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Feb 5, 2019 9:52 PM

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SSL443 said:

Which is all in your head...

Hmm, a rather original retort... Too bad that doesn't substitute for evidence...

Except you claim that I have committed logical fallacies, which would implicitly invalidate my argument.

Which is all in your head...


Then you're just cutting off your nose to spite your face because your time is being wasted just as much as mine.

What do you mean? I had a good laugh. Sounds like you didn't enjoy it, though...

A thinly disguised "no u". Disappointing, frankly.

Yeah, quite disappointing that you lack the capability to support a claim. It's okay.
Feb 5, 2019 9:54 PM
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SSL443 said:
Aren't we? Again, it's about the pacing; lot's of change, little time. Not debating whether or not a timeskip is appropriate, my point is that in the context of the pacing a timeskip makes it even more abrupt.

It is intended to be abrupt. That is plain to see with how Raftalia is re-introduced in ep.3. You have an implicit claim that a lot of information in short span of time is inherently bad. I disagree - if we got enough to extrapolate from, then the rest can be just skipped.

Why is everyone on this site so careless when it comes to reading the actual words in from of them? I never said it was the same, I responded to someone else who said it was.

I see. I don't have an automatic expectation of anyone taking much effort to read or respond to me, because my person is not all that important. As a bonus, I get to be happy when people do it.
Well, I guess we are in agreement on the perception thing.

No, I don't have "questions", nothing is "unclear".

Okay, so it is not an issue with information provided.
The problem is structuring this information into a compelling story. I can say "Naofumi was nice to Raphtalia, she was able to overcome her trauma and level up real good in a week"; that might be a good concept but what I've said isn't necessarily good storytelling. The way that this information is conveyed to the viewer is what makes for a good story. And I think that the way it was done in this anime was rushed and inadequate.

More information that this was conveyed though? If you haven't been paying attention, the entirety of ep.2 is dedicated to various specifics of how exactly Naofumi was nice (and not-nice) to Raftalia. They covered the most important character-establishing moments in actual scenes and did the rest through a montage, which isn't a bad way to do things. So yeah, it was certainly done in a hurry, but it wasn't inadequate.
Or rather, it was inadequate for you, but not for me. So maybe you need to go into some more detail as to what specifically you needed to make it work better that the show haven't done.

I'm just going to quote myself because I am sick of having to explain the same basic concepts ten different ways.

Repeating stuff doesn't make it true.

I accept that you can't buy into the notion of going from an abused kid to a confident adult in a week and cite "ground to cover".

What ground, specifically, was not covered? Was she not separated from and protected against discriminating society? Were her past hopes not addressed in the form of the flag and the ball? Were her fears and inner conflicts not addressed in the form of the dog and the very idea of Shield Hero in her mind? Were she not taught how to fight? The show even spent precious time showing her drink medicine. Not sure what else you'd even want. More time spent on soiling of bedsheets?

If your complaint is that you specifically can't keep up, then let me remind you that it is not just writings and critics that can be bad. Viewers have a role to play as well. Complaints about "pacing" basically always mean that you didn't pay the show the attention it requires. But the real question is - why didn't you pay the attention? Did the show not deserve attention or are you just lazy?

If the show didn't deserve your attention, I'm interested as to what made it so undeserving in your eyes. Because it certainly deserved mine.
Feb 5, 2019 9:57 PM

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VeryLTTP said:
Hmm, a rather original retort... Too bad that doesn't substitute for evidence...

Do you get aroused every time you get to type "evidence"?

VeryLTTP said:
Which is all in your head...

I think you're running out of steam... what a shame...

VeryLTTP said:
What do you mean? I had a good laugh. Sounds like you didn't enjoy it, though...

I mean it's hard to enjoy something that presents so little challenge, but it wasn't too bad.

VeryLTTP said:
Yeah, quite disappointing that you lack the capability to support a claim. It's okay.

My claims are all accounted for. Your knowledge of logic and fallacies though... it's like watching a toddler wave around his dad's gun. Duck!
Feb 5, 2019 10:02 PM

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SSL443 said:
Do you get aroused every time you get to type "evidence"?

Red herring

I think you're running out of steam... what a shame...

Nah, I'm satirizing your low effort in your posts.

I mean it's hard to enjoy something that presents so little challenge, but it wasn't too bad.

I mean, it's not that hard to see someone hang under his own words and inaction. If you can't back up your claim, then you can't back up your claim. I'm surprised that you're quite honest that you pose a little challenge.

My claims are all accounted for. Your knowledge of logic and fallacies though... it's like watching a toddler wave around his dad's gun. Duck!

Yep, there you go again with the premature "checkmate". I mean, I'm not the only one who has already pointed out at your ad nauseam fallacies anyways. But hey, keep playing the "Muh ignored arguments" card. Surely, it'll work this time...
Feb 5, 2019 10:05 PM

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VeryLTTP said:

Red herring

ad "nauseaum"

VeryLTTP said:

Nah, I'm satirizing your low effort in your posts.

I'm replying to yours with as much effort as they deserve. More, even.

VeryLTTP said:

I mean, it's not that hard to see someone hang under his own words and inaction. If you can't back up your claim, then you can't back up your claim. I'm surprised that you're quite honest that you pose a little challenge.

You can't understand words, you end up making a stooge of yourself. It happens.
Feb 5, 2019 10:23 PM

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malMaxi said:

More information that this was conveyed though?

No. The pacing of the information, as I said.

malMaxi said:

If you haven't been paying attention, the entirety of ep.2 is dedicated to various specifics of how exactly Naofumi was nice (and not-nice) to Raftalia. They covered the most important character-establishing moments in actual scenes and did the rest through a montage, which isn't a bad way to do things.

Absolutely.

malMaxi said:

So yeah, it was certainly done in a hurry, but it wasn't inadequate.

Or rather, it was inadequate for you, but not for me. So maybe you need to go into some more detail as to what specifically you needed to make it work better that the show haven't done.

Well... they could pace it so that all this development isn't front-loaded into a single episode.

I think it's obvious that the plot needs Raphtalia to level up quickly so that she is strong enough soon enough to fight the waves. And in that sense, the author has written himself into a corner; his plots needs something to happen in a way that will undermine character development.

malMaxi said:

I accept that you can't buy into the notion of going from an abused kid to a confident adult in a week and cite "ground to cover".

Correct.

malMaxi said:

What ground, specifically, was not covered?

Probably not much? Again, as I said, the issue was with the rate at which this ground was covered.

We get each of these scenes, each addressing a token issue, one after the other. It doesn't give us a chance to really absorb what is happening or explore any nuance.

I think it would help a great deal if Raphtalia's physical transformation preceded her mental and emotional one. That would go a long way to assuaging my gripes about this particular issue. It would certainly feel more believable.

malMaxi said:

More time spent on soiling of bedsheets?

That could also be a great scene.

malMaxi said:

If your complaint is that you specifically can't keep up, then let me remind you that it is not just writings and critics that can be bad. Viewers have a role to play as well. Complaints about "pacing" basically always mean that you didn't pay the show the attention it requires. But the real question is - why didn't you pay the attention? Did the show not deserve attention or are you just lazy?

If the show didn't deserve your attention, I'm interested as to what made it so undeserving in your eyes. Because it certainly deserved mine.

Not at all. For me, pacing is always about the events of a story feeling natural and organic. Obviously, there is a lot of flexibility that an adept storyteller can exploit if they do it with the right narrative queues and in the right context.

Unfortunately, I'm not really getting that level of depth from this series.
Feb 6, 2019 12:43 AM
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Amazing how this useless fucking thread still hasn't been locked or deleted yet, and I dont even like this show. 9 fucking pages of wannabe master elite analysts who can't let people enjoy whatever the fuck they want. This show has plot holes, so what? FMA has plot holes, Steins;Gate has plot holes, every single show on mal has plot holes. Just write a goddamn review if the urge to bash on this show is so intense that you can't keep it to yourself.
removed-userFeb 6, 2019 12:56 AM
Feb 6, 2019 1:41 AM

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SSL443 said:
vhagar8 said:
What ur saying here is quite interesting because it underlines the problem we're having pretty well imo:
ur too bound to the "classical" way of judging anime, the one u see in many reviews here on mal, anime aren't as simple as that approach might make u think they are.

This shit isn't high art or some kind of avante garde new wave experimental genere. It is bound by the same story conventions as any other medium. Conventions can be broken, but not without good reason. And the author of Shield Hero is no genius.

Rather than implying shield hero author is a genius and so it should be an exeption, I was saying that way of judging anime sucks whatever anime ur judging, but that's a little off-topic so whatever

SSL443 said:
vhagar8 said:
Raphtalia characterization is rushed if u look at that alone (at least as we viewers see it) and I agree with u on that, my point has never been the opposite.

The problem here is with the last word "if u look at that ALONE", in this particular situation being rushed rather than gradually characterized is actually a merit rather than a flaw, because it's used to help the viewers see Naofumi's prospective of Raphtalia development, which is distorted by his trauma while still giving though a timeskip enough time to make that happen in a reasonable way, even if it happens off-screen.

Okay, let's consider all of it TOGETHER.

During episode 2, the storytelling is very linear and unassuming. There are no indications of how Naofumi is perceiving these events one way or the other. The standard assumption here is that the camera is showing us a third person perspective that is no different than if the viewer was there in person.

Then episode 3 rolls around and Raphtalias character has changed drastically, as has the relationship dynamic between her and Naofumi. I fail to see where Naofumi's trauma has had any effect on the pacing of the story up to this point.

Finally, in episode 4, there is a very clear, temporary transition to Naofmi's perspective, and we learn how he has seen Raphtalia up to this point.

This doesn't retroactively fix the pacing of the story. There is no link between this perspective and what we've been shown so far.

There are numerous ways that the author could have actually executed the story how you are suggesting. There could have been hard cuts, creating a more clipped, piecemeal documentation of the events in episode 2; there could have been internal monoglogue or flashbacks, or any other number of queues that indicate that the perception of a specific character is impacting the flow of the narrative.

Instead, we get nothing. Dicking up the pacing and then coming back to say "oops, by the way that was all because of X" is not effective.

During ep 2 the storytelling is linear, because the time is still linear as well, don't see any problem with that.
About ep 3, Naoufimi's joke about lolicons was meant to be a clue in that sense, but I'll admit they coulda done better, I was kinda disappointed they didn't do more in that sense myself tbh, so yes, u got a point there.
The thing is, I've never said shield hero is flawless, the realization of the anime adaptation may be a little lacking in that episode but it's not like anime are eirher perfect or bad and there's absolutely nothing in between.
And anyway the realization of this narration technique not being flawless doesn't really justifies tens of your previous comments where u were completely missing the point of the discussion.
U got a point in this comment and this comment alone

SSL443 said:
vhagar8 said:
U can't assume rushed = bad in any situation and u don't even look at the context, the "rules" to how to make a story aren't black or white, there's quite the number of nuances in the middle

There's a difference between rushed pacing and using narrative queues to convey a sense of urgency or distorted time flow/altered consciousness.

There are plenty of films and books that subvert audience expectations by witholding information, idienties, and creating plot twists. A good example is the 1966 film Blow-Up, which includes elements of questioning perception. There are a lot of unanswered questions, but the film acknowledges them. There are no instances where a plot hole emerges, only to be curdely patched by some later scene.

I don't think something can really be classified as a plot hole if it's then "curdely patched" by some later scenes.
U need to watch the whole damn thing before being able to claim what's a plot hole and what's not.
Some things may be meant to feel off to create doubts and mistery.
Feb 6, 2019 1:51 AM
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Man this thread is awful, worthless. Just close it.
Feb 6, 2019 2:44 AM

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Hunter_Garou said:
OG_Gattsu said:


Well Isekai’s are poorly written garbage. I wouldn’t expect you to know what good writing looks like considering you like Shield Hero and DiTF lmao
Dumb elitist. My definition of good writing is superior to yours (quite a sad loser you are).


There was nothing elitist about my post, but looking at your profile I can see why it triggered you considering you do have shit taste e.g. Shield Hero, Overlord, Slime, Black Clover are generic, poorly written trash LMAO
FlexstyleFeb 6, 2019 3:01 AM
Feb 6, 2019 3:47 AM

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OG_Gattsu said:
Hunter_Garou said:
Dumb elitist. My definition of good writing is superior to yours (quite a sad loser you are).


There was nothing elitist about my post, but looking at your profile I can see why it triggered you considering you do have shit taste e.g. Shield Hero, Overlord, Slime, Black Clover are generic, poorly written trash LMAO

Don't act like ur beyond this, the very fact ur taking the trouble to shitpost in this thread proves ur at the very least as triggered by these shows' popularity as he's triggered by your shitposting
Feb 6, 2019 3:48 AM

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This thread is disgusting. I can't you people are wasting 9 fucking pages on this horseshit.

Can mods PLEASE close this cancer already?
Feb 6, 2019 3:55 AM
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4) Yes these things do happen IRL
Feb 6, 2019 3:56 AM

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SSL443 said:

ad "nauseaum"

Incorrect usage. Observation =/= Argument. When something is irrelevant to what it's responding to, it's irrelevant...


I'm replying to yours with as much effort as they deserve. More, even.

Nah, this "no u" response is much lazier...


You can't understand words, you end up making a stooge of yourself. It happens.

Like how you don't understand how to use ad nauseam above? It's not the first time that you have incorrectly applied fallacies...
Feb 6, 2019 4:55 AM
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OG_Gattsu said:
Hunter_Garou said:
Dumb elitist. My definition of good writing is superior to yours (quite a sad loser you are).


There was nothing elitist about my post, but looking at your profile I can see why it triggered you considering you do have shit taste e.g. Shield Hero, Overlord, Slime, Black Clover are generic, poorly written trash LMAO
You called Overlord and Black Clover trash ?? Yep, thank you for proving my point right. I am not triggered, I am calling for what you are, a dumb elitist. You mean Overlord that was the most sold LN of 2018 and the best-rated isekai (your elitism is soo sad). For Black Clover, so far it's the most exciting shounen from shounen jump releasing right now, it's awesome. I mean the most recent chapter was more exciting than the recent One Piece chapter and the recent Boku no Hero chapter. Another case of bad elitism(sorry you are a lost cause, Black Clover is awesome).
Feb 6, 2019 6:23 AM

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_shahriar_shiham said:
4) Yes these things do happen IRL

For example...? Where?

Hunter_Garou said:
You called Overlord and Black Clover trash ?? Yep, thank you for proving my point right. I am not triggered, I am calling for what you are, a dumb elitist. You mean Overlord that was the most sold LN of 2018 and the best-rated isekai (your elitism is soo sad).

Really? It looked pretty bad to me so I dropped S1 at episode 6 or smth.
Also, I don't get that "elitism" thing or whatever. I do think that Overlord does seem bad for mature (20+) audience. That's all there is to it.
Kamiyan3991Feb 6, 2019 6:27 AM
Feb 6, 2019 6:23 AM
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SSL443 said:
Well... they could pace it so that all this development isn't front-loaded into a single episode.

I think it's obvious that the plot needs Raphtalia to level up quickly so that she is strong enough soon enough to fight the waves. And in that sense, the author has written himself into a corner; his plots needs something to happen in a way that will undermine character development.

Hmmm, not really?
The author of the original novel does actually spend a bit more time on scenes during the skipped week, like the scenes pertaining to the rubber ball (some mean kids try to take the ball away from Raph, Nao sets them straight). The manga also has an adorable page where Raftalia is sleeping back against back with Naofumi.

The rush is introduced by the anime adaptation is what i'm saying. And i actually agree with the adaptation on this one.

Probably not much? Again, as I said, the issue was with the rate at which this ground was covered.

We get each of these scenes, each addressing a token issue, one after the other. It doesn't give us a chance to really absorb what is happening or explore any nuance.

This is predicated on the fact that something outside of "token moments" is happening. The only thing happening outside of "token moments" is a lot of fighting and a lot of eating for Raftalia. Not much reason to go into these. Also, the scenes from LN and manga that were skipped in anime don't really have enough content to extend things another episode. I'd rather have one complete story in an episode than two half-assed ones.

That could also be a great scene.

I think it was handled just right in the anime. We get enough of a picture to establish the situation, the crucial part - Naofumi patting Raftalia who is first scared by the hand and then surprised by the pat - is animated. Then the whole thing is moved on from because in the grand scheme of things it changes nothing and affects very little.

Not at all. For me, pacing is always about the events of a story feeling natural and organic. Obviously, there is a lot of flexibility that an adept storyteller can exploit if they do it with the right narrative queues and in the right context.

Unfortunately, I'm not really getting that level of depth from this series.

Now that we have established that there is a distinction between what SH does and what "adept storytellers" do, the proper way to move forward would be to examine some actual examples of adept storytelling in anime that do the same thing SH does (rapid development of a child character in a very small span of time), only in a way that works for you. If you manage to provide some examples and explain what works in them, we can then establish what specifically doesn't work in SH.

Alternatively, you can choose to take a position that all works that spend less than 30 minutes on the childhood phase of a deuteragonist are bad writing, period. I'm sure you can see how that would be indefensible, though.
Feb 6, 2019 6:34 AM
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OG_Gattsu said:
There was nothing elitist about my post, but looking at your profile I can see why it triggered you considering you do have shit taste e.g. Shield Hero, Overlord, Slime, Black Clover are generic, poorly written trash LMAO

Overlord is great, but niche. You either get the appeal, or you never truly RPed an undead.

Black Clover is just more Fairy Tail, as far as i'm concerned. Only worse, because Asta is no Natsu, his rival dude is no Gray and the chicks can't even hold a candle to Erza and Lucy. BC's real success so far is actually Yami. Mentor figures in shounen don't ever get to be this cool or this involved.

However, the salient point here is that people having a tendency to judge a person based on their profile are the reason i don't fill out my profile. That, and also because listing every single anime i saw in the past 30 years sounds both boring and pointless.
Feb 6, 2019 7:02 AM

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Turtles_Hunter said:
caio_brb said:


Tate no Yusha is mediocre but anime only thinking they are something is always hilarious when they are locked on one medium thinking that they know how other medium works because they only know those things when they are adapted. Anime only are complete morons and pathetic lazy people.
That said, after watching it, It's actually quite good. Despite some clichés, characterization is pretty good (no overpowered Gary Stu, for example). It kind of works. I must says it's a pretty good surprise, for once.


It's admirable to admit that. Few people ever will once they have a preconceived idea to hate something.

Also reported this thread like 5xs, don't know wtf the mods are doing, but they're not doing their job.
Feb 6, 2019 7:08 AM
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Grimzey said:
Amazing how this useless fucking thread still hasn't been locked or deleted yet, and I dont even like this show. 9 fucking pages of wannabe master elite analysts who can't let people enjoy whatever the fuck they want. This show has plot holes, so what? FMA has plot holes, Steins;Gate has plot holes, every single show on mal has plot holes. Just write a goddamn review if the urge to bash on this show is so intense that you can't keep it to yourself.

Literally the only take that’s worth a damn in this god foresaken thread. No one gives a rat’s ass about any of this. If you don’t like the show, find something better to watch and spend your time there, end of. Not write 15 pages of this cancerous shit.
dedeogbeFeb 6, 2019 9:55 AM
Feb 6, 2019 7:23 AM

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Kamiyan3991 said:
_shahriar_shiham said:
4) Yes these things do happen IRL

For example...? Where?

Hunter_Garou said:
You called Overlord and Black Clover trash ?? Yep, thank you for proving my point right. I am not triggered, I am calling for what you are, a dumb elitist. You mean Overlord that was the most sold LN of 2018 and the best-rated isekai (your elitism is soo sad).

Really? It looked pretty bad to me so I dropped S1 at episode 6 or smth.
Also, I don't get that "elitism" thing or whatever. I do think that Overlord does seem bad for mature (20+) audience. That's all there is to it.
Hunter_Garou said:
OG_Gattsu said:


There was nothing elitist about my post, but looking at your profile I can see why it triggered you considering you do have shit taste e.g. Shield Hero, Overlord, Slime, Black Clover are generic, poorly written trash LMAO
You called Overlord and Black Clover trash ?? Yep, thank you for proving my point right. I am not triggered, I am calling for what you are, a dumb elitist. You mean Overlord that was the most sold LN of 2018 and the best-rated isekai (your elitism is soo sad). For Black Clover, so far it's the most exciting shounen from shounen jump releasing right now, it's awesome. I mean the most recent chapter was more exciting than the recent One Piece chapter and the recent Boku no Hero chapter. Another case of bad elitism(sorry you are a lost cause, Black Clover is awesome).


Elitist is a shitty buzzword for weebs to use when someone points out your bad taste in anime.

Overlord is a pointless story following evil wizard Kirito and his giant harem enslaving/killing everyone who opposes them like they’re squashing ants. It’s like watching a otaku playing with cheat mode on with all the bullshit spells he has. There’s no semblance of stakes or tension involved when you know wizard Kirito could take over the world in a week. Popularity =/= quality

If Overlord is the best rated Isekai it proves my point with how bad Isekais are.

You finding Black Clover the most entertaining in shounen is subjective. Besides, don’t act like the current arc is any good. It’s fight after fight against one dimensional, revenge fuelled elves with no personality being rehashed 😂

Black Clover is not awesome, it’s a generic shounen with no originality. It’s Naruto x Fairy Tail but worse than both of them.
FlexstyleFeb 6, 2019 9:05 AM
Feb 6, 2019 7:29 AM

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malMaxi said:
OG_Gattsu said:
There was nothing elitist about my post, but looking at your profile I can see why it triggered you considering you do have shit taste e.g. Shield Hero, Overlord, Slime, Black Clover are generic, poorly written trash LMAO

Overlord is great, but niche. You either get the appeal, or you never truly RPed an undead.

Black Clover is just more Fairy Tail, as far as i'm concerned. Only worse, because Asta is no Natsu, his rival dude is no Gray and the chicks can't even hold a candle to Erza and Lucy. BC's real success so far is actually Yami. Mentor figures in shounen don't ever get to be this cool or this involved.

However, the salient point here is that people having a tendency to judge a person based on their profile are the reason i don't fill out my profile. That, and also because listing every single anime i saw in the past 30 years sounds both boring and pointless.


Not filling out a profile because you’re insecure of being judged isn’t the right mentality to have... We’re all judged on a daily basis. Add whatever you like, but make sure to own it.
Feb 6, 2019 7:55 AM

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I find it hilarious how this guy is going on about "shit taste" and then he has Prison School rated as a 10 and One Punch Man as a 3... lol.
Feb 6, 2019 8:19 AM

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It's not as bad as boogiepop AKA the most pretentious BS of the season. Let's just withhold all the info and confuse our audience so the show appears to be mysterious and deep.
Feb 6, 2019 8:40 AM

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XanTheInsane said:
I find it hilarious how this guy is going on about "shit taste" and then he has Prison School rated as a 10 and One Punch Man as a 3... lol.


Well you need to ignore these kind of people.
They only live just to hate popular shows.
Feb 6, 2019 8:58 AM

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XanTheInsane said:
I find it hilarious how this guy is going on about "shit taste" and then he has Prison School rated as a 10 and One Punch Man as a 3... lol.


Did it take you long searching through my profile to find some controversial rating? LMAO

Admittedly, I don’t remember why I scored PS that high. However, it doesn’t discredit anything I said.

OPM is all hype no substance. I’ve made a review if you need to be enlightened on that overrated trash 😊 https://myanimelist.net/reviews.php?id=293045
FlexstyleFeb 6, 2019 9:04 AM
Feb 6, 2019 9:00 AM

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malMaxi said:

Hmmm, not really?
The author of the original novel does actually spend a bit more time on scenes during the skipped week, like the scenes pertaining to the rubber ball (some mean kids try to take the ball away from Raph, Nao sets them straight). The manga also has an adorable page where Raftalia is sleeping back against back with Naofumi.

The rush is introduced by the anime adaptation is what i'm saying. And i actually agree with the adaptation on this one.

This is predicated on the fact that something outside of "token moments" is happening. The only thing happening outside of "token moments" is a lot of fighting and a lot of eating for Raftalia. Not much reason to go into these. Also, the scenes from LN and manga that were skipped in anime don't really have enough content to extend things another episode. I'd rather have one complete story in an episode than two half-assed ones.

I think it was handled just right in the anime. We get enough of a picture to establish the situation, the crucial part - Naofumi patting Raftalia who is first scared by the hand and then surprised by the pat - is animated. Then the whole thing is moved on from because in the grand scheme of things it changes nothing and affects very little.

That's prefectly fine, I acknowledge that you have an opinion. But this doesn't really address the issue of pacing. As I said, the series don't necessarilly need more scenes, it's more how they fit together and into the context of the story.

malMaxi said:

(rapid development of a child character in a very small span of time)

That's an incredibly narrow requirement that really has nothing to do with my point. I don't care how quickly Raphtalia "levels up" or develops physically as long as her characterization and her relationship with Naofumi develop in a believable and geniuine way. Excusing bad writing with in-world fantasy mechanics is asspull.

More reasonably, anime that have elements either of children growing up, development of a character, or their relationship with another character, might include The Tale of Princess Kaguya, Ponyo, Claymore, NGE, with varying levels of success.

Frankly, writing of the level needed to deal with this kind of situation is somewhat rare in fiction, let alone anime. Why? Because handling a character that has been traumatized to this degree requires knowledge, care, and skill.

malMaxi said:

Alternatively, you can choose to take a position that all works that spend less than 30 minutes on the childhood phase of a deuteragonist are bad writing, period. I'm sure you can see how that would be indefensible, though.

Sure. Fortunately that has nothing to do with what I said.
Feb 6, 2019 9:08 AM

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XanTheInsane said:
I find it hilarious how this guy is going on about "shit taste" and then he has Prison School rated as a 10 and One Punch Man as a 3... lol.


I didn’t realise you like Jojo part 3, the objectively worst part of the entire series. You have no credibility to be in this discussion 😂
Feb 6, 2019 9:17 AM

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2990
again, NO ONE is forcing you to watch it, ffs.
Idk why this damn thread is still very active when it's obvious trolling.
Feb 6, 2019 9:20 AM

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Oct 2014
6
OG_Gattsu said:
XanTheInsane said:
I find it hilarious how this guy is going on about "shit taste" and then he has Prison School rated as a 10 and One Punch Man as a 3... lol.


Did it take you long searching through my profile to find some controversial rating? LMAO

Admittedly, I don’t remember why I scored PS that high. However, it doesn’t discredit anything I said.

OPM is all hype no substance. I’ve made a review if you need to be enlightened on that overrated trash 😊 https://myanimelist.net/reviews.php?id=293045



Read your review, seems like you missed the point of the plot of OPM, did you even watch it or read it? Or did you just skim through everything quickly?
Feb 6, 2019 9:26 AM

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Jul 2017
352
XanTheInsane said:
OG_Gattsu said:


Did it take you long searching through my profile to find some controversial rating? LMAO

Admittedly, I don’t remember why I scored PS that high. However, it doesn’t discredit anything I said.

OPM is all hype no substance. I’ve made a review if you need to be enlightened on that overrated trash 😊 https://myanimelist.net/reviews.php?id=293045



Read your review, seems like you missed the point of the plot of OPM, did you even watch it or read it? Or did you just skim through everything quickly?


“Plot of OPM” lel.
Feb 6, 2019 10:05 AM
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Dec 2018
74
OG_Gattsu said:
Kamiyan3991 said:

For example...? Where?


Really? It looked pretty bad to me so I dropped S1 at episode 6 or smth.
Also, I don't get that "elitism" thing or whatever. I do think that Overlord does seem bad for mature (20+) audience. That's all there is to it.
Hunter_Garou said:
You called Overlord and Black Clover trash ?? Yep, thank you for proving my point right. I am not triggered, I am calling for what you are, a dumb elitist. You mean Overlord that was the most sold LN of 2018 and the best-rated isekai (your elitism is soo sad). For Black Clover, so far it's the most exciting shounen from shounen jump releasing right now, it's awesome. I mean the most recent chapter was more exciting than the recent One Piece chapter and the recent Boku no Hero chapter. Another case of bad elitism(sorry you are a lost cause, Black Clover is awesome).


Elitist is a shitty buzzword for weebs to use when someone points out your bad taste in anime.

Overlord is a pointless story following evil wizard Kirito and his giant harem enslaving/killing everyone who opposes them like they’re squashing ants. It’s like watching a otaku playing with cheat mode on with all the bullshit spells he has. There’s no semblance of stakes or tension involved when you know wizard Kirito could take over the world in a week. Popularity =/= quality

If Overlord is the best rated Isekai it proves my point with how bad Isekais are.

You finding Black Clover the most entertaining in shounen is subjective. Besides, don’t act like the current arc is any good. It’s fight after fight against one dimensional, revenge fuelled elves with no personality being rehashed 😂

Black Clover is not awesome, it’s a generic shounen with no originality. It’s Naruto x Fairy Tail but worse than both of them.
Proves what point? It's sold more than every light novel last year and it's the 8th rated best LN on this site, it's not proving your point in any way, It's proving mine. The current arc of Black Clover is really good, I am not acting like it, it just is, sorry you can't accept reality. It's truly sad. Also, there is nothing that is truly original in fiction so using the point of no originality doesn't help your argument one bit.

Another thing, the best-rated anime are not original(Steins Gate is about time-travel, it's has been used a lot in fiction, Gintama is literally a parody shounen, Fullmetal Alchemist has some shounen cliches here and there, Hunter x Hunter has some shounen cliches), they are rated for their story and execution. Also, Black Clover is superior to Fairy tail by a lot. Hey, Elitist how are you doing no matter what you say, you are still an elitist (you prove my point right with every comment you make).
Hunter_GarouFeb 6, 2019 10:17 AM
Feb 6, 2019 10:07 AM
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Dec 2018
74
OG_Gattsu said:
XanTheInsane said:
I find it hilarious how this guy is going on about "shit taste" and then he has Prison School rated as a 10 and One Punch Man as a 3... lol.


I didn’t realise you like Jojo part 3, the objectively worst part of the entire series. You have no credibility to be in this discussion 😂
Wrong, the worst part is Jojo part 1, elitist.
Feb 6, 2019 10:11 AM

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Dec 2016
904
vhagar8 said:

During ep 2 the storytelling is linear, because the time is still linear as well, don't see any problem with that.

There's nothing wrong with linear storytelling. I highlight that aspect as a LACK of evidence that our perception of the story is affected by Naofumi's.

vhagar8 said:

About ep 3, Naoufimi's joke about lolicons was meant to be a clue in that sense, but I'll admit they coulda done better, I was kinda disappointed they didn't do more in that sense myself tbh, so yes, u got a point there.

That may be a clue as to how Naofumi is perceiving things, but it does nothing to suggest that our perspective as the audience is showing anything but the reality of the story.

vhagar8 said:

The thing is, I've never said shield hero is flawless, the realization of the anime adaptation may be a little lacking in that episode but it's not like anime are eirher perfect or bad and there's absolutely nothing in between.

I've rated this show as average so far, subject to change of course. Yes, I've said the writing is bad, no it's not the worst I've seen. The OP of this thread unfortunately set the level of discourse on a bad foot with his click-bait title.

vhagar8 said:

And anyway the realization of this narration technique not being flawless doesn't really justifies tens of your previous comments where u were completely missing the point of the discussion.

Okay?

vhagar8 said:

I don't think something can really be classified as a plot hole if it's then "curdely patched" by some later scenes.

Example: Murder mystery, detective catches the killer using fingerprints, but there is no scene where he dusted for fingerprints. So the author adds in a line at the end of the story about how he dusted for prints earlier when nobody was looking. Technically the plot hole is fixed, but it just doesn't make any sense in terms of what you'd expect from this type of story; it's nonsensical and obviously a writing error, not some kind of ingenious subversion.

vhagar8 said:

U need to watch the whole damn thing before being able to claim what's a plot hole and what's not.
Some things may be meant to feel off to create doubts and mistery.

Again, there is a difference between creating mystery and just leaving out information from the plot. Honestly, I shouldn't need to explain the difference. "Doubt and mystery" is not a blanket justification for weak or illogical plot.


Feb 6, 2019 10:13 AM
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Dec 2018
74
Kamiyan3991 said:
_shahriar_shiham said:
4) Yes these things do happen IRL

For example...? Where?

Hunter_Garou said:
You called Overlord and Black Clover trash ?? Yep, thank you for proving my point right. I am not triggered, I am calling for what you are, a dumb elitist. You mean Overlord that was the most sold LN of 2018 and the best-rated isekai (your elitism is soo sad).

Really? It looked pretty bad to me so I dropped S1 at episode 6 or smth.
Also, I don't get that "elitism" thing or whatever. I do think that Overlord does seem bad for mature (20+) audience. That's all there is to it.
Oh you are one of those people who know nothing about Overlord, sorry got nothing to say to you. You can relish in that ignorance. Since you didn't finish the series you don't know shit about it and I don't really need to defend the series to you since it has really high ratings and it was the best sold LN last year, so it pretty much stands on its own.
Feb 6, 2019 10:15 AM
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Dec 2018
74
SSL443 said:
vhagar8 said:

During ep 2 the storytelling is linear, because the time is still linear as well, don't see any problem with that.

There's nothing wrong with linear storytelling. I highlight that aspect as a LACK of evidence that our perception of the story is affected by Naofumi's.

vhagar8 said:

About ep 3, Naoufimi's joke about lolicons was meant to be a clue in that sense, but I'll admit they coulda done better, I was kinda disappointed they didn't do more in that sense myself tbh, so yes, u got a point there.

That may be a clue as to how Naofumi is perceiving things, but it does nothing to suggest that our perspective as the audience is showing anything but the reality of the story.

vhagar8 said:

The thing is, I've never said shield hero is flawless, the realization of the anime adaptation may be a little lacking in that episode but it's not like anime are eirher perfect or bad and there's absolutely nothing in between.

I've rated this show as average so far, subject to change of course. Yes, I've said the writing is bad, no it's not the worst I've seen. The OP of this thread unfortunately set the level of discourse on a bad foot with his click-bait title.

vhagar8 said:

And anyway the realization of this narration technique not being flawless doesn't really justifies tens of your previous comments where u were completely missing the point of the discussion.

Okay?

vhagar8 said:

I don't think something can really be classified as a plot hole if it's then "curdely patched" by some later scenes.

Example: Murder mystery, detective catches the killer using fingerprints, but there is no scene where he dusted for fingerprints. So the author adds in a line at the end of the story about how he dusted for prints earlier when nobody was looking. Technically the plot hole is fixed, but it just doesn't make any sense in terms of what you'd expect from this type of story; it's nonsensical and obviously a writing error, not some kind of ingenious subversion.

vhagar8 said:

U need to watch the whole damn thing before being able to claim what's a plot hole and what's not.
Some things may be meant to feel off to create doubts and mistery.

Again, there is a difference between creating mystery and just leaving out information from the plot. Honestly, I shouldn't need to explain the difference. "Doubt and mystery" is not a blanket justification for weak or illogical plot.


Hey, the Queen is already introduced so your scream of plothole from the last thread about the matriarchy is really starting to wear thin.
Feb 6, 2019 10:21 AM

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Dec 2013
833
Hunter_Garou said:
Kamiyan3991 said:

For example...? Where?


Really? It looked pretty bad to me so I dropped S1 at episode 6 or smth.
Also, I don't get that "elitism" thing or whatever. I do think that Overlord does seem bad for mature (20+) audience. That's all there is to it.
Oh you are one of those people who know nothing about Overlord, sorry got nothing to say to you. You can relish in that ignorance. Since you didn't finish the series you don't know shit about it and I don't really need to defend the series to you since it has really high ratings and it was the best sold LN last year, so it pretty much stands on its own.

Well, I obvi. didn't finish the series, since it was pretty dull. So, I know it was dull. So, I actually know something about Overlord. Checkmate.

SSL443 said:
I've rated this show as average so far, subject to change of course. Yes, I've said the writing is bad, no it's not the worst I've seen. The OP of this thread unfortunately set the level of discourse on a bad foot with his click-bait title.

Uhh, but this actually is the worst writing I've seen in a while.
RTFM.
Feb 6, 2019 10:24 AM

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Dec 2016
904
Hunter_Garou said:

Hey, the Queen is already introduced so your scream of plothole from the last thread about the matriarchy is really starting to wear thin.

That isn't even part of this discussion, so good to know?
Feb 6, 2019 10:30 AM

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Dec 2016
904
Hunter_Garou said:
Oh you are one of those people who know nothing about Overlord, sorry got nothing to say to you. You can relish in that ignorance. Since you didn't finish the series you don't know shit about it and I don't really need to defend the series to you since it has really high ratings and it was the best sold LN last year, so it pretty much stands on its own.

I finished Overlord and it's pretty bad.

Kamiyan3991 said:

Uhh, but this actually is the worst writing I've seen in a while.
RTFM.

Well, I won't say you're wrong. Maybe I've just seen some worse shows than you have recently.

Edit: nevermind, started watching episode 5... youch.
SSL443Feb 6, 2019 10:39 AM
Feb 6, 2019 10:57 AM

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Nov 2011
288
SSL443 said:
Hunter_Garou said:
Oh you are one of those people who know nothing about Overlord, sorry got nothing to say to you. You can relish in that ignorance. Since you didn't finish the series you don't know shit about it and I don't really need to defend the series to you since it has really high ratings and it was the best sold LN last year, so it pretty much stands on its own.

I finished Overlord and it's pretty bad.

Kamiyan3991 said:

Uhh, but this actually is the worst writing I've seen in a while.
RTFM.

Well, I won't say you're wrong. Maybe I've just seen some worse shows than you have recently.

Edit: nevermind, started watching episode 5... youch.
Yeah, the start to book 2, which is where episode 5 is at, is one of my least favorite sections, and in all honesty book 2 is my least favorite, outside of revealing different plot points, a few fights, and wave 3 happening.

Get ready for Naofumi's tour as traveling merchant and fixing the other 3 heroes' fuck ups!
Feb 6, 2019 11:04 AM

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Dec 2016
904
Demyx_IX said:
Yeah, the start to book 2, which is where episode 5 is at, is one of my least favorite sections, and in all honesty book 2 is my least favorite, outside of revealing different plot points, a few fights, and wave 3 happening.

Get ready for Naofumi's tour as traveling merchant and fixing the other 3 heroes' fuck ups!

If it continues in the vein of this episode I will definitely drop the series.
Feb 6, 2019 11:14 AM

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Sep 2018
1273
Agree i think the premise of a Anti Hero isekai is good and very refreshing in such a generic genre but my biggest issue is every Character exept our Main Characters (and maybe the 2 useless Heros Green and Blue because they actually start thinking like a human in ep 5)

1.Yellow Hero has Armor of Shield after that false rape thing they couldve just asked the Armorsmith who bought it and boom everything is fine

2.Why does the Shield hero even get hated? Because he protecc and doesnt lvl as much as the other? Why even cooperate with all 4 Heros if the fucking world is on the line if they fail? (Maybe he has to get hated because of something that will be explained later)

3.The howl kings family we saw so far just doesnt care about its people at all...why is he even still King wheres the rebellion?

I think its still an entertaining show that just threw away its potential to be actually great

Note: And one question thats just based on my taste...
Why is this again a Isekai in a fucking game world why not just a Fantasy world?
I think when you do something like this than set a focus on it and not just say ok lets level to get stronger....explain how you level and i overall dislike this type of shows because 1. i still have a trauma from SAO and 2. most of the time its completely irrelevant that the Protagonist is in a Game world or just a normal world the game aspect has 0 use
Feb 6, 2019 11:20 AM

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Dec 2018
346
Episode 5 and the only thing I see is a woman obsessed with annoying the MC in any way, it is not as if she had other more important issues to do as to defeat the evil waves.
Of course the inevitable scene scene of the naked loli on the protagonist, and the people who complained that in tension the monsters became too human, but this is absurd the fat chicken was better and made it so obvious that this will turn into a putrid harem
Feb 6, 2019 11:25 AM

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Nov 2011
288
SSL443 said:
Demyx_IX said:
Yeah, the start to book 2, which is where episode 5 is at, is one of my least favorite sections, and in all honesty book 2 is my least favorite, outside of revealing different plot points, a few fights, and wave 3 happening.

Get ready for Naofumi's tour as traveling merchant and fixing the other 3 heroes' fuck ups!

If it continues in the vein of this episode I will definitely drop the series.
That's fair, and it really depends on the pace that they go for, as there's a bit of development to go through. If you don't mind reading a cliff notes summary of what /should/ be covered in the next three-ish episodes, just say the word.
Feb 6, 2019 11:32 AM

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Dec 2016
904
Demyx_IX said:
That's fair, and it really depends on the pace that they go for, as there's a bit of development to go through. If you don't mind reading a cliff notes summary of what /should/ be covered in the next three-ish episodes, just say the word.

I'll take your word for it that it improves again, complaints aside the series was at least watchable up to this point.
Feb 6, 2019 11:44 AM

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2272
I absolutely love the "criticisms" this show is receiving from people. Most of them are purely opinion based over exaggerations. It's incredibly funny to watch.
Feb 6, 2019 12:02 PM

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Apr 2018
614
Jak said:
I absolutely love the "criticisms" this show is receiving from people. Most of them are purely opinion based over exaggerations. It's incredibly funny to watch.


That's mal for u

.....................................
Feb 6, 2019 12:51 PM

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Dec 2016
904
Jak said:
I absolutely love the "criticisms" this show is receiving from people. Most of them are purely opinion based over exaggerations. It's incredibly funny to watch.

Oh look, the wannabe aloof edgelord who pretends to find everything funny when he's secretly triggering harder than anyone.

Private anime list as well, nicely done.
Feb 6, 2019 12:58 PM

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Dec 2013
833
Episode 5 in a nutshell

Feb 6, 2019 1:31 PM

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