| From ANN, my best bet would be: From: http://www.animenewsnetwork.com/review/fate/stay-night/unlimited-blade-works/.85648 Review: Unlimited Blade Works is a tricky one to approach, both structurally and due to its place in a broader, creakier canon. The show technically adapts the second of three routes included in the original Fate/stay night visual novel - Fate, Unlimited Blade Works, and Heaven's Feel, all of which occupy separate timelines but all of which also feed into each other knowledge-wise. The Fate route was adapted into a somewhat maligned anime close to ten years back, so you could technically consider UBW a sequel - but if we're talking in terms of sequels, then it's likely more appropriate to consider UBW a sequel to Fate/Zero, which was envisioned as a prequel to the visual novel, but adapted by the same studio who are currently handling Unlimited Blade Works, and which is full of information which enriches the viewer's understanding of UBW. So, yes. Somewhat confusing. Fortunately, the solution here is pretty simple - your best bet is to watch Fate/Zero first, as it maintains style congruity with UBW and enriches the context of the story, but it's also perfectly fine to jump in right here. I am in a fence in watching F/Z as I have already finished the 1st cour of UBW. Is he correct? Thoughts?? |
| F0XFIRE said: OP 4 most butthurt bitch on MAL. |
| I've already fought that battle pls don't re-open the fresh wounds. And no, he is not correct. F/SN is meant to be watched/read first as intended of the author of FSN and F/Zero http://i.imgur.com/BGU5W0W.png Ultimately it's up to you. If you want an unspoiled experience go with UBW. If you don't care, do what you want. |
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| You don't technically need to, but the UBW remake didn't explain the war in depth like F/Z did so I think you'd find it confusing if you didn't watch F/Z. But watch F/Z - it gives you more background on the war and the characters that are in UBW. And plus, F/Z >>> F/SN by a long shot |
| Listen to Nocorras. You'll spoil the hell out of yourself if you watch Zero first. |
| “When you have eliminated the impossible, whatever remains, however improbable must be the truth. - Shinichi Kudo” - Gosho Aoyama The Ayako Mitsuzuri Fan Club Taiga Fuji-nee Club Prince Kashima Club |
monarchyanarchy said: You don't technically need to, but the UBW remake didn't explain the war in depth like F/Z did so I think you'd find it confusing if you didn't watch F/Z. But watch F/Z - it gives you more background on the war and the characters that are in UBW. And plus, F/Z >>> F/SN by a long shot The war doesn't need to be explained in depth (and how is it not explained in FSN). Neither show is primarily about the war. Stop spreading mis-information. And to say FSN doesn't explain the war is ridiculous. It does not give you any meaningful background on characters outside of blatant spoilers that you're not supposed to know as you watch UBW. Fate Zero relies more on FSN knowledge than FSN relies on F/Z knowledge. |
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| You don't need it. |
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monarchyanarchy said: You don't technically need to, but the UBW remake didn't explain the war in depth like F/Z did so I think you'd find it confusing if you didn't watch F/Z. But watch F/Z - it gives you more background on the war and the characters that are in UBW. And plus, F/Z >>> F/SN by a long shot FZ doesn't explain the war in depth, though. Not that the war itself is really that important in the whole story to begin with... |
Stev said: ayy lmao |
| ANN is full of clowns. Okay fine, there are smart people there - but they're so confident of their own ignorance it's infuriating. |
| Signature removed. Please follow the signature rules, as defined in the Site & Forum Guidelines. |
| Revelations of F/Z are some of the most important plot points / twists of F/SN and watching or reading F/Z first completely ruin the premise. You are supposed to know what Shirou knows and F/Z is supposed to just be something you watch just because of curiosity - It's not actually important at all for F/SN as F/SN is designed to be a stand alone. You don't really lose anything of importance by never watching F/Z. Of course, people who did watch it first would have no idea and obviously don't care about what the author intended. The joke's starting to become way too old.I could compare it to a certain incredible book that's got a non-linear structure with revelations from different times all over the story. Not everything's supposed to be experienced in a chronological order, for example that would completely ruin the book in question. |
| "When they're alive, you can enjoy watching them struggle. When they're dead, you can enjoy tearing out their guts. Tales are things you get to enjoy twice." |
nocorras said: monarchyanarchy said: You don't technically need to, but the UBW remake didn't explain the war in depth like F/Z did so I think you'd find it confusing if you didn't watch F/Z. But watch F/Z - it gives you more background on the war and the characters that are in UBW. And plus, F/Z >>> F/SN by a long shot The war doesn't need to be explained in depth. Neither show is primarily about the war. Stop spreading mis-information. And to say FSN doesn't explain the war is ridiculous. For me I needed some details about the war, such as the functions of command spells, the mana mechanics with the servants and the grail itself. UBW didn't really explain the war mechanics from what I remember like F/z did. And what are you talking about? The show is based around the war. Also I'd like to add that the UBW remake is follows the same route as F/z, and IS the sequel so yes I'd say watch F/z before UBW. |
monarchyanarchy said: nocorras said: The war doesn't need to be explained in depth. Neither show is primarily about the war. Stop spreading mis-information. And to say FSN doesn't explain the war is ridiculous. For me I needed some details about the war, such as the functions of command spells, the mana mechanics with the servants and the grail itself. UBW didn't really explain the war mechanics from what I remember like F/z did. And what are you talking about? The show is based around the war. Also I'd like to add that the UBW remake is follows the same route as F/z, and IS the sequel so yes I'd say watch F/z before UBW. F/Z didn't explain shit. F/SN Fate is the introductionary story. F/Z is, again, just something you can watch if you're curious. |
| "When they're alive, you can enjoy watching them struggle. When they're dead, you can enjoy tearing out their guts. Tales are things you get to enjoy twice." |
monarchyanarchy said: nocorras said: The war doesn't need to be explained in depth. Neither show is primarily about the war. Stop spreading mis-information. And to say FSN doesn't explain the war is ridiculous. For me I needed some details about the war, such as the functions of command spells, the mana mechanics with the servants and the grail itself. UBW didn't really explain the war mechanics from what I remember like F/z did. And what are you talking about? The show is based around the war. Also I'd like to add that the UBW remake is follows the same route as F/z, and IS the sequel so yes I'd say watch F/z before UBW. All explained by Rin or Kirei, sorry. The show is not about the war. Neither show is, sorry. It is not a sequel. Why are you talking about something you don't know about? |
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monarchyanarchy said: nocorras said: The war doesn't need to be explained in depth. Neither show is primarily about the war. Stop spreading mis-information. And to say FSN doesn't explain the war is ridiculous. For me I needed some details about the war, such as the functions of command spells, the mana mechanics with the servants and the grail itself. UBW didn't really explain the war mechanics from what I remember like F/z did. And what are you talking about? The show is based around the war. Also I'd like to add that the UBW remake is follows the same route as F/z, and IS the sequel so yes I'd say watch F/z before UBW. You lost me at sequel |
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monarchyanarchy said: nocorras said: The war doesn't need to be explained in depth. Neither show is primarily about the war. Stop spreading mis-information. And to say FSN doesn't explain the war is ridiculous. For me I needed some details about the war, such as the functions of command spells, the mana mechanics with the servants and the grail itself. UBW didn't really explain the war mechanics from what I remember like F/z did. And what are you talking about? The show is based around the war. Also I'd like to add that the UBW remake is follows the same route as F/z, and IS the sequel so yes I'd say watch F/z before UBW. Archer explains seals better than anyone in Zero ever did. War is the setting, not the focus. FSN routes branch after FZ, what the hell are you talking about? Read this again. http://i.imgur.com/BGU5W0W.png |
Stev said: ayy lmao |
| Why does one random person that I've never seen in this sub forum show up to spread mis-information the moment one of these threads is made? |
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nocorras said: Why does one random person that I've never seen in this sub forum show up to spread mis-information the moment one of these threads is made? Because talking it's free |
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Praland said: nocorras said: Why does one random person that I've never seen in this sub forum show up to spread mis-information the moment one of these threads is made? Because talking it's free I'm saying it seems suspicious. |
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Praland said: monarchyanarchy said: For me I needed some details about the war, such as the functions of command spells, the mana mechanics with the servants and the grail itself. UBW didn't really explain the war mechanics from what I remember like F/z did. And what are you talking about? The show is based around the war. Also I'd like to add that the UBW remake is follows the same route as F/z, and IS the sequel so yes I'd say watch F/z before UBW. You lost me at sequel Mhm, UBW isn't a sequel of F/Z. You could argue that UBW is the sequel of the Fate route because that's technically true as it's meant to be experienced after it. F/Z is a "here is more information if you're curious about it but you know all the important things anyway" - Basically 100% fanservice. Like an extra disc for a VN. Again, saying F/Z explained something is pretty strange considering that it doesn't really explain anything as it assumes that the viewer already knows everything. |
| "When they're alive, you can enjoy watching them struggle. When they're dead, you can enjoy tearing out their guts. Tales are things you get to enjoy twice." |
The end of Volume I of Fate/Zero |
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ijuka said: monarchyanarchy said: For me I needed some details about the war, such as the functions of command spells, the mana mechanics with the servants and the grail itself. UBW didn't really explain the war mechanics from what I remember like F/z did. And what are you talking about? The show is based around the war. Also I'd like to add that the UBW remake is follows the same route as F/z, and IS the sequel so yes I'd say watch F/z before UBW. F/Z didn't explain shit. F/SN is the introductionary story. F/Z is, again, just something you can watch if you're curious. I got much more out of F/z than I ever did F/sn about the war and the overall setting the show was in. But yea I agree you can watch F/sn without F/z, but I wouldn't recommend it. nocorras said: monarchyanarchy said: For me I needed some details about the war, such as the functions of command spells, the mana mechanics with the servants and the grail itself. UBW didn't really explain the war mechanics from what I remember like F/z did. And what are you talking about? The show is based around the war. Also I'd like to add that the UBW remake is follows the same route as F/z, and IS the sequel so yes I'd say watch F/z before UBW. All explained by Rin or Kirei, sorry. The show is not about the war. Neither show is, sorry. It is not a sequel. Why are you talking about something you don't know about? Not quite sure what else the show could be about since it's centered around the Holy Grail War but whatever. I'm not the Fate fanatic here nocorras said: Why does one random person that I've never seen in this sub forum show up to spread mis-information the moment one of these threads is made? it's comical how hormonal you're getting over someone not agreeing with you |
| It's because you're FLAT OUT wrong and spreading mis-information. If you don't know that the series is not focused on the HGW then it's obvious you shouldn't be giving advice about the series, sorry. It's like me watching Star Wars 1-3, reading plot points about 4-6 and telling people it's fine to start with 1-3. All while really not knowing what either series is about. |
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| Guess spoiling most major plot points in FSN is now necessary to watch it. |
Stev said: ayy lmao |
ijuka said: Praland said: You lost me at sequel Mhm, UBW isn't a sequel of F/Z. You could argue that UBW is the sequel of the Fate route because that's technically true as it's meant to be experienced after it. F/Z is a "here is more information if you're curious about it but you know all the important things anyway" - Basically 100% fanservice. Like an extra disc for a VN. Again, saying F/Z explained something is pretty strange considering that it doesn't really explain anything as it assumes that the viewer already knows everything. Really? F/z seemed like the starting point of the series for me. It explained the war in the beginning about the grail, the servants etc. and basically went from there while adding little details about other logistics like mana and whatnot. UBW didn't really do that for me but I guess it's cause I watched f/z beforehand. UBW didn't display much of anything new (yet) that I didn't know about |
ijuka said: Praland said: You lost me at sequel Mhm, UBW isn't a sequel of F/Z. You could argue that UBW is the sequel of the Fate route because that's technically true as it's meant to be experienced after it. F/Z is a "here is more information if you're curious about it but you know all the important things anyway" - Basically 100% fanservice. Like an extra disc for a VN. Again, saying F/Z explained something is pretty strange considering that it doesn't really explain anything as it assumes that the viewer already knows everything. You lost me at explaining things that i know |
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Praland said: ijuka said: Mhm, UBW isn't a sequel of F/Z. You could argue that UBW is the sequel of the Fate route because that's technically true as it's meant to be experienced after it. F/Z is a "here is more information if you're curious about it but you know all the important things anyway" - Basically 100% fanservice. Like an extra disc for a VN. Again, saying F/Z explained something is pretty strange considering that it doesn't really explain anything as it assumes that the viewer already knows everything. You lost me at explaining things that i know mfw when he said that  |
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monarchyanarchy said: ijuka said: Mhm, UBW isn't a sequel of F/Z. You could argue that UBW is the sequel of the Fate route because that's technically true as it's meant to be experienced after it. F/Z is a "here is more information if you're curious about it but you know all the important things anyway" - Basically 100% fanservice. Like an extra disc for a VN. Again, saying F/Z explained something is pretty strange considering that it doesn't really explain anything as it assumes that the viewer already knows everything. Really? F/z seemed like the starting point of the series for me. It explained the war in the beginning about the grail, the servants etc. and basically went from there while adding little details about other logistics like mana and whatnot. UBW didn't really do that for me but I guess it's cause I watched f/z beforehand. UBW didn't display much of anything new (yet) that I didn't know about F/Z has no use. Everything important that happens in F/Z is revealed in F/SN. After finishing F/SN, I didn't watch F/Z until about a year later. I got no new information out of it. A central point of F/SN is the mystery of F/Z. Watching F/Z ruins the mystery. It's like watching the murder take place before reading a book about the investigation of the murder. The murder's supposed to be watched afterwards - Out of curiosity. Is this example clear enough? |
| "When they're alive, you can enjoy watching them struggle. When they're dead, you can enjoy tearing out their guts. Tales are things you get to enjoy twice." |
monarchyanarchy said: ijuka said: Mhm, UBW isn't a sequel of F/Z. You could argue that UBW is the sequel of the Fate route because that's technically true as it's meant to be experienced after it. F/Z is a "here is more information if you're curious about it but you know all the important things anyway" - Basically 100% fanservice. Like an extra disc for a VN. Again, saying F/Z explained something is pretty strange considering that it doesn't really explain anything as it assumes that the viewer already knows everything. Really? F/z seemed like the starting point of the series for me. It explained the war in the beginning about the grail, the servants etc. and basically went from there while adding little details about other logistics like mana and whatnot. UBW didn't really do that for me but I guess it's cause I watched f/z beforehand. UBW didn't display much of anything new (yet) that I didn't know about The VN it's the starting point of the series, better, the FATE route it's the starting point of the series |
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ijuka said: monarchyanarchy said: Really? F/z seemed like the starting point of the series for me. It explained the war in the beginning about the grail, the servants etc. and basically went from there while adding little details about other logistics like mana and whatnot. UBW didn't really do that for me but I guess it's cause I watched f/z beforehand. UBW didn't display much of anything new (yet) that I didn't know about F/Z has no use. Everything important that happens in F/Z is revealed in F/SN. After finishing F/SN, I didn't watch F/Z until about a year later. I got no new information out of it. A central point of F/SN is the mystery of F/Z. Watching F/Z ruins the mystery. It's like watching the murder take place before reading a book about the investigation of the murder. The murder's supposed to be watched afterwards - Out of curiosity. Is this example clear enough? I get you. It would be more entertaining thinking about it. Thanks for the explanation. Sucks cause I told a classmate of mine a while ago to watch F/z before the UBW remake. |
ZeroDragon said: Q: I watched F/Z and so far they haven't really told us anything we didn't already know. Why is that? A: Keep in mind that F/Z was a prequel made after F/SN. As well as F/Z might have done in getting newcomers up to speed, F/SN is a standalone story so it doesn't and can't make the assumption that everyone has already seen F/Z beforehand if it's to be faithful to the source material. Essentially this question is akin to watching a remastered version of the original Star Wars trilogy and asking why it explains things that you already know from watching the prequel trilogy. Follow up Q: But I watched F/Z first and I swear they're treating this anime as a sequel to it. Just look at all the references! A: Many of the references that you see were already present in the original source material, though this anime plays them up more or less. They only appear to be references because they were the pieces of information used in creating F/Z. The other references were added in by Ufotable for this show as an acknowledgment that F/Z exists and that many viewers had already seen it. However, as good of a prequel that F/Z was and no matter how well it flows into F/SN, the fact remains that F/SN's story is standalone and was written first and F/Z was meant to be complimentary material that goes in depth regarding the past that F/SN refers to. It's ok if you watched F/Z first, but don't act like it was the intended starting point of this franchise. But to make it easy for you, OP, it comes down to who you'll choose to listen to. You can either listen to the fans who know Fate inside out and save F/Z for afterwards, or you can listen to anime-only watchers who have little knowledge of the franchise outside of F/Z and watch F/Z first. |
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monarchyanarchy said: For me I needed some details about the war, such as the functions of command spells, Told by Rin and Archer in prologue. Told by Rin to Shirou in episode 2. monarchyanarchy said: the mana mechanics with the servants Told by Rin and Saber to Shirou in episode 2. Told by Saber and somewhat Shirou in episode 4. monarchyanarchy said: and the grail itself. Due to nature of F/SN, told in Heaven's Feel; basics told by Kirei in episode 2. monarchyanarchy said: UBW didn't really explain the war mechanics from what I remember like F/z did. Told by Rin to Shirou in episode 2. Told by Kirei and Rin to Shirou in episode 2. Told by Saber to Shirou in episode 4. monarchyanarchy said: And what are you talking about? The show is based around the war. No, it isn't, if by that you mean that show is about battle royale. Fate/Stay Night is Shirou's story. Fate/Zero is story about how it came to the situation in Fate/Stay Night. Grail War is only a secondary thing. Otherwise it would be more like Mirai Nikki. monarchyanarchy said: Also I'd like to add that the UBW remake is follows the same route as F/z, Pardon me? I have no idea what does that mean. monarchyanarchy said: and IS the sequel so yes I'd say watch F/z before UBW. No, it isn't a sequel. Both Urobuchi said that when he wrote the light novel, and release dates of the VN and LN say that. |
AuriochMar 9, 2015 7:56 PM
astroprogs said: If HF ended up being a single movie, what would it need to do so it can get a high score from all of you? Not air. |
| Ah, I quite like the analogy. If you had a mystery novel about a murder investigation and an extra cd with an animation of the murder taking place, would you watch the murder first because the investigation would "spoil" what happens in the murder? Of course not, because the investigation and the revelations is where the fun is. Of course, F/Z isn't about a murder, but the relationship is pretty much the same. *Jots it down in this post so that I can pasta it on youtube* Oh by the way, the holy grail war is still important as the setting, even if the characters are the central focus. It's not just something that doesn't matter at all. |
| "When they're alive, you can enjoy watching them struggle. When they're dead, you can enjoy tearing out their guts. Tales are things you get to enjoy twice." |
ijuka said: gotta say dude i like your analogy and i will more than likely be quoting it later.Ah, I quite like the analogy. If you had a mystery novel about a murder investigation and an extra cd with an animation of the murder taking place, would you watch the murder first because the investigation would "spoil" what happens in the murder? Of course not, because the investigation and the revelations is where the fun is. Of course, F/Z isn't about a murder, but the relationship is pretty much the same. *Jots it down in this post so that I can pasta it on youtube* Oh by the way, the holy grail war is still important as the setting, even if the characters are the central focus. It's not just something that doesn't matter at all. |
Journey_95 said: I watched F/Z first (didn't even know about F/SN) but its very clear that its meant to be watched after F/SN it spoils a lot for the three routes also you might go into F/SN UBW with the wrong expectations if you watch F/Z first I expected a "real" sequel (regarding the atmosphere etc.) but I was disappointed in that regard its still pretty good but F/Z is superior in almost every way Pretty much, you can like whichever one you want but C'mon, this watch order stuff isn't rocket science. |
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Maloghurst said: ijuka said: gotta say dude i like your analogy and i will more than likely be quoting it later.Ah, I quite like the analogy. If you had a mystery novel about a murder investigation and an extra cd with an animation of the murder taking place, would you watch the murder first because the investigation would "spoil" what happens in the murder? Of course not, because the investigation and the revelations is where the fun is. Of course, F/Z isn't about a murder, but the relationship is pretty much the same. *Jots it down in this post so that I can pasta it on youtube* Oh by the way, the holy grail war is still important as the setting, even if the characters are the central focus. It's not just something that doesn't matter at all. Yeah it's a great analogy. Mind if I use it in the FAQ? |
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| Holy shit. I missed a shitstorm. TlDR: - The ANN review is uninformed bullshit - FSN is not about the war, it is story about Emiya Shirou and his worldview. Fate/Zero is a bonus material that expands upon biggest plot twists that you learn through FSN. - Zero spoils EVERY SINGLE FSN plot point, except ONE. FSN tells you ONE thing about Zero that you are expected to know since the start anyway. - FSN does NOT expect you to know Zero events, Zero EXPECTS you to know entirety of FSN. ijuka said: Ah, I quite like the analogy. If you had a mystery novel about a murder investigation and an extra cd with an animation of the murder taking place, would you watch the murder first because the investigation would "spoil" what happens in the murder? Of course not, because the investigation and the revelations is where the fun is. Of course, F/Z isn't about a murder, but the relationship is pretty much the same. *Jots it down in this post so that I can pasta it on youtube* Oh by the way, the holy grail war is still important as the setting, even if the characters are the central focus. It's not just something that doesn't matter at all. I love it when people take inspiration from my youtube posts If FSN was a murder mystery book/movie, then FSN would be the whole book/movie where you discover clues, learn about characters and plot details, concepts of how stuff works etc, while Fate/Zero would be that flashback near the end when the detective sits all the suspects down and goes "okay, here's how it all went down". Nobody watches detective movies by starting at the end part. Nobody starts books by reading the last chapter just because it has a flashback(and Fate Zero is exactly that - a flashback that you see once you know all the character motivations and the endgame and are interested to see HOW they get to that endgame) |
AhenshihaelMar 10, 2015 7:55 AM
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Drucoz said: There's plenty more than one twist in F/SN not spoiled by Zero. Not that it matters anyway, FSN isn't a mystery to begin with, and isn't built around "shocking" you with twists, so that analogy goes nowhere, though I agree it probably would be best to watch (or read, the better experience) FSN first. He's talking about plot points not necessarily twists, but yeah I know what you mean. Anyway, try not to get CP started, this thread has been relatively painless so far. |
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| Only ''reason'' you could come up with to say Zero should be watched before Stay Night is that you'd be familiar with some of the characters while reading/watching through Stay Night, but that isn't a reason to watch Zero first since the case still applies if you go through SN first and then watch Zero after. Fai is right. Zero is a flashback, not the first part of the series. And it very much expects you to have Stay Night knowledge before-hand as the experience is much more enjoyable and some character's words make much more sense. Last episode is a huge example why Zero should be watched after SN. First episode is somewhat as well. Along with other numerous things throughout the series - example would be Byakuya. While the scene was rather minor as hell, it really meant nothing to a Zero viewer because Byakuya was just some random Matou they've never heard of, while Stay Night viewers recognize him as Shinji's dad. I've posted my thoughts in the general discussion thread on why I don't understand what possible reason is there to watch Zero first instead of Stay Night. I can copy paste it here, but it contains some spoilers for Fate and HF. It makes no sense to me and I'm saying this as someone who got into the Fate series through Zero's anime. It was a mistake I regretted after I found out the VN existed and should have been seen first. |
Drucoz said: you're using them wrong. Wrongpriest. Haha. ayy lmao |
| ayy shutup Steve Nah I probably am, It's just that you defined them as Twists when Fai said Plot points. Although I'm not too sure what you mean by the first sentence with spoilers. Although that could be because it's 1:30AM |
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Drucoz said: WrongPriest said: He's talking about plot points not necessarily twists, but yeah I know what you mean. Anyway, try not to get CP started, this thread has been relatively painless so far. Still makes no sense, am I somehow supposed to figure out Exactly how are you defining "twist" and "plot point"? Because I think you're using them wrong. Wrongpriest. Haha. The upcoming Heaven's Feel movie(s) will have some important plot points directly spoiled by F/Z. |
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Drucoz said: ...what? I didn't say otherwise. Zero probably assumed you didn't read the VN. |
| By "majority" we often refer at the twists in the whole VN. UBW has that luck that it's the least spoiled route, while Fate and especially HF bear the brunt of spoilers. |
astroprogs said: If HF ended up being a single movie, what would it need to do so it can get a high score from all of you? Not air. |
Drucoz said: WrongPriest said: ayy shutup Steve Nah I probably am, It's just that you defined them as Twists when Fai said Plot points. Although I'm not too sure what you mean by the first sentence with spoilers. Although that could be because it's 1:30AM He used the term twists too. Everything I described in my post were major twists in the story, and there's no way zero spoils any of them, so clearly the majority of twists are not spoiled by zero. Yeah I don't know how I missed that lol, Carry on. Fai is also the guy that tries to convince people that Shirou is the lovechild of Inferno Cop and Chuck Norris with the combined methodical mind Lelouche and Light Yagami while we're just attempting to convince them he's not clinically retarded. It doesn't help. He exaggerates a shitload. |
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WormPriest said: WrongPriest said: I wish you guys would stop giving him exactly what he wants.. like everytime. Now, where's the fun in not taking the bait? See, even this mongrel understands Yuetsu. |
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