| So the triangle promised resolution was slotted for the two movies (last one promoted with the "end of the triangle" additional subtitle). And yes, it was resolved as Shôji Kawamori wanted since the beginning (his scriptwriter convinced him to leave a non resolution). Following are spoilers about the girl Alto loves: "Kiss in the Galaxy" manga poster. And the commemorative end of the triangle one in Macross Ace. Macross Frontier has officially concluded. |
| I think its pretty retarded pairing to be honest. All she did was "play around" with him and act like a hoe just getting in the way of Ranka. Alto's character doesn't strike me as the type of guy who'd be attracted to strippers. bah Ranka had truest feelings for him Sherly just treated him like a toy. |
| Sheryl marrying Alto that's no good Alto, I'm disappointed in you. |
 |
| If you think the movie and the final soundtrack confirmed it, the Sheryl ~Kiss in the Galaxy~ manga nailed the final nail on the Alto/Ranka coffin. Not that I'm complaining. People could see the Sheryl end a mile away. :p |
| Never liked the Ranka-Alto pairing to be honest. Now then, it isn't a matter of preferences(though, I still don't like girls with short hair and I still like the tsundere types) but Sheryl, with her wacky personality seemed the best for Alto. In terms of their voices, I would've chosen the more mature like Sheryl. Anyway, I would've chosen Sheryl as well anyway xD All in all, I'm glad they finally decided on someone... |
| Yet, there are still naysayers and those in denial about the ending. The rabid ones are even saying that Kawamori wanted an Alto/Ranka end but for some reason could not exercise his artistic license, hence why we got the 'out-of-the-blue' Alto/Sheryl end. Oh and that it was all about the money. You should read it, it's very funny. :D |
| Well, don't blame me if you start getting headaches. :P (http://forums.bleachboard.com/showthread.php?2106-Macross-Frontier-2nd-Movie-Sayonara-no-Tsubasa/page6) |
| Judging from the posted images, that's the most likely outcome. Frontier is basically just a huge tribute to the original Macross (for those of you who haven't seen it) and the main cast of Frontier each resembles the original: Alto->Hikaru Ranka->Minmey Sheryl->Misa Hikaru ends up with Misa (whose character is tributed in Sheryl) in the original Macross, which makes it the Alto and Sheryl pairing the most likely outcome. |
LoveDriftsAway said: Alto isn't the type to be attracted to girls who look like 11 years olds, either. Not an insult to Ranka, but she played the role of Mao Nome... who was 11 years old in Zero and their bodies were identical :lol: Hey now! Ranka might have similar bodybuild to Mao, yes, but I still have hard time swallowing the fact Mao was supposed to be 11 year old - she looked like 14-15 year old to me and I thought she was about that old when I first saw Zero. And while she is nowhere near as curvy as Sheryl Ranka does have hips, small breasts etc. She's petite for sure but she doesn't look *prepubescent* by any means. Loli Klan looks like 10-11 year old to me and there's clear difference between her and Ranka. LoveDriftsAway said: Even though the one who took that decision, the scriptwriter, already stated Alto loved Sheryl...but that he liked the sky over the girls. Just out of curiosity, do you have source avalaible for this? This "he liked the sky over the girls" coming from 'official source' is too hilarious for me to pass. :lol: LoveDriftsAway said: Brera You can't be fucking serious. Kiss of the Galaxy has been pretty much piece of shit glorified fanfic adaption from the start but Anyway, Sayonara no Tsubasa is bloody fantastic film. Saw it in Japan four times while I was there and it was worth it every time. Ranka's character got phenomenal treatment in the film so this Ranka fan could be happy and content no matter what way they ended the triangle. And it was ended with grace and skill and in a manner that 100% trolled ALL shippers to some extent, some much moreso than others of course. All in all they handled the triangle better than any entry inte franchise since Macross Plus. Great job, all in all. Still, I can't deny I feel sad for Ranka. But remembering how hazardious for your health or mental well being winning love triangle in Kawamori work is perhaps she's better off this way. |
| You know I'm happy to see all the Alto/Ranka fans (the fucking annoying and arrogant, high and mighty ones) whine, cry, shout conspiracy, go "it wasn't a happy ending for them because Sheryl is in a coma, even though she'll wake up and Kawamori hinted in an interview that there's a happy ending, but oh well, I will just ignore it!", and all that shit. Because, for three long years, I had to endure their bullshit, ESPECIALLY their point of views and opinions that were heavily Ranka-biased in series and movie discussions. So really, their sour-graping and grasping at straws provide good entertainment for me. At the end of it all, I actually find movie!Ranka a good character (just as I had found DYRL Minmay wonderful). BUT her fans will forever leave a horrible taste in my mouth. Particularly the demented rantings of BleachOD and her close followers. *shudders* |
steshinMay 23, 2011 11:15 AM
steshin said: You know I'm happy to see all the Alto/Ranka fans (the fucking annoying and arrogant, high and mighty ones) whine, cry, shout conspiracy, go "it wasn't a happy ending for them because Sheryl is in a coma, even though she'll wake up and Kawamori hinted in an interview that there's a happy ending, but oh well, I will just ignore it!", and all that shit. Because, for three long years, I had to endure their bullshit, ESPECIALLY their point of views and opinions that were heavily Ranka-biased in series and movie discussions. So really, their sour-graping and grasping at straws provide good entertainment for me. Funny. I've never met more unsightly, vicious and nasty bunch in any Macross discussion or board ever than hardcore Sheryl fans. You have absolutely no idea what kind of shit I've been through during past years because I loved Ranka's character. And I really liked Sheryl too, but apparently in some corners of the internet it's deadly sin to like BOTH if the other one happens to be Ranka. And hearing self-professed Sheryl fan like you blame Ranka fans of being "biased" in MacrossF discussion is hilarious. If I went by the most insane and hysterical Sheryl fans Ranka would've eaten babies if given chance while Sheryl was living saint herself. The amount of undeserved hate Ranka got from certain sects of fandom was in scale far bigger than similar irrational bs that was said of Sheryl. Thankfully nearly all people I've got to watch the series and love it tended to appreciate both characters. For some reason it's only the hardcore fan audiences of *both* characters I've ever seen engage in vicious hatedom... “Why do you see the speck in your brother's eye but fail to notice the beam in your own eye?" and all that jazz, y'know. It's people like you - on *both* "sides" (there shouldn't be any sides here and there wouldn't be any if anime fans didn't turn into bunch of sectarian retards from slightest provocation) - that poisoned the atmosphere of fandom in so many places over the time. If you didn't engage in the retarded shipping wars then please forgive my false accusations, but by openly delighting in anguish of fellow fans I see the same ugly mentality raising its head. If some bitchy Ranka "fans" gave you hard time over the years you have my sympathy. But don't you fucking dare to pretend Sheryl fans were any better on average. I carry memories of too many personal attacks, too many trolled "neutral" areas and too much unjustified bs to led falsitude like that slide by. Jesus, this is why I hate the fandom into the whole romance aspect of series. No matter what pairing they're all the same. I'm sorry if I offended you with this post, I have no problem with your opinions per se but I can't let hypocrisy fly by when it's as blatant as that. steshin said: At the end of it all, I actually find movie!Ranka a good character (just as I had found DYRL Minmay wonderful). BUT her fans will forever leave a horrible taste in my mouth. Particularly the demented rantings of BleachOD and her close followers. *shudders* Have you even *seen* the film yet? If you haven't how can you judge "film!Ranka"? But yes, film Ranka is wonderful and definetly better than her series counterpart (who too I found lovely). Just like film Sheryl and film Alto are superior to their tv series counterparts (Sheryl too I found lovely in series, Alto I didn't care much for before Sayonara). BleachOD is *hardcore shipper* and should not be taken as exemplary of typical Ranka fan. I couldn't care less about shipping, if the romantic pair is supported by good writing and decent narrative I accept it. So, if Ranka fans "will forever leave a horrible taste" in your mouth unfortunately I can say same of Sheryl fans. But then again, what's the point? Some of my friends liked both but liked Sheryl a lot more. I have nothing against them, or "Sheryl fans" in general. Perhaps I could count myself as one too as she's one of my all time favourite characters. But if being Sheryl fan comes with the requirement of dissing Ranka you can count me out. And by making posts like that insulting Ranka fans as singular group, as if it wasn't composed of individuals with differing opinions about many things, you aren't gaining any points for Alto/Sheryl front. At all. Sorry for angryness of this reply but you *did* offend me here through hypocrisy and the suggestion "Ranka fans" are universally detestable bunch. Because I count myself as one and I've done *nothing* you accuse her fans of doing. |
XardieMay 23, 2011 4:11 PM
| ^Umm, did you read the ones in the open-close parenthesis? If the rabidness and arrogance applied to you, then go ahead and be offended. *rolls eyes* It's just nice to finally see something explode in their hardcore shippers' face. If that is so horrible, then boo hoo for you. I don't fucking care. I have friends who are Ranka fans who aren't clouded by their bias and actually great to discuss the series with without going into tl;drs of how superior Ranka is or how there is so much Alto/Ranka love in this one scene. Thank fucking God for that. |
steshinMay 24, 2011 1:18 AM
steshin said: ^Umm, did you read the ones in the open-close parenthesis? If the rabidness and arrogance applied to you, then go ahead and be offended. *rolls eyes* Well, you did later write "BUT her fans will forever leave a horrible taste in my mouth" so I figured you were just offering description of Ranka fans in parenthesis early on... but if that's not the case then there's no harm done :) steshin said: It's just nice to finally see something explode in their hardcore shippers' face. If that is so horrible, then boo hoo for you. I don't fucking care. Fair enough and I can definetly understand that. One of the reasons I liked the way they resolved the triangle was that it trolled all shippers to some extent, in fact. Some much moreso than others of course, but no faction emerged completely unscathed. That's typical Kawamori ending for you, it's dangerous to ship in any work of his. One would think people'd know this by now with Escaflowne, Macross Zero and all but nooooo... :D steshin said: I have friends who are Ranka fans who aren't clouded by their bias and actually great to discuss the series with without going into tl;drs of how superior Ranka is or how there is so much Alto/Ranka love in this one scene. Thank fucking God for that. Change Rankas to Sheryls and Alto/Ranka to Alto/Sheryl and I could say exactly same thing :P I guess we could just agree all rabid fans (truly honoring the words origin in "fanatic") are annoying, eh? You didn't answer my question about have you seen Sayonara though. If you haven't seen it how can you so boldly say you like Ranka in the film version of the story? Essentially she's same as in series anyway. |
XardieMay 24, 2011 2:03 AM
| The ending was inevitable, especially when Kawamori suggested everyone to rewatch Macross Zero rather than the Frontier series. Also, simple, I just happened to like first movie Ranka, and while I have not seen the second movie, I did spoil myself in it. Plus, with all the raves I'm hearing about her in the second movie, particularly her selfless actions, it only makes me admire her even more. That's something I would never have thought or done in the series. |
steshin said: The ending was inevitable, especially when Kawamori suggested everyone to rewatch Macross Zero rather than the Frontier series. Well...I guess. I do think Macross Zero suggestion had to do with other things too than just the climax because the film really beautifully ties some thematic and story elements from Zero to Frontier, thus really grounding Macross Zero within the franchise. In any rate the ending is pretty much perfect in my opinion, bittersweet to fit film's themes better but with also a hint of possible "happy ending" that they thankfully didn't depict as it would have cheapened the impact and made it too saccharine affair for film that took "ikiru" as its main theme. Which is why Kiss of the Galaxy's final volume sounds like piece of shit (well, that and the shit about Brera in it if what OP said was true. Fucking hack author) steshin said: Also, simple, I just happened to like first movie Ranka, ...well see, this is exactly what bugs me. I'm really not interested in debating people who hated Ranka in the tv series, I'm mostly "whatever" about it these days. But what does boggle and confound me is the lack of consistency with this thing. That many people who hated Ranka in tv series liked her in the first film makes absolutely no sense to me because *she is just the same* girl. They haven't changed her personality or aspirations one bit and whatever changes there are in comparison to her tv series counterpart during first cour (which Utahime broadly speaking reinterprepts and adapts) are mainly about her background. Nanase is gone and Alto is her friend she has known for period of time that's difficult to determine instead of her and Alto being complete strangers to each other in the beginning of the story. How one can hate Ranka in series yet like her in Utahime when she's 99% identical has never made any sense at all to me. steshin said: and while I have not seen the second movie, I did spoil myself in it. Plus, with all the raves I'm hearing about her in the second movie, particularly her selfless actions, it only makes me admire her even more. That's something I would never have thought or done in the series. Too bad about spoiling oneself because less one knows beforehand the better. This reminds me, I really should start putting my review together... and yes, Ranka IS a showstealer in Sayonara no Tsubasa for sure (hell, both me and my friend who saw the film with me agreed that she ended up coming off stronger than even Sheryl, and it's not like Sheryl is any weaker than she has been before) but it's not like there are any changes in her basic nature or personality (unlike some other characters). She simply has more room to act and grow in storyline whereas in original series she got shafted by narrative repeatedly starting with episode 16 and got rather dickheadish, ever worsening treatment without a single lucky break all the way up to final episode. In film version of MacrossF she just has more freedom, largerly because Kawamori felt remorse and couldn't get over how Ranka got treated in tv series and deprived of much genuine autonomy in second half due to demands of plot. This time around he wanted to give more chances for Ranka to do what she wanted. |
XardieMay 24, 2011 5:34 AM
| I don't mind being spoiled. Typical Kawamori ending is typical, when he mentioned Zero, what immediately comes to mind is how Sara and Shin folded away to God-knows-where. I have to say it's even generous of him to leave it in the sweeter note in bittersweet (Alto being alive and having folded and Sheryl waking up--he was even amused and surprised at how people saw it as a sad ending). And considering all continuities in Macross are canon, then it's fine with me. I am just glad it finally ends the triangle and that people can' supposedly' move on to other discussions. *shrugs* Movie-Ranka is different from Series-Ranka in terms of maturity and empathy inmho, (a lot of people agree to this). Your mileage may vary. After all, I didn't agree with your points on the series romance in ghostlightning's blog. We have our own opinions and perspective, and I'm fine with it, as long as one doesn't try to shove it down my throat like it's the truth (unless backed up by canon evidence) and the only correct perspective [see LoveMeKags], (which I'm been subject to countless times in the fandom). I remember an interview before Itsuwari no Utahime where Kawamori said (you'll have to dig for it in forums) that Alto would be more "active" and Ranka would be given changes. Sheryl was essentially the one who was more or less left the same. |
steshinMay 24, 2011 10:32 AM
steshin said: Typical Kawamori ending is typical, when he mentioned Zero, what immediately comes to mind is how Sara and Shin folded away to God-knows-where. I have to say it's even generous of him to leave it in the sweeter note in bittersweet (Alto being alive and having folded and Sheryl waking up--he was even amused and surprised at how people saw it as a sad ending). And considering all continuities in Macross are canon, then it's fine with me. Yeah, he couldn't have made more Kawamori ending if he tried. I like the ambiguity film leaves though, we see Sheryl's lips moving a bit with Ranka's singing and her earring glitter but it just gives inclination of hope that Sheryl will be able to wake up one day (and the final song can be interprepted as concert S & R are going to hold some time afterwards) but it doesn't actually show that it WILL happen no matter what. There's hope there but it's not certain. Similarly Alto is MIA - and theoretically KIA is possible, who the fuck knows if the place Vajra folded to has atmosphere at all - and could be in other side of the universe without no clear way home for all viewer knows...and thus that he'd manage to return would be a small miracle. A possibility, but miracle nonetheless. The implied happy ending is mostly transmitted through the final song if one interprepts it as audio from future live concert taking place after epilogue, but of course that isn't 100% certain interprepation either. It isn't sad end and the implications are towards the lighter side of things, but it's still ambiguous enough to not make it too "easy". steshin said: *shrugs* Movie-Ranka is different from Series-Ranka in terms of maturity and empathy inmho, (a lot of people agree to this). Your mileage may vary. Empathy is just "wat" but in terms of maturity = absolutely. By the end of Sayonara Ranka is mature and in a sense wise way beyond her years (though in a different way from how Sheryl is) - this time around they really fullfilled her potential completely, something I felt they never did in tv series. As said, I couldn't have asked for more. I'd say same for Alto in smaller scale because I finally learned to dig the guy in the final film and whatever issues I had with him are now gone. But this is exactly why I asked if you had seen Sayonara because then I would've seen where you came from. But in regards of maturity Ranka really isn't any different in Utahime in comparison to tv series IMO. Yes, I know some people think so. Then again, universally people who have expressed opinions like this hated Ranka in tv series and wrote some of the silliest things I've seen (I don't really care how much you hate some character but if your "interprepations" would land a lead heroine in absolute villain territory *you're doing it wrong*. Either your view is severely skewered or then the writing was stupifyingly incompetent < is what I'd say to some of these folks) - in comparison people who did like her rarely perceived any *drastic* changes. Considering how much of the rage she got was result of eps 20 (understandable if eventually overblown, Ranka deserved that slap) and 21 ("lol") I'm more inclined to think these events completely skewered some people's perpective on Ranka and just because Ranka avoided her lowest moment - ep 20 - in film some folks felt like they had done much bigger changes to her character than they really did. Ranka's development is roughly equal to the one she showcases from ep 1 to Gallia IV episodes, it has just been condensed little bit due to running time. *shrug* but whatever steshin said: After all, I didn't agree with your points on the series romance in ghostlightning's blog. We have our own opinions and perspective, and I'm fine with it, as long as one doesn't try to shove it down my throat like it's the truth (unless backed up by canon evidence) and the only correct perspective [see LoveMeKags], (which I'm been subject to countless times in the fandom). I honestly don't remember what exactly you're referring to, there was so many things going down there at the same time and after youtube vids etc. got spammed the whole discussion turned laggy as hell and I tuned out of it because it was just becoming too unwieldy. I don't even remember what I ever said about the romance in there and there's no guarantee I'd now sign my words from back then ^^; For the record I've been firmly in "Sheryl wins" camp for a long, long time. steshin said: I remember an interview before Itsuwari no Utahime where Kawamori said (you'll have to dig for it in forums) that Alto would be more "active" and Ranka would be given changes. Sheryl was essentially the one who was more or less left the same. with "forums" you better not mean animesuki... Funnily enough I thought Sheryl was the one who was changed the most for the first film while Alto and Ranka remained pretty much how they were in series. Sheryl was so awesome in the first film she impressed me there as much as she did in series second half - and in the original series I really didn't like her much untill after Gallia IV arc to be honest. In here she was so winsome from the start that her only "flaw" was just how close to Mary Sue territory she ended in (though luckily she didn't quite make it there, second film also added more vulnerability and humane flawlessness to her which was a great thing). For one she was the character with biggest revisions in terms of backstory and position (the spy subplot didn't exist at all in series), she was way more integrated to the core narrative as she knew Aimo etc., she was given some own motivation for coming to Frontier which wouldn't be revealed before Sayonara... List continues. I also found her personality much more likeable as they toned down her immature tsundereness considerably and got pretty much entirely rid off her haughty and pompous moments. In return they gave her somewhat softer and simply "cuter" personality especially evident in Star Date, presumably influenced by Aya Endo and May'n (at least people told me Kawamori incorporated their traits to film Sheryl). All in all I felt there weren't much "improvements" to Alto or Ranka but Sheryl was considerably more likeable to me than she was in the beginning of tv series. And looking at all the additional plot weight from various hings she gained I'd say she was certainly changed for the film version, whereas Ranka and Alto were much more static (changing Ranka into Alto's friend was mostly just a way to save screentime because now they needed only one "meet the cute" moment between Alto and female lead as he already knew the other one) I wouldn't mind reading the interview though! And I suspect with "changes" to Ranka's character Kawamori ment - instead of major personality revisions which don't really exist as far as I can tell - the same thing he ment in his recent comments about handling her character arc differently from series because that had probably been bugging him since the end of the tv series. |
| Thanks for great reply! Looks like we agree on a lot here, actually. :) LoveDriftsAway said: I don't think shippers got "trolled." The movie is well liked and well received in Japan (it does help Kawamori confirmed a lot of hopeful facts: Alto's alive, Sheryl's awakening). I was always expecting the Zero/Escaflowne ending. His commentary before the movie screamed this kind of ending. Oh yeah I didn't mean to imply film was badly received, to the contrary. Going through japanese blogs, comments, pixiv etc. it's been pretty much universal high praise for the film - and it absolutely deserves it. I think it was either in Nakajima's or Endo's blog but some guy (presumably guy) said that he had brought his friends, completely unfamiliar with Macross, to see the film and they had been instantly "converted" which I found funny and somewhat baffling. Utahime/Sayonara stands well on its own IMO but I'd think seeing just Sayonara would be helluva baffling experience... Anyway this isn't what I ment. I just ment that no really positive HAPPY HAPPY RABU RABU ending was delivered for anyone on screen, as shippers presumably would hope. Sheryl/Alto shippers got it best by "winning" but even that victory has its more bitter shade in Sheryl falling in coma and Alto going MIA. Alto/Ranka ship was sunk concurrently, of course but they also went and killed Brera - in which I take particular delight because I really don't like it when some fans ship the two. It's also not uncommon mentality among shippers to want to pair the "remaining ones" so by having Alto first reject Ranka the likelihood of shippers wanting to put the siblings together increased...but that was outdone by killing Brera :P I didn't mean "trolling" too literally, just that Kawamori rarely just gives straightforward happy ends to his couples like shippers presumably hope. LoveDriftsAway said: In the movies, I agree, but in the TV series, there were times she looked, dressed and acted younger than Klan's apparent age (who always acted like an adult since she's the oldest of the group). It made me feel like a pedo when she wore those pajamas of hers. Hahaha, you mean that ridiculous Donkey pajama? :DDD I think that outfit was very INTENTIONAL move. In that scene Ranka is brooding rather childishly and immaturely. The pajama - not fanservicey at all as far as I can tell so I'm not sure what gave you pedo vibes - just emphatized this scene and feeling. In short it was very similar to Lain using the bear pajama in Serial Experiments Lain. Ranka snaps out of it though and we never see the outfit again. I also disagree about Klan who could act great deal more immaturely in her tsundere loli form than in her natural size (all the way up to ep 20 and her confession. She springs away rather comically afterwards). I also forgot to add that even loli Klan has some sort of rack (see ep 20) so not even she looks completely prepubescent... As for Ranka's outfit there's that red one which is childish, but I've seen similar ones used by young adult idols in some music PVs etc. so I guess it's just simply ment to be "cute" (and in Japan this quickly comes up with infantilism to some degree). Most of the time she runs around either in school uniform or that simple skirt she had on in first episode which really suits her cute and modest personality. Ranka's clothes in general don't stand out whereas Sheryl's clothes tend to be as outrageously eyecatching as the person wearing them so I haven't thought about this all that much. But I guess you're right about her dressing more her age (I just thought they had her dress a bit more flashy :P)... I certainly loved all the new outfits she got in films, out of her "casual" wear that pink outfit she had on in Sheryl's concert was particularly great. She didn't wear anything like that in series for sure. As for looks, sure. Sometimes Ranka looked like she could've been 18 (ep 10 as she sings Aimo on the hill and director hears her) while at other times she DOES look like maybe 12 year old (ending scene of ep 11). Most of the time she falls somewhere in-between. Sheryl had her fluctuations too, mainly with boob size :P I think this was mostly just animators having hard time with character designs which do differ a bit from the norm, esp. with noses. For example in ep 15 Sheryl tends to have HUGE nose in nearly all shots that looks almost comical. So that in films Ranka looks more consistently her age I took simply as outcome of film budget and time schedule being able to fully render the character designs in the glory they deserved. I think same of Sheryl (and rest of the cast) though in her case she didn't fluctuate much in age per se. Because of this I tend to go by design sheets and official art (for example this is good showcase how Sheryl and Ranka would ideally look IMO) for the "original design" and in here Ranka doesn't really look any older in newer material than in older (they fluctuate depending on artist etc. more than by if they came from tv series or film era). Her "base look" has been really consistent as far as I can tell so that Ranka looks older (and better!) as a rule in films I've thought only as natural result of films having tighter key check rather than any real design alterations. I mean, they did use good quality footage from tv series straight in Utahime too. For example, I don't see much difference in Ranka in this from tv series era and this from film time. Of course I can be wrong about this, but I haven't really heard of any design alterations for films (clothes not counted). LoveDriftsAway said: I think she's a total cutie when they stop treating her like a pre-pubescent girl. They fell into this trap in the Anime which grated me. She looks stunning when she doesn't look too childish (her farewell scene in episode 21, for example). Oh yeah, I agree. I have wondered if they didn't intentionally play with this thing in the series though - that Ranka looks so mature (and stunning, certainly) for example in that scene would make sense in a same way the donkey pajama thingy made sense in ep 6. It's hard to say, they do play with intentional shift in animation style/looks in first film in the "Valkyrie outfit" scene. Ranka is given very "blobby", round-faced look with vivid simple expressions in the non-closeup shots and it wonderfully suits the animator's style - but she doesn't look like that in any other shots. She's really lovable in the films through and through though (I'd say only films do consistently justice to the character designs anyway without any hickup moments), which certainly doesn't make my preference for film version any more difficult :P I especially loved the look she had with the Houkago Overflow school uniform. Alas it was not enough to melt Alto's heart... LoveDriftsAway said: Macross F Official Fan Book, p. 92. Thanks. Has the interview/commentary been transcribed/translated somewhere? I remember reading Yosino coming really close to saying Alto was going to confess to Sheryl in ep 24 in some interview bit I've read, but I don't remember the details... LoveDriftsAway said: As a side note. The creators love to bash Alto. They love the girls, it seems, dislike the guy. Kawamori said he was "very lucky" to survive the series in a commentary track of episode 25 if I recall correctly. HAHAHAHAHAAHAHAH :DDDDD Well, sure sounds like my own reaction to Frontier initially. I loved Ranka and Sheryl but couldn't stand Alto in general at all. This surely contributed to the fact I really wasn't into shipping at all. I would've preferred yuri ship of the two girls anyway and unfortunately that was out of question. LoveDriftsAway said: Sheryl: Kiss in the Galaxy LoveDriftsAway said: Sheryl's personality is exactly as she acted in the tv series when we got to "know" her "true self" (not the one stressed or suffering jet lag). The one "false impressions" trick wouldn't work twice on the audience (they purposefully had her arrive sick and irritated to mislead us in episode 1), so they skipped that. I wasn't referring to the very beginning when she came off as a huge bitch though, I was speaking of the first cour or so in more general terms. I didn't hate her by any means and was reasonably fond of her (especially when she trolled Alto) but overall I didn't like her much. Film Sheryl engages in notably less tsundere antics etc. than her tv series counterpart and doesn't come off as arrogant etc. in my opinion. Which is why I liked her a lot more from the start in Utahime. LoveDriftsAway said: I also think Ranka's major problems were less to do with her personality and more to do with the plot in the TV series. She was given to hold the "idiot ball" and "distress ball" for the sake of the story. She had a very good growth in episode 12. Ozma's flashbacks of her as well. Sadly, they put her "in a bus". Her movie version is given chances to shine because she's not given the damsel in distress plot all the time (she couldn't even go to the bathroom in the TV series that she got kidnapped for Alto to look manly and for Brera to look aloofly mysterious), but chances to be proactive. Without being in constant danger, her reliance on Alto diminishes so she gives an independent vibe she could have had in the TV series if they hadn't messed up the development. Well "messed up" is way too strongly put in my opinion (I think Ranka and Alto were overall well developed in the series, but Ranka in particular had potential for so much more... especially when one remembers the fantastic char. dev. Sheryl got in second half) but apart from that: YES!!! I agree 100% - this is exactly what I mean when I say that Ranka got screwed over by the plot again and again and again in second half. The narrative placed such heavy constraints and demands on her role that she really didn't have even ounce of "space" to develop or act on her own like Sheryl had, for comparison. Good example would be the turning point of the series, ep 20. The simple fact is that the narrative NEEDED Ranka to be out of it and in pretty much hysterical state. Otherwise the whole storyline would've bene unable to progress. As far as I can tell they had exactly two ways to achieve this, either they kill Ozma or then Ranka goes through serious heartbreak. Ozma dodged the bullet so they really had no other option than to play out the scene like they did. If Ranka hadn't picked up the "distress ball" that first had her in a fit of hysterics and then render Aimo useless the Vajra would've been unable to unleash the great destruction they did. I feel certain kind of "meta-pity" for Ranka here because her moment of epic fail was absolutely necessitated by narrative. Mostly I'm just taking a issue and already cringing at those extreme Ranka haters who - after finally seeing the second film - will probably be talking all over how they "fixed" her nigh-evil personality when nothing like that happened or needed to happen. There was nothing to be fixed there. In terms of character and personality series and film Ranka are for the most part pretty much the same (they just capitalize on her virtues and thanks to the development film version allowed Ranka goes much further than in series) unlike series and DYRL Minmay who have clearly different personalities in many ways. It's the narrative that is different and this time around Ranka doesn't get screwed over systematically by it. |
| Can't wait for 2nd movie to be out. Sheryl my favorite due to few reasons, the simplest one would be how kind/supportive she is to Ranka (rival). |
 |
| To Alto, it seems that Ranka is a good little sister or good friend material while Sheryl's good girlfriend material. It's how the official material promotes them sometimes. They pushed Sheryl into a romantic view while Ranka had all platonic ones (outside a scripted movie kiss). This filters into their goodies. Sheryl as Queen to Alto's King in the Macross F deck of cards (Ranka was the Joker). The love declaration (from a scan of the official movie book): |
| That babe is so hot in that pic....oh, and Sheryl too! XD |
| wow thanks for the spoilers ^^ I've just finished the series and the end is just LOL, but now knowing Sheryl won after all makes me so happy. Seriously she is my godness, Alto regained some points in my book for making the right decision. |
torrentsven said: but she didnt win, its still an open book No. Sheryl won the triangle. Alto couldn't even love Ranka when he thought Sheryl was dead. The only open part is that if they'll be reunited one day (there are enough hints they will, including a nudge nudge by Kawamori). Ranka pretty much gives up on Alto by hoping for Sheryl and him to be reunited together in the end. The official Macross Frontier movie book. Story part, a chapter is called:   It has a full page of Alto friendzoning Ranka and telling Sheryl she's the one he loves as conclusion. The seiyuus interview also point out that the 'romance' part of Frontier is finally resolved (Alto loves Sheryl). |
| ^If only certain teenage girls would GET that message... |
| i hated both pairing and all the characters in them so i was just hoping for a all 3 dies ending, ehh i got 1.5/3 of that (sheryls at least dead on the inside) |
Immahnoob said: Jizzy, I know you have no idea how to argue for shit, tokiyashiro said: Jizzy as you would call yourself because youre a dick The most butthurt award goes to you And clearly you havent watched that many shows thats why you cant determine if a show is unique or not Or maybe you're just a child who likes common stuffs where hero saves the day and guys gets all the girls. Sad taste you have there kid you came up to me in the first place making you look more like a kid who got slapped without me even knowing it and start crying about it to me |
| ^Sheryl wakes up in the end. the dShutistab duet with Ranka in the credits gives that away. |
DJIzzyIzzyHitler said: i hated both pairing and all the characters in them so i was just hoping for a all 3 dies ending, ehh i got 1.5/3 of that (sheryls at least dead on the inside) You ain't seen nothing yet. :)) I'm simply satisfied with the conclusion, me being not to shipping-conscious, but more focused on storytelling. |
| I play, the haters lose. |
| Why hate the Sheryl x Alto pairing/ending? I have to say I found myself rooting more for Ranka in the series because I didn't like Sheryl all that much until the end (but I didn't hate her). Both of their characters were great in the movies--far better than the series counterparts. People use the excuse that Ranka was childish and immature while others say Sheryl was snobby and only played around with Alto; these are not decent excuses people. The characters are not prefect and were never meant to be, they're going to have flaws and problems; moments of weakness and strength. Stop hating them for it. Both Ranka and Sheryl are great characters and each deserves a happy ending with or without Alto. Both girls loved Alto with true feelings; they just showed it in different ways. There was nothing "fake" about how either of them felt for Alto. In the end, I'm quite happy with how it closed up, the pairing that won. And I admire Ranka for accepting the outcome of Alto's feelings for Sheryl. |
| <img src="http://i1121.photobucket.com/albums/l515/kiddy-girl-and/hubby-1-1-2-1-1-1.jpg" /> |
ModifiedxAkuma said: Why hate the Sheryl x Alto pairing/ending? I have to say I found myself rooting more for Ranka in the series because I didn't like Sheryl all that much until the end (but I didn't hate her). Both of their characters were great in the movies--far better than the series counterparts. People use the excuse that Ranka was childish and immature while others say Sheryl was snobby and only played around with Alto; these are not decent excuses people. The characters are not prefect and were never meant to be, they're going to have flaws and problems; moments of weakness and strength. Stop hating them for it. Both Ranka and Sheryl are great characters and each deserves a happy ending with or without Alto. Both girls loved Alto with true feelings; they just showed it in different ways. There was nothing "fake" about how either of them felt for Alto. In the end, I'm quite happy with how it closed up, the pairing that won. And I admire Ranka for accepting the outcome of Alto's feelings for Sheryl. This is pretty much how I felt. By making Ranka the underdog, I tended to root for her more even though I knew Sheryl would be the clear winner. I didn't like Sheryl very much as her character development seemed inconsistent and the series itself seemed to focus more on Alto/Ranka. Although I warmed up to her near the end when she was revealed to not be as perfect as she seemed and I think she suits Alto well. Alto and Ranka were cute together but their relationship did a feel a bit like that of siblings. It's funny because Brera and Ranka were actual siblings but their connection has a romantic light to it. XD |
sauveterreJul 29, 2012 6:06 AM
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| Can anyone reupload the picture of the commemorative end of the love triangle by macross ace pls?? |
| I'm personally glad that Alto and Sheryl end up together. Alto x Ranka never felt right to me as I watched the series. Pus they didn't look good together. What I didn't really like is how obscure the relationships are even all the way towards the end! I wish they made it clear before ending the anime series. The only way people would actually know that Alto and Sheryl end up together is if they watch the movie and read the manga.... which is what I had to do after watching the series because I needed the closure and just had to know for sure. |
 . . . . . ✘ . . . . .DO NOT touch my rice. . . . . . I'm Asian. . . . . . |
| So they decide to release some movies years later. Instead of giving us a conclusive ending they jerk the fans around. Fuck that man. Not watching those movies. Kinda surprised Sheryl wins, I honestly thought it would have been Ranka since they focused a lot more on her feelings than Sheryl. I'm pretty indifferent to either though. They made a good job making both girls seem like likable and possible contenders. So either way I'm not bothered. |
| What was so great about alto though? |
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