Syrup- said: Fullmetal89 said: What if the actual cost of making two different stories for this game was actually high enough that they had to 'milk' it? Also fuck there's no actual proof you need to buy both at all anyway.No,no,no,no. This is a game company trying to shamelessly milk a franchise for all it's worth. If you think they are doing this for any other reason than to maximize profits you are being delusional. Just wait and see. Chances are both will be worth the money in the end. I paid like $70 for SMT4 and then there's $40 DLC on top of that but I don't hear anybody bitching about it. Why did you pay $70 for SMT4? I got my copy for $49.99 at release. I'm guessing you imported it or your country charges more for games. I also bought the DLC for that game mostly because it's amazing for power leveling demons during your second playthrough. I get what you are saying and all but that's no excuse to split the game in two. You didn't see Xenoblade Chronicles split in two and that game could have easily be split into 3. From what I've read so far this reads as nothing more than a shameless money grab. It isn't just the split of the game into black and white. It's the DLC gating for the endings that really pisses me off. I would understand if this was something added post release or some kind of what if scenario. What they are doing is nothing more than locking up content behind pay walls. |
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| If you say so. But this is Nintendo so I'm going to wait and see what happens before whipping out the "IT'S ALL OVER, GAMING IS RUINED" cries. ps. Fullmetal89 said: I paid for the shitty artbook only to find a half assed attempt at a game guide included. Absolutely not worth the extra $20. Why did you pay $70 for SMT4? I got my copy for $49.99 at release. I'm guessing you imported it or your country charges more for games. I also bought the DLC for that game mostly because it's amazing for power leveling demons during your second playthrough. |
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Syrup- said: If you say so. But this is Nintendo so I'm going to wait and see what happens before whipping out the "IT'S ALL OVER, GAMING IS RUINED" cries. What's with that mentality? So you think it's better to quietly sit by until some overprized, horribly modeled game hits the shelves and its too late to make any drastic changes to it, instead of voicing our discontent in advance to maybe prevent it from happening in the first place? Just look at the Xbox One. Microsoft tried to push trough with some horrible additions to the console market, but people's early and extreme 'overreactions' made them give in a few months later and retract all of it. So I'm all for people shitting all over Nintendo for this one, hoping that they won't even consider pulling through with this/doing it again in future or becoming even worse. And no, Nintendo isn't some holy saint. If they think their fans can be easily milked then they will do it. |
JoekstarApr 2, 2015 11:16 AM
FunnyStory said: Syrup- said: If you say so. But this is Nintendo so I'm going to wait and see what happens before whipping out the "IT'S ALL OVER, GAMING IS RUINED" cries. What's with that mentality? So you think it's better to quietly sit by until some overprized, horribly modeled game hits the shelves and its too late to make any drastic changes to it, instead of voicing our discontent in advance to maybe prevent it from happening in the first place? Just look at the Xbox One. Microsoft tried to push trough with some horrible additions to the console market, but people's early and extreme 'overreactions' made them give in a few months later and retract all of it. So I'm all for people shitting all over Nintendo for this one, hoping that they won't even consider pulling through with this/doing it again in future or becoming even worse. And no, Nintendo isn't some holy saint. If they think their fans can be easily milked then they will do it. This argument applies to games where that is the actual scenario. When we got images of DmC, shit hit the fan. Fans pleaded for them to change it before it was too late, and it was actually at a time before it was too late. In fact, some changes were made, but they were too stubborn to change it completely. Now DMC is likely dead. When we got images of the new Fire Emblem, everything was peachy. We all felt "that looks like a good addition to the series". Just because one feature isn't as you expect doesn't mean the entirety of the fanbase is against it. It also doesn't mean it'll result in the death of the series. I'm not exactly excited about it being split into two games, but if two games means double the content of the average FE game, I will in fact be happy. If two games means ensuring the series continues forward, I'll be even happier. Even if it isn't all perfect, it doesn't look so bad that I'm going to regret buying the game. The truth is that Nintendo has a tendency to please their fans. Capcom has a tendency to disappoint their fans. The mentality of "give it a chance" or "wait to see what happens" is actually logical when there is actual logic behind it. |
FunnyStory said: So instead of seeing what they have planned for this game when we know little other than that the two copies are different in some ways, we're going to bitch about it and tell them to stop. Dunno, it just sounds like something that Nintendo wouldn't do. I don't care if they're capable of doing it, I think they're smarter than that. They want to try something new, I'm going to be for it.Syrup- said: If you say so. But this is Nintendo so I'm going to wait and see what happens before whipping out the "IT'S ALL OVER, GAMING IS RUINED" cries. What's with that mentality? So you think it's better to quietly sit by until some overprized, horribly modeled game hits the shelves and its too late to make any drastic changes to it, instead of voicing our discontent in advance to maybe prevent it from happening in the first place? Just look at the Xbox One. Microsoft tried to push trough with some horrible additions to the console market, but people's early and extreme 'overreactions' made them give in a few months later and retract all of it. So I'm all for people shitting all over Nintendo for this one, hoping that they won't even consider pulling through with this/doing it again in future or becoming even worse. And no, Nintendo isn't some holy saint. If they think their fans can be easily milked then they will do it. Screw me for being optimistic right? Fuck. edit: Thrashinuva said: It's pretty much this. I don't think Nintendo has let me down in this way, and yes they are certainly capable of doing it, but they've got a larger history of making things good, and making things BETTER after they release something if it is in some way a flop. The truth is that Nintendo has a tendency to please their fans. Capcom has a tendency to disappoint their fans. The mentality of "give it a chance" or "wait to see what happens" is actually logical when there is actual logic behind it. |
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| Hell I can't help but remember the reaction and shock of Wind Waker, and now it's a beloved title of the Zelda series. |
| That's different though. Those games you referenced are design decisions, this is a financial decision. "Let's change the aesthetics" can at least be seen as artistic experimentation. "Let's split a storyline into two games and lock the neutral route as DLC before we even publish the game" can be seen as ripping you the fuck off. |
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DoctorCaim said: Is it really a financial decision though? Do you have proof that they could fit both the games onto one cart without quality suffering and even the DLC too? That's different though. Those games you referenced are design decisions, this is a financial decision. Fire Emblem is one of Nintendo's best franchises. I don't understand why fanboys suddenly turn on Nintendo every time they try something new. That's Nintendo's thing, I thought people who have been playing since NES would realize that by now. |
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| They're releasing a "Special Edition" that cost twice the amount of a normal copy and contains both routes and the third route as well. There's your proof. They can store it into one copy but they're sticking to the money route. It's estimated to be $77. Buying a normal copy and getting the other route along with the third DLC costs $70. It's also available on release. This is day one DLC money laundering bullshit dude. |
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Thrashinuva said: When we got images of the new Fire Emblem, everything was peachy. We all felt "that looks like a good addition to the series". Just because one feature isn't as you expect doesn't mean the entirety of the fanbase is against it. It also doesn't mean it'll result in the death of the series. Haha, you call splitting the game in half to grab some extra cash of its fans a feature? They are cutting HALF THE DAMN STORY to sell it as extra DLC. On release day! Why couldn't they just add something different, a new plotline or something, instead of taking half the characters, story and exploration of both sides of this installment's conflict and locking it away, forcing people who want the full experience to not only pay extra, but also bother them with Nintendo's archaic online service. Maybe even forcing them to purchase a new SD card to download it all. Thrashinuva said: If two games means ensuring the series continues forward, I'll be even happier. Even if it isn't all perfect, it doesn't look so bad that I'm going to regret buying the game. But FE Awakening did great and ensured a future for the series without a cheap move like this. Syrup- said: DoctorCaim said: Is it really a financial decision though? Do you have proof that they could fit both the games onto one cart without quality suffering and even the DLC too? That's different though. Those games you referenced are design decisions, this is a financial decision. Fire Emblem is one of Nintendo's best franchises. I don't understand why fanboys suddenly turn on Nintendo every time they try something new. That's Nintendo's thing, I thought people who have been playing since NES would realize that by now. Yeah, haha. 'Trying something new'. You sound like they are implementing fresh features and gameplay elements, and not simply cutting a game into little pieces and selling it as Day1 DLC. Something countless other publishers have been criticized for, only that Nintendo is new to this kind off practice. Not that that didn't stop them from going all out right from the get-go. And btw you don't have to be a fanboy to see that somethings sounds really iffy about this announcement, and neither am I one. In fact I'm completely new to the Nintendo camp. I can agree that Nintendo has one of the more reassuring track records, but there's always a first for everything. |
FunnyStory said: I could say the same to you. You make it sound like Nintendo is an evil money grubbing company that needs more money so they're splitting a popular franchise in to two pieces to get top dollar. That's not how shit works.Syrup- said: Is it really a financial decision though? Do you have proof that they could fit both the games onto one cart without quality suffering and even the DLC too? Fire Emblem is one of Nintendo's best franchises. I don't understand why fanboys suddenly turn on Nintendo every time they try something new. That's Nintendo's thing, I thought people who have been playing since NES would realize that by now. Yeah, haha. 'Trying something new'. You sound like they are implementing fresh features and gameplay elements, and not simply cutting a game into little pieces and selling it as Day1 DLC. Something countless other publishers have been criticized for, only that Nintendo is new to this kind off practice. Not that that didn't stop them from going all out right from the get-go. And btw you don't have to be a fanboy to see that somethings sounds really iffy about this announcement, and neither am I one. In fact I'm completely new to the Nintendo camp. I can agree that Nintendo has one of the more reassuring track records, but there's always a first for everything. |
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| I don't have a problem with this as long as both games play different and have a unique plot. I don't want to see a Pokemon-concept in Fire Emblem. |
Syrup- said: FunnyStory said: I could say the same to you. You make it sound like Nintendo is an evil money grubbing company that needs more money so they're splitting a popular franchise in to two pieces to get top dollar. That's not how shit works.Yeah, haha. 'Trying something new'. You sound like they are implementing fresh features and gameplay elements, and not simply cutting a game into little pieces and selling it as Day1 DLC. Something countless other publishers have been criticized for, only that Nintendo is new to this kind off practice. Not that that didn't stop them from going all out right from the get-go. And btw you don't have to be a fanboy to see that somethings sounds really iffy about this announcement, and neither am I one. In fact I'm completely new to the Nintendo camp. I can agree that Nintendo has one of the more reassuring track records, but there's always a first for everything. Now you're just sounding like a blind fanboy. They struggled quite a bit this generation already, and their strong mobile division is also in an undeniable decline, and don't get me started on the WiiU. Just look at their new line-up of free-to-play, smartphone-esque games with micro transactions, their advance onto the smartphone market for some easy dollars. And no, this isn't one of those 'Nintendo is doomed'-speeches, but there's still some truth to it. And yes, that is how shit works. This is nothing but a business decision to maximize profit. Just compare what they are currently doing to say, CDProject RED and their Witcher 3. Or do you think that game should also be split into 5 different games, because it's massive in scope, there also lots of decisions to be made and a breaching story line. |
| It's kinda undeniable that they have the capacity to put the entire game, including it's other route + DLC, into one cartridge with their day one "Special Release". |
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Thrashinuva said: Hell I can't help but remember the reaction and shock of Wind Waker, and now it's a beloved title of the Zelda series. Wind Waker is a complete game though. |
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| Well, this is rather unexpected and unfortunate. I'll probably still end up buying it as I don't often play many video games and FE is a definite favorite, but if they continue to do this with future installments of FE or future game titles in general - I will most likely not purchase any more. That's a worst case scenario, of course. |
"Be the change you wish to see in the world." ⛩️  |
| You guys must have some inside information. Since when did we find out that two FULL PRICED games were going to equal out to one NORMAL PRICED game? 1. As far as any of you are aware, these will be sold at $15.99. 2. As far as any of you are aware, this will be like Ages/Seasons housing completely different plots, problems, and maybe even enemies. 3. As far as any of you know, they'll be cramming so much content into these games that both will have the same amount of content as stand alone games. You say "waiting is bad" but you don't even have all the facts. Where do you get off pretending you know it all? |
| You're defending day one DLC. Disgusting. |
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DoctorCaim said: You're defending day one DLC. Disgusting. I can do that too. "You're attacking the Pokémon series and Zelda Ages/Seasons. Lolpinions." |
| Did I say I like those games or defend them? Day One DLC sucks cock. It reeks of desperation, shit Nintendo has been doing for years now with their other business practices. |
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Thrashinuva said: You guys must have some inside information. Since when did we find out that two FULL PRICED games were going to equal out to one NORMAL PRICED game? 1. As far as any of you are aware, these will be sold at $15.99. 2. As far as any of you are aware, this will be like Ages/Seasons housing completely different plots, problems, and maybe even enemies. 3. As far as any of you know, they'll be cramming so much content into these games that both will have the same amount of content as stand alone games. You say "waiting is bad" but you don't even have all the facts. Where do you get off pretending you know it all? 1. Source? Btw the JP versions are $40 a piece (I just checked Play Asia). 2. It still isn't worth it when they can cram both stories into one game. 3. That doesn't makes it any better, if that is the case, they should release them one at a time similar to Persona 2. Which would also have the benefit of having 2 perfectly polished games instead of rushing 2 games at the same time. |
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DoctorCaim said: Did I say I like those games or defend them? Day One DLC sucks cock. It reeks of desperation, shit Nintendo has been doing for years now with their other business practices. Seeing how Nintendo was the last to join the DLC party, your argument kinda falls flat. Hoppy said: Thrashinuva said: You guys must have some inside information. Since when did we find out that two FULL PRICED games were going to equal out to one NORMAL PRICED game? 1. As far as any of you are aware, these will be sold at $15.99. 2. As far as any of you are aware, this will be like Ages/Seasons housing completely different plots, problems, and maybe even enemies. 3. As far as any of you know, they'll be cramming so much content into these games that both will have the same amount of content as stand alone games. You say "waiting is bad" but you don't even have all the facts. Where do you get off pretending you know it all? 1. Source? 2. It still isn't worth it when they can cram both stories into one game. 3. That doesn't makes it any better, if that is the case, they should release them one at a time similar to Persona 2. Which would also have the benefit of having 2 perfectly polished games instead of rushing 2 games at the same time. 2/3 (both relate to my point) Thats what I want to see before slamming or not what they are doing. If both stories really are big and had to be separated in two games, then I approve it. If not, then yes, I will whine. They are selling it as "two different games, plots, characters in the same setting" If they keep their word, then okay. If not, I am done with this series. |
2. It still isn't worth it when they can cram both stories into one game. 3. That doesn't makes it any better, if that is the case, they should release them one at a time similar to Persona 2. Which would also have the benefit of having 2 perfectly polished games instead of rushing 2 games at the same time. (Point 1 has been met with a good answer.) 2. You don't know that. They might be the size of two full games and may not fit on one cartridge. Do you want them to give away games now? 3. they could very well be 2 perfectly polished games, like Ages/Seasons |
| @Soul-Master, I was referring to other business decisions they've done, like making limited copies of a game or amiibos to increase short term sales at the risk of low stock |
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Thrashinuva said: The special edition can fit both games into one cartridge. Along with the DLC. They seriously split the game in half to milk my wallet2. It still isn't worth it when they can cram both stories into one game. 3. That doesn't makes it any better, if that is the case, they should release them one at a time similar to Persona 2. Which would also have the benefit of having 2 perfectly polished games instead of rushing 2 games at the same time. (Point 1 has been met with a good answer.) 2. You don't know that. They might be the size of two full games and may not fit on one cartridge. Do you want them to give away games now? 3. they could very well be 2 perfectly polished games, like Ages/Seasons |
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| Great, another solid series that will go to shit because of milking :/ |
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DoctorCaim said: @Soul-Master, I was referring to other business decisions they've done, like making limited copies of a game or amiibos to increase short term sales at the risk of low stock Dunno about the amiibos since I don´t care. If there is any serious demand for amiibos that are rare like Shulk or Lucina, then there will be more made. Unless Nintendo pulls a Sega and starts hating profits. About limited copies, thats really you complaining that the party ended and you arrived late. Sorry to tell you, there was no serious and real demand for more Xenoblade copies to be printed. I feel for you, since I had the same issue with some of my fav GC games like Baten Kaitos. After the initial demand was satisfied, no one was asking for more. Tales of the Abyss 3DS was highly demanded, so they had to reprint the title to meet demand. Don´t see how your arguments stand really. |
| They did this with the Ocarina of Time 3DS though. When Majora's Mask was announced. This is a 1st party game. People are still buying it at $100+ online. |
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| It's going to be great. All aboard the hype train. |
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DoctorCaim said: They did this with the Ocarina of Time 3DS though. When Majora's Mask was announced. This is a 1st party game. People are still buying it at $100+ online. This one is more valid. Though I cant really blame them, seeing how OoT 3DS is from 2011. I would also think that those who were interested in it already bought it. Besides there is also the digital version. Whether we like it or not, we are moving into that era. I bet Sony is already developing propietary storage hardware to sell, like the PSP/Vita memory sticks. Hell, next gen consoles might as well include it with the actual consoles. |
| On a sidenote that Shin Megami Tensei x Fire Emblem game has me hyped as fuck. The trailer was amazing. |
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| Lol Nintendo really does still have crap support for DLC. Compared to the Playstation Store, the eShop is cumbersome to use and really annoying to buy more than one thing at a time. They are not experts at this. |
Thrashinuva said: Lol Nintendo really does still have crap support for DLC. Compared to the Playstation Store, the eShop is cumbersome to use and really annoying to buy more than one thing at a time. They are not experts at this. And this is one major reason for my dislike of this announcement, as mentioned before. I don't want to have to be dependent on their trashy e-store in order to get my full experience. And it's especially worse as we are not simply talking about a short expansion, but HALF of the new game. Instead of jumping onto the whole DLC and micro-transaction train, they should first catch up in other areas, like their online infrastructure. They are simply not at the point where needed to be for these kinds of offerings, imo. Add to that the other things I brought up and I personally have more than enough reasons to feel disgruntled about this, even if some parts are still unclear atm. |
| What the fuck, the recent Nintendo direct made it sound like it was a single game with some big choice of who you pick to side with. |
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| @Syrup- I'm sure we both already made our stances regarding Nintendo more than clear and I doubt that either one of us will change their mind for now (and I respect that), but the following just fit our little disagreement all too well to not share it here, for whoever cares to read it :P. You make it sound like Nintendo is an evil money grubbing company I'll just leave thiiiiiiiis here. That article really clearly shows that Nintendo isn't as consumer-friendly as some people think. This whole situation actually clearly shows us the opposite, for them 'exclusive deals for extra $' > their fan's satisfaction. And all this could be avoided so easily yet they don't seem to care, lol. |
FunnyStory said: @Syrup- I'm sure we both already made our stances regarding Nintendo more than clear and I doubt that either one of us will change their mind for now (and I respect that), but the following just fit our little disagreement all too well to not share it here, for whoever cares to read it :P. You make it sound like Nintendo is an evil money grubbing company I'll just leave thiiiiiiiis here. That article really clearly shows that Nintendo isn't as consumer-friendly as some people think. This whole situation actually clearly shows us the opposite, for them 'exclusive deals for extra $' > their fan's satisfaction. And all this could be avoided so easily yet they don't seem to care, lol. Nintendo has always been corporate tyrants, for those who haven't been gaming in the 80's and 90's they had such a stranglehold on developers and publishers outside of Japan in the past unlike Sega. |
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| Sega let anyone put anything on their console for Sega Saturn. Nintendo did that for NES, and it resulted in terrible games that ruined the Nintendo image. Think E.T. and worse. Sega wasn't wise enough to learn from the mistakes of others, and it resulted in a system with mostly crappy games. It had a couple good games on it and a few on the way, but it wasn't alive for long enough for people to know that. And then Dreamcast had to follow that colossal failure. Not to mention all of their stupid Genesis add ons that no one got or even knew about. |
| I don't mind wasting 80 bucks. If they want, make more versions. I'll gladly buy em all |
| .. |
| Oh yay, FE is going the Pokemon route now? TRADE WITH YOUR FRIENDS TO GET ALL THE VERSION-EXCLUSIVE WAIFUS! GOTTA CATCH THEM ALL! I guess le happy merchant don't fear the samurai after all then? And here I was thinking this would be a instant preorder, fuck that. |
FunnyStory said: @Syrup- I'm sure we both already made our stances regarding Nintendo more than clear and I doubt that either one of us will change their mind for now (and I respect that), but the following just fit our little disagreement all too well to not share it here, for whoever cares to read it :P. You make it sound like Nintendo is an evil money grubbing company I'll just leave thiiiiiiiis here. That article really clearly shows that Nintendo isn't as consumer-friendly as some people think. This whole situation actually clearly shows us the opposite, for them 'exclusive deals for extra $' > their fan's satisfaction. And all this could be avoided so easily yet they don't seem to care, lol. Are you naive enough to believe that? Every gaming company cares more about money. You haven´t discovered anything new lol |
Soul-Master said: FunnyStory said: @Syrup- I'm sure we both already made our stances regarding Nintendo more than clear and I doubt that either one of us will change their mind for now (and I respect that), but the following just fit our little disagreement all too well to not share it here, for whoever cares to read it :P. I'll just leave thiiiiiiiis here. That article really clearly shows that Nintendo isn't as consumer-friendly as some people think. This whole situation actually clearly shows us the opposite, for them 'exclusive deals for extra $' > their fan's satisfaction. And all this could be avoided so easily yet they don't seem to care, lol. Are you naive enough to believe that? Every gaming company cares more about money. You haven´t discovered anything new lol Your point? Did you even read the comments? |
JoekstarApr 3, 2015 2:03 PM
FunnyStory said: Soul-Master said: Are you naive enough to believe that? Every gaming company cares more about money. You haven´t discovered anything new lol Your point? Did you even read the comments? You put like it Nintendo is the only one that pulls non-consumer friendly things. Every company does. |
Soul-Master said: FunnyStory said: Your point? Did you even read the comments? You put like it Nintendo is the only one that pulls non-consumer friendly things. Every company does. WHERE, seriously, WHERE did I say only Nintendo does it? I even mentioned that other Publishers did and do equally annoying shit and get RIGHTFULLY criticized for it. So again, read the comments properly or leave it be. I'm not even sure what you're trying to accomplish here. Even if I hadn't brought up other companies, does that make my points any less valid? Not that that really matters as this topic is specifically about Nintendo and FE. And if you agree with me anyway then you targeting the wrong person, sigh. |
JoekstarApr 3, 2015 2:10 PM
FunnyStory said: Soul-Master said: You put like it Nintendo is the only one that pulls non-consumer friendly things. Every company does. WHERE, seriously, WHERE did I say only Nintendo does it? I even mentioned that other Publishers did and do equally annoying shit and get RIGHTFULLY criticized for it. So again, read the comments properly or leave it be. I'm not even sure what you're trying to accomplish here. Even if I hadn't brought up other companies, does that make my points any less valid? Not that that really matters as this topic is specifically about Nintendo and FE. And if you agree with me anyway then you targeting the wrong person, sigh. Now that´s more like it. And yeah, I shit on Nintendo for joining the DLC party, but its nothing new. Its the era we are now. I will wait before I make my judgements on what they are pulling here. This is supposedly two different games, I will wait and see if they keep their word. |
Soul-Master said: FunnyStory said: Now that´s more like it. And yeah, I shit on Nintendo for joining the DLC party, but its nothing new. Its the era we are now. I will wait before I make my judgements on what they are pulling here. This is supposedly two different games, I will wait and see if they keep their word. Good to see that's cleared up, lol. Well, not much else we can do anyway for the time being anyway aside from being butthurt for few days. I sure hope it won't be as bad as it seems right now, because the game itself already looks great. |
Soul-Master said: It's hardly different games at all if it's all the same assets used with the only difference being another point of view for the story.I will wait before I make my judgements on what they are pulling here. This is supposedly two different games, I will wait and see if they keep their word. Just expect the worst and steer clear of any preorders I guess. |
| If there's enough content to justify purchasing two games, even with the discount, then that's ok, but I won't be buying this on release...wait and see if it's worth it. |
| I'll just have my friend buy the other and I pick one up to save myself the trouble of spending more than I should. |
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Baman said: Soul-Master said: It's hardly different games at all if it's all the same assets used with the only difference being another point of view for the story.I will wait before I make my judgements on what they are pulling here. This is supposedly two different games, I will wait and see if they keep their word. Just expect the worst and steer clear of any preorders I guess. Yeah, if that were the case, but thats something we wont know till we see the games. I never preorder or buy day 1 because thats moronic. I am gonna wait to see how the actual thing is. Then I will buy if it each version had content to warrant releasing it that way. |
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