Blue Lock
| Sports anime need fluid animation above all else. If that means eschewing hand drawn animation in favor of cg, then so be it. -snip- -snip- This is as close to live action as it gets. There's a much better video out there depicting the final moments of the match, so it's kinda spoilery. Edit: Videos above have been taken down. They are from the movie: The First Slam Dunk (2022). Here's another one before it gets taken down too: https://www.bilibili.com/video/BV1wW4y1g7S8 |
TorribleDec 16, 2022 12:45 AM
| don't worry this is the new animation of anime sports |
 [jmg align=right]https://i.imgur.com/XLRDPsi.png?1[/img] anime list manga list blog posts |
| Watch Haikyuu if you think this is good sports animation |
 |
| Bro has watched haikyuu but still says this pfftt |
 |
| dude no Go back BL is just flashy so don't get it twisted. |
 |
| As mucg as I enjoy Blue Lock, I dont think the animation is that high level even for a sports anime. Its decent, and it does its job well. Not good, but not bad!! Although I didnt enjoy watching Haikyuu, I do think it has better animation than Blue Lock. Art is subjective. What you think looks beautiful, may not be beautiful for everybody else. |
DexterDrubo said: Torrible said: Sports anime need fluid animation above all else. If that means eschewing hand drawn animation in favor of cg, then so be it. https://www.bilibili.com/video/BV1sd4y147TE/ https://www.bilibili.com/video/BV1PK411975b/ This is as close to live action as it gets. There's a much better video out there depicting the final moments of the match, so it's kinda spoilery. Sorry I can't take that disney style animation seriously. And bro why tf do you want to make animation to look like live action? What's the point of animation then? Because I'll enjoy it more if it looks like actual athletes are performing those moves? For example, look at 2:14 of the first video onwards. Compare that to Akashi zone, Bachira flow or whatever Haikyuu moves. No matter how well animated those scenes are, they not going to compare with motion capture of an actual athlete. it's not just about fluidity. There are all the subtle motions and mannerisms that 2D animation cannot depict well. Also, 2D animation for most sports anime (apart from Haikyuu) only tend to look good during those Sakuga moments, but outside those moments, animation look noticeably worse or even bad. With CG animation, the animation can be consistent throughout, which is what I prefer. The problem with a lot of 3D animation right now is that there is no motion capture. When everything is animated using software, of course it looks infinitely worse than 2D Sakuga animation. Edit: Rotoscoping is another alternative. I believe that is actually done for some of the shooting animation in KnB. But again, that's going to be more expensive and time-consuming than simply using motion capture.  |
TorribleDec 5, 2022 6:43 AM
lFrogs said: Watch Haikyuu if you think this is good sports animation There are 2 reasons why Haikyuu is so well animated. 1) Budget (I've not seen any sports anime that comes close to that consistency in animation quality). Needless to say, this is not going to be the norm now or in future. 2) Volleyball is a sport that lends itself very well to animation. Unlike other sports that have hundreds or thousands of variations in movements, all the different forms of spiking, serving and blocking are not going to be dramatically different from one another which means a lot of animation frames can be reused or simply traced over. |
| Blue Lock is so good I love it. By far the most exciting soccer anime I’ve seen, partly due to its animation and music. |
 |
anime_on_demand said: Blue Lock is so good I love it. By far the most exciting soccer anime I’ve seen, partly due to its animation and music. I love this show's OST and sound direction, they're so effective. |
| I hope they use this good animation on a better story next time. I really dont like Blue Locks story and characters. |
NobleWasTaken said: Torrible said: There are 2 reasons why Haikyuu is so well animated. 1) Budget (I've not seen any sports anime that comes close to that consistency in animation quality). Needless to say, this is not going to be the norm now or in future. 2) Volleyball is a sport that lends itself very well to animation. Unlike other sports that have hundreds or thousands of variations in movements, all the different forms of spiking, serving and blocking are not going to be dramatically different from one another which means a lot of animation frames can be reused or simply traced over. 1) What's your source for Haikyuu having bigger budget? The vast majority of time people say this it's bullshit. 2) If volleyball is a sports that's so easy to animate, why is blue lock the one constantly using the same 3D models with the same running animation? Seems to me it's much more likely they rushed the production so it could be out for the world cup. 1) Better animation = more keyframes, more details = more work = bigger team (outsourced or in-house) and/or longer time frame = more budget needed. Even if the studio's animators are so amazing that they can achieve better animation than their competitors with a smaller team and in a smaller time-frame, it makes no sense to negotiate for less money. In fact, if the animation team is so skilled, they should negotiate for more money. 2) If they reuse the same volleyball serving animation over and over, viewers are not going to complain because in real life, volleyball players use a narrow and optimal range of serving motions. It's the same when it comes to taking free kicks or corner kicks in soccer. It's not so jarring when animation is reused for these dead ball situations. But motions like dribbling is highly dependent on the situation and position of other players on the pitch. And there are dozens upon dozens of different kinds of dribbling skills in soccer: elastico, sombrero, the Ronaldo chop, etc. Likewise, defending in soccer can have vastly different forms compared to blocking in volleyball because there is much more variation (standing tackle, sliding tackle from the front, sliding tackle from behind, scorpion kick clearance, bicycle kick clearance, headed clearance, and blocking a shot with various parts of the body, etc). Of course, there's nothing to stop Blue Lock from reusing dribbling or running animation, but it's going to look bad on them, whereas reusing animation for volleyball is more acceptable. That was my point. |
TorribleDec 16, 2022 1:01 AM
XCF_Konzarn said: Torrible said: 1) Better animation = more keyframes, more details = more work = bigger team (outsourced or in-house) and/or longer time frame = more budget needed. Even if the studio's animators are so amazing that they can achieve better animation than their competitors with a smaller team and in a smaller time-frame, it makes no sense to negotiate for less money. In fact, if the animation team is so skilled, they should negotiate for more money. 2) If they reuse the same volleyball serving animation over and over, viewers are not going to complain because in real life, volleyball players use a narrow and optimal range of serving motions. It's the same when it comes to taking free kicks or corner kicks in soccer. It's not so jarring when animation is reused for these dead ball situations. But motions like dribbling is highly dependent on the situation and position of other players on the pitch. And there are dozens upon dozens of different kinds of dribbling skills in soccer: elastico, sombrero, the Ronaldo chop, etc. Likewise, defending in soccer can have vastly different forms compared to blocking in volleyball because there is much more variation (standing tackle, sliding tackle from the front, sliding tackle from behind, scorpion kick clearance, bicycle kick clearance, headed clearance, and blocking a shot with various parts of the body, etc). Of course, there's nothing to stop Blue Lock from reusing dribbling or running animation, but it's going to look bad on them, whereas reusing animation for volleyball is more acceptable. That was my point. If you ACTUALLY think that better animation invariably means a higher budget, not only are you absolutely clueless about how the industry works but you are also being hugely disrespectful to the overworked and underpaid animators by spreading misinformation about them intentionally or not. There's a great piece by KVin from SakugaBlog regarding Haikyu's exceptional production and I'd recommend reading it if you really want to know what goes on BTS instead of throwing made up facts here and there on the internet. Yes, I actually think better animation means a higher budget, not invariably, but in general. Animators are underpaid, but an exploited animator who works 200 hours get paid more than an exploited animator who works 100 hours. When the final product is better, it usually means more work, more out-sourcing to other studios and those studios are not going to charge less just because they are underpaying their own workers. Of course, it's not always the case. Some studios exploit their workers more than others. Some animators may choose to work overtime for free out of pride (OPM comes to mind). But in general, higher quality animation costs more to make. If you think Haikyuu was operating under the same budget as Ahiru no Sora and Ao Ashi, regardless of the production shortcuts used or otherwise, you are out of your mind. KNB is under production IG as well, but if you compare Haikyuu S1 and KnB S1, there's no way their budgets are comparable. Like seriously, Haikyuu's off-court moments are better animated than most of KnB S1's midseason basketball action. Anyway, I saw the article. Thanks for bringing it to my attention. https://blog.sakugabooru.com/2020/02/04/the-evolution-of-haikyuus-exceptional-production-refining-reality/ The role of elements like stock footage can’t be understated here. There are tons of sequences in Haikyuu that aren’t so much recycled as deliberately animated with multiple uses in mind. This actually proves my second point. This can be more easily done for volleyball than other sports like soccer and basketball. If such animation shortcuts are also effective for non-volleyball anime, other studios would try to replicate it and such methods would eventually become a new norm. We'd be seeing more movie-level animation operating under modest budgets. It's not like what they did was top secret stuff. Lastly, I don't know why you are bringing underpaid animators into this conversation. Because from the article, the production team is able to achieve such animation through cleverness and animation reuse rather than exploitation of animators. |
TorribleDec 16, 2022 8:48 AM
More topics from this board
Poll: » Blue Lock Episode 18 Discussion ( 1 2 3 4 )Stark700 - Feb 11, 2023 |
190 |
by EspionageArcs
»»
Yesterday, 4:01 PM |
|
Poll: » Blue Lock Episode 23 Discussion ( 1 2 3 4 )Stark700 - Mar 18, 2023 |
177 |
by Mmb23
»»
Sep 15, 12:03 PM |
|
Poll: » Blue Lock Episode 24 Discussion ( 1 2 3 4 5 ... Last Page )KANLen09 - Mar 25, 2023 |
362 |
by 37charles
»»
Sep 15, 9:39 AM |
|
Poll: » Blue Lock Episode 20 Discussion ( 1 2 3 )Stark700 - Feb 25, 2023 |
141 |
by ProGoddess
»»
Sep 9, 9:28 AM |
|
Poll: » Blue Lock Episode 15 Discussion ( 1 2 3 4 )Tatsunami - Jan 21, 2023 |
174 |
by ProGoddess
»»
Sep 9, 7:06 AM |