| I have feeling that Tsumugu falling in love with Chisaki before time skip, but he knows that Chisaki love Hikari, that's why he don't confessed. |
LittleStar said: I have feeling that Tsumugu falling in love with Chisaki before time skip, but he knows that Chisaki love Hikari, that's why he don't confessed. i feel the same, and i do believe that chisaki is developing romantic feelings for tsumugu, she might've already realized that her love for hikari wasn't genuine but more to admiration |
| They may be living together but because of that I don't think they'll end up togeher. :| At the beginning of the episode I thought they were a married couple >.< |
| The pairing is so obvious they wouldn't end up together knowing Okada. |
| Chisaki and Tsumugu already act like they were married. She take care of him, even with private/intimate staff. She take care of his grandfather... take care of home, really act like wife... -.- Also I like how she changed, first sad... but then she become happy :D |
| Tsumungu x Chisaki is a ship mate for Manaka x Hikari. It leaves Manaka free to be with Hikari, and also avoid the chances of Chisaki staying with Hikari. I ship Tsumungu x Chisaki, because i ship Manaka x Hikari. Tsumungu x Chisaki becoming canon will make the anime perfect. |
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| After time skip I don't think there is a chance for ChisakixHikari, after all he love only Manaka, and even after confession nothing changed between them, Hikari will forever love Manaka. I think people who ship Chisaki/Hikari are shipping them, because Chisaki is their favorite character and Hikari is MC and most popular guy... There is nothing between them, even there is something more between Hikari/Miuna than Chisaki/Hikari... Even Chisaki love Hikari, because of his love for Manaka, then this isn't even love, this is just admiration. But this is only my thoghts and opinion, and I don't really care that there will be somebody who will don't agree with me. |
LittleStar said: Chisaki and Tsumugu already act like they were married. She take care of him, even with private/intimate staff. She take care of his grandfather... take care of home, really act like wife... -.- Also I like how she changed, first sad... but then she become happy :D She's called a lonely housewife (since Tsumugu's off to the city) and she doesn't deny it. http://i.imgur.com/J5ODbNf.jpg Also. ;) People are misunderstanding Chisaki's love. She never really loved Hikari, she admired him in his pursuit for Manaka, that's the same kind of love Manaka felt towards Tsumugu: a strong admiration. She is experiencing now feelings of guilt and loss but she has show attraction to Tsumugu that Kaname has picked up before the timeskip. Her entire character issues is about the denial of change. She will now face the fact she changed and she will be honest with herself. |
Thess said: LittleStar said: Chisaki and Tsumugu already act like they were married. She take care of him, even with private/intimate staff. She take care of his grandfather... take care of home, really act like wife... -.- Also I like how she changed, first sad... but then she become happy :D She's called a lonely housewife (since Tsumugu's off to the city) and she doesn't deny it. http://i.imgur.com/J5ODbNf.jpg Also. ;) People are misunderstanding Chisaki's love. She never really loved Hikari, she admired him in his pursuit for Manaka, that's the same kind of love Manaka felt towards Tsumugu: a strong admiration. She is experiencing now feelings of guilt and loss but she has show attraction to Tsumugu that Kaname has picked up before the timeskip. Her entire character issues is about the denial of change. She will now face the fact she changed and she will be honest with herself. "She never loved Hikari". It's wrong believing what YOU want, she spent like 13 episodes in shyness just to confess to Hikari. That's admiration? No way. Anyway, at first I was shipping Chisaki x Hikari, but now I don't care about her anymore. Neither I care about Tsumugu who is the worst passive character of the show, being passive and cool gives you pussy, remember kids. Hikari x Miuna at the least, is the only thing I'm hoping but it will hardly happens because Manaka will come back sooner or later ... |
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Akanezora said: "She never loved Hikari". It's wrong believing what YOU want, she spent like 13 episodes in shyness just to confess to Hikari. That's admiration? No way. It was admiration, she admitted that she loved the Hikari who was chasing after Manaka like that when she reflected about her feelings. Similarly, Manaka admired Tsumugu. It's extremely easy to confuse her feelings as really romantic love (by herself and other people). Admiration can evoke feeling of crush (like we have to actors or models). Take note she didn't have a natural overreaction when she touched Hikari like she did when she accidentally bumped her elbow with Tsumugu's. Because there wasn't legitimate sexual/romantic attraction. If you have watched Princess Tutu, what Ahiru felt towards Mytho was the same: admiration disguised and mistaken by romantic love. Akanezora said: Anyway, at first I was shipping Chisaki x Hikari, but now I don't care about her anymore. Neither I care about Tsumugu who is the worst passive character of the show, being passive and cool gives you pussy, remember kids Then off this thread. ;) |
ThessJan 10, 2014 1:57 PM
Thess said: Akanezora said: "She never loved Hikari". It's wrong believing what YOU want, she spent like 13 episodes in shyness just to confess to Hikari. That's admiration? No way. It was admiration, she admitted that she loved the Hikari who was chasing after Manaka like that when she reflected about her feelings. Similarly, Manaka admired Tsumugu. It's extremely easy to confuse her feelings as really romantic love (by herself and other people). Admiration can evoke feeling of crush (like we have to actors or models). Take note she didn't have a natural overreaction when she touched Hikari like she did when she accidentally bumped her elbow with Tsumugu's. Because there wasn't legitimate sexual/romantic attraction. If you have watched Princess Tutu, what Ahiru felt towards Mytho was the same: admiration disguised and mistaken by romantic love. I didn't watch Princess Tutu, so I can't understand your comparison. Anyway, Manaka admired Hikari too, but she didn't show the fish on the knee to Tsumugu, didn't she? So why? Obviously because she thought of Tsumugu of something MORE than admiration, and didn't want to show him an UGLY side of her. This kind of event happens to maidens in love when the feeling is beyond admiration. As for Chisaki, we'll see in a few episodes if you're right or not. As soon as Chisaki talks again to Hikari. Thess said: Then off this thread. ;) I don't like being ordered around, so no, I have every right to post here, just like you. |
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Akanezora said: I didn't watch Princess Tutu, so I can't understand your comparison. Anyway, Manaka admired Hikari too, but she didn't show the fish on the knee to Tsumugu, didn't she? So why? Obviously because she thought of Tsumugu of something MORE than admiration, and didn't want to show him an UGLY side of her. This kind of event happens to maidens in love when the feeling is beyond admiration. Manaka reflected her feelings for Tsumugu as the ones she felt for the sun. It wasn't more than admiration, it confused her. So, I didn't take them seriously. As for her feelings for Hikari they were pending, but Manaka developed and reflected more of why she might like Hikari after she acknowledged him as a man that isn't just admiration. When Chisaki listed Tsumugu's traits for instance, up early episodes when he did the pond, she was rationalizing him a lot and looking excuses for "Manaka" to not like him. He got under her skin. While in Hikari's case, it was a stagnant celebrity crush admiration, imo, she clung to because she was afraid of "growing up" and "change." This terrified her. Tsumugu appearing and turning her world upside down shattered this. That's why they are likely to be paired up. It's all in Chisaki's coming of age story. Tsumugu was the one who forced her to mature and change her, not Hikari. Kaname is more a serious rival, in her arc, but he's associated with the past, her childhood too. Chisaki's storyarc is to embrace the surface, the changes she was against and fearful of. That's why Tsumugu's the only love interest that makes sense. Akanezora said: I don't like being ordered around, so no, I have every right to post here, just like you. This is a pairing thread, if you have an issue with this pairing, stay in your favorite pairing thread. It's rude to spam complains. |
Thess said: Manaka reflected her feelings for Tsumugu as the ones she felt for the sun. It wasn't more than admiration, it confused her. So, I didn't take them seriously. As for her feelings for Hikari they were pending, but Manaka developed and reflected more of why she might like Hikari after she acknowledged him as a man that isn't just admiration. When Chisaki listed Tsumugu's traits for instance, up early episodes when he did the pond, she was rationalizing him a lot and looking excuses for "Manaka" to not like him. He got under her skin. While in Hikari's case, it was a stagnant celebrity crush admiration, imo, she clung to because she was afraid of "growing up" and "change." This terrified her. Tsumugu appearing and turning her world upside down shattered this. That's why they are likely to be paired up. It's all in Chisaki's coming of age story. Tsumugu was the one who forced her to mature and change her, not Hikari. Kaname is more a serious rival, in her arc, but he's associated with the past, her childhood too. Chisaki's storyarc is to embrace the surface, the changes she was against and fearful of. That's why Tsumugu's the only love interest that makes sense. Then how can you explain her "maiden-in-love" behaviour? Isn't it usual for girls in love to not show "ugly" sides of them at the guys they love? It's known that this kind of act is used for couples in love, the staff knew it and used it, simple as that. That's why it can't be just admiration, the fact that the Staff showed us this, proves it. Ok, I can see now the many hints about Tsumugu that were thrown in the episodes. It's legit. But I'm still of the opinion that it was more than admiration after all. You can't say "I love you" to someone you admire, it's damn awkward. Yours are speculations of course, we don't know anything for sure and many episodes are left. So I'd say, let's just see what will happen. Thess said: This is a pairing thread, if you have an issue with this pairing, stay in your favorite pairing thread. It's rude to spam complains. Hello Hitler, negative opinions are still opinions, I'm talking about this paring too. So I'm on the topic here. |
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Akanezora said: Then how can you explain her "maiden-in-love" behaviour? Isn't it usual for girls in love to not show "ugly" sides of them at the guys they love? It's known that this kind of act is used for couples in love, the staff knew it and used it, simple as that. That's why it can't be just admiration, the fact that the Staff showed us this, proves it. Ok, I can see now the many hints about Tsumugu that were thrown in the episodes. It's legit. But I'm still of the opinion that it was more than admiration after all. You can't say "I love you" to someone you admire, it's damn awkward. Yours are speculations of course, we don't know anything for sure and many episodes are left. So I'd say, let's just see what will happen. While it is typical of girls to not show their ugly sides for the ones they like, it’s often more romanticized, in a modern sense, for girls to be truly in love with the person they can be natural. And think about it, if she actually did get together with Hikari, she’d be putting up with a romanticized ideal of herself, not who she is. With Tsugumu, she can be however she is without reserves. I think the staff showed it to show that it is just admiration. Love is when you can support the other person while the other person can support you (I’m generalizing here). You can’t support the person when she’s not her true self. :P Her “maiden-in-love” behavior is just that. Her feelings were unrequited, always will be. She realized that and moved on. |
| Ok, another question popped up in my mind. Chisaki after the disappearance of Hikari lived with Tsumugu under the same roof for 5 whole years. Then why she didn't do any moves on Tsumugu? Instead she's still waiting for Hikari (We also know this thanks to Tsumugu who said that she loves someone else, and basically implied that she's eager to see once again Hikari), if it was only admiration she should at least be able to express her feelings to Tsumugu and start a new life. What do you think? |
AkanezoraJan 10, 2014 8:32 PM
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Akanezora said: Ok, another question popped up in my mind. Chisaki after the disappearance of Hikari lived with Tsumugu under the same roof for 5 whole years. Then why she didn't do any moves on Tsumugu? Instead she's still waiting for Hikari, if it was only admiration she should at least be able to express her feelings to Tsumugu and start a new life. What do you think? I feel that after her breakdown she'd do whatever she could until her friends re-emerged. She held on to a sliver of hope that things would be as they were before everything happened. This is why she never tried to get close to Tsumugu. Maybe? |
| "A cruel world is not without it's beauty, and many times a select few find it by mistake. Only then do those select few see the world for what it is... A disastrous masterpiece." ~ 7thVoid "Hates a river that only flows down." ~ 7thVoid |
Akanezora said: Ok, another question popped up in my mind. Chisaki after the disappearance of Hikari lived with Tsumugu under the same roof for 5 whole years. Then why she didn't do any moves on Tsumugu? Instead she's still waiting for Hikari (We also know this thanks to Tsumugu who said that she loves someone else, and basically implied she's eager to see once again Hikari), if it was only admiration she should at least be able to express her feelings to Tsumugu and start a new life. What do you think? But we don't know whether or not she has feelings for Tsugumu or not. It's not like Chisaki has been making moves on Hikari when she first liked him. She's already harboring feelings for Hikari well before the series started. Only until Tsugumu comes into her life and ruins the balance between her and her friends did she started to make moves on Hikari. She didn't make a move on Hikari on her own accord. What Tsugumu says doesn't mean it's true. He could be saying that from his own point of view, not necessarily what is true. Of course she'd be eager to see Hikari, not necessarily out of romantic love but just the sake of seeing a friend she's been separated from. But Chisaki's whole character is that she is unsure of her own feelings. Considering the traumatic experience of losing her friends and life in one shot, during an event that's supposed to save her life, she's unlikely to pay attention to her romantic inclinations. She has started a new life which is a huge step itself so figuring out her feelings for Tsugumu is just pushing it too far. 7thVoid said: I feel that after her breakdown she'd do whatever she could until her friends re-emerged. She held on to a sliver of hope that things would be as they were before everything happened. This is why she never tried to get close to Tsumugu. Maybe? Agreed. (: |
| ^ ^ I see thanks, it might be the case. |
|
| No prob. ^^ |
| I want to add to Parisbelle's brilliant reply is that she's not just missing Hikari and her friends, but she's missing her parents too, her entire family and life has been taken of her. Those who believe "geez, just move on" are crude statements of those who have never lost someone when they were bloody 13-14 years old. Chisaki lost her best friends, her parents, her entire city and conformable world in one traumatic swoop. She's thirteen-fourteen years old. Even worsened by her obvious fear of drastic changes. To make this only about a boy she had a crush on is entirely laughable and disrespecting her. Tsumugu doesn't know she confessed her feelings and got a closure (unlike Hikari who still has open business with Manaka). He's not aware of this because Chisaki has only been in general pain and it would be absolutely gross to ask her about her romantic feelings. If you guys noticed the scene of the graduation ceremony, after a while, Chisaki was returning to be more cheerful and sure of herself and what she displayed? Longing towards Tsumugu: http://i.imgur.com/zW2eGQb.jpg But alas, the dramatic crisis of Tsumugu's grandfather falling sick immediately afterwards became another emotional obstacle. Tsumugu misunderstood what she wanted him to be, but also didn't take advantage of her emotional vulnerable state. The feelings and attraction are there, but they have a bad timing to bloom. There's a lot of emphasis on family (not just blood family but becoming family and forming a family) in the show. The OP has two households in particular. Chisaki is the 'housewife' of one of them. The return of her friends will open up the hope she can get her life back, so it would be a good time for her to reflect her feelings and the changes on them. Tsumugu should too be made aware Chisaki has already confessed and made peace with her feelings. In the past, she shared this angst with him because it was the most important, but after the incident, her loss was more profound. |
ThessJan 10, 2014 10:05 PM
dokidokidoing said: To Parisbelle and Thess: I think you presented very valid and well-written points. Reading them was a pleasure. I personally think that there's something to be said in the career paths Chisaki and Tsumugu chose for themselves. Chisaki's decision to become a nurse reflects not only her maternal demeanour but a desire to ensure that people don't lose their loved ones- a desire that I feel is strongly linked to the fiasco in episode 13. I highly doubt that the experience had no long-lasting behaviour on her personality. Additionally, one possible way to view her post-timeskip is that she's burying any notion of pursuing a romance because romance is a reminder of the past she shared with Manaka, Hikari and Kaname, as well a big part of what culminated in the events of episode 13. So, she has pushed it away because being in a romance would re-open the wounds that time has just started to heal- she's still holding out hope for her closest friends to come back and for some semblance of normalcy to return to her life. I don't think she'll be ready for a romantic relationship until they come back. Her work (including looking after the Kiharas) and studies keep her busy and cheerful, but when alone or reminded of childhood joys like the Tomoebi, it's quite obvious that Chisaki hasn't been able to move on- something that is understandable, considering the young age at which she experienced the trauma. I wish people would cut her some slack with regard to that. She eventually came to see Isamu and Tsumugu as pillars of support (something she really needed at the time) and became attached to them really quickly, helping them out of gratitude. Isamu's collapse brought back memories so painful that she became quite hysterical at the hospital, and his recovery (he's now healthy enough that he can sit up in bed), was probably more of a psychological necessity for her than it might have been for most people- which is saying a lot. Tsumugu becoming an oceanographer was less unexpected, since we knew that he was always fascinated by the sea. I don't think I was the only one who thought that Tsumugu's decision to major in the ocean was partly due to that he wanted to make Chisaki happy and find out enough to see his old friends again. Having Chisaki at his house brought the two together (in a non-romantic sense), and Tsumugu got to partake in Chisaki's happiness and grief during those five years. I think he didn't bring the topic up out of consideration for her feelings, but I won't be surprised if Tsumugu felt some guilt/frustration over not being able to do anything to help her (or help anyone during the chaos that took place during the Ofunehiki)- and the flashbacks back me up here, for they seem to show the eventual solidification of his resolve. It's quite possible that he hoped that he could find the others again if he studied the ocean terrain its people's habits- this time in a more active manner. It was kind of heartbreaking to see him this episode- he seems to have developed romantic feelings for her, but, he has decided to put aside those feelings for the sake of her hopes and her happiness, and in that process has taken huge responsibilities for the both of them. This too was very well written and also a pleasure to read. You should read the post in the time skip paradox thread. |
| "A cruel world is not without it's beauty, and many times a select few find it by mistake. Only then do those select few see the world for what it is... A disastrous masterpiece." ~ 7thVoid "Hates a river that only flows down." ~ 7thVoid |
kekepania said: He needs some loving! He has Sayu who has grown up by now! And Kaname hasn't aged after the hibernation, just waiting him to wake up soon. |
| @Thess, dokidokidoing, 7thVoid You guys are so awesome. ;D All of you have also raised very excellent discussions, observations, and arguments. (: |
| This really is probably the most interesting couple, mostly due to the fact that no one can really tell what's going on inside their heads. There have been subtle hints here and there hinting that they like each other but neither has explicitly stated it yet. It'd be interesting, if they do become a couple, to see how they get there. |
barriedude said: Tsumugu is also known as : Mr. steal yo gurl, My hate for him grows each episode. Tsumugu doesn't really "try" to steal hoes, but you are correct this nigga seems to always get the best moments with the females xD. |
| I want to leave this ship... First was Kaname/Chisaki, now Tsumugu/Chisaki... This girl deserves to be forever alone... |
LittleStar said: I want to leave this ship... First was Kaname/Chisaki, now Tsumugu/Chisaki... This girl deserves to be forever alone... Then just leave. Like it's her fault that Kaname and (maybe) Tsumugu love her :/ . And what's wrong with keeping her feelings for Hikari I wonder :/ |
| This isn't her fault that guys like her, but she piss me of how she treat people who like her (Kaname/Tsumugu)... I wonder she will treat Tsumugu just like Kaname (especially now when she still have feelings for Hikari) when he confess to her... |
| I don't think they're gonna pair Chisaki with younger Hikari/Kaname so I think/hope she'll end up with Tsumugu. (Like I want :D) |
LittleStar said: This isn't her fault that guys like her, but she piss me of how she treat people who like her (Kaname/Tsumugu)... I wonder she will treat Tsumugu just like Kaname (especially now when she still have feelings for Hikari) when he confess to her... For one, Chisaki didn't know what to do at the time when Kaname confessed to her. Kaname confessed anyway all the while knowing she has feelings for Hikari. Sure she could've asked to talk to him but that would be hard with everything else going on at the time. Tsumugu also understands why she keeps him at arms length. Chisaki just wants to have her friends back. She doesn't want feelings getting in the way of their friendship. She's trying hard to be who she was before because she doesn't want the others to feel alienated as she did. |
| "A cruel world is not without it's beauty, and many times a select few find it by mistake. Only then do those select few see the world for what it is... A disastrous masterpiece." ~ 7thVoid "Hates a river that only flows down." ~ 7thVoid |
| No, I never hate them, I liked them... |
| I support them too, you're not alone! :3 |
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| I wanted him with Manaka but it really seems like that he's going with Chisaki. Lets see if Miuna does something, but I'm feeling that she isn't going to do anything. |
maruko101 said: Don't like this ship. The reason most people don't is because Tsumugu isn't a good character. IRL, I'm sure he would make a terrible boyfriend for most just because of his total inhuman lack of emotion. We all know he can listen to somebody rant and keep a straight face, but that's ALL we know. Which makes him a bad choice for Chisaki, because; A. Chisaki is super emotional and even if this pairing could possibly work in a real situation, it isn't any fun to watch. Chisaki cries, (idk what about, but she always does somehow) he listens, BOOM scene over. B. Chisaki hasn't grown a bit since 5 years ago. She's gotten much more beautiful but she's still the same girl as she was before the timeskip. C. Chisaki just doesn't like Tsumugu. They've been living together but Tsumugu has just been getting friendzoned for 5 years. Because Chisaki's practically the same girl as she was before the timeskip, it's much more reasonable that she would still pursue Hikari than give up on him. Sorry if this offended any of you. I just wanted to give a couple reasons why I think this pairing just isn't the greatest. But, its the creator's decision. This is a beautiful, well done anime, and whatever comes up I'm sure it'll be great. I find him to be a great character. One must not look at what they've been given rather what has not yet been said to find true meaning behind a character like Tsumugu. Or any character for that matter. As some know Tsumugu's early life has been hinted at yet has not been delved into. I believe the reason for his calm demeanor is because of this fact. On to your points... 1) This is a show filled with unrequited love and a heap ton of drama. I don't believe that this pairing needs to be fun to be interesting. 2) Chisaki has grown up but she's simply afraid of this because she lost her friends and doesn't want to be left out imo. Which is why she keeps Tsumugu away. 3) I feel that at the end of episode fifteen we see what could've been these past five years for TsumuguxChisaki. There also wasn't anything to be offended by in your post. You can't blame another for having an opinion different from your own. |
7thVoidJan 16, 2014 3:45 PM
| "A cruel world is not without it's beauty, and many times a select few find it by mistake. Only then do those select few see the world for what it is... A disastrous masterpiece." ~ 7thVoid "Hates a river that only flows down." ~ 7thVoid |
| I actually really like Tsumugu. I'm fairly certain his emotionless front can be explained by his child hood and simple personality. Kaname and him were similar in the aspect that they both didn't display their real feelings because they wanted to preserve the friendship. Except Kaname towards the end realized that it was a now or never opportunity and decided to speak up. If Tsumugu does like Chisaki, his lack of emotion / reaction could be that he didn't want to take advantage of Hikari's disappearance. I don't know how else he could show emotion because everyone uses his as an emotional support for their own problems. Rather than takes he gives, and I'm sure later on someone will be kind enough to help him out. |
| Anyone else realize Tsumugu is very much like his grandfather and not so mysterious once you make the comparisons ie. emotion,logic, and cool head. |
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