Retcon the NTR

Apr 14, 2015 9:31 PM

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May 2009

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Didn't realize it, but I made a mistake. Didn't notice the typo. Kids start Elementary at 7, or either they're going on 7 for that school year, unless it's a school or area that requires said students to be 7, 13, 16 by April 1.

Apr 15, 2015 12:03 AM

#52

CarenPriestess

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Jul 2013

1103

Yemi_Hikari said:

All students will turn eighteen during their final year of high school. The ones who turn eighteen early on in the school year are the ones with birthdays early in the school year. (Of course that may be what you meant, and I just didn't understand your wording of "one year later") Being held back a year before starting is actually something different. (Again... not sure exactly what you meant by the wording you used.)

Doesn't necessarily have to be either of the two.

My country uses the same overall system Japan does, and I started school a year early (NOT being held back a year), so I'll technically be 17 by the time it ends. While it's fairly - and rather surprisingly - rare, it does happen from time to time.

The vice versa also works. It's not completely outlandish for someone to enter school even though he's two years older than the standard, which just so happens to be the case with my younger brother (circumstances prevented him from entering earlier).

All I'm saying is, you guys are sticking to the age thing way too much. When it comes to classes, the age group is not quite a specification or requirement, but an EXPECTATION. One or two years deviation older or younger, not necessarily due to having to repeat a year, can very well happen.

Apr 15, 2015 1:44 PM

#53

Yemi_Hikari

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Jun 2008

751

@ CarenPriest – I actually did not mean to say “all students”, but instead “the majority of students”. I don't think there is a school system where there isn't some kind of outlier from the expectation or norm going both ways. Outliers are a minority though, and the expectation tends to be the majority.

@ y123y – The cases you're talking about are actually outliers from what is expected or is considered the norm. The first one you're talking about has a birthday close to the end of the term, but they also may have gone to one of the schools that does break away from the norm in regards to when they allow students to start school. You'll actually find many of these outliers in the American school system as well, as there are some schools which don't follow the norm.

Finding out the standard age for a grade level of any country is something anybody can easily do a quick search for in any search engine. I brought up Anime not as actual fact to support my point, but to point out a logic fallacy. If the majority of students do start at age sixteen like you say then why do the majority of people creating Anime get this fact wrong?

This doesn't make sense due to the fact the people creating Anime should know how the school system in Japan works far better then we do. This kind of occurrence is something which would make me go and double check my facts as things do not add up logically.

P.S. Italy's expectation or norm is rather interesting compared to the other countries I've looked at.

May 5, 2015 6:42 PM

#54

quercifolia

☆A-Qing's hair☆

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Jun 2008

1562

YamatoxDaichi > Sora pairings

May 6, 2015 4:00 AM

#55

elior1

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Jun 2011

2095

y123y said:
Just show the preview of the anime and air it during summer and make it 24-26 episodes and i promise I wont ship!!! pleaseeeeeeeeeeee

Stark, where are you with the preview!!!!!!!!!!!!

we at episode 48 right now in the marathonn not much episodes left before the preview

May 6, 2015 10:37 AM

#56

gedata

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Feb 2013

7532

May the Taichifags remain forever fannyflustered

May 6, 2015 3:34 PM

#57

Chanaynay

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Jul 2013

909

pagina said:
It's kind of funny to reference Naruto on this. I mean, Sorato x Taiora came hell long ago before that. To be fair, it is Naruto's shit that would be "like Digimon shipping war all over again".

Naruto spoilers ahead:

ChanaynayMay 6, 2015 3:40 PM

May 7, 2015 12:40 AM

#58

niwasatou

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Oct 2006

285

Lynx_7 said:
Because people always marry their first childhood crush and aren't allowed to change partners.

Tai lost, it's been over a decade, get over it.

Looks like unlike the characters some people never grew up...

May 7, 2015 2:52 AM

#59

White_Alice

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Jul 2012

3267

muhuchiki said:
OH SHUT THE FUCK UP ALREADY!

Digimon is a series about adventure,friendship and teaming up to save the world and not some cheesy slice of life romance shit...who the hell cares if Sora ends up with Tai or Matt, thats not the point of the show...

Agree with you ^_^

who the hell care with romance when u must save the world? :D
it's not a romance-shoujo show!~
but the best part of digimon is I can play it, not like other anime :3

May 7, 2015 10:26 AM

#60

OminousWrex

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May 2010

5840

muhuchiki said:
OH SHUT THE FUCK UP ALREADY!

Digimon is a series about adventure,friendship and teaming up to save the world and not some cheesy slice of life romance shit...who the hell cares if Sora ends up with Tai or Matt, thats not the point of the show...

Sounds pretty boring. Already have enough of those naive ideals in Marvel movies, the hundreds of shounen titles, and just about any American cartoon you can find out there. Whoopdy-doo for good guys saving the world. Thanks but, I'll save those Saturday morning cartoon cliches for my kids.

On the other hand, romance BS is not any better. I propose something with a little more substance, like realistic slice-of-life romance. It would be nice to see Taichi and Sora not pull a generic NTR, but interact with each other like mature adults about how they've matured and moved on from whatever unfortunate Taiora implications the fans had mistakenly plastered upon these two characters, despite the word of god claiming Sorato to be canon.

I'm a Taiora fan, btw. :3

May 7, 2015 11:24 AM

#61

OminousWrex

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May 2010

5840

y123y said:
Im a Tai fan. But... I just dont see the appeal in Sora that everyone sees. Yes, she was the best of the female cast, but she wasnt all that.

Whhhhhat? She's head-strong, loving, motherly, spunky, passionate, and isn't just some sissy girl like Mimi. She's like Taichi with all the good things about Yamato added to her.

y123y said:
When I saw that scene where Sora was going to give homemade cookies to Yamato, I was like "oh wow, you like Yamato? I thought that... oh well... thats that." I wasnt heartbroken or any of that stuff because Sora just wasnt all that.

Yeah, I was kinda bummed out, but I never felt that attached to Digimon to be 'traumatized' or anything. It's probably more due to associating myself with Taichi's personality than anything though.

Yamato's boring. He's the idealistic version of what an intelligent person should be. He's a good thinker and has his charms, but I never really found myself being that fond of that generic rocker. Join the rest of the 'intelligent Mary-Sues' out there like L and Kudo Shinichi. Sure, he had his insecurities back in the day (which amounted to being your stereotypical 'emo' Lone Wolves found in later seasons), but after 02, losing all that, he's this 'big brother' whogivesashit. At least Taichi still had some growing up to do in 02. I'm sorry if I've offended any Yamato fans out there, but there's just this fundamental annoyance that comes with him for some reason. I don't hate him, just find him 'meh'.

Touma from Savers is much more interesting than Yamato. Much smarter too. Unfortunately, he got outshined by the hilarious 'punch-everything' Masaru, whom I absolutely loves.

I've said it before in another thread titled "Sora", but I find Sorato pretty boring, because no conflict will ever happen with this pairing. It's mundane and realistic, not really a good formula for good drama. It's much more fun to watch Taichi and Sora have playful banter with each other as they struggle to compliment each other's flaws and help each other mature even further than they already had.

y123y said:
Mimi has always been pretty, but my problem with Mimi is that her personality has always stunk. Hopefully, she will have a better personality in the movies.

I love Mimi. She can be pretty annoying in Season 1 ESPECIALLY in the dubs, but in the subs, I find her innocence not that bad. She doesn't make any mean jokes on intention - unlike the dub. She's kinda like an airhead who doesn't think before she speaks. That changes in 02 though, when she's matured. In fact, after the maturity past the Vamdemon arc, she became quite likable and sympathetic, especially when she mourned for all the 'dead' Digimon.

y123y said:
So if Digimon wants to shock us Tai fans, then Tai should end with Hikari. Shock the fanbase >__>

Imagine, a love triangle between Tai x Mimi x Hikari.

I could imagine it being an incest hentai. That's pretty much the only place a Taichi x Hikari shipping will appear.

May 7, 2015 5:54 PM

#62

Yemi_Hikari

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Jun 2008

751

JacobKyon said:

Sounds pretty boring. Already have enough of those naive ideals in Marvel movies, the hundreds of shounen titles, and just about any American cartoon you can find out there. Whoopdy-doo for good guys saving the world. Thanks but, I'll save those Saturday morning cartoon cliches for my kids.[/quote]

Certain people unfortunately have the misconception the difference between shounen and shojo is a plot with no romance and a plot with romance when they simply identify target audience -- shounen is targeted towards boys, and shojo is targeted for girl. Add to this the misconception works aimed at a male target audience shouldn't have romance and works aimed at a female audience should have romance and you have exactly why people keep insisting the show shouldn't have any kind of romance -- that and the misconception that shows aimed at children never contain any romance.

I think my biggest issue with season two was how the series broke all the rules a good writer should follow if one is adding romance as a sub plot. If romance doesn't belong in the series then they shouldn't have touched upon pairings at all within the series, and yet the creators of the series made romance important to the series.

May 7, 2015 5:58 PM

#63

OminousWrex

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May 2010

5840

Yemi_Hikari said:
I think my biggest issue with season two was how the series broke all the rules a good writer should follow if one is adding romance as a sub plot. If romance doesn't belong in the series then they shouldn't have touched upon pairings at all within the series, and yet the creators of the series made romance important to the series.

Don't forget Taicherine. Ugh. That's a whole nother can of worms.

May 7, 2015 6:45 PM

#64

Yemi_Hikari

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Jun 2008

751

JacobKyon said:

Yemi_Hikari said:
I think my biggest issue with season two was how the series broke all the rules a good writer should follow if one is adding romance as a sub plot. If romance doesn't belong in the series then they shouldn't have touched upon pairings at all within the series, and yet the creators of the series made romance important to the series.

Don't forget Taicherine. Ugh. That's a whole nother can of worms.

I actually tend to forget about the trip to France because of how the custom of "faire la bise" is taken out of context. I'm not sure whether to blame more - the part of the staff attempting to push their own agenda without doing research or a lack of research by the fan base into said custom. For some reason I actually like the idea of shipping Matt with Catherine.

May 7, 2015 6:53 PM

#65

OminousWrex

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May 2010

5840

Yemi_Hikari said:
the part of the staff attempting to push their own agenda without doing research

Which begs the question... what was even the point of the world tour arc? Seriously, in Adventure 01, every arc had its own consistent conflict and drama, but the world tour arc has gotta be the most boring arc in the first two seasons. Was there a writer's strike during mid-production or something? Who came up with that crap?

OminousWrexMay 7, 2015 8:04 PM

May 7, 2015 7:49 PM

#66

Yemi_Hikari

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Jun 2008

751

JacobKyon said:

Yemi_Hikari said:
the part of the staff attempting to push their own agenda without doing research

Which begs the question... what was even the point of the world tour arc? Seriously, in Adventure 01, every arc had its own consistence conflict and drama, but the world tour arc has gotta be the most boring arc in the first two seasons. Was there a writer's strike during mid-production or something? Who came up with that crap?

Rumor has it there was a writer's strike where a bunch of writer's who weren't happy with the way the series was going did threaten to walk out so the company owning Digimon moved them onto the Tamers project. The most likely place for this to have occurred was during the world tour arc.

An supposed interview I've seen Matt/Sora fans use to support their pairing actually lends credence to this particular rumor. The interview with the director doesn't leave a good impression of the man. Pretty much imagine Hidaka Masamitsu claiming he was the creator of Pokemon and not Tajiri Satoshi. Imagine then people believing he and and the producer were the co-creators of the series, but never once crediting the real creator.

That's what's happened to Digimon.

As such there is no telling what will be ret-conned from season two. From the looks of it the happy ending is going to be ret-conned in some manner. Whether the ret-con is an outright retcon or they use time travel, all just a dream or some other trope.

May 7, 2015 8:15 PM

#67

Yemi_Hikari

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Jun 2008

751

y123y said:
Tai x Hikari It will happen. Hikari's a brocon last time I remembered.

Although I wouldnt mind Tai x Mimi, if and only if, Mimi gets a better personality.

idolization =/= romantic interest

May 7, 2015 8:15 PM

#68

OminousWrex

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May 2010

5840

y123y said:
Tai x Hikari It will happen. Hikari's a brocon last time I remembered.

lol Hikari is not a brocon... at least not in canon. She's as much a brocon as Taiora is canon.

I do admit though, she had quite the unhealthy attachment to Taichi, even up to 02. Then again, I've seen girls who in real life who have shown the same kind of affection for their elder brothers, and it's not like Hikari was as playing a martyr around Taichi in 02 as she was in 01. It would definitely be interesting to see some lingering sibling affection between the two, as 02 hardly fleshed out their sibling relationship as well as 01 (01 episode 21 is still my favorite episode, "Home Away From Home").

May 8, 2015 2:03 AM

#69

AvatarJinzo

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Aug 2013

484

I wouldn't mind the Matt x Sora thing if I've seen some character development between them but no the producers had to pull the "foreshadow and we let the fans use their imagination" move. But I don't care about that all I care about is seeing my main man Tai, the true digimon leader. I hope Tai and Agumon will some badass digimon battles in this six part movie series.

May 8, 2015 9:57 AM

#70

OminousWrex

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May 2010

5840

y123y said:
See, heres the thing that bothered me with the whole Yamato x Sora x Tai stuff.

If the producers were planning Yamato x Sora from the start as they said, and that Tai and Sora was never going to happen and that they were just friends, then why is it, in that episode 38 of season 2, the homemade cookies scene, why is it that Tai had to be there to witness Sora going to give cookies to Yamato? Was it really important for Tai to be there to witness him getting "NTR" as many have said? If Sora and Tai were just friends and nothing more, than that cookies scene should have just been Sora and Yamato, and Tai should not have been there. It just felt like getting NTR was part of Tai's development, which is just cruel, specially after that movie that occurred after season 1 and before season 2.

Not to mention the fact that even in the subbed version, not the American dub, Agumon said, "You've matured a lot, Taichi." Why the hell has he matured a lot if he's merely advising a friend to pursue another friend as a love interest? The logic here doesn't make sense.

May 8, 2015 4:08 PM

#71

Chanaynay

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Jul 2013

909

JacobKyon said:

y123y said:
See, heres the thing that bothered me with the whole Yamato x Sora x Tai stuff.

If the producers were planning Yamato x Sora from the start as they said, and that Tai and Sora was never going to happen and that they were just friends, then why is it, in that episode 38 of season 2, the homemade cookies scene, why is it that Tai had to be there to witness Sora going to give cookies to Yamato? Was it really important for Tai to be there to witness him getting "NTR" as many have said? If Sora and Tai were just friends and nothing more, than that cookies scene should have just been Sora and Yamato, and Tai should not have been there. It just felt like getting NTR was part of Tai's development, which is just cruel, specially after that movie that occurred after season 1 and before season 2.

Not to mention the fact that even in the subbed version, not the American dub, Agumon said, "You've matured a lot, Taichi." Why the hell has he matured a lot if he's merely advising a friend to pursue another friend as a love interest? The logic here doesn't make sense.

@y123y: I think they did to address the potential Taiora romance presented by the Our War Game movie (in the interview with the series director, he even addresses it by saying "“I had nothing to do with that movie"). So since Digimon fans knew Taichi had a crush on Sora, it had to be addressed for Sorato to become canon without confusing people even more.

@JacobKyon: Well Yamato and Sora are both of his best friends, and since he knew of Sora's feelings he decided to respect them rather than interfere in their relationship. If he kept trying to win her over even after he realized she liked someone else that would be immature. Deciding to move on and get over his feelings instead seems like the mature move to me.

And yes this is coming from a Taiora shipper with a grudge against heroine/rival ships. I'm just glad Sorato had a healthy relationship before the epilogue of 02.

May 8, 2015 4:22 PM

#72

OminousWrex

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May 2010

5840

Chanaynay said:
@JacobKyon: Well Yamato and Sora are both of his best friends, and since he knew of Sora's feelings he decided to respect them rather than interfere in their relationship. If he kept trying to win her over even after he realized she liked someone else that would be immature. Deciding to move on and get over his feelings instead seems like the mature move to me.

And yes this is coming from a Taiora shipper with a grudge against heroine/rival ships. I'm just glad Sorato had a healthy relationship before the epilogue of 02.

I get that. I meant to say, "Why the heck did Agumon say Taichi has matured a lot if the creators had no intentions for Taiora to be implied?" That line kinda states that the creators had some kind of intention towards Taichi expressing romantic interest in 02. I'm just saying.

The reason I'm compelled to point out this rather obvious observation is because there were anti-Taiora people out there who claimed that Taiora shippers are having delusions, that the creators never intended for Taiora to even remotely be a thing, when the evidence proves otherwise.

Yeah, I know I'm contradicting from what I said earlier about Taiora not being canon. Technically, Taiora still isn't canon, but the creators definitely intended for Taichi to have interest in a relationship with Sora back then in 02.

All in all though, I think it's better if tri. just stays out of these convoluted love triangles. They are hardly interesting, and they cause all kinds of unnecessary arguments and complications.

OminousWrexMay 8, 2015 4:34 PM

May 8, 2015 5:14 PM

#73

Chanaynay

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Jul 2013

909

JacobKyon said:
I get that. I meant to say, "Why the heck did Agumon say Taichi has matured a lot if the creators had no intentions for Taiora to be implied?" That line kinda states that the creators had some kind of intention towards Taichi expressing romantic interest in 02. I'm just saying.

Oooh that makes sense. Well since it ended up being a one-sided crush, maybe the creators meant...no it doesn't make sense either way. Good point.

The reason I'm compelled to point out this rather obvious observation is because there were anti-Taiora people out there who claimed that Taiora shippers are having delusions, that the creators never intended for Taiora to even remotely be a thing, when the evidence proves otherwise.

Oh yeah, I know this all too well from being a NaruSaku shipper. T_T

All in all though, I think it's better if tri. just stays out of these convoluted love triangles. They are hardly interesting, and they cause all kinds of unnecessary arguments and complications.

Agree!

May 9, 2015 4:15 PM

#74

OminousWrex

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May 2010

5840

ooo333 said:
IM CALLING IT RIGHT NOW!!!!!! This is how the romance in the movies will be:

Yamato and Sora will be a couple. But then, all of a sudden, Mimi falls in love with Yamato. And Mimi will cause drama for Yamato to see if he really loves Sora. In the end, he goes back to Sora, who spent most of the movies sad because of Yamato.

And Tai will get nothing.

Taichi will get beastiality love with Agumon. 'Coz you know Japan likes that weird kink.

May 11, 2015 11:37 AM

#75

Yemi_Hikari

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Jun 2008

751

There is actual evidence that Sora had a crush on Tai as well, but ended up giving up on him. I think the main problem lies with a certain director believing any form of relationship between Tai and Sora didn't exist because the movies and games weren't created by said director. Problem - he's not the original creator, so he shouldn't be acting like he is the original creator.

May 11, 2015 10:03 PM

#76

Yemi_Hikari

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Jun 2008

751

ooo333 said:
From a business point of view, the creators decided on Sora and Yamato because Yamato and Sora were really popular in Jpn, and many fans over there shipped Yamato x Sora much much more than they shipped Tai x Sora, and the creators wanted to increase sales if they put Yamato x Sora. Hey, it got them another season and many more seasons since.

How? The Tamers project was green lit prior to adding Matt and Sora into 02, and they moved staff from the 02 project onto the Tamers project because the staff members were threatening to walk out due to disagreements with the rest of the staff. There was also little to nothing about said pairing until the end.

What I remember from that time period is also very different. Sales tanked because of season two for both the Anime and games released during said time period and what kept the franchise afloat was the V-Tamers manga. Tamers was meant to fix the slump the franchise fell into because of season two.

Sep 16, 2019 3:53 AM

#77

mechian

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Jun 2009

1045

I'm disappointed the NTR was partially retconned only to return in the last 2 minutes of the end.

Poll: » Do you like the character design in Tri? ( 1 2 3 ) cro3 - Feb 20, 2015	106	by JVskunkape »» Aug 28, 2023 12:48 AM
» Why does everyone hate the 02 characters? 12ylie - May 12, 2015	22	by JVskunkape »» Aug 27, 2023 11:42 PM
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» Plot holes in 02? cro3 - Mar 16, 2015	29	by Ducksama14 »» Apr 2, 2022 9:25 PM

Retcon the NTR

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