If Fate/Hollow Ataraxia didn't exist, would you still like the F/SN servants better than the F/Z ones?(spoilers)
-kV- said: Rider easily stopped the Assassins from murdering Waver at Caster's lair. I assume Rider instinctively knew Waver was not in danger when the Assassins appeared at the drinking party. How ufotable animated that scene didn't help... It's an "adaptation", not "interpretation". There's original author involved in the process, ya know. We're not talking about mixing stuff like Deen did. You're assuming much. Don't be Kayneth, it's not cool. It's like how Kerry goes off to murder other people because he's confident in his sniping, bomb-making, etc. Kayneth was a master mage. The other teams were busy dealing with Caster. Kayneth saw the opportunity to use Lancer to distract a wounded Saber while he kills her master. Even Kiritsugu planned to use the Caster distraction to kill the others. Only problem was Kayneth's personality, his fatal flaw. Kerry at least is willing to use any means to kill his opponent and he doesn't charge into enemy strongholds. It doesn't matter if Kayneth's personality is responsible for his fail or anything else. He already knew that Kerry doesn't play by his rules, but still went there assuming he'd win by still playing by the same rules. You'd need to be brain-dead to think it would work. (not that I think that Kerry was much better) See above. And well his actions kept Waver and him alive till the tail end. Actually, Rider left Waver alone with an enemy servant. Average servant would have axed him right there and then, but he lucked out as Gil is a trooper. Kariya was dying and could barely control Berserker. So he just went the "at least I'll take out Tokiomi before I die." He went in it with sole reason to dip his willy (sure, and to remove Tokiomi's willy). He was completely unprepared for the entire war. I don't see what you're trying to argue there. |
Stev said: ayy lmao |
Wingul said: I haven't played F/HA yet and I prefer the F/SN servants... they were better fleshed out, generally. Iskandar is the only "F/SN-tier" servant in F/Z. Why, and how? Everyone pretty much curbstomps him, if that' what you mean. |
The sun is a deadly laser |
mira-lala said: Wingul said: I haven't played F/HA yet and I prefer the F/SN servants... they were better fleshed out, generally. Iskandar is the only "F/SN-tier" servant in F/Z. Why, and how? Everyone pretty much curbstomps him, if that' what you mean. I mean character-wise, not power level. |
Wingul said: mira-lala said: Why, and how? Everyone pretty much curbstomps him, if that' what you mean. I mean character-wise, not power level. Which I still don't get. Pls, explain. |
The sun is a deadly laser |
mira-lala said: Wingul said: I mean character-wise, not power level. Which I still don't get. Pls, explain. He is charismatic. However for the Zero servants my favourite is Gil. |
Insertanamehere said: mira-lala said: Which I still don't get. Pls, explain. He is charismatic. However for the Zero servants my favourite is Gil. So are most of the servants. So he's illuminati-brainwashing poor secondaries to believe he's amazing? @_@ |
The sun is a deadly laser |
| Iskandar is a good bro, and an outright horrible human being unsuited for ruling. |
mira-lala said: Insertanamehere said: He is charismatic. However for the Zero servants my favourite is Gil. So are most of the servants. So he's illuminati-brainwashing poor secondaries to believe he's amazing? @_@ Only explanation :3 But seriously, he just appears to be a cool guy - someone to have a drink with. |
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| Is that why people think he's so amazing? He's literally a one dimensional character @_@ I swear to Mango, there's more to it. |
The sun is a deadly laser |
mira-lala said: Is that why people think he's so amazing? He's literally a one dimensional character @_@ I swear to Mango, there's more to it. He shits on Saber |
Insertanamehere said: mira-lala said: Is that why people think he's so amazing? He's literally a one dimensional character @_@ I swear to Mango, there's more to it. He shits on Saber  |
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Insertanamehere said: mira-lala said: Is that why people think he's so amazing? He's literally a one dimensional character @_@ I swear to Mango, there's more to it. He shits on Saber If that's the case then I should love him, but I'm just not feeling it. :| |
Stev said: ayy lmao |
mira-lala said: Wingul said: I mean character-wise, not power level. Which I still don't get. Pls, explain. He had an interesting and developed dynamic with Waver, a bunch of standout scenes (banquet of kings, Waver pep talk, his ), and some awesome lines ("this wine is as your blood", ionian hetairoi, etc). I found Gilles and Hassan one dimensional, Urobuchi's portrayal of Saber lackluster, and there wasn't much to Berserker (I haven't read the LN, which supposedly has more info on him). Gil and Lancer were pretty good, though. |
Mickdrew said: Insertanamehere said: He shits on Saber Hey I'll have you know I don't like him, i'm just saying people take his word as fact and like him because of that for some reason. Personally, I felt he came off as obnoxious and his talking down to Saber felt like this: Seiba ur idels are shite i am g8r king dan u lil girl u must be tyrnt and kll ppl |
Insertanamehere said: Hey I'll have you know I don't like him, i'm just saying people take his word as fact and like him because of that for some reason. Personally, I felt he came off as obnoxious and his talking down to Saber felt like this: Seiba ur idels are shite i am g8r king dan u lil girl u must be tyrnt and kll ppl I guess that attitude is why people like him. mira-lala said: I swear to Mango, there's more to it. Cause he acts larger than life. He's charismatic and commands attention with his presence. One dimensional, but it's a dimension many people like. Maybe it's a cultural or gender thing, idk |
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| So you mainly like him because of Waver best-Elmelloi and because he spoke a bunch on nonsense speeches? Very well *Goes off to the corner and facepalms* |
The sun is a deadly laser |
mira-lala said: So you mainly like him because of Waver best-Elmelloi and because he spoke a bunch on nonsense speeches? Very well *Goes off to the corner and facepalms* Many Zerofags like Saber because of lolChivalry and say that FSN destroys her character. :3 |
mira-lala said: So you mainly like him because of Waver best-Elmelloi and because he spoke a bunch on nonsense speeches? Very well *Goes off to the corner and facepalms* I don't particularly like him, he was just my favorite of F/Z's servants. |
mira-lala said: So you mainly like him because of Waver best-Elmelloi and because he spoke a bunch on nonsense speeches? Very well *Goes off to the corner and facepalms* Steady on, never said I agree with his speeches. I'm saying his attitude and confidence he takes in his position are inviting. Not that he deserves to be admired as a person. |
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chickenonthepan said: mira-lala said: So you mainly like him because of Waver best-Elmelloi and because he spoke a bunch on nonsense speeches? Very well *Goes off to the corner and facepalms* Many Zerofags like Saber because of lolChivalry and say that FSN destroys her character. :3 What does this have to do with anything? It's just you stating facts =3 Mickdrew said: mira-lala said: So you mainly like him because of Waver best-Elmelloi and because he spoke a bunch on nonsense speeches? Very well *Goes off to the corner and facepalms* Steady on, never said I agree with his speeches. I'm saying his attitude and confidence he takes in his position are inviting. Not that he deserves to be admired as a person. I still don't get it. But alas, I've had experience with the rl female version of him. *facepalms* |
The sun is a deadly laser |
HungryPriest said: It's an "adaptation", not "interpretation". There's original author involved in the process, ya know. We're not talking about mixing stuff like Deen did. You're assuming much. Don't be Kayneth, it's not cool. I'll admit I only read the F/SN VN, not the F/Z novel, so I don't know how it plays out there. I don't see any issue with the anime adaptation. Rider already senses and blocks an assassination attempt in an earlier episode. At the party, I highly doubt he just sits there totally unprepared as an Assassin shanks his master. Perhaps that's too much of an assumption, but I don't personally think it is. Kerry at least is willing to use any means to kill his opponent and he doesn't charge into enemy strongholds. It doesn't matter if Kayneth's personality is responsible for his fail or anything else. He already knew that Kerry doesn't play by his rules, but still went there assuming he'd win by still playing by the same rules. You'd need to be brain-dead to think it would work. (not that I think that Kerry was much better) If Kerry played by the same rules (a mage duel), Kayneth holds the advantage. Even if he doesn't, Kay's Hydrargyrum *is* a trump card. It saved him from dying in a collapsing hotel. It instantly blocks the released traps and close-range gunfire. It can track and kill. It can be made for a situation where an opponent doesn't follow the rules as well. With an offensive/defensive tool of that caliber, Kay's strat wasn't completely brainless. I will say though that he does become full brain-dead when he doesn't retreat after getting hit in the shoulder. That's when he should have backed out. At least then he would have learned about Kerry's own abilities, so it wouldn't have been a complete defeat. Actually, Rider left Waver alone with an enemy servant. Average servant would have axed him right there and then, but he lucked out as Gil is a trooper. You talking about the end? It's not like Rider was intending on losing. He went in it with sole reason to dip his willy (sure, and to remove Tokiomi's willy). He was completely unprepared for the entire war. I don't see what you're trying to argue there. I agree. I am saying Kariya was always doomed. His body was in decay and he could barely control his Servant. He just made it his priority to screw over Tokiomi. Probably not the best strategy, but then again, he really couldn't do much at all. |
mira-lala said: I still don't get it. But alas, I've had experience with the rl female version of him. *facepalms* No, I guess you don't get it. |
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| A concept unknown to Lalas everywhere; the manly code. |
The sun is a deadly laser |
mira-lala said: A concept unknown to Lalas everywhere; the manly code. Hah, come back when you are older, young girl. |
chickenonthepan said: mira-lala said: A concept unknown to Lalas everywhere; the manly code. Hah, come back when you are older, young girl. I hope Ufotable does that scene justice. The OST (Ever-present feeling) really carried it - can't imagine it without it. |
| Just going to say people who will only watch the anime and not read the VNs will never know about all the extra dimensions in character of the F/SN Servants. Tell me all about the extra dimensions UBW14 shows of Fake Assassin versus F/Z Rider. |
-kV- said: CookingPriest said: People keep talking on how much he planned yet his "plans" were litterally luck and "sitting with sniper riffle". If FSN Caster was in that War, Kerry would die in first day from his "plans". Or Caster might do a hare brained decision and let him go like she does with Shirou. Or Kiritsugu will go to the school and snipe Kuzuki. Letting Shirou go is in Caster's character. Kerry is not Shirou. She would despise the fuck out of Kerry. And the moment Kerry would try to attack Kuizuki Caster would off him anyway. She has eyes and ears over entire city being able to monitor most of it. And then they sat in the basement drinking wine and wasting time till they betrayed each other. So much strategy wow. Better than nothing. Tokiomi knew if he stepped out he might get sniped or stabbed. So what you mean is that Tokiomi's planning is below Ilya's level.Illya's who does not give a shit about war and just wants to troll certain Shirou. And oh look he got stabbed. Wow so much tactics. Yeah and then he goes to attack the mansion being all prideful villain and underestimates every single of his opponents. Then dies in most pathetic way. So much strategy. His strategy was fine. His personality was not. Please do define his "Strategy" if we remove his stupidity because I see none. Those two sat for the whole war playing video games and then went to randomly fight Gil. I never saw them playing video games. They did more than that. yeah they also drank tea with couple of granny characters. most likely fucked and also played basketball and looked at encyclopedias. So much planning. Yet again below Illya level. |
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Wingul said: chickenonthepan said: Hah, come back when you are older, young girl. I hope Ufotable does that scene justice. The OST (Ever-present feeling) really carried it - can't imagine it without it. Are you referring to the back to back scene? |
Insertanamehere said: Wingul said: I hope Ufotable does that scene justice. The OST (Ever-present feeling) really carried it - can't imagine it without it. Are you referring to the back to back scene? |
Wingul said: Insertanamehere said: Are you referring to the back to back scene? |
-kV- said: Just going to say people who will only watch the anime and not read the VNs will never know about all the extra dimensions in character of the F/SN Servants. Tell me all about the extra dimensions UBW14 shows of Fake Assassin versus F/Z Rider. Sasaki is pretty one-dimensional. But he is a really cool bad guy, and fit the theme of UBW. His VA is godly. |
chickenonthepan said: -kV- said: Just going to say people who will only watch the anime and not read the VNs will never know about all the extra dimensions in character of the F/SN Servants. Tell me all about the extra dimensions UBW14 shows of Fake Assassin versus F/Z Rider. Sasaki is pretty one-dimensional. But he is a really cool bad guy, and fit the theme of UBW. I'd say 2 dimensional, maybe |
mira-lala said: Is that why people think he's so amazing? He's literally a one dimensional character @_@ I swear to Mango, there's more to it. He's not one dimensional. Iskandar has is incredibly prideful and confident and can gain followers with his charisma. But despite his pride, he's not bothered by the way the history books portrayed him as a midget, he just accepts it as it and continues on with his life. He's also open to new things and enjoys learning about the way the modern world works. (He learns to shop online and wants to try other new technologies like videogames and such. He's also very into the joys of living life to the fullest and wants to take on the biggest obstacles to make his life worth living. He can come off as mean and arrogant as he puts down saber's ideals and sees his way of ruling to be the best, but he's also shown to be rather friendly as he tries to boost waver's confidence and will even enjoy a drink with his enemies. While he's not complex by any means, he's certainly more than just one dimension. Oh, and also: |
emobuttercupJan 25, 2015 2:01 PM
| I'd go with emobubbles, but someone else already had it, damn bastard. |
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| I agree, he's not one dimensional if nothing else. |
emoblossom123 said: mira-lala said: Is that why people think he's so amazing? He's literally a one dimensional character @_@ I swear to Mango, there's more to it. He's not one dimensional. Iskandar has is incredibly prideful and confident and can gain followers with his charisma. But despite his pride, he's not bothered by the way the history books portrayed him as a midget, he just accepts it as it and continues on with his life. He's also open to new things and enjoys learning about the way the modern world works. (He learns to shop online and wants to try other new technologies like videogames and such. He's also very into the joys of living life to the fullest and wants to take on the biggest obstacles to make his life worth living. He can come off as mean and arrogant as he puts down saber's ideals and sees his way of ruling to be the best, but he's also shown to be rather friendly as he tries to boost waver's confidence and will even enjoy a drink with his enemies. While he's not complex by any means, he's certainly more than just one dimension. Yup. I don't know much about Alexander the Great from history, but in F/Z he came across as a good (albeit incredibly prideful) person who gave some fantastic advice to Waver. |
| Meh, I will never get it. I literally don't have enough information to find him an 'amazing' character like everyone else does. :/ He is prideful ---> So is everyone else He has charisma ------> Lel, look at Gil We know from CP that Gil has done exactly this =3 So should everyone be loving him as much as people love Alex? Alex doesn't have a life anymore, so he can't make it worth living. He isn't necessarily mean, be he is arrogant. So basically, you guys love the guy that doesn't take things seriously? He's jolly and funny and all, but what I got from Alex in FZ, is the same as what I got from Saber in UBW 2014. They only look at the great side of him, and forget he was a tyrant. Some people even argue whether or not her's so 'great' in behaviour. He gave great advice to Waver, but I never found things like that amazing. Lancer gave great advice to Shirou, so did Archer, Assassin, Rin, and even Taiga. Maybe I've just seen too much to think he is as great as you do ~.~ chickenonthepan said: mira-lala said: A concept unknown to Lalas everywhere; the manly code. Hah, come back when you are older, young girl. I don't even....this... |
The sun is a deadly laser |
| Lala, go to sleep, you're not reading properly anymore. :P |
Stev said: ayy lmao |
| Tell me how F/SN Berserker is more dimensional of a character than F/Z Berserker. You have one big guy going crazy to protect a little girl, and another big guy going crazy to kill a little girl. |
-kV- said: Tell me how F/SN Berserker is more dimensional of a character than F/Z Berserker. You have one big guy going crazy to protect a little girl, and another big guy going crazy to kill a little girl. http://lparchive.org/Fatestay-night/Update%20202/ |
chickenonthepan said: -kV- said: Tell me how F/SN Berserker is more dimensional of a character than F/Z Berserker. You have one big guy going crazy to protect a little girl, and another big guy going crazy to kill a little girl. http://lparchive.org/Fatestay-night/Update%20202/ Exactly. You have one big guy going crazy to protect a little girl. |
-kV- said: Exactly. You have one big guy going crazy to protect a little girl. Well, he is crazy, BUT he protects a little girl. |
-kV- said: Tell me how F/SN Berserker is more dimensional of a character than F/Z Berserker. You have one big guy going crazy to protect a little girl, and another big guy going crazy to kill a little girl. He has the power of moe |
| BAN ME |
-kV- said: Tell me how F/SN Berserker is more dimensional of a character than F/Z Berserker. You have one big guy going crazy to protect a little girl, and another big guy going crazy to kill a little girl. Fate and UBW. Fha? I don't find Lancelot that amazing. He went mad because someone was too pure for him to handle. Herk was fucked with by gods, and now wants to at least be able to protect Illya. Sadly, HF happens ;_; |
The sun is a deadly laser |
mira-lala said: -kV- said: Tell me how F/SN Berserker is more dimensional of a character than F/Z Berserker. You have one big guy going crazy to protect a little girl, and another big guy going crazy to kill a little girl. Fate and UBW. Fha? I don't find Lancelot that amazing. He went mad because someone was too pure for him to handle. Herk was fucked with by gods, and now wants to at least be able to protect Illya. Sadly, HF happens ;_; Really? I thought UBW was sadder end for Herc? |
Stev said: ayy lmao |
HungryPriest said: mira-lala said: Fate and UBW. Fha? I don't find Lancelot that amazing. He went mad because someone was too pure for him to handle. Herk was fucked with by gods, and now wants to at least be able to protect Illya. Sadly, HF happens ;_; Really? I thought UBW was sadder end for Herc? yeah, in HF, at least he is able to protect Illya In UBW, he can't. |
tsuyurii said: -kV- said: Tell me how F/SN Berserker is more dimensional of a character than F/Z Berserker. You have one big guy going crazy to protect a little girl, and another big guy going crazy to kill a little girl. He has the power of moe F/Z Berserker can NP a normal battery into an enerloop one. |
tsuyurii said: -kV- said: Tell me how F/SN Berserker is more dimensional of a character than F/Z Berserker. You have one big guy going crazy to protect a little girl, and another big guy going crazy to kill a little girl. He has the power of moe Haters gonna hate XD |
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chickenonthepan said: HungryPriest said: Really? I thought UBW was sadder end for Herc? yeah, in HF, at least he is able to protect Illya In UBW, he can't. But then he turns against her T_T Poor Herk. |
The sun is a deadly laser |
mira-lala said: chickenonthepan said: yeah, in HF, at least he is able to protect Illya In UBW, he can't. But then he turns against her T_T Poor Herk. Saber turned against Shirou. So that's not a big deal. That's hardly Herc anymore. He is under Sakura's control. |
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