature. |
| Maybe forgiven but not pardoned if that makes sense? Since they're effectively a new person but their subconsciousness might still carry those same traits that made them do bad things in the first place before they got amnesia |
| Why would *my* forgiveness depend on someone's consciousness? I may forgive them just on a whim, or hate them forever - who knows? Might depend more on the day of the week or the moon phase, than their consciousness, repentance or whatever. Ah, I read this funny story about Canadian court freeing a sexual offender because he was high - is it related somehow? |
| Beauty is in the eye of the beholder. |
Reply to fleurbleue
Absurdo_N said:
has to suffer the consequences of their actions and receive treatment to try to fix Amnesia.
Wait, so the consequence for their actions is to receive treatment for their amnesia...? I don't think such a thing actually exists, though.has to suffer the consequences of their actions and receive treatment to try to fix Amnesia.
| @fleurbleue That's not what I said, I said that in addition to receiving punishment, the perpetrator of the crimes must also receive treatment to alleviate the Amnesia, in some cases this works, not all. |
Reply to Zarutaku
fleurbleue said:
I'm not exactly sure how forgetting everything about yourself and your past would make someone a demented lunatic without sanity.
I'm not exactly sure how forgetting everything about yourself and your past would make someone a demented lunatic without sanity.
Because forgetting all this would presuppose severe brain damage, which is also why many demented people become considerably dangerous with time.
| @Zarutaku Brain damage could be a cause, though I've heard strong trauma and psychological stress could also cause it (like in the Octave Monjoin case). |
Reply to fleurbleue
@149597871 So you think they should be set free? I think legally if such a thing were to happen, they would be institutionalized in a psychiatric facility since there is technically no way of ever knowing if they will get their memories back or not.
| @fleurbleue If it was up to me, yes. To quote traed: "Prison should be to keep people safe not for revenge." And considering that the guy has lost his memories, revenge isn't even possible to begin with. Even if all the memories are restored, it may come as a shock to him rather than a "I'm back." moment. He can still be a completely different person. |
Reply to LoveYourSmile
Why would *my* forgiveness depend on someone's consciousness? I may forgive them just on a whim, or hate them forever - who knows? Might depend more on the day of the week or the moon phase, than their consciousness, repentance or whatever.
Ah, I read this funny story about Canadian court freeing a sexual offender because he was high - is it related somehow?
Ah, I read this funny story about Canadian court freeing a sexual offender because he was high - is it related somehow?
LoveYourSmile said: Are you talking about the Daviault case? That's really old. The guy was found guilty in my province, but the Supreme Court of Canada ruled him not guilty (also, did I ever mention that I was an independentist?)Ah, I read this funny story about Canadian court freeing a sexual offender because he was high - is it related somehow? |
Reply to Absurdo_N
@fleurbleue
That's not what I said, I said that in addition to receiving punishment, the perpetrator of the crimes must also receive treatment to alleviate the Amnesia, in some cases this works, not all.
That's not what I said, I said that in addition to receiving punishment, the perpetrator of the crimes must also receive treatment to alleviate the Amnesia, in some cases this works, not all.
Absurdo_N said: I'd be curious to know what they are. If this is about hypnosis, it's more likely to only create false memories.in some cases this works, not all. |
| Hell no, they've still done it, they've still hurt somebody, idc if they've lost memories of it, it reminds me of this Sonic comics where Eggman had Amnesia and this create a mini-civil war between Shadow and Sonic team to know if they should let him a chance or profit of his amnesia to imprison him easily. |
19/09/2025 🕊❤  |
Reply to fleurbleue
LoveYourSmile said:
Ah, I read this funny story about Canadian court freeing a sexual offender because he was high - is it related somehow?
Are you talking about the Daviault case? That's really old. The guy was found guilty in my province, but the Supreme Court of Canada ruled him not guilty (also, did I ever mention that I was an independentist?)Ah, I read this funny story about Canadian court freeing a sexual offender because he was high - is it related somehow?
| @fleurbleue Idk, can't remember the name. I just found it funny precedent. Can't google it now, already driving half-drunk/half-sleepy. Hope they rule it according to Canadian law if I forgot my shovel or whatever. |
| Beauty is in the eye of the beholder. |
| Hmm, assuming that the person in question has gone through a full medical diagnosis (brain scans, certain tests, etc.) and there is official confirmation that he indeed has amnesia and isn't lying, I would probably say "yes," that person should still face some type of sentence. The severity of the sentence might depend on the type of crime that was being committed, as well as whether that person's evil inclinations are still present or not — I'm not sure if the latter is something that can be officially diagnosed and confirmed or not when it comes to amnesia cases, but depending on what the overall details are, I can still see a lessened/milder sentence being understandable. |
| It should not excuse their actions, but maybe their sentence should look a little different. |
  |
| Yeah, that game is legit fire. No person that has it can be a bad one. |
| 'Tis the same brain that committed the acts is it not? Under the same circumstances, it would have committed the same acts. If it is not the nature of a person that we (should rehabilitate but I digress) punish, then what is it? Because if each brain is the same then we are all capable of doing the same things as the persecuted persons, under the same circumstances. In which case, what right has one to punish the other? So... By purely following the laws of our society and the philosophical and moral implications of it, the sentence should remain. Would that feel fair to the person in question? I would imagine not. But when has our society in its most grounded roots ever valued fairness above all else? Not to mention not all amnesia is permanent. |
PrinceYutaSep 19, 9:13 PM
| I guess it depends on what they did, and what kind of punishment would be issued. |
 |
| The villain of Mardock Scramble erases his own memories so that he can continue to kill without guilt. |
| その目だれの目？ |
| I will have definitive answer after Flower of Allure gets 30 more chapters. But for real, no. Amnesia erases past for said person, not for everyone around them. |
| There is no banquet in this world that doesn't come to an end... But I will never leave you. |
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