No Game No Life (light novel)
| I had a bit of trouble reading that, so to simplify: - A race loses their race piece, no longer part of the exceeds - Can the race kill other races without playing a game? - If Old Deus are the most powerful and lose their race piece - Can't they kill with no one to stop them? That's actually what I initially thought, but I kind of figured that losing your race piece doesn't just mean losing your rights to an exceed, but also the end of your sentience as a race. You literally become just like an animal. Probably not correct, though |
| That is a very interesting theory. It could be possible. |
| No, once you lose your race piece you are not bound by the rules and oaths, that means the Old Dues can die and the others cannot die because they are being protected by the rules Tet The one true God put in place so you either go under the protection of another race or die (good luck trying to kill immortal enemies) Besides that's not the point, it's a game and everyone should have fun and get along not try to massacre each other for no reason. |
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| If that were the case then everyone would lose their piece on purpose. |
| I believe that you are thinking that Old Deus are a united race when they arent, in the first episode it said that "The Gods and their creations were locked in eternal strife " with one another to take the throne of one true god meaning that the Old Deus were killing each other during that time and wernt fighting as a united race like Imanity or the Elves.If the Old Deus were to lose the status of exceed the Old Deus would kill each other. |
Knightmaretiger said: This pretty much.-snip- |
"Rejoice! We are humans— we are the most talented people! Precisely because we were born without any ability— we can achieve anything— this is the will of the weakest race!" – Sora, ‘No game No life Vol.01’ |
| I was giving some thought about the OP's idea. While it initially seems plausible, the question is: if that were so - why haven't they already done so? Well I have examined a bunch of scenarios and pitted them against the 10 Oaths and my findings were that I am very surprised how well thought out the 10 Oaths are. I must give credit to the author. Here's my take... Excerpt from Wikipedia: The 16 intelligent races of Disboard, collectively known as the Exceed. Every race has been assigned a representative chess piece; if the designated "race piece" is ever lost, the race will lose both its place among the Exceed and the protection of the Oaths, rendering it vulnerable to any attack, enslavement, or murder from the other races. All races of the Exceed are bound by the Ten Oaths. Let's examine Oath 3: In games, each party will bet something that both sides agree is of equal value. - It can be argued that if Old Deus intended to lose the game they can sucker another nation like so: Old Deus race piece for anything negligible that the opposing nation can wager. As long as both sides agree it is of equal value, the game's bet is set. Now under normal circumstances, no nation will bet its race piece for something trivial therefore the notion of deliberately losing a race piece is not entertained. If Old Deus can afford to do so then the idea works so far. But what then? All we know is that if a race loses their Race Piece - they lose their place in the Exceed. Based on the way its worded, we can assume the following: 1) IMPORTANTLY - They don't cease to exist in the Exceed 2) By my logical interpretation of the condition of losing their race piece, they simply will not be recognized as a independent race which gives credence to: 3) Losing a Race Piece to another race is equivalent to self enslavement, UNLESS: The Old Deus is able to provide a provision in the bet that if they lose they won't be submissive and can claim independence. But even so: They are now assimilated into another nation and as long as the winning nation is still bound to the oaths, the same oaths technically apply to the Old Deus. The only difference is that they cannot be recognized as an independent race and as such their future existence now hangs on a string in the hands of the winning nation. This probably explains why they haven't elected to handing over their race piece over to anyone because they obviously cherish their life. I think the only way for Old Deus to be able to be exempt from the oaths entirely is to engineer a way for them to be able to lose their Race Piece without losing it to another nation. The question is...Is that even possible let alone even allowed? Another idea is: Can a race bet outside the scope of the 10 oaths? For example, the right for the loser to exist independently without having to obey the 10 oaths? My conclusion: 1) Opposing party won't entertain that bet provision made by an Old Deus, that's a fact 2) Oath 6 states: Any bets made in accordance with the Oaths must be upheld. - In this case, does simply making a provisional bet as mentioned above give ultimate power to the betting party or will Tet intervene? Based on my take, at this time I can confidently say you cannot make a bet with something you cannot personally guarantee to uphold or deliver. So betting to be excluded from the oaths is out of the question. Unless Tet intervenes, what if the opposing party accepts but then discovers the other party cannot uphold their bet? Once again I reasonably think the game itself if void and no winner can be contested. Thoughts anyone? |
HaganemeJun 25, 2014 9:53 PM
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Takuan_Soho said: kramXD said: iit would probably take a thousand flugel to kill just one Old Deus but what i'm saying is if the Old Deus lost their race piece on purpose they can wipe out the rest if the exceeds to extinction right Not probably, Jibiriru explained that it would take that many flugel to kill one Old Deus back in episode 7 or 8, but your point is completely wrong. Tet beat all of them, and only his pledges is what is keeping them alive now. If they lost their race piece and tried to kill the other races, they would be killed by Tet (this was hinted at during the beginning of episode 5 I believe, where the Deus were taking to Tet). Besides, if Humans survived before Tet took over, why do you think they wouldn't survive if the Old Deus lost their race piece? As the show explained, humans were the biggest losers under the Tet regime. Just to clarify one thing. Tet didn't beat anyone. He as far as I know has not been suggested to even be a particularity strong Old Deus, he was the god of play or games? The only reason he "won" is because he sat out, and everyone else killed each other, hence he won by default. |
| The old gods seem to have lost some of their powers. Even a great number of Flugel managed to take down one of them according to Jibril, what do you think would happen if all other races teamed up against them? |
yeslelno123 said: The old gods seem to have lost some of their powers. Even a great number of Flugel managed to take down one of them according to Jibril, what do you think would happen if all other races teamed up against them? Not in the anime. Jibril said it took about 50 flugel to kill a dragon and that even 200 could not beat a Old Deus. Unless that LN said something else, I doubt anyone under a dragon could, and many dragons at that, could take them on. |
| In conclusion, losing your race piece means no protection. It doesn't mean you become free to kill everyone! Simple. |
| A great protagonist once said, "It's only overpowered if you can't return the favor!" |
| I think that someone who has loss there Race Piece can do w.e. Considering that if they are degraded to that of an regular animal after losing the piece, Im sure they can since im sure some people are still killed by animals. |
| You know what is one possibility? Maybe the Old Deus could in fact kill everyone if they lost their piece, but what would be their likely desire? I would assume it would be revenge on Tet for just sitting on the sidelines, and the only way to face Tet is by winning the game. So maybe they keep their piece because without it they could not challenge Tet. |
| ^ NO :( Tet is the ONE TRUE GOD, he is all powerful and the rule/laws are absolute, the only way to challenge/fight is through games. Old Dues would be fighting against 15 IMMORTAL RACES if they lost (as in can't be killed/murdered but they can die of old age thou) :O |
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ichii_1 said: ^ NO :( Tet is the ONE TRUE GOD, he is all powerful and the rule/laws are absolute, the only way to challenge/fight is through games. Old Dues would be fighting against 15 IMMORTAL RACES if they lost (as in can't be killed/murdered but they can die of old age thou) :O reading comprehension is not your strong suit That is exactly what I said, if the old deus lost their piece, even if they could kill the other 15 races, and I think they could, they could not challenge him due to the forced obedience to the rules. As they likely would want to challenge for revenge, it would not be in their best interest to lose their piece on purpose. And none of the races, including the Old Deus are immortal, so I have no idea where you got that from. |
krownklown said: Maybe the Old Deus could in fact kill everyone if they lost their piece That's an oxymoron because you know that losing the Race Piece means you fall out of the oaths protection/restriction meaning in short you can be killed and they can't. Reading comprehension right back at you, they are immortal in the sense of not being killed and murdered not living forever as they can die of natural causes. Oh and you need all the pieces to challenge Tet and this- Oath 10 - Let's get along and play together! Slaughtering all the other races isn't getting along and playing together is it? XD |
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ichii_1 said: krownklown said: Maybe the Old Deus could in fact kill everyone if they lost their piece That's an oxymoron because you know that losing the Race Piece means you fall out of the oaths protection/restriction meaning in short you can be killed and they can't. Reading comprehension right back at you, they are immortal in the sense of not being killed and murdered not living forever as they can die of natural causes. Oh and you need all the pieces to challenge Tet and this- Oath 10 - Let's get along and play together! Slaughtering all the other races isn't getting along and playing together is it? XD Sigh I would rather be speaking with the shibi inu in your avatar. At least in the anime it has not be clarified what it means to be protected by the pledges or not. That was the whole point of the thread. Its never stated anything other than a group that loses the protection can be attacked, that is it. And are you trolling? People die. No one is immortal, did you miss the part where Asagi's grandfather died? No one is immortal, they are just barred from fighting each other. The only thing I will give you is the have fun part, but fun is subjective, so even that can be subverted. The Flugel are blood thirsty, to them fun is killing others. So that line can be interpreted any way. |
:O "sigh" immortal as in CAN'T be murdered (stabbed, nuked) :( they CAN die of natural causes (old age, heart attack, disease), how hard is it to understand my sentence? :O |
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ichii_1 said: :O "sigh" immortal as in CAN'T be murdered (stabbed, nuked) :( they CAN die of natural causes (old age, heart attack, disease), how hard is it to understand my sentence? :O So they can jump off a cliff and not die? They can fight a pack of wolves and not die? Hunters can go hunting with their bare hands then I suppose. The rules only state that the exceed cannot be violent towards each other which would technically make them immortal if not for the fact that there are races that ARE NOT Exceed. Non-sentient life forms cannot aschente to the rules. The OP is saying that the Old Deus losing their race piece would make them equivalent to a wild animal, not bound the rules. |
| ^ :O yes, Sora and Shiro fell from the sky and survived remember? :) Wolves? killing for food and murder is different. And if the non exceed can kill them that makes the whole thing pointless since they would just lose their piece and go to war anyway :( They say aschente when they play a formal game, the pledge 1 and 2 should still apply regardless. Pledge 1. - All murder, war and robbery is forbidden in this world. |
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ichii_1 said: ^ :O yes, Sora and Shiro fell from the sky and survived remember? :) Wolves? killing for food and murder is different. And if the non exceed can kill them that makes the whole thing pointless since they would just lose their piece and go to war anyway :( They say aschente when they play a formal game, the pledge 1 and 2 should still apply regardless. Pledge 1. - All murder, war and robbery is forbidden in this world. I still disagree with them being immortal but whatever, its not like this debate will bring us closer to a second season, so interest lost. |
ichii_1 said: krownklown said: Maybe the Old Deus could in fact kill everyone if they lost their piece That's an oxymoron because you know that losing the Race Piece means you fall out of the oaths protection/restriction meaning in short you can be killed and they can't. Reading comprehension right back at you, they are immortal in the sense of not being killed and murdered not living forever as they can die of natural causes. Oh and you need all the pieces to challenge Tet and this- Oath 10 - Let's get along and play together! Slaughtering all the other races isn't getting along and playing together is it? XD They are not required to follow the last pledge. The pledge 9 says that the "above rules must be upheld followed and never changed", the last rule comes afterwards. |
| But if they can kill the other races that would be completely against the point, more than half the race wants war so Tet making it so that even if someone loses their piece they can still kill everyone is pointless :O And who know what their food situation is, Tet is God I'm sure he can create food from dirt if he needs to. |
ichii_1Jun 30, 2014 8:23 PM
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