| Why are Mushoku fans so adamant about selling it as a redemption story? When you say it like that, it paints the picture that the "character development" is about Rudeus letting go of his weird perverted and immoral sides AFTER suffering consequences for it. But the thing is, the narrative has never painted that as a bad thing and something Rudeus needs to overcome or whatever. The story views Rudeus as a failure in his previous life due to being an anti social lazy immature bum and that's the part where he needs to grow from during his journey in this new world and experience life fully. Basically, stop trying to make the series more marketable and just accept that it won't sit right with everyone. |
| This is a little excerpt from the light novel review I did for it: This series is not a straight-up ‘redemption’ journey, it is about Rudeus living a life with no regrets and trying to live in a satisfactory way by the end without wasting his chances. It is not about him being whitewashed to being a perfect human being with zero flaws but growing amidst them and learning from his mistakes to do better and find a real purpose in his life, and stick to it as much as possible. Basically, he is redeeming what he lost in his previous life through decades of depression, anxiety and internal hatred that robbed him of any future from society and life as a decent adult. He does absolutely develop throughout the story and more to come later on, especially when he gains more friends and comrades, and builds personal relationships along the way and work. He is a pervert and that does somewhat reduce in its extremeness compared to the start of the series but he won't ever become someone completely clean from all of that. He will have weird quirks to him, but as he grows up, he does showcase growth as an adult and is motivated to accomplish life as a responsible adult with building a family and attaining happiness, something he never did in the past. It is not a redemption story per say but it is a story that does allow him to grow as a character in spades. Just maybe not in ways that some people wish, which is more on the moral side (although he does have own moral conflicts that are introduced in the series though with his new world vs old world in certain areas for its own development). There are redemption elements to it but yeah, as an explicit story, wouldn't say it is one. Still a fucking great story though. |
Advide said: Yeah, it never made any sense to me that people would try and say his perverted/creepy behavior was supposed to be immoral, that he starts off as a "bad" person, when the author is crystal clear about not giving a shit whether Rudy was a highly controversial character before his reincarnation, aside from the degenerate, jobless, anti-social loser, angle. How could the narrative be condemning his perverted actions when these elements are frequently used as comedy or fanservice? If you're viewing the story realistically, then you might not expect this, but it should be easy enough to recognize that the author doesn't intend/want you to treat Rudy like a 40+ yr old disgusting pedophile for the entire story. Why are Mushoku fans so adamant about selling it as a redemption story? When you say it like that, it paints the picture that the "character development" is about Rudeus letting go of his weird perverted and immoral sides AFTER suffering consequences for it. But the thing is, the narrative has never painted that as a bad thing and something Rudeus needs to overcome or whatever. The story views Rudeus as a failure in his previous life due to being an anti social lazy immature bum and that's the part where he needs to grow from during his journey in this new world and experience life fully. Basically, stop trying to make the series more marketable and just accept that it won't sit right with everyone. |
| If you reply back to me and I never respond, I lost interest and don't care. Sorry about that. |
Eldencheese said: Are you missing the point? He's talking about moral redemption, which the author was never concerned with in the first place.Advide said: Why are Mushoku fans so adamant about selling it as a redemption story? When you say it like that, it paints the picture that the "character development" is about Rudeus letting go of his weird perverted and immoral sides AFTER suffering consequences for it. But the thing is, the narrative has never painted that as a bad thing and something Rudeus needs to overcome or whatever. The story views Rudeus as a failure in his previous life due to being an anti social lazy immature bum and that's the part where he needs to grow from during his journey in this new world and experience life fully. Basically, stop trying to make the series more marketable and just accept that it won't sit right with everyone. Top 10 people who don’t know what happens in ln and doesn’t know that they want people to catch up by then so they get to experience the diamond in the ruff story |
| If you reply back to me and I never respond, I lost interest and don't care. Sorry about that. |
| let it goooooooooo |
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Eldencheese said: Your reply feels completely irrelevant. You aren't showing any comprehension of the point the OP was making. LostSpectre said: tbh idc if you understand or like the show. i just think if you stick it out till the anime adaptation is finished you might enjoy it but probably not im just waffaling.Are you missing the point? He's talking about moral redemption, which the author was never concerned with in the first place. |
| If you reply back to me and I never respond, I lost interest and don't care. Sorry about that. |
Todday said: Tbh that's true as well, MT is a pretty decisive show where the "if you don't like it then don't watch" argument is actually valid since the "don't like it" part isn't really about the quality of the series. If people are that deeply unsettled by the uncomfortable elements then they should have left at S1 and moved on. You say just accept that it won’t sit right with everyone, but the only people I see complaining is people who feel uncomfortable watching it. I don’t understand why you would watch something that makes you feel uncomfortable. Either stfu or stop watching it |
Isekai-Enjoyer said: Generally, when people use the term redemption it's in regard to a perceived moral wrongdoing, while Rudy's "redemption" is about personal growth.Because it IS a redemption story? It’s simply not a redemption story about perversion lmao. His perversion wasn’t even supposed to be viewed as a bad trait at all. Westerns are just annoying as fuck when it comes to that. Either way, it’s a story about moving on from his old detestable life. Saying Rudeus didn’t develop is ridiculous. The ONLY thing he didn’t grow from is his perversion, and hell, even that got way better with time (the way he deals with it, at least). If you can’t see that, then I really don’t know what to say. His development isn’t even subtle at all. Just don’t watch the show expecting a story in which perversion is a theme. The ecchi part is just an extra. It’s not a deep part of the plot at all. You have to know that when people use "perversion" in this instance, it's in regard to him being a predator/pedo, not worshipping panties. The OP also didn't claim that Rudy doesn't develop, he said it makes it seem like the development is tied to becoming a morally righteous person. |
| If you reply back to me and I never respond, I lost interest and don't care. Sorry about that. |
| This is a bit complicated because Mushoku Tensei is not actually a redemption story, while Rudeus does grow as a person and shades off some of his most unsavory aspects, he doesn't actually aim to become a fully moral person, he literally sees Paul as his life example for God's sake. |
Isekai-Enjoyer said: Pretty much what LostSpectre at #16 quoted. As I implied in my original post, the story at its core is about a hikikomori and NEET not wasting his second chance at life and using it for personal growth. That doesn't seem to align with the typical view of redemption in fictional stories.Because it IS a redemption story? It’s simply not a redemption story about perversion lmao. His perversion wasn’t even supposed to be viewed as a bad trait at all. Westerns are just annoying as fuck when it comes to that. Either way, it’s a story about moving on from his old detestable life. Saying Rudeus didn’t develop is ridiculous. The ONLY thing he didn’t grow from is his perversion, and hell, even that got way better with time (the way he deals with it, at least). If you can’t see that, then I really don’t know what to say. His development isn’t even subtle at all. Just don’t watch the show expecting a story in which perversion is a theme. The ecchi part is just an extra. It’s not a deep part of the plot at all. |
| I mean, I am not one of the people trying to make others like it, but I am also not trying to make others hate it. Just watch it if you want to. However, I do disagree with Rudeus not changing. He most literally "touches grass" and matures, which in turn allows him to be more likeable and someone that the girls would want to be with. |
| It's a story about a completely new life on the back of a wasted one, I don't think redemption is any specific aim of this story. Next to all his issues in the story stem from his past life and it's specifically written not to be a self insert but at the same time tries to get the audience to understand atleast how certain situations effect him, there is a grey area when it comes to things such as understanding his morality or if the audience is supposed to empathize, because some situations there is and others there isn't, it changes between it. |
| A large part of it is thanks to Gigguk calling it a redemption story, which is wrong and gives people the wrong impression. Mushoku Tensei is NOT a redemption story. Its a reincarnation story. He'll get better, but not in the way you want him to (and I'm aware that thats already too much for some people). If you find it uncomfortable, you can stop watching. I'm not gonna hold you. Rudeus in not an equivalent of a white liberal struck by a white guilt, who tries to correct long overdue mistakes, that he honestly can't even if he would try. The only thing he can do is making sure it won't happen again and obviously, it's a gradual process. I love this series because of the self improvement he undergoes. The controversy won't change that for me in the slightest. Also, no hate on Gigguk btw he just made an honest mistake its pretty easy to get that impression. |
 |
| Yeah rudeus seemed like an irredeemable character by the end of part 1. I never trust anyone who says that it is a redemption story cause as far as I know, he has no redeemable qualities and it all just gets worse as time passes. Honestly, being an immoral person doesn't mean he is a bad or uninteresting character. The lack of consequences and his portrayal is so utterly trash that I don't think there is any point in defending it. |
If you enjoyed the time you wasted, then its not a waste of time.  |
| rudy is still an ugly bastard deep inside anyway imagine if he still looks like an ugly bastard outside of their reality too then no one would like him |
Risa92 said: Isekai-Enjoyer said: Because it IS a redemption story? It’s simply not a redemption story about perversion lmao. His perversion wasn’t even supposed to be viewed as a bad trait at all. Westerns are just annoying as fuck when it comes to that. Either way, it’s a story about moving on from his old detestable life. Saying Rudeus didn’t develop is ridiculous. The ONLY thing he didn’t grow from is his perversion, and hell, even that got way better with time (the way he deals with it, at least). If you can’t see that, then I really don’t know what to say. His development isn’t even subtle at all. Just don’t watch the show expecting a story in which perversion is a theme. The ecchi part is just an extra. It’s not a deep part of the plot at all. Urgh, look at these westerners are so annoying, judging pedophilia. Almost nobody cares if he looks at the breasts of an adult women, but he constantly touches literal primary school aged kids. Yea, it was hilarious when he fondled that slave girl he just bought. Oh, wait... Obviously, since you are just mindlessly sticking to the script, I don't expect you to even notice, that it didn't happened for like a dozen of episodes, so that's why haters started whining about slavery. |
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