Do you agree with what Gilgamesh said about mankind not having a purpose in life in the modern age because of overpopulation?
j0x said: poor nations, have issues besides just their people though, but I understand where you are coming from.fair enough, but it was never my intention to say that you only need intellect for proper contributions to society and you miss my edit on the previous reply i included the poor people that is labeled by society as useless as well or not contributing much and majority of the countries in the world are still poor, and majority of the poor countries all over the world are overpopulated as for the contribution part, i say the lower middle class for example work equally or more harder than rich people like celebrities or sports players when you compare their total working hours in relation to their income As for the lower middle class vs rich, that is more of a U.S. thing. For example a CEO in the US earns 534 times more than the average worker. In Canada it is 204 times more and in japan, it is only 67 times more. So it's something in our nation that leads to this, not really them being less useful just our country values them more for some reason. Oh and athletes and celebrities don't earn as much as CEOs. That is once again the media only focusing on them. If the media talked more about how much they earn as opposed to celebrities, people would stop wanting to be rappers and ball players and instead would try to run big companies. |
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| lol OP of course not What kind of stupid question is that? Yeah, with the current world of course that there are people here and there that are lost, but who says these people won't turn around their lives and do something productive in the future? |
MightyM16Jun 17, 2015 11:03 PM
KamiCity said: j0x said: Now your stating that only intellect/mental abilities are proper contributions. What about a person with no legs that knows economics, or a person with down syndrome but the strength to lift heavy things for construction? What about a blind man who runs could run a radio show, or a person without arms that can direct? A perfectly healthy person, sometimes contributes less than a disabled one. he and other minority are an exception to the majority, and besides Stephen Hawking is a genius and scientists so his intellect/mental abilities can contribute on its own What are proper contributions? What is good enough? What is needed? Who gets to decide? You talk about majority, but did you know most "useless" people are actually a minority? Since society wouldn't be able to function if the majority was useless. I understand what you are trying to say, but I think your missing a bigger picture here. We hear more about the "useless" than the useful, that's a media thing though. Not reality. I agree with everything you say (as my posts at the start say) but I think we're just gonna have to let these guys be edgy and unhappy. |
| No. And I also have a feeling it's highly possible that there's a too romanticized view point on people of the long long past, as if we know how those people felt living in their eras and also people ignore a lot of the despicable things people did back then that were downright barbaric. For example does being some irreplaceable slave hunter make you more meaningful than people today? A life having meaning and purpose is subjective, let alone the worth of said meaning and purpose. I don't really care if someone is useful to "society" either when it comes to posts on this thread, because it's not like the world at large from country to country even have the same morals or goals, we don't even know if the direction a "society" going towards is a good one deserving of people contributing to it. People always go on and on about people on welfare, bums and the such when it comes to not being useful, but honestly just because you work hard or are successful doesn't mean you're useful in my view. You could be this huge sports player, but do sports really matter? Then there's people who make technologies and entertainment, their works are some of what helps and contributes to people being lazy, yet people who complain about the lazy never claim they're detriments to society despite building what makes people lazy and etc in the first place. I've recently graduated college and have done computer programming, my so called "contribution" to society life will probably continuing to make and debug programs and websites for people and companies, but I won't really value it any more than I do just messing around like now or playing around on any other website for fun. The only reason I work hard and try to keep good quality in what I do is out of pride, desire to have good credentials and being able to one day be able to provide to the people I do and will care about, I believe anything other than would be misguided because you could easily be pumping into a system that isn't worth it or hell just diluting yourself into thinking you're a "good" person because you feel you contribute to others when really you're doing it for yourself and refuse to see it then get on your high horse judging other people because you think you're this good person, or see other people as good people when they do it for themselves. The only people I hold to a degree of high esteem personally are people of medicine, civil rights and those who do things to prevent the waste and destruction of the earth we humans do, but that's personal taste anyways as there is no inherent reason that lives and this planet necessarily need to be prolonged, and who knows if there is some higher deity maybe many of the rights we give are sinful. |
| Jaywalker. |
| Gil is a goddamn psychopath. That being said he is right to an extent that there are some pretty worthless people out in the world and that something does need to be done about it. Mass Genocide probably is the best way to go about that. But I do respect Gil, in a sense, that he's willing to get shit done to see a new world. |
| Big Order (TV):great anime or greatest anime? |
ZeroDragon said: The reason I wish to eradicate the current world is so that a new one may blossom in its place, one that is worthy of my rule. Humans are far too excessive in this era. They indulge themselves on trivialities and inflict harm upon one another as if the tribulations that the world brings are nothing, as if they own and have claimed superiority against it. There is no value in ruling over petty filth that continually seeks to self-destruct. Certainly they have innovated and developed over the millenia, but they have become far too comfortable and have lost the worth they once had. They only serve to provide me with amusement when they impart despair and pain amongst themselves. I seek to recreate this world, one that I shall lead to greatness.  In a time once past, this world was a merciless entity to be respected, a time when prolonged survival and stability were blessings. Certainly there existed many fools who attempted to claim power for themselves and brought death and despair upon many, but it was all amidst an already harsh environment. Those who were capable of surviving would be granted the privilege of continuing their family bloodline, and amidst the never-ending cycle of chaos that is human existence, humanity would steadily rise ever-closer to ultimate glory. But, witness the state humanity dwells in. Throughout its advancement, it has managed to conquered this world, but yet it has demonstrated its incapability at being able to treasure its own garden. Humans continue to multiply at an abhorrent rate, their spawn carrying on their comfort and bliss. A ruler is no ruler if they cannot lead their kingdom to glory, and thus the human conquerors of the garden are undeserving of their possessions. For every person of worth to humanity, there are ten thousand others who provide no true value and who only seek to leech off of the achievements and creations of those who do possess a meaningful purpose to the collective. Humanity is in such a state of affluence and abundance, but yet the majority of resources are withheld in a few castles managed by filth who fancy themselves worthwhile and inflate their societal status by convincing fools. The remainder of the lands are left to wither and die, meanwhile within those castles the fools in their delusions and pettiness find nothing better to do than inflict upon themselves needless despair, tragedy, and destruction. There is no greatness nor magnificence in beholding such a disgusting sight. In a time when the world was an adversary and the population much lower, such actions were acceptable. But now, there is an excess of uselessness and the majority of those who possess power squander it on frivolous pursuits. It is far too late for humanity to find salvation. It has already elected to venture down the path of destruction. Those who possess value are far outnumbered by those who do not, and thus a rebirth is necessary. |
ZeroDragonJun 16, 2015 9:56 PM
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j0x said: well there maybe difference on each country like you shown but the basic idea that celebrities/athletes and even CEOs earn more than the middle class is the same on majority of the world if not the whole world even if they work for equal number of hours work per day You're kidding me right? Why shouldn't the CEO's earn more? Do you realize how much more work a CEO/CFO has to do than an average joe? They don't work an equal amount of hours per day, the average person or 9 to 5er has no more responsibility than going to work on time, doing their work, and going home. It's a repetitive cycle, and they do nothing more than do the same things day to day. They don't take their work home with them, There are no big projects that last an entire week, month, sometimes year that they are responsible for, and they are not responsible for the benefits and failures of the entire company. Celebrities and Athletes are another issue entirely, the reason they are paid so much isn't because of the companies, it isn't because of their responsibilities, and it isn't because they do or don't contribute to society. We, the consumers, are the ones to blame, the more famous a person becomes the more people pay to see them. It is because of us that they gain so much money, it is because of us that companies are able to market them, and it is because of us that they are famous. In a sense you can say they contribute to society as a whole, a lot more than an average person, because they are able to influence for better or worse, a lot more people than someone who isn't well known. |
KamiCityJun 16, 2015 10:02 PM
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| Gil is right that nowadays that are lots of people who aren't doing much. This is especially true in cities. Where Gil is wrong is that he derives human worth based on whether or not they're doing something he thinks is valuable. If someone is not working, that doesn't make them less of a human. |
bobzanny said: Gil is a goddamn psychopath. That being said he is right to an extent that there are some pretty worthless people out in the world and that something does need to be done about it. Mass Genocide probably is the best way to go about that. But I do respect Gil, in a sense, that he's willing to get shit done to see a new world. You are completely wrong is so many ways. I don't think this question should be posed on an anime thread where the majority of people are young teens (I assume). No one can dictate what is worthless. Someone can become a genius or discover something amazing later in life. An individuals potential never stops. Using this retarded argument we should kill all babies/children as they don't benefit or are useful at their age. Just such a stupid argument and Gilgamesh is a naive manchild and I don't get how anyone can think he's this super clever wise edgemachine who knows what changes the world needs. |
SaintEmiya said: Insertanamehere said: Well he's right that there are more people who contribute little to society, but mass genocide is most assuredly not the right way to go about fixing it. That said, the whole decline of man thing is tied into more general Nasuverse themes leading to the endtimes and eschatological things like that, so he is in fact objectively correct, within the series, that humanity has declined (hoh) compared to the people of his time. You make a point but the OP is referring to our world (I assume) due to his mentioning of people being replacable etc. Right, my point was he shouldn't really apply what Gil says about the fictional setting to the real world. |
SaintEmiya said: bobzanny said: Gil is a goddamn psychopath. That being said he is right to an extent that there are some pretty worthless people out in the world and that something does need to be done about it. Mass Genocide probably is the best way to go about that. But I do respect Gil, in a sense, that he's willing to get shit done to see a new world. You are completely wrong is so many ways. I don't think this question should be posed on an anime thread where the majority of people are young teens (I assume). No one can dictate what is worthless. Someone can become a genius or discover something amazing later in life. An individuals potential never stops. Using this retarded argument we should kill all babies/children as they don't benefit or are useful at their age. Just such a stupid argument and Gilgamesh is a naive manchild and I don't get how anyone can think he's this super clever wise edgemachine who knows what changes the world needs. The fuck is this shit? you can become a genius? You don't BECOME a genius, you are born a genius. You can acquire knowledge and become smarter, but there is a large difference between the ways extremely smart people and those who are "genius'" comprehend information and those of regular people. Discover something amazing in life? what? I would like for you to give me an example of where someone who had no prior record of being intelligent in some way suddenly became a "genius" and discovered some breakthrough in society. What you are saying is just wishful thinking on those who are born less fortunate than others. Anyone, in my opinion, can become an Engineer with enough willpower, studying, and learning. Only those born fortunate can be the next Albert Einstein. Again, naive statements coming from wishful thinking. Gilgamesh isn't super clever, i don't believe the guy is a genius. But he is right. again, I would love for you to give me an example of a homeless man who has never had a job or education becoming a genius and discovering something undiscovered before. The amount of "What ifs" you are pulling out are more than this animes asspulls. |
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TheUnknownMerc said: -Snip- *shakes head* It's sad that nowdays their are still people who think like that. |
| There's no point in reasoning with you UnknownMerc. Enjoy your view of the world. I'm going to enjoy being happy and optimistic :). |
| He should tell that to President Xi. |
#CHEXIT |
Shrimperor said: TheUnknownMerc said: -Snip- *shakes head* It's sad that nowdays their are still people who think like that. Still think like that? point me to an example that disproves my statements? Why? Should everyone think "everyone is a special snowflake who has a purpose in life and is someone who is important." Pretty much exactly the reason why we have entitled little shits growing up thinking that just by existing they have the right to money, a house, a job, a car, and respect. Not knowing that without qualification and a good attitude you won't get a job, and without a job you won't get money, a car, a house unless your parents spoon feed you...but then you aren't getting that through your own abilities are you? And self entitled people definitely don't earn their respect. SaintEmiya said: There's no point in reasoning with you UnknownMerc. Enjoy your view of the world. I'm going to enjoy being happy and optimistic :). Reasoning? I gave you a rebuttal, this is a discussion, discuss. If you aren't ready to back up your statements then you aren't discussing anything, you are merely stating thoughts without proof. My view isn't a happy go lucky view, it's a pretty factual view. I'm not saying that people who are useless can't be happy, but this isn't a discussion on whether or not these people should or can be happy. It's "Do you agree with what Gilgamesh said about mankind not having a purpose in life in the modern age because of overpopulation?" Do I agree that there are people who have literally no other purpose other than to exist? not to further anyone's lives or humanity as a whole but to just exist and do nothing? yes i do. Do i believe they should be happy? I don't really care, but my point still stands that there are people who are completely useless to not only society but to any individual. |
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TheUnknownMerc said: Shrimperor said: *shakes head* It's sad that nowdays their are still people who think like that. Still think like that? point me to an example that disproves my statements? Why? Should everyone think "everyone is a special snowflake who has a purpose in life and is someone who is important." Pretty much exactly the reason why we have entitled little shits growing up thinking that just by existing they have the right to money, a house, a job, a car, and respect. Not knowing that without qualification and a good attitude you won't get a job, and without a job you won't get money, a car, a house unless your parents spoon feed you...but then you aren't getting that through your own abilities are you? And self entitled people definitely don't earn their respect. SaintEmiya said: There's no point in reasoning with you UnknownMerc. Enjoy your view of the world. I'm going to enjoy being happy and optimistic :). Reasoning? I gave you a rebuttal, this is a discussion, discuss. If you aren't ready to back up your statements then you aren't discussing anything, you are merely stating thoughts without proof. My view isn't a happy go lucky view, it's a pretty factual view. I'm not saying that people who are useless can't be happy, but this isn't a discussion on whether or not these people should or can be happy. It's "Do you agree with what Gilgamesh said about mankind not having a purpose in life in the modern age because of overpopulation?" Do I agree that there are people who have literally no other purpose other than to exist? not to further anyone's lives or humanity as a whole but to just exist and do nothing? yes i do. Do i believe they should be happy? I don't really care, but my point still stands that there are people who are completely useless to not only society but to any individual. You aren't saying facts. My point is that you can decide who is useless. You simply can't. Everyone has a different view on what is useless and that is indisputable. Also you can never say who doesn't have potential or not or dictate what their future will consist of. And a person becomes a genius when they are recognised as one, they aren't always a genius because they aren't recognised as a genius since birth. It's pretty simple. Everything I have said is true. But you're too busy trying to be edgy that nothing is getting through into your head. I'm done with this. If you still haven't gotten the message then you're hopeless. |
| Most people will only ever be unremarkable and average, but then the label of "average person" wouldn't exist if the majority wasn't like that. Of course, the value of people who are designated as an ordinary person are subjective, and who has the right to determine if someone is useless enough to be removed from this world? Who's standard of worthiness shall be used and how should it be determined? "Uselessness" is also just one among many temporary states that a human transitions in and out of. Someone useless today may be useful tomorrow, and someone useful today may be useless tomorrow. Until someone has concluded their existence, there's no telling exactly how much worth they can provide, which again is subjective itself. Every human that exists is a +1 to the glory counter of humanity, signifying that such a successful birth and sustained survival was possible. The innovators, the creators, those who humanity hold in high esteem, certainly they can be said to have worth. But, even those who never accomplish anything of worth still have their roles to play. If anything, they serve to act as reaffirmation that the accomplishments were indeed deserving of that label, whether in using the product, giving high recognition to the achiever, or through other means. For those where just simply surviving is the primary concern, the fact that they have testifies of their ability. Humanity has continually improved and innovated, and overall has continued to progress forward. The current level of humanity's excess, abundance, and comfort are only possible because of those things, and they are a symbol of our greatness. A world without enough people to play the role of uselessness (without leading to a collapse of civilization) is a world that has yet to be conquered, but we have and thus our collective prosperity and glory. |
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TheUnknownMerc said: The fuck is this shit? you can become a genius? You don't BECOME a genius, you are born a genius. You can acquire knowledge and become smarter, but there is a large difference between the ways extremely smart people and those who are "genius'" comprehend information and those of regular people. There is no set definition to what a genius is, besides subjective standards. Define Genius for me? Given most standard definitions it just means being exceptional at something, you know like a genius guitarist, a genius soccer player, or a genius in physics. Is it IQ tests that define a genius? You do realize they're biased right. Take a psychology course, they'll all say the same thing. IQ tests depend on your environment, you don't give someone from Japan the same test as someone from the U.S. Their is too much difference in culture and you won't get an accurate reading on their intelligence. Geniuses aren't born, they're raised. The major deciding factor is their environment. Sure genetics give some people advantages, but that doesn't mean that others can't catch up. Plus your claims are a highly debated topic between most intellectual philosophers, are you claiming you know what they don't? There is no facts here, it's a highly subjective topic which scholars can't agree on. If you have proof, by all means go publish it, show your proof in a scholarly journal if you have the answer, i'm sure you will be recognized. Discover something amazing in life? what? I would like for you to give me an example of where someone who had no prior record of being intelligent in some way suddenly became a "genius" and discovered some breakthrough in society. How about Albert Einstein? Couldn't even make the entrance exams at the age of 16, with the exception of being good at math and physics, everything else he failed. It should also be noted that he was taught a lot more than others, getting extra lessons, from an early age, which shows once again that geniuses are raised not born. He was thought to be lazy and sloppy, he didn't even talk until he was 3 years old according to reports. It wasn't until Max Talmund introduced him to physics that he got interested, and started researching and learning. It wasn't because he was "born a genius" it was because he found an interest and started working at it. Even then it wasn't until Einstein turned 20+ years that he became the genius that is now known. So in reality, if it wasn't for Einstein befriending Max when he did, he would have never started researching and learning about physics, he would have never wrote the essays that "changed the view of the world" and he would have never become the genius he became. What you are saying is just wishful thinking on those who are born less fortunate than others. By born fortunate you mean with more access to resources right? Since that is the ONLY factor that can stop someone from reaching their potential. Their environment, the way they are raised, the things they are taught. That's how people become something. Anyone, in my opinion, can become an Engineer with enough willpower, studying, and learning. Only those born fortunate can be the next Albert Einstein. No matter the genius you name, hard work, research, and willpower, always factor into the equation. Since you keep saying "name someone" I'll ask you this, name a person a genius, who revolutionized something without those three 3. Show me a born genius that never had to work for it. I would love for you to give me an example of a homeless man who has never had a job or education becoming a genius and discovering something undiscovered before. The amount of "What ifs" you are pulling out are more than this animes asspulls. Ever heard of Walter Pitts? Not only was he a homeless runaway, he became a self taught genius. He spent his time at a chicago university, at the age of 15 and without registering as a student, just because he wanted to learn. He taught himself by spending hours at the library and learning. He wasn't born a genius, he wasn't born smart, he worked to be one. He gained knowledge, he exploited resources, he worked for what he received.Should everyone think "everyone is a special snowflake who has a purpose in life and is someone who is important. Everyone has potential, that doesn't mean everyone is special. Learn the difference, in fact no one is special. You are the one claiming that some people are born "special." You are the one claiming that some people don't have to work for what they earn, that they are somehow given all the knowledge in the world on a silver platter. No, hard work is what draws out potential. Your statements are those of the lazy, that feel that some people were born with an advantage and everyone else just quit because they'll never be able to reach them. |
KamiCityJun 17, 2015 3:04 PM
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| Gilgamesh is a spoiled petulant child that was never taught how to play fair with the other kids on the block growing up. His views are juvenile and egotistical, and he deserves every bit of the reaming he is about to get in the next couple episodes. I only wish the VN better-conveyed Gil getting super butthurt at a lowly mongrel beating his pampered asshole. It's truly poetic justice. |
kingcity20 said: Oh for the love of -_- nvm gotta love MAL |
j0x said: KamiCity said: hard work is what draws out potential this is your point all along but not every hardwork is rewarded and not everyone has the potential society with capitalism for example determines who contributes more and who contributes less or be useless, i know you know this too since you mention the environment is what determines a genius and much of the environment we have today is about money/capitalism KamiCity said: Your statements are those of the lazy, that feel that some people were born at an advantage and everyone else just quit because they'll become something. In fact, it is people like YOU that Gil is pissed off at. People that don't want to work hard for things, because they'll "never be special." i do not think that statement is for the lazy, i for example would like to work again if i my sick brain allows me too, im mentally disabled (schizophrenic) for 4 years now so the amount of stress i put into work is triple to quadruple of my coworkers and it overwhelmed me not everyone gets what they deserve, if you do not agree then you think the world is fair and you like victim blaming (blaming the poor or violence victim for example) which says more about this - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Just-world_hypothesis Once again who are you to decide who has potential. It's literally unknown how much potential someone has. |
j0x said: Except those tests literally mean nothing, IQ tests aren't going to impress a law firm, they aren't going to impress a business, and most psychologist thing they're flawed.like i said society today decides that, we have tests for example of IQ and EQ and even aptitude tests that recognize who will succeed, and this tests especially the aptitude tests are part of the employee requirements of many companies, do you have experience working already? if so there is a high chance you encountered this already during a job interview process what makes you think that society today do not divide people base on their potential or abilities anyway? why do we even have class sections in schools for example if all students have potential according to the needs of society your previous replies in this thread shows you like victim blaming, blaming the poor or unfortunate for example because of the assumption that they are lazy where in fact there are many factors like bad luck affecting a persons success or contribution to society No one is blaming the poor for not succeeding, we're blaming the people that say "the poor can't succeed." It is you people who are stating "oh people who are poor, can't succeed." People with disabilities can't succeed. Oh by the way there are many signs that show that Einstein, da vinci, and others could have been Dyslexic. |
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j0x said: KamiCity said: Except those tests literally mean nothing, IQ tests aren't going to impress a law firm, they aren't going to impress a business, and most psychologist thing they're flawed. No one is blaming the poor for not succeeding, we're blaming the people that say "the poor can't succeed." It is you people who are stating "oh people who are poor, can't succeed." People with disabilities can't succeed. Oh by the way there are many signs that show that Einstein, da vinci, and others could have been Dyslexic. but it is true statistically that much of the poor cannot succeed, just look at how many poor countries there are compared to the rich countries, and this poor countries are overpopulated, its like we are repeating the same arguments previously i do not know if you read about this recent news but more than half (if i recall right) of the global wealth is only owned by the 1% of the world population your examples are the minority if you look at statistics, another example just how many schizophrenics like me do you think can succeed and contribute to society heck i cannot even take care of myself a lot of times and you think that im just being lazy? when in fact one of the symptoms is lack of motivation? and about the IQ test i agree, but im just showing it as an example of tests that society invented to filter out who is useless or not Let me stop you there and explain why that statistic, despite being widely propagated, is highly misleading. http://blogs.reuters.com/felix-salmon/2014/04/04/stop-adding-up-the-wealth-of-the-poor/ tl;dr, they're looking solely at net worth (assets - debts), which means the poorest people are not those in the slums in india; it's people with shitloads of student loans or credit card debt. The net worth of the "poorest" people is negative. When a huge chunk of the world's population has negative net worth, you require far fewer people to hold half the world's "wealth" |
j0x said: but it is true statistically that much of the poor cannot succeed, just look at how many poor countries there are compared to the rich countries, and this poor countries are overpopulated, its like we are repeating the same arguments previously i do not know if you read about this recent news but more than half (if i recall right) of the global wealth is only owned by the 1% of the world population your examples are the minority if you look at statistics, another example just how many schizophrenics like me do you think can succeed and contribute to society heck i cannot even take care of myself a lot of times and you think that im just being lazy? when in fact one of the symptoms is lack of motivation? and about the IQ test i agree, but im just showing it as an example of tests that society invented to filter out who is useless or not What exactly does any of that have to do with their potential though? That outside factor "for example their environment" altered their success rate? Isn't that exactly what i've been saying? It isn't that they don't have the potential to succeed, it's that something is impeding them. Even then, people still make it out of poorer countries. Sure they have to work harder, but unless they work harder they'll never succeed. As for schizophrenia, you have to look at society as a whole. Only 0.3 to 0.7 percent of adults suffer from schizophrenia attacks in their lifetime, and it's an even smaller percentage have repetitive attacks which alter their lifestyle. Even then medication helps with that, so for the most part most people with schizophrenia could function pretty well in socieity. It is an extremely small and unlucky percentage that can't, which you seem to fall under. That percentage in statistics is called an outlier, a very small percentage that fall out of the curve. So yes, there are some people that might not be able to succeed even through hard work, but very few fall under that percentage. I've studied enough psychology to know this, plus I have Adhd so I fall under the "disabilities" catagory also. Graduated highschool with a 1.9 GPA, in university though I have yet to have a semester under a 3.3 GPA. I started working harder, and I saw more results, even with a disability. |
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| The only technical word I used was net worth, and I explained what it was; it's your total assets minus your total debts. it's not that hard >.> |
j0x said: You keep calling them useless, I have yet to see anyone except you state that they can't function in society. I'll give you some statistics in how much people recover.as far as i know 1% of the world population has schizophrenia, and antipsychotics works only in 50% of the schizophrenia cases, which im lucky that neuroleptics work on me but it still did not help me from having a decent life since it cannot totally remove my psychosis when im stress out at work, stress triggers my insanity, but my point is not to show how statistically low schizophrenia is but to show to you how many schizophrenics can still have a decent life, among schizophrenics how many of the sufferers can contribute to society? thats my point, and also to show that mental illness is another factor limiting free will (even though free will is an illusion but a good one) or freedom of choice even if we come up with the total of that 1% of the world population thats still 70 million people and add all other physical and mental disabilities as well as the number of poor people or people not living in developed countries then i say thats a lot of so called useless people or less contributors to society that todays society claims 25% Completely Recover 25% Much Improved, relatively independent 25% Improved, but require extensive support network 15% Hospitalized, unimproved 10% Dead (Mostly Suicide) That means that out of 1% of the population, only 25% actually fail to improve themselves. Meaning that it's a very small percentage of people who don't improve. That also means 75% of them can potentially contribute to society, 50% of those should be able to function almost normally. good for you, want to trade situations? i will get your ADHD and you will get my insanity? /joke Does Schizophrenia qualify as insanity? I'm not sure it does, since most people with Schizophrenia can still use reasoning. Anyway I get it, haha joke.but like my previous example, among all the ADHD people how many are as successful as you? For the most part it is very high, i'd also have to point out that ADHD is a lot more common. I think it's up to 15% of the population gets diagnosed with ADHD/ADD.What we've been trying to tell you is that having a disability =/= no potential to be successful. Statistics show that there is a high chance for success. |
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| I partly agree with the part of most of us having no purpose or a higher goal because there's simply that many of us, but obviously cutting down the population is not a solution lol. Although, if I had a solution I wouldn't be posting on MAL and would be winning Nobel Prizes like a motherfucker wouldn't I? Same goes for all of you people. btw off-topic, ADHD is make-believe disorder for spoiled brats that are lazy. faking americans. |
| I love my gurlz |
Zeus4President said: btw off-topic, ADHD is make-believe disorder for spoiled brats that are lazy. faking americans. Except i'm not lazy, and i'm a high overachiever. Come at me. Plus Do you even know what Adhd is? You know, not being able to pay attention to one thing at a time, being constantly on the move, and doing things on impulse. Isn't that the opposite of lazy? Plus my ability to mutlitask is off the charts, i'm constantly doing 3 things at once. Looks like someone was to lazy to do research... oh the irony j0x said: i maybe bias since i have tried numerous times but i resign a lot of times since i cannot cope up and why is it that few succeed while many fail then, i even just recently made a thread about it - http://myanimelist.net/forum/?topicid=1395995 and schizophrenia is not insanity to you? what defines insanity in psychology then i wonder Depends on what you define as success, looking at statistics it seems that more than 50% succeed. Unless success only means becoming wealthy and not living a normal and good life. Insanity is hard to define, it usually means severely mentally ill, irrational, and not being able to reason properly. |
KamiCityJun 18, 2015 4:35 AM
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KamiCity said: Zeus4President said: btw off-topic, ADHD is make-believe disorder for spoiled brats that are lazy. faking americans. Except i'm not lazy, and i'm a high overachiever. Come at me. Plus Do you even know what Adhd is? You know, not being able to pay attention to one thing at a time, being constantly on the move, and doing things on impulse. Isn't that the opposite of lazy? Plus my ability to mutlitask is off the charts, i'm constantly doing 3 things at once. Looks like someone was to lazy to do research... oh the irony Meh. You clearly do have the make-believe disorder since you're incapable to understand what I meant. |
| I love my gurlz |
j0x said: i googled about "schizophrenia and employment rate" and i get this http://www.bps.org.uk/news/work-foundation-publishes-report-people-schizophrenia-and-employment that is from UK alone but im sure schizophrenia is one of the leading disability world wide even google says so http://www.schizophrenia.com/szfacts.htm here is from WHO or World Health Organization Worldwide, schizophrenia is associated with considerable disability and may affect educational and occupational performance. http://www.who.int/mediacentre/factsheets/fs397/en/ that adds up to my knowledge about my suffering too Umm I'm pretty sure depression and anxiety are the 2 leading mental disorders. Depression 19% of americans Anxiety 27% of americans Employment rates for mental disabilities is kind of hard to calculate, since most people wouldn't say they have a disability when being employed. Other than that, you are right employment rates are pretty low. I wonder if that is after recovering or during though. Zeus4President said: ???Meh. You clearly do have the make-believe disorder since you're incapable to understand what I meant. |
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| Kami just stop, they want to keep their edgy view of the world. |
| Showing achievements in subjects but failing at others, like say a person who can do nothing academic but can paint masterpieces or a person who can't do anything socially, but is amazing at math/physics/science (not all, one is fine) is different from someone who literally can't do anything. Ever heard of Walter Pitts? Not only was he a homeless runaway, he became a self taught genius. He spent his time at a chicago university, at the age of 15 and without registering as a student, just because he wanted to learn. He taught himself by spending hours at the library and learning. He wasn't born a genius, he wasn't born smart, he worked to be one. He gained knowledge, he exploited resources, he worked for what he received. Except he displayed desire to learn and improve, different from lets say, the same person deciding to stay on the streets for 5-10 years. I'm also claiming that there are indeed people who see the world quite differently. Their ability to learn, retain information, and put pieces together are a step above normal people. Naturally with this, it isn't something you can learn to this degree. They are special. Other can become smart through hard work, practice, and desire to learn. I'm talking about the people who do nothing with their lives other than eat, sleep and leech off of other people to allow them to continue living yet still think they are important people. this is your point all along but not every hardwork is rewarded and not everyone has the potential society with capitalism for example determines who contributes more and who contributes less or be useless, i know you know this too since you mention the environment is what determines a genius and much of the environment we have today is about money/capitalism Quite right, Capitalism is a great idea and, in concept, a great plan. Problem is human greed and we all know how this turns out (russia...) like i said society today decides that, we have tests for example of IQ and EQ and even aptitude tests that recognize who will succeed, and this tests especially the aptitude tests are part of the employee requirements of many companies, do you have experience working already? if so there is a high chance you encountered this already during a job interview process what makes you think that society today do not divide people base on their potential or abilities anyway? why do we even have class sections in schools for example if all students have potential according to the needs of society, why do we need to filter out students/professionals base on who pass the licensure exams as another example your previous replies in this thread shows you like victim blaming, blaming the poor or unfortunate for example because of the assumption that they are lazy when in fact there are many factors like bad luck affecting a persons success or contribution to society Love it. As for the ADHD topic, so what? You make it out like ADHD is such a burden. Want to know what i a was told when i was a kid? "ADHD isn't real" "Don't use ADHD as an excuse." You all seem to be still not understanding what i'm saying. when a person gets into their adult age and still has done nothing with their life from the moment they are born until adult hood. Has not shown any promise in doing anything at all (kami for you, albert einstein could still fucking do work, he just sucked at other stuff, doesn't mean he hadn't shown promise). I see i am talking to the most special of snowflakes who believe everyone can change the world because everyone has that potential...wrong, but whatever, believe it. I feel entirely sad for generations to come. I've talked to multiple professors over the years, every one of them said that each year the students just keep getting stupider and stupider. They continuously have to dumb down the courses because the students "can't handle it." |
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| Pretty sure people don't "decide" to stay on the streets for years. And your idiocy has shown itself. Never did we say everyone has the potential to change the world. We simply said you can't decide who is useless or not, or who will forever be useless for the rest of your life. Unfortunately you're a fucking idiot who can't read. |
SaintEmiya said: Pretty sure people don't "decide" to stay on the streets for years. And your idiocy has shown itself. Never did we say everyone has the potential to change the world. We simply said you can't decide who is useless or not, or who will forever be useless for the rest of your life. Unfortunately you're a fucking idiot who can't read. And this just shows that you yourself are ignorant of the world and what goes on in society. There are in fact people who CHOOSE to be on the streets, this is why in my original arguement i stated those people who are on the streets for actual reasons. You thinking that people don't "decide" to stay on the streets for years just shows how ignorant you are. There are actually plenty of people who stay on the streets trying to "con" others out of money with sympathy cards and bullshit lies. They stay on the streets, in busy business areas in downtown cities because they make a decent amount of "money" by literally sitting their doing nothing. but go ahead, tell me i'm wrong, i would love that. Tell me to give you examples, i would love that as well. And yes you indirectly did when you stated constantly that "An individuals potential never stops. " among other ignorant phrases you've used with potential in the sentence. By stating the potential never stops that means everyone has the potential to "change the world" being the pinnacle of potential usefulness. But they do not...but continue for arguments sake. |
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TheUnknownMerc said: SaintEmiya said: Pretty sure people don't "decide" to stay on the streets for years. And your idiocy has shown itself. Never did we say everyone has the potential to change the world. We simply said you can't decide who is useless or not, or who will forever be useless for the rest of your life. Unfortunately you're a fucking idiot who can't read. And this just shows that you yourself are ignorant of the world and what goes on in society. There are in fact people who CHOOSE to be on the streets, this is why in my original arguement i stated those people who are on the streets for actual reasons. You thinking that people don't "decide" to stay on the streets for years just shows how ignorant you are. And yes you indirectly did when you stated constantly that "An individuals potential never stops. " among other ignorant phrases you've used with potential in the sentence. By stating the potential never stops that means everyone has the potential to "change the world" being the pinnacle of potential usefulness. But they do not...but continue for arguments sake. Well everyone has potential, and you are not god and you can't decide who has potential or who doesn't. This is what the argument comes down to. However if you do truly believe that the world would be better with another genocide then please, I hope you experience it personally :). You're just an example of kids being brought up in a world with only comfort and therefore you have no humanity or empathy. So sad. |
| Not that I want to get involved in this, but people deliberately not taking a job and just living off unemployment benefits when they are perfectly capable of working is a thing that does happen. |
Insertanamehere said: Not that I want to get involved in this, but people deliberately not taking a job and just living off unemployment benefits when they are perfectly capable of working is a thing that does happen. Sadly, yeah. Doesn't mean they should be killed ._. |
Insertanamehere said: Not that I want to get involved in this, but people deliberately not taking a job and just living off unemployment benefits when they are perfectly capable of working is a thing that does happen. Never said it doesn't. But literally everyone is ignoring the point that you CAN'T DECIDE WHAT SOMEONE WILL DO IN THEIR FUTURE OR WHAT POTENTIAL THEY HAVE. It's not difficult. Regardless, if you truly think killing all these people is a viable solution then please check yourself into a mental hospital as you are a psychopath. |
| Yes I'm not saying they should, but he said that doesn't happen which isn't true. |
Shrimperor said: Insertanamehere said: Not that I want to get involved in this, but people deliberately not taking a job and just living off unemployment benefits when they are perfectly capable of working is a thing that does happen. Sadly, yeah. Doesn't mean they should be killed ._. Can't blunt the edge on these kids though. |
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