Othi-tan said: Epicenter said: This is ridiculous.for what he did to Rider. . You are basically saying that he shouldn't have taken Rider seriously.Which means Rider wouldnt get his heart beating like crazy,enjoying the battlefield and finally reaching Okeanos. I think you're looking too much into it. I'm just a sore/butt hurt Rider fan who didn’t want to see him die/lose, at least not by the hands of someone besides the main character, therefore I hold a permanent grudge over Gil defeating him. Actually. I sort of goes deeper when it comes to me infinitely always rooting against Gil. But I want to preface this, before I get bombarded by the VN army like I’ve seen happen to multiple people. When I watched Fate Zero, I had 0 knowledge of Fate-I didn't even go on anime forums and watch anime with a more critical eye-, I thought Zero was the end all be all, to me it was its own story, so everything here might sound utterly silly, but I'll say it anyways because it's how my seat was formed. Aside from Rider, I was very interested in the Tokiomi team. Tokiomi despite perhaps being over dedicated to his work to me seemed like a pretty alright guy considering the setting of the story, especially if compared to the other mages in the show in that old Zouken guy abusing multiple people, Kaynath and his asshole wife, even Waver-though he grew on me later- was a liar and was brainwashing an innocent old couple to get ahead as a mage, so I liked him, not my fav like Kirei, kid Rin and Rider but good enough right alongside Saber. I really felt attached to Kirei, it was a personal bias since I’m an agnostic/lapsed catholic raised by a religious family, I was enamored at how he was this thoughtful guy trying to do what was right, struggled to find his personal enjoyment in life and how to others he might seem a bit too detached emotionally. Gil was alright with me, maybe it was his blonde hair and his lectures about enjoying life, but I really thought he’d be Kirei’s Great Teacher Onizuka, I thought he’d be the one to make Kirei smile and realize he can enjoy life even without the ways of the church. Compounded with the fact I never really liked Kiritsugu before his flashback-still not in my top fav Zero characters after it-, since I considered him to fit the bill of overrated cynical anime characters and he kept interfering in/ruining epic fights, plus kept being mean to Saber, I really became a bigger fan of Kirei. I think a part of me even thought Kirei would obtain Saber(since she was main character I knew she’d have to have a critical role in the end), saving her from Kiritsugu-Who I thought would have killed Tokiomi eventually- since she hated his guts. But instead, from my view at the time, Gil corrupted Kirei into a betrayal-I do now know years later that Kirei was always crazy but just not outwardly so it’s not completely Gil’s fault-, causing the death of Tokiomi who Gil should have been loyal to, having Kirei turn into a sociopath-which to me sucked because the character who left the church and sought for happiness became the villain with utterly disgusting ways.- and then he defeated Rider. Therefore Gil negatively effected my three fav characters, killing one, corrupted another and leaving another fatherless as a child, plus did what I consider what is one of the worst things people can do and that’s betrayal. So yeah, I dislike him and root for anything that involves him getting owned or in any way harmed. Same with Kirei, I especially enjoyed when Caster had Kirei running like a punk and had him bleeding, though I’m sure he’ll probably get his revenge sadly, but still was fun while it lasted. Now before people look at my long post and say I take it too serious. It’s not like I sit around plotting anything on the writers, it’s not like I disliked fate zero-I loved it- and it’s not like I actually think of Gil that much in life. But when I watch an ep of Fate, I always hope he and Kirei get what’s coming to them, in fact I hope Rin is the one who lays the smackdown on both of them, I wish she did that more than her silly tsundere stuff that convinces me more and more that she won’t be achieving ownage on Kirei. I hope she’s at least there to see their downfall when Shirou probably gets to be the one who does shit since he is main character-sadly, I mean he’s cool, but from a Zero point of view coming into UBW point of view I don’t care about him as much as Rin-. Even if all this doesn’t happen, I’ll still like UBW because of its quality despite not seeing what I want to see get done. |
| Jaywalker. |
WrongPriest said: Epicenter said: And yes Wrong Priest, I do concede that said fan service was quality ass fan service. Not much of a concession, I did enjoy it, just as you said made me take her less serious, which is funny since she was just a kid, but a badass kid. This is how I spend my time coping with Rin's new position of fan-service grill. http://lalagif.com/lewronggif Lol, people make the craziest/pointless/best things on the internet. |
| Jaywalker. |
| I didn't read the whole thing but let me just say that calling whatever waver did brainwashing is giving the kid far too much credit. |
fst said: I didn't read the whole thing but let me just say that calling whatever waver did brainwashing is giving the kid far too much credit. Well whatever it was close enough lol. Either way, brain washing, tampering with memories andor illusions, he was highly questionable for what he did. He got off way too easy with them being nice about it. Still like him overall though. |
| Jaywalker. |
| Which reminds me, it's kind of sad that Waver isn't appearing in this. |
| Jaywalker. |
Epicenter said: Which reminds me, it's kind of sad that Waver isn't appearing in this. you never know..... |
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chat77 said: Epicenter said: Which reminds me, it's kind of sad that Waver isn't appearing in this. you never know..... It would be epic if he showed up in the last episode and drop kicks Gil for defeating Rider, and with the grail summons Rider back to life and they have the ultimate bro moment of the century. |
| Jaywalker. |
Epicenter said: -Long but reasonable post- You won't find any "good" main characters in Fate verse. The only reasonable people are the extra characters such Taiga, Issei and Mitsuzuri. As for Shirou not being interesting, you need to know about all three routes. They all have the same start, where Shirou has mostly false view of Kiritsugu's ideals. All three routes see him grow and deviate from it in different ways. As for Gil, he's the main villain in Fate route. He appears as a main villain in UBW, but he really isn't the focus, and Kirei is just another extra character in UBW. Kirei gets the most attention in Heaven's Feel. You'll get to know his back story and his true personality in that route. F/Z Kirei is about him being clueless about himself. One thing I can't understand from your post tho about you thinking Tokiomi was an alright guy. |
Epicenter said: chat77 said: you never know..... It would be epic if he showed up in the last episode and drop kicks Gil for defeating Rider, and with the grail summons Rider back to life and they have the ultimate bro moment of the century. uh no...thats a bit too far fetched but he has a pretty legit chance of appearing in the final episode. |
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chat77 said: Epicenter said: It would be epic if he showed up in the last episode and drop kicks Gil for defeating Rider, and with the grail summons Rider back to life and they have the ultimate bro moment of the century. uh no...thats a bit too far fetched but he has a pretty legit chance of appearing in the final episode. I think I have struggles when it comes to conveying when I'm playing around or not, but I don't like inserting lol too many times to do it. I don't actually think Waver would do that, or even could lol. |
| Jaywalker. |
iravuseiba said: Epicenter said: -Long but reasonable post- You won't find any "good" main characters in Fate verse. The only reasonable people are the extra characters such Taiga, Issei and Mitsuzuri. As for Shirou not being interesting, you need to know about all three routes. They all have the same start, where Shirou has mostly false view of Kiritsugu's ideals. All three routes see him grow and deviate from it in different ways. As for Gil, he's the main villain in Fate route. He appears as a main villain in UBW, but he really isn't the focus, and Kirei is just another extra character in UBW. Kirei gets the most attention in Heaven's Feel. You'll get to know his back story and his true personality in that route. F/Z Kirei is about him being clueless about himself. One thing I can't understand from your post tho about you thinking Tokiomi was an alright guy. I don't recall Tokiomi doing anything particularly heinous. Sure he wasn't heroic or anything, but he seemed like a neutral alriight guy to me, arguably even honourable. I don't really have anything agaisn't Shirou, I'm just more into Rin because she was developed more in Zero. You saw her as a kid overcoming her fears to fight those things from Caster, saving a bunch of other kids in the process, she was also the one who saw through Kirei and you got that emotional connection because her father got killed and her mother got messed up, yet she still grew up strong and over came it all.Her spunk was also great. Shirou was just picked up out of some last episode fire, and barely seemed important. |
| Jaywalker. |
| Archer, rin and Gil gets a lot of scenes. honestly, i wouldn't be surprised to see a shirtless archer at some point. but thats a given since the douch class archer class has the best abs objectively speaking ( ͡° ͜ʖ ͡°) |
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WrongPriest said: Dumb oaf should have just jumped off the bridge. lmfao |
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chat77 said: Epicenter said: It would be epic if he showed up in the last episode and drop kicks Gil for defeating Rider, and with the grail summons Rider back to life and they have the ultimate bro moment of the century. uh no...thats a bit too far fetched but he has a pretty legit chance of appearing in the final episode. No no no no no. Legit how about no. No. No. NO. nO |
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CookingPriest said: chat77 said: uh no...thats a bit too far fetched but he has a pretty legit chance of appearing in the final episode. No no no no no. Legit how about no. No. No. NO. nO Tsk......Miura,Fai |
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| lol yeah I'm more butthurt about what he did to iskandar too. Yes he was a heroic spirit and not a real person but broskandar > all. |
Epicenter said: Close but not quite. If they show Waver then he'll definitely be badass, but he won't be part of UBW's story.chat77 said: you never know..... It would be epic if he showed up in the last episode and drop kicks Gil |
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| followed up from a now nuked post chain... FanEu said: you mind those spoilers dude? you F/Z fanboys throwing around spoilers and not even realising it.i would say a lot of your complaint has to do with all the "why you should watch F/Z last". F/Z is very very consistent with F/SN you just got the wrong impression. what you basically did was watch the last chapter then came back asking why arent these things adressed at the 2nd chapter...the Fate series has always been about it's characters even F/Z. F/Z just has more "HGW focus" because that is really all there is for F/Z to do. F/SN covered every single bit that could be covered and laid down the foundation so then you have F/Z which is more or less extra content. another thing to point out is htat F/Z had to be an ensemble cast to cover ALL the plot threads that lead into F/SN. it's also a hell of a lot simpler than F/SN because it's a condensed story. -for saber. i'm sorry you as a new fan just gets fucked in this department. UBW is not the saber saber story. Saber will receive resolution here too it just wont be as spectacular as it was in Fate. Fate is meant to be the "first chapter". Saber's story is the foundation that all the fate series/stories are built upon. and it's not getting an adaptation. if you happen to live in japan you at least get the fate route as a free phone app. The author himself even said he's tired of doing Saber's story because it's been done to death for over 10 years now. -Kirei is not a major player here. plain and simple. it's apart of the format FSN is writen under. he will play a major role in the upcoming HF though. and beleive me you havent seen him at his best. no character in FSN aside from shirou gets more than two routes worth of major spotlight. it's a matter of not putting all your eggs in one basket. -gil -Sakura -the nature of the grail is revealed in all 3 routes. -the characters being uninteresting..well i wanna sya this boils down to a combination of things. but i also wanna say if you had read the material you probably would have a different view on them also. but not the same amount of depth of F/Z? a thing to note is that the FSN characters have 3 entire stories plus Hollow ataraxia worth of characterization. when everything is laid out the F/Z characters dont really compare imo, it's not even a matter of shit talking it's just the F/Z chars got what they can get in a short timespan compared to a story that is like double the length of lord of the rings. -plot armor. while you havent elaborated on this i can almost see what your about to complain about and i can almost garantee there is an answer for it and a reason why it isnt plot armor....a large number of F/Z viewers have certain complaints that are in fact adressed and adressable....we'll just see how the anime handles it and run damage control. because by now your suppose to have known how exactly shirou's weapon projection works... -going to school. a thing to point out that isnt stressed in F/Z is the fact that most of the action happens at night. the ensemble cast of F/Z also didnt linger on characters long enough for you to actually get to see them outside of the magus life. Rin is not exactly a low prophile person. she has to maintain apearence inspite of her keeping herself mostly isolated from others. Rin suddenly dissapearing is gonna cause even more problems then solving them. to top this off there was another master looking to murder the entire school so yes she had to go to stop that from happening. whether or not a school full of kids getting killed matters to you there is still the fact that the servant could have gotten a power boost from it. and the romance really isnt a forced and cliched....or at least it's not suppose to be....there is a reason why these ships have fans. and some things just didnt really make it into the anime... when it comes to Fate in general your talking about not only an expansive world but a multiverse. and it's rather closely knit. however type-moon/ nasu series are really not for instant satisfaction, they never have been. it's not gonna sit here and spoon feed you everything nor is it gonna hold your hand. this as well as F/Z Kara no kyouakai and HF all require your undivided attention to get every bit of detail out of it. some of which wont even make sense until the end and EVERYTHING(UBW+HF for example and even this will be missing the FAte route..) is laid out. - |
| Lol seems like I missed whatever was going on, I would have hoped people could be civil so there is no need for nuking by I assume mods. I didn't read that whole post, and won't until much later since I have stuff I must do, but I just wanted to state that the title of this thread clearly states spoilers, clearly indicates that this would be a place UBW could be spoken about through a Fate Zero point of view and I don't see why anyone who hadn't watched Fate Zero would be reading. So I don't get that F/Z fanboys not realizing spoilers intro Malog. |
| Jaywalker. |
FanEu said: Alright man thanks I appreciate the detailed answers I agree though watching F/Z first definetly soured my experience with F/SN Looking forward to HF since it seems lots of things will be resolved F?Z is supposed to be left to be watched last since its a prequel for F/SN the right order is Fate--> UBW---> HF---> F/Z You will receive some answers in H/F but not all of them. The answers for F/Z are shared in the three routes (In UBW less so) |
Epicenter said: this was in response to a post in the episode thread. i had to move it here before it got deletedLol seems like I missed whatever was going on, I would have hoped people could be civil so there is no need for nuking by I assume mods. I didn't read that whole post, and won't until much later since I have stuff I must do, but I just wanted to state that the title of this thread clearly states spoilers, clearly indicates that this would be a place UBW could be spoken about through a Fate Zero point of view and I don't see why anyone who hadn't watched Fate Zero would be reading. So I don't get that F/Z fanboys not realizing spoilers intro Malog. |
| In my view Saber isn't even more robotic in UBW, she's just seen less, in fact she might even be more human. She get's all offended over Shirou preferring Archer's blades and getting all bent up of shape over that baseball thing. Her protective streak is the same in both animes. Usually she'd be stoic all the time and talking about honour, though she still has those stoic elements at times, it's not like its new. I must admit, as much as I lose respect for Rin as a character due to tsundere emphasis and fan service, it's a strange double edge sword because her interactions with Shirou actually at times greatly amuse and entertain me. I didn't really enjoy their picnic with Saber or whatever it's called, but I crack up when she get's all pissed when Shirou forgets to meet her, or that she has to stand outside of his class pissed, or her menacing smiles at people, and Shirou and Lancer actually amused me last episode too. However, I just really wish Rin would hurry up in avenging her family, or at least have more scenes with her bad mouthing Kirei. I miss the kickass elements of kid Rin. Maybe its because I actually like Caster's master, but I feel like characters like him get a good enough amount of being able to tell us their views and beliefs. The truest downgrade to me is the battles. Fate Zero's battles had a certain more intense feeling to them, while in UBW so many of these fights have flashbacks in the middle of them or end without conclusion, cutting away from the fights or off-screen kills of servants. But that's my take on it. But hey, looks like there might be some good fights to come, hopefully nothing stupid happens. |
| Jaywalker. |
Epicenter said: The two fights from this route that I actually wanted to see the most have yet to be animated if that says anything, dunno if one of them is even going to be good due to issues with how they portrayed certain characters though.But hey, looks like there might be some good fights to come, hopefully nothing stupid happens. |
WrongPriest said: Yea I'm talking about I didn't know Feaor was also worried about little ol Shirou.. or are you talking about someone else? I'm not current with the new season as I've found watching a couple episodes in one sitting provides a better experience but I could see them screwing up that scene given everything we saw last season. |
| Hmm... let's see... Fate/Zero Saber vs Lancer = great Gil vs Berserker = good Saber+Lancer vs Caster = average Kayneth vs Kiritsugu = average (yeaaaah... let's barge into the house of the magus who just destroyed whole skyscraper to kill you and expect from him to fight like a normal mage) Gil vs Berserker, sky battle = great Saber vs Lancer 2 = good Gil vs Rider = average Saber vs Berserker = average Kiritsugu vs Kirei = great I think I mentioned them all... except few that were pure curbstomp like Rider vs Assassin UfoUBW Archer vs Lancer = great Saber+Archer vs Berserker = good Rin vs Illya = great Shirou vs Rin = great Shirou vs Rider = average Saber vs Assassin = great Archer vs Caster = meh (complete disappointment) Kuzuki ambush = good Gil vs Berserker = meh (complete disappointment) Interestingly, Saber vs Lancer in Zero and Archer vs Lancer in UfoUBW are both first fights, and in my opinion are best fights in their respective series. Also, from the visual standpoint, Zero fights were much more interesting to watch overall, due to better choreography and way more dynamic camera movement. But neither of them come even close to Prisma Illya when it comes to animating battles. Those things are just gorgeous to watch. |
astroprogs said: If HF ended up being a single movie, what would it need to do so it can get a high score from all of you? Not air. |
Epicenter said: that's nice you can catch saber's character here. unlike in F/Z she is in a much different environment and thus will act differently. the anime does have some missed chances to "show" her character more. like when she's asking about kiritsugu at dinner. she asks this question because she never met this "caring father" that taiga is talking about. all she ever knew from him is " the magus killer" and in the toolshed scene with archer it struck her pretty deep as well as shirou. since you have no fate route you wont get everything about her that makes her so popular but you still get something...more like crumbs but lol. no fate route means you wont get some aspects of her In my view Saber isn't even more robotic in UBW, she's just seen less, in fact she might even be more human. She get's all offended over Shirou preferring Archer's blades and getting all bent up of shape over that baseball thing. Her protective streak is the same in both animes. Usually she'd be stoic all the time and talking about honour, though she still has those stoic elements at times, it's not like its new. I must admit, as much as I lose respect for Rin as a character due to tsundere emphasis and fan service, it's a strange double edge sword because her interactions with Shirou actually at times greatly amuse and entertain me. I didn't really enjoy their picnic with Saber or whatever it's called, but I crack up when she get's all pissed when Shirou forgets to meet her, or that she has to stand outside of his class pissed, or her menacing smiles at people, and Shirou and Lancer actually amused me last episode too. However, I just really wish Rin would hurry up in avenging her family, or at least have more scenes with her bad mouthing Kirei. I miss the kickass elements of kid Rin. Maybe its because I actually like Caster's master, but I feel like characters like him get a good enough amount of being able to tell us their views and beliefs. The truest downgrade to me is the battles. Fate Zero's battles had a certain more intense feeling to them, while in UBW so many of these fights have flashbacks in the middle of them or end without conclusion, cutting away from the fights or off-screen kills of servants. But that's my take on it. But hey, looks like there might be some good fights to come, hopefully nothing stupid happens. as for rin..blame the adaptation. it doesnt do much to highlight rins struggles. she doesnt suffer nearly as bad as shirou does but she still sufferes. the anime trades highlighting her flaws and showing she's "perfect" because she's not perfect. it's been said time and time agian the the picnic does in fact serve a purpose and it plays heavily into shirou. the anime didnt do too much to highlight the punchline of the date but you should by now have at least gotten the idea of why it happened. shirou doesnt live for himself she wants him to get the idea to do so. bit from the date. you probably have not caught a large number of subtlties from rin but it will fall into place in a few episodes and then it should really drive home why she made the date in the first place. you F/Z fans may hate the date but there is a purpose it serves and it will make more sense in hindsight. a bigger part of their banter is that shirou is invoking rin's "tsun tsun" it doesnt really look that way because shirou is a straight faced character and the anime doesnt lend much credibility to his actions despite going through the trouble of animating them. though i will say as much as i'm lovin rin's tsun tsun and dere dere it can get a bit much.....and it overshadows her as a character. as for avenging her family, what is rin gonna avenge? all she knows is that her father went off to the HGW and died. dying is a natural thing that occurs in the life of a magus she has no reason to seek some "vendetta" that she didnt have in the first place. as for her kicking ass you will see more of it soon very soon and even in HF she reaches a new level of badass. Rin is like the obi-wan kenobi of fate. only instead of dying she gets more awesome. another thing i want to point out is that we're watching this series week by week. try doing this with F/Z your gonna feel the same slow pacing. the kuzuki scenes are nice with this archer conversation in the new ep it looks like nasu is gonna take the opportunity to give him some more character that he didnt get the chance to before. now for rider's off-screen death this was actually for the benefit of introducing Kuzuki. Kuzuki had actually not made any significant appearance before this point in the story(even for VN readers) nor has caster has any real presence during the saber story. in saber's route she pretty much just shows up and gets killed. and the reason for this is that she never had a reason to after saber in the saber route. Saber got her ass royaly handed to her by berserker because shirou didn't use his command seal to stop her from hurting archer in the begining. a bit of a butterfly effect deal. there is a reason why the fights end abruptly partly if you pay attention, but these all make more sense when you actually know all the character motivations....it's kind of a hindsight thing. no character baring shirou gets a major role in more than 2 routes rider her got shafted so now you can guess what that means for her in the other routes..or in this case the upcoming HF. as for flashbacks in the middle? uh...that's really more the anime doing that....the winter forest flashback actually happens AFTER the fight in the vn so it didnt interrupt it. if i recall the only real huge interuptor was the first lancer vs archer fight were rin breaks into exposition mid fight....but there isnt too much like that....well at least for most of the upcoming fights....though i get the feeling we're gonna see some inserted flashbacks...soon. |
MaloghurstApr 28, 2015 8:43 PM
| So is this a bash F/Z and suck off FSN thread? |
| Signature removed. Please follow the signature rules, as defined in the Site & Forum Guidelines. |
Eylandos said: this is just a chat about F/Z and UBW thread were f/z fans can make posts and not worry about spoilers. FSN fans will still have to be a little mindful though since FSN still has a few tricks up it's sleeve. so far this thread has managed to avoid any real bashing. believe me if you think a couple little shots being fired is bashing F/Z you really havent been in this subforum. and really we dont hate F/Z it's just the F/Z fans coming aorund trying to be on some misconceived highhorse spouting bullshit and bashing FSN constantly for the last 6 months that gets bashed on. can't come around spit in somebodies face and not expect to get punched in the mouth know what i mean?So is this a bash F/Z and suck off FSN thread? |
MaloghurstApr 28, 2015 8:48 PM
| @Maloghurst Indeed it was nice to see Saber get a different touch of how Kiritsugu had lived very differently without her and outside his cold hearted role she saw. I worded my post about Rin and avenge her family wrongly, when I said I wish she would avenge them already I meant that from my viewing perspective, meaning I would personally would love to see her own them for what she did to her family, so her family is avenged and I can watch the justice being laid out, even if she as a character is unaware of this. As you seem to have gathered by yourself, I did binge watch Fate Zero, so my anxiousness for things getting done in UBW might indeed be unfair lol. Perhaps this is going off on a tangent, but based Eylandos post and your reply, and the general hostilities that have occurred since UBW began, I'll just say this. I really think a lot of this beefing that has occurred between Fate Zero people and VN readers is unfortunate, but comes from sides refusing to take in the other side's placement with fairness. For sure, some of us Zero starters have not adjusted to the fact that this setting involves younger characters and focuses on things we hadn't expected, and should come to terms with that reality. Also our judgments may come too soon since the anime isn't over-though at the same time, we are talking week by week so what else can we discuss but what is going on currently in our opinions.- I think VN readers have a tendency to forget, or have a sort of defense mechanism that ignores it to defend their beloved material, that whenever a poster from Fate Zero says something about UBW that they're talking from an anime stand point, you're one of the more civil VN people but you'll add statements like "blame the adaption" for Rin's struggles not being delved into more and how a flashback wasn't in the middle of a fight in the VN, when of course everything I say is based on the adaption since that's what this forum is about, I wouldn't say anything about the VN since I haven't read it. For example, I've seen various posts about Shirou, and how frustrated people are when he is criticized when in the VN readers' point of view he is much more witty and controls Rin via trolling/baiting, you can't really expect Shirou the anime character to be respected for something that is not part of the anime, especially when to us he is being presented as a clueless buffoon. When someone from Fate Zero, or anime fans in general, say "Shirou is bland" on an anime forum they aren't talking about Shirou from the VN-though considering the last episode, that'll probably stop happening as things seem to be changing for him anyways based on his crazed expression and his talk with Lancer-. I understand that many VN people have a loyalty and adoration for the world building and bridging stories that Nasu created, therefore I can see why they'd get protective if they see the name of his work being criticized, but it really needs to be kept in mind that its not the story of fate or Nasu being criticized, but what we are watching instead. This isn't just a VN people issue of course, it goes through many different areas, manga fans get touchy when people say something about what they saw in an anime, book readers get angry about what happens in shows and movies, then try to defend it through what happened in the manga, book, etc instead of what is being talked about. I myself try to keep this in mind when someone says something about GOT, I read some of the books, but I don't perceive an insult to the show an insult on the work of Martin. |
EpicenterApr 28, 2015 10:03 PM
| Jaywalker. |
Epicenter said: @Maloghurst Indeed it was nice to see Saber get a different touch of how Kiritsugu had lived very differently without her and outside his cold hearted role she saw. I worded my post about Rin and avenge her family wrongly, when I said I wish she would avenge them already I meant that from my viewing perspective, meaning I would personally would love to see her own them for what she did to her family, so her family is avenged and I can watch the justice being laid out, even if she as a character is unaware of this. As you seem to have gathered by yourself, I did binge watch Fate Zero, so my anxiousness for things getting done in UBW might indeed be unfair lol. Perhaps this is going off on a tangent, but based Eylandos post and your reply, and the general hostilities that have occurred since UBW began, I'll just say this. I really think a lot of this beefing that has occurred between Fate Zero people and VN readers is unfortunate, but comes from sides refusing to take in the other side's placement with fairness. For sure, some of us Zero starters have not adjusted to the fact that this setting involves younger characters and focuses on things we hadn't expected, and should come to terms with that reality. Also our judgments may come too soon since the anime isn't over-though at the same time, we are talking week by week so what else can we discuss but what is going on currently in our opinions.- I think VN readers have a tendency to forget, or have a sort of defense mechanism that ignores it to defend their beloved material, that whenever a poster from Fate Zero says something about UBW that they're talking from an anime stand point, you're one of the more civil VN people but you'll add statements like "blame the adaption" for Rin's struggles not being delved into more and how a flashback wasn't in the middle of a fight in the VN, when of course everything I say is based on the adaption since that's what this forum is about, I wouldn't say anything about the VN since I haven't read it. For example, I've seen various posts about Shirou, and how frustrated people are when he is criticized when in the VN readers' point of view he is much more witty and controls Rin via trolling, you can't really expect Shirou the anime character to be respected for something that is not part of the anime. When someone from Fate Zero, or anime fans in general, say "Shirou is bland" on an anime forum they aren't talking about Shirou from the VN-though considering the last episode, that'll probably stop happening as things seem to be changing for him anyways based on his crazed expression and his talk with Lancer-. I understand that many VN people have a loyalty and adoration for the world building and bridging stories that Nasu created, therefore I can see why they'd get protective if they see the name of his work being criticized, but it really needs to be kept in mind that its not the story of fate or Nasu being criticized, but what we are watching instead. This isn't just a VN people issue of course, it goes through many different areas, manga fans get touchy when people say something about what they saw in an anime, book readers get angry about what happens in shows and movies, then try to defend it through what happened in the manga, book, etc instead of what is being talked about. I myself try to keep this in mind when someone says something about GOT, I read some of the books, but I don't perceive an insult to the show an insult on the work of Martin. Despite my own tendency to get carried away sometimes, there is much truth here, will try to keep it in mind when I rant, though I promise nothing. |
| I'll change this as soon as I think of something clever. |
WrongPriest said: Not at all, It's probably the most balanced thread we've had here in ages. im sorry but lol. sorry, but sadly, no. just, no... |
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WAD1992 said: WrongPriest said: Not at all, It's probably the most balanced thread we've had here in ages. im sorry but lol. sorry, but sadly, no. just, no... Well atleast there has been no shitting on each other....most of the time |
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chat77 said: WAD1992 said: im sorry but lol. sorry, but sadly, no. just, no... Well atleast there has been no shitting on each other....most of the time thats just cz UFO is doing the adaptation. and now priests are looking to rape up the series all together with a ribbon :3 not against it or anything, but it seams a bit "convenient" but whateves ... live and let live i guess. and to be fair , i have only met a few fate fans who gave F/Z its well deserved praise even before UFO did the adaptation. |
ZA_WAYDApr 29, 2015 2:08 PM
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WrongPriest said: WAD1992 said: thats just cz UFO is doing the adaptation. and now priests are looking to rape up the series all together with a ribbon :3 not against it or anything, but it seams a bit "convenient" but whateves ... live and let live i guess. and to be fair , i have only met a few fate fans who gave F/Z its well deserved praise even before UFO did the adaptation. What are you going on about waddlez? Go back to the F/Z episode discussion threads back when it was airing and there was most of the posters here (the ones that were active back then) sucking dick and fighting off secondaries with sticks. The only thing that's changed now is F/Z became another weapon to hurt the poor porn game, so it too became a causality. Much like the slaine paine traine, there simply is no end to it. I wonder if this circlejerk will still be a thing in another 50 years... |
| wait..you guys arent really trying to complain about this thread are you? it's been pretty decent so far all things considering. we've had plenty of F/Z fans make entire threads here in this subforum just to bash FSN. i dare say this thread has remained quite tame. i mean this is a hell of a lot better than "FSN is stupid because that girl said onii-chan". and like 30 pages of "similar = the same". Epicenter said: i understand, and i'll try to maintain the thought when i respond to F/Z fans. I just can't honestly make any promises or guarantees especially with the shit that i've seen these last 6 months. but i can understand, i use to be in the position of AO starting with F/Z then watching DEENstay night before going through the VN. |
Aurioch said: Hmm... let's see... Fate/Zero Saber vs Lancer = great Gil vs Berserker = good Saber+Lancer vs Caster = average Kayneth vs Kiritsugu = average (yeaaaah... let's barge into the house of the magus who just destroyed whole skyscraper to kill you and expect from him to fight like a normal mage) Gil vs Berserker, sky battle = great Saber vs Lancer 2 = good Gil vs Rider = average Saber vs Berserker = average Kiritsugu vs Kirei = great I think I mentioned them all... except few that were pure curbstomp like Rider vs Assassin UfoUBW Archer vs Lancer = great Saber+Archer vs Berserker = good Rin vs Illya = great Shirou vs Rin = great Shirou vs Rider = average Saber vs Assassin = great Archer vs Caster = meh (complete disappointment) Kuzuki ambush = good Gil vs Berserker = meh (complete disappointment) Interestingly, Saber vs Lancer in Zero and Archer vs Lancer in UfoUBW are both first fights, and in my opinion are best fights in their respective series. Also, from the visual standpoint, Zero fights were much more interesting to watch overall, due to better choreography and way more dynamic camera movement. But neither of them come even close to Prisma Illya when it comes to animating battles. Those things are just gorgeous to watch. I also think Zero just had more creative battles in general from a narrative standpoint, because they were more about the battles themselves and less about the idealogical conflict ala F/SN. But because of that.. In the 1st half of F/Z characters would just randomly fight with no narrative consequence, and while that worked wonders in terms of giving us lots of awesome animation and choreography, it didn't really work for the plot. |
Aurioch said: Hmm... let's see... Fate/Zero Saber vs Lancer = great Gil vs Berserker = good Saber+Lancer vs Caster = average Kayneth vs Kiritsugu = average (yeaaaah... let's barge into the house of the magus who just destroyed whole skyscraper to kill you and expect from him to fight like a normal mage) Gil vs Berserker, sky battle = great Saber vs Lancer 2 = good Gil vs Rider = average Saber vs Berserker = average Kiritsugu vs Kirei = great I think I mentioned them all... except few that were pure curbstomp like Rider vs Assassin UfoUBW Archer vs Lancer = great Saber+Archer vs Berserker = good Rin vs Illya = great Shirou vs Rin = great Shirou vs Rider = average Saber vs Assassin = great Archer vs Caster = meh (complete disappointment) Kuzuki ambush = good Gil vs Berserker = meh (complete disappointment) Interestingly, Saber vs Lancer in Zero and Archer vs Lancer in UfoUBW are both first fights, and in my opinion are best fights in their respective series. Also, from the visual standpoint, Zero fights were much more interesting to watch overall, due to better choreography and way more dynamic camera movement. But neither of them come even close to Prisma Illya when it comes to animating battles. Those things are just gorgeous to watch. I disagree on a few things. For one gil vs berserker was great! Saber vs lancer and archer vs lancer are the best in stay night anime so far. |
 Anime is good, fucking deal with it. |
WrongPriest said: WAD1992 said: thats just cz UFO is doing the adaptation. and now priests are looking to rape up the series all together with a ribbon :3 not against it or anything, but it seams a bit "convenient" but whateves ... live and let live i guess. and to be fair , i have only met a few fate fans who gave F/Z its well deserved praise even before UFO did the adaptation. What are you going on about waddlez? Go back to the F/Z episode discussion threads back when it was airing and there was most of the posters here (the ones that were active back then) sucking dick and fighting off secondaries with sticks. The only thing that's changed now is F/Z became another weapon to hurt the poor porn game, so it too became a causality. fair enough, i wasnt really here, so i cant really judge. but i'l take your word for it. |
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Aurioch said: Hmm... let's see... Fate/Zero Saber vs Lancer = great Gil vs Berserker = good Saber+Lancer vs Caster = average Kayneth vs Kiritsugu = average (yeaaaah... let's barge into the house of the magus who just destroyed whole skyscraper to kill you and expect from him to fight like a normal mage) Gil vs Berserker, sky battle = great Saber vs Lancer 2 = good Gil vs Rider = average Saber vs Berserker = average Kiritsugu vs Kirei = great They killed good stuff. #BelowAverage |
The sun is a deadly laser |
mira-nyan said: Aurioch said: Hmm... let's see... Fate/Zero Saber vs Lancer = great Gil vs Berserker = good Saber+Lancer vs Caster = average Kayneth vs Kiritsugu = average (yeaaaah... let's barge into the house of the magus who just destroyed whole skyscraper to kill you and expect from him to fight like a normal mage) Gil vs Berserker, sky battle = great Saber vs Lancer 2 = good Gil vs Rider = average Saber vs Berserker = average Kiritsugu vs Kirei = great They killed good stuff. #BelowAverage I'm more concerned about the fact that Kiritsugu v. Kirei could be considered anywhere near good. #Meeeeeeeh |
| Proud founder of The Official Anti-Ging Freecss Fan Club Join now! Kellhus said: GuusWayne said: there is a limit to the suspension of disbelief And it's the fan that did it. Not the smoking porn reading rubik cube genius rape ape with a magic boat. |
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