Kamen Rider Kiva?
| Here's the official discussion topic for Kamen Rider Kiva, last year's Kamen Rider series. So what did everyone think of it? Did it live up to your standards for a Kamen Rider series? Did you enjoy it regardless? |
SusanOct 12, 2009 2:56 PM
| <---made of awesome! |
| I've only seen the first 21 episodes, but it's been pretty disappointing. All Toei seems to care about was copying the success of Den-O while sacrificing a good story and characters in the process. It's okay, but I need to watch the rest of the series to make a final judgement. |
| Signature removed. Please follow the signature rules, as defined in the Site & Forum Guidelines. |
| well i liked it but not loved it.. the ending is kinda bit rushed.. |
  |
| Yeah, kinda. |
| SSAA Podcast<-A show about things involving stuff, mainly about anime, dramas and whatever comes to mind. Follow me on Twitter |
| Just finished the Kiva movie. The high points were the Den-O cameos! The voice actors for Momotaros, Urataros, Kintaros and Ryuutaros all appeared with their catchphrases in some way (Kintaros is hard to spot tho, because his is written and not said), and Naomi also appears. Besides that there was some cool special effects and the usual continuity errors (Well, usually the movies are kind of in their own separate little universe these days). Worst error: It was basically like a really long episode of Kiva, with a better ending and special effects than the series itself, but the same weirdness and errors and generally sloppy writing. XD |
| <---made of awesome! |
| I loved Kiva. First episode was highly disappointing (I thought Wataru was a weakling), but as the story went on things got better and better. Time travel's getting kinda old, but Otoya's one of the coolest characters in the Kamen Rider universe. The fact that Kiva managed to create a number of interesting characters, provide a main character who actually grew stronger as time went on (no "Shinji", please), give me quite a few good fight scenes, design some cool-looking Kamen Riders, and even tied up all its loose ends in the story... All of that, plus some great music, makes this one of my favorite Kamen Rider series. Only #4 on the list, though. |
| Jumping in Headfirst - I hear reading it causes immortality. Warning. Reading may not actually cause immortality. |
| I've seen up to episode 32 now and the story still has trouble keeping my interest. Everything here was already done in either Faiz or Den-O. So many characters appear and then just vanish for several episodes on end (I'm looking at you, Kengo). Plus, so many power-ups have just been entirely forgotten about, namely Kiva's alternate forms with Garuru, Dogga, and Bassha. Not to mention that any time the girl that lives with Wataru (have they ever explained their relationship?) shows up, I want to punch the screen. One of the worst KR characters ever. |
| Signature removed. Please follow the signature rules, as defined in the Site & Forum Guidelines. |
| I dunno. Kiva was the first series to do parallel story telling. It was a cool idea in theory, but it didn't work out as they never defeated anyone in the 80's... They dropped the ball on Kengo. He was a fun side-character until they tossed him at 753 and then killed his character completely. I think he would've made a good tertiary rider. Kiva is filled with characters that I hate. Whatserface who calls herself Wataru's mother, Mio (Yeah, and I didn't like Mari either!), 753 and his craptacular self... Not enough Jiro, dammit! |
| <---made of awesome! |
Susan said: I dunno. Kiva was the first series to do parallel story telling. It was a cool idea in theory, but it didn't work out as they never defeated anyone in the 80's... They dropped the ball on Kengo. He was a fun side-character until they tossed him at 753 and then killed his character completely. I think he would've made a good tertiary rider. Kiva is filled with characters that I hate. Whatserface who calls herself Wataru's mother, Mio (Yeah, and I didn't like Mari either!), 753 and his craptacular self... Not enough Jiro, dammit! That's not true--they beat a few people here and there, but that wasn't really the point of it. If they were amazingly successful at beating the Fangaia, then there wouldn't have been a story for the future. :D Plus in the end it all worked out pretty well, plot-wise. And I've never been the guy ti tell the writer they killed their own character. I think they know what they're doing with their story. That said, maybe it didn't bother me as much seeing Kengo's changes because he was only mildly entertaining at first, and watching him become IxA was some nice character progression. Also, I LOVED Mio! >_< Nago Keisuke was inches away from being Tendou: Part Deux, but he ended up being more like the first TheBee Rider, which was cool. I even liked the girl, though she could be sort of bothersome when she got in Wataru's way while he was dating Mio. |
| Jumping in Headfirst - I hear reading it causes immortality. Warning. Reading may not actually cause immortality. |
| Well, I finally finished the show, and it just left one huge "meh" taste in my mouth. I'll just list the cons first to get them out of the way: -Almost EVERY power-up was forgotten about by the end...including the original Kiva suit itself. With no doubt, Bandai just kept throwing ideas at Toei to incorporate into the show and when they didn't work, they were dropped and never mentioned again. -Horrendous comic-relief abound! -Too many characters were simply unlikeable, and then later on...we're supposed to like some of them? Both Queens come to mind. -I hate it when shows lead us to believe characters are dead, and then have them magically show up a few episodes later with tacked-on explanations. -The story was like some twisted hybrid of Faiz and Den-O. :S -Castle Doran never gets a full explanation. Why does he hide in a building? Why did it collect Fangire souls? How could it send people back in time? What was that mini-castle? However, the show did have some good parts amazingly enough. Wataru and Otoya were kick-ass leads, especially once Wataru grew into a more self-reliant lead. The suit designs were wicked cool, with the stained-glass mirror motif giving the Fangire a really unique look compared to other KR villains of years past. Kiva was always close to being a pretty good show, but it never left the "okay" realm. Easily the weakest Heisei KR show. |
| Signature removed. Please follow the signature rules, as defined in the Site & Forum Guidelines. |
| It always surprises me how much my opinions differ from everyone else's. Kiva the weakest Heisei show? When Faiz and Ryuki are around? Wow. BTW...in what way were power-ups forgotten about? Kiva attained Emperor Form, he quit using the others. ...Why would he? You didn't see Agito use anything but Ground Form and Shining after he attained Shining. You don't see Kenzaki use Jack form after he attains King+. The only thing forgotten about was the fact that, seemingly, Kiva's Emperor Form was able to combine with his other monster forms. Emperor Wolf Form was seen once, and then a few eps later he got the sword, and that was that. |
| Jumping in Headfirst - I hear reading it causes immortality. Warning. Reading may not actually cause immortality. |
SageShinigami said: It always surprises me how much my opinions differ from everyone else's. Kiva the weakest Heisei show? When Faiz and Ryuki are around? Wow. BTW...in what way were power-ups forgotten about? Kiva attained Emperor Form, he quit using the others. ...Why would he? You didn't see Agito use anything but Ground Form and Shining after he attained Shining. You don't see Kenzaki use Jack form after he attains King+. The only thing forgotten about was the fact that, seemingly, Kiva's Emperor Form was able to combine with his other monster forms. Emperor Wolf Form was seen once, and then a few eps later he got the sword, and that was that. Well, with your first argument, then shouldn't Kiva automatically be worse than Faiz, in your opinion, since Kiva ripped off many of Faiz's plot points? Well, I haven't seen Agito, but in Blade, Kenzaki still used his base form. I mean, what was even the point of ever having a base form if it's never used again once the main power-up is achieved? Kiva would use Emperor Form on enemies that were seriously not that strong. Why not use the original form on those enemies? Because Bandai wanted to milk the crap out of that toy. And it's not just Emperor Form's monster combos that were forgotten. What happened to IXA's tractor? IXA being able to steal Kiva's weapons and use them himself? All three of the monster forms? DoGaBaKi Form? The mini-Castle Doran that powered up Kiva's kick? Kiva's bike? Those were ALL used maybe twice at most (except for Garuru Saber and Bassha Magnum). |
| Signature removed. Please follow the signature rules, as defined in the Site & Forum Guidelines. |
CCZilla said: Well, with your first argument, then shouldn't Kiva automatically be worse than Faiz, in your opinion, since Kiva ripped off many of Faiz's plot points? I'll admit, I wouldn't know for sure. Couldn't finish Faiz. That said, if they did, they must've done them a whole lot better than Faiz did 'cause, obviously, I DID finish Kiva. Well, I haven't seen Agito, but in Blade, Kenzaki still used his base form. I mean, what was even the point of ever having a base form if it's never used again once the main power-up is achieved? Kiva would use Emperor Form on enemies that were seriously not that strong. Why not use the original form on those enemies? Because Bandai wanted to milk the crap out of that toy. ....Okay, seriously? Why WOULD you use a base form after you receive a massive power upgrade? It just seems like, unless there's a reason NOT to, you're really just not being serious with your opponent, which is how someone gets killed. There was DEFINITELY a reason why Kenzaki went base form over King+ all the time (there was more than one, really). Tendou wasn't much for Hyper Form either, since he couldn't control it all that well. But, if you think about it, Emperor Form isn't really Kiva's "power-up" so much as it is him stepping into his role as King. Hence why the form never had any kind of drawbacks like King+ Blade or Hyper Kabuto. That's why he almost never used Base Form again. And it's not just Emperor Form's monster combos that were forgotten. What happened to IXA's tractor? IXA being able to steal Kiva's weapons and use them himself? All three of the monster forms? DoGaBaKi Form? The mini-Castle Doran that powered up Kiva's kick? Kiva's bike? Those were ALL used maybe twice at most (except for Garuru Saber and Bassha Magnum). You got a point. I forgot about a lot of that stuff. I forgot about IxA's fake castle 'cause it looked awful. I forgot about him stealing Kiva's weapons because it was really a bitch move, and I kinda feel like once he attained Rising he felt it was unnecessary to fight that way any more. (Thinking on it now, that is.) The monster forms, again, were just little stop gap measures when base Kiva couldn't all the way make it, as opposed to Emperor Form which was all-purpose. The only one of those I REALLY agree with is Kiva's bike. Reason being the show IS called Kamen Rider. So when the bike popped back up around episode 40 or so, I was kind of thrown off and felt they actually would have been better never mentioning it again, since it looked so out of place by then. |
| Jumping in Headfirst - I hear reading it causes immortality. Warning. Reading may not actually cause immortality. |
| A lot fo spoilers about other series in Kiva's thread... Small stuff, but you shouldn't do that. The acting: It was better than most riders I've seen. The enemies: The fangires are too generic. Sure, they look different but they don't tend to have different sets of skills. They also don't have a goal. They are just there... the music: Good. They really wanted to make money with that amount of songs. But they are good. the battles: The coreography is good. The movs in the fights are cool. I won't mention again the fact that he didn't use his forms and weapons enough, because you guys already did. He got the emperor form too soon IMO and that killed the other forms. I always felt that Kiva always won because of a power up. He never really had to think strategically or anything. The show had some plot power ups and "debuffs", especially for IXA. Kiva had some motivation power ups. The 1986 crew was too inefective. I know that was to show how they were just beginning to develop IXA, but I grew tired of seeing the same monsters in both eras. Wataru's strenght. I was never able to think that he and Kiva were the same person. He started TOO weak, and Kiva was strong. Then, in the end, he became strong just because he talked to his father. I mean, he could get a stronger will doing that, but he became physically stronger. the plot: The parallel story telling was a nice touch, because it made really curious. I wanted to know how the situation became like that. The 2008 plot was the old story about a weak person becoming strong. The 1986 tells us how Wataru became a link between humans and fangire. The cohexistence theme was already used before (in the Heisei era) and Kiva isn't the one to make best use of it. The plot ressurections were awful. A cheap way to create drama. I hate that. The time travels were a bad point. Not only they came out of nowhere, they could have done the same things without that. They don't really add to the story. Nago's was totally useless and Wataru's was just to show him fighting together with Otoya. Pure fanservice. Characters: Kengo. As wrote before, he was a nice side character, but then, out of nowhere he became an asshole. I could buy thatm given the conditions, but he also becaem a strong guy that always punched people in the face. Wtf? And as quickly as he got IXA, in a stupid way, he lost it in the same manner. Nago was a pain as a character, but that was his role. Since the beginning I thought he would start as thata stuck up and become softer later. He started to become worse, and I liked that. They were showing how his obssession with justice made him a bad person, and I knew he would get real and become good. That happened, but in a stupid way. He lost IXA, and then his pride. He became a weakling and then started to be good to people just so he could be useful and maintain his way of life. Then he became IXA again, but now he was good to people. IMO he should have gone berserk, realized that he was wrong and then become nice. Wataru as a character was ok. He starts as a weakling and ends as a badass. Too cliché, but it works in the story. Shima-san and Master are just... there. Riki and Ramon too. Mio was the female Wataru. A weak woman that was what the weak Wataru could handle. The only originality she showed was when she plotted Taiga's murder, but that was thrown away. Taiga just appeared to be the rival and he had all the cliche traits. Strong, smart, cool, rich and powerful. And yet he looses to the hero... He did have some good points though. He wanted to be with the ones he loved, which kept him from being a total cliche. Shizuka had a big part in hte beginning, but she eventually disappeared. The only thing she did that was nice was trying to break Wataru and Mio. But that was quickly thrown away too. They never explained how Wataru met Shizuka. I liked Megumi very much. A strong and playful woman. Very determined. Unfortunately she didn't have a bigger role as a warrior (though if she did she would have died). I also liked her interaction with Nago. I also liked Yuri a lot. Another strong woman, though she is a serious one. She also could have used IXA more... I liked her relationship with Otoya. Maya was the person that tries to understand the enemy and starts to like them. She played that role well. I liked her calm personality. I also liked her relationship with Otoya, and how she almost entranced him. Jirou was a great character too. The cool guy. His rivalry with Otoya was very funny. Unfortunately, they made him weak and stopped using him as an important part of the plot. And then threre is Otoya, th soul of the show. Everything happens because of him, the one that sets both stories in motion. He is the guy that acts like a fool, but is wise and strong-hearted. He also was very cunning. The type of character I always wanted to see as a rider. The design: The vitral fangires were very cool. Kiva also has an inspider design, but my favorite is IXA, followed by Saga. Overall I liked Kiva. Its a good show, mainly because of Otoya and his story, though the rest wasn't bad, just plain. edit: did you notice how the IXA belt would just magically show up when someone was using the knucle and magically disappear when the transformation wore off? Didi you also noticed that Nagos actor was always hunching in order to look menacing? |
m4rc0Jan 9, 2010 11:51 AM
CCZilla said: Well, I finally finished the show, and it just left one huge "meh" taste in my mouth. I'll just list the cons first to get them out of the way: -Almost EVERY power-up was forgotten about by the end...including the original Kiva suit itself. With no doubt, Bandai just kept throwing ideas at Toei to incorporate into the show and when they didn't work, they were dropped and never mentioned again. -Horrendous comic-relief abound! -Too many characters were simply unlikeable, and then later on...we're supposed to like some of them? Both Queens come to mind. -I hate it when shows lead us to believe characters are dead, and then have them magically show up a few episodes later with tacked-on explanations. -The story was like some twisted hybrid of Faiz and Den-O. :S -Castle Doran never gets a full explanation. Why does he hide in a building? Why did it collect Fangire souls? How could it send people back in time? What was that mini-castle? However, the show did have some good parts amazingly enough. Wataru and Otoya were kick-ass leads, especially once Wataru grew into a more self-reliant lead. The suit designs were wicked cool, with the stained-glass mirror motif giving the Fangire a really unique look compared to other KR villains of years past. Kiva was always close to being a pretty good show, but it never left the "okay" realm. Easily the weakest Heisei KR show. While I can't speak for all the powerups, the reason they stopped using Kiva's base form was that the suit was to heavy for the suit actor, and he literally almost died in it a few times(you can look it up if you don't believe me) and in the case of Castle Doran,(as well as other KR series) the CGI afterwhile gets real expensive so they eventually try not to use it much later on(at least when it comes to giant monsters and the like) |
| I like what I like and I'm not that picky, and I'm immune to spoilers |
More topics from this board
» Kamen Rider Gavv Series Discussion (2024-2025)Punkbeetle - Sep 10, 2024 |
0 |
by Punkbeetle
»»
Sep 10, 2024 11:04 AM |
|
» Global YouTube Channel【TOEI TOKUSATSU WORLD OFFICIAL】prepare4trouble - Mar 22, 2020 |
0 |
by prepare4trouble
»»
Mar 22, 2020 6:09 PM |
|
» Your First TokusatsuCCZilla - Feb 17, 2009 |
34 |
by prepare4trouble
»»
Mar 22, 2020 6:02 PM |
|
Sticky: » Kamen Rider Zero-One Series Discussion (2019-2020)wakka9ca - Sep 16, 2019 |
16 |
by AngelsArcanum
»»
Nov 25, 2019 8:22 PM |
|
Sticky: » Kamen Rider BUILD Series Discussion (2017-2018)Susan - Sep 16, 2017 |
13 |
by Susan
»»
May 15, 2018 3:26 AM |