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| I think I fell into sleep at least four times during this...damn, even first episode wasn't so boring, and what do we get? Anothe pseudophilosophical speech about soul and body. We don't need that. We had 7 movies about it already. |
| ????????? At the end of episode 7 it made the impression they were going to stay together forever. And in the epilogue she 'flys' away.... When she says she will see him tomorrow does that mean they will still be together forever? |
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| Ahmmm.... went away Shiki Ryoug - body/container/killer impulse, next day he will meet Shiki-girlside, so to say, usual Shiki. So... who knows. |
flyingeagle666 said: ????????? At the end of episode 7 it made the impression they were going to stay together forever. And in the epilogue she 'flys' away.... When she says she will see him tomorrow does that mean they will still be together forever? That part is based on the multiple entities representing Shiki. What she means is Ryougi Shiki, the true and original one, will not be meeting with hime again. Shiki, the "female" aspect, will be the one he meets again tomorrow. I suspect Ryougi Shiki's final line is a dual-meaning one based on the fact that Shiki is a part of Ryougi Shiki, and thus Shiki meeting him can be construed as an indirect, or even direct, meeting with Ryougi Shiki as well. |
| Heh, that was so Kara no Kyoukai-ish... difficult to understand, but the atmosphere simply takes you.. I guess this is the end, of a great journey... or a beginning for Shiki and Mikiya :) Well, thanks for everything- It was nice and interesting~ |
| Boring! But the animation was very nice. |
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| Kara, I am disappoint. |
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| This Shiki's voice has a lulling tone to it. I got sleepy in the middle of this epilogue lol. :P I find the snowy landscape very beautiful. Perfect backdrop for a deep conversation. |
| Great Scenery Good animation/drawing Other then that, its just a shithole. Shiki personality automatically reminded me of the Elfen Lied Manga. The talk is godawful boring. The current Shiki is terrible. The soundtrack is also awful. Can't believe my expectation from high went down to low in 4 minutes. |
Agonist said: fri said: This is not what I have waited for for more than a year. And the "Blu-ray" movies are mostly DVD upscales. Ufotable, I am disappoint. Bullshit. Did you even see it? I'l make it easy for you this is dvd upscale - http://twitvideo.jp/contents/img/04fNv and this is what we got - http://twitvideo.jp/contents/img/04fNs Moreover, the epilogue look amazing. http://salmon.gundam.eu/knk/knk-epilogue004771.png http://salmon.gundam.eu/knk/knk-epilogue014313.png No, the movies are upconverts. It's a little more complicated than scaling the picture up, which is what happened to that DVD frame you linked to. The picture is better in the bluray because it's missing all the dvd artifacts that were in the earlier release. More bandwidth for video, no color banding, and no edge haloing. But the artwork itself really isn't any finer lined than it was in the last release. It's funny, I remember when people used to talk about how awesome the new DVD transfer was of X film and how much better it was than the previous VHS version, and now DVD is actually recognized as being not that great for all the reasons I just mentioned. The Epilogue however, that does look like a true HD production. Regarding the limp: I don't think she healed it. He picks up his leg to turn and walk away, but if you watch the scene as we pan out he still seems to be dragging it. Even a useless leg can be picked up by a working hip. |
2/10 Shiki pretty much summed up this episode. 30 fucking minute saying the same shit over and over and over and over and over. How the fuck did her finger grow back by the way? The Epilogue however, that does look like a true HD production That's probably the only good thing about this episode. |
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SuperSaiyen said: How the fuck did her finger grow back by the way? Touko probably gave her a new one : Shiki "removed" the thumb on her artificial arm (the left one). |
Urufuzu_rein said: fri said: It's 33 minutes of long, boring talk between Kokutou and Shiki. Uhm, doesn't the synopsis say so? MAL synopsis said: The epilogue titled "Kara no Kyoukai" is about a conversation between Mikiya and 「 」. I didn't even bother to read the synopsis after all it was KnK. if i knew there is all talk in 33 minutes which is not even shiki herself but her third personality who don't even have a name. i would have never ever watched this epilogue. how could i wasted my 40 minutes. (pause and try to understand some dialogues) but oh well. |
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I didn't even bother to read the synopsis after all it was KnK. if i knew there is all talk in 33 minutes which is not even shiki herself but her third personality who don't even have a name. i would have never ever watched this epilogue. how could i wasted my 40 minutes. (pause and try to understand some dialogues) but oh well. |
| This epilogue was good, except the repetitive dialogue and length. The meaning and outcome behind their whole conversation was acceptable, but it was just... mmm... it could have been better done, but nevertheless at least the conclusion to the story was OK and understandable. In the end all I can say regarding this story is that it had a nice and decent ending. |
| It was pretty boring but the dialogues were meaningful to a certain extend. |
| It was pretty boring but the dialogues were meaningful to a certain extent. |
| It was pretty boring but the dialogues were meaningful to a certain extent. |
| It was pretty boring but the dialogues were meaningful to a certain extend. |
tsubasalover said: I kind of loled before Shiki's leave, she said, "stupid Kokutou, you can still meet me tomorrow" Shiki: Goodbye Kokuto... Silly me, i know ill see you again tomorrow! |
| The epilogue just summed up most of what we knew... but I was in awe with the scenery... Edit:Damn I want a wallpaper from this >.< |
PersonasMar 31, 2011 11:34 PM
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| Shiki has got to me one of the most complex and interesting characters I've ever seen, you really gotta watch every Kara no Kyoukai movie to even start to grasp and understand the multiple layers that exist within Ryougi Shiki. Overall this was a pretty nice conclusion to the Kara no Kyoukai saga. While still leaving us with some pieces for us to put together, it warped the main point rather well. |
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| Like others have already said, the long drawn out repeating dialog was unneeded. They could have summed up everything they said in 5 no 10 mins comfortably. Even for an Epilogue it was painfully long and contributed very little to the overall story. No, she did not fix his leg. Watch the ending scene where he's moving down the hill. He lifts one leg up while dragging the other it's clear as day. The visuals where great but the overall OVA was a waste of time to watch. I wasn't expecting much to begin with since it was an Epilogue but I have to say this left a sour taste in my mouth. The series as a whole was amazing though. It's definitely worth buying and rematching over and over again. |
^)^ DeathfireD ^)^ Anime Alliance P2P Network *OPEN FOR NEW MEMBERS* |
| I don't even understand 80% of what they were talking about.. |
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| seems like i understand a bit about their conversation. but for epilogue, it's too damn long till i can't get every part that was important...:( |
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| Not what i was expecting, but it did not disappoint, one of the most interesting conversations ever! Cleared up some of my questions, I didn't even notice 33mins flew by xD. Great conclusion to the series. oOooOooo~ i need some wallpapers from this! 9/10 |
| honestly, the actual subject matter is probably horribly inconsistent with reality to anyone who can actually be arsed to watch this 5 times and think it over carefully. i can't. having said that i do think that i must have taken a lot of thought to come up with these explanations, since they aren't just made up bull or stuff coppypasted from some already existing worldview. and within the series itself this ís a well though out and (i think) mostly consistent explanation. something most producers cant be arsed to think up. so i respect it. you may think it's a pity because flat-out explaining it like this kind of shows how it doesn't make complete sense. but overall its better than just saying "magic did it". and it must be remembered that they thought about the rest of the anime, the interactions and relations and such with the same care. (never mind the animation O.o) i guess the downside of being on a completely different level from most anime is that you get judged with a higher standard ^^" |
| ~Flow |
| For the people who are wondering if 'girl' Shiki (the one we know from the series) died, I'm positive she's still alive; for several of reasons. Mostly for the last line that the 'original' Shiki says, "Goodbye Kokuto... Silly me, i know ill see you again tomorrow!" I think this implies that the body the 'original' Shiki was using was just temporary, and that the 'girl' Shiki's body is just some where else. Refering back to the last quote, I think she means that even though she may be "gone" a part of her will always remain within 'girl' Shiki, so when he sees 'girl' Shiki tomorrow he'd technically be seeing both Shikis. Another few lines that I remember the 'original' Shiki saying was something like, "tomorrow (girl) Shiki won't have any memory of this conversation.", because her persona was seperate from that of the 'guy' and 'girl' personas. Ther's also when 'original' Shiki made Mikiya promise not to tell 'girl' Shiki that it was the deep emotions from the 'original' Shiki that made her have a murderous impulse. I don't think she wouldn't have said these things if Mikiya wasn't ever going to see 'girl' Shiki again. Another example would also be when 'original' Shiki offered to head Mikiya's wound, but he rejects the offer because he doesn't want to test his luck and ruin his chance at a happy life; and because 'girl' Shiki's power has always been used for destruction not healing. And I know that this is a long shot, but the last few lines in the last movie made it sound like 'girl' Shiki would never leave the side of Mikiya no matter what; and that she is going to live her own life that she shaw fit, and not that of her other personas. Plus the fact the Mikiya doesn't seem to be flustered or upset at all when 'original' Shiki disappears at the end. Those examples in my mind are subtle hints that 'girl' Shiki is still around. However this is just my interpretation the episode. Edit: Just found some info that confirms my argument (warning major spoilers) |
alcapowned8592Dec 13, 2011 4:09 AM
| It's nice to see the 3rd personality of Shiki out on the last movie, but I don't really agree with some of the long posts in here since they sound pretty irrelevant imho. Honestly I think they should've had the Remix debut AFTER this. Overall, good movies. |
| I liked this a lot. Brought into light specific ideas as well as tying up loose ends. Not to mention Mikiya's role gets even more fleshed out and here we see the end result of his development as a character. I don't think it's so much as repeating the same thing over and over again rather it's a way of leading the viewer. It was conversation between two people, not an encyclopedia. The way it was written gave the impression of "leading on" the listener (and in part the audience), so you can sit back and relax as you take it all in one part at a time. Also disagree with people thinking that this is all gibberish, the title of Kara no Kyoukai gets explained in full detail, and it all fits within the nature of the series. Not to mention some of the stuff they talk about are actually reminiscent of Hinduism/Buddhism concepts, far from anything random. One could say that the purpose of this Epilogue was to bring a whole new and much more enlightening perspective on the series, bringing in that complementary sense of inevitability and choice of will to the whole story. I thoroughly enjoyed this, as it's a nice and relaxed way to end the series, leaving its audience with something thoughtful to ponder about. |
ronriJul 13, 2012 2:41 AM
ronri said: I liked this a lot. Brought into light specific ideas as well as tying up loose ends. Not to mention Mikiya's role gets even more fleshed out and here we see the end result of his development as a character. Yes, I was also intrigued to see Mikiya's personality explained in that manner. He wasn't the way he was, "just because"; he had a role in his life. Not everyone's origin needs to be centered around or derived from violence and personal benefit. ronri said: I don't think it's so much as repeating the same thing over and over again rather it's a way of leading the viewer. It was conversation between two people, not an encyclopedia. The way it was written gave the impression of "leading on" the listener (and in part the audience), so you can sit back and relax as you take it all in one part at a time. Yes, I agree. There were certain parts of the conversation which made me hesitate and reach for the pause button to grasp a better concept on what was just said. However, as I continued watching, I realized the episode was doing me a favor by reiterating things, and in different mannerisms or figures of speech. By the end of the episode, I had no need to immediately re-watch it for understanding, as I thought I would have needed to. ronri said: Also disagree with people thinking that this is all gibberish, the title of Kara no Kyoukai gets explained in full detail, and it all fits within the nature of the series. Not to mention some of the stuff they talk about are actually reminiscent of Hinduism/Buddhism concepts, far from anything random. Definitely. One of the primary reason I thoroughly enjoyed this series so much, besides the production values, was the deep and philosophical backdrop behind everything. You can definitely see the origins of the Nasuverse come alive in this series, and with more definition, logic, and reasoning than some of Nasu's other works. Kara no Kyoukai is definitely the 'root of all things', as far as inspiration goes, for Nasu's other works. |
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Verdale said: ronri said: I liked this a lot. Brought into light specific ideas as well as tying up loose ends. Not to mention Mikiya's role gets even more fleshed out and here we see the end result of his development as a character. Yes, I was also intrigued to see Mikiya's personality explained in that manner. He wasn't the way he was, "just because"; he had a role in his life. Not everyone's origin needs to be centered around or derived from violence and personal benefit. Exactly. This is what confuses me about people thinking that the Epilogue was nothing more than a 30-minute meaningless/pretentious conversation. It wasn't just random pretentious ideas about what many have come to know as the "Nasuverse", anyone with any decent knowledge of the world should be able to recognize that it borrows ideas from various religious concepts as a way to highlight certain aspects of the characters and the story in a more meaningful way. If anything, this Epilogue shows the bare ideas in which the Nasuverse built its universe around on and why it's not simply just there to be quirky. With that said, that's exactly what this Epilogue does, it gives meaning to Mikiya's actions as a person and it acts as his final "development" within the series. At the same time, it brings Shiki's existence into a new perspective that allows the series to truly show how much both characters have influenced each other. |
| I was expecting something much better to be the epilogue of the series and not 30 minutes of talking and philosophizing about things that we already know after watching the entire series... |
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| For a series with a bit of Jungian philosophy it was interesting to see the three Shikis forming somewhat of a Freudian trio. As for the epilogue itself: 90% pseudo-philosophical, metaphysical bullshit; 10% transcendentally enlightening views on the relationship between body, mind, and soul which draw from both Eastern and Western philosophy. The irony? That 90% is basically just the 10% thrown into a blender and turned into meaninglessly obfuscated dialogue. There are some great morsels tucked away in nooks and crannies of the script, but the script itself is doing its damnedest to keep them hidden. |
Hakuromatsu said: For a series with a bit of Jungian philosophy it was interesting to see the three Shikis forming somewhat of a Freudian trio. As for the epilogue itself: 90% pseudo-philosophical, metaphysical bullshit; 10% transcendentally enlightening views on the relationship between body, mind, and soul which draw from both Eastern and Western philosophy. The irony? That 90% is basically just the 10% thrown into a blender and turned into meaninglessly obfuscated dialogue. There are some great morsels tucked away in nooks and crannies of the script, but the script itself is doing its damnedest to keep them hidden. While I most definitely agree with a lot of your points, I personally (and thoroughly) enjoyed the 90% that you mentioned, but of course to each his own. Personally what I didn't mind about it was the fact that the metaphysical ideas weren't just random, rather they were a clever mix of various religious concepts. I thought that they were great in that the supernatural truly wasn't the focus, rather they simply served to enhance the story and the human qualities of the characters of Kara no Kyoukai. I honestly liked this as it serves to show that Nasu didn't just cough random BS for Kara no Kyoukai as most people assume in his other works. To quote myself: Also disagree with people thinking that this is all gibberish, the title of Kara no Kyoukai gets explained in full detail, and it all fits within the nature of the series. Not to mention some of the stuff they talk about are actually reminiscent of Hinduism/Buddhism concepts, far from anything random. As well as: It wasn't just random pretentious ideas about what many have come to know as the "Nasuverse", anyone with any decent knowledge of the world should be able to recognize that it borrows ideas from various religious concepts as a way to highlight certain aspects of the characters and the story in a more meaningful way. If anything, this Epilogue shows the bare ideas in which the Nasuverse built its universe around on and why it's not simply just there to be quirky. |
ronriSep 28, 2012 9:06 PM
| That's fair. I'll definitely be rewatching KNK sometime in the future to sort out what are misunderstandings and miscomprehensions on my part and what are legitimate criticisms. (You should definitely make a thread for your subs in each of the film's sub-forums when you're done, otherwise I probably won't remember.) One thing I'll say in favor of KNK is that the order of the films is optimal; you couldn't change a single one's placement. And that means a lot to me -- nonlinear stories that have a jumbled order or, even worse, didn't need to be presented in a nonlinear order in the first place are a pet peeve of mine. That's evidence that Nasu himself had a grasp on the themes he wanted to present and that shows through to the audience. |
Hakuromatsu said: One thing I'll say in favor of KNK is that the order of the films is optimal; you couldn't change a single one's placement. And that means a lot to me -- nonlinear stories that have a jumbled order or, even worse, didn't need to be presented in a nonlinear order in the first place are a pet peeve of mine. That's evidence that Nasu himself had a grasp on the themes he wanted to present and that shows through to the audience. Definitely agree with this. Having analyzed the series myself, it simply doesn't work as well if it were done in proper chronological order. An example was the introduction of the concept of the supernatural. The way the series introduces it allows the audience to already assume the presence of the supernatural within the series. Had the series started with the second movie instantly (as many people have mistakenly suggested), it would've created a huge leap in the narrative from being a thriller-romance to suddenly a story that involves the supernatural and paranormal investigations. That's just one simple example that shows the level of thought put into the nonlinear narrative. Thanks for the suggestion! While I'm not sure if promotion of fansubs are allowed in these forums, I'll ask around and see if it'd be possible. If not, I wouldn't even mind just sending you a message about it once I finish the subs. |
| I agree that the order in which these movies were released add to the overall enjoyment of them. I cringe when I hear people say they watched them in chronological order the first time because they didn't want to be confused... You're just missing out on so much hidden and subliminal production value by doing that. |
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xpalzin said: ok there is one small thing i actually would love to finalise with this OVA when they say they will see each other tommorrow. do they actually stay together afterward. probably a silly things to ask, but i would love to know please Haha yes. Mikiya and Shiki are still gonna be together. ^_^ It just so happens, the conversation he has in this OVA with Shiki's 3rd manifested personality (aka the Origin), is quite a rarity of its own. |
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