New
Mar 17, 3:10 PM
#1
Since I see so many ppl struggling to understand the show here's a ""short"" version with some details to explain that the whole 23 first episodes were just a fiction from Albert's life and no time travel or alternate universe or doppelgänger stuff out of nowhere. We spent 23 episodes watching characters risking their lives and trying to publish a book about heliocentrism but the twist is, We were watching Chi. Chikyuu no Undou ni Tsuite with Rafal, Oczy, etc., in Chi. Chikyuu no Undou ni Tsuite, written by Albert, in Chi. Chikyuu no Undou ni Tsuite, the manga adapted into an anime. About the letter as @headless_nick said : "Here comes author's original intention to tell a "strange lie". It is a personality trait in albert brudzewski which made him a fictionalist in real life. A make-believe story from a random event that happened because of hearing a very random conversation between two stranger. It stayed in his mind and later converted into a story. Uoto San, the mangaka blurs reality and fictions and believes one influences another to materialize. Its a chicken or egg first situation." Just like Makoto Yukimura created Vinland Saga with partial information about Thorfinn, Albert created Orb with the partial information he had about the people he met, his surroundings, and his life. At the end when hearing the book's name, he stops and think, "The Heavens are moving, not the Earth...but wait, what's the story behind this mysterious letter and book" into the black screen with text saying that the real Albert was skeptical of the geocentric system and all. Bonus: Their's so much details in every chapters and episodes but for example, adult Rafal is just the real Rafal that inspired Rafal and Nowak depicted in Albert's book. That's why those 2 characters are tightly connected during the show even tho they only spent only 10-20min together. |
Le_Chat_Du_FuturApr 11, 5:33 AM
Mar 17, 3:38 PM
#2
woah! now i appreciate the ending even more. this show's amazing |
Mar 17, 4:37 PM
#3
Ailil said: woah! now i appreciate the ending even more. this show's amazing I totally agree. It makes way more sense about the similarities of the characters' looks, and why we follow different stories And wouldn't surprise me if Albert would depict himself as Oczy (his shier self, not so sure close to Rafal (Badeni)) or Doulaka (his more courageous self, after applying to academy), the latter waiting to gain lots of money with the book... something Albert hears in the last scene when a neighbor got the letter by mistake. Wouldn't suprise me if he depicted Rafal as Badeni either, lol... Albert Brudzewski really existed though. He was one of the first astronomers saying the Moon shows the same face. And it's an even greater work, because heliocentrism was also denied. Man do I love astronomy, such an amazing show such a plot I've never seen before. Opening on repeat too not gonna lie. |
Mar 17, 4:46 PM
#4
Hmm? What book did Albert write again? |
Mar 17, 4:48 PM
#5
Mar 17, 5:00 PM
#7
thank you for the clarification because i was so lost that raffal was very clearly an adult because he was so fkin tall in every scene, after somehow escaping prison making everyone think he was dead off screen (we see him on the cross towards the end so my initial thinking of events is wrong xd) he just shows up kills a man and goes to prison, this felt so random and underwhelming for a character who had such meaning, but with this being the first real time the character shows up it make sense. the 3rd one seems like its wrong, like it would make sense if the sun was rising as he found his father dead, but there wasnt any of that. its probably would be schmit especially since lev (who was the priest, which was confirmed by him talking about simons death)was talking about the natural world and how miracoulous it was that the would existed, and if you go to the scene of him stepping out of the carriage its literally him taking a deep breath and having his arms wide for the world, draka got it from him, so they do they same thing but the parallel with the murder of their father and the sun rise isnt there. this"it was all a dream" sht actually ruined the anime for me like yea, its really clever how its connected. but like you gain such a bond with the characters because theyre so goated and the goal that theyre so desperately trying to show to the world. then this ending comes out and just spits in ur face... lul just a dream fiction being fiction as an ending just tilts me personally, it would be different if there was some doubt hidden throughtout the show or something that made the ending actually make sense of being the ending rather than it feeling like a rushed last resort the author made as an ending |
Ayon_LaruneMar 17, 5:11 PM
Mar 17, 5:15 PM
#8
The_Spectre_01 said: Hmm? What book did Albert write again? the book about the stories of the characters from the anime you watched |
Mar 17, 5:19 PM
#9
Reply to Ayon_Larune
thank you for the clarification because i was so lost that raffal was very clearly an adult because he was so fkin tall in every scene, after somehow escaping prison making everyone think he was dead off screen (we see him on the cross towards the end so my initial thinking of events is wrong xd) he just shows up kills a man and goes to prison, this felt so random and underwhelming for a character who had such meaning, but with this being the first real time the character shows up it make sense.
the 3rd one seems like its wrong, like it would make sense if the sun was rising as he found his father dead, but there wasnt any of that.
its probably would be schmit especially since lev (who was the priest, which was confirmed by him talking about simons death)was talking about the natural world and how miracoulous it was that the would existed, and if you go to the scene of him stepping out of the carriage its literally him taking a deep breath and having his arms wide for the world, draka got it from him, so they do they same thing but the parallel with the murder of their father and the sun rise isnt there.
this"it was all a dream" sht actually ruined the anime for me
like yea, its really clever how its connected.
but like you gain such a bond with the characters because theyre so goated and the goal that theyre so desperately trying to show to the world.
then this ending comes out and just spits in ur face... lul just a dream
fiction being fiction as an ending just tilts me personally, it would be different if there was some doubt hidden throughtout the show or something that made the ending actually make sense of being the ending rather than it feeling like a rushed last resort the author made as an ending
the 3rd one seems like its wrong, like it would make sense if the sun was rising as he found his father dead, but there wasnt any of that.
its probably would be schmit especially since lev (who was the priest, which was confirmed by him talking about simons death)was talking about the natural world and how miracoulous it was that the would existed, and if you go to the scene of him stepping out of the carriage its literally him taking a deep breath and having his arms wide for the world, draka got it from him, so they do they same thing but the parallel with the murder of their father and the sun rise isnt there.
this"it was all a dream" sht actually ruined the anime for me
like yea, its really clever how its connected.
but like you gain such a bond with the characters because theyre so goated and the goal that theyre so desperately trying to show to the world.
then this ending comes out and just spits in ur face... lul just a dream
fiction being fiction as an ending just tilts me personally, it would be different if there was some doubt hidden throughtout the show or something that made the ending actually make sense of being the ending rather than it feeling like a rushed last resort the author made as an ending
@Ayon_Larune It's not a dream, it's a series of what-ifs. Answering the priest's questions Albert came up with a story. Just like in our real life, many discoveries have happened before they were actually dated to be discovered. This series ponders upon this what-if scenario, of people who discovered and were killed for the truth, only small message remaining inspired someone else to write a story about it. At least I would not call this a dream, it's more like a story within a story. Clever writing. |
Mar 17, 5:22 PM
#10
Ayon_Larune said: thank you for the clarification because i was so lost that raffal was very clearly an adult because he was so fkin tall in every scene, after somehow escaping prison making everyone think he was dead off screen (we see him on the cross towards the end so my initial thinking of events is wrong xd) he just shows up kills a man and goes to prison, this felt so random and underwhelming for a character who had such meaning, but with this being the first real time the character shows up it make sense. the 3rd one seems like its wrong, like it would make sense if the sun was rising as he found his father dead, but there wasnt any of that. its probably would be schmit especially since lev (who was the priest, which was confirmed by him talking about simons death)was talking about the natural world and how miracoulous it was that the would existed, and if you go to the scene of him stepping out of the carriage its literally him taking a deep breath and having his arms wide for the world, draka got it from him, so they do they same thing but the parallel with the murder of their father and the sun rise isnt there. this"it was all a dream" sht actually ruined the anime for me like yea, its really clever how its connected. but like you gain such a bond with the characters because theyre so goated and the goal that theyre so desperately trying to show to the world. then this ending comes out and just spits in ur face... lul just a dream fiction being fiction as an ending just tilts me personally, it would be different if there was some doubt hidden throughtout the show or something that made the ending actually make sense of being the ending rather than it feeling like a rushed last resort the author made as an ending I mean it still is not very much fiction as Inquisition existed and tortured people. I think Albert's book is more about the fear of the Church and being burnt alive for trying to understand the world around him. It's fiction of actual historical events made in a fiction and that's what it makes it amazing: those events happened so it's not really fiction. It's romanticized of course but that's something else |
Mar 17, 5:53 PM
#11
Truly appreciate your compilation ! Somehow i am so much absorbed with the beautiful idea of a letter triggering a revolution that the veil between reality and fiction did not actually mattered most. It felt like a magic realism book ending to me ! Did not even think about solving it until much much later. Have been marveling in the ending ever since the episode ended . The epilogue became the prologue . Poetic full circle ! The intricate connection , weaving of the themes , connected illusion , all in all a strange lie ! What a great piece of literature it is ! Deeper layers of Chi episodes through in-depth discussions and reviews https://www.youtube.com/@SriMoriReaction |
Mar 17, 6:02 PM
#12
(just for character limit sake)![]() |
Mar 17, 6:08 PM
#13
Reply to ricardopetrere
(just for character limit sake)


@ricardopetrere (just for character limit sake) |
Mar 17, 6:11 PM
#14
this does seem like a nice explanation, but how did the letter reach that person first? who sent it then? |
Mar 17, 8:41 PM
#15
My biggest issue with this theory is who created the original letter and book then? If everything before is fiction then that plot point comes off as a random contrivance rather than the culmination of all of our characters' efforts And while it is possible, I don't think that the parallels in the story necessarily mean that they have to be a fictionalized and self-referential account |
Mar 17, 9:03 PM
#16
If everything was fiction then what about the letter shown in episode 25? |
Mar 17, 10:35 PM
#17
Reply to NegativeRei
If everything was fiction then what about the letter shown in episode 25?
@NegativeRei Here comes author's original intention to tell a "strange lie". It is a personality trait in albert brudzewski which made him a fictionalist in real life. A make-believe story from a random event that happened because of hearing a very random conversation between two stranger. It stayed in his mind and later converted into a story. I highly recommend Umberto Eco's Foucault's Pendulum. Uoto San, the mangaka blurs reality and fictions and believes one influences another to materialize. Its a chicken or egg first situation. Tenet also reflects something similar in story telling. Not everything is 100 percent rationalized. Deeper layers of Chi episodes through in-depth discussions and reviews https://www.youtube.com/@SriMoriReaction |
Mar 17, 11:23 PM
#18
OH MY GOD, THANK YOU SO MUCH FOR THIS ANALYSIS! Now it's so much clearer! Thank you so much! 💗 |
Mar 18, 1:05 AM
#19
explanation was good. in the show the explanation was wack honestly. there shouldn't be so much confusion at the end of a show like that. so much was left to interpretation unintentionally, so it's no surprise people are kind of pissed off. I'm not one that's pissed at the ending, I just wished they gave it more time, more episodes rather than 2. it felt rushed and generally confusing for most people which isn't good. Good ending though once you actually get your head around it and understand the actual meaning behind what was real, what wasn't and what actually happened in the story |
Mar 18, 1:52 AM
#20
Great explanation. This really makes me appreciate the ending |
Mar 18, 1:56 AM
#21
@psychedelicious I saw Draka as a manifestation of Albert's "doing what is necessary to get by"/loss of faith. Eventually, she finds the drive to throw herself recklessly behind an idea that may not pay out & doesn't have a safety net, may even ruin her, and in the process she finds fulfillment. For him, he takes the risk & pursues his curiosity, goes on to university, finds purpose & finds meaning in his faith again. All of the characters in the series are highly romanticised, but I do think Draka is more than him at his most courageous; In fact, I think most of her character is him at his emptiest(while Oczy might be him at his least courageous, as well as his most inspired, by comparison*). *I actually thought Badeni & Oczy were two sides of Albert's father. Oczy craved knowledge & was enamored with the written word once the opportunity came to him, but he was crippled by his own faith, his doubt, & his existential fears. Albert's father DID believe in sharing knowledge, to a point, even with the common folk, & this could be seen though Oczy, even through the exchanges between Oczy & Badeni as a sort of presumed inner conflict his father may have struggled with. (This isn't to say I don't think Albert projected any of himself onto Oczy. He absolutely did. Daddy issues a** type of guy, through & through.) |
cranky because your taste sucks, aren't you? |
Mar 18, 2:04 AM
#22
Reply to headless_nick
@NegativeRei
Here comes author's original intention to tell a "strange lie". It is a personality trait in albert brudzewski which made him a fictionalist in real life. A make-believe story from a random event that happened because of hearing a very random conversation between two stranger. It stayed in his mind and later converted into a story. I highly recommend Umberto Eco's Foucault's Pendulum. Uoto San, the mangaka blurs reality and fictions and believes one influences another to materialize. Its a chicken or egg first situation. Tenet also reflects something similar in story telling. Not everything is 100 percent rationalized.
Deeper layers of Chi episodes through in-depth discussions and reviews
https://www.youtube.com/@SriMoriReaction
Here comes author's original intention to tell a "strange lie". It is a personality trait in albert brudzewski which made him a fictionalist in real life. A make-believe story from a random event that happened because of hearing a very random conversation between two stranger. It stayed in his mind and later converted into a story. I highly recommend Umberto Eco's Foucault's Pendulum. Uoto San, the mangaka blurs reality and fictions and believes one influences another to materialize. Its a chicken or egg first situation. Tenet also reflects something similar in story telling. Not everything is 100 percent rationalized.
Deeper layers of Chi episodes through in-depth discussions and reviews
https://www.youtube.com/@SriMoriReaction
@headless_nick That's a clever way to explain it thank you (I edited the original post with your comment and quoted you on this) |
Mar 18, 2:29 AM
#23
Interesting, thanks for clarifying. |
No, this isn't my signature. |
Mar 18, 3:12 AM
#24
I tought something like this after ep 24, but then saw that Albert was a real person and he was not a novelist. If the author wanted the first chpters/episodes to be part of a fictional story, wouldn't it make more sense the character from the real world to be a novelist? |
Mar 18, 4:47 AM
#25
I do not believe Albert actually wrote the story with Rafal, Oczy etc. I think it could have just been something he pondered on, but never put pen to paper. What we saw could have been his speculation on what a book with the name "Orb: On the movements of the Earth" could have been about. Nevertheless, exceptional explanation from the creator of this thread! |
Mar 18, 5:04 AM
#26
Thanks for this explanation it's so necessary for me LOL But I still don't really understand why in the last episode, there already was a letter sent to Potocki with the title of the book ... was that just something completely unrelated then? @.@ |
Mar 18, 5:24 AM
#27
This would be great if literally any of it was communicated clearly in the anime, and it wrapped up with a satisfying conclusion, but... it's not. |
If you reply back to me and I never respond, I lost interest and don't care. Sorry about that. |
Mar 18, 5:32 AM
#28
Reply to Lunipu
Thanks for this explanation it's so necessary for me LOL
But I still don't really understand why in the last episode, there already was a letter sent to Potocki with the title of the book ... was that just something completely unrelated then? @.@
But I still don't really understand why in the last episode, there already was a letter sent to Potocki with the title of the book ... was that just something completely unrelated then? @.@
@Lunipu @Dami-Echertal I think the letter served as an inspiration for Albert to start writing the story. I think it was explained, no? So basically it becomes a full circle.. Albert hears a about a letter -> Writes a story about it, in the story it explains how the letter came to be until it reaches him-> Albert hears about a letter -> ... Like in the end you don't know who those people were who initiated it all, might have been some other people but might have been the exact characters themselves.. open for interpretation. Very philosophical, I know. Ah yes, it's basically same as OP said: Le_Chat_Du_Futur said: Its a chicken or egg first situation |
LylaazMar 18, 5:39 AM
Mar 18, 5:36 AM
#29
thank you! now i appreciate the ending more. |
Mar 18, 5:55 AM
#30
Yeah, this just doesn't work. There's a far simpler explanation. The first 23 episodes aren't "fiction" in-universe, they're fiction in ours, and if the story is supposed to end at the advent of our reality at that time in history, then the obvious "lie" is trying to make the viewer believe it could be the same timeline, even if it's canonically true, it's the same basic principle with time travel in fiction. The similarities between Albert's life and our main cast can be chalked up to good writing, and "adult" Rafal can be viewed symbolically, just as he was used at the end of Nowak's life. I can only go off the show I watched, but unless the manga makes this connection clear, I see no reason to believe it over what is plainly told, instead. |
If you reply back to me and I never respond, I lost interest and don't care. Sorry about that. |
Mar 18, 6:05 AM
#31
Reply to Lylaaz
@Lunipu @Dami-Echertal I think the letter served as an inspiration for Albert to start writing the story. I think it was explained, no?
So basically it becomes a full circle..
Albert hears a about a letter -> Writes a story about it, in the story it explains how the letter came to be until it reaches him-> Albert hears about a letter -> ...
Like in the end you don't know who those people were who initiated it all, might have been some other people but might have been the exact characters themselves.. open for interpretation. Very philosophical, I know.
Ah yes, it's basically same as OP said:
So basically it becomes a full circle..
Albert hears a about a letter -> Writes a story about it, in the story it explains how the letter came to be until it reaches him-> Albert hears about a letter -> ...
Like in the end you don't know who those people were who initiated it all, might have been some other people but might have been the exact characters themselves.. open for interpretation. Very philosophical, I know.
Ah yes, it's basically same as OP said:
Le_Chat_Du_Futur said:
Its a chicken or egg first situation
Its a chicken or egg first situation
@Lylaaz Huh? How are you just ignoring that the letter was delivered to Potocki, and only found its way there by the blood and sacrifice of our main cast of characters? This series would be so much worse if it was a barely (if at all) alluded to fictional story rather than an overambitious attempt to mold together two distinctly different realities, the "fictional" one and the one that closely matches our own. Even if naturally uneven, that's a much better story of passing the torch onto a generation that was afforded the opportunities to challenge previously held beliefs, even if they were controversial with religious interpretations of the time. |
If you reply back to me and I never respond, I lost interest and don't care. Sorry about that. |
Mar 18, 12:11 PM
#32
Reply to Ayon_Larune
thank you for the clarification because i was so lost that raffal was very clearly an adult because he was so fkin tall in every scene, after somehow escaping prison making everyone think he was dead off screen (we see him on the cross towards the end so my initial thinking of events is wrong xd) he just shows up kills a man and goes to prison, this felt so random and underwhelming for a character who had such meaning, but with this being the first real time the character shows up it make sense.
the 3rd one seems like its wrong, like it would make sense if the sun was rising as he found his father dead, but there wasnt any of that.
its probably would be schmit especially since lev (who was the priest, which was confirmed by him talking about simons death)was talking about the natural world and how miracoulous it was that the would existed, and if you go to the scene of him stepping out of the carriage its literally him taking a deep breath and having his arms wide for the world, draka got it from him, so they do they same thing but the parallel with the murder of their father and the sun rise isnt there.
this"it was all a dream" sht actually ruined the anime for me
like yea, its really clever how its connected.
but like you gain such a bond with the characters because theyre so goated and the goal that theyre so desperately trying to show to the world.
then this ending comes out and just spits in ur face... lul just a dream
fiction being fiction as an ending just tilts me personally, it would be different if there was some doubt hidden throughtout the show or something that made the ending actually make sense of being the ending rather than it feeling like a rushed last resort the author made as an ending
the 3rd one seems like its wrong, like it would make sense if the sun was rising as he found his father dead, but there wasnt any of that.
its probably would be schmit especially since lev (who was the priest, which was confirmed by him talking about simons death)was talking about the natural world and how miracoulous it was that the would existed, and if you go to the scene of him stepping out of the carriage its literally him taking a deep breath and having his arms wide for the world, draka got it from him, so they do they same thing but the parallel with the murder of their father and the sun rise isnt there.
this"it was all a dream" sht actually ruined the anime for me
like yea, its really clever how its connected.
but like you gain such a bond with the characters because theyre so goated and the goal that theyre so desperately trying to show to the world.
then this ending comes out and just spits in ur face... lul just a dream
fiction being fiction as an ending just tilts me personally, it would be different if there was some doubt hidden throughtout the show or something that made the ending actually make sense of being the ending rather than it feeling like a rushed last resort the author made as an ending
@Ayon_Larune Thank you. I feel the same. I had high hopes for the ending, but for me, it was a disappointment. |
Mar 18, 12:44 PM
#33
Love the theory. At first I was very dissapointed with the ending, but now I think it's cool that we can make our own connections trying to find what's true and what's fictional. Just like Albert's father said "you must doubt". Although imo they could've made a clearer ending with the same idea. |
Mar 18, 2:26 PM
#34
cool theory. but kind of a stretch. i think explanation of: kingdom of P is what is lost in history of humanity (remember, that antoni even ordered to burn all the records, so humanity knows nothing about badeni etc.), and kingdom of Poland is what is known, e.g. Albert is a real character and we know him from history. also the priest was in the show, the friend of the one who saved the girl and watched him burned. its same VA and story matches. if we imagine now that is a fiction, he would have highlighted the priest more, because clearly that was him, same va etc. so its a much simpler explanation, the only weak part is Rafal. although i like this book theory, but too much speculation also, how would Albert Brudzewski write a book about heliocentrism, including Badeni's theory of elliptic orbit, when even Copernicus didnt think of that? that would be a plot hole |
nagasawa__Mar 18, 2:29 PM
Mar 18, 2:45 PM
#35
Reply to CrJook
Love the theory. At first I was very dissapointed with the ending, but now I think it's cool that we can make our own connections trying to find what's true and what's fictional. Just like Albert's father said "you must doubt". Although imo they could've made a clearer ending with the same idea.
@CrJook Making it clearer in the end might not have rewarded the "curiosity" of searching all the hidden details Uoto and the staff deliberately put into the anime/manga, I think. |
Mar 18, 5:12 PM
#36
Reply to Le_Chat_Du_Futur
@headless_nick That's a clever way to explain it thank you (I edited the original post with your comment and quoted you on this)
@Le_Chat_Du_Futur ah great ! thanks and appreciate it ! |
Mar 18, 5:27 PM
#37
Reply to CrJook
Love the theory. At first I was very dissapointed with the ending, but now I think it's cool that we can make our own connections trying to find what's true and what's fictional. Just like Albert's father said "you must doubt". Although imo they could've made a clearer ending with the same idea.
@CrJook Isn't it also creative that the mangaka made audience figure out and be part of the "Thaumazein game" with the ending? I like to think Albert actually figured out the Heliocentric theory but his backstory and desire to doubt and believe in others made him write the theory in a fictional format - only to be picked up by his student Copernicus in later years. Maybe he chose fiction over theory cause he believed someone will pick it up in the future and prove it. Maybe this time there will actually exist a book " about the movement of earth " if he did not take an extreme path and let it publish. Anyway all of this is also guesswork. Best part is our reality is shaped by what we think. Not by truth. For example- Suppose In the potochki letter , the title of the book could have been " on the pavement of earth" - and albert mistakenly heard movement instead of pavement, the result would have been the same. He would have gone to explore this research and eventually written the book. So what we believe shapes our reality. So i really like this part- " you must doubt" . Maybe thats what alberts answer is on " what to offer to obtain the truth ?" - its the sacrifice of ego or ability to doubt. After all - cogito ergo sum, dubito ergo sum . I think therefore I exist, I doubt therefore I exist. Deeper layers of Chi episodes through in-depth discussions and reviews https://www.youtube.com/@SriMoriReaction |
Mar 18, 6:34 PM
#38
NegativeRei said: If everything was fiction then what about the letter shown in episode 25? you mean wrongly given by the postman? that's literally the inspiration for Albert to write a book, with the confession he had in the Church. the letter says "The Movements of the Earth". He gives his book the same name. And the show you watched is the animation of Albert's book. |
Mar 18, 8:43 PM
#39
I think I've circled back around to the "alternate timeline" theory, but more so in a logical sense, than a canonical one. The "lie" the author refers to is bridging the gap between this fictional draconian tragedy, with the real history of Albert, and later his student, Copernicus. What is interesting is that the author intentionally points out the differences between the "Kingdom of P" and the "Kingdom of Poland" and even Rafal's group of freethinkers is simply too brazen to exist out in the open in the story we knew, but not in Albert's time. Everything comes full circle in Potocki's letter, canonically this is proof of the lost history of our entire cast, they did exist, struggled, and died, and yet this letter still found its way to Albert's ear, and sparks the inspiration and foundation of Heliocentric theory. In reality, it's more obvious that this is just a lovely sentiment, a passing of the torch for our cast of fallen heroes. I agree with another poster who called Draka's death the "true" ending, and everything with Albert is closer to an epilogue, and can be likened to that of fanfiction. The whole "book" theory is wildly unnecessary, the series doesn't need to be wrapped up in a bow, and it would greatly undermine our characters. |
LostSpectreMar 18, 8:51 PM
If you reply back to me and I never respond, I lost interest and don't care. Sorry about that. |
Mar 19, 6:39 AM
#40
Reply to headless_nick
@CrJook Isn't it also creative that the mangaka made audience figure out and be part of the "Thaumazein game" with the ending?
I like to think Albert actually figured out the Heliocentric theory but his backstory and desire to doubt and believe in others made him write the theory in a fictional format - only to be picked up by his student Copernicus in later years. Maybe he chose fiction over theory cause he believed someone will pick it up in the future and prove it. Maybe this time there will actually exist a book " about the movement of earth " if he did not take an extreme path and let it publish. Anyway all of this is also guesswork. Best part is our reality is shaped by what we think. Not by truth. For example-
Suppose In the potochki letter , the title of the book could have been " on the pavement of earth" - and albert mistakenly heard movement instead of pavement, the result would have been the same. He would have gone to explore this research and eventually written the book. So what we believe shapes our reality. So i really like this part- " you must doubt" . Maybe thats what alberts answer is on " what to offer to obtain the truth ?" - its the sacrifice of ego or ability to doubt. After all - cogito ergo sum, dubito ergo sum . I think therefore I exist, I doubt therefore I exist.
Deeper layers of Chi episodes through in-depth discussions and reviews
https://www.youtube.com/@SriMoriReaction
I like to think Albert actually figured out the Heliocentric theory but his backstory and desire to doubt and believe in others made him write the theory in a fictional format - only to be picked up by his student Copernicus in later years. Maybe he chose fiction over theory cause he believed someone will pick it up in the future and prove it. Maybe this time there will actually exist a book " about the movement of earth " if he did not take an extreme path and let it publish. Anyway all of this is also guesswork. Best part is our reality is shaped by what we think. Not by truth. For example-
Suppose In the potochki letter , the title of the book could have been " on the pavement of earth" - and albert mistakenly heard movement instead of pavement, the result would have been the same. He would have gone to explore this research and eventually written the book. So what we believe shapes our reality. So i really like this part- " you must doubt" . Maybe thats what alberts answer is on " what to offer to obtain the truth ?" - its the sacrifice of ego or ability to doubt. After all - cogito ergo sum, dubito ergo sum . I think therefore I exist, I doubt therefore I exist.
Deeper layers of Chi episodes through in-depth discussions and reviews
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@headless_nick I rewatched some part of the manga/anime and edited the post but yeah, Albert has been exposed to Ibn al-Shâtir (one of the first to propose a heliocentric model) and uniform movement theory. Based on how smart Albert is and the concrete elements in the show, he might actually figured out the Heliocentric theory. |
Mar 19, 7:05 AM
#41
I think is same world for part 1 and 2. Some characters in "Kingdom of P" said that they will not be remembered in history and that's what happened, nothing and nobody survived to save story about characters from part 1, that why they all are part of "Kingdom o P" The book has not been published, Draka sended only letter to Potocki to let him known about possible book and money but letter didn't reach him, but some random guy who doesn't know him and is seems that he don't want to get involved. Albert Brudzewski is only main character who went down in history and that's why he is part of "Kingdom of Poland", not "Kingdom of P" which is not based on real life. Mangaka mixed real life story with fiction, show us Albert heard about book "O ruchach Ziemi" what could inspire him and later Mikołaj Kopernik, of course in this story. |
LittleStarMar 21, 3:21 AM
Mar 19, 7:43 AM
#42
Reply to LittleStar
I think is same world for part 1 and 2.
Some characters in "Kingdom of P" said that they will not be remembered in history and that's what happened, nothing and nobody survived to save story about characters from part 1, that why they all are part of "Kingdom o P"
The book has not been published, Draka sended only letter to Potocki to let him known about possible book and money but letter didn't reach him, but some random guy who doesn't know him and is seems that he don't want to get involved.
Albert Brudzewski is only main character who went down in history and that's why he is part of "Kingdom of Poland", not "Kingdom of P" which is not based on real life.
Mangaka mixed real life story with fiction, show us Albert heard about book "O ruchach Ziemi" what could inspire him and later Mikołaj Kopernik, of course in this story.
Some characters in "Kingdom of P" said that they will not be remembered in history and that's what happened, nothing and nobody survived to save story about characters from part 1, that why they all are part of "Kingdom o P"
The book has not been published, Draka sended only letter to Potocki to let him known about possible book and money but letter didn't reach him, but some random guy who doesn't know him and is seems that he don't want to get involved.
Albert Brudzewski is only main character who went down in history and that's why he is part of "Kingdom of Poland", not "Kingdom of P" which is not based on real life.
Mangaka mixed real life story with fiction, show us Albert heard about book "O ruchach Ziemi" what could inspire him and later Mikołaj Kopernik, of course in this story.
@LittleStar Kingdom of P is based on real life, Badeni and Piast for example are real life/real world Polish dynasties The whole Kigndom of P use real world inspiration in names, story or places and yet it's not the real world, but more likely a fiction or more specifically, a book. |
Mar 19, 8:01 AM
#43
@Le_Chat_Du_Futur, yes "Kingdom of P" is Poland, Rafał, Nowak, Jolanta, Piast, Badeni, Potocki... and polish words, proof is "Poland" but first part is fiction, thats why "Kingdom of P", but when story move to more real life based story is changed to "Kingdom of Poland" and we get character based on real life Albert Brudzewski. In this series author mix fiction with reality. |
LittleStarMar 19, 8:14 AM
Mar 19, 12:37 PM
#44
So OP thinks that these aren't parallel realities, but rather that the first 23 episodes just never happened? Does that change much? It seems that the only thing that changes is that the multiverse tag can be removed to avoid scaring people. On the other hand, what's better: that almost the entire story was just a dog's dream and had no meaning, or that almost the entire story took place somewhere in a parallel reality and intersected with this one through a letter from Draka? |
Mar 19, 2:38 PM
#45
Reply to OrigamistToo
So OP thinks that these aren't parallel realities, but rather that the first 23 episodes just never happened? Does that change much? It seems that the only thing that changes is that the multiverse tag can be removed to avoid scaring people. On the other hand, what's better: that almost the entire story was just a dog's dream and had no meaning, or that almost the entire story took place somewhere in a parallel reality and intersected with this one through a letter from Draka?
@OrigamistToo Sorry for you then, I can always suggest you to rewatch the show while keeping in mind that it's a down-to-earth story, with no miracle or deus ex machina out of nowhere. Maybe this will help you out to understand the meaning and messages behind Albert answer from the chapter 1 priest speech and the "it was a book all along" theory. P.S: If you think hard enough about the parallel realities theory, you should've understood that's the theory who neglected the most the show's philosophy, the accomplishment made by our fictional protagonist and the reason behind Albert's story introduction. |
Mar 19, 3:47 PM
#46
Reply to Le_Chat_Du_Futur
@OrigamistToo Sorry for you then, I can always suggest you to rewatch the show while keeping in mind that it's a down-to-earth story, with no miracle or deus ex machina out of nowhere.
Maybe this will help you out to understand the meaning and messages behind Albert answer from the chapter 1 priest speech and the "it was a book all along" theory.
P.S: If you think hard enough about the parallel realities theory, you should've understood that's the theory who neglected the most the show's philosophy, the accomplishment made by our fictional protagonist and the reason behind Albert's story introduction.
Maybe this will help you out to understand the meaning and messages behind Albert answer from the chapter 1 priest speech and the "it was a book all along" theory.
P.S: If you think hard enough about the parallel realities theory, you should've understood that's the theory who neglected the most the show's philosophy, the accomplishment made by our fictional protagonist and the reason behind Albert's story introduction.
@Le_Chat_Du_Futur The theory of parallel realities is supported by that seemingly unnecessary transition from 'P' to Poland and the clear hint from the author in the scene where 'Rafal the Second' was telling little Albert about a distant world from which they are being watched, clearly referencing previous episodes. Whether the author adds Deus Ex Machina to the story or not depends solely on him, and not on your perception of the mundane nature of the story. How does the theory of parallel realities disregard the plot more than the theory of 'It was all a dream'? Is it because the 'book' is something in the language of the intelligent, while the multiverse is for foolish Rick and Morty fans? The fact that you skimmed through the manga and found characters standing in the same poses as characters from previous chapters proves absolutely nothing and simply looks like another manifestation of the 'search for deeper meaning syndrome'. It's funny, of course, that people fall for all this nonsense, but the author of the manga did his vague ending for this very reason. |
Mar 19, 4:42 PM
#47
I really needed this explanation, it let me get some closure. What a great series. |
Mar 19, 4:46 PM
#48
Reply to LostSpectre
@Lylaaz Huh? How are you just ignoring that the letter was delivered to Potocki, and only found its way there by the blood and sacrifice of our main cast of characters? This series would be so much worse if it was a barely (if at all) alluded to fictional story rather than an overambitious attempt to mold together two distinctly different realities, the "fictional" one and the one that closely matches our own. Even if naturally uneven, that's a much better story of passing the torch onto a generation that was afforded the opportunities to challenge previously held beliefs, even if they were controversial with religious interpretations of the time.
@LostSpectre I am not ignoring it though? That's how the letter got there in the first place.. |
Mar 19, 4:52 PM
#49
Your explanation is not really convincing to be honest. |
Mar 19, 6:06 PM
#50
Reply to OrigamistToo
@Le_Chat_Du_Futur The theory of parallel realities is supported by that seemingly unnecessary transition from 'P' to Poland and the clear hint from the author in the scene where 'Rafal the Second' was telling little Albert about a distant world from which they are being watched, clearly referencing previous episodes.
Whether the author adds Deus Ex Machina to the story or not depends solely on him, and not on your perception of the mundane nature of the story.
How does the theory of parallel realities disregard the plot more than the theory of 'It was all a dream'? Is it because the 'book' is something in the language of the intelligent, while the multiverse is for foolish Rick and Morty fans?
The fact that you skimmed through the manga and found characters standing in the same poses as characters from previous chapters proves absolutely nothing and simply looks like another manifestation of the 'search for deeper meaning syndrome'.
It's funny, of course, that people fall for all this nonsense, but the author of the manga did his vague ending for this very reason.
Whether the author adds Deus Ex Machina to the story or not depends solely on him, and not on your perception of the mundane nature of the story.
How does the theory of parallel realities disregard the plot more than the theory of 'It was all a dream'? Is it because the 'book' is something in the language of the intelligent, while the multiverse is for foolish Rick and Morty fans?
The fact that you skimmed through the manga and found characters standing in the same poses as characters from previous chapters proves absolutely nothing and simply looks like another manifestation of the 'search for deeper meaning syndrome'.
It's funny, of course, that people fall for all this nonsense, but the author of the manga did his vague ending for this very reason.
@OrigamistToo "The fact that you skimmed through the manga and found characters standing in the same poses as characters from previous chapters proves absolutely nothing and simply looks like another manifestation of the 'search for deeper meaning syndrome'. " When the author (and the anime) deliberately make parallels between the chapters with same places, same drawing, same poses or same sentences, it's not like chasing a ghost to search for those similarities and drawing conclusion about it, friend. Yet you can always draw your own conclusion, I drew mine based on concrete panel and dialogue within the story and on the author/anime staff's work and interview. The "search for deeper meaning syndrome" is more likely to be the parallel realities theory, I mean : it's easier for you to believe that, "out of nowhere, there's a multiverse now", than "from the beginning it was 1 universe and just a clever trick : a story inside a story", weird when you think about it. The biggest lack of the multiverse theory is, what does it add to the story ? Why introducing even the real world, what's the point ? If the only things that connect the 2 universe and the efforts of our protag is Draka's letters that tranced the multiverse itself. Then what will be the point behind the 2 chapters depicting Albert's life and backstory and new characters, why spent 2 chapters and episodes for that if the only thing that matters is the letter in just 2 panels of the last chapter. Moreover, according to this theory, the sole purpose of that was to bring Thaumazein to Albert and not even bring a concrete conclusion to our protagonist work and the show's philospohy ? Weird. |
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