Kowabon Episode 1 Discussion

Protaku94 said:
For what it was worth, I kind of liked it. It's no Yami Shibai, but already better than Yami Shibai S2 at least.

Lockensocke said:


You can say what you want, in animation quality it beats every japanese studio.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Snow_White_and_the_Seven_Dwarfs_%281937_film%29
Under animation, 4th paragraph it says: quote "None of Babbit's animation of the Queen was rotoscoped despite Graham and Natwick's objections, however, some scenes of Snow White and the Prince were directly traced from the live-action footage"
so it was partially rotoscoped(for example the famous scene where she is at the fountain). I wont make a statement on the other movies, since I havent seen them.

2weeaboo4u said:

People only think so because they think that fluidity is the only thing that matters in animation, because they aren't aware Disney made extensive use of rotoscoping (and even recycled it), because they don't understand anything about animation in general, and because they think there only exists a single style of animation (Disney's) that is definitely better than everything else.

Lockensocke said:
Credibility of motion is the core essence of what animation is suppost to be. So yeah, fluidity is the most important thing when you objectivly speak about animation, everything else is just subjectivly. But enlighenme what you think is important in animation.

And what exactly is bad about "extensive use of rotoscoping"? Using live action movment is logically the best way to echo realistic motions.

Lockensocke said:


You can say what you want, in animation quality it beats every japanese studio.

2weeaboo4u said:

This is an example of good animation. The character's outfit consists of six independently moving parts (skirt, shirt, collar, necktie, bag, bag accessory) that respond appropriately to her movements and deform realistically. Her uniform is detailed with decorative stripes rather than being all solid colors (and it's not just painted onto her skin, it's a separate object). Her hair is very detailed and realistically animated. Her expression is detailed and keeps changing. The lighting and shading—determined by light sources in the scene—is detailed and brings out the shape of her clothes. The camera work is varied and very three-dimensional.

This fight scene is another example. It has all the same thing as the first exampl but with extremely complex character movement and camera work. This opening animation has outstanding three-dimensional shots of vehicles and characters. Note the very high level of detail in both of them even during the most complicated shots.

Credibility of motion doesn't require animating on ones, it requires good animation. Animating on twos or threes is enough.


Rotoscoping isn't real animation and there's nothing interesting or really impressive about it. Realistic motion is impressive when it's done by hand, from the animator's imagination or from reference footage (which I don't think is used very often in anime).

ichii_1 said:


Go watch REDLINE then come back.

Lockensocke said:
First of all, do you apply that the picture consists out of 6 separate parts? Because it doesn’t, this isn’t flash animation, this is one picture drawn multiple times.

Her running around the corner had crappy cgi backgrounds which moves in a different speed than her and the whole scene doesn’t look realistically because a person doesn’t move with the same constant speed, after the feet hit the ground you become shortly slower, because of friction and then you accelerate. They faked it on her because she bounces, but you can see that on the background, that’s why the whole scene looks fake. Also the angle in which she runs around the corner looks slightly fake.

Also what happened to the guy with the green shirt, he suddenly is torn out of the picture.

Then we come to lightning. This is the worst part. Despite having multiple light sources (cars, stars, light reflection on the surface of the water, street lights, etc.) she has hard edged shadows on her even though only slight edge shadows should appear. And her shadows only consist of 3 different colors (ok, many works only have 3 layers). Also you see that she does not project any shadow on the ground and the shadows projected for example from the pillar changes the direction from second 2 to second 5.

If you want to post me good animation at least post me something like this: https://youtu.be/8fYR2huWNHY?t=28m50s where you have highly detailed lightning while moving the angle of the frame.

Then you take into consideration that her outfight is not that detailed compared to other works (compared to sword of the stranger for example)
Just look at this picture and tell me which one is more detailed, and btw the right one moves more realistically.
https://gyazo.com/d355c0d9105f17beeff836164e663700

Another good example would be:
https://youtu.be/8fYR2huWNHY?t=27m57s
-highly detailed outfight with highly detailed lighting on it

Yeah Sword of the Stranger is a greatly animated movie, but many anime movies are at the level of Disney (many Ghibli movies, Akira, Redline, Spriggan, Ghost in the Shell or like you posted, Jin Roh). But you don’t have the quantity of these high quality works like Disney has.

Not to mention that Disney revolutionized animated movies.

Well ofc Disney only makes Cgi movies now and Disneys cgi is pretty inferior to works from Pixars or Dreamworks but at least a whole lot better than anime cgi.

And the third one you posted me was a troll, right?

And if Rotoscoping is unimpressive for you or not is unimportant, what matters is the quality of the animation on the finished product

2weeaboo4u said:

Not only do you not know anything about animation, but you don't even appreciate it as an artform.

Lockensocke said:
Ok now I see you are trolling me. Have a nice day!

Vindstot said:
That was more comical than scary. Well, hopefully the next ones would be better. ILCA probably should've focused on making Yami Shibai 3 instead.

Vindstot said:
That was more comical than scary. Well, hopefully the next ones would be better. ILCA probably should've focused on making Yami Shibai 3 instead.

NostalgiaDrive94 said:
Though, I don't know where did you find the comedy...

Horrid said:


It's on their website http://www.kbc.co.jp/kowabon/story/detail.html?id=2
and there's a raw up on nyaa torrents

BlueEyedUchiha said:


http://kissanime.com/Anime/Kowabon/Episode-001?id=117736

ReaperCreeper said:
Pretty happy go lucky ED there.

raveninthemuddle said:

Of course I'm talking about the rate of key frame per second, what else it can be? What kind of anime fan I am who don't know the different between frame rate of a video and the key frame of animation?