GARBrotato said: You forgot edgy. You are right, I added it and some same similar words. |
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GARBrotato said: TheIMF said: Nope.The original source material is like the ultimate self-insert story to appeal to socially stunted teenagers and young adults. TheIMF said: And nope; people seriously overrate Ufotable's animation. That, or they confuse animation with style.The anime has production values comparable to the GDP of a small country and spends generous portions on incredibly animated fights featuring some pretty cool looking characters. TheIMF said: And nope.And, duh, it's about an ancient, clandestine mage war. Dragon_Slayer_X said: TheIMF said: The original source material is like the ultimate self-insert story to appeal to socially stunted teenagers and young adults. We are so sorry that you are such an mature adult who couldn't self insert and come here whining about it like a little kid. Seriously try harder to troll without buzzwords and childish excuses. I see I've struck a cord with the both of you. I'd like you to re-read my post again, but this time without feeling as though every single reason I've listed is a personal attack against you specifically. If you can do that, then you should be able to realise that 1. this type of story does in fact appeal to fans of self-inserts wanting to engage in narcissistic escapism 2. to a lot of people, superb animation and badass characters will always compensate for poor storytelling 3. the concept of a mage war will never not be badass, or at the very least interesting |
| Those threads always turns edgy |
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Grey-Zone said: "self-insert" (alternating between reader self-insert and writer self-insert whenever it is convenient), "wish-fulfillment", "generic", "bland", "edgy", "dark", "mature", "asspull" and "Dues Ex Machina" are the current trendy buzzwords. I think it's safe to ignore any arguments that have any of thsoe words in them. And I think it's safe to assume that anyone who flatout denies that self-inserts appeal to anyone is probably the time of person that wishes they were like Kirigaya Kirito and Kaizuka Inaho in real life. WrongPriest said: If there's one thing I affiliate with the fate franchise it's defiantly not "superb animation" lol Although funnily enough I seem to take offence at someone insinuating I'm a fan of self-inserts wanting to engage in narcissistic escapism. I'm sorry if that wasn't your intention. By comparison to the vast majority of anime out there, the Fate franchise undoubtedly has superb animation. It's like the most consistent source of praise for it. At no point did I insinuate you (or anyone else in particular) like Fate/stay night because you are a fan of self-inserts. I stated fan of self-inserts will likely be a fan of Fate/stay night. That's what some would call an important distinction. |
faderunnerApr 5, 2015 11:23 AM
| Wasn't offended. I am aware of pt 2, what I am saying is that Ufo's animation isn't superb. As for 3, that's the setting, not what the stories are about. In your previous post you are still wrong, but I guess if what you wanted to say is that people find this setting appealing then sure I guess, won't argue against that; it's what kept me from dropping DEENight well, that and Archer of course. |
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TheIMF said: By comparison to the vast majority of anime out there, the Fate franchise undoubtedly has superb animation So, Deen anime had superb animation? Haha, lel Please |
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| I doubt anyone would want to be Inaho tbh. The dude doesn't smile much, must have a crappy life. |
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Dragon_Slayer_X said: Nope i still see another troll post laden with some popular buzzwords trying to look like an elitist. So is troll a shorthand for "opinion I don't agree with," and buzzword a shorthand for "I don't know what this means"? There is absolutely nothing elitist about anything I've posted. GARBrotato said: Wasn't offended. I am aware of pt 2, what I am saying is that Ufo's animation isn't superb. As for 3, that's the setting, not what the stories are about. In your previous post you are still wrong, but I guess if what you wanted to say is that people find this setting appealing then sure I guess, won't argue against that; it's what kept me from dropping DEENight well, that and Archer of course. I'm okay with agreeing to disagreeing if you are. Praland said: So, Deen anime had superb animation? Haha, lel Please Do you know what a strawman fallacy is? |
WrongPriest said: Do VNs even have animation?Praland said: So, Deen anime had superb animation? Haha, lel Please This is what I was talking about lol And the animation in the VN was pretty basic too Besides OPs, obviously.. |
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| The wider nasuverse is very interesting. I admit I watched fate/zero when it was coming out and I really like it. A few years later (when I found out about the nasuverse as a whole) I watched kara no kyoukai and OMG it was amazing. I had been waiting for the fate/stay night anime but at that point I didn't the know the routes they where adapting, so I read the VN. The visual novel really is great, the characters are interesting and the world building is top notch. I am a big fan of fantasy stories and kara no kyoukai turned me into a big fan of urban fantasy. The nasuverse is the urban fantasy anime/VN/LN capital (correct me if I am wrong). |
 Anime is good, fucking deal with it. |
WrongPriest said: TheIMF said: Do you know what a strawman fallacy is? This thread poses the question as to why the franchise is so popular. I think it's safe to assume we're not just talking about 2 Ufotable adaptations here. I figured that was the disconnect. The superb animation comment was obviously in respect of the anime. The OP doesn't specificy the visual novels in particular, it asks why the franchise is popular, of which the anime is a part of. |
WrongPriest said: Yeah but there's been Before Ufotable even aired Zero, and that's just Fate not other type-moon works. So the anime you speak of is a very small, very recent part of the franchise. So what makes fate so popular? Must be a ton of self insert fans out there with figma money that's for sure. Zero began airing late 2011, that's hardly recent. I listed a number of reasons why the franchise is popular. The animation quality is just one of them. I'm not sure how you're struggling to get this. |
TheIMF said: WrongPriest said: Yeah but there's been Before Ufotable even aired Zero, and that's just Fate not other type-moon works. So the anime you speak of is a very small, very recent part of the franchise. So what makes fate so popular? Must be a ton of self insert fans out there with figma money that's for sure. Zero began airing late 2011, that's hardly recent. I listed a number of reasons why the franchise is popular. The animation quality is just one of them. I'm not sure how you're struggling to get this. Because the franchise didnt started in 2011 (it started in 2004, those are 7 years ) and before that hardly "animation quality" is a reason for it's popularity. |
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Praland said: Because the franchise didnt started in 2011 (it started in 2004, those are 7 years ) and before that hardly "animation quality" is a reason for it's popularity. You do know popularity isn't static, don't you? The franchise became more popular in part due to the animation quality of the latest adaptations and the subsequent interest and hype. |
TheIMF said: And I think it's safe to assume than anyone flatout denies that self-inserts don't appeal to anyone is probably the time of person that wishes they were like Kirigaya Kirito and Kaizuka Inaho in real life. That may apply to some. Take note however that when making accusations like "self-insert" or "wish-fulfillment" you cannot take specific scenes out of context. When people are using those words I often see a trend where the "bad" or "alien" parts of a supposed self-insert/wish-fulfillment character is intentionally ignored to make the own argument more credible. But if one does that then you could literally label ANY character (aside from "constant loser" characters) as a "self-insert/wish-fulfillment character". If you want to make the claim you must also take care to take the negative and unrelatable experiences into consideration. Calling the MC of One-punch-man a self-insert/wish-fulfillment character would be something I consider as invalid, as most of the people who would want to be in his shoes would not actually train their body like him, neither would they be able to pull off his "not giving a single sh*t" attitude. In other words using the labels for a character who's behaviour and mentality is too "alien" or unlikable does not work that well. On the other hand you can perfectly use the labels for characters that just have random things happenening around them, although they are "normal" people. That is even actually the reason they are depicted as "normal". For example the MC from to-love-ru. Spineless, weak-willed and "normal", BUT he gets surrounded by countless of girls despite that. THAT is where I would consider those labels to be legitimate. Of course there is always that one pitfall, where you have to make a difference between "self-insert characters" and "relatable characters". On another forum someone said "if you like it, it's relatable, if you hate it, it's self-insert". That's probably the main reason why I don't like this particuar label. |
Grey-ZoneApr 5, 2015 10:51 AM
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Rance-sama said: It's an over glorified porn game that doesn't even adapt the porn scenes. 0/10  |
TheIMF said: Praland said: Because the franchise didnt started in 2011 (it started in 2004, those are 7 years ) and before that hardly "animation quality" is a reason for it's popularity. You do know popularity isn't static, don't you? The franchise became more popular in part due to the animation quality of the latest adaptations and the subsequent interest and hype. Outside Japan yeah that's probably true, since a lot of people probably never considered reading the VN till they watched F/Z (I know I didn't). |
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GARBrotato said: TheIMF said: You do know popularity isn't static, don't you? The franchise became more popular in part due to the animation quality of the latest adaptations and the subsequent interest and hype. Outside Japan yeah that's probably true, since a lot of people probably never considered reading the VN till they watched F/Z (I know I didn't). Lancer is pretty OP. |
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TheIMF said: The original source material is like the ultimate self-insert story to appeal to socially stunted teenagers and young adults. The anime has high production values. Any piece of entertainment can be considered escapism, and that's not inherently bad. Agreed. The high production values, definitely has a big part in the popularity of those two anime. |
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tsudecimo said: TheIMF said: The original source material is like the ultimate self-insert story to appeal to socially stunted teenagers and young adults. The anime has high production values. Any piece of entertainment can be considered escapism, and that's not inherently bad. Agreed. The high production values, definitely has a big part in the popularity of those two anime. I don't know...Oregairu is popular in Japan and in some foruns, and the animation is a shit or very very weak... |
I am Hatedmainofanime. More no one. |
survivor_hero said: I don't know...Oregairu is popular in Japan and in some foruns, and the animation is a shit or very very weak... Uh.....no, it's around average. It's not shit, whatever else. |
Awry said: Of course he is.Lancer is pretty OP. Too bad there's no Fate route anime to help show that a little ;_; |
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| So for anyone who missed this amazing piece of information; Next ep 11/10 |
survivor_hero said: tsudecimo said: Any piece of entertainment can be considered escapism, and that's not inherently bad. Agreed. The high production values, definitely has a big part in the popularity of those two anime. I don't know...Oregairu is popular in Japan and in some foruns, and the animation is a shit or very very weak... Irrelevant and not my point. High production values, have an appeal. Some people are most likely to watch something, if it's known for great animation, or art. I did not mean, that something can't be popular if it doesn't have good animation. |
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Insertanamehere said: I seriously hope this is true.So for anyone who missed this amazing piece of information; Next ep 11/10 More mindfucks are always welcome. |
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Insertanamehere said: So for anyone who missed this amazing piece of information; Next ep 11/10 VN knowledge? |
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Awry said: Insertanamehere said: So for anyone who missed this amazing piece of information; Next ep 11/10 VN knowledge? No, from the prescreening. That....never happened in the VN. |
| I was going to make a point about a lot of the complaints being levied against the fate franchise, such as "Escapism", "Self-Insert", "Waifu-Pandering" and how they belie an insipid, almost arrogant ignorance of the style of storytelling and the medium from which Fate was spawned...but it's not worth my time. Instead, I'm just going to say that using ANY anime other than the DEEN one as a REASON for the popularity of the fate franchise is utterly, completely idiotic. The Fate franchise was already HUGE, not just in Japan but even in the west, for years before Ufotable worked on any TM anime. That success was why those anime were made - promoting an already huge franchise. Anyway, guys, should Shinji have any reason to be able to |
Kaixe-RhoApr 5, 2015 1:07 PM
Kaixe-Rho said: Anyway, guys, should Shinji have any reason to be able to No, he has no legitimate way to do it whatsoever, which is why it's hilarious(ly awesome). Also your spoiler's broken might wanna fix that. |
AmbiguousMonster said: For me, the themes and characters are the selling point. ^ |
| Has anyone said edgy yet? |
| "Let Justice Be Done!" My Theme Fight again, fight again for justice! |
RedRoseFring said: i think "ultimate self-insert fantasy" is the phrase now. makes sense. Tohno Shiki is the one of the best self-insert protags there is. i know whenever i walk into an alley way with dead bodies in it i start jizzing uncontrollably while screaming spaghetti.Has anyone said edgy yet? |
RedRoseFring said: Has anyone said edgy yet? Mickdrew did. |
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| saber is waifu material |
Valaskjalf said: saber is waifu material Not only her tho |
Forgetfulness said: Maloghurst said: Obviously. And how could you forget to mention getting angry at chairs and repeating the same two words like 25 times or something?i think "ultimate self-insert fantasy" is the phrase now. makes sense. Tohno Shiki is the one of the best self-insert protags there is. i know whenever i walk into an alley way with dead bodies in it i start jizzing uncontrollably while screaming spaghetti. IKR. When ever I see blonde women I just want to slice them up. I also have a sister fetish -_- |
Anime is good, fucking deal with it. |
black1blade said: You guys are just putting me off of Tsukihime.Forgetfulness said: Obviously. And how could you forget to mention getting angry at chairs and repeating the same two words like 25 times or something? IKR. When ever I see blonde women I just want to slice them up. I also have a sister fetish -_- Meh it's okay, I don't like VNs anyway, especially ones with no voices... |
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GARBrotato said: black1blade said: You guys are just putting me off of Tsukihime.IKR. When ever I see blonde women I just want to slice them up. I also have a sister fetish -_- Meh it's okay, I don't like VNs anyway, especially ones with no voices... >not reading Tsukihime stop being a tm pleb pls |
GARBrotato said: black1blade said: You guys are just putting me off of Tsukihime.IKR. When ever I see blonde women I just want to slice them up. I also have a sister fetish -_- Meh it's okay, I don't like VNs anyway, especially ones with no voices... It's great seriously. |
Anime is good, fucking deal with it. |
Insertanamehere said: With the pace TM shit is getting translated, I'd rather take my sweet time going through the novels/games/manga/etc.GARBrotato said: You guys are just putting me off of Tsukihime. Meh it's okay, I don't like VNs anyway, especially ones with no voices... >not reading Tsukihime stop being a tm pleb pls I don't want to run out of this shit; it's better than drugs ffs. black1blade said: B-b-but... But...It's great seriously. > Jizzing at dead bodies. > Having an urge to slice up blondes. > Sister fetish. Wtf... |
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GARBrotato said: Insertanamehere said: With the pace TM shit is getting translated, I'd rather take my sweet time going through the novels/games/manga/etc.>not reading Tsukihime stop being a tm pleb pls I don't want to run out of this shit; it's better than drugs ffs. black1blade said: B-b-but... But...It's great seriously. > Jizzing at dead bodies. > Having an urge to slice up blondes. > Sister fetish. Wtf... Shiki is really fucked up we are making it out to be worse than it is. |
Anime is good, fucking deal with it. |
GARBrotato said: With the pace TM shit is getting translated, I'd rather take my sweet time going through the novels/games/manga/etc. I don't want to run out of this shit; it's better than drugs ffs. It gets more and more antiquated as you wait though. B-b-but... But... > Jizzing at dead bodies. > Having an urge to slice up blondes. > Sister fetish. Wtf... That's what makes him great ( ͡° ͜ʖ ͡°) Though I will say all of those do actually have a legitimate explanation, it's just more fun to ignore it |
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